The day has arrived! Dumbing of Age Book 5 is now available in the online store! I’m down to the nitty gritty on Kickstarter pledge fulfillment, and it’s teeeeeechnically holiday shopping season now even if it feels gross to admit that, so up it goes! Have at it.
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“Yes, honeybunny??”
Ruth has become Harley Quinn. I KNEW Arkham wasn’t a good place to treat depression.
Arkham isn’t a good place to treat anything really.
its a good way to test the flaws in security systems
I like to think WayneTech provides them with free security systems…as a form of Beta testing.
Guaranteed to withstand a joker level threat for up to three weeks…
“… or your money back!”
“I thought you were giving this to us for free?”
“Yup! Also, it’s the Joker. He might have planted bombs in the units just now while we were talking.”
Arkham is great at treating agoraphobia. None of the patients stay indoors for long.
Whaaat, that’s crazy talk
Looks a bit overdressed for Harley Quinn.
What are you talking about?
Harley wears a full-body black and white Harlequin costume. I don’t know who this “underdressed” person everyone is talking about is supposed to be. It’s like everyone lives in some alternate world from me, where Harley wears skimpy outfits, and Starfire is an emotionless sex robot, and Zeus is Wonder Woman’s father. What gives?
Oops, black and red. You know what I meant. :op
I think Chaucer’s talking about Suicide Squad and New 52 Harleen. God, I hate that costume
Search “Harley Quinn”. Then, search “Harley Quinn classic”. Times are changing. This is what modern is, whether we like it or not.
Missing the joke so hard that you could cut diamond.
“Is that you, snoogy-woogy lips???”
This is either a good sign or very bad, hopefully it’s a stir in the right direction.
Ruth is doing MUCH better than if Trump were there.
“DID YOU JUST CALL ME A GIANT MUTANT???”
“Also, this thing I’m eating is pretty good. Want some, sweetie?”
Goddammit, this was supposed to be dramatic and meaningful!!
Billie picked unnecessary fights with three more staff members on her way here! She punched a clown on his way to the children’s ward! She flattened herself against the wall when a security guard walked by, while loudly humming the Mission: Impossible theme!
Was all that for nothing, Ruth?!
That clown was a bit of a dick.
Actually, he prefers to be called Ricky.
Punching a clown is never for nothing.
Ruth has adjusted to life on the inside, she knows who to trade cigarettes for pudding
She already scooped out the eyeball of the biggest lady with a rusty spoon. Now they know that she means business.
The crazy thing is, it was a plastic spoon, so they don’t even know how it got rusty
BECAUSE SHE’S FUDGING RUTHLESS, THAT’S WHY!!!!!
Ruth’s haunted house is full of actual body parts- “Feel the spaghetti,” she says as she puts your hand in a bowl of actual intestines. “Peeled grapes, creepy!” as you grab actual eyeballs.
they get to have pudding in their room? I never got to bring food to my room.
She’s still in the hospital; they probably brought it to her.
All the psych wards I’ve been to only allowed food in the common areas. Then again, this looks more like a regular hospital room rather than a psych ward room.
Especially considering the closed door. On the rare occasions a psych ward I was in actually had doors to the rooms it was forbidden to close them.
A good friend of mine has been in three psych wards over the past year, and one of them did allow food in the rooms. That one was considerably more low-security. We (visitors) even got to keep our phones on us if we promised to keep them off.
Of course, this was the hospital that discharged my friend while they were in the middle of a depressive episode because their insurance ran out, so fuck them anyway.
The closed door is curious for someone on suicide watch. They gotta have some way of monitoring her. … or maybe there’s different grades of suicidal, and they don’t have her on a grade that merits 24/7 surveillance?
I don’t know. This situation is really weird. Like, there was one time I hit a vein and the doctor at the ER just sent me home so I didn’t even end up in the psych ward that time. But like I said before, it doesn’t even look like Ruth is in a psych ward room (it’s been like a decade since I’ve been in one but I seem to recall we didn’t even have windows…? So we wouldn’t like try to escape I guess, throw a chair through them or something? We certainly didn’t have the kind of bed Ruth’s in). Sorry I’m really tired right now so my brain is a disorganised mess but I’m kinda trying to say that different doctors will react differently to suicidal ideation (and even bona fide suicide attempts), and also that Ruth’s room seems to be some sort of weird middle ground that I don’t understand. She’s not injured so she shouldn’t be in a non-psych ward room, but everything about that room says “this isn’t a psych ward.”
Chocolate seahorse sailboat popcorn. No more sense-making from me today~
Billie don’t leave!
Pudding makes everything better.
depending on the flavor
RUTH KILLED CHLOE
No, she didn’t.
She just ate her hair.
the pudding queen is dead, long live depression queen
Ruth couldn’t kill Chloe Crashman. The Dark Spirits would protect her.
There’s always room for pudding! ^_^
I guess Ruth ate her meat.
I didn’t realize she was into that.
If you don’t eat your meat, you can’t have any pudding.
How can you have any pudding, if you don’t eat your meat?
We don’t need no education
Wrong, do it again!
Wrong, do it again!
Relatable.
Pudding laced with antidepressants, smart.
I mean, sure, if by ‘smart’ you mean ‘horribly unethical.’
I think it’s only unethical if you don’t tell them that it has antidepressants.
Unless it’s [insert flavor you don’t like] pudding. That violates the Hippocratic Oath.
I like your use of the [Insert] gag.
If you find those terms coinciding a lot in your life, it’s time to start shopping for volcano lairs.
I don’t care what the evil overlord list says, volcano lairs are the *best.*
I prefer moving sky lairs myself
I like the meteor hurling towards earth lair shure they only hold so long but they alredy include a villainy plan to earth’s destrzction
And useless, antidepressants don’t work like that.
(I’ve taken a LOT of antidepressants over the years…)
Benzodiazepines, on the other hand…
it’s a dead giveaway when the pudding is made by the pharmacist.
Happy Ruth makes me very very uncomfortable
Mary’s body is stuffed under the mattress isn’t it?
Maybe she heard about Billie knocking her down and isn’t so much happy as INCREDIBLY horny.
The entire Clarke wing just got the shivers and they don’t know why.
“Be good,” they whisper to each other. “keep your head down. She can see you, even now. She hears your thoughts. She will come back one day, and you don’t want to be on the naughty list then…”
I don’t know about you but that sounds suspiciously like Santa Claus >.>
more like Krampus
She knows when you are sleeping, she knows when you’re awake. Her network of hidden cameras are everywhere, so be good for Ruthless’s sake!
Bagge, you can’t keep making comments that I want to marry. Do you have any idea how all those comment weddings are going to ruin me?!?!
I do wish for you to be happy and I respect your choice, but honestly I think you can do better than comments about evil!Ruth.
(but thanks :-))
Did I ever show you the video of the groom’s speech I made for my actual wedding?
I’m sure it was suitably epic!
++good
Doubleplusgood!
I am authorized to say the action we are now reporting may well bring the SLSP within measurable distance of its end!
i hope to see more happy ruthless.
Can a happy Ruth even be called Ruthless? I guess she has to change her last name… ooh, is she getting married???
Helloooooo, sunshine!
Relevant profile pic
My profile pick is always relevant.
I’m choosing to believe at least PART of that smile is because she’s happy to see Billie.
The rest is still pudding, obviously.
It’s difficult to be sad with a mouth full of pudding.
Impossible if the pudding is butterscotch.
What if it’s tapioca pudding?
Doesn’t that depend on what is in the Tapioca? We got raisins. Often with sliced banana on top. Hee-hee, ba-Na-Na! BaNnananan. Heehee, Banana!
Yuk, raisins!
But Banana, I’ll take!
I’ll take the raisins if you don’t want them.
Gladly! Sharing food together is more fun anyway! 😀
Yum!
One of the great universal truths of the world.
-“BB”-
Because of YOU I discovered that there’s butterscotch-flavoured pudding. I’ve never had heard about that in my life.
You have my eternal gratitude!
I find this hilarious because most of our patients don’t like the butterscotch – but the few who like it want only butterscotch. Very black and white.
Mhmmm… maybe they don’t like whiskey?
I only knew about butterscotch as a flavour because I once found butterscotch fudge, and it was pretty tasty! (never ate the pudding, which might have been obvious since I didn’t know about that)
I’ll try making the pudding soon (because it’s probably not available anywhere where I am and if it is its an important product and definitely overpriced), but I’m pretty confident I’ll like the taste, since I’m a whiskey-y-person anyway…
Anti-depression meds, maybe?
She’s living in a world where Trump isn’t going to be president.
I mean, their representative is Robin DeSanto, but I hear tell that they’re still doing much better than if trump was in the room.
If only they worked so quickly!
I think it’s more that she is in a sunbeam eating pudding and she doesn’t have to deal with all her problems right now.
If they worked that quickly it’d be quite frightening. I’d be extremely hesitant to take them, and I’m saying that as someone who’s made peace with likely being on multiple psychiatric medications for the rest of his life.
Heck, the reason I held off from agreeing to take them despite nearly a year of suicidal depression was a fear that they were going to radically change my personality.
Huh! I wanted them to work Right The Hell Now, but people sure have different experiences.
Yeah, and if they worked overnight that’s moving from personality change territory into philosophical thought experiment territory.
There’s actually currently research into a potential new category of anti-depressants based on ketamine that might potentially lead to anti-depressants that can work instantly, or at least in a manner of days rather than weeks.
Not to be on both sides of the issue, but my wife’s quality of life could potentially be so much better if her insurance covered ketamine for her depression. Nothing else has made more than a dent in it. It’s good to hear they’re working on finding a way to make money off of it so they can offer it to people without shirking responsibility to various corporation’s stockholders. Wow, I’m bitter about this.
That’s a really good reason to feel bitter, in my opinion.
Oof.
Yeah, our drug system is borked to all hell, but it would be nice for folks for whom ketamine works to have something to take that could be covered by insurance and not have to involve a crime to acquire.
That sounds pretty cool. The fact it takes anti-depressants weeks and sometimes even longer than a month of taking them to check if they even work is pretty inefficient and all. If they can even get it down to like 5-7 days that would be incredible.
I personally view it as the depression has already altered my personality, and my psychiatric meds help me knock it back into shape. Obviously, which meds work best vary from person to person due to individual brain chemistry, and some meds can have unwanted side-effects on your personality. But just reducing the weight of the depression isn’t so much a personality change but pulling you OUT of a personality change.
Obviously this is a very personal thing and I’m not telling you how to think about it. Sometimes you have to go through multiple meds to find ones that work right and sometimes nothing works quite right and you have to decide which variety of side effects you can live with, and that’s all admittedly quite scary.
I definitely think that Ruth’s change in mood isn’t medication but not having outside pressure on her anymore. As far as she’s concerned, she’s already hit rock bottom, and where it’s gotten her is sitting in bed in PJs with pudding. She doesn’t have to worry about work and school obligations for the time being and it’ll be a little bit before she has to deal with her grandfather. She’s not in an objectively great place but getting a little bit of time to breathe and just exist for a while can do wonders.
I’m happy with what I’m on now, and these questions have been a multi-decade journey. Right now I’m just terrified of the Medicaid expansion being taken away and not being able to afford treatment.
God, yeah, that’s a horrifying what-if. I hope things work out for you.
I’d get them, but I’m afraid of spending money that could have gone to food on medication that could potentially be thrown out by my “NATURAL WAY EXERCISE SUNSHINE” mother.
Depression is a lot easier to deal with if you can ignore basically all of the things that stress you out. The second you have to think about them again though…
oh boy
Anti-depressants should bring the patient’s mood up, but not to the level of Ruth’s apparent euphoria.
There’s a phase at the beginning of taking *some* A/D where mood-swings set in so the patient can become hyper-depressed or very euphoric. Both can lead to bad things happening.
Mood swings also happen when the patient begins the withdrawal from the drug program.
I’m on escitalopram. It’s helped me through a few episodes. There are other drugs, but that one is popular now. I did not feel any major side effects at the beginning or end, and most people don’t.
Yeah, I got the hyper-euphoria when I first went on anti-depressants. Part of it was chemical, part of it was just “oh, maybe I really am going to get better, yay” and at least part of it was placebo. I wouldn’t be too worried about Ruth’s mood levels being where they are, but if she got more euphoric than this, we might start worrying she has bipolar, which can have nasty responses to traditional antidepressants, and is often undiagnosed in women.
“More euphoric than this”
I’m envisioning Ruth donning a dress, dancing out in the sunshine, singing a song, with cute little animals trailing along behind her and perching on her shoulders.
umm, so euphoric people think they can fly so they walk off a cliff.
The group of meds I’m on got a very bad rep when they first came out.
Its really nice to see Ruth having a better moment, even if its a small one.
omg
I feel somehow disturbed by this and I don’t know why.
Pudding? Billie doesn’t even know you any more, Ruth.
I too am very conflicted
But eerily-happy Ruth is adorable so I’m just gonna roll with this
*dances because Ruth is doing better*
Why is she so pink and glowy?
She almost seems … gelatinous.
Oh no. She has become Glob Ruth.
Ruth is become pudding, destroyer of worlds
oh god this is even scarier than depressed ruth
jokes aside, happy ruth is good
the sudden dramatic change can be scary or a false mask honestly
Come on, she’s sitting in a sunbeam eating pudding. Not everything has to have some deep dark root cause!
Everything in the DOA universe has a deep dark root cause, and his name is David M. Willis.
And that is why I cannot look away. I must watch the unfold, because: Willis.
Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Willis R’lyeh wgah-nagl fhtagn
Maybe her vitamin D was just down and is now replenished!
Yup. Could also just be that she’s under less external pressure now. Also, Billie surprised her, so it’s not just a show for Billie (at this point).
this is such a beautiful moment.. thenks willis for my life….
Yes. That is pudding.
“Hospital sex?”
I feel kinda bad for Billie, because in her anger and fear over what has happened she has probably convinced herself that Ruth would be an absolute mess. Strapped to the bed, suffering, maybe finally crying. I can’t blame Billie, she’s just uninformed in how things like this work. She thinks Ruth is gonna be held against her will, hissing and spitting. Maybe still a doll in her bed. And instead that vision in her head is shattered and replaced with “Pudding?”. It hurts because she didn’t want to think Carla was right to do what she did (the method for doing it, including outting the two of them and not taking into account how Ruth has an abusive grandpa, these are both flaws. Definite mistakes in what she’s done. But in the end it was better than letting Ruth just sit in her bed). It hurts her because it confirms to Billie that she couldn’t fix Ruth alone. Billie is gonna take this personally and feel like shit about herself even more. Billie is Amethyst.
It’s one of several major problems with basing your self worth on your sole ability to fix somebody else: you require your loved ones to be broken.
Ouch.
They have the healthiest relationship dynamic, don’t they…
Suuuuper healthy.
(Kinda like how the Joker is super sane.)
It gets worse:
If Ruth has actually improved, then she’s no longer beyond ‘toxic’ Billie’s ability to harm!
What everyone’s said. Cause yeah, she genuinely believed she was the only one who could save Ruth and that Ruth being broken and toxic meant she wouldn’t be destroyed by her own toxicity (this being how Billie views herself rather than something true). And that meant that part of her needed Ruth to stay broken to feel like she’s not something that will destroy her. That she can be capable of opening up joy in someone rather than pain.
And playing off Leorale, there’s another nasty element of being the person who helps “fix” their partner and care for their mental illness during a time of crisis and it’s one I fell into really bad in my youth.
And that’s that if you’re the one “fixing” and “supporting”, then it can seem wrong or gauche to process your own pain or suffering and in fact can be outright discouraged because that’s not the dynamic.
It’s been clear for a while in comic that Billie is incredibly depressed and in emotional crisis, but has been using “being there for Ruth” and “caring for Ruth” as her excuse to avoid actually tackling that and healing from that. If Ruth is well, then her excuse to hide from her own pain disappears and I don’t think she’s fully ready to acknowledge just how bad her mental state currently is.
Ouch, ouch, ouch.
This growing sense of dread I’m feeling, that’s what Walky has felt like haft the comic now…
I was worried about what was going to happen when she got inside the room, but now I’m very worried about what will happen if she actually backs out and leaves like she’s starting to do in the last panel.
I really hope Ruth calls her back into the room before she slinks away.
Amethyst is the stone that is thought to neutralize alcohol, hence its Greek name. That doesn’t quite fit Billie’s habits, does it? So what other reference have I missed?
Amethyst from Steven Universe. Like Billie she takes everything personally as a sign of her inherent failings.
Also like Billie she has a giant butt.
They’re both very nice butts though.
Billie: Thanks, but I’m lactose intolerant.
…
Also, yay Ruth seems to be doing better. Either therapy went better than expected or there is a pile of femurs from group therapy under her bed and she stole all of there pudding as well.
Panel 5 Billie is joy-intolerant.
Panel Six, sorry.
Eyes !
They’re green again! Hooray!
Oh shit, they’re all the way back!
So shiny
Pudding: helps people drown their sorrows and also helps Ruth by polishing her eyes.
That’s nice :). Then again, I’m smiling like that and I have never been more depressed in my life. I’m exhibiting entirely new and scary symptoms. Just yesterday, I became emotionally unable to move for an hour
That sounds potentially important, please remember to mention it to your therapist.
What Leorale said. Also, keep an eye on ideation. If you start to feel it creeping up, please reach out to suicide hotlines or if it gets hard to move or think or believe that this state will pass, then please check out the following site which has helped me and mine countless times in the past:
http://www.metanoia.org/suicide/
thanks. I talked with my therapist about earlier today. And I’m going back home to get my life back together next semester
also, is suicidal ideation something different from suicidal tendencies? Cause I have fantasies, but dismiss them immediately
For me, there is sort of a line that divides fleeting thoughts from more intentional planning. I can tell when I’ve crossed it.
that’s good to hear
Ideation: thoughts. Tendencies: danger of acting. I’m sorry you’re dealing with this right now. I’ve definitely been lie-on-the-floor-and-can’t-get-up depressed a few times in my life. It does get better.
When I’m like that (although I’m not sure if it’s the same thing) my family tries to push me out of it by forcing me to do something or get out of the house, because some of them measure their worth as a human being as weather I look ok and normal or not, it’s not healthy. Usually that only leads to arguments and fighting and me getting blamed for not acting right
I want to protect that smile.
you know what would protect that smile?
Drawings of butts
…no you’re a pervert!
I mean, I’m flattered, but you don’t even know what I look like.
I tried drawing your profile once, but it came out looking kinda half-assed.
Ouch. That was cheeky.
I could do that.
But I could also do it for money *wink*.
So I know you need money to live but hear me out.
What if I pay you in exposure.
That just sounds dirty.
l-lewd
Hee-hee, Some-1 said Butts!
I really love that sentiment and yes, 100% agree. Protect the smile!
When I was hospitalized last year for my suicide ideation, I actually ended up like this within a day or two. I didn’t feel as hopeless, I actually befriended a lot of people there, and generally started to feel more ‘alive’. It’s nice to see Ruth experiencing something similar and becoming receptive to help of some sort.
However, I do wish the nurses would let me go barefoot. Those slip socks sucked. |:U
Better slip socks than barefoot on a hospital floor. Eeeeeggggghhh. Ick.
Currently in partial-hospitalization and just started it on Tuesday. And yeah, despite being utterly terrified going in there, once it actually started I’ve been feeling a lot better and fairly quick because hey, learning actual coping mechanisms. Hey, being around a lot of other people who know precisely what you’re going through and who are equipped to help.
Though sadly I have not yet found any pudding cups.
escaping your usual life can be relaxing even if nothing else.
I mean, the worst already happened. Now and least she doesn’t have to worry about it.
if you are locked away then life outside of the area doesn’t seem to matter much.
….yes.
“We’re doing pet names now? Okay, snookie-ookums… Oh… wait. You’re actually eating pudding. Nevermind.”
Ah, brings back memories of the ward. Not good ones, but you know.
Completely reminds me of this Shortpacked comic
http://www.shortpacked.com/index.php?id=917
It reminds me of the time Joyce rushed back to the dorm from her class, worried sick about Becky and fantasizing about cheering her up, and then Becky was all, “Surprise haircut!”
You weren’t married to the idea of a sexy lesbian suicide pact, were you billie?
I think she might have, that the tragic secret affair and codependence of being someone’s whole world is something that helps her feel connected, important, meaningful.
And this might be a key step towards being able to have healthy relationships even if there are still elements of pain, depression, and survival.
Pudding makes everything better!
You think there’s some antidepressant and that putting
Maybe it is laced with tryptophane, which is a precursor for serotonine.
And a cartoon blue bird lands on Ruth’s shoulder.
Wonderful psychiatric ward,
Wonderful day!
Cuter than I was expecting
I am guessing Ruth is out of her low point for the moment and will have to go to therapy to deal with the next ones that might come.
There are many things that this could herald, but right now I simply want to sit back and enjoy Ruth’s apparent happiness.
Those are some powerful drugs Ruth must be taking.
Having been in Ruth’s position I hope that smile is genuine. Getting out of the spiral and getting help/meds can make a huge difference
I just hope Billie takes it ok. Depresssion feeds on those around you.
I don’t quite see a smile, just a non-frown while talking with a full mouth.
Comic Reactions:
This is such a beautiful scene. Ruth smiling in the sun, eyes wide again. And part of me wants to believe this is a major turning point, that the hospitalization and therapies and round-the-clock care is helping as is the momentary respite from her responsibilities and fear.
But another part of me, a cynical part of me honed by too many years of supporting suicidal friends and lovers warns me that someone suddenly seeming happy after a long depressive episode often means that they’ve started forming a suicide plan and are about to have an attempt.
So… yeah, I’m really glad she’s safe and in hospital right now and I’m going to hope like hell that it’s just the hospital care and therapies working rather than a portent of something sinister.
Also, Billie in Panel 2 is heart-breaking, the fear on her face, that she will be walking in on a walking corpse and that massive distrust she has that any form of official therapy or care will help. Because in her experience, she’s seen how that’s failed her might-as-well-be-a-sister Sal. And that becomes super apparent in her question in panel 3 and the stutter she has to even ask.
And panel 1 is beautiful. Her so alone and waiting, building up the courage. It really hammers home how lost she has felt without the ability to structure her sense of self around “saving” Ruth and makes me worry that she’ll interpret Ruth potentially getting better very negatively, assuming that now Ruth will be “too good for her” and thus will be “poisoned by her toxicity”.
And it makes me hopeful that Billie can be encouraged more and more by the mandatory therapy into really working through that assumption of worthlessness. And also makes me hopeful that these two crazy kids might actually get out of this relatively okay. And if it’s the end of the relationship, that’s okay, as I don’t think it’ll be the end of a really strong friendship no matter what.
They’ve been through fire and hell and have been alone in a maelstrom of bullshit and that’s not been the healthiest, so I enjoy seeing where things evolve from here.
I’m pretty sure Billie shares each and every one of your worries. Entering that room is pure torture, she has no idea what she will find.
And yet she goes in.
I’m glad Ruth is feeling better today too, and Billie is all too heartbreaking here.
I’m not sure she’s got part of her ideas about therapy from Sal though. Keep in mind, she didn’t know about the robbery until this year, and therapy was a consequence of that. I think if she heard Sal was in therapy she would ask why (or for what).
Unless she and Sal have had a heart to heart we’ve not been privy to, I think we can chalk this up to A) Societal stigmatization of therapy and possibly B) Dear old daddy not giving a rat’s ass about emotional or psychiatric health and probably being shitty about it.
Where did you get that she didn’t know about the robbery? They lived in the same town, went to the same school, Sal’s mothers threats her more like a daughter than she does Sal: how could she not know about the robbery?
But, yeah, visiting someone hospitalized for depression is scary and finding them apparently happy when you expect them do be even more depressed than before is unsettling and hard to deal with.
Especially if you feel like hell yourself and are just keeping it together to help.
Billie did not actually know about the robbery. She says as much to Walky way back near the comic’s beginning.
And it makes sense why not. Sal being a “criminal” is “shameful for the family” so you bury it and warn everyone not to tell anyone and you tell even the closest of family friends that Sal is just going off to boarding school and it was her choice and wasn’t that a silly decision on her part.
And BBCC-
Yeah, you’re probably right on that then. Given what we already know about her dear old dad and how vile his views on services that help others are, it’s probably a given that he’s viciously against psychological services as well and might even view receiving them as a sign of weakness or irreparable brokenness and certainly not as something that could help someone in crisis.
Now I’m just imagining the Walkerton parents acting like Sal somehow ‘found god’ or something so they sent her off.
Either that or kept it to ‘she’s always been so troubled and we’re so worried so we thought maybe some moral instruction would help and god would give her someone to talk to’. No details on what they mean by troubled, of course. That would make them sound like bad parents and playing the overly concerned ones are so much more sympathetic to the neighbours.
She says so here: http://www.dumbingofage.com/2010/comic/book-1/02-uphill-from-here/news/
Though what is interesting is that Walky seems to have thought she knew.
Thanks for the link. I may be missing something here. It sounded like Walky and Billie went to the same school (as she was stuffing him into closets as mentioned somewhere). So how could Sal possibly commit a crime and be sent of to catholic school without anyone catching on? Even if minor’s names are not disclosed, there’s a grapevine everywhere. Or did she commit her crime somewhere outside her home town?
It was at a gas station, presumably out of the way.
I think it’s very likely that the Walkertons were extremely hush about why Sal was sent to Tennessee, even to Billie. From what I figure Billie was still around Walky to the point where she still at least somewhat close with his parents, but still not willing to openly acknowledge him in public.
Catholic school? They couldn’t, unless they wanted to lie that she’d switched to home schooling and just never ever ever ever left the house or was conveniently out of the house when people were over (and I don’t think Marcie – or Billie – would buy that if they did)
But commit a crime? Easier to bury than you might think.
Per your second paragraph I am worrying that she is in super-fake-happy-mode because she thinks that is the best way to get out of the hospital.
I was told that a danger with anti-depressants was that they can restore energy before they change mood, leading to suicide attempts from people who were too lethargic before. Though as others have noted, one day on anti-depressants is unlikely to have much effect.
honestly, this strip makes me so happy. i smiled when i saw this. she’s clearly not somehow cured, or better, or whatever, but i feel like this strip is like… the perfect way to really begin a recovery arc of sorts. idk! it makes me feel really optimistic about the future. it’s nice.
Also the humor
That’s a look of fear because I think she’s never seen Ruth that happy.
She was in it for the spite, but now she just seems so sweet and huggable.
It’s obviously some sort of trap
Those are the eyes of someone who has discovered the wonderful world of Drugs.
Seeing some of the other comments here, It’s amazing how many emotions people can get from this, and how many feelings they’ve found are actually part of the strip. I’d feel that way, too– but no, my laughter-and-cynicism-based mind only saw the humor of it initially. I genuinely chuckled at the alt-text.
Aww this is actually cute and Ruth looks better maybe she got more out of group than she thoughtm and I officially want one of them to call the other pudding or puddin as a nickname
The last panel is the absolutely most perfect “WHAT.” face.
I’m crying from laughing at the last 3 panels, this is fucking hilarious.
Sumbongo!! That actually looks like a smile on Ruth’s face!!!
While I am happy Ruth is getting help and is happy seeming in this strip, I won’t lie, I’m kinda irritated it’s happened already. I’m sure I don’t have to tell anyone here that therapy is not an insta-cure. Therapy very rarely works in a day. That stuff takes time. Maybe other people have different experiences from what I’ve heard and gone to, but I wouldn’t think it’d be this much of a change this soon. Though, on the other hand, Ruth’s already been seeming better than yesterday, so maybe today just hasn’t been as rough, depression wise?
Aaaah, already feeling dickish. I definitely trust this isn’t the end of Ruth’s depression story and I trust Willis to write it well. I’ve seen too many stories where therapy (when it isn’t demonized) is treated like an instant cure and never followed up on again. It’s one of those things that raised my guard up. My apologies for the OP.
Yeah neither thing (therapy, even intensive-you-hit-rock-bottom therapy, or meds) should be enough to produce a full recovery in a few hours. My bet’s that this is mostly the lighting (here for comedic/dramatic effect in true Willisian fashion) and Ruth getting some pudding cups, a prescription if not the actual first dose of whatever they put her on, the first rounds of therapy that are at least not the total “you’re worthless” shun-fest Ruth was probably fearing, and the “well I’ve hit rock bottom and people are insisting there’s still a path forward and giving actual suggestions” all giving her a boost back up from pure catatonia and next strip we’ll see she isn’t in fact as better as this strip suggests, just that it seems really dramatic since she was at rock bottom and is now starting to improve.
Now the question is whether or not Billie stays to notice that fact, because I think the lighting and everything are partly to feed into her whole “I should have been enough to save Ruth and I couldn’t” guilt complex that something else could and Carla may actually have had a better idea than watching from a distance and the sexy lesbian suicide pact. ‘Cause we are CLEARLY not at the end of Billie’s depression story.
Damn that second sentence is a run-on.
FWIW I don’t think that’s something you have to be concerned about in this comic.
Ruth hasn’t been cured by going to group therapy that one time.
I’m not overly worried, just something that shot my guard up for weird reasons last night and I don’t know why.
I understand. That happens to me too on occasion when I see something that just pings all my Nope alarms at once.
It didn’t even come up the first time I saw the strip what the fuck brain.
Ruth looks so good and happy in the middle panels it makes me smile. 😀
Ruth looks like she’s doing okay! She’s telling the psychiatrists things in exchange she’s getting pudding! I think that Billie may rightly feel a bit peeved that Ruth is having a better time on the inside than she is on the outside!
This is what’s called ‘shocked therapy’ and Billie isn’t even the patient.
Judging by eye dilation, that pudding is designed to make people extra-happy.
Do you not have yours with Prozac sprinkles?
I am worried about where this is going.
you don’t just go from suicidal to happy pudding face that quickly without some form of meds or some sort of denial.
Ruth isn’t shocked or surprised or elated to see her girlfriend after the incident, she just offers her some pudding like she is in her own little world.
i may be reading to deeply into this, but i have been in deep suicidal depression, and have known a couple of people that were in the same situation, and shit don’t turn around that fast. Not even with therapy.
Really? Cause I do it all the time.
It seems pretty natural to me. I’ve had suicidal and happy pudding face inside of the same day. Just because you have happy pudding face doesn’t mean you won’t want to die in the morning.
and just because you have happy pudding face doesnt mean you dont want to die on the inside (and is momentarily distracted from being sad)
According to an article published by a suicide prevention worker, this sort of sudden emotional reversal can actually be a HUGE red flag, because sometimes a suicidal person’s apparent calm and contentment can be because they’ve made up their mind to go through with it. That sense of peace and finality is what makes them suddenly “normal”; a common refrain from loved ones afterwards is “they seemed so normal”.
Be especially wary in these situations if the suicidal person tries to encourage you to leave them alone, or if they spend several days seeing friends or family (they’re “saying goodbye”, even if they don’t come out and say it).
Yeah, that’s my current fear. Cause that happens a lot. One of my trans kids had been in a depressive haze for a while and came in one day super happy and excited and really open about his life in a way he hadn’t been before and I started getting a sinking feeling. And that turned out to be prescient because he then had an attempt over the weekend (he’s alive and in a protected space now).
But I also know from personal experience that when you’ve been in a deep pit for awhile, finally having access to services that make things better can create a temporary euphoria. The first time I went to therapy and started talking with the doctors about getting access to antidepressants, I was crying happily for hours afterwards because for the first time in months it finally felt like I wasn’t just stuck in an unending pit and I was finally starting to claw my way up to the light.
So could really go either way here and I’m really hoping for the latter.
My thoughts also, in both directions.
(Also hugs to you for having to deal with that, and support others, in RL.)
On the more positive part of your experience- it’s very possible for something to cause that sort of temporary mood shift, I agree. For me, personally, it was being prescribed hormones after I think three years of trying- that was just a huge feeling of “holy crap EVERYTHING is going to be okay now, I can be happy”. But of course that wasn’t the fix to everything and even with the things it helped with, it took time for the testosterone to actually start causing changes.
I suspect the change here isn’t as extreme as it appears, and that it is partly a relief of having a safe space kicking in or similar. Time will tell, but as someone who’s experienced depression myself I’m interested to see where this goes.
Agreed on the ‘not as extreme as it appears’ front. Bet you ten to one the next strip shifts to Ruth in normal light again and that changes the effect somewhat.
In a counseling course I took in the ’70’s (so this could be really outdated information) the professor, a working psychiatrist, said that occasionally a depressed person hasn’t killed themselves because that takes more than they’ve got. At the beginning of therapy, they get just well enough to finish the job. A crucial time.
Euphoric/depressive episodes at the beginning of an A/D program are common.
Both can lead to bad situations if the patient isn’t being monitored.
Feeling the need to say more/ share my experience with depression.
To all the people suggesting her brief happy looking moment is from anti-depressants: they don’t work instantly. Rarely a patient might see some instant alleviation in symptoms but they take 4-8 weeks to reach full effectiveness. Additionally some patients will not respond to a particular anti-depressant, or find the side-effects unlivable. If Ruth had just started on anti-depressants I highly doubt she’d be sitting up eating pudding; day 1 of side-effects usually sucks hard.
So time to share something weird/depressing. (If suicide mentions are a trigger for you please don’t read further.)
I got really depressed this year. It was bad enough that I spent three weeks solid miserable and crying or unable to feel anything at all. Additionally I had difficulty eating, sleeping, thinking clearly, etc. At the end of that three weeks my spouse had to take me to the ER because I wanted to kill myself, and had a plan. I spent the night there, came home in the morning, and rested.
The next day I was doing loads better. The day after that I was all charisma and smiling and out with my friends. Then the depression came back and I ended up having to go on an anti-depressant. Side-effects hit almost immediately after taking it, and for me it felt very much like I had gotten the flu. Each day the side-effects were less bad, and each day the depression eased. It took some time to get me mostly on my feet but I was one of those rare patients that 1) responded quickly and 2) the first anti-depressant I tried worked for me.
Several weeks later and I’ve only had one brief bad episode due to mountains of stress and bad news (the election and related fallout) and me failing to do the necessary self care. But I’m recovering, and in about a year or so will be, under the supervision of my psychiatrist, attempting to get off of the anti-depressant.
Erm to make my second point clear: Even with depression there can be moments of clarity and/or happiness. It doesn’t mean you’re crying or empty constantly. Before my three weeks of hell I had several shorter episodes. So Ruth looking happy here may just be one of those brief moments.
But its still hopeful; sometimes remembering you can feel something joyful, even if its little, helps you hold on long enough to get help.
Also, there is a clarity and peace that can come on the far side of a crash.
Sorry I missed your comment.
I had those same symptoms at the initial phase of taking an A/D. Luckily my mood-swings weren’t too severe and my emotional state stabilized after a while.
Other’s aren’t so lucky. People should be aware.
*hugs* Thank you so much for sharing.
Billie’s never seen drunk Walkyverse Mike, so that’s the next best thing.
The only thing missing from this strip is shoujo sparkles on Ruth’s panels.
I have a linguistic question: Why “shoujo sparkles”? Can’t “bishie sparkles” be applied both to “bishounen” and “bishoujo”?
It’s a reference to the genre, which is “shoujo manga” or “Manga for girls”. It is used far less frequently in shounen manga, which targets young boys. In other words, if you call them “Shoujo sparkles” you’re referrencing the genre, not the characters.
Frequently accompanied by wind-blown cherry blossoms and eyes the size of dinner plates, which shimmer with liquid highlights even when not about to weep.
Ruth looks so unusually cute. ^^
This makes me more worried than it should…
Remember: What Willis giveth, Willis will take….
I want to imagine that good pudding gave her the green in her eyes again. That first shot of Ruth is honestly the most adorable shot in DoA I swear. #canwehaveaprint?
Run, Billie! She’s willingly eating HOSPITAL FOOD! Ruth is no longer human! D:
I kid, when I was hospitalized for a couple days in 2008 the food wasn’t bad.
The tastiest taste I ever tasted was a small bowl of cream of wheat from a hospital kitchen. It was a friggin’ religious experience. Of course, that was after not eating for about two weeks with 6 tubes in me (and none of them delivered nourishment). I lost 30 pounds in 29 days.
Yay, Ruth got her eyes back!
This strip makes me happy.
Is that an offer of pudding, or an unexpected pet name for Billie?
Billie as Joker and Ruth as Harley Quinn?
Sorry, I’m afraid the official DoA Joker character is Blaine.
On my second reading, panel 6 really makes me think that Billie is worried that Ruth has been replaced with an alien pod-person.
Hey folks~ I made a dumbing of age fan discord so folks can talk about this a bit more regularly! I think my last message didn’t go through, but sorry for the double post if it did.
https://discord.gg/9CBA8wb
Ruth is so bad at being that depressed girl needing comfort from her girlfriend…
Pudding makes everything better. 😉
Seriously, I know that RL depressives can have major ‘ups’ as well as deep ‘downs’. It’s possible that the change of circumstances and being in a supportive and helpful environment has triggered an ‘up’. How long that lasts may be diagnostically significant.
Keep feeding her pudding then!
I don’t know if it’s the same, but I tend to laugh a lot more when I’m in a depressive episode. Both at the absurdity of my life and genuinely at slightly funny things
Stop being happy, Ruth. Billie needs to validate her self worth.
Unless “Pudding” is Ruth’s pet nickname for Billie this doesn’t bode well…
…ruth, i get the feeling that you’re not taking this seriously enough. Just look at billie, it’s weirding her out. She would prefer that you drop the pudding and go back to black irises. That way at least she knows where she stands
Man, Xanax is the best, isn’t it?
Yeah, anti-depressants don’t work that quickly, but anti-anxieties do, thankfully. Perhaps they’ve got her on those as well. I know they started me out on a combination of the two to help me get through to the anti-depressants working when I was having a major depressive episode years ago.
These days the anit-anxieties are just “as needed”. Which, admittedly, has been pretty damned regularly since the eighth… :/
By the way, guys, there’s a petition to get the electoral college to elect Hillary instead of Trump. They’ve almost got the requisite 4.5 million signatures. Spread the word!
https://www.change.org/p/electoral-college-electors-electoral-college-make-hillary-clinton-president-on-december-19
It’s very exciting to see so many Americans take the initiative against Trump after the election.
Preface: I’m not a USAmerican. I’m not up to spec on the functioning of your electoral college, nor of the legislated consequences of it going against the votes. I think that the electoral college is stupid, and you having it should result in people laughing in your face every time you go around pretending you’re a democracy.
Fact: You shouldn’t change the rules after the game is played. Clinton knew the rules better than Trump (I’m pretty sure, considering that he didn’t even know he’d need a whole new West Wing staff). I understand the consequences are dreadful, but if you wanted to change the rules, the time to petition for a rules change was between games (like the previous two 4 years of Obama).
Opinion: I don’t even think you WANT to do this. If you think emboldened Trumpists are bad, enraged Trumpists are going to be ten times worse, aggravated by the fact that then when they claim that Trump was cheated out of the win they’ll actually be right.
The game isn’t finished being played though. The game is still going. And Hillary did win the popular vote, so saying he was cheated out of a win is dubious at best when you can argue he was cheated into a win via an undemocratic institution.
That said, I’m not American either, so I may be missing something. I’ve seen worries among folks who are worried this can open the gate to the college voting then for incompetent/evil presidents later and unravel democracy later on (though I’d argue the solution then would be to ditch the stupid thing but again, not American so what the hell do I know?)
Well, the playing is finished. The competitors have delivered their performance, and they’re just waiting for the all the judges to weigh in. And their performances were delivered according to the rules they were given; I mean, no-one looks at a score after a game and says, “you know what, this time we’re going to judge according to how snazzy we think the teams’ uniforms are.”
I agree with you (and the folks you mentioned): I think this would create a precedent that people really don’t want created, and that the electoral college is an undemocratic institution that should be done away with. But the electoral college has been around for (a cursory look at wikipedia tells me) over 200 years, and the time to change how it worked for this election was, well, BEFORE this election.
Moreover, if I understand the section under Faithless Electors correctly (I might not), what people are asking for right now is “well, we done and fucked up, so would you guys terribly mind losing your jobs, being ostracised from your party, and possibly face criminal charges so we don’t feel bad about it?” Also, I have little doubt that if the electoral college does switch to Clinton, this will have a detrimental effect on voter turnout in future elections. Plenty of USians already couldn’t be bothered to get off their asses to vote when their votes wouldn’t be overturned by something they can do at their computers afterwards, what do you think will happen when the possibility is there?
A better case could be made, I feel (again, considering my limited understanding of the whole mess) by applying section 2 of the 14th amendment to counter voter suppression, though I have no idea if what course that would take and if it even would impact the results sufficiently.
Okay, mixing metaphors – sports don’t usually have judges (mind, Canadian, so my focus is on hockey, which doesn’t. XD) But that said, the judges are in their rights to decide someone else performed better.
Not all states actually penalize faithless electors though and whether or not that’s constitutional is debatable.
I don’t know how I feel about the whole thing, but frankly it’s not my life on the line. If it were, I might be desperate enough to risk the precedent. You can always change the electoral college after you’ve gotten rid of the clown who wants me dead. So even if I do end up deciding it’s a bad idea, I can’t blame folks for wanting to risk it.
I disagree with pretty much nothing of what you said. Damn you!
I’m sorry! XD
Hey, that’s my and Fart Captor’s schtick!
Eh, keep it – I prefer the carrot part anyway.
HRC is almost 2m+ in the popular vote.
Unheard of.
I think shenanigans have played their.
Although looking at the Trump Transition Time I reckon it’s 2 to 1 against them making it to the WH with a full dance card.
BTB, Trump has spoken to Putin and a bunch of celebs before speaking to the DoD or the State Dept or to anyone else in govt afaik.
It’s going to be an interesting couple of years.
“It’s going to be an interesting couple of years.”
In the Chinese curse sense, I suspect.
I don’t get this, I really don’t get it at all. Those are the rules your country has worked under for the last 200 odd years (I’m guessing) and now because there’s a result people don’t like its now bad
The reality of democracy is you don’t always get the candidate you like, deserve or should win but that’s the price you pay for democracy otherwise it isn’t democracy at all (although one could argue that only having two realistic choices isn’t democratic either)
NZ doesn’t have electoral colleges but we had elections in the past where the party with the most vote didn’t always get into power (electoral boundaries and such like instead) instead of starting a petition* we instead changed our voting system to MMP
MMP still has its issues (especially the tail wagging the dog syndrome) but its still a lot fairer then the old ways, instead of trying to change the rules because the result isn’t what you like is it instead possible to agitate for a change to the system itself
*Someone did try to start a petition because they didn’t believe the result but when the leading party gains over 47% of the vote the petition didn’t go anywhere
A) People have tried to change the system. A senator has already begun discussing trying to get rid of the stupid thing.
B) This is a repeated issue of the college changing the result. It’s happened at least four times and (arguably) encourages gerrymandering with no actual democratic benefit.
C) Something being there for a long time doesn’t make it a good thing.
D) There are folks who’ve wanted a direct democracy for a long time. May as well start now.
E) If the faithless elector plan works, it would not be ‘the system is bad’ (well, it still will be, but regardless) it would be using an undemocratic part of the system to follow the actual vote. Electors are allowed to vote for the President. Trying to sway them to vote for who you think is better is still part of the system. Especially since anything against faithless electors is of debatable constitutionality.
I’m not sure whether I like the idea or not, but don’t try to boil it down to something it isn’t.
Also, it’s not ‘a result you don’t like’ it’s a ‘result that may get me killed’.
A. Good, a discussion is always good to hold
B. How has it changed the result? If you win enough electoral college votes (as I understand it) then you win the presidency
C. No but both candidates were working under the same rules so if you’re going to change the system change it before the election not after because you don’t like the result, had Clinton benefitted like Trump has would there be a discussion on the college vote?
D. Good, a discussion is always good to hold
E. The problem with knee jerk reactions is the unintended consequences, lets say next election the democratic nominee wins the electoral votes but loses the popular vote to Trump (if he stands) then you’ve just given every excuse his supporters would need to riot, to attempt to force change, to (possibly) agitate to stage a coup (far-fetched but not out of the realms of possibility)
B. More people voted for Clinton. The electoral college made the result less representative of what people actually want. As it does in about 1 in 3 elections.
C. It’s always both before and after an election. Unless there isn’t another election after this one. I can’t say I’m 100% confident about that.
Obviously, any changes made now will affect the outcome of the next election, not this one.
E. I don’t know why you bring up future elections here. Even though about 20 states don’t actually bind their electors to vote according to their counties, they’ve never done it in US history (or at least it didn’t end up changing the outcome). If enough changed their votes to change the result in December, Trumps supporters would definitely get even more violent.
Thanks to Trump and the GOP brilliantly undermining trust in both the media and the election system, and building paranoia about the election being rigged, the electoral college giving it to Clinton would likely destabilize our democracy.
I can’t really decide whether that would end up being worse than 4 years of Trump or not.
B. So what?
C. He hasn’t even taken office yet, it was what one day, two days before riots started so why wasn’t the talk about the college system done after Bush (who lost the popular vote) and during Obamas presidency?
E. I bring it up because anything that happens now will be used by the opposition in future, happens in my country and I’m pretty sure it’ll happen everywhere in a democratic system
I’d suggest, being an impartial observer, that it wasn’t so much the GOP and Trump (since the GOP didn’t want Trump) to blame its the democratic party for selecting Clinton over Saunders that’s more to blame for this decision
B. A result that better reflects the actual will of the people seems worth looking into. I don’t see why this is confusing.
C. I mean this in the most respectful way I can, but fuck you. There were peaceful protests, some of which had people that got out of control, others which got escalated to violence by our overzealous police. And in case you hadn’t noticed, we now have a disgusting excuse for a human being as our president. A bigot and a sexual predator. Protesting to show that we are NOT okay with that, and to show the people he’d target that they aren’t alone doesn’t need to wait for that shithead to take office.
E. They might introduce further changes, but that’s always a possibility with any law. Hell, Trump might try that even though he won.
And you clearly haven’t been paying as much attention to our elections as we have.
I’m not talking about who’s to blame for Clinton losing. There’s a lot of blame to go around for that. I’m taking about the violent shitstorm that would likely result from the electoral college giving the election to Hillary, even though the rules say they can. There were people – including Trump himself, though of course he was coy about it – who were calling for armed uprising against the “rigged system” when it only looked like he was going to lose.
B. If its the college votes that count and not to the popular count then so what if you win the popular vote. In NZ the party that got more votes didn’t always win the lection due to rigging of the boundaries (why we changed from FPP to MMP)
C. No I don’t accept it, you don’t get to respond to someone’s argument with fuck you simply because you don’t like it, so believe me when I say with absolutely no respect at all fuck you
I’ll let you know that your country of 400 odd million decided the best candidates were Trump and Clinton, think about that, Trump and Clinton is the best your country can come up with
61 million people voted for Trump and as Michael Moore put it a they’re not all racists and red necks, a lot of them previously voted for Obama but couldn’t vote for Clinton, ask yourself why
The politicians in your country don’t have the courage to change an electoral system that people and now that there’s an election and a candidate that didn’t win the popular vote (by less then 1.5 millions votes which in a country your size is nothing) and the response of it is to violently protest, just like any good third world country
Legal protest is good for democracy, violent protest is not. Democracy doesn’t just mean you only get the candidate you want it means you also accept the candidate you don’t get
The 2016 American election and aftermath is why the rest of the world think that the USA is a joke
“i worry because i might lose my rights”
“ha ha ha everyone is laughing at you,” said some fucking asshole
Instead of commenting to stuff you’re imagining why not try commenting to the things I actually say
fucking asshole is still talking
fucking asshole is about a comment away from all of his comments being redirected to the spam folder
fucking asshole should reconsider his line of action
Alright, fine.
B) The college hasn’t voted yet. That’s what this whole thing is about – trying to persuade them to vote for the candidate that did win the popular vote AKA the one who should be president based on democratic principles.
C) “because you don’t like it” and not because you lumped a bunch of peaceful and legal protests in with riots. Again, the majority of this is legal protest.
And no, democracy does not require you to accept a candidate that has a serious chance of getting you killed. You are not obligated to take that bullshit lying down. Trump DESERVES protest and contacting their electors to try and persuade them to vote for the candidate that will not do that is neither illegal nor immoral.
You seem to be disregarding that asking the electoral college to swap their vote is not illegal. Unorthodox yes, illegal no.
What Willis and BBCC said, especially about labeling 95% peaceful protests as violent riots
While I am sorry about getting hostile, this isn’t just an embarrassment for us. This a threat to what democracy we have, and to the rights and safety of anyone who isn’t directly related to Trump.
We’re damn well going to do something about it, even though there is no perfect or simple solution.
Agreed on A and D, but
B) As FC, more people voted for Clinton. The electoral college is the only reason Trump would have the presidency. This has happened at least four times to my knowledge, and as FC pointed out may be as high as one in three. Even if it is just four? Four too many.
C) There have been electoral college discussions since before the election. Just no will to act. If they’re getting rid of the college instead of trying to get them to vote for the candidate people liked, then of course it will only apply to later elections. It wouldn’t change the results of this election, but it would keep this situation from happening again.
E) Except this plan does not make riots good, does not mean ‘forcing’ change since trying to persuade electors to change their votes is not forcing them – they are not being compelled to do so, and it certainly is not a coup. It is within the system. A precedent for faithless electors does not equal carte blanche to violently removing and installing other government leaders. You are comparing political apples to political oranges.
@ FC – That’s the only concern I’ve seen about it that had merit tbh. I’m not sure either. I do know though that if it were me and mine on the line, I might just be desperate enough to risk it, so I can hardly fault them for trying.
As a quick off the top of my head- In addition to this year, we have the election of 2000 (and what a clusterfuck THAT was) with Gore winning the popular vote and W. Bush getting the presidency.
Looking it up, also
1824 – Andrew Jackson won the vote but lost the electoral college to John Quincy Adams
1876 – Most disputed presidential election in our history (at least to this point), Samuel Tilden won the popular vote by over two hundred thousand but lost to Rutherford B. Hayes by one electoral vote, due to twenty disputed votes and a backroom deal that ended Reconstruction.
1888 – Benjamin Harrison beating incumbent president Grover Cleveland (who he then lost to the next election, making Cleveland the only president to date who served non-consecutive terms.)
1960 – Disputed, but Wikipedia lists it so I will too: JFK is generally considered to have won the popular vote over Nixon, but there was some kind of bizarre bullshit with regards to the electors in Alabama that I’m looking it up and don’t even begin to understand how that system works and I GENERALLY SORT OF UNDERSTAND HOW THE BULLSHIT SYSTEM WORKS.
So yeah, this? Is our fifth or sixth time at the Electoral College Is A Huge Fucking Disaster rodeo. And about half the time that’s only delayed by another four to eight years whoever the actual popular vote winner was, so I can’t even say “well it kept us from having THAT particular homicidal genocidal racist fuckbiscuit for president” (Jackson) or “well it kept Nixon out of the White House, his vice president being brought on criminal charges and losing the seat, and then a wiretaping scandal in which Nixon resigned to avoid criminal charges of his own led to the weird situation of Gerald Ford, the President Who Was Literally Never Elected To Be In The Actual Presidential Line”.
And of the ones where it didn’t? Well, I don’t know enough about Tilden to judge what his presidency would’ve been like, but Hayes gutting Reconstruction formally brought in another hundred-plus years of crap we’re still slogging through today, and people I cannot even BEGIN to explain what a disaster show the W. years were except “we’re about to get it on steroids come January, I fucking guarantee you, and the world still hadn’t fucking recovered from W.”
1824 was more complicated than that. There were four presidential candidates, all from the same party (the Democratic-Republicans), and, while Jackson secured the plurality of the popular vote and the electoral college vote, no candidate secured a majority of either, and the election went to Congress to choose between the top three candidates. Henry Clay, the #4 candidate, threw his support behind John Quincy Adams, the #2 candidate, which was enough to put Adams over the top. The Democratic-Republicans schismed over this, and the modern Democratic Party is the descendant of Jackson’s faction.
Also worth noting is that several states didn’t even have popular votes at that point. In some, electors were chosen by the state legislature, and in at least one, electors were elected directly by districts (similar to what Maine and Nebraska do now), which often resulted in split delegations.
All states but South Carolina had the popular vote by the 1830s. South Carolina actually didn’t get the popular vote until after the Civil War.
“It’s worked that way forever and nobody complained before” is a stupid and dismissive argument.
Something working the same way for hundreds of years is actually a good reason to reevaluate it to see if it actually works as well as it could, or if it’s just stayed that way from momentum.
And considering the way the electoral college doesn’t match up with the popular vote like a third of the time, it’s worth re-examining.
CGP Grey has a really good video on it:
https://youtu.be/G3wLQz-LgrM
That’s not my argument, my argument is you’ve had the system for 200 years, 200 years to change the system, 200 years in which presidents have won the presidency without winning the popular vote so 200 years to change
In 2000 I think Dubya won the electoral vote and lost the popular vote so where were the calls to change then
Had Clinton won the presidency without winning the popular vote would you still be wanting change?
I seem to remember there being a lot of calls to change it then.
The motivation wasn’t as strong then as it is for Cheeto Mussolini. For good reason.
And no, I would not feel as strongly about changing it if things were the other way around. But even a broken clock is right twice a day. That doesn’t mean it isn’t broken
Also, people have been talking about the electoral college since before the election. Also, the alternative to Clinton is that the election goes to said bigot putting people’s lives on the line.
Believe me I have fucking hated the electoral college since I was, like, ten. (Basically since I was old enough to understand 1: it was bullshit and 2: it was bullshit responsible for bringing us all down to a really, really bad place.)
Hell, there were people kicking up a fuss about it along with the delegates mess in the primaries earlier this year. I certainly was. (Like the Treaty of Versailles, President James Buchanan, and George B. McClellan, the electoral college is one of those broken disastrous messes I do not pass up an opportunity to trash on.)
Just because a system worked in the past doesn’t mean that it still applies. Take for instance the Germanic farmer republics, like Ditmarsia, East Frisia or Iceland. They worked for a long time, but eventually were overturned by other systems. I don’t exactly believe that the current forms of free democracies (there are a few, like the oldest ones in Iceland or Switzerland) or constitutional monarchies (think back to Magna Charta) are the last word in a fair form of population-driven sensible government.
The British and US tradition of “the winner takes it all” elections which leaves the majority of votes “worthless” may be such a symptom. The electoral college is another such oddity (interestingly repeated in the German composite forum of both chambers for electing the President, with “outsiders” filling the ranks from the federal assembly). The continental European tradition of relational assignment of parliamentary seats according to the percentage of votes (in some cases coupled with election of direct mandates) has its own problems (such as having more than two parties in parliament), but might feel fairer.
There is a movement calling for direct democracy (making the voters decide on specific issues rather than letting parliament deal with them), but plebiscites can and will produce unconsidered consequences (such as Brexit) when populists make people forget the issue and replace it with fear-mongering. Such a system still can be stable (see Switzerland), though.
Ah, crap, when I said direct democracy I meant ‘directly voting for the President’. Please forgive my inaccurate and messy terminology!
Let’s get this out of the way: direct democracy is a horrid, innefectual, useless, disastrous system. Your average voter isn’t qualified to make those sorts of decisions, AND you’d need to get rid of nations as an organisational unit. It was all fine and dandy in the Greek city-states, because the people who voted there were mostly not the ones doing any actual work, so they had the time to get some information on the subject, and their decisions affected an area of about 2 hours travel in either direction.
Second point: more than two parties in parliament or equivalent isn’t a bug of the system, it’s a feature. I wouldn’t want the party I voted for to hold 50%+1 of the seats, let alone get an increased risk that another party does. An absolute majority is bad on either side of the political spectrum, and tends to lead to bad results. Trust me on this, because I’ve lived it. A result where a relative majority in parliament requires at least one other party (of multiples) to get something done is exactly the place where you want to be, because everyone gets enormously stupid ideas sometimes and that curbs it.
1) It’s not going to happen and I’m not entirely sure I want it to, for a whole number of reasons.
2) I do get it though. This isn’t a routine case of the candidate I didn’t prefer won, but a really serious threat to many people directly and to the country as a whole. His plans and suggested policies (such as they are) are bad enough. His complete incompetence and apparent lack of awareness of what the job even involves may be the bigger problem.
People will die because of this. The consequences, short term and long term, may be horrifically bad. This may well be a case the damage to the political system is better than the alternative.
3) As a matter of law, this is a part of what the electoral college is for, even if it’s never been used this way. It’s not a mere formality that there are actual electors chosen to cast votes for the states. In a very real sense, the actual presidential election is December 19, when the electoral college meets.
December 19.
December 19.
December 19.
*eye twitch*
Great. That’s just what this disaster of an election needed, another extra month of running time.
Hell. People are ALREADY starting to die because of this, because his winning the election (despite losing the popular vote) was enough to empower all the bigots who have been listening to what he’s said and nodding along and going “See? He says what we’re all REALLY thinking” because in their eyes a vote for him was a vote for white supremacist violence.
The question is now solely “how many will die” and whether or not he’ll bring down the entire world while he’s at it.
Being suspicious of one’s happiness: never a good sign.
Jello’s new spokesperson was a bit unorthodox, and her spoons made out of femurs drew some attention, but at least she was cute.
*can’t think of any fitting music to play*
*puts “Shiny Happy People” on the hacked muzak*
I counter with “Comfortably Numb”
I relate to Ruth so much. I remember being in a clinic and being super chill while my family was more emotional.
So many interesting interpretations… My own is: Ruth went into regression in response to getting pudding and being cared for. That is a way to cope and distance oneself from one’s problems. And if it were so, I would guess a massive amount of crying happened the previous night, at least that’s the dinamic for me. And this smiling offer is an invitation like “Come into my blanket fort”
…word
I wish I could do that. I mean, I do, but I wish it worked better
Panel 6 Billie is like:
wat
Not really believing that what we’re seeing is Ruth being magically cured of her suicidal depression after going to group therapy one time. I can understand readers being concerned that that’s what’s going to happen, but I really, really don’t think we’ll see that. Depression isn’t a switch, it’s something Ruth will live with for a long time.
I believe you’re right.
Yay, the pudding healed her!
Knowing people who suffer Depression, I note it’s not usually a 100% straight street. I hardly think Ruth is cured but it is possible to have “good days” following horrific bad days. The problem isn’t good days happening, it’s the fact they don’t last.
word
On some level, Billie *wants* Ruth not to be okay, so she can fix it. If Ruth is okay without her, it means she’s not needed. It’s important to her to be necessary to Ruth.
pudding heals
??? why are people talking about her being cured or not??? cant depressed people enjoy their fucking pudding?!?!?!?!?
seriously, depression is MOST TIMES in-fucking-visible so dont even talk about it its just making me angry that people are even suggesting that shes cured or on meds or some shit
TW!!! oh and all of you who are talking about your personal experiences make me want to share that ive been on meds for sooo freaking long and its not helping a single bit and every day im closer to killing myself,i even have a noose in my wardrobe wtf
anywayy.. i first got 20mg a day. didnt work, so i took 50mg a day. didbt work so a doctor told me i needed 100mg a day so i first took 75 mg for two weeks and now im taking 100mg and ive been taking it for at least 2 months and ita not helping.. whats wrong with me?
There’s nothing wrong with you. Your brain is just a bag of dicks.
If you’re taking huge doses of this medication to no effect, then it’s possible this particular medicine won’t work for you. You should talk to your doctor about trying a different kind of antidepressant.
Also, please throw the noose away. You don’t deserve that fear in your life.
Yeah, this. If adjusting the doses doesn’t work, talk to your doctor about trying something else. That’s why we have different kinds. Some don’t work on some people, while they’re a miracle for others.
Honestly, I’m surprised the doctor’s reaction was just “more of the same” rather than “okay, let’s try something different.” I mean- if going from 20mg to 50mg still had no impact then surely that would be the time to try a different medication?
Different medications have different effects on different people. Personally I’ve only been on one type of anti-depressant and I found it horrific. After months the physical side effects- things like nausea, headaches etc- were not going away and emotionally I felt like a robot. No depression, sure, but no nothing else either.
I wrote them off entirely and- somehow- managed to get through. (Although there was a fun spell of alcoholism in there.) When I have depressive spells now people urge me to try a different one because people can react so differently to different types, but thankfully by the time I was ready to hear that it really was occasional depressive periods between long spells where I was okay, so it wasn’t necessary for me to explore other options.
What I always needed was counselling. In my case the depression wasn’t a case of my brain just making these hormones happen- I was living with severe PTSD from my childhood, and I needed to work through that. The depression, for me, was an outcome of another mental illness which required treatment.
My gf had issues with her medication a while back and I wanted to strangle her doctor for this exact reason, sadly. She said ‘it’s not working’ and he said ‘well, take more then’. Especially aggravating to me because my gf is so pathologically afraid of confrontation that she won’t ever argue shit like that. And he’s been her psychiatrist longer than I’ve been her gf (almost five years for me), he should KNOW things like that.
She did eventually get her meds changed (a trip to the ER and a brief hospitalization did that trick) and she’s doing much better overall now. (And I’ve gotten better at nudging her into standing up for herself.) But her psychiatrist is still a quick trip to angertown for me, because the woman I love maybe almost died thanks to his lazy unconcerned ass.
I’m no doctor but I’ve heard anecdotally that, sometimes, the body builds up resistance to certain meds so that they lose their effectiveness. Maybe you need to talk to your doctor and maybe he needs to shift you onto a different ‘family’ of medications to counteract this.
*hugs* Listen to BenRG, he has a good point
I’d talk to your doctor about switching medications.
Hopefully you see this or it gets passed on.
If medication isn’t working for you, the problem lies not with you, but with the medication. Make sure the person prescribing the meds understands that they’re not working, and if that person won’t listen, get a new person.
thank you, all of you<3
THAT LIGHTING.
That last panel is heartbreaking. I hope there’s a spare room for Billie.
In panel 2 is Billies worst fear be Ruth not needing Billie and, in fact, Ruth being better off without her?
But look at how full that spoon is! Ruth, you’re eating it too fast!
There’s only like four or five ounces in one of those little Snack-Pack cups. It’s not meant to be slammed down like a Jell-O shot; it’s meant to be eaten slowly and savored … less than a half-spoonful at a time so the deliciousness lasts.
Especially if it’s butterscotch.
Ruth realises this. It’s why on panel 4 she has the facial expression of a dog who’s been caught gnawing on your favourite shoes AGAIN, and is trying desperately to think of a way to avoid the inevitable berating.
The third and fourth panel just screams, “just call me the angel of the morning, baby!”
Damn it! I meant to say fourth and fifth panel!
It’s kinda interesting to me that Billie calls herself Billingsworth. I don’t think Walky would ever call himself David.
Jinx! (Plus or minus 40 minutes — I’m a slow writer and didn’t see your comment until I’d posted mine.)
Wouldn’t Walky analogously call himself “Walkerton?”
Sal: “David Walkerton. ‘Walky.’ It’s both our last names. Ah ain’t callin’ him that. S’weird.”
I can’t believe I missed this when I read this comic 14 hours ago, and I’m surprised no one has mentioned this since then — but —
When Billie is talking to herself to build up her courage, she calls herself “Billingsworth.” Not Jennifer, not Billie, not Jen or Jenny, not anything anyone else in the POV of the strip has ever called her. Billingsworth.
I’m not sure what that means, but it has to mean something.
“At this point, he probably is.”
What, no [Replaced X with Y] Joke? I have a sad.