I was gonna say I don’t think Joyce’s understanding of these topics has advanced that far yet, but then again she DOES enjoy reading Amber’s fics, so she must have some exposure to the concepts. Albeit through a very…Amber-tinted lens.
“I’ve lost seven pounds…
…and two teeth…
It’s hard to dance when I’m this weak.
I smell food but I can’t buy it:
Oh, Poverty! The Miracle Diet!”
Been there. Sending consoling vibes and hope.
Also 211, if you happen to be in North America. They seem to have a phone number for everything. And there’s nothing that tastes quite as sweet as free food, sometimes!
Up here our local chains get snuffed out by the biggest of the basic national chains, but other regionals never follow. We still have our d’Angelo, but Subway is everywhere and we started seeing Jersey Mike’s pop up in the last few years.
Meanwhile, even further up here, with the exception of Subway, none of the chains mentioned even exist.
Instead we have the occasional Firehouse, which, thanks to the silly practice of actually being good, is slowly but surely removing the blight of Subway from our shores… to be replaced with Tim Horton’s or McDonalds, because even in Canada nature abhors a vaccuum.
Huh, that’s so weird, that’s clearly somewhere in Bloomington, but I don’t recognize it in the slightest, I’ve never heard of any of those businesses, never seen any of those signs, but the reference to the Well’s library pretty clearly places it as local, and I recognize the architecture from a few other strip malls locally, so I know what part of town it is probably in, but it seems odd that I’ve never seen it before considering I’m a delivery driver and I’ve kind of been everywhere around here a few hundred times.
Counterpoint: She revealed herself to Ethan in hopes he might let it slip because she’s ambivalent about coming out to Joyce and was hoping the decision might be made for her.
At the time, it was very unsafe to tell Joyce. Jocelyn had no read yet on which way Joyce would go re: trans people, and Joyce had zero ability to lie to authority.
She’s been waiting a long time for Joyce to be ready to hear this information. It’s gonna be so great.
i am really glad Joyce is learning the basics on how to treat a trans person NOW, i hope this means she’ll be way less awkward when Jocelyne finally comes out. <3
Considering Joyce said “Who I’ve known for a while”, I wouldn’t think Ethan would think she was talking about Jocelyn, who she’s known for her whole life.
It’s confusing because I was fresh out of college myself when DoA first began, these characters were practically a peer group, and their Walkyverse incarnations were comfortably older than me.
But these days…yeah, they’re all poor stupid babies.
Carla is maybe taller than him with skates on. With regular shoes, she’s tall, but still shorter than him. Ethan is I wanna say taller than Jacob, maybe about the same height as Joe, but the three are around the same height. Joyce has a type, it’d seem.
I want to say that Carla is in the same ballpark as Sarah, height-wise, maybe a touch taller.
The archive, on the top banner just underneath the title click on”archive” and you’ll see a list of all the chapters including ones that have strips in the backlog that haven’t been posted yet, right now it looks like Willis is two stories ahead of us
I could see more how that makes Ethan think it’s about her sister because what does she have to do in regards to Carla? With her sister, she’ll need to work on adjusting her thinking and how she refers to her a bit.
Look, she’s wrong, but she’s groping her way towards the understanding that ultimately all liberation struggles are actually one struggle, she’ll get yelled at and it’ll be fine
Technically speaking, the T is only one letter away from G in the LGBTQA+, so in that sense she isn’t wrong. But somebody needs to sit her down and properly explain everything.
I mean, she used to think ethan wasn’t gay b/c he wasn’t “holding a barbie doll/wearing a skirt” so someone in her friend circle talking about it is prolly better
Although considering leslie is the gender studies teacher, i wonder how often trans ppl would come up
Leslie did mention her regret that the 101 course didn’t cover more genders.
(How do I remember stuff like this, I can’t even remember people who actively know me, let alone random things they’ve said many years ago.)
Undertale-sexual. The one that means your only sexually attracted to Skeletons with Blue flames in their eyes or Strong fish ladies that try to kill you.
She’s trying to learn.
It’s not anyone’s responsibility since she’s technically an adult, but it does fall to her friends and community to help her understand.
Given that Ethan is her friend, in her community, and part of the LGBT+ community… not a bad person to pick.
But considering he’s definitely going through… a lot.
Maaaaybe don’t ask the first person you see?
well i imagine jen’s not too fond of carla but that had nothing to do with her benig trans lol (although i don’t really know if malaya would rly be wiling to have a ‘friendly chat’ about it since joyce said she ‘transcends friendship”)
Ethan’s been going through this ‘lot’ for a while – being asked to help a friend with something, even as simple as sharing some personal knowledge/perspective, can be good to draw one out from their own troubles for a moment.
Also this is familiar territory for Joyce and Ethan. One of her first big signs of growth was breaking up with Ethan because he was gay and she didn’t want to be his beard. Joyce was instrumental in getting Ethan to the GSA meeting, which seemed to be an overall positive for him. They’ve had some big, complex conversations about sex, love, and dating. I get why she would choose to ask him.
it definitely reflects some fucked-up attitudes but, well, we already knew joyce had a lot of those rattling around; and luckily she’s fictional so she stands a much better chance of deciding not to be malicious about it
Joyce, you do know how to use a computer. Please use a computer, and a search engine, and the terms “LGBTQ+ 101” and stop asking your dormmates to be walking FAQs.
tbf i wouldn’t be surprised if google and the like had some ‘biased research’, bc you could easily stumble upon the rabbit hole of all the ‘discourse’/in-fighting but you’d think there’d be more seminars like the ‘questioning’ one tho that was more gender focused than sexuality
This reminds me of a lesson in one of my writing classes in college. This was back in the early-to-mid-00s, when the internet was still getting established as a source for schoolwork. We went to the computer lab and the professor had us look up MLK Jr., because at this point Stormfront had gotten their rancid lying hate page boosted in the rankings so it was if not the top, one of the top sources. The point of the lesson was “don’t trust the internet, and don’t assume a high Google ranking means anything.” So, yeah, good on Joyce, and more so if they’re in our floating timeline where AI has ruined the shit out of everything.
Look, it’s not 2010 in-universe anymore, trying to find useful information with a search engine these days is like asking a kindergarten class where they think babies come from.
Good thing she’s not fucking doing that, then. Jesus Christ, why is it always a fucking problem when someone is actively trying to learn something, from someone who might know it, or at least know where to look for it? Quit fucking pretending you were born with the answers coming out of your pampered little asses, people.
It IS ok to have conversations with your friends. Joyce is a good example of how to stumble towards understanding with a little help from your friends. Going online is a recipe for disaster and being the next mass killer. Definitely don’t go on the Telegram social network/broadcast medium shudder ew.
For real, like if I look up “how to learn about queer people”, I fucking guarantee I’ll find a list of addresses and recipes within ten minutes. It’s literally not safe if you’re not In The Know™, and The Know™ has to keep relocating because the wrong people keep getting in. Friends aren’t unhinged randos inside your computer, gathered together by an algorithm to determine the most advertiser-friendly answers to what you wanna know, they’re people in your life you can rely on to help you, even if helping you only amounts to “Hell, Idk the answer”.
I absolutely want my friends and family to ask me questions. Because they will actually listen if I tell them that I’m not in a good place to answer them at that time. The last thing I’d want is for someone to go online and stumble onto the Cass report and Galbraith’s bullshit. If someone asks can discuss my experiences and give them beneficial website to go to. But I have had complete strangers accosted me acting lime they were entitled to lime I’m some sort of queer eniac.
Ethan’s like “Sure, I do have an encyclopedic knowledge of who in your family is trans. But other than that why would you think I know anything about trans people?”
No Human Interaction. Do Not Ask Questions of People You Have Personal Relationships With. Keep Eyes Straight Ahead or On Devices. Charismatic Bloggers Shall Speak for Everyone They Share a Demographic With.
I mean, I guess she’s already dismissed Mary’s attempt to turn her into a TERF, so there isn’t too much danger that Google will do so. Still not somewhere I’d turn for actual information, though.
I absolutely get that queer people don’t want to and don’t have to take on the task of educating everyone around them, but let’s not pretend the Internet is a safe, better way.
She asked him a single fucking question because she’s trying not to cause harm. Can we PLEASE stop demonizing normal human interactions by people trying their best? Ethan is perfectly within his rights to say “I’m not comfortable having this conversation” and so far he hasn’t.
I get that it can be exhausting to constantly answer questions, but treating them like The Enemy because they wanted a human connection over a digital one for a difficult topic is so needlessly weird.
*puts on pince nez glasses and stares over them pedantically*
Yes, mm, tech-ni-calllly what is happening here is “emotional work,” not “emotional labor” as described in the original paper that popularized these terms.
I love how being surprised briefly turns Ethan into Ethan Classic.
Also, this makes me wonder if Ethan has been talking to Jocelyn. They exchanged contact info obviously a ways back, but Ethan’s been so withdrawn this semester. Of course, maybe it’d be easier for him to touch base through a screen than in person, so… who knows.
well, he was going through a lot tho idk if jocelyne would’ve asked ethan to ‘check in’ on joyce after her phone call was ignored (although personally it might’ve been better to reach out to becky)
The number is high, but seems higher from the outside because quite a few of them are regional. For instance, I am in Texas, and we have many Whataburger locations, but in, say, New York, there would be none at all.
Yes, true. I’ve never heard of these joints she’s mentioning. They make them up and brand them at a fast clip and then bulldoze all the pastures to put more up. Suburbs are full of miles of strip malls. Some of these corporations own dozens of brands and thousands of “restaurants.”
not to mention the ‘mini’ fast food places within gas stations and such, if not just a gas station where you can get hot coffee and such, but depends on where you live.
(tho at least in tx if you don’t want like mcdonalds/taco bell, you could easily find a ‘local’ burger joint or taco place)
Depends on where you live. I live in a small town in Florida, which is a state that pulls in lots of visitors and tourists AKA people who’d want food on the go. So along the stretch of road that cuts across my small town we have McDonalds, Burger King, Hardees, Subway, Checkers, Zaxby’s, Taco Bell, Wendy’s, Dominos, and Pizza Hut. And that’s just the actual big name franchises, we have a bunch of smaller, family owned food places too!
I don’t think you understand just how branded this country is, if you have to ask that. A town could have exactly the same variety of food and shopping as its neighbor, but if Town A has a locally-owned single restaurant called Chuck’s Burgers and Town B has a McDonald’s, Americans will literally drive 40 miles to Town B to eat sewage because it has that brand on it. Chuck’s burgers are all made from locally-farmed ingredients, made by people who get paid enough to show up and care, and a lot of the locals know Chuck personally, but that does not matter in the slightest to Americans. They need the brand, no matter how much actual enrichment Chuck gives them and how actually nice Town A is, because the magic TV box and mail coupons and billboards and T-shirts and radio and sidewalk and traffic signs and toys and stickers and school work all tell them so.
No, that’s not even it. It’s that where I’m sitting, if you want to go to a burger place, your choices are McDonald’s and, in some of the larger cities, Burger King. That’s it. The long, long list of brands found in the US simply hasn’t made it across except for these two; and because burgers are pretty much only known as industrial fast food, there are no small family-owned burger places – the very concept doesn’t compute.
Mobility has something to do with it, too. If you’re passing through an unfamiliar town (or neighborhood) and feeling hungry, it’s: “Chuck’s Burgers? are they any good? Oh! a McDonald’s, I know their stuff.” Sometimes I don’t feel adventurous.
Well, I’m sorry you like the taste of human body waste and cleaning fluids, but for the same price you could get actual food made by someone who doesn’t wish you’d die.
Seriously, McDonald’s really just costs the same as a sit-in restaurant now, it’s fuckin’ wacky.
Mostly we have so many different franchises because we’re so big and most of them are regional (in some cases very local).
We do have a lot of such restaurants most places, but hardly endless loops.
I like that this is phrased as if other countries don’t also have a bunch of fast food franchises. This isn’t a uniquely USA thing, I say this having lived in three countries and visited many more. We just get shit on for it more because people refuse to understand how BIG the US is.
Yeah, Korean Fried Chicken has gotten popular enough that KFC literally has a “Korean BBQ” sauce now to try to drag back some mindshare, which I find hilarious.
I used sad as an humorous exaggeration of the fact that while this is pretty cringe, it’s miles better of how she would reacted to the same situation at the start of the comic.
god right? can’t really explain to people that this sucks without the cis coming in and being like “BUT SHE IS TRYING AND THAT’S ALL THAT MATTERS BECAUSE INTENT IS MAGIC”
Hey, trans person here who disagrees with you – you have literally no idea who is behind the screen and we’re not a fucking monolith bearing a single opinion. Grow up.
That’s what I’m thinking. She’s misguided, yes, but she’s trying. “The G and the T are both part of that, so they should have some insight into each other, right?” She is seeking insight and understanding, she just doesn’t know where and who to seek it from.
And she’s not entirely wrong. Gay men more likely to have some positive knowledge of Trans issues than straights. She could go to Booster or Malaya, but she knows Ethan a lot better.
Plus she sees him first – it’s not like she specifically sought anyone out.
Exactly. Bi cis woman here, I probably know a lot more about trans people than cishet people just by being more active in queer spaces. Ethan is not really there yet, though? He’s dating / sleeping around but we haven’t really seen him actively seek out a community apart from that one time he and Joyce went to the LGBTQI+ meet-up together.
You’re absolutely right, however I didn’t say I have more in common with trans people, but that I know more about them in general than most cishet people do. I am talking purely about knowledge, not about common experiences. But I should probably have specified that I have this knowledge because I am a bi woman who frequents queer spaces that are fairly diverse. Some queer people of all types of identity do not have access to those spaces, or they might not actively seek them out (like Ethan is gay and sleeps with gay men but does not seek out queer bars, political movements or communities).
(Once again I should have proofread my comment before posting, apologise for the spelling errors and also Ethan does not exclusively sleep with gay men so there was no reason to specify “gay men” in that context)
As if I wasn’t already super anticipating her return next chapter, here Ethan is ramping up the hype!
I do gotta wonder about why Willis chose to use a literal descriptive title like this, though, as opposed to the usual vague ones. Makes me wonder if there’s gonna be a surprise appearance by another character in addition to her.
I think it’s because once there was a semi vague chapter title about a sister and everyone thought it was about Jocelyne and then it was actually about Liz.
I remember that, it was hilarious. I seem to recall making a comment beforehand jokingly predicting something like that would happen, although I can’t seem to find it.
It’s really nice to see Carla roller skating onscreen again. There was a long spell where we never saw it (unless my memory sucks, which it does). But it’s happened a lot in the past couple of weeks.
The only good chain restaurants I ever encountered in Ohio were the original Wendy’s, across from the old COSI on Broad Street in Columbus (I was staying at the Christopher Inn), and an Arthur Treacher’s in the German Village neighborhood (I was at the old Great Southern Hotel that time).
the basket in her right hand has toiletries (shampoo and conditioner, maybe) and her left hand is carrying the shower shoes Carla helped her make out of milk jugs
They can both claim the Q as an umbrella term, and they will have some common experiences of having people expect things of them they cannot fulfil, fears about coming out, fears about what it means for their dating expectations… Theoretically, all of the stripes of the rainbow flag should have some empathy for eachother.
I think cis people who are aware of their privilege are very quick to say, “But I could never understand the struggle of being trans,” even if they do have some things in common.
Oh my god if Ethan ends up accidentally outing her because Joyce still isn’t answering the question, then Jocelyne comes back and Joyce spends the whole thing in an autistic social panic, I will holler.
Prove it. You can’t and you wouldn’t if you could. You’re catching fish at a rate unprecedented, your boat is overflowed with them. Why do you feel you need all of these fish, knowing you cannot eat or sell them all before they spoil and are wasted? Your greed blinds you.
To be fair, “how to deal with someone who you have learned is XXX, but hasn’t come out to you about it yet” is something someone gay might have the experience to give some input to.
It’s funny cos it happens. It’s happened to me two or three times and I’ve been the Joyce of the situation yonks ago. Learning is a long ass process and it often starts with asking the wrong questions and having to sort through a lot of good and bad info.
Very very late to the party, so nothing I say will garbner attention, but *this* trans lady is highly invested in Joyce’s learning arc (not just cos Jocelyn) and I love how respectful she’s trying to be whilst also shoving her foot in it. Because I am also autistic and I feel Joyce’s struggle here *IN MY SOUL*.
I’d say ‘never change’ and mean it, but the whole arc of Joyce has been all about change. I guess, Joyce: always be you and be determined to make the changes you make. Sorry, I’m talking direct to a fictional character. Willis, you will never read this (I know) but, for the record, your writing has always been on point and your characters have always been beguiling – this version of Joyce has to be the most carefully drawn (ha) so far and I am here for it. You, sir: always be you but continue to be determined about the changes *you* make.
I don’t know how to phrase this without sounding cheesy, but sometimes seeing a person earnestly try to understand something, even if they do it awkwardly and imperfectly, is very, very heartwarming. “It’s the thought that counts” isn’t 100% true but it also isn’t 0% true. Everyone wants someone to understand them but it’s also very easy to mess up trying to understand. Easy to emphasise with both Joyce and Jocelyne in the story.
Ethan’s like “Sure, I do have an encyclopedic knowledge of who in your family is trans. But other than that why would you think I know anything about trans people?”
Joyce, you know what these things have in common? That they’re both the target of bigotry.
Also, who’s Ethan talking about? He doesn’t know Joycelyn, right? And Carla is not precisely secretive, so who’s left to come out of the closet (to Joyce anyway)?.
Panel four Ethan face. For a brief moment, he wasn’t locked deep in his dark self. He felt like he was part of the outside world, its positive developments. I hope to see more of that.
Well yeah, she’s still in the USA, where three miles apparently isn’t a reasonable walking distance anymore. There are no sidewalks, and the road abruptly drops off into a two meter ditch basically the moment the asphalt stops.
Everybody knows that LGBT isn’t just an acronym, it’s a map! G is two neighborhoods over from T, with B in-between. Now if you’re heading to T and you see Q signs, you’ve gone too far.
This isn’t great, but it’s actually significantly above neutral on the scale. She’s clearly asking something very inappropriate and of the wrong person. But she’s also reached out to someone she trusts, who knows her history and failings, and who she expects empathy from (albeit that might be insensitive itself seeing as she hasn’t checked up on him much since Halloween IIRC). And she’s trying to work out how to be best supportive, I *think*, she’s unfortunately however phrased it in a very misinterpretable way which can also read as “how do I report them”, was that what you were picking up on? Because I think she only sees the positive interpretation of what she’s just said. I’ve gotten into real trouble with that in years past myself; haven’t realised something could have been read as having unpleasant connotations when I’ve meant it totally benevolently. Autism!
Remember that diagnosis Joyce got? You know, the one that wasn’t that she needed glasses. If you were paying attention, you might have more tact and not insult someone on the spectrum who’s trying to learn.
This. I can’t say Joyce is doing WELL, here – this is exactly the issue Sarah called her out for when Booster was doing the rounds, the fact that her “private research” was just cornering the friends who were more lenient. But at the same time, it’s still so much better to ask someone gently who won’t be hurt and betrayed by the subject matter than to just foul up unknowingly. And Joyce, like a LOT of undiagnosed or late diagnosed autistics, is likely currently unsure whether to trust the vat of information she’d receive from a quick Google search to be helpful and sensitive, but is willing to trust the friends who have supported and guided her before.
She didn’t get diagnosed, she got told to have someone refer her to someone who could diagnose her. Aside from that though, you’re 100% correct. Tact is kind of a privilege, in a way.
In my experience (i’m trans), gay cismen (esp the white, more privileged kind) are very often just as far away from understanding trans realities as straight cis people. Unfortunately.
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half-expected her to mention the DOMino’s next to the SUBway, but I guess that’s outside of her field of view
I was gonna say I don’t think Joyce’s understanding of these topics has advanced that far yet, but then again she DOES enjoy reading Amber’s fics, so she must have some exposure to the concepts. Albeit through a very…Amber-tinted lens.
Joyce: “So, are you a Steve, or more of a Bucky?”
I far prefer Dominos and Subway to Charleys and Bibibop.
Take from that what you will.
Charley’s is good, but all these places are too expensive for someone in dire poverty, me
To quote Stinkin’ Lizaveta:
“I’ve lost seven pounds…
…and two teeth…
It’s hard to dance when I’m this weak.
I smell food but I can’t buy it:
Oh, Poverty! The Miracle Diet!”
Been there. Sending consoling vibes and hope.
Also 211, if you happen to be in North America. They seem to have a phone number for everything. And there’s nothing that tastes quite as sweet as free food, sometimes!
I can honestly say I have never heard of either Charley’s Subs or Bibibop.
Same.
Up here our local chains get snuffed out by the biggest of the basic national chains, but other regionals never follow. We still have our d’Angelo, but Subway is everywhere and we started seeing Jersey Mike’s pop up in the last few years.
Meanwhile, even further up here, with the exception of Subway, none of the chains mentioned even exist.
Instead we have the occasional Firehouse, which, thanks to the silly practice of actually being good, is slowly but surely removing the blight of Subway from our shores… to be replaced with Tim Horton’s or McDonalds, because even in Canada nature abhors a vaccuum.
Never been around Charley’s, which is a geography thing I guess.
My amazement is how Blimpie’s is still a going concwen.
Oh… Charleys and Bibipop are real? I thought they were like Nachitos, made up stand-ins for …. something, I dunno.
all the better for her Well B Ing:p
Huh, that’s so weird, that’s clearly somewhere in Bloomington, but I don’t recognize it in the slightest, I’ve never heard of any of those businesses, never seen any of those signs, but the reference to the Well’s library pretty clearly places it as local, and I recognize the architecture from a few other strip malls locally, so I know what part of town it is probably in, but it seems odd that I’ve never seen it before considering I’m a delivery driver and I’ve kind of been everywhere around here a few hundred times.
It’s like northeast US? bc we have them in the DC Metro area
ah, yes, the suburbs of being gay… i feel like this analogy can go south quite quickly
Nah, down south they don’t allow gay suburbs.
Joyce is trying.
Very trying.
(Had to, I know she’s getting a lot better, but you can’t tee up an opportunity for a Groucho quote and not have me take it.)
Would you belong to any club that would have you as a member?
Whatever it is, I’m against it!
Sometimes extremely so but she means well.
WAIT WHO IS ETHAN EXPECTING TO COME OUT… ethan what do you know
(unless im Completely Misreading this strip lmao)
Ethan thinks she’s talking about Jocelyne. She came out to him forever ago when Joyce’s family visited campus for parents day.
Oh, god. What if Ethan accidentally outs Jocelyn in the next strip or something
NIGHTMARE NIGHTMARE NIGHTMARE NIGHTMARE
It looks like Ethan caught himself in time.
Plus it’s just a cooler story for Jocelyn to have control over this reveal.
Counterpoint: She revealed herself to Ethan in hopes he might let it slip because she’s ambivalent about coming out to Joyce and was hoping the decision might be made for her.
At the time, it was very unsafe to tell Joyce. Jocelyn had no read yet on which way Joyce would go re: trans people, and Joyce had zero ability to lie to authority.
She’s been waiting a long time for Joyce to be ready to hear this information. It’s gonna be so great.
i am really glad Joyce is learning the basics on how to treat a trans person NOW, i hope this means she’ll be way less awkward when Jocelyne finally comes out. <3
Considering Joyce said “Who I’ve known for a while”, I wouldn’t think Ethan would think she was talking about Jocelyn, who she’s known for her whole life.
Jocelyne, who Joyce still doesn’t know about.
God I can’t wait to see the surely Mega Joyce Face when she realizes that
me neither, been waiting for their reunion so long now T_T
There’s a tumblr post about this that encapsulates my feelings about it very well https://www.tumblr.com/prince-atom/730254724255891456/when-becky-said-she-and-dina-were-getting-married
Jocelyne, Joyce’s sister. She came out to him when Joyce introduced him to her family. She had a blog website that she used her real name on.
Oh, he’s known for a while.
Time in this comic has no meaning.
Saw that strip was from 2013, and it immediately made me sprout like 5 new gray hairs
I got new joint pain from reading this comic. I’ve got pain in joints i didn’t even know existed!
My kids were 9 months old when that comic came out, and now they’re middle schoolers…
My kids were 9 months old when that comic came out, and now they’re going into middle school.
I tell my children they’re called wisdom.glitter. my eldest’s reaction was to tell me how wise I must be…
Has AARP contacted you yet?
How many years has it been since we saw her (Joc)?
Her last on-camera appearance was May 11, 2019.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/removed-2/
(She popped up once on Joyce’s Caller ID in 2021, but that was just her picture.)
There are a few bonus strips since then, mostly her and Miss Sakaki. But the “mid” May 2019 one also features Jordan (and is a flashback).
Oh shit, I forgot Jocelyne came out to Ethan.
…
Is that gonna be how Joyce learns about her?
OH MY I FORGOR
I continue to maintain that YOU POOR STUPID BABIES works as a comment on pretty much every DoA strip.
It’s confusing because I was fresh out of college myself when DoA first began, these characters were practically a peer group, and their Walkyverse incarnations were comfortably older than me.
But these days…yeah, they’re all poor stupid babies.
Having started reading before college and now being between my bachelors and masters degrees, I look forward to this …interesting experience!
Oh hey. A rare comic that showcases how obscenely tall Carla is.
Is she actually taller than Ethan? Posture is accounting for some of it of course but they look pretty close in height at least.
It’s the skates I think
And the skates do boost her a lil
The skates are naturally a part of her body, so it still counts
Carla is maybe taller than him with skates on. With regular shoes, she’s tall, but still shorter than him. Ethan is I wanna say taller than Jacob, maybe about the same height as Joe, but the three are around the same height. Joyce has a type, it’d seem.
I want to say that Carla is in the same ballpark as Sarah, height-wise, maybe a touch taller.
Oh, Jocelyne. When will you return? …..Signs say try again soon.
The storyline after this one is called “The One Where Jocylene Returns”
Ehh it’s probably nothing
Where did you find that future chapter title?
The archive, on the top banner just underneath the title click on”archive” and you’ll see a list of all the chapters including ones that have strips in the backlog that haven’t been posted yet, right now it looks like Willis is two stories ahead of us
Only two? They must be slowing down in their moderate age. Back in my day a Willis would be 5 chapters ahead and doing six other comics on the side!
They just don’t make Willis’s the way they used to.
That’s an 8 month buffer, buddy!!
The Archives drop-down menu has the names of upcoming storylines at the bottom of its scroll.
The next two storylines of Book 15 are “The One Where Jocelyne Returns” and “Me And Who You Say I Was Yesterday”.
[This Is That Part]
soon
Does Joyce even have to do anything, really
Though I guess her heart is in the right place.
I could see more how that makes Ethan think it’s about her sister because what does she have to do in regards to Carla? With her sister, she’ll need to work on adjusting her thinking and how she refers to her a bit.
For a moment, Ethan’s surprise was so hardcore you could almost say he lit up. And then the Depresso Face was back.
Joyce, babygirl, I do get the analogy but pls tread carefully sdkgjs
Look, she’s wrong, but she’s groping her way towards the understanding that ultimately all liberation struggles are actually one struggle, she’ll get yelled at and it’ll be fine
Nobody’s free until all of us are free ✊✊✨
But yeah: Clumsy wording and all Intent Matters, and every time she learns faster.
The important nuance is that she’s asking out of ignorance, not malice.
Yelling at her for asking questions, even rudely, would be an incredibly stupid thing to do. ‘How dare you be ignorant!’
I mean, she DOES have the part about Charlie’s sub right
Eh?? EHHHHH???
Good lord. I had missed that specific aspect entirely. Bravo.
Technically speaking, the T is only one letter away from G in the LGBTQA+, so in that sense she isn’t wrong. But somebody needs to sit her down and properly explain everything.
I mean, she used to think ethan wasn’t gay b/c he wasn’t “holding a barbie doll/wearing a skirt” so someone in her friend circle talking about it is prolly better
Although considering leslie is the gender studies teacher, i wonder how often trans ppl would come up
Leslie did mention her regret that the 101 course didn’t cover more genders.
(How do I remember stuff like this, I can’t even remember people who actively know me, let alone random things they’ve said many years ago.)
She really needs that brochure from the pizza thing way back when.
But it’s three letters away in QUILTBAG.
Why did I not previously realise the letter soup could be an anagram?! That is adorable! A quiltbag made of loads of tiny flags!!!
What’s the U for? Undeclared? Just curious.
Undertale
Ah. Makes sense. I knew I was forgetting one! Thanks, Taffy!
Undertale-sexual. The one that means your only sexually attracted to Skeletons with Blue flames in their eyes or Strong fish ladies that try to kill you.
She’s trying to learn.
It’s not anyone’s responsibility since she’s technically an adult, but it does fall to her friends and community to help her understand.
Given that Ethan is her friend, in her community, and part of the LGBT+ community… not a bad person to pick.
But considering he’s definitely going through… a lot.
Maaaaybe don’t ask the first person you see?
well, i’m sure it’ll be fine, ethan needs a somewhat stable friend too even if things with asher are going well
wonder if she’ll have a talk with booster, although their experiences might be diff
I mean, it could be worse. She could’ve asked Jennifer.
But yeah it woulda made more sense to ask, say, Malaya or Booster.
well i imagine jen’s not too fond of carla but that had nothing to do with her benig trans lol (although i don’t really know if malaya would rly be wiling to have a ‘friendly chat’ about it since joyce said she ‘transcends friendship”)
Honestly, I can see asking Booster being hard work, because, y’know, Booster. They’d want to analyse her about it.
Not nearly as hard work as asking Malaya, however, although it might help Joyce extend her range of profanity now that she does that.
Ethan’s been going through this ‘lot’ for a while – being asked to help a friend with something, even as simple as sharing some personal knowledge/perspective, can be good to draw one out from their own troubles for a moment.
Also this is familiar territory for Joyce and Ethan. One of her first big signs of growth was breaking up with Ethan because he was gay and she didn’t want to be his beard. Joyce was instrumental in getting Ethan to the GSA meeting, which seemed to be an overall positive for him. They’ve had some big, complex conversations about sex, love, and dating. I get why she would choose to ask him.
“oh hey you’re a gay man, tell me about trans women” and if you don’t see the issue with that you don’t know nearly enough trans women.
Yep, and that’s why it’s a question. Y’know, an attempt at gathering information. Attempts can fail, it’s actually fine and completely legal.
it definitely reflects some fucked-up attitudes but, well, we already knew joyce had a lot of those rattling around; and luckily she’s fictional so she stands a much better chance of deciding not to be malicious about it
oh hell yes i got a carla gravatar
Joyce, you do know how to use a computer. Please use a computer, and a search engine, and the terms “LGBTQ+ 101” and stop asking your dormmates to be walking FAQs.
tbf i wouldn’t be surprised if google and the like had some ‘biased research’, bc you could easily stumble upon the rabbit hole of all the ‘discourse’/in-fighting but you’d think there’d be more seminars like the ‘questioning’ one tho that was more gender focused than sexuality
This reminds me of a lesson in one of my writing classes in college. This was back in the early-to-mid-00s, when the internet was still getting established as a source for schoolwork. We went to the computer lab and the professor had us look up MLK Jr., because at this point Stormfront had gotten their rancid lying hate page boosted in the rankings so it was if not the top, one of the top sources. The point of the lesson was “don’t trust the internet, and don’t assume a high Google ranking means anything.” So, yeah, good on Joyce, and more so if they’re in our floating timeline where AI has ruined the shit out of everything.
Look, it’s not 2010 in-universe anymore, trying to find useful information with a search engine these days is like asking a kindergarten class where they think babies come from.
Nowadays you ask some chatbot what to do, and it learned from some random X post that it’s ok to eat them on pizza. (Sigh.)
Ludicity: “I Will Fucking Piledrive You If You Mention AI Again”
Thanks, I’ve been looking for this article and I couldn’t remember which appropriate act of violence was in the title.
Okay, but have you tried a non-binary and spinach pizza? If not, don’t knock it/its.
I want you to know that this? This is a perfect joke. It cracked me right the fuck up.
I mean, she literally TOOK LGBTQ+ 101
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-12/02-ill-leave-you-a-phantom/determine/
but evidently it went right over her, (-_-) sigh
As revealed in the previous strip, she actually did really well in the class, but she has some difficulty applying it.
hope is not lost
evidence suggests that when it comes to this stuff, Joyce is more of a “hands on” learner
Good thing she’s not fucking doing that, then. Jesus Christ, why is it always a fucking problem when someone is actively trying to learn something, from someone who might know it, or at least know where to look for it? Quit fucking pretending you were born with the answers coming out of your pampered little asses, people.
It IS ok to have conversations with your friends. Joyce is a good example of how to stumble towards understanding with a little help from your friends. Going online is a recipe for disaster and being the next mass killer. Definitely don’t go on the Telegram social network/broadcast medium shudder ew.
For real, like if I look up “how to learn about queer people”, I fucking guarantee I’ll find a list of addresses and recipes within ten minutes. It’s literally not safe if you’re not In The Know™, and The Know™ has to keep relocating because the wrong people keep getting in. Friends aren’t unhinged randos inside your computer, gathered together by an algorithm to determine the most advertiser-friendly answers to what you wanna know, they’re people in your life you can rely on to help you, even if helping you only amounts to “Hell, Idk the answer”.
I absolutely want my friends and family to ask me questions. Because they will actually listen if I tell them that I’m not in a good place to answer them at that time. The last thing I’d want is for someone to go online and stumble onto the Cass report and Galbraith’s bullshit. If someone asks can discuss my experiences and give them beneficial website to go to. But I have had complete strangers accosted me acting lime they were entitled to lime I’m some sort of queer eniac.
Sure and that last bit sucks, but it isn’t what’s happening here.
Ethan’s like “Sure, I do have an encyclopedic knowledge of who in your family is trans. But other than that why would you think I know anything about trans people?”
Oops, meant this to be its own comment.
No Human Interaction. Do Not Ask Questions of People You Have Personal Relationships With. Keep Eyes Straight Ahead or On Devices. Charismatic Bloggers Shall Speak for Everyone They Share a Demographic With.
THIS
Frequently Aggravated Queers, yes.
I mean, I guess she’s already dismissed Mary’s attempt to turn her into a TERF, so there isn’t too much danger that Google will do so. Still not somewhere I’d turn for actual information, though.
“Do your own research!”
I absolutely get that queer people don’t want to and don’t have to take on the task of educating everyone around them, but let’s not pretend the Internet is a safe, better way.
She asked him a single fucking question because she’s trying not to cause harm. Can we PLEASE stop demonizing normal human interactions by people trying their best? Ethan is perfectly within his rights to say “I’m not comfortable having this conversation” and so far he hasn’t.
I get that it can be exhausting to constantly answer questions, but treating them like The Enemy because they wanted a human connection over a digital one for a difficult topic is so needlessly weird.
We should really shelve concepts like “emotional labor” until people learn what it entails tbh.
Emotional labor is when anyone asks anything of me at all.
*puts on pince nez glasses and stares over them pedantically*
Yes, mm, tech-ni-calllly what is happening here is “emotional work,” not “emotional labor” as described in the original paper that popularized these terms.
It’s also not like Ethan and Joyce are total randos to each other. They’ve drifted apart considerably, yes, but they have considerable history.
I love how being surprised briefly turns Ethan into Ethan Classic.
Also, this makes me wonder if Ethan has been talking to Jocelyn. They exchanged contact info obviously a ways back, but Ethan’s been so withdrawn this semester. Of course, maybe it’d be easier for him to touch base through a screen than in person, so… who knows.
well, he was going through a lot tho idk if jocelyne would’ve asked ethan to ‘check in’ on joyce after her phone call was ignored (although personally it might’ve been better to reach out to becky)
Just how many fast food franchises does the US have? Are your streets endless loops of these restaurants?
To absurd degrees, yes. Though some areas are more oversaturated than others.
usually how it goes is that you can go for miles without seeing any then suddenly find a whole LOT of them right next to each other
The number is high, but seems higher from the outside because quite a few of them are regional. For instance, I am in Texas, and we have many Whataburger locations, but in, say, New York, there would be none at all.
Yes, true. I’ve never heard of these joints she’s mentioning. They make them up and brand them at a fast clip and then bulldoze all the pastures to put more up. Suburbs are full of miles of strip malls. Some of these corporations own dozens of brands and thousands of “restaurants.”
A lot. and sometimes. They tend to be clustered on main thoroughfares, and if those are long enough you get repeats.
not to mention the ‘mini’ fast food places within gas stations and such, if not just a gas station where you can get hot coffee and such, but depends on where you live.
(tho at least in tx if you don’t want like mcdonalds/taco bell, you could easily find a ‘local’ burger joint or taco place)
Depends on where you live. I live in a small town in Florida, which is a state that pulls in lots of visitors and tourists AKA people who’d want food on the go. So along the stretch of road that cuts across my small town we have McDonalds, Burger King, Hardees, Subway, Checkers, Zaxby’s, Taco Bell, Wendy’s, Dominos, and Pizza Hut. And that’s just the actual big name franchises, we have a bunch of smaller, family owned food places too!
I don’t think you understand just how branded this country is, if you have to ask that. A town could have exactly the same variety of food and shopping as its neighbor, but if Town A has a locally-owned single restaurant called Chuck’s Burgers and Town B has a McDonald’s, Americans will literally drive 40 miles to Town B to eat sewage because it has that brand on it. Chuck’s burgers are all made from locally-farmed ingredients, made by people who get paid enough to show up and care, and a lot of the locals know Chuck personally, but that does not matter in the slightest to Americans. They need the brand, no matter how much actual enrichment Chuck gives them and how actually nice Town A is, because the magic TV box and mail coupons and billboards and T-shirts and radio and sidewalk and traffic signs and toys and stickers and school work all tell them so.
No, that’s not even it. It’s that where I’m sitting, if you want to go to a burger place, your choices are McDonald’s and, in some of the larger cities, Burger King. That’s it. The long, long list of brands found in the US simply hasn’t made it across except for these two; and because burgers are pretty much only known as industrial fast food, there are no small family-owned burger places – the very concept doesn’t compute.
Mobility has something to do with it, too. If you’re passing through an unfamiliar town (or neighborhood) and feeling hungry, it’s: “Chuck’s Burgers? are they any good? Oh! a McDonald’s, I know their stuff.” Sometimes I don’t feel adventurous.
Well, I’m sorry you like the taste of human body waste and cleaning fluids, but for the same price you could get actual food made by someone who doesn’t wish you’d die.
Seriously, McDonald’s really just costs the same as a sit-in restaurant now, it’s fuckin’ wacky.
You’re making my place in the city and my parents’ place in the country sound idyllic by comparison, and they are not.
Any reference to you or your family is imagined.
makes sense, we’re imaginary.
Mostly we have so many different franchises because we’re so big and most of them are regional (in some cases very local).
We do have a lot of such restaurants most places, but hardly endless loops.
I like that this is phrased as if other countries don’t also have a bunch of fast food franchises. This isn’t a uniquely USA thing, I say this having lived in three countries and visited many more. We just get shit on for it more because people refuse to understand how BIG the US is.
Like, you can literally fit the entirety of Europe inside of Kansas alone, with room left for a few outlying island countries.
Not quite, but you can fit most of Europe inside the United States. (Europe is 1/2 Kansas bigger than the U.S.)
No. You’re wrong.
Europe’s coastline is deceptively long, like the small intestine.
i wonder if ethan has been keeping up, other than just knowing the website i guess they haven’t really emailed each other
i assume it’s a local indian restaurant? tho i read ‘bibibop’ as bibimbap at first lol
“BIBIBOP is a fast casual restaurant that offers healthy, Asian-inspired ingredients for bowls and salads.”
Mostly a Midwest chain, with one Santa Monica outlier.
(meant to write indiana lol)
Ah i see. although healthy salads aside i feel like korean fried chicken might be more popular as well
Yeah, Korean Fried Chicken has gotten popular enough that KFC literally has a “Korean BBQ” sauce now to try to drag back some mindshare, which I find hilarious.
Just staring at the word ‘bibibop’ trying to figure out if my brain is freaking out while trying to read the word ‘bishop’
Optimistic take:
Ethan goes from this to telling Joyelyn that it might be okay to come out to Joyce.
I think he will, yeah. There’s honestly not likely to be any other reason for Jocelyne to show up.
The saddest part is that this is genuinely a immense improvement from how she was at the start.
Improvement is sad?
Why is that sad?
I used sad as an humorous exaggeration of the fact that while this is pretty cringe, it’s miles better of how she would reacted to the same situation at the start of the comic.
yeah like
at the start of DoA Joyce was downright SCARY
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2020/comic/book-10/02-to-remind-you-of-my-love/situation/
It’s been acknowledged in-universe before, too. Joyce has grown quite a bit as a person in what has, in-universe, been a matter of months.
god right? can’t really explain to people that this sucks without the cis coming in and being like “BUT SHE IS TRYING AND THAT’S ALL THAT MATTERS BECAUSE INTENT IS MAGIC”
Literally nobody said intent was magic, you made that up. Joyce is not causing even minor harm, it’s fine.
I want to make clear that my comment doesn’t mean any of that and that I strongly disagree with you.
You’re really going out of your way to ignore all of the non-cis people expressing a very similar sentiment, huh?
I guess we’re honorary cisfolk now, since we don’t fit the narrative.🤷
Hey, trans person here who disagrees with you – you have literally no idea who is behind the screen and we’re not a fucking monolith bearing a single opinion. Grow up.
I… Actually will give her this one. Being called LGBTQ+ has probably lead to that assumption a LOT
That’s what I’m thinking. She’s misguided, yes, but she’s trying. “The G and the T are both part of that, so they should have some insight into each other, right?” She is seeking insight and understanding, she just doesn’t know where and who to seek it from.
And she’s not entirely wrong. Gay men more likely to have some positive knowledge of Trans issues than straights. She could go to Booster or Malaya, but she knows Ethan a lot better.
Plus she sees him first – it’s not like she specifically sought anyone out.
Exactly. Bi cis woman here, I probably know a lot more about trans people than cishet people just by being more active in queer spaces. Ethan is not really there yet, though? He’s dating / sleeping around but we haven’t really seen him actively seek out a community apart from that one time he and Joyce went to the LGBTQI+ meet-up together.
as a cis *woman* you have far more in common with trans *women* than cis gay *men* do
hopefully this emphasis will help some of the cis in this comment thread to pull their heads out of their asses
You’re absolutely right, however I didn’t say I have more in common with trans people, but that I know more about them in general than most cishet people do. I am talking purely about knowledge, not about common experiences. But I should probably have specified that I have this knowledge because I am a bi woman who frequents queer spaces that are fairly diverse. Some queer people of all types of identity do not have access to those spaces, or they might not actively seek them out (like Ethan is gay and sleeps with gay men but does not seek out queer bars, political movements or communities).
(Once again I should have proofread my comment before posting, apologise for the spelling errors and also Ethan does not exclusively sleep with gay men so there was no reason to specify “gay men” in that context)
joyce please
Please what?
I’m genuinely baffled what people think she’s supposed to do here. She’s not hurting anyone, she’s information gathering and pretty politely at that.
It isn’t her fault she just doesn’t know yet.
you can still hurt people with your ignorance!
But she’s not.
I wonder how people who know they are ignorant, and don’t want to be ignorant, stop being ignorant.
Pretty sure they’re supposed to wither and die for the crime of willfully and defiantly being born without the knowledge tattooed on their soul.
They go on the internet, do their own research and get infected by the absolute worst bigots of course.
Y’know it’s been so long, I actually completely forgot we only know about Jocelyn because of that one time she talked to Ethan.
For a second, I thought Joyce’s vest was the lesbian flag lmao
As if I wasn’t already super anticipating her return next chapter, here Ethan is ramping up the hype!
I do gotta wonder about why Willis chose to use a literal descriptive title like this, though, as opposed to the usual vague ones. Makes me wonder if there’s gonna be a surprise appearance by another character in addition to her.
I think it’s because once there was a semi vague chapter title about a sister and everyone thought it was about Jocelyne and then it was actually about Liz.
I remember that, it was hilarious. I seem to recall making a comment beforehand jokingly predicting something like that would happen, although I can’t seem to find it.
oh THATS why this came up, the universe is hinting at joyce that jocelyn is about to come out
It’s really nice to see Carla roller skating onscreen again. There was a long spell where we never saw it (unless my memory sucks, which it does). But it’s happened a lot in the past couple of weeks.
This story line is absolutely awesome.
I’d say it probably took time for her to get new skates in the mail, but she’s Carla. She would’ve gotten them express delivered by courier.
Great, I had to look up what the fuck a “bibibop” is. Some restaurant I’ve never heard of and will probably never encounter, cool.
I went to one once when I was visiting family in Ohio, I seem to recall liking it fairly well.
The only good chain restaurants I ever encountered in Ohio were the original Wendy’s, across from the old COSI on Broad Street in Columbus (I was staying at the Christopher Inn), and an Arthur Treacher’s in the German Village neighborhood (I was at the old Great Southern Hotel that time).
I asked my three weed-smoking girlfriends (who smoke weed btw) and they all agreed that Joyce’s simile here is very powerful
Very powerful. Very beautiful.
They smoke weed?
OMG Ethan isn’t talking about Carla is he
nope, he was thinking of Joss
Why is Joyce carrying all that stuff? She can’t possibly be going to the shower like that, surely?
looked like a shower caddy and shoes (jug shoes?) to me, but she’s very dressed for being on her way to the shower so idk
maybe she’s coming back from the shower
Brought her clothes for the day to the shower so she wouldn’t have to put the old ones back on?
She’s wearing a completely different outfit now. Why would she do that first?
I wondered if the heat had gone out in the dorm.
the basket in her right hand has toiletries (shampoo and conditioner, maybe) and her left hand is carrying the shower shoes Carla helped her make out of milk jugs
I mean, they are listed together with Ls and B’s.
They can both claim the Q as an umbrella term, and they will have some common experiences of having people expect things of them they cannot fulfil, fears about coming out, fears about what it means for their dating expectations… Theoretically, all of the stripes of the rainbow flag should have some empathy for eachother.
I think cis people who are aware of their privilege are very quick to say, “But I could never understand the struggle of being trans,” even if they do have some things in common.
True, but they still might be able to give a primer for those even less aware.
trust that I speak from experience when I say:
no more than any other random cis person you might meet
Yes, though in this case, Ethan having the barest knowledge of the subject whatsoever would be a lifeline to Joyce.
Oh my god if Ethan ends up accidentally outing her because Joyce still isn’t answering the question, then Jocelyne comes back and Joyce spends the whole thing in an autistic social panic, I will holler.
Okay NOW Ethan is annoyed with Joyce.
Prove it. You can’t and you wouldn’t if you could. You’re catching fish at a rate unprecedented, your boat is overflowed with them. Why do you feel you need all of these fish, knowing you cannot eat or sell them all before they spoil and are wasted? Your greed blinds you.
I doubt it.
I see that expression as “struggling to comprehend Joyce’s increasingly strained analogy.”
God I can’t believe how unbelievably close Ethan came to outing Joyce’s sister
stop god damn skating in the halls already ><
Why does it bug you?
socially we are conditioned to not allow trans women to have anything
Carla enjoys being loud and obnoxious when people are trying to study.
And that’s very sexy of her.
Hope you are aware that if you say that to Carla she would skate in the halls even harder specifically to annoy you.
Yunno I completely forgot ethan knew about jocelyn
I was really confused until the third or fourth reading when I suddenly remembered.
To be fair, “how to deal with someone who you have learned is XXX, but hasn’t come out to you about it yet” is something someone gay might have the experience to give some input to.
Really happy to see that moment of Ethan classic on his face. It’s nice.
yes, First time the Emo Ethan is gone for a while
Joyce, please, throw away the shovel.
Wow, Ethan’s eyes really came alive for a moment there :’)
It’s funny cos it happens. It’s happened to me two or three times and I’ve been the Joyce of the situation yonks ago. Learning is a long ass process and it often starts with asking the wrong questions and having to sort through a lot of good and bad info.
Semi-relevant
Bah humbug.
DOA meme
I’m just wondering what that entire map of queerness looks like.
Very very late to the party, so nothing I say will garbner attention, but *this* trans lady is highly invested in Joyce’s learning arc (not just cos Jocelyn) and I love how respectful she’s trying to be whilst also shoving her foot in it. Because I am also autistic and I feel Joyce’s struggle here *IN MY SOUL*.
I’d say ‘never change’ and mean it, but the whole arc of Joyce has been all about change. I guess, Joyce: always be you and be determined to make the changes you make. Sorry, I’m talking direct to a fictional character. Willis, you will never read this (I know) but, for the record, your writing has always been on point and your characters have always been beguiling – this version of Joyce has to be the most carefully drawn (ha) so far and I am here for it. You, sir: always be you but continue to be determined about the changes *you* make.
Somehow I know she’s going to do everything wrong but still get it so right.
Same here! Trans, autistic, and having a blast. I’ve been looking forward to this for a while.
Like I’ve said before, she’s a self-insert character, so I assume her path will mirror Willis’.
I don’t know how to phrase this without sounding cheesy, but sometimes seeing a person earnestly try to understand something, even if they do it awkwardly and imperfectly, is very, very heartwarming. “It’s the thought that counts” isn’t 100% true but it also isn’t 0% true. Everyone wants someone to understand them but it’s also very easy to mess up trying to understand. Easy to emphasise with both Joyce and Jocelyne in the story.
Also, nice yellow dress. Looks very spinny.
I really love your read on this, thank you <3
Help her out, Ethan. Joyce is new to all the suburban planning and zones.
Ethan’s like “Sure, I do have an encyclopedic knowledge of who in your family is trans. But other than that why would you think I know anything about trans people?”
Joyce, you know what these things have in common? That they’re both the target of bigotry.
Also, who’s Ethan talking about? He doesn’t know Joycelyn, right? And Carla is not precisely secretive, so who’s left to come out of the closet (to Joyce anyway)?.
After going through the comments, I completely forgot that Ethan does know about Joycelyne.
Aaaaaand I’ve reported myself.
Panel four Ethan face. For a brief moment, he wasn’t locked deep in his dark self. He felt like he was part of the outside world, its positive developments. I hope to see more of that.
I really hope this plotline helps both him and Jocelyne.
just skipping over “Gayborhood” , i see
I know there’s a Mr. Rogers joke in there somewhere, there’s just gotta be.
Hehehehehehehehehehe
You’re gonna need a car to traverse those, Joyce XD
Well yeah, she’s still in the USA, where three miles apparently isn’t a reasonable walking distance anymore. There are no sidewalks, and the road abruptly drops off into a two meter ditch basically the moment the asphalt stops.
And you need to drive outside the Suburb to get to any store or entertainment XD Those zoning laws are so silly
Everybody knows that LGBT isn’t just an acronym, it’s a map! G is two neighborhoods over from T, with B in-between. Now if you’re heading to T and you see Q signs, you’ve gone too far.
Joyce continues her trend of saying just the actual shittiest, dumbest thing she possibly can.
You think THIS is the shittiest thing someone could possibly say in this scenario?
If you think this is the shittiest thing someone can say in this scenario, then I envy your innocence but also…no, no it’s *really* not.
This isn’t great, but it’s actually significantly above neutral on the scale. She’s clearly asking something very inappropriate and of the wrong person. But she’s also reached out to someone she trusts, who knows her history and failings, and who she expects empathy from (albeit that might be insensitive itself seeing as she hasn’t checked up on him much since Halloween IIRC). And she’s trying to work out how to be best supportive, I *think*, she’s unfortunately however phrased it in a very misinterpretable way which can also read as “how do I report them”, was that what you were picking up on? Because I think she only sees the positive interpretation of what she’s just said. I’ve gotten into real trouble with that in years past myself; haven’t realised something could have been read as having unpleasant connotations when I’ve meant it totally benevolently. Autism!
At this point i really can’t just say “it’s innocence” it’s just having no tact at all
Remember that diagnosis Joyce got? You know, the one that wasn’t that she needed glasses. If you were paying attention, you might have more tact and not insult someone on the spectrum who’s trying to learn.
This. I can’t say Joyce is doing WELL, here – this is exactly the issue Sarah called her out for when Booster was doing the rounds, the fact that her “private research” was just cornering the friends who were more lenient. But at the same time, it’s still so much better to ask someone gently who won’t be hurt and betrayed by the subject matter than to just foul up unknowingly. And Joyce, like a LOT of undiagnosed or late diagnosed autistics, is likely currently unsure whether to trust the vat of information she’d receive from a quick Google search to be helpful and sensitive, but is willing to trust the friends who have supported and guided her before.
She didn’t get diagnosed, she got told to have someone refer her to someone who could diagnose her. Aside from that though, you’re 100% correct. Tact is kind of a privilege, in a way.
Is Joyce still speaking English here? I didn’t understand that last panel at all.
Apparently those are names of restaurants.
I look forward to Joyce getting educated on LGBTQ and discovering she’s bi.
Slow down! Let’s keep it to one shocking revelation per day XD
“Wait a minute, it’s not straight to charge my J.O. crystals with my best gal pal, and to secretly wish it was her hand instead of mine????”
It’s not straight to ask her if I can watch her having sex while I cover my eye and only see her body?? C’mon, that’s just gals bein pals!
The heterosexual urge to watch your same-sex bestie get railed.
god i love bibibop i need them to come to michigan
Oh I forgot Ethan knew about Jocelyne! I’d love to see her in this story
previewed panel, but two days off. I guess two strips got added in between the enbuffering and today.
Oh my Cheeze Ethan thinks Joyce found out about the other trans woman she knows.
Ah, good old Joyce. Always finding the wrong way to ask every question.
“I mean, it’s ‘LGBT’, right? Aren’t all you guys, like…?”
*Seamus voice*: Are these Midwest restaurant franchise references workin’ for ye?
In my experience (i’m trans), gay cismen (esp the white, more privileged kind) are very often just as far away from understanding trans realities as straight cis people. Unfortunately.