the dumping stairs, on her birthday

Transcript

Joyce: I... told Dorothy that I informed you about her and me. And that you gave us your blessing! WHICH IS TRUE!
Joe: But you left out the-- Okay.
Joe: Okay. I am going to SAVE your new relationship.
Joe: RETROACTIVELY, I have dumped you, okay? You are DUMPED. Never tell Dorothy about this.
Joyce: ...okay. I'm sorry, Joe.
Joyce: ...do you want me to give you back the weighted blanket you gave me?
Joe: Keep it. I bought it because I LOVE YOU.
Joe: And THAT will NEVER change.
Joyce: ...I love you, too.

Give back
Posted on May 5, 2026 by David M Willis

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Tags: joe, joyce

245 thoughts on “Give back”

  1. Wack'd

    An important reminder:
    .
    We are here to talk about the comic, not each other.
    .
    I saw a lot of comments yesterday about who the comments section hates more, which characters are more likely to be taken in bad faith by the comments, who in the comments is using motivated reasoning to arrive at a bad take.
    .
    So a reminder: Comments that are making broad, sweeping accusations about other commenters will be removed. Rants about how bad someone else’s take is will be removed. Comments that are personal insults directed at one another will be removed.
    .
    Apart from fostering an unhealthy environment, it really just encourages people to engage in already-established off-limits behavior about mindless character dunking. If you say “commenters are so much harder on Joe than on Joyce,” it’s just an invitation for all the folks who don’t like Joe to show up and explain to you how much he sucks! Metadiscourse on character dunking is just more character dunking!
    .
    And if someone is being bigoted, report them. Your three-paragraph essay on why “you’re allowed to be monogamous” is an anti-polyamory dogwhistle is just gonna get deleted when the original comment does. It’s just not worth it.
    .
    And yes, before anyone points it out: yes, I get to make sweeping generalizations about how much y’all suck. If it helps, imagine that I’m a unionized hater trying to clear the workplace of scabs. Y’all wanna dunk on each other, get Willis to pay you first.

    1. Li

      I’m not going to try to make any kind of defense of the irritable sniping you just deleted, apart from not having read this comment before I typed it out, but I do feel the need to point out that multiple paragraphs explaining why something is a dog whistle might actually be worth leaving up, since readers who might’ve agreed with the original comment might learn more from that explanation than from just seeing the whole thread disappear — especially if it’s not clear what happened or what got removed. Especially since Willis demonstrated the ability to delete a comment without deleting all the replies to it a month or so back.
      .
      Like I don’t think I was the one who posted that, but. I fundamentally disagree with the idea that explaining why a thing is bigoted is ever going to be not worth it, even if the comment doesn’t stick around for more than an hour.

      1. Wack'd

        I’m not saying it’s never worth it in any context to try to explain why someone’s being a bigot. That’s a very complicated and nuanced subject I have a lot of complicated feelings on.
        .
        This is a very public space. No one here has the ability to slip into a private message and explain how someone fucks up. Every argument contributes to the atmosphere of the overall space. I want this to be a place kind people want to comment, and I think that is simply less likely if they see a bigoted comment, let alone a bigoted comment followed immediately by a huge argument. (I will grant there are some people who’ll see a huge argument and go “oh yeah, tag me in,” but I don’t want that sort of person to comment, so.)
        .
        Look. I’m not gonna make “report bigots and move on” a hard and fast rule. I also think it’s pretty bad optics if, like, a bigoted comment spends hours just sitting there like a turd on the sidewalk because it didn’t reach the automod threshold. And I think it would just plain be a dick move to say people can’t defend themselves from shit like that, optics or no. This is one of those cases where, upon reflection, I don’t actually know what the right answer is. I want this to be a place where I can say “use your best judgement” and that works, but I think yesterday illustrated for a multitude of reasons that the day where that’s the right approach is still some time off.
        .
        I guess my real conclusion is that if your in-depth argument with some little creep gets annihilated, don’t be shocked.

        1. NGPZ

          honestly “report and move on” SHOULD be the standard modus operandi moving forward, hard rule or not

          we can and we should, venerate the truth without acknowledging the lies, the liars, or those who relentlessly repeat them

          in this political climate, the topics of these discussions are of some very real impact on other peoples’ lives — they are in fact, NOT a game of intellectual Bey-Blade or some shit

          if some provocative bigoted asshole thinks they can force you to play defense, just know — you don’t have to play at ALL, and it’s for the best that you DON’T 👀

        2. Wack'd

          and with two sides now represented i am going to ask that no further arguments take place in this thread about the nature of arguments, please and thank you

        3. ProfNekko

          so is that why my comments for the past few days have been removed within minutes even though I didn’t leave any inappropriate comments?

        4. Wack'd

          You can scroll down to my reply to ADLegend21 on why I won’t answer questions like this. Sorry.

        5. Li

          I am currently expecting to have comments continue to be deleted until I get a better feel for what the rules are. So, no shock happening here, don’t worry, heh.
          .
          My instinct is that the top post was potentially starting an era where provocative top comments get to stand and the rebuttals and arguments they were deliberately provoking get deleted, which might suck for some things, but eh. Growing pangs. I’ll live.

      2. nadamás

        Thanks for the vote of confidence Li I am pretty wack refers to a comment I made. I don’t personally care that much that it got deleted and i don’t take anything I said either. It just is what it is.

    2. Mira

      This is totally unrelated to the main content of the announcement, but I’m genuinely confused about the union/scab metaphor at the end and how it applies to this situation.

      I feel like these are two scenarios with vastly different power dynamics, and I don’t understand how it’s helpful to map one onto another, or what implications that’s meant to have. Could somebody who does get the metaphor explain it to me?

      As I understand it, scabs are generally workers who are getting paid by a company/entity in a way that bypasses or undercuts the collective action of the union — so then in what way would a difference in who is being paid (and/or who holds official designation) make unpaid/unofficial commenters equivalent to scabs? Who/what is the company and union in this metaphor?

      1. Alaztyr

        Wack’d is explicitly chosen for the job of deciding what is and is not content the author wants swirling around in the public forum, presumably for a reason. Fully above-board card carrying union officer calling the shots on policy.

        People who circumvent that policy because they don’t like it while trying to piggyback off of the provided means of communication that is provided for a specific purpose and general interest: scabs. The company is Willis’s vision.

        1. thejeff

          The problem is that in the union/scab/company situation, the union is in conflict with the company/scabs. The company hires scabs to try to break a union strike.
          The only way this makes sense as a metaphor is if Willis is metaphorically the union and Wack’d a paid organizer trying to weed out scabs.
          I’m not sure what, if anything, is the company in this scenario.

    3. nadamás

      If it’s going to be deleted anyway I don’t see any reason not to post it (since you are referring to my comment yesterday). I am also pretty ok with any of my comments getting deleted for any reason, I don’t have the mental bandwidth to remember all the rules all the time so I just trust if I break them the comment will be deal with.

      1. Caroline

        “I’m cool with throwing garbage on the floor, because it’s the janitor’s job to pick it up anyways.”

        1. Wack'd

          my dad used to literally say this about movie theaters and get upset when i collected my popcorn bucket and candy wrappers to discard after the film. drove me nuts

  2. Mitzi B.

    DUMPING OF AGE

    1. Foxtastic

      this is so good with your icon LOL

    2. Cholma

      All ships are sunk! From now on it will just be dump after dump!

      1. Corey C.

        DoJo will live on forever now because it’s the last ship sailing…

        Oh, wait, there’s also Sal and Danny… dang…

      2. Sharizard

        *SalxDanny shudders uncomfortably*

        1. Steamweed

          NOOOO! Do not sink my Sanny ship!

    3. anon

      imagine a life imitating art scenario where the percentage of dumping/breakups actually do happen on this stair case irl after this comic spiking up (which i suppose statistically is true not counting any via text breakups lol)

      1. Leadsynth

        Surely some relationships have STARTED on these stairs too

  3. EpochFlame

    I love that they still love each other. Looking forward to see how Joe moves on from here.

    1. Rose By Any Other Name

      I, meanwhile, am looking forward to neither of them remotely moving on from this.

      1. Skewbrow

        Yeah. Some day, Joyce will feel an overwhelming need to get smooshed. And there is only one cure to that. A long way to get there, and unforeseen tutrns and twists along the way.

        1. Justin8448

          Oh wow. I was already thinking that this isn’t the last we’ve seen of Joe x Joyce, and I didn’t even factor in the fact that Dorothy is likely physically incapable of smooshing Joyce the way she likes. And Joe is, like, RIGHT THERE. This is going to be great.

      2. EpochFlame

        tbh same
        though I welcome the impending joe/dina friendship expansion

        1. Intragalactic

          Yes! I friend-ship Joe and Dina. Also Joe & Dorothy.

        2. flake

          really? why joe and dorothy? I don’t think they have anything other than joyce in common. is it like a differences complementing each other thing?

      3. Kreiger

        I hope Joe DOES move on from this, and I hope that Dorothy and Joyce get through the honeymoon phase and end up not really being as perfect for each other as they thought they would be and that drama gives us some fun strips about battling with consequences.

    2. anon

      i mean even with the mess ups i don’t think joe would be like “fuck you i hate you now” Even if some high school breakups might be like that /something as extreme/ toxic as ruth and billiefers was

    3. Insanenoodlyguy

      For maximum drama? Moving into a relationship with Dina.

  4. Erzsi

    bruh moment (devastated)

    1. Theluxland

      Willis, i’m sad

  5. Sirksome

    I really think these two crazy kids might go the distance!

    1. Dot

      Unironically

  6. CK

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaa. My heart.

  7. Esolo

    Oh, Joe. :(

  8. Stormtide Leviathan

    “Never tell Dorothy about this” surely it’ll never come up then and this is no longer an issue! All’s well that ends well!

    1. Dot

      Luckily Joyce is well known for playing it cool when it comes to keeping secrets

      1. clif

        Mmm.

    2. Needfuldoer

      “Thus solving Joyce’s relationship problem once and for all.”
      “But–”
      “ONCE AND FOR ALL!”

  9. NGPZ

    all I gotta say is, why does panel 2 Joe look like me when I unplug my nostrils? @-@

  10. IntangibleMatter

    Joe is now a strong contender in my eyes for biggest character arc over the strip aside from Joyce.

    He’s too good, man…

  11. shanunu

    Dang, Joe has it bad, huh. I guess him falling for Joyce has made him into a better person, but its unfortunate it had to happen right when Joyce realized her feelings for Dorothy. Sorry Joe. But thanks for growing up 🙏🏾

  12. raker

    I like this Joe. He is trying really hard.

  13. Dot

    This isn’t over, I’m calling it now

    1. Dot

      And if it is, well… I think it’d be creatively very conservative to eschew taking these characters in a bold and uncharted new direction which has been very well set up. It leaves interesting story potential on the table in favor of tying things up in nice little bows, and I think that’s pretty boring.

      1. Oasis Nadrama

        In my opinion, this moment absolutely SETS IN STONE that Joyce will want to try polyamory. With Joe or someone else. But likely with Joe.

        The subject has been broached, talked about, narrative tensions have unfolded, Joyce has MULTIPLE TIMES been lead to confront her assumptions and prejudices regarding compulsory monogamy and ethical non-monogamy, and now it is confirmed she still loves Joe, while he just declared he will always love her.

        We know Joe is still in the picture (publishing) months from now, in January 2027. He will not, as I feared at some point, immediately ragequit for his cooking school or something. So the romantic tension will remain.

        By breaking up now, he demonstrates in a powerful move that he’s both willing to put Joyce’s well-being as the priority and not interested to compete or to go first. This is a way healthier foundation for a future polycule than if he had stayed and waited for the situation to be clarified (which Joyce likely still doesn’t have the force to do currently).

        1. AK

          I agree with all of this, I would be shocked if this did not precipitate actually having the conversation. But also holy shit this is such a beautiful incredibly complicated feelingsy moment.
          .
          Large amounts of this arc have not worked super well for me, but like honest to god this moment is strong enough to (assuming it is capitalized on effectively, which I trust it will be) make a lot of stuff that worked less well feel like I understand how it fits into the grand strategy. You need to establish very quickly how all the way in Joyce is on the new relationship for this moment and the sudden concrete realization of what she’s losing to hit as hard as it does and for whatever Joyce is going to follow this with to feel like it has appropriate stakes. It’s such a dramatic and true Choice at this point to not let this go and to embark on really complicated negotiations in current relationship, I feel like I really see the vision.

      2. zee

        Saaaaame. I think this is the first time Joyce said she loved joe? Come on, there’s so much there! We just watched the juiciest Wagyu stake get cooked up, don’t tell me it’s just gonna get thrown in the bin!

        1. Hell Yeah

          don’t count aged wagyu out yet!

    2. Rose By Any Other Name

      I mean, that last panel basically confirms that it’s not over.
      My money’s on Joyce immediately ignoring Joe’s advice and going to talk to Dorothy about this.
      **gets the popcorn out of the bag and puts it in the microwave**

    3. Andrusi

      Well yeah, there’s a whole buffer.

    4. Tan

      I’m rooting for Joyce to (attempt to?) cheat on Dorothy with Joe by week’s end (in-universe). (yes I realize how long this will take to confirm/deny). Just… Be the absolute worst person you can be, for the mess. It’d even be a callback to when Dorothy was criticizing Joyce over trying to get Jacob to cheat on Raidah.

      And then try to fix it with poly.

      1. Needfuldoer

        Yes… Ha ha ha… YES!
        .
        Remember that time Dorothy tried to get Walky to cheat on Lucy with her? Do any of the other characters know about that?

    5. Li

      It definitely isn’t over. I mean, the last panel is in present-tense. Also, “don’t tell Dorothy about this” is a terrible plan (appropriately terrible for two 18-19 year olds).

  14. ZombieKyrik

    I feel like this was currently the best way to deal with things even if they never should have gotten this far. I do feel a bit bad for Joe, but he’s 18; this might suck right now, but if he’s willing to look forward then he still has a good chance of ending up in a serious relationship with someone. I have certainly been there, but Joe is hotter, and shouldn’t have trouble finding someone in the future.
    .
    I’m still failing to have a love life, but I’m thinking about joining a dating site, so I guess I’ll let y’all know how that goes.
    Regardless of your feelings on either of those things, I hope you have a good night/day.

  15. Sirksome

    So it turns out my hyperbole is somewhat true. You are not truly dumped until it is officially declared and your relationship is sacrificed to the unholy deity of broken hearts. The dumping stairs. I will mentally archive this information for when future relationships are being tested. Don’t trust breakups.

    1. Rose By Any Other Name

      I guess that’s good news for Becky.
      Dina was nowhere near those stairs during their conversation.

      1. Amós Batista

        *Dina behind the door*
        Venegance. Taste like fresh meat *gnaws*

  16. poofdepoof

    Why does Joe tell Joyce never to tell Dorothy about this?

    1. Brian K. Pittman

      Because Joe knows Dorothy extremely well and figures she’d likely react negatively in some fashion to learning Joyce hadn’t actually broken things off with Joe.

    2. Sirksome

      Dorothy wouldn’t take it well. She already feels intense guilt and jealousy and Joe knows that about her. It’s sort of sparing Joyce having to deal with that so early in their relationship.

    3. Tan

      Because Joyce is famously good at keeping secrets from her loved ones, meaning there is no possible way for this to backfire.

      (will this wind up as a reply to the right comment thread? I’m rooting for you, website)

    4. anon

      it does reinforce sarah’s belief of dorothy being a ‘homewrecker’ ;P

    5. thejeff

      He’s dumping Joyce to retroactively make it true that they broke up when Joyce let Dorothy think they did. There’s no point in doing that if Joyce is just going to tell Dorothy about it.
      The intent is so that Dorothy won’t be upset with Joyce for misleading her about the status of her relationship with Joe.
      It’s a noble try and there’s no possible way it could backfire.

      1. Sirksome

        Thoughts on whether we can trust Joyce to keep this secret?

        1. thejeff

          She’s kept it so far.
          Unless Dorothy catches her while she’s still upset about being dumped by Joe, she might be able to pull it off.
          One way or another I doubt this is over.

        2. OngoingConversation

          @thejeff I think “kept” is a bit generous, given how close she was to spilling the beans earlier …

  17. Thag Simmons

    And so Joe, for the very first time in his life, was actually a good wingman.

    1. MyBlueBox

      I think it’s well-established that he’s always been a good wingman, but yes he is going above and beyond. He’s gone from being a hanky-panky enabler to a relationship saviour.

      1. Thag Simmons

        No it very much has not been. Joe has pretty consistently been an awful wingman. Dude’s okay at getting himself laid, but Danny’s successes have been in spite of Joe’s assistance, not because of it

  18. mads_in_zero

    I’m thinking about the comment thread I was in yesterday about how Joyce needs to properly ask Dorothy instead of just assuming… and man, man… man. I love how the characters in this comic make good decisions that are also bad decisions, because Joe’s making a really classy move here but also, telling Dorothy might not not work, you don’t know yet!

    It’s really juicy stuff.

    1. anon

      well even if it’s not right to speak for her, she knows her well enough. although i’m surprised joe wouldn’t also seek dorothy out one on one to talk again like how they had the “it certainly feels like joyce is everything” convo

  19. Yumi

    Oh, wow, her birthday’s May 5. Luckily they’re not in May in-universe, but… happy birthday, Joyce!

  20. I Know Why The Mowed Lawn Screams

    Oh dang, I can almost hear the aughts teen drama breakup music playing on this one.

    1. Wack'd

      🎶 when i was young
      i never needed anyone
      and making love was just for fun
      those days are gone       🎵

      1. I Know Why The Mowed Lawn Screams

        *mumbling mumbling dial the telephone mumbling* ok, i think i got it now, ahem- “ALL BY MYSELF, DON’T WANNA BE-“

      2. ValdVin

        Walky sang that one well. Should have been a double A-side with Desperado.

    2. Yumi

      (“Goodbye to You” by Michelle Branch starts up)

  21. Astariel

    Aw, poor Joe. The retroactive dumping is a bit weird. If he’d accepted Joyce breaking up with him in the first place, none of this would have been necessary. But still, I get how he feels and it sucks a lot. I hope things get better for him soon.

    1. Grimey

      I think Joe’s logic is if he says he dumped her and Joyce commits to it then Joyce doesn’t have to later lie to Dorothy, in saying she ever dumped Joe. Ergo protecting their relationship (Joyce/Dorothy’s) beginning with being built on a lie.

      1. thejeff

        Yeah, but Astariel thinks that Joyce did dump him originally and Joe just refused to accept it. In which case, Joe’s just fixing a problem entirely of his own creation and Joyce did nothing wrong.

        1. Throwatron

          Joe didn’t really “refuse” anything. He corrected one of Joyce’s fundie assumptions, because he’s used to identifying and correcting those. He was fully willing to accept being broken up with; he just wasn’t willing to accept Joyce doing it out of her feeling an abstract obligation to strict monogamy. That caused Joyce to immediately waffle, as she often does when conversations fail to go exactly the way she presumed they must go in advance.

    2. geno

      She explicitly did not dump him. Which maybe Joe should have recognized as a problem of hoping for the best, but he didn’t need to do that Joyce did. Really weird mental gymnastics going on here

  22. Muttski

    Joe is a better person than I would have been in that situation. Bravo, sir.

  23. Lanz

    Joe, I while I *get it*, and your heart is in the right place, I feel like you *kinda* got dumped first here, on the day she said “I have to break up with you”. Like, you can’t quite *parry a breakup* with “what if poly though?” That is a whole new separate to deal with conversation if someone says they’re breaking up with you to be with someone else.

    Especially when their immediate response is to BSOD, go into denial, and immediately shift gears because they are nowhere near ready to *process* attempting polyamory, let alone actually going poly.

    1. Theozilla

      I don’t think we can say Joe got dumped first though, more like Joyce initiated a dumping but just never fully followed through on it.

      1. Thing 2

        “we” can say she did, “we” can say she didn’t. “we” have said both things, in more than one comment!
        The Joy of Different Opinions!

        1. Theozilla

          I mean one can maybe consider the first part a difference of opinion but the “not following through” part isn’t really up for debate when the last couple of strips involves has Joyce literally admitting how she has fully broken up with Joe. Like when someone has to add on the statement “mostly” that means something isn’t “fully” complete.

        2. Amara

          The Joyce of different opinions!

        3. Jon

          “We may say this, we may say that – indeed, we may say anything we want. We may say, for example, that he was not a man at all, but a highly evolved bicycle. See? We may say just about anything.” – from National Lampoon’s Doon

    2. Day!

      Yeah, the “parry a breakup” mechanic was only in Suoer Dumbing of Age Turbo 3

      1. Rectilinear Propagation

        I really want “Parry a Breakup” to be a song or album title. I want it to be a mechanic in a dating sim or interactive visual novel. I want it to be a web toon or comic that gets adapted into an anime. I want it to be said by a character in this comic.

        I’m going to be amused by this phrase and concept for a long time.

        1. Intragalactic

          Those are excellent examples!
          Also, I accidentally reported your comment, sorry. I know, I know, a single report doesn’t make much difference, but I still feel I ought to apologize.

    3. eh, whatever

      she said “I have to break up with you”
       
      It came across as “I don’t want to break up with you, but I’m led to believe I have to”; Joe inquired about the part after the “but”; Joyce ran away.
       
      That’s not a breakup. It’s a delay in a conversation that could or could not lead to a breakup.

    4. thejeff

      You kind of can though.
      Obviously it depends on the other person’s response. It’s far from guaranteed, but if Joyce had said “I like that idea, let me go talk to Dorothy about it” and they’d wound up in a polycule, we wouldn’t say they’d broken up.
      Instead in this case, Joyce clearly wasn’t able to commit. She wanted them both and wasn’t willing to either raise the issue with Dorothy or tell Joe it wasn’t going to happen. Leaving their breakup status in Limbo.

    5. Calder

      Since the debate over whether or not Joyce, in fact, did clearly break up with Joe earlier has been coming up a lot the last few days, I feel compelled to offer an abbreviated version of my thoughts – I think there is room for ambiguity in the textual analysis of that initial conversation, a debate to be had whether “This is why I have to break up with you” is content-equivalent to “I am breaking up with you.” I personally fall very much in the camp of they weren’t broken up yet, particularly given Joyce’s promise to talk more later, but I can see the case for debate (she could have meant that they’re broken up, but she’s willing to talk about what that means for the future of their friendship, etc. Not what I would consider A+ communication, but again, I could see a case for that interpretation.) The thing that sways me actually isn’t that conversation, but the August 31st strip where Dorothy and Joyce are at the newspaper and Joyce refers to Joe as her ‘boyfriend’, Dorothy immediately ‘corrects’ her and refers to Joe as ‘her EX-boyfriend’, and Joyce (in the background where Dorothy doesn’t notice) gives a quiet “Yeeeeaaaah…?” while nervously looking off to the side. I just can’t parse a reading of that strip in any way that supports that Joyce actually believes that she has 100%, clearly broken up with Joe.

  24. Zamperla

    Oh, Joe. You’re a good guy. And Joyce is a good kid making not much worse choices then I ever did at this age, if in wildly different directions.

    He’s a sweetheart. I think this really genuinely is, probably, from his perspective, the best way for this to go. I actually think these three as a poly thing would be *wonderful*. But right now? As things are, with how things went, with the history Dorothy and Joe have….

    I mean look at this point im down for whatever decade slowburn this strip wants to send my way. But I admit I’m also excited by the idea of Joe taking the clean break, and walking away with the tools under his belt of knowing he can be a supportive, loving partner. He’s not cursed. He’s not His Dad 2: Clone Of The Beard.

    Maybe how he loves Joyce’ll change. Maybe their relationship’ll roll over to platonic. Maybe there’ll be bigger shifts then that and all the other polly enjoyers and me can go WOOOOOO!

    For now. This is bittersweet, but damn I love this comic. I love story and I love interesting things happen and if everyone did The Exact Right THing In Every Circumstance i wouldn’t be here.

  25. Bea

    Great turnaround, the Dumping Stairs always get their due.
    –
    Love that Joe 2.0 will take just about any treatment himself but if someone else (a woman) is being disrespected he has to act. Very much “my trauma isn’t healed but I *have* decided to switch roles” coded. Which is … progress? Yeah let’s call it progress, go off Joe.
    –
    Also RIP Joyce. Never got to go properly poly but did learn an important lesson that occasionally having two partners means you’re twice as lonely.

  26. Morgans

    I saw the Joyce sitting before I saw the rest of the comic and shouted “dumping stairs!” Out loud to my housemates confusion

  27. JR

    Given that we have reason to question Sarah’s tolerance for Tony’s stature combined with the ticking timebomb of how reliable he is when Humans He Cares About come into conflict with Rules He Believes Should Be Followed…

    Well, things are looking up long-term for the Josara shippers!

    1. apocryphascribe

      I’ve been keeping that ship on the downlow for years now, and *boy* is there some tasty potential messiness there now that’s ripe for the picking.

  28. RassilonTDavros

    Goodbye for now, Joeyce/JoJo/whatever-you-the-reader-personally-call-them. It was nice while it lasted.
     
    (plays Goodbye So Soon on the hacked Muzak, you will never convince me it isn’t a breakup song)

    1. Amós Batista

      Sincerely, after reading it, I don’t believe it will be forever.

  29. Alongcameaspider

    Feels like “never tell dorothy about this” is definitely going to come back and bite both of them in the ass

  30. Theozilla

    Finally the other shoe drops while managing an uno-reverse card at the same time.

    But knowing Joyce and as the last panel illustrates, I doubt things are as emotionally resolved as she’d like to think. The fact that Joe ended up having to “dump” her is probably something that will be gnawing on Joyce for a while going forwards. I would be surprised if Dorothy truly never eventually learns about this, but I imagine this will take a good long time to stew the drama properly.

    1. thejeff

      Might be quicker than we think. If Dorothy sees Joyce upset, Joyce is a terrible liar, so it might all come out right away.

  31. Bill Erak

    Given a recent preview panel I think dorothy 100% finds out about this and it’s gonna be HILARIOUS.
    Love you, Joe. Hope the poly thing comes around in a couple years if you don’t leave for chef college before it happens.

  32. brionl

    Miss Scarlet, on the dumping stairs, for her birthday!
    I win!

  33. JessWitt

    Bummed for Joe. I’m hoping he doesn’t regress into an even worse version of his initial self from the comic’s start.

  34. Newlland(Henryvolt)

    Good on you Joe.

    1. TrueSurvivor

      Joe is great. I mean old Joe was funnier, but now he carries a sorrowful maturity, quite integrity, and plaid shirts – like Logan or Joel. Now we must simply wait for his hit film adaption.

  35. Albi

    SHAMBLES CONFIRMED (for now)

  36. Slartibeast Button, BIA

    Retroactive Dumping?

    Joe is changing the past! He could create a time paradox, the results of which could cause a chain reaction that would unravel the very fabric of the space time continuum, and destroy the entire universe!

    1. clif

      It may have already happened.

    2. Gunslinger

      Reminder that Head Alien actively weaponised alternate timelines and time paradoxes.

      (It’s uncertain if his carnage was only limited to our own galaxy)

    3. Sirksome

      Incan’t believe Joe is wasting his time rewriting powers to retroactively dump his girlfriend instead of doing something useful like going back in time to make it so people actually went to theatre’s and watched Transformers: One.

      1. Wack'd

        how can he use this…to get a show at the rivoli

    4. Tan

      Important question: *how* retroactive is the dumping? Was it before Joyce & Dorothy’s kiss, making Joyce never a cheater and thereby undoing all comment drama forever?? Did Joe’s retroactive dumping get Wack’d fired???? Will Soggies rule??????

      1. Thing 2

        OMG, yes, very important question!

      2. Corey C.

        The “rewritten” record will show that Joe broke up with Joyce when he saw the paper with the kiss on the cover and went to talk to Joyce about it. As far as Dorothy knows, that conversation directly led to the end of the Joyce/Joe relationship. All they have to do now is agree that that is exactly what happened.

  37. clif

    Rather uncharacteristically, we haven’t heard from Taffy in a while. Does anyone know them well enough to confirm that the Taff is alive and well???

    1. Yumi

      Pretty sure they commented yesterday, but it was in a thread that got deleted.

      1. clif

        Thanks.

    2. NGPZ

      I can confirm that they are alive, sleepy and full of burrito ^-^

      1. Morleuca

        Good

      2. clif

        Thank you, NGPZ.

  38. Nionel

    Dorothy is going to find out about this and she’ll blame herself for breaking them up. These are things that will happen.

    Poor Joe, he’s grown so much and this is evidence that he’s no longer the playboy he once was.

    1. segnosaur

      But Dorothy thought they were already broken up, and I’m pretty sure she knew it was because she and Joyce were now an item. So I don’t think Dorothy will feel any “guilt” (at least not any more than she already would have felt.)

      1. Yue Ryong

        I mean… almost the last thing we saw her doing was going into meltdown the moment someone even lightly prodded on the possibility that she had some culpability in the JoJo breakup. She *definitely* will not be able to get out of her own head once it starts to become clear that Joyce still holds even the faintest torch for Joe.

        1. Dave

          It occurs to me that this also parallels what’s currently happening with Becky and Dina. Bonus mess!

  39. redcaela

    Had a feeling Joe would take this turn. He still cares about Joyce’s happiness and he knows the cleanest way out.

    1. Arawn

      How you know that you love somebody; You’re willing to do things that aren’t what you want in order for them to be healthier and in a better place.

      1. redcaela

        “I want you to have what you want.”
        And he followed through decisively, especially when it seemed like she might fumble right out of the gate.

  40. Gunslinger

    Reminder that Walky!verse Joe had a similar arc.
    “Get away from me, Joyce. Before I destroy you.”
    Dude can’t catch a break.

  41. anon

    i wonder how much etiquette there is in giving back ex-gifts. i mean stuff like ‘stolen hoodies’/the anecdotes of ppl never getting their hoodie back is known but i imagine unless it’s something you’re both sharing , feels kinda unneccesary to give something back or some ppl might at least recompensate the monetary amount or so

    1. Bittersweet

      The etiquette, for girls at least, is that you NEVER give ANYTHING back. If they gave it to you, it’s yours now. To give it back is to display weakness, the exact same behavior as crying when dumped. Never cry where the ex will hear about it, always be seen having fun the next day, and never return gifts. At least, that’s how my mom raised me and what she told me constantly growing up. She’s very old fashioned, so I imagine that was The Way for much of the 20th century in the US South.

      (Mind you, the only time I was ready to put that into practice she forced me to drive 2 hours to give him back all his stuff so he would take me back. It didn’t work and I lost my gameboy with Pokemon Yellow from the deal.)

      Basically, as mad as I’ve been at Joyce throughout all of this, the weighted blanket was hers to keep even without Joe’s declaration of undying love. I do feel bad for her here though. Love triangle resolutions are always painful, you never really want to let the other person go but polyamory isn’t for everyone and I don’t think Joyce is wrong about Dorothy not wanting that setup with Joe. She could be, but I don’t think any of them are really ready for it rn.

    2. Opinion

      I always thought of it as vaguely dependent on the value and the time before breakup.
      .
      Like if you were given a gift a couple hours before breaking up with someone probably should return it.
      .
      The bigger/more valuable/more meaningful the item the farther back pre breakup that etiquette applies.

      1. Big Z

        There’s also the sliding scale of the dumper generally being expected to give back gifts on a longer horizon than the dumpee, since the dumper is in control of the timeline.

      2. AK

        I think there’s some legal stuff around engagement rings in particular too. Like I think courts will side with you on reclaiming those. But for the most part I don’t think anyone is expected to return anything unless it’s like. Your partner’s grandma’s necklace or something.

        1. thejeff

          OTOH, you probably should accept gifts while you’re planning on breaking up (Or even seriously thinking about it), but haven’t pulled the trigger yet.
          Like the blanket – which was basically given when the relationship was already dead.

  42. CT Phipps

    Now Joyce and Dorothy must have TRAUMA.

  43. darkoneko

    oh no

  44. TrueSurvivor

    Wow, those stairs are cursed. Are we sure that the little half walls there aren’t built a top the body of a hearbroken softmore or the cursed doll harboring which harbors a demon envious of human love or something?

    1. eh, whatever

      There’s nothing soft about a sophomore. There’s something wise, as in a sophist or a philosopher or Sophia herself.

      1. TrueSurvivor

        Thank you for pointing out my spelling mistake and being kind about it.

  45. Nash

    Joyce lives her life like a cat with a sock stuck on its head.

  46. Odditude

    Yeah, I am gonna miss them despite everything. My favorite couple in the strip :(

  47. Queezle

    Probably for the best. As much as I would love to see a poly-relationship represented in the main cast, I do not really think that these three are equipped to attempt it in an even moderately healthy way.
    I feel bad for Joe (through I do think he is wrong, in so far that I believe that Joyce should tell Dorothy), but I think this conversation was good for him, in the long run, and with time he will get over this, and I can see it being another opportunity for character growth.
    And it is nice to see Joyce acknowledge that she does care for Joe, and apologize to him. Shows that she is aware that she hurt him, when she is not on her ‘I am with Dorothy’ high, and does feel bad about that. Sad that the relationship was so short, but happy with how this conversation turned out.

    1. Chris Phoenix

      OK, you got me thinking. (I spent years being honorably poly with basically zero jealousy on anyone’s part; now I’m being mono.)
      What is it that can make poly relationships unhealthy, and why would these kids go there?
      – Jealousy that’s not handled well. Who would be jealous of whom? Joe wouldn’t. Joyce probably wouldn’t (I’m assuming it would be an angle, not a triangle). Dorothy…? My impression is she might feel jealous but would require herself to handle it calmly.
      – Poor communication about important things. Communication skills are something they’d have to grow into. But if they gave each other space to be imperfect and improve, this isn’t necessarily a deal-breaker.
      – A sense of “I’m sinning” or “I shouldn’t be doing this.” Joyce would ruthlessly squash any such feelings. Dorothy probably wouldn’t have them. Joe would get all tangled up with his family history, but he’s used to that and seems to deal with it OK (at least in the short term).
      – Unsustainable inequality in the polycule – for example, two pair off and leave a third out in the cold. I think Joyce has enough feelings for them both, and I suspect neither Dorothy nor Joe would try to squeeze the other out (though more likely Dorothy would do it than Joe).
      – Someone bringing in an additional partner in an unhealthy way. Ooh, I know! Joyce’s long-term guilt about Becky gets together with her new-found bisexuality, and she tries to bring Becky into the polycule. I’m pretty sure that would not end well at all.

      Any thoughts on any of this?

      1. Corey C.

        Just that bringing Becky in after they’ve established that they’ll always be FRIENDS and nothing more would be the single worst idea ever. I see the playful antagonistic relationship Becky and Dotty have worked so hard to maintain becoming an actual antagonistic relationship as one tries to “top” the other as to how much they love Joyce. Ever see the scene in “Bridesmaids” where Kristin Wiig is trying to “out-toast” Rose Byrne? That would be the Dotty/Joyce/Becky polycule.

      2. thejeff

        1) I’m not sure it would be jealousy at this point, though it might be, but Dorothy would likely have left over trust issues with Joe. That’s more likely to block things getting started, since it would resolve over time

        2) Poor communication has definitely just been demonstrated. You can try to give space, but if you can’t trust your partners to tell you important things, that’s going to cause problems. (Also applies to non-poly)

        3) Ruthlessly squashing such feelings doesn’t actually deal with them.

      3. Opinion

        2 and 4. Communication is not in a good enough place. Bad communication would be the norm and would very quickly lead to some problem.
        .
        And the imbalance Joyce has made it very clear Joyce/Dorothy would be the primary with Joe being a secondary relationship with Joyce and unclear what the Joe/Dorothy director relationship would be but I doubt those two go on a date while Joyce studies. Not all Poly setups need to be equal, but the inequality does make it more difficult (imo). So it would basically be asking people struggling with relationship 101 to jump straight to graduate level relationship dynamics.

        1. AK

          Re: 4, I think it would be hinge poly, not triad, In which case Joe and Dorothy don’t have to do anything with one another if they don’t want. And hierarchical polyamory works fine as long as everybody involved knows what that looks like and where they stand in it and they’re okay with that.
          .
          The communication thing is something I want to like watch them overcome, since it has specifically been set up as the failure point in this reality. But I’m not super worried about the hierarchy. Joe seemed to know what that was going to be. The real question for me there is whether, confronted with actually for real losing Joe and having to think about what that relationship means to her, that’s actually what she wants.

      4. clif

        There would be a fundamental inequity between Joyce insisting that Dorothy give up Walky, to the point of breaking up for her ((which I still maintain isn’t a valid breakup except that both parties accepted it as such)) and Dorothy being expected to be fine with Joyce’s continued interest in Joe. Dorothy, like Joe, might voluntarily chose to value Joyce’s interests above their own, and that can be a valid decision. But in no way is it an equitable situation or a reasonable expectation.

  48. RyzerShadows

    I feel for Joe so bad dude, I don’t know what’s in his future but whatever it is I hope it makes him happy, I hope he keeps being who he is and growing.

    All that said…I feel like I’ve finally been let off a 3 year long emotional rollercoaster, I’m sad and crying, the pain I suffered will never truly go away…yet somehow I want to get back on, hoping it ends differently.

    1. geno

      I mean Rachel was already changing her mind on him, so I have to imagine this gets her over her original opinion of him. Which was frankly correct. This server just gets irrationally angry at characters not being aware of events they weren’t there for, so she has only just started to his character development. Whether they date or she just helps him get himself together will be pretty good.

  49. Acher4

    this is crazy!
    >.<
    I love it!

    And the dump(b)ing stairs get one more under their belt. rofl!

  50. SillyGoose

    But… It’s two people who love each other saying I love you to each other! It’s not supposed to hurt, dammit

  51. ADLegend21

    are plot speculative comments not allowed anymore? I missed where that might’ve been in the new mods allowed/not allowed thing.

    1. Wack'd

      Plot speculation is fine.
      .
      I’m not really sure what to do in cases like this. I don’t want to publicly litigate people’s comments after they’ve been deleted. The person whose comment got deleted is just gonna argue their point further and it’ll become a whole thing. But I also feel bad just, like, not telling folks what they did wrong. Part of me is tempted to just give out my socials (not that I’m difficult to find) so people can DM me about it but, like. That massively opens me up to harassment.
      .
      So, uh. Maybe think back on what you said and what rules I’ve laid down and try to figure it out? I dunno! I genuinely do not have a good answer here. Sorry.

      1. zee

        If I may, a reddit style “comment deleted by mod, violated rule 3: no bigotry” might be helpful. And if someone tries to get noisy about it that can just be deleted too. Is it possible to set someone to be automatically sent into moderation when they comment, like what happens with new commenters or if you try to add too many links? My autistic ass isn’t exactly thrilled about just being made to sit and figure out what I did wrong with no guidance if I were to ever run afoul of the rules.

        1. Wack'd

          My gut instinct is leaving a lot of “This comment was deleted” stuff lying around just makes the fact of “wow so many deletions!” more of a conversation topic which is exactly what I don’t want. And then when I delete those comments, and put up more notifications, it just perpetuates the cycle.
          .
          There is also, frankly, the fact that I am not full time. I do not want to specify my exact working hours because I already live in constant terror that everything will go to shit if I look away for two seconds, but suffice to say that they are not long enough for me to feasibly pull this off. Sorry.
          .
          As for “just automod everyone”, this has been discussed and dismissed, which is all I can say about that.

        2. zee

          Oki, fair enough. Tho I wasn’t suggesting auto modding everyone, it was an expansion on people trying to litigate their comment getting deleted. Not reiterating my point, just clarifying my meaning while still accepting the overall rejection 👍

        3. Mr D

          If I may quote Zee for a second here, given we do not have thumb ups or likes:
          “My autistic ass isn’t exactly thrilled about just being made to sit and figure out what I did wrong with no guidance if I were to ever run afoul of the rules.”

      2. Insanenoodlyguy

        Wack’d I can promise you people will have no clue often. The comment itself is gone, nothing to reference, the rules are ever farther away if they were seen in the first place. This may not change how you’ve decided to do things in the slightest, but you should understand that’s going to keep happening and people will be confused more than anything.

      3. Opinion

        Personally I have more an issue with how the deletion works here, where the whole thread gets nuked. It can make it hard to know if I said something, the original comment said something, or if some one replied to me and I never even saw it.

        1. Insanenoodlyguy

          That too! “think back on what you said and what rules I’ve laid down and try to figure it out” doesn’t really work if you were a “casualty of war” as Wack’d put it. And with the whole thing gone, you don’t necessarily know what part or parts were the problem to begin with. It doesn’t invite reflection.

      4. Big Z

        Is there a way to send a PRIVATE note explaining a deletion/moderation action, at least for commenters who have an e-mail address that works specified?

        That’s at least a plausible way to split the difference between “overcrowding the thread with deletion notices” and “people having no real idea why their comment was deleted” — although it admittedly won’t help the folks downthread of the offender.

        1. Wack'd

          I could hypothetically email the people who give real email addresses (the site will accept literally anything with an @ sign) but that seems like a pretty big violation of privacy to me.

        2. Big Z

          It is almost certainly a function of when I started using online fora that I honestly expected that “occasional moderator communication” was part of the reason to make the field “required” in the first place, rather than it being a privacy issue.

        3. Li

          That or notifications about replies. As is, it’s weird that it’s a required field.

  52. Morrison

    I mean, this is Joyce. Her core is truth. That’s why she loves Dorothy. How long is this going to go unsung?

  53. Corey C.

    Well, that’s that. Joyce no longer has the albatross of Joe around her neck. And since, by retroactively. that will mean Joyce and Joe OFFICIALLY broke up after he saw the paper (which is what Dorothy believes) I think this chapter is finally over and Joyce can finally give 100% of her heart to Dotty. All is finally as it should be.

    It’s not going to be that simple, is it?

    1. thejeff

      “… I love you, too.”

      Yeah, somehow I doubt this is over.

    2. geno

      The only albatross Joyce ever had was her own anxieties and insecurities

  54. David Welbourn

    I suppose I’m the only one wondering if somehow, someway, Danny will accidentally “Dan” this up.

    1. Rectilinear Propagation

      Oh!

      Yeah, Joe’s probably going to tell him the next time they’re both in the dorm. Last time they talked, Dan started yelling about biphobia.

    2. PhoenixMoon

      Oh yes, I believe Danny will be the catalyst for all of this coming out. The first rule to keeping a secret is Never Tell Danny. Tis already broken, there is no going back now.

  55. Chris

    Staying out of the feelings minefield here. What catches my eye is that Joe is TALL and Joyce is not. Even on the ledge, she is still below eye level.

  56. Anonymous

    The concepts of Jacob/lying/{relationship start}/{bad precedents} comes to mind. I wonder whether Joyce is (compulsively) remembering that particular lesson..?

  57. JoeCovenant

    I guess the IMPORTANT question is….
    Did Joe HEAR that…?

    1. Daibhid C

      You mean the “I love you too”? I don’t think it matters that much if he did or not; I don’t get the impression he’s ever doubted it.

  58. Jay

    Joe’s a good guy 😌 Love this man

  59. Jerna

    “This is where Joe dumped me, Raphael.”

    “Cowabummer.”

    1. Tequila Mockingbird

      perfection. i just snort-laughed at this. A+

  60. Leaf

    Assuming the other parties involved can’t handle it is like peak baby poly. To be fair, Joyce is actively not handling it well, and Joe is justified in finding this to be his limit. But never giving folks (like Dorothy) a chance to crash out just a little before realizing it will be okay is really just making their relationship decisions for them. It’s difficult to trust that someone could really want to be with me, even if it doesn’t fit a grand narrative, even if I could come up with better options for them that involve me less or not at all. But that’s their choice, just like my dedication to my partners is one I gladly make every day.

    1. Daibhid C

      The vibe I’m getting here is that neither Joyce nor Joe think they could handle a poly, even though they might see advantages to the idea. Asking Dorothy about it would kind of feel like dumping the decision not to do that onto her so they don’t have to make it, which feels like the same pattern Joe deliberately breaks here.

    2. geno

      I think this is ignoring the fact that Joyce lied to her first. That makes it difficult to start off any relationship let alone a poly one. This is still only like 2 days, so it’s probably salvageable, and these kids are being dumb but that is the comic

  61. Ornathe

    Pretty sure my comment yesterday got deleted, but that’s fair. I was being a bit tetchy about how Joe was coming off, and probably more so than I want to come off. Mostly I’m here today to say that I’m pretty happy about how he’s handling things here and helping Joyce out of the dilemma she’s been stuck in for a while now, even if it means having to accept that it sucks for him. I definitely have a feeling this isn’t the end of this whole thing, but it’s a nice and bittersweet moment, and Joe deciding to retroactively dump her for both their sakes is a neat sacrifice on his part that I really like for his character arc. I’m really curious to see where it’s going to lead him, especially given the convos he’s had about her with Rachel and Jacob vis-à-vis him changing and losing Joyce to her own questionable decisions.

    1. geno

      Joe was being actively cheated on and lied to. He had a right to be upset with the person who hurt him. He just loves her more than he is sad

      1. Ornathe

        He’s allowed to be upset, totally. I don’t fault him for that in the slightest. I felt like he was kind of guilt tripping her yesterday, though, and my comment about it probably came off a bit more hatey than I intended. I think both Joe and Joyce are acting very realistic in this whole scene, very much including that Joyce was struggling with ending things in a way that would be kind to him versus him being rightfully upset with her while also being hopeful that she would consider his suggestion. That’s also why I think it’s pretty big of him to take one for the team here and make the call for her so she doesn’t have to make it any worse for all three of them while trying to please everyone, even though it sucks for him.

  62. Donutholebandit

    I like the role reversal here, compared to what might have been expected of these two earlier in the comic. Joe is sliding closer to my favourite characters list which I never thought I would say lol

  63. Donutholebandit

    This is definitely the healthier option for them atm, UNFORTUNATELY, JOE, your otherwise solid solution here requires Joyce Brown to Lie to Dorothy Keener. Good luck with that lasting long lmao

    1. thejeff

      I mean, she’s been lying by omission to Dorothy for awhile now. All she has to do is continue.

      1. geno

        Unfortunately those lies had several layers of self delusion protecting them. This one is a fresh wound. Dorothy is gonna find out pretty much immediately, because her first instinct is always to heal the baby duckling

    2. Insanenoodlyguy

      Here’s the thing: that’s not on him anymore. He was part of it. And now he’s not, as he has most wisely extracted himself from that situation. What Joyce does or doesn’t tell Dorothy is up to her, but he is 100% correct that the current situation with Joyce omitting key information is a prelude to disaster. That situation no longer exists.

  64. Dave

    Joyce told Dina that she should be selfish, that she should have the things she wants.
    Joyce is internally consistent to a fault, even if it takes her a while to reach the logical conclusion of her values.
    Joyce wants both Dorothy and Joe.
    This is going to be REAL GOOD.

    1. SanoSS7

      I AM ROOTING FOR IT. It might even be what tips me into paying for a slipshine XD

  65. YourCousinJay

    Yeah I’m sure this won’t cause festering emotions to build up into an eventual violent emotional outburst
    –
    They broke up, so everything’s beautifully wrapped up in a bow now.

  66. Poppakatt

    Good job, Joe. He has had a really cool character arc.

  67. Big Z

    Well, I will let my new gravatar summarize how I feel about this. (complimentary)

    1. Big Z

      … if gravatar ever loads my changes >.<

  68. eskimolos

    I love this comic, I love Joe here, I have full confidence he isn’t going to spiral and I’m hoping this has been a valuable learning experience for Joyce. Very relatable on both sides, this is a discussion I feel like I could have with a former romantic partner today in my 30s, timeless stuff, maturely handled.

    Aside from that – I finally got my own gravatar! Though I suspect I may have difficulties posting this first time, as I don’t actually have access to the email I used for commenting up until today. I haven’t had access for a few years now, 2FA is a pox for forgetful/accident-prone gremlins. Crossing fingers this actually works…

  69. Matt

    I haven’t really liked Joe or felt good about his redemption arc, or loved his relationship with Joyce, but I have to admit, he does seem to be genuine.

  70. Mustachio

    Joe looked at her when he said he loves her. She replied nonchalantly, not looking at him, as she sat. They don’t love each other the same way. I’m not sure she’s matured enough yet to truly love someone, actually.

    1. Big Z

      Hmm, I don’t read her choice of pose as “not in the same way”, I read it as her trying to work through it in the context of her Hallmark Movie inner life with Dorothy.

      It seems more reasonable to me to assume Joyce is still crawling out from under the fundie “exactly one true love, forever” mindset and into something more reflective of the real complexity of human relationships.

      If only because “Joyce doesn’t feel the same way as Joe” isn’t nearly as INTERESTING as “Joyce has some thinking to do about how she actually feels and organizes her internal/external reactions to those feelings” — and I take it as an interesting sign that she’s at least starting to be thoughtful about it after an in-universe week of mostly just reacting.

      1. thejeff

        Agreed. I don’t read that as nonchalant at all. More of an admission to herself as much as to him.

    2. SanoSS7

      I mean. Nobody loves each other the same way, to the same degree. It’s like asking if the color blue I see is the same color blue you do – it’s our own inner experience and we can never know for sure how other’s feel or why they act the way they do.

      I don’t disagree that Joyce and Joe are in different brackets of love as an emotion, action, commitment, etc – but yeah. Maturity is a real component of learning what is healthy vs toxic in relation to love/relationships, but I think Joyce has a huge heart, and her version of Love is a big, encompassing, messy concept that she herself is struggling with.

      She probably knows the difference between I love you as family/friend, but she’s in a binary with there is platonic love and LOVE Love. Maybe she will learn there are degrees of love that are sexual, romantic, admiration, maybe she will learn you don’t need to LOVE love someone to fuck them, maybe she will learn that there are soulmates of all kinds and a soul in not a singular monolith of a thing and different people will spark different parts of your fire as you encounter them.

      Maybe I’ll have to dust off the ao3 account and write the ‘and everyone fucked and it was all okay in the end’ fix it fic when the story breaks my heart XD (which is a glowing compliment to the story! I love a good heart break!)

  71. SanoSS7

    Oh Joe, my heart is breaking for you.

    I know that the point of narrative drama / an engaging story is conflict and emotion but …

    My poor heart is wailing “polyamory! POLY CAN SAVE THIS”

    they’re college kids. They break each other’s hearts, they make poor choices, they make rash decisions. These are stories that I think a lot of us can relate to and depending on the side of the equation it hurts to different degrees.

    This makes me nostalgic with a side of rose colored glasses, and I’m loving the storyline. I just want everyone to kiss and make up and have that ideal college orgy you look back on in your mid thirties and sigh and go ‘wow that coulda been messy but it was fun while it happened’

  72. keithcurtis

    Is the title text “The dumping stairs, one her birthday” a Darmok reference? Because if it isn’t, it should be.

    1. PhoenixMoon

      Followed by, “Joyce, her heart broken, her dreams shattered.” :(

  73. DashWallkick

    Joe’s a stand up dude for just ending it for her but I honestly wonder if he’s kinda channeling his mom here — just quietly accepting that he got deeply screwed over when he only risked this because he was very scared of cheating. There’s no anger or annoyance despite that no dude you got your heart broken!

    1. Big Z

      Still feels to me like Joe has some self-esteem/self-worth problems that are manifesting in this behavior here. Having been in a similar place at points in my college days, it feels like either that, “I was a shithead and now I must be extra solicitous of ladies to make up for it, to my own detriment”, or both.

      1. thejeff

        I keep flashing back to his “With my history, I don’t get to be jealous” after Joyce and Dorothy went out for dranks

        1. Big Z

          Yeah, I think I called that out as over the line into “self-worth problems” rather than “honest self-appraisal” back when it happened too.

  74. Rimwalker55

    You can totally hear the echoes of Robin telling Leslie, “Keep it down. I’m trying to do a soft reboot here!”

  75. Osopescado

    The trash goblins who crave mess are eating good today

  76. Jackie

    I really respect Joe. He knows this is he was her first relationship and she doesn’t really know how to handle this stuff and isn’t blaming her for being bad at it and also isn’t blaming himself.

  77. Florence

    I know a strip is good when I’m chuckling at the possibilities

    I especially love that Joyce basically gets everything she technically wants but is still unhappy

  78. Rosicrucian

    Joyce sure looks like she could use a batch of Kraft macaroni and cheese, prepared by the box directions.

    But then she’d have to figure out whether she’d rather Dorothy or Joe cook it.

    1. Rosicrucian

      (And honestly, if we’re talking who would do it better BY JOYCE’S STANDARDS, Joe is more likely to do it exactly by the box instructions and thus respect her wishes. Dorothy is more likely to Google budget-friendly ways to “improve” box macaroni, pick the one that seems most promising, and do it without telling Joyce until after she ate it. Dorothy would then have to own the freak-out that ensued.)

      1. transamus

        in fairness, both of them have canonically prepared her mac’n’cheese exactly by the instructions, because both of them understand how important it is to her. Dorothy is more likely to encourage Joyce to leave her comfort zone, but she wouldn’t be oblivious to the consequences of messing with the Kraft method.

      2. Big Z

        Don’t make me look up the strip where Dorothy canonically prepares Kraft according to the box directions for Joyce. She’s not STUPID.

        1. Rosicrucian

          The one where she suggests several ingredients and gets stopped cold even at basic seasoning? The urge is in Dorothy, QED.

        2. Tan

          No, the more recent one where she made it plain according to the instructions explicitly for Joyce. https://www.dumbingofage.com/comic/work-3/

        3. Li

          They’ve actually both been similarly exasperated but indulgent with Joyce about her food sensitivities, and I imagine Dorothy is only going to be more careful (possibly to the point of overcorrection) now that she knows Joyce is autistic.

        4. Tan

          Also it is worth noting that Joe asked Dorothy for a Joyce date idea: https://www.dumbingofage.com/comic/fairlysafe/ and then exactly 4 strips later is when Joe offers to cook macaroni and cheese by the instructions: https://www.dumbingofage.com/comic/dateidea/ So. Draw your own conclusions there.

  79. grant

    It’s going to be so epic when my grandchildren get to read about Joe and Joyce actually dating for real in 2120, when the strip finally reaches the beginning of junior year

  80. AC

    Ok now i want her to cheat with him. Maximum angst maximum drama !!

  81. Insanenoodlyguy

    She already was really. But I definitely don’t as it’d represent such an enormous backslide for him.

  82. Grimothy

    Something I really appreciate about this comic is how realistic Joyce’s deconstruction is. She’s still deeply affected by Christianity. It’s a religion that says you can only love one thing and you must do so with all your heart. Any passion outside of the church can be called idolatry, like her enjoyment of Dexter & Monkey Master. So the fact that she loves Dorothy means she can’t be with Joe. It makes a lot of sense for her character, but I’m still banging my head against the wall. You can love multiple people! You just have to communicate with them!!

    1. Treehawk

      Yes!!!

    2. Albi

      Rome wasn’t built– or torn down– in a day, after all.

  83. JuanokuG4

    Oh wow Joe dumped her, now that’s a twist

  84. HereComesHoneyBadger

    Zero Minus

  85. NGPZ

    pika? will this comment go through? could have SWORN i typed my email right

  86. Ash

    Marry me, Joe.

  87. Rimwalker55

    For anyone that track such things this is the strip referenced in panel 1
    https://www.dumbingofage.com/comic/informed/

  88. PhoenixMoon

    Yaaaaassss let the mess commence! As a fan of old school soap opera plots, I’m looking forward to years (our time) of longing stares between Joyce and Joe behind Dorothy’s back, emotional miscommunication shenanigans, followed by good ole unintended consequences. Eventually it all comes to light, possibly via Danny telling Dorothy about how biphobic Joe’s poly triad suggestion was, and how he’s glad that she vetoed it. I can just see her reaction face to that information. “I vetoed what now??”

  89. Smooti

    I do hope for poly Joyce but also: to be successfully poly you gotta be good at communicating and, well, this is a great example of why I don’t think she’s there yet

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