Can’t we give ourselves one more chance? Can’t we give ourselves one more chance? Why can’t we give love that one more chance? Why can’t we give love, give love, give love….etc.
Cause love’s such an old fashioned word and love DARES YOU TO CARE FOR THE PEOPLE ON THE EDGE OF THE NIGHT AND LOVE DARES YOU TO CHANGE OUR WAY OF CARING ABOUT OURSELVES!
THIS IS OUR LAST DANCE!
THIS IS OUR LAST CHANCE.
This is ourselves….
I had to listen to ‘Ice Ice Baby’ for FOUR HOURS EACH WAY going to Myrtle Beach some years ago. It was on a CASSETTE SINGLE in a car player with auto reverse. It wasn’t my car and it’s what the person paying my way down wanted to listen to.
I had a dude in the gym put “Beyond My Broken Heart” on speaker. On his shitty smartphone speaker. On repeat. At least twenty times. I swear, songs are even more irritating with the “muzak” treatment of being just audible enough to be an earworm rather than an enjoyable listening experience. Even when I left and came back with my headphones, I COULD STILL HEAR IT through EARBLASTING VOLUME.
At least that was survivable, though. The next time, dude next to me let an SBD… then another. I legit could not breathe and had to bail.
Alt text is probably just a joke, but I genuinely do think that just knowing people care enough to help you is a huge positive, even if they’re not saying quite the right thing.
It depends on the person, and the state of mind. When I’m feeling intensely anxious, depressed, and/ or frustrated, being fed platitudes makes me want to scream and hit things. Relax. Don’t worry. Everything will be all right. Don’t cry. There’s no reason to cry. Smile, be happy. As long as you do your best, everything will be fine. You can do anything if you put your mind to it. Everything’s darkest before the dawn. Aaaaggghhh!
That’s just me, though. We’re not all the same.
I agree that someone needs to talk to Joyce, and encourage her to open up about what she’s been feeling. I suspect that won’t be an easy task. Also, I suspect that Joyce isn’t yet in a place where she’s ready to open up, and share the stuff she’s trying to work through.
These situations are never easy. The best bet would probably to offer to be a supportive ear or shoulder to Joyce when she is ready to talk about this, and also give her information on other useful resources that might be able to help her.
Of course, it’s one thing to write all this out. Personally, I’m a lot better at writing thing than I am at actually doing things, because my brain is weird like that. It’s way easier to think of the right things to do when I’m just sitting and writing than it is when life is actually happening. Then, there’s just too much information to process, and I fail to think of things. In real life situations like this, I’ll be as supportive as I’m able if the other person comes to me, but I’m not inclined to take the initiative. When someone is visibly upset, but not saying anything to me about it, I generally can’t think what to do, so I avoid, avoid, avoid.
I can go and and on about what Billie and Ruth *should* do, but I really wouldn’t do any better facing a real life situation like this. People are really hard.
Oh god yeah, I know that feeling when it comes to the platitudes. Friends are better about it, but if I try venting to my folks they think I’m on the verge of a breakdown, and like, just let me be angry for a bit. Anger is okay!
I do appreciate that they’re trying to help, though, even if they have a tendency to go too far with the “everything is fine” talk.
In moments of grief one asks the impossible questions to which one knows the answer – like “I want my Dad back” – but the scream contained within the question has to be let out.
The answer has to be brutal, that is how the world works. Facing oblivion’s flowers is hard, but it has to be done.
That’s totally common, to think of things except when a person needing comfort is right there, and then freezing up or avoiding the person that you wish you could comfort.
What works for me was to just say what’s there: “I don’t quite know what to say. I care about you tho.” It gives me permission to get it wrong, which frees me up to listen. Also sometimes I ask, “would you like a hug-and-listen, a distraction, or to be left alone?” People always seem to know which they’d prefer.
Well…yes. Absolutely. I generally think giving someone hallmark platitudes is super duper the wrong way to do things.
On the other hand “Hey, Joyce, you seemed really hurt by everything that happened and I was worried about you. If you want to talk, anytime, I’m right here to listen and help in any way I can”…that would make me feel a lot better.
So, do not give the platitudes, live the platitudes. Don’t say “I’m here to help because maybe that will make you feel better”. Just…be there to help, and hope (silently) that this will make her feel better.
It… usually is, at least, but Ruth’s more or less right in that last panel. Still, it’s probably not actively harmful, so you should try. Yeah, there’s a risk, but life’s kind of about managing them, and Joyce doesn’t seem /depressed/, just hateful of the planet, which is a fairly valid place to be after the last few major events.
I think in Joyce’s case it’d definitely be helpful to her if she just has support, since there’s nobody who can actively solve her problems right now, and it’s going to be a process she has to go through.
So like, I think it’s really good for Joyce right now to know that, while things have changed, she always has her friends to back her up.
It….. really depends. I’ve been trying to cope with severe depression for most of my life, and some of the things people have said to me while trying to help have actually hurt my immediate mental state enough to tip me over from unmotivated and empty to self-harm, because I went from feeling nothing to feeling like I was worthless and a burden to people around me, and they’d be better if my problems and I weren’t there.
Yeah, I remember that period, that part where just being around other people was a crime and how dare I blight them with my presence. Even just being encouraged made me feel worse because they’re taking time out of their schedule to make me feel better, and they must have so many better things to do!
It took me a while, but I eventually started to grasp that people can like me, and it’s not something that had to be measured or earned.
And speaking from the other side I never knew how to act or what to say. Always too scared of saying the wrong thing to say or do anything other than what I’d normally say.
Totally agree with everyone else. It can be a really random affair for depressed people. What might help shake one person out of stuff might dump another into an even deeper spiral. I’ve gotten in the habit of asking what I can do to support and then just be present and listening if the person is noncommunicative.
And from personal experience, I’ve been the literal worst person to deal with when depressed because I tend to climb inside myself and not come out when I get into a hole, which drives “fixer” personalities up a wall.
If you feel terrible because you think no one likes you then maybe. But if you feel terrible because you think people only do nice things for you when you seem hurt or need sympathy then not so much.
Similarly if you feel bad because you feel useless, like a waste of time and effort and them someone starts wasting time and effort on you that’s not going to work so well. Even if you give them a chance if you still feel depressed then you are caught in a nasty bind where you either assume that the help failed = waste of life. Or you pretend to feel better to make them feel better = ignoring the problem.
Often times unhelpful help can make a person feel better in the short term temporarily alleviating the stress, only for it to come back when the “helper” is gone. For instance, if someone’s feeling bad about their academics which causes them to feel worthless and then they express these feelings of worthlessness to a friend, who tells them not to care so much about academics, they aren’t everything after all. The result could be a temporary relief from stress and depression only to return when other consequential goals such as career success reinforce the importance of academic success forcing the distressed person to again face their sense of failure and worthlessness now with four hours passed and none of which spent studying.
I’m just spit-balling many ways in which unhelpful help can be unhelpful. And of course none of this explores the many more obvious and immediate ways that someone can be unhelpful while trying to help. Such as when the proffer drugs as a solution to feelings of sadness. When their behavior reinforces negative images about the person or the world. Or when their advice is otherwise self destructive.
It definitely helps to know people care, but sometimes the best way to do that is ask ‘do you want a distraction, do you want someone to listen or would you rather be left alone’.
People trying to placate me has always just made me angry and prone to lashing out that they’re wrong. While letting me choose when to reopen interactions has let me calm down, lift my mood by talking with them and then move on past that particular moment.
I agree with the sentiment, even when I read messages on comment boards from people who want to react only to the word and are unwilling to even consider anything resembling context. But keep the thought. It’s a good one.
I bet there’s not even anything on that clipboard. Ruth is just using it so she has something to pretend to pay attention to, so she doesn’t have to make eye contact and engage.
Been there. Psst, Ruth, keep the sound effect you use for text notifications on your phone’s homescreen, so you can play it and fake a text whenever you want.
I think the difference is that Danny can actually believe what Ethan was saying to him, and also Ethan’s advice was more “it’s not your fault, just be yourself and wait for Amber to come back to you”, and while he knows that it feels like beating your hands against a brick wall, Ethan thinks it’s helping.
Ruth and Billie are trying to help each other too, but since letting Ruth down that one time and her encounter with Alice, Billie doubts her ability to help. Ruth… I’m not sure. I know that she wants what’s best for Billie, she’s definitely started to open up every so slightly with her, but I think she’s more convinced of the hopelessness of the situation, while Billie still thinks she can pull Ruth out of it.
Because Willis can write. Ethan \ Danny \ Amber. Ruth \ Billie \ Joyce. Echoing trios. He pays a lot of attention to structure, resonance and callbacks. It’s what makes the comic so good. Better than many published novels.
Sorry to continue this from yesterday’s comic, but I didn’t see this until today and for better or worse I felt attacked and want an opportunity to respond. Willis, your in charge, so if you think I’m being unreasonable here or this is otherwise unwelcome feel free to move it or delete it as you deem appropriate. I’ll bow to your judgment without complaint.
Anyway, for reference Tan said this yesterday:
“Also asidely, if your major objection to accepting that something is problematic is that it potentially puts your own past self in a negative light, THAT sounds like a personal problem, and I reallly hope you don’t take that approach to real life situations.”
Here’s my response- what you called an objection *I* call an example drawn from my own experience to illustrate why I believe Ruth’s character is more a dumbass with terrible social skills fumbling her way through an attraction she barely understood herself….and less the sexual predator she was being accused of. Your response is putting words in my mouth, and I think that’s a lot of bullshit and I don’t feel like letting that slide.
You and I don’t have the same interpretation of this character. We just don’t. That’s a thing that happens frequently on the internet. I am allowed to have my interpretation as much as you are yours. So take your ‘accepting that something is problematic’ and shove it. You have your reasons for your interpretation, and that’s fine, but its still your opinion. There isn’t a damn thing I need to accept about it other than it differs from my opinion. Don’t talk to me like its a goddamn fact and I just need to stop being in denial about it.
And at the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I continue to believe my interpretation is correct more firmly now than ever. Not for anything in the story proper, but for the simple fact that you throwing around accusations and assumptions about what I’m saying gives me reasonable cause to question your interpretations elsewhere.
That’s all I have to say. I will refrain from hijacking the comment thread that should be about the current strip any further. Good night, everybody.
So as not to completely make all of this about me…
If Billie is that worried about it, why not ask Ruth to come with her and talk to Joyce together. She’s legitimately worried about Joyce so making it out to be a concerned friend going to the RA for help/support is hardly implausible, and she can hopefully convince herself that Ruth will be there to shield Joyce from any “damage” Billie could do trying to help.
But it IS all about about you.and what a monster you are. If you don’t agree we’ll just have to explain in detail why we’re right, because we certainly can’t have someone being wrong on the Internet.
On the other hand, if you aren’t starting your romantic relationships by slamming them against the wall and kissing them, then you obviously aren’t doing it right. Just ask Ruth.
Since I jumped on that comment yesterday too, I’ll add a bit here:
I don’t think Ruth is a “sexual predator”. I agree that she “is more a dumbass with terrible social skills fumbling her way through an attraction she barely understood herself”.
However, her action – slamming Billie against the wall and forcing a kiss on her was unambiguously sexual assault. That it came out of her confusion and her general self-destructive behavior doesn’t change that. It makes it more understandable and forgivable, but it doesn’t change the basic act.
Not a bad idea northri. But, Joyce is liable to resent both of them visiting her at same time, she may think of it like, a delegation or something.
But, however it works out: Ruth is the RA and she needs to go talk to Joyce if only to make an appearance…it is her JOB.
Billy could go on her own just as a concerned person, if she wasn’t afraid of screwing up. And Ruth in her Ruthless way is pushing her to do it with her lefthanded compliments.
True, but it might help Billie realize that she doesn’t really mean it. Problem-solver is a hard role to give up and is a functional counterweight to Billie’s tendency to depression.
Or counterwise, solving other people’s problems means she doesn’t have to solve her own.
Oh hey all, I’ve been working on a Dumbing of Age CAH pack in CardCast. Still a work in progress. If you can think of any cards to put in, message me on Tumblr or reply below. I really wanna get this right.
You’re right, but on the second one you left out the sexy, which is kind of important. Also I’m thinking the first one works better as a pattern than an object. But, hey, up to you.
You could also argue that Other Jacob is already on there as dormmate’s vibrator, but other Jacob is funnier. Similarly a nickle isn’t that hilarious in most contexts while doing it with your mother for a nickle is always good for a snerk. Just saying.
Part of me is starting to think that Ruth would actually be the right person to talk to Joyce right now, because she’s not Joyce’s friend. She’s enough of an authority figure that Joyce might still feel obligated to talk to her, and if she starts whining, Ruth will tell her, harshly, to stop. As Joyce pointed out to Roz, sometimes she needs someone to be mean to her, and Ruth is really quite well suited to that role.
I think Billie and Ruth have become my favorite couple/pairing. I liked Joyce/Dorothy friendship, but Billie and Ruth, wow.. It’s all coming up Billie for me, she is so interesting and so changed since we met her.
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RKO…..
Out of nowhere.
Ruth is right with her last line tho.
“myth: BUSTED”
“STOP TRYNA PROVE I’M ACTUALLY A GOOD PERSON, THAT’S TOO MUCH PRESSURE”
Diamonds are made under pressure.
Well, Diamond is Unbreakable.
I’m sorry. I just started watching JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure and had to work a reference somewhere.
Muda muda muda muda muda muda muda muda !
There are other JoJo references to make! Kars was a really cool villain too!
Well, not as cool as Dio. Nobody’s cooler than Dio.
Diamonds are one of the Hardest materials out there but they are very breakable. Hard = Brittle
They also require that conditions be very hot. I’m sure Billie can supply that too.
and because they are ‘under’ pressure… Billie’s topping.
Pressure: It can turn coal into diamonds or implode a submarine.
What if there was coal in the submarine? Would the implosion create a diamond out of the coal?:-P
Can’t we give ourselves one more chance? Can’t we give ourselves one more chance? Why can’t we give love that one more chance? Why can’t we give love, give love, give love….etc.
Cause love’s such an old fashioned word and love DARES YOU TO CARE FOR THE PEOPLE ON THE EDGE OF THE NIGHT AND LOVE DARES YOU TO CHANGE OUR WAY OF CARING ABOUT OURSELVES!
THIS IS OUR LAST DANCE!
THIS IS OUR LAST CHANCE.
This is ourselves….
Under pressure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWdLt3Afjrg
(Ice Ice Ba-)
Sweet lightning, I love that song. There’s no letdown like expecting Queen and getting Vanilla Ice.
Ifeel the opposite
It’s not as bad as what Kid Rock did to ‘Sweet Home Alabama’, but it’s close.
Damn right. It’s a good thing Warren Zevon had already passed away or Kid Rock would have gotten his ass sued from here to hell and back.
You can listen to Queen anytime, Ice Ice Baby is a rare and precious gift.
I had to listen to ‘Ice Ice Baby’ for FOUR HOURS EACH WAY going to Myrtle Beach some years ago. It was on a CASSETTE SINGLE in a car player with auto reverse. It wasn’t my car and it’s what the person paying my way down wanted to listen to.
That…my friends…is hell.
I had a dude in the gym put “Beyond My Broken Heart” on speaker. On his shitty smartphone speaker. On repeat. At least twenty times. I swear, songs are even more irritating with the “muzak” treatment of being just audible enough to be an earworm rather than an enjoyable listening experience. Even when I left and came back with my headphones, I COULD STILL HEAR IT through EARBLASTING VOLUME.
At least that was survivable, though. The next time, dude next to me let an SBD… then another. I legit could not breathe and had to bail.
or that time he was on that cooking show and was cooking rice and went “Rice rice baby”
Pressure also makes waffles.
Billie’s on the verge of a paradigm shift! Maybe she should have a drink!
Billie and Ruthie are both starting to sound a bit more like actual counsellors here. I applaud this! Here girls, having a drink…of applejuice.
Alt text is probably just a joke, but I genuinely do think that just knowing people care enough to help you is a huge positive, even if they’re not saying quite the right thing.
It depends on the person, and the state of mind. When I’m feeling intensely anxious, depressed, and/ or frustrated, being fed platitudes makes me want to scream and hit things. Relax. Don’t worry. Everything will be all right. Don’t cry. There’s no reason to cry. Smile, be happy. As long as you do your best, everything will be fine. You can do anything if you put your mind to it. Everything’s darkest before the dawn. Aaaaggghhh!
That’s just me, though. We’re not all the same.
I agree that someone needs to talk to Joyce, and encourage her to open up about what she’s been feeling. I suspect that won’t be an easy task. Also, I suspect that Joyce isn’t yet in a place where she’s ready to open up, and share the stuff she’s trying to work through.
These situations are never easy. The best bet would probably to offer to be a supportive ear or shoulder to Joyce when she is ready to talk about this, and also give her information on other useful resources that might be able to help her.
Of course, it’s one thing to write all this out. Personally, I’m a lot better at writing thing than I am at actually doing things, because my brain is weird like that. It’s way easier to think of the right things to do when I’m just sitting and writing than it is when life is actually happening. Then, there’s just too much information to process, and I fail to think of things. In real life situations like this, I’ll be as supportive as I’m able if the other person comes to me, but I’m not inclined to take the initiative. When someone is visibly upset, but not saying anything to me about it, I generally can’t think what to do, so I avoid, avoid, avoid.
I can go and and on about what Billie and Ruth *should* do, but I really wouldn’t do any better facing a real life situation like this. People are really hard.
Oh god yeah, I know that feeling when it comes to the platitudes. Friends are better about it, but if I try venting to my folks they think I’m on the verge of a breakdown, and like, just let me be angry for a bit. Anger is okay!
I do appreciate that they’re trying to help, though, even if they have a tendency to go too far with the “everything is fine” talk.
This is reminding me of the advice on people complaining about more mundane problems, that sometimes people want sympathy rather than solutions.
And the advice on comforting the bereaved, if they ask you why someone had to die, don’t give them platitudes, just say “I don’t know.”
(Not meaning this comment to sound as callous as it seems to be ending up.)
You don’t know? You horrible monster you.
Yeah, even Han Solo knew.
In moments of grief one asks the impossible questions to which one knows the answer – like “I want my Dad back” – but the scream contained within the question has to be let out.
The answer has to be brutal, that is how the world works. Facing oblivion’s flowers is hard, but it has to be done.
Yeah, Joyce definitely needs someone to set her straight.
Because I love proposing awful ideas simply for the spectacle of their awfulness, I nominate Mary.
“Joyce have you considered that you crisis of faith is happening is because you’re associating with that sinning harlot?”
Cue nose crunching noise.
That’s totally common, to think of things except when a person needing comfort is right there, and then freezing up or avoiding the person that you wish you could comfort.
What works for me was to just say what’s there: “I don’t quite know what to say. I care about you tho.” It gives me permission to get it wrong, which frees me up to listen. Also sometimes I ask, “would you like a hug-and-listen, a distraction, or to be left alone?” People always seem to know which they’d prefer.
Well…yes. Absolutely. I generally think giving someone hallmark platitudes is super duper the wrong way to do things.
On the other hand “Hey, Joyce, you seemed really hurt by everything that happened and I was worried about you. If you want to talk, anytime, I’m right here to listen and help in any way I can”…that would make me feel a lot better.
So, do not give the platitudes, live the platitudes. Don’t say “I’m here to help because maybe that will make you feel better”. Just…be there to help, and hope (silently) that this will make her feel better.
Live the platitudes. I like that. It’ll be my new platitude.
Is Platitudes the book right after Proverbs or the one just before Psalms?
It… usually is, at least, but Ruth’s more or less right in that last panel. Still, it’s probably not actively harmful, so you should try. Yeah, there’s a risk, but life’s kind of about managing them, and Joyce doesn’t seem /depressed/, just hateful of the planet, which is a fairly valid place to be after the last few major events.
I think in Joyce’s case it’d definitely be helpful to her if she just has support, since there’s nobody who can actively solve her problems right now, and it’s going to be a process she has to go through.
So like, I think it’s really good for Joyce right now to know that, while things have changed, she always has her friends to back her up.
It….. really depends. I’ve been trying to cope with severe depression for most of my life, and some of the things people have said to me while trying to help have actually hurt my immediate mental state enough to tip me over from unmotivated and empty to self-harm, because I went from feeling nothing to feeling like I was worthless and a burden to people around me, and they’d be better if my problems and I weren’t there.
Yeah, I remember that period, that part where just being around other people was a crime and how dare I blight them with my presence. Even just being encouraged made me feel worse because they’re taking time out of their schedule to make me feel better, and they must have so many better things to do!
It took me a while, but I eventually started to grasp that people can like me, and it’s not something that had to be measured or earned.
And speaking from the other side I never knew how to act or what to say. Always too scared of saying the wrong thing to say or do anything other than what I’d normally say.
Totally agree with everyone else. It can be a really random affair for depressed people. What might help shake one person out of stuff might dump another into an even deeper spiral. I’ve gotten in the habit of asking what I can do to support and then just be present and listening if the person is noncommunicative.
And from personal experience, I’ve been the literal worst person to deal with when depressed because I tend to climb inside myself and not come out when I get into a hole, which drives “fixer” personalities up a wall.
It depends on why the person is feeling terrible.
If you feel terrible because you think no one likes you then maybe. But if you feel terrible because you think people only do nice things for you when you seem hurt or need sympathy then not so much.
Similarly if you feel bad because you feel useless, like a waste of time and effort and them someone starts wasting time and effort on you that’s not going to work so well. Even if you give them a chance if you still feel depressed then you are caught in a nasty bind where you either assume that the help failed = waste of life. Or you pretend to feel better to make them feel better = ignoring the problem.
Often times unhelpful help can make a person feel better in the short term temporarily alleviating the stress, only for it to come back when the “helper” is gone. For instance, if someone’s feeling bad about their academics which causes them to feel worthless and then they express these feelings of worthlessness to a friend, who tells them not to care so much about academics, they aren’t everything after all. The result could be a temporary relief from stress and depression only to return when other consequential goals such as career success reinforce the importance of academic success forcing the distressed person to again face their sense of failure and worthlessness now with four hours passed and none of which spent studying.
I’m just spit-balling many ways in which unhelpful help can be unhelpful. And of course none of this explores the many more obvious and immediate ways that someone can be unhelpful while trying to help. Such as when the proffer drugs as a solution to feelings of sadness. When their behavior reinforces negative images about the person or the world. Or when their advice is otherwise self destructive.
It definitely helps to know people care, but sometimes the best way to do that is ask ‘do you want a distraction, do you want someone to listen or would you rather be left alone’.
People trying to placate me has always just made me angry and prone to lashing out that they’re wrong. While letting me choose when to reopen interactions has let me calm down, lift my mood by talking with them and then move on past that particular moment.
I agree with the sentiment, even when I read messages on comment boards from people who want to react only to the word and are unwilling to even consider anything resembling context. But keep the thought. It’s a good one.
… the sentiment expressed in Spencer’s original post.
I bet there’s not even anything on that clipboard. Ruth is just using it so she has something to pretend to pay attention to, so she doesn’t have to make eye contact and engage.
Been there. Psst, Ruth, keep the sound effect you use for text notifications on your phone’s homescreen, so you can play it and fake a text whenever you want.
It’s her List.
You do not want to be on Ruth’s list.
(unless you are Billie).
Or maybe Mike. We’ve seen how Mike responds to domineering, abusive women.
So Ruth is telling Billie what a good person she is, but making it look like insulting her.
That does seem to be how their relationship works.
Yeah, they’ve got beautiful healthy moments sandwiched in self-loathing, self-destruction, alcoholism, and abuse.
Mr. Willis, I don’t recall signing the permission slip for this feels trip.
Please let this be a normal feels trip…
With the Willis?
NO WAY!
Quick Billie, roll a die and base your decision on that!
*rolls a d20*
*gets a 1*
This game’s rigged!
Correct. But you can’t not play.
That would be against the rules.
The only winning move is to not play.
What is that, some kind of D&D thing?
NERRRRRRD!
(Sometimes I miss my old Yelling Billie gravatar.)
It’s from “War Games”, a 1983 Matthew Broderick movie.
Yyyyyyyyyyyyep.
*plays Molly Hatchet’s “Lady Luck” on the Muzak*
In South Park Canadians have flappy heads but in DoA they have square jaws?
Well the only Canadians we’ve seen are Ruth and Howard and they’re related. Also non Canadians have been shown to have square jaws as well. (Like Joe)
…huh. It just occurred to me that Joe’s probably related in some way to Canada Guy.
What?
Who’s Canada Guy?
And what is a search engine, may i ask?
LMGTFY
Why are they having the same conversation as Ethan and Danny?
It’s that part of the (first) semester.
I think the difference is that Danny can actually believe what Ethan was saying to him, and also Ethan’s advice was more “it’s not your fault, just be yourself and wait for Amber to come back to you”, and while he knows that it feels like beating your hands against a brick wall, Ethan thinks it’s helping.
Ruth and Billie are trying to help each other too, but since letting Ruth down that one time and her encounter with Alice, Billie doubts her ability to help. Ruth… I’m not sure. I know that she wants what’s best for Billie, she’s definitely started to open up every so slightly with her, but I think she’s more convinced of the hopelessness of the situation, while Billie still thinks she can pull Ruth out of it.
Because Willis can write. Ethan \ Danny \ Amber. Ruth \ Billie \ Joyce. Echoing trios. He pays a lot of attention to structure, resonance and callbacks. It’s what makes the comic so good. Better than many published novels.
Billie could get busy with your body, Ruth.
Does Ruth realize that she’s talking about herself?
My thoughts also.
What? What are you even on abou….
Holy crap! I totally missed that! Yeah, she really kind of is. Damn you and your layered storytelling, Willis!
Sorry to continue this from yesterday’s comic, but I didn’t see this until today and for better or worse I felt attacked and want an opportunity to respond. Willis, your in charge, so if you think I’m being unreasonable here or this is otherwise unwelcome feel free to move it or delete it as you deem appropriate. I’ll bow to your judgment without complaint.
Anyway, for reference Tan said this yesterday:
“Also asidely, if your major objection to accepting that something is problematic is that it potentially puts your own past self in a negative light, THAT sounds like a personal problem, and I reallly hope you don’t take that approach to real life situations.”
Here’s my response- what you called an objection *I* call an example drawn from my own experience to illustrate why I believe Ruth’s character is more a dumbass with terrible social skills fumbling her way through an attraction she barely understood herself….and less the sexual predator she was being accused of. Your response is putting words in my mouth, and I think that’s a lot of bullshit and I don’t feel like letting that slide.
You and I don’t have the same interpretation of this character. We just don’t. That’s a thing that happens frequently on the internet. I am allowed to have my interpretation as much as you are yours. So take your ‘accepting that something is problematic’ and shove it. You have your reasons for your interpretation, and that’s fine, but its still your opinion. There isn’t a damn thing I need to accept about it other than it differs from my opinion. Don’t talk to me like its a goddamn fact and I just need to stop being in denial about it.
And at the risk of putting my foot in my mouth, I continue to believe my interpretation is correct more firmly now than ever. Not for anything in the story proper, but for the simple fact that you throwing around accusations and assumptions about what I’m saying gives me reasonable cause to question your interpretations elsewhere.
That’s all I have to say. I will refrain from hijacking the comment thread that should be about the current strip any further. Good night, everybody.
So as not to completely make all of this about me…
If Billie is that worried about it, why not ask Ruth to come with her and talk to Joyce together. She’s legitimately worried about Joyce so making it out to be a concerned friend going to the RA for help/support is hardly implausible, and she can hopefully convince herself that Ruth will be there to shield Joyce from any “damage” Billie could do trying to help.
But it IS all about about you.and what a monster you are. If you don’t agree we’ll just have to explain in detail why we’re right, because we certainly can’t have someone being wrong on the Internet.
On the other hand, if you aren’t starting your romantic relationships by slamming them against the wall and kissing them, then you obviously aren’t doing it right. Just ask Ruth.
Billie has “spied” on Joyce and her friends at the dorm party.
Coming with the R.A. to Joyce would reveal that (and destroy any confidence to her that Joyce may have).
Since I jumped on that comment yesterday too, I’ll add a bit here:
I don’t think Ruth is a “sexual predator”. I agree that she “is more a dumbass with terrible social skills fumbling her way through an attraction she barely understood herself”.
However, her action – slamming Billie against the wall and forcing a kiss on her was unambiguously sexual assault. That it came out of her confusion and her general self-destructive behavior doesn’t change that. It makes it more understandable and forgivable, but it doesn’t change the basic act.
Not a bad idea northri. But, Joyce is liable to resent both of them visiting her at same time, she may think of it like, a delegation or something.
But, however it works out: Ruth is the RA and she needs to go talk to Joyce if only to make an appearance…it is her JOB.
Billy could go on her own just as a concerned person, if she wasn’t afraid of screwing up. And Ruth in her Ruthless way is pushing her to do it with her lefthanded compliments.
Besides if Ruth is there with Billie, Joyce can’t nag Billie for details about her boyfriend…
As an RA, it does help some people knowing that the RA cares.
Ruth is kinda right. But sometimes one little voice keeps you from the last jump to insanity. So, worth a try.
AAAAAAAALPHA BOOOOOONGOOOOO HEADER CHEER LEADER PROBLEM SOOOOOLVER… no more
You’ve relinquished the job of being a helpful busybody? Does that mean I can suicide without interference now?
I think the sexy lesbian suicide pact still applies.
True, but it might help Billie realize that she doesn’t really mean it. Problem-solver is a hard role to give up and is a functional counterweight to Billie’s tendency to depression.
Or counterwise, solving other people’s problems means she doesn’t have to solve her own.
Oh hey all, I’ve been working on a Dumbing of Age CAH pack in CardCast. Still a work in progress. If you can think of any cards to put in, message me on Tumblr or reply below. I really wanna get this right.
Oops, forgot the link.
Heartrendingly being hit by a truck.
___ with your mom for a nickle.
Sexy Lesbian Suicide Pact.
Leaving out the window
Other Jacob
I got a variation of the first one, the second one verbatim, and I’ll add those last two.
You’re right, but on the second one you left out the sexy, which is kind of important. Also I’m thinking the first one works better as a pattern than an object. But, hey, up to you.
You could also argue that Other Jacob is already on there as dormmate’s vibrator, but other Jacob is funnier. Similarly a nickle isn’t that hilarious in most contexts while doing it with your mother for a nickle is always good for a snerk. Just saying.
A Hugs Boson
You’ve felt awfully quiet lately, Lord. Send me ___, ___, anything.
Speaking entirely in sarcasm
The shower detritus.
Eyeballin’ the business ends of the squirrels
Having loud arguments in the hall to divert suspicion.
Never before has ___ sounded so much like ___.
What you said exactly, but without the sarcasm.
Eating cereal and mountain dew for breakfast
It’s been hypothesized that some dinosaurs found ___ particularly arousing.
Fart jokes
Kissing a girl
That is so funny! Now all we need is a DOA fighting game.
Yes, exactly like that, only without the ____!
Sal, our roommate agreement clearly states that we should refrain from ______.
Well if it’s the LAST one, then you’re ______. We’re all _____ here.
Sometimes in these _____ I strongly feel like I’m missing some ______.
Teacher this _____ is making me feel uncomfortable, and I request ______.
Premarital hanky-panky.
Racially charged invectives.
Coming out whiter.
Barking up the wrong tree.
The Cragged Shame Pits of the Lustwolves.
… I’ll stop now.
Thanks, everyone.
Which I meant to follow up with “keep ’em coming!” Why must my computer be dumb.
In other words, Dad, ____ says you can _____.
The Great Faz
PDF guides on how to properly approach and dominate a lady.
Infinite, Unlimited Cocoa Puffs
A Tricera-Top(tm)
A grappling hook.
Free gay pizza (and subs!)
Butts
Twenty bucks to go away.
A lesbian waitin’ to happen.
Being sustained by the sadness of others.
Dang! If you weren’t ___ we’ here to have a very serious talk about your taste in ___.
We’d have to have a very.serious talk…
Dangnabit autocorrect and lack of editing.
“Hey, guess what, I’m a __________!”
Added.
I may have missed something but “whiteboard ding-dongs” and “Whiteboard Ding-Dong Bandit” appear to be missing as responses.
I never added those yet, but I shall.
Part of me is starting to think that Ruth would actually be the right person to talk to Joyce right now, because she’s not Joyce’s friend. She’s enough of an authority figure that Joyce might still feel obligated to talk to her, and if she starts whining, Ruth will tell her, harshly, to stop. As Joyce pointed out to Roz, sometimes she needs someone to be mean to her, and Ruth is really quite well suited to that role.
I think Billie and Ruth have become my favorite couple/pairing. I liked Joyce/Dorothy friendship, but Billie and Ruth, wow.. It’s all coming up Billie for me, she is so interesting and so changed since we met her.
So Billie has become the Nathan Detroit of hearts?
Awwwww, Billie clings to Ruth like a teddy bear. A cranky, insulting teddy bear, but still.
More like what she thinks is a buoy in the ocean, but is actually a floating mine.
That’s a very apt metaphor for their relationship
Aaaaaaaaah, I sympathise with you both so much
yeeeeeeeeeep
Anyone else notice that, from the side, Ruth’s head looks like a Box? Like she’s a Lego Action Figure?
The top of her head is flat, and her chin is square and pointy and it’s so long two of Billie’s heads could fit right inside.
Consult the Book of Platitudes!
This may be a situation requiring a “There’s no I in Team” level platitude.
We are entering a crisis.
http://i.imgur.com/sFk2r.jpg
Platitudes, Chapter two, verses nine to twenty-one. There you’ll find the answer .