Dorothy sees herself as the one who solves problems. She’s given up on the president-level problems and now her friends are solving their own problems without her.
There are two kinds of spoilers. One is “spoiling a twist no one saw coming,” the other is “spoiling something that technically has not been confirmed but absolutely zero people will be surprised once it has been confirmed.” You know, like in the 2018 She-Ra series.
I can see how finding out a friend of hers she previously thought escaped a confrontation unharmed was injured to the point she needed medical attention might eclipse that in her mind for a bit.
Yeah, I would in fact be a lot more uncharitable to her if she immediately breezed past learning her friend was hurt by the cops bad enough to need medical attention so she could get back to her own problems.
This is something that should take the wind out of your sails a bit.
She’s just found out one of her best friends has been seriously wounded and that has become, understandably, a priority for her over relationship drama. Even if there’s little she can do in the moment she wants to help in any way she can, in keeping with everything we know about her personality.
So yeah, guff maintained, because this continues to be an uncharitable read.
She learned her friend was wounded and that’s understandably something to be concerned about but even after learning that everything’s been taken care of and she’ll be fine Dorothy is still trying to find something she can do to busy herself with the situation, because she is subconsciously trying to put off facing up to what she actually needs to be doing.
You can call it an uncharitable read if you want but it’s my view of her character and I like her better that way. I like when characters have really bad flaws!
To be fair, while she is also very likely trying to put it off, this reaction would also be completely in character if she didn’t have anything to put off.
Dorothy’s for sure avoidant, when it comes to things she knows will upset someone.
Dorothy could smell gas, see someone about to light a match, and then fret over interrupting the song that person is playing to tell them about the gas. She’d try to somehow organize the warning into a spreadsheet, and by the time she got around to actually saying something, the house would be a pile of ashes and she’d be attending their funeral from her hospital bed, via video call.
Yes, forget about your injured friend and go back to worrying about your other problems so that people can attack you for being callous to Amber instead!
I think you could make a case for waiting until Joyce actually breaks up with Joe. If she breaks up with Walky and Joyce is unable to bring herself to break up with Joe, then Dorothy could wind up with no-one and all her bridges burned. I mean, trust Joyce, but verify.
The bridge is already burned. Hanging onto a partner just in case things don’t work out with the person you’re cheating on them with is a colossal dick move.
Dorothy clearly feels some guilt for not helping Amazi-Girl, but staying to help would only have made things worse. Amazi-Girl contacted Sal because she knew who would be able to help her the most.
I wonder if Dorothy also feels guilty because she thinks if she’d run sooner AG would be less injured. (I also wonder just how much her actions did put AG at more risk of injury.)
What AG did was very cool, fuck the police, but she decided to be there. She decided to fight cops. She decided to go back in and continue helping people get out long after she sent Dorothy on her merry way.
Of all the things that might arguably be Dorothy’s fault, AG’s actions are not. AG had agency, and she used it.
Yes, I think that’s 100% where this is going. Hopefully it’s *just* Jennifer who thinks it’s Sal, even after that. And if not, hopefully Dorothy can use her title as “amazigirl interviewer” to squash any theories that it’s Sal.
Hopefully without making everyone think it’s that Dorothy is the one behind the mask.
I know, right? Dude’s got some kind of superhuman luck of being in the right place and the right time to catch those interviews. I don’t know how he does it!
Can’t remember when I last saw it, so I don’t know if it still happens, but Marvel used to have unnamed reporters who were obviously Clark and Lois show up occasionally. I think DC did the same with Peter, but I’m less sure of that.
Imagining them together in the same Super Hero Journalism school reminded me of that.
Yeah re: hoping it’s just Billie; it’s a little concerning to me because Sal has already been seen with Amazigirl, so even if someone didn’t think Sal is her, it could be used as evidence against her, and be used to leverage ‘she got in a fistfight with some rapist’ into ‘well clearly with this grappling hook she planned to (or already did) break into places’
This sounds like it could be extremely disturbing. Sal going down for Amazi-Girl’s actions would be very awful. I could see if that was about to happen. Amber might just come forward and confess to save Sal. Which would be very dramatic. I’m prepared to link back to this comment if this happens!
That’s a terrifying thought. If Billie finds it connected with Sal and OUTS her publicly as the person who did violence to cops, the bi racial black girl who has a criminal history would be the target of the police, d-list masked characters and Carol.
God I hope you’re right. But one memory that makes me a little nervous is that really naive phone call she had where she was asking someone “okay, you sent the homeless people away, but where to? Is it somewhere nice?”
I certainly can’t see Billie doing it intentionally, especially given how she let Lucy know about the “moving goal posts” aspect of Walky and Sal’s parents.
It was back when Becky had just arrived at IU after having run away from the fundie college and Toedad. I’m not sure how to search the archives for multiple tags… I just remember it was a scene that had Billie and Sal in the same strip. Billie was lying on the top bunk calling some associate or employee of her rich dad. Sal was standing on the floor, listening, growing more and more put off by what she heard of the phone conversation. I remember her really specific facial expression.
All you need to do to search multiple tags is to click on one tag (Let’s say Dina since she’s on this page), go to the URL, find that tag, put a + right after it, and add a second character’s name (I’ll go with Robin, on a whim). Once you’ve done that, it should look like this: https://www.dumbingofage.com/tag/dina+robin/
And you can substitute any character you want, plus add a third or fourth or fifth the same way. I’ve never gone beyond 5, since bigger group shots aren’t super common, but you can.
Oh, she’s absolutely still got CLASS blindness, but she’s always been really sharp on spotting racial biases of other people and cutting right to the point. With Walky and Sal at first and then again with Lucy.
She would know better than to out Sal as somebody who assaulted the police.
Racial awareness, yes, but not so aware of what is happening outside of her own immediate interest. If she were to out Sal (which she’s continually hoping to prove) I don’t think it would be knowing recent events and the stakes involved
Yeah I am in with the Sense of Dread here – you could be right. Also the only way out for Sal might be if Asher throws himself back to the Mob to pull some favours.
I was gonna be snarky, but I actually feel bad that Dorothys identity is so wrapped up in being the mom friend that when she’s not needed she feels she has no value
Surface level read? That’s like the basis of all of her close interpersonal relationships with the cast. It’s literally in the alt text, however facetious it’s meant to be. You’re actually talking out of your butt for someone going around telling others they don’t understand a character.
People literally said that Dorothy didn’t have fellings for Joyce and just wnated to be her mom and that make her abusive because “power dynamic”. Nothing to do with calling her a mom friend.
I’m pretty sure it was a couple of ’em, maybe three. I will not provide receipts though, because it would eat into my Fortnite Battle Pass time, and I’m only 10 levels away from unlocking the White Power Ranger.
Plus, digging through a comments section to quote a troll verbatim is hardly what I’d call a worthwhile use of one’s time. So you know, a very wise decision on your part.
I like to exaggerate what they were saying sometimes and make jokes about Dorothy being Joyce’s literal biological mother who gave birth to her and raised her. Much nicer than trawling through an indeterminate amount of old strips to find individual comments that will perfectly satisfy even the pickiest evidence-needers.
The mythological queen of Thebes. I’m not sure what she has to do with this either. Probably another instance of auto-incorrect. Either that or an Oedipus reference is being made that I’m missing.
Some people (very few, who have taken it to this extent) have said that Dorothy is basically Joyce’s mom, therefore a romantic/sexual relationship between them would be/is incestuous. Thus, Jocasta.
I was looking for a strip that demonstrated that, but ran across this one. https://www.dumbingofage.com/counselor/ Where she wonders if she confuses “busy” with “happy”. Which probably plays into feeling needed now that I think about it.
I read a fic some years back that really leaned into/deconstructed this aspect of the “Compulsive Hero” archetype, with a protagonist who, turns out, felt that they had no worth as a person except in what they could do for others. They drove themself to the brink of self-destruction and, when finally and literally forced to stop and rest, had no idea what to do with (or for) themself.
Honestly not a bad idea. Depending on how long Amber sleeps they might not be hot anymore but they should still be fresh enough for her to have something to eat when she wakes up that doesn’t require her to go to effort to make.
We know that Dorothy is getting therapy. We also know that at the time it came up she was lying to her therapist so nothing that might interfere with her presidential ambitions would wind up on her medical record. We don’t know if she’s stopped lying to her therapist since. Therapy doesn’t do much good if you refuse to talk about what you actually need help with.
A good therapist will learn a lot from avoidance behavior. It remains to be seen if Dorothy has a good therapist. (The therapist strips in Questionable Content are gold.)
Yeah, honestly I miss Dr. Buenavida. She always cracked me up. Her quip about “things you’ll never hear a therapist tell you” lives rent free in my head.
Incidentally, going through them I noticed an oddity that may have been coincidental… In that Dr. Buenvenida’s first appearance, Faye seemed to be consistently avoiding eye contact, but only intermittently later, which was presumably intentional (to show her varying levels of discomfort) and not the oddity. The oddity was that, in that first appearance, her eyes seem to be locked onto her therapist’s breasts.
Possibly lack of care over gaze depiction, possibly subtle foreshadowing that she’s not as heterosexual as she thought.
Hopefully that digression wasn’t offensive. As an aromantic asexual who, as a child, read zoology books for fun, I struggle to relate to the levels of meaning normal people attach to specific body parts.
Also, that’s generally the threshold for people who feel like they can’t afford therapy. And while I seem to recall that the school is covering their therapy that can be a hard habit to get out of. Just like how I currently have full medical coverage but generally won’t make an appointment beyond the ones the office scheduled for me unless I think I’m dying because my brain tells me I can’t afford to go see a doctor.
That’s definitely some of it in the US, but far from all of it. How much higher are therapy rates in countries with better health systems?
There’s a lot of internal prejudice against seeking therapy still. Some of it’s for thinking you’re admitting to being crazy. Some for admitting you can’t handle your own relatively minor problems that anyone should be able to handle.
There’s also that fun little detail that sometimes, the things a person might benefit from therapy for may also make them not want to go to therapy (or make it harder to benefit even if they do).
For example: Dorothy seems to have a tendency to feel she needs to be the one working on problems. Getting help from a therapist means letting another person work on her problems…
Yes, good therapists tend to help the client work on themselves (something that shouldn’t conflict with Dorothy’s issues) rather than doing all the work themselves, but it’s very possible that, with Dorothy’s reluctant interactions, this might’ve never been communicated.
Besides, there’s still that expectation many people have that therapy is just about telling the therapist some stuff and then getting proscribed pills (medication can certainly help (and sometimes may be critical due to neurochemical imbalances) but even then, usually in combination with other approaches). Dorothy may have an unexamined assumption that addressing mental health means having someone else do all the work, and that’s just not Dorothy’s style.
Triple that for the military, where any hint of mental issues can 86 your career instantly. (This might have changed for the better since I retired, but I doubt it. Only general officers are allowed to be obviously nuts. Oh, and CW4 helicopter pilots. And combat medics. And – you, know, the people who would have to be nuts to want the job.
“There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one’s own safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn’t, but if he was sane, he had to fly them. If he flew them, he was crazy and didn’t have to; but if he didn’t want to, he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle.”
Although, on less jokey reflection… maybe the reason we haven’t seen Dina eating cereal much lately is that, now she has Becky, she no longer needs the regular dopamine hit from her preferred food?
It seems possible that there might be an investigation in which a few detectives will try to find out who Amazi-Girl “is”. And one of the things that they are likely to do is interview the student-journalist who wrote stories about her. But one of the things they are not likely to do is respect the confidentiality of a student-journalist’s notes and sources.
So what you do now, Dorothy, is erase incriminating notes and records, then engage a lawyer. The student newspaper ought to have someone on retainer.
Would the school even lend the use of that lawyer? Since said lawyer would be on their payroll, and they have a vested interest in continuing to send funds to the Bulmeria conflict… couldn’t they just say “lol, nope” and leave Dorothy to fend for herself regardless of her status as a student and a journalist?
And given how absurdly expensive lawyers are (dear lordy are they expensive), I doubt she could afford one on a college student’s budget.
To be fair, Indiana University as a whole should have a lawyer on retainer, who could potentially offer some of their spare time to help if they’re not busy and IU is ok with it… neither of which is likely in the current situation. There’s just recently been a decidedly violent event on campus that’s almost certainly monopolising any legal attention, and as Tequila Mockingbird said, IU likely doesn’t want to do anything that might annoy their financial benefactors…
Come to think of it, they presumably wouldn’t want to take an official stance on this in either direction (due to their lesser sense of obligation to their students), and would welcome anything that takes attention away from their involvement in recent events.
That said… it’s not impossible that some faculty members are secretly in favour of Amazi-Girl’s actions to protect the students… Besides, even at the protest, nothing she did was likely to affect IU’s financial interests (the protest still broke up, after all). So… while I doubt any legal help will be forthcoming, some unofficial assistance is certainly possible.
The primary or only focus of any attorney employed by the university is going to be Making Problems Go Away for their client. This often will not align with, or be directly opposed to, the best interest(s) of any students.
Back when I was an undergraduate (at UNSW) our Student’s Union had a bail fund for bailing out students arrested in protests, and a solicitor on retainer. And the Student’s Union, not the University, published the student newspaper (Tharunka).
I thought the US took these civics things more seriously than Australia.
Also, Dina seems really glued to her phone. This seems like a conversation that warrants putting the screen down for a few seconds, so that it might continue uninterrupted and with a sense of greater severity.
Can’t speak for others, but I have (after sustained effort) managed to convince people I live with that staring at my screen doesn’t mean I’m not paying attention to them, to the point that I can carry on an entire conversation without more than glancing in their direction and not cause offense.
An important part of that, of course, is actually paying sufficient attention to the other person… Something that some people struggle with, leading to the common assumption that looking at the screen means at least partially ignoring the not-looked-at person. However, many of us are perfectly capable of both listening to what we’re not looking at and keeping track of objects in our peripheral vision (at least enough that we can still notice if there is cause to actually look directly at them)… and, as explained by a great comment by S.R. yesterday — https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-16/01-not-so-smooth-criminals/goodgood/#comment-1918955 — some people may need the extra stimulation to actually be able to pay attention.
There are plenty of things Dorothy can do that don’t involve Amber. Breaking up with Walky for example, and maybe checking to see if Joyce has broken up with Joe yet.
True, but by the looks of things Sal and Dina already did everything to help Amber so far. So since Dorothy can’t do anything to help Amber right now, she can go do the other things she was planning to do instead.
Ok, but going “Phew, guess I don’t have to worry about her at all then, ok bye” is also kinda the wrong reaction here.
There is no plausible reality, fictional or otherwise, where receiving all of this information is rationally met immediately with a response of “I’m going to continue about my day as if nothing is wrong.”
She was told there was nothing she could do for Amber at the moment, and her response was “But what about me?” How is that not making it all about her?
Her response was not “What about me?” it was “What do I do?” because she just learned a friend was injured and wants to help her. Why are people inventing things that didn’t actually happen in the comic to get mad at Dorothy about?
Calling it narcissistic is a bit much, it is a problem that she has so much of her self-worth tied up in being the friend who ‘fixes’ things, and I think the toll it is taking is primarily on herself. This is not so much ‘how do I make this about myself’ and more ‘if I can not do anything right now, am I failing as a friend? Am I failing the person I want to be?’.
Narcissism is “I’m the best ever in the history of everything, the closest thing to a god that has ever existed”, not “I need to feel like I’m doing something useful”.
It’s not really that either, it’s “I deserve to be treated like I’m the most important person in the room” — quite a few folks with NPD also struggle with self-loathing.
More to the point, these days it’s probably better to use “self-aggrandizing” or “self-centered” rather than “narcissist” now that the latter is becoming a better-understood diagnosis.
Since narcissistic has been co-opted as a medical term, we could take advantage of the richness and flexibility of the English language by pointing back to the foundational mythology with the term Narciss-like.
Maybe it’s just me, but when someone I care about is hurt or ill and there’s nothing I can do to help them at the moment, I try to do other stuff I need to get done and avoid spending all my time worrying about them. It’s not so much “continuing my day as if nothing is wrong”, more like not letting myself be consumed with worry when I can’t do anything anyway.
Yes, but Dorothy has a lot of her self-worth tied up in being the friend who cleans up the mess and ‘fixes’ things. Not being able to help feels like failing to her.
See, I think there’s a fairly major difference between “I’m going to continue about my day as if nothing is wrong.” and “I’m glad it’s been taken care of, that means that even though I’m worried I can do the other important things that I have to do.”
Mildly surprised that Amber wasn’t shot, it seemed implausible that she’d have escaped if she sustained those injuries in a brawl, but I guess it wouldn’t be the first time she’s done implausible things.
Might have been less of an escape and more that the mystery assailant heard someone coming and booked it leaving time for AG to limp away and collapse before texting Sal.
I’m guessing you’re speculating on the possibility that she was shot and the bullet didn’t penetrate, leading to people mistakenly believing she wasn’t shot due to a lack of a bullet wound?
I’m not speaking from personal experience here, but… my understanding is that getting shot in kevlar doesn’t result in external bleeding (it stops the bullet but the force is transferred), unless the bullet actually passes through the kevlar.
For evidence of the blood, see https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-15/04-the-only-exception/enigmaticass/
Admittedly, it’s not impossible she was shot and her costume blocked it, but she was still hurt enough that a subsequent encounter with one of her earlier enemies ended in injury for her (and, to address to Thag’s objection, may have nonetheless won the fight after being injured), after which she staggered off and collapsed in the snow.
More on that: I’ve read of people in duels continuing even after receiving fatal injuries. Struggling to find a good source right now, but https://thebooktrap.weebly.com/anthonys-blog/duelling-with-swords-the-reality includes the sentence “From the autopsies, it was clear that the first wound suffered by each man was the fatal injury. ” yet both had received at least four wounds in the course of the duel… and, apparently, one drove his sword into the other’s chest all the way to the hilt, yet it didn’t stop the latter stabbing the former in the heart through the shoulder.
Admittedly, that page lacks sources, but it fits with what I remember reading before… Looking further, I found https://defensescience.com/survival/what-really-happens-when-you-get-stabbed-or-cut/ — remember that the body has no need for a specific “off switch”, and as long as bodily processes can continue for the moment, death has not entirely occurred. In fact, considering known cases of animals fighting to the death to protect their young, there’s evolutionary benefit to being able to eke out a few more seconds even when mortally injured.
So… if someone can keep going a little longer when they should be dead, there should be nothing that strange about taking a gut injury, defeating or scaring off your opponent, and only then stopping to realise “oh dangit, I’m dying”.
That said, if this is what happened, whoever she ran into is quite possibly even worse off (maybe permanently so). If someone stabs you in the gut, you’re unlikely to get away unless you make very certain that your stabber won’t be doing any more stabbing.
Most reporters in the US and other Western countries don’t do that these days. And the ones that do while working at major media companies tend to lose their jobs and sometimes their lives for doing so.
Oh damn, that would be a positive outlet for Dorothy. Doubt she’ll recognise it, but I’m gonna sit here and imagine a whole years worth of comics where that is what happens because that’s how I deal with not being able to help the characters
She could write up a piece about the protest, but it’s likely exposing any actual problems would get buried under the sensationalism of the campus superhero going rogue and attacking the police.
Very interesting indeed, because the police are not shooting people and shanking them now? Perhaps I’m crackpotting but we may soon learn that the police might now have been involved in her injury at all
one theory was that someone like the Incelerator or one of Ryan’s douche bros may have used the chaos of the protest to get some “payback” at Amazi-Girl in some fashion.
Dina seems like the exact wrong person to say “She was not shot,” though. Dina would probably correct people on the technicality of it being fired from a gun if it was a rubber bullet.
Or maybe they lied to Dina about it? Dunno, weird turn.
wouldn’t be surprised if a counter protester attacked her, plus plenty of injuries from batongs and shit (which will also break skin). or not shot but grazed by a bullet. Or having fallen (or been pushed) from a high surface.
I know this isn’t the focus of today’s strip, but my eyes were drawn to the poll again today, and I want to point out how much the way things are framed changes dynamics.
The majority of us – at least those who responded to the poll fall in two main camps:
– 29% who aren’t too fussed about this plot line, attributing the errors in judgment to being young, which entails both horniness and inexperience/potentially poor judgment
– 24% who don’t like the cheating but aren’t condemning the characters forever
The second two largest groups, which are trailing by quite a lot, could roughly be associated with the two biggest groups:
– the 10% who say cheating is evil have something in common with the 24% in that both don’t like the cheating; one just finds it more permanently ethically damaging
– the 9% who say they don’t care because it’s a comic strip have a similar sort of chill vibe to the 29% who basically say, “hey they’re young let’s not get too worked up”
There’s a lot of interesting stuff about conflict dynamics and polarization observable in the comments the past few weeks – including how polls about complex topics can shift people toward a more polarized position. Sometimes people seem to take a more extreme/polarized stance out of humor, but then that gets lost over time, even to ourselves, and more easily to others who can’t tell it’s a “joke.”
Mind you, I really like Joe and i’m fully sympathetic to the fact that this is going to suck so so so much for him and I do absolutely think that Joyce is in the wrong to cheat on him and betray his trust but IMO I just never gelled with the idea that tying Joe’s ability to grow as a person with his ability to be a good boyfriend to Joyce was ever going to be the long term solution to the wider character arc he’s gone through, and now that he’s gotta directly confront those fears and hangups in such a direct and unpleasant way that is going to radically change him in a way that the current status quo wouldn’t have had.
I will fully cop that this is an unpopular opinion esp if you were more interested in seeing that journey for Joe be explored in a not-so nuclear way and maybe not even an accurate assessment for the other 2% who wanna kill jakey but that’s at least my reasoning for it.
This is a really good comment. I voted Jakey bc I have strong Paladin sympathies but at this point “I wish they’d done this the right way so I wouldn’t have to read about dudes every time this wlw relationship comes on screen” has superseded ”because I dislike cheating plotlines.” Also JoeJoyce veered into the actual territory that the original I hope jakey dies post was irritated with too much for my taste.
I actually like cheating plots so i think that’s probably were we differ lol, but thank you for the kind words!
I agree that seeing the same whataboutisms about Joe and Walky being said everytime Joyce and Dorothy are on screen together has been exhausting at best, but there’s only so much you can do when people are expressing their feelings and opinions on a story y’know?
This isn’t the first time the comments section has been in a tizzy over a major plotline and it probably won’t be the last, and i think taking steps to step away more often and be more thoughtful about sharing my opinions on this comic (even when it’s contradictory to majority consensus) has been helping to quell that peeved feeling lol.
I appreciate your recognition that people have a “right” to express themselves – I mean to the extent that 1) there is a comment section and 2) they aren’t violating the ToS here. It is on each of us to take responsibility for what we choose to read and engage with.
So to you, you’re not saying you want Joe to die, but for this aspect of his personality where he’s all about Joyce to die? Am I understanding correctly?
A bit, yeah! Very much how Dorothy choosing to go back into the protest signified the death of President Dorothy and Amazi-Girl signified the death of Amazi-Girl the Super Cop, Joe having to break up with Joyce (or at least having to heavily reevaluate his relationship with her) is the death of Joe as the proverbial “Jakey”, or at least that’s my take on it.
OK, I get it, although I initially was confused because I am not familiar with the meme and only have seen others’ explanations of it here (and don’t really want to look it up…I might like connecting with folks here but don’t want to go down a rabbit hole). The way others were explaining it, I thought it was more about a friend wanting their friend’s boyfriend to die because he’s annoying/getting in the way of their friendship.
I don’t dislike Joe or Walky at all, but I am incredibly resistant to the idea that Joe “deserves” a relationship with Joyce as some sort of reward for cleaning up his act. I want to see where his character arc goes when he’s put in the work and DOESN’T get the girl. I want to see what he does when Joyce falls off the pedestal he’s put her on by doing something thoughtless and shitty, except this time it’s something she’s done to him and not to Jacob and it’s harder to write it off as “well she’s trying”.
I am equally lukewarm on the latest iteration of Dorothy/Walky, which lacks a lot of the spark that they had back before they broke up. I don’t get the idea that there’s a lot of passion between them any longer, but that they have fallen together into something that is comfortable. What I want most for Walky is to see him make a decision about the trajectory of his life, because he has thus far path-of-least-resistenced himself into three relationships that have not done numbers for his personal growth. I want to put the guy in a terrarium by himself and examine him for a while.
The third wolf in me has been shipping Joyce/Dorothy for like ten years. I have truncated this all down into “I hope Jakey dies”.
I don’t recall seeing anyone saying anything about Joe “deserving” a relationship with Joyce, but maybe that’s because I tend to interpret comments as though the commenter has good intentions, if such an interpretation is in any way plausible; that whole idea of someone (usually a girl, for some reason) having a romantic obligation to someone (usually a boy, for equally mysterious reasons) for something that all too often amounts to basic decency… well, I don’t find that tends to be compatible with charitable readings of a comment.
Anyway… I liked Joyce and Joe together because they were nice together and seemed good for each other. Joyce and Dorothy is more ambiguous right now… both of them have issues to work through, but then, maybe they’ll figure out how not to be terrible and end up also being good for each other.
The possibility of Joyce never managing to let go of either Joe or Dorothy and ending up in a poly disaster might ultimately be the best option for all of them (in character development terms) but would probably take a book’s worth of strips to sort out that mess.
For some of us, of course, that’s the primary appeal.
As to Dorothy+Walky… remember how, back when the cheating started and people were arguing over how it would affect Joyce+Joe and how much or how little Joyce and Dorothy should think about that between kisses or whatever? And Walky seemed like an afterthought? Yes, pretty sure you’re far from the only one who didn’t find their relationship particularly interesting, at least for its own sake. I know I personally liked their interactions, but — aside from their intimate activities sometimes being necessary context — they could’ve just as well have been simply friends.
As to your final paragraph: likewise. I might not be fond of how their relationship is currently going, and Dorothy’s recent mental state has soured it a bit too… but these don’t need to be permanent issues.
In fact, on further reflection: most of what I like about Joyce+Joe could also exist with someoneelse+Joe. Most of what I like about Dorothy+Walky could work just fine with them simply as friends. What I like about Joyce+Dorothy, though? Not sure we can find that with anyone else.
TBF I don’t think that anyone has been saying that Joe “deserves” Joyce as an award, but you hit the head on the whole “guy character’s emotional journey is complemented with a [wholesome] relationship with a girl” thing. It’s so common in the wider sphere of media that seeing it be subverted here is really refreshing.
Really like seeing your other thoughts as well, ultimately I think it’s a testament that all these characters and relationship dynamics are well written enough that there’s so much flexibility on how this can all turn out.
I don’t recall seeing anyone saying anything about Joe “deserving” a relationship with Joyce, but maybe that’s because I tend to interpret comments as though the commenter has good intentions, if such an interpretation is in any way plausible; that whole idea of someone (usually a girl, for some reason) having a romantic obligation to someone (usually a boy, for equally mysterious reasons) for something that all too often amounts to basic decency… well, I don’t find that tends to be compatible with charitable readings of a comment.
I don’t think anyone was saying it directly, and I certainly don’t think anyone was saying it on purpose. As you acknowledge, it’s such an odious thing to say! Very basic misogyny! When you put it in those terms, it’s so obviously bad, and most people don’t believe obviously bad things.
(Long pause while I stare into the middle distance and think about the current crop of conservative personalities, saying shit like “empathy is a sin” with their whole chests.)
…..anyway.
No one was saying that, but people were sometimes saying — variants. Versions that kind of circle around to being that basic sentiment once you follow them through to their logical conclusion.
There was a lot of “Joe’s worked so hard, he doesn’t deserve this” — and a distinct lack of the same sentiment for Walky, even though no one really “deserves” to be cheated on.
A lot of: “Joe’s come so far from the misogynist he used to be, he doesn’t deserve to have his first serious relationship end with him being cheated on.”
And I want to stress, I don’t think anyone saying this was consciously thinking, “What Joe deserves is the opposite, for Joyce to stay with him and be faithful.” I would bet that at least 99% of the people saying it, if they were asked, would argue that there’s a lot of gray area between those two opposites!
Even folks who would agree that Joe deserves a faithful girlfriend who loves him would argue that they’re not saying he should be awarded a woman as a prize, and they’re definitely not saying he should specifically have gotten to “keep” Joyce, just that he deserves nice things (generally), and that he didn’t deserve to be betrayed, and that Joyce should have broken up with him before she kissed Dorothy…
…and all of that is very reasonable, but I do think that there’s a part of all of us, programmed into us by society, that does kind of view “a faithful girlfriend who loves him” as a nice thing to which good heterosexual male characters are in fact kind of entitled.
And we react with confusion and sometimes anger when that narrative contract is broken.
Lindsay Ellis even mentions it, casually, in her video about Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2, when she notes that there’s “a reason” why Quinn didn’t “get the girl” in that movie. (The reason is that Quinn hasn’t yet completed work on himself and doesn’t yet deserve that particular reward.)
Again: not saying everyone who has complained about Joe not “deserving” this means that he should have been given the opposite by the narrative, and indeed I would venture to guess that that’s not a conscious part of anyone’s mental math.
But if you go back like two months, to before it became unarguable that Joyce returned Dorothy’s feelings, you’ll see a kind of interesting thread in conversations over how there was no way Willis would do that to Joe, because it would inevitably derail or ruin Joe’s character arc.
And I think that thread spoke to the underlying, unconscious assumption that Joe was going to “get the girl” because he deserved her more than Dorothy did. And I think there is a lingering thread now of betrayal from some of the readers that Willis subverted that particular expectation: manifesting occasionally in very specific complaints about how the writing is bad now, or Joyce’s characterization doesn’t make sense.
I am generally inclined to take charitable readings of comments, but I am also intensely sensitive to undercurrents of misogyny. I don’t believe that people intend to say to the letter “Joyce is a prize that Joe deserves”, but there has certainly been a noxious tone to some of the bemoaning of Joe’s plight and how this was going to rip all of his character development into shreds and how he deserved – maybe not saying Joyce outright, but deserved SOMETHING for all of his hard work.
And again, to be clear, I like Joe and I do feel for him. I don’t think he deserves to be cheated on, but I also don’t think he is entitled to anything for bettering himself. You should seek to better yourself for the sake of bettering yourself, and not because you will be cosmically rewarded for your efforts.
Joyce shouldn’t be seen as some object Joe is entitled to for his improvement — besides the latent and ironically misogynist undertones of that sentiment, it’s such a narrow way of looking at the meaning of his becoming a better person for his own sake
like he’s formed a great friendship with Dina, have we really forgotten that???
I think this may be where “it’s fiction” applies. Narrative logic is a thing and doesn’t always (and doesn’t need to) follow what’s right in the real world.
That’s especially true in the Lindsay Ellis bit. That’s not a moral judgement about men needing to be rewarded with the prize of a woman, but a statement about narrative arcs. That’s just how romance plot arcs work – and they work the same way even in non hetero romances. You don’t go to “happily ever after” in the middle of the arc. (Caveats apply of course, there are countless variations, but the basic arc is there).
It’s not quite the same here, especially because this is serial literature, not a single story, so it’s normal to reach a temporary resolution of an arc and then disrupt it for another arc in a later story. My objection to this in terms of JoJo and why it feels off it me is not that Joe didn’t complete his arc and get his proper reward, but that their arc feels like it ran headlong into another one and for me at least, that’s where the sense the “narrative contract is broken” came from. JoJo didn’t need to be endgame and Joe didn’t need to get his “reward”, but I felt like JoJo needed to run its course.
And my feeling was strengthened by finding that Willis changed plans in the middle of this arc.
Now, none of this is quite what you’re talking about, but I think it’s easily mistaken for it at a glance
Okay. But I was just attempting to explain why no one needed to literally be saying “Joe deserved Joyce” for that to still be a vibe in the comment section.
Also, narratives that treat romantic love as a reward for character growth aren’t above criticism. It’s boring, for one thing, and contributes to female characters being more often object than subject in stories.
I’ve seen a few different interpretations now that I can’t even relate to each other, and I think some people chose it to be random without even understanding it. Something about everything being about a girl’s boyfriend? Her being too dependent on him or too cute with him? Him being too basic? Then there’s the other commenter here who seems to have a totally different take on it.
No, but depending on where Sal hid Amber’s paraphernalia, and how eager Billie is to get the scoop on Amazi-Girl before Dorothy, we might be seeing a different kind of “reveal.”
Superpowers are absolutely real in the Dumbiverse. There’s Joyce’s teleport-to-Dorothy, Sal’s wall-crawling, Dina’s invisibility, behind-door-portaling, and teleport-to-incorrect-dinosaur-information, the Dina-Charlie gestalt ability to teleport anywhere, Billie’s Most Common Superpower, Carla’s ability to wear roller skates all the time without breaking her neck on the stairs…
They”re like Roger Rabbit’s, though… they only work when it’s funny.
This whole plotline, the exchange from Bo Burnham’s “How the World Works” has been on loop in my head. “What can I do to help?” “I don’t know read a book or something!” […] “I’m just trying to become a better person.” “Why do you rich fucking white people always insist on seeing everything through the myopic lens of your own self-actualization? This isn’t about you! So either get with it, or get out of the way!”
Allow me to take a moment to respond to the reddit thread complaining about the main site comments complaining about reddit comments complaining about the comic.
Butts.
Thank you, that is all.
(please note, in case it is not obvious, that this is not in any way meant seriously)
“Allow me to take a moment to respond to the reddit thread”, now that’s a dangerous way to start a sentence. Whatever the dweebs are bawling about this time, they should go buy another Funko Pop about it. I’m sure there’s a new color of Batman coming out soon for them to preorder.
Hm. It almost seems like Amazi-Girl needs someone who can deflect attention from her secret identity. Perhaps someone of similar proportions, who has experience with sewing an Amazi-Girl costume, and is filled with enough beans in the moment to set a plan in motion before Amber wakes up and can be seen in public.
Not as far as I know. I was specifically referring to Dorothy. Then again, with that era of Hollywood and television, would we even know? Napier reportedly said his autobiography wasn’t published because “I haven’t committed a major crime and I’m not known to have slept with any famous actresses.” He didn’t say anything about actors.
Setting up a pillow fort here for other people who are also in the “Dorothy has plenty of flaws, but like the rest of the main characters, she means well and does in fact like and care about her friends” camp, I suspect that’s most of us — even most of us who dislike her!
I am seriously also welcoming folks in who don’t like her but don’t think she’s the strip’s villain.
I totally get finding her boring or bland or annoying! Much as I see her as a compelling sad wet cat of a woman, there are plenty of very reasonable negative takes and I think we can break bread together.
Or maybe in the spirit of pillow forts I should break out the childhood snacks. Gushers and Fruit by the Foot are lunch box desserts I remember fondly.
Oh snap, is there any room left in here? Stepping outside feels like hopping into the Warp without a Geller Field right now. (Warhammer 40k reference, for those who don’t get it.)
My position is that she’s a good person at heart and cares about her friends but is expressing that in an unhealthy way that dovetails into her avoidant tendencies.
That need to care more about others needs and on top of things and always be the best version of yourself 24/7 even when it’s obviously stretching yourself thin and ruining your life in disastrous ways that you know you should deal with but the impulse is to brute force yourself into overcoming it instead of actually stopping is too real for me to ever hate Dorothy. Anyways i brought cookies and nail polish for anyone who wants to do at-home manicures ✨💅
Dorothy is literally on Day 2 of her unplanned affair, having tried to confess her failing to Walky on Day 1. The hatefest and lack of grace extended to her feels more like trauma projection than anything else.
I do think there’s some of that. And I’m not making assumptions — some of the most vocally distressed folks in the comments have said they have trauma around cheating.
Me: oh, the comments will be full of people maybe realising that white girls with boyfriends kissing is a drop in the bucket compared to the actual greater stakes of the protest events yesterday
The comments: why is amber being gravely injured while ensuring the safety of protestors being used as a DISTRACTION from Dorothy’s moral duty to crush Wally so that she can live honestly???
Also the comments: once again, Dorothy makes everything about her. So self-centred, unlike me who can let go of my moral agenda for a moment to understand that the cheating plotline is peanuts compared to the wider ramifications of an anti-war protest in the midst of a police state.
Also me though: gee I really wish the protest hadn’t been inserted at all because it already takes forever for this messy webcomic to get through more mundane plots, much less a plot that has been going on in the real world for the last 60-70 years that makes me feel helpless and distraught at the impotency of individual actions.
Me: oh, the comments will be full of people maybe realising that white girls with boyfriends kissing is a drop in the bucket compared to the actual greater stakes of the protest events yesterday
It’s really a question of audience and focus — the strip is ABOUT the college kids being dumb, not about the real-world political implications of the campus protest that’s fundamentally being used as a backdrop rather than a major thread here.
In other words, mostly, I agree with your last paragraph here as it functions as an adequate explanation of why most of us are happy to put the entire protest (and related comment blow-up) in the rear view mirror as fast as possible.
Wow, the Dorothy-hate is strong tonight. She might deserve it for cheating on Walky, and the fact that she still hasn’t told him yet. However I think there is clearly conflict going on within Dorothy because of this; not that she is trying to make it about herself, but she feels like she’s failed Amber/Amazi-Girl by not being there to help, or take care of her afterwards.
Is Dorothy more worried about how she could have helped Amber/Amazi-Girl rather than whether they are ok? A little bit, but more so she is feeling like she failed someone she cares about. I imagine this is more self-shame than anything else. Dorothy doesn’t like to fail; whether that be academically, professionally, socially, and personally. I have no doubt she cares about Amber/Amazi-Girl even if right now she’s hung up on her own self-worth at the moment.
So everyone take a deep breath, and learn to disagree without making it toxic.
I think it’s a mixture of both. Dorothy genuinely IS kind and thoughtful and looks out for other people. She’s sort of built up her self-identity as being the organizer and the carer of others, she who keeps people safe and functioning, so to speak. So she’s now confronted with a situation where normally SHE would be the one to have done all this, only to realize people went ahead and did it without her. So she’s having the usual “But then what am I even for??” moment of self-doubt, even though she is genuinely worried for AG/Amber.
I agree. I also think this comic doesn’t really have thought bubbles and she’s saying this almost to herself. I don’t think her intent is for Dina to hear it. It’s more like her internal knee-jerk reaction which I can have more grace for.
Equally, I think people being holier than thou about it either have already developed better coping strategies (like letting it be and not hovering) or are like me the mom friend who is actually relieved when stuff is sorted. Like I personally don’t want to have to do anything, I just feel compelled to step in a lot. But that doesn’t make me better than a Dorothy that probably just means I’m lazier or something. I’d probably be more inclined to hover in this moment because just buggering off would just feel wrong even if there’s nothing for me to do. I probably couldn’t just go on with my day if my friend was hurt.
I don’t hate Dorothy but am annoyed that the train of thought that she exhibiting now is the same train of thought that lead her to stay in the protest for so long causing Amber to jump into a mob of cops just to save her in the first place.
To be fair, as people argued at length yesterday, while Dorothy did provide one more person to rescue (well 2, since Joyce came back in for her), Amazi-Girl also rescued others, starting with Asma if the bonus strip is to be believed and went back in after DoJo was out and safe. Dorothy is at least not the only reason AG got hurt there. Maybe, with a couple people less to worry about, she could have gotten everyone else out without injury, but that seems a stretch.
I asked the science department about it, and while they say it is unlikely, the numbers indicate it is possible… additional tests may be needed to verify.
In tomorrow’s strip, Dina reassures Dorothy that they will call her if they need her and that she is nice for checking in. Dorothy will promptly spiral in the shower within 5 minutes of that interaction.
Ugh now there is a horrific thought. Can’t imagine how you are supposed to process that when hearing it from the person who your partner cheated on you with. Even them being present for moral support would feel like a slap in the face.
I really do hope it’s Joe who ends up doing the dumping. My man really deserves to keep his dignity.
I feel for Dorothy here. It’s hard to be a mom friend hearing that one of your friends is in a bad spot but there’s no tasks left for you to do. It means you still have all the worry but nowhere to exercise it by helping so you just feel helpless.
Thankfully, just being there and going ‘let me know if you want/need anything’ and offering extra strength Tylenol can be lots in that situation.
I think a lot of folks would be more charitable to Dorothy’s concern about Amber in last comic and this one if it wasn’t also increasingly seeming like her underlying motivation in all of this (conscious or not) is “put off talking to Walky, the one thing here that only she can do, as long as possible”.
she was very quick to just agree to Joyce’s idea to put it off until the morning, and there was no actual reason for her to pop in on Amber to see if she saw anything if she was just gonna go talk to Walky after her shower anyway. She’s being avoidant.
I’m sympathetic to people using the term since the colloquial use of “narcissist” to describe “destructively self-centered/self-aggrandizing” has been around centuries longer than the formal diagnosis of NPD.
That said, now that it IS a diagnosis, I highly recommend being clear about whether you’re being colloquial or psychiatric, or better yet just using “abusively self-centered” etc. At least two folks in this comment section have a friend who’s struggling with the clinical diagnosis, and it (to be blunt) doesn’t always look like the colloquial abusive narcissist.
glad you said this
last time I mentioned the clinical diagnosis vs “abusive self centred” thing online (NOT HERE, to be clear) and said that maybe we shouldn’t be demonising mental illness people decided I was a “covert narcissist” and also a demon
kind of sucks!
Online narcissist discourse is an actual plague and evidence of much of the ills of modern society. It goes right in there with myers-briggs, PUA as a lifestyle, and religious fervor over one or another self-help guru.
There is an entire industry of unscrupulous or outright fake therapists/psychologists monetising your distaste over an ex or a difficult parent under the pretense of “narcissist awareness”.
read the room, dorothy, it’s quiet time
for real though I do know how a friend getting hurt and not being able to help eats at a person
even if your self-worth isn’t tied up in helping others (there are worse things to have one’s self-worth tied up in, it must be said) it sucks donkey dick like a vastly out of control vacuum in a stable
I mean, do you need a reason to have some delicious cake? I say enjoy it, even if the event it was made for didn’t pan out… and pass me a slice where you’re at it.
“What you will do is talk to your boyfriend before you continue with your girlfriend.”
“Does EVERYone know about that?!”
“Yes. And please keep your voice down. As I said, Amber is sleeping.”
If Dorothy goes to Walky and leads with Ambers injury, both Joe and Walky will be busy for a while. Joe would prioritize his new sister and Walky would remember who committed a felony for him.
Btw, amber is badly injured and no one talked to her new step brother, who they all know. Looks like a plot hole that Dorothy can fill.
I dunno, the old old cheating memes were pretty up front on the whole ‘betrayal is bad’ part. I mean, Tristan was supposed to deliver Isolde to King Mark WITHOUT SAMPLING. Arthur needed to be able to trust Lance with everything, not just his wife. (Of course, both of those involved arranged marriages – does that make a difference?) Helen’s face launched a thousand ships. (Hopefully she had good dental.)
Those old tales were less about hurt feelings and more about lost honor, but the appeal was the same; people did what they weren’t supposed to, as people do, and everyone knows the feeling. It makes for good story telling.
Also, about Dorothy doing a barrel roll, please remember the wise seagull:
arranged marriages make a difference, yeah
there’s a cultural context there that’s not particularly nice and while cheating is still, y’know, kinda shit it doesn’t typically have the same potentially quite dire consequences – an interpersonal matter rather than one of “the realm”
I actually hate Dorothy and I cannot think one of character, real or fictional who is worse than her. I think if I had a gun with two bullets and it was between Dorothy and Voldemort I would shoot Dorothy both times.
Willis has called Dorothy and Amazi-Girl’s relationship a little bit Superman/Lois Lane, and I’ve been wondering for a while now whether there was any chance Amazi-Girl actually felt that way about Dorothy, or if it’s just a one-sided crush.
That she texted Sal when she needed help instead kind of seemed like a “no” to me, on top of her mildly baffled “surprisingly okay with the skirt” reaction to Dorothy’s “help” finishing her new costume…
…but. According to the tags, that wasn’t Amazi-Girl: that was all Amber, who’s a.) probably more aware of the tropey value of a superhero reaching out to their “nemesis” for help, and b.) maaaybe reluctant to talk to Dorothy right now anyway, given Booster’s analysis of her reasons for “helping” Dorothy take and send a lewd to Joyce…
Dorothy is like Sauron after the destruction of the One Ring, a powerless spirit left to wander reality without the ability to affect anything or anyone.
No. Or at least not until the end when the world is unmade.
As Gandalf described what would happen at the Council of Elrond:
“If it is destroyed, then he will fall; and his fall will be so low that none can foresee his arising ever again. For he will lose the best part of the strength that was native to him in his beginning, and all that was made or begun with that power will crumble, and he will be maimed for ever, becoming a mere spirit of malice that gnaws itself in the shadows, but cannot again grow or take shape. And so a great evil of this world will be removed.”
After looking at this strip a half dozen times, it suddenly clicks what looks strange about Dina. She isn’t whiling away the time on a laptop while her friend rests up. She is using her iphone and doing her best not to look away for any length of time. Not Dina behavior, but from old experience it totally looks like a duty officer during a security alert.
Or maybe playing Angry Birds.
LOL The funny part is our phones couldn’t leave the house and you never got a taste of avocado without being within 100 miles of the southern border. 🙂
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“what do i do?”
wdym?
what even is there for you TO do than let her rest?
Dorothy sees herself as the one who solves problems. She’s given up on the president-level problems and now her friends are solving their own problems without her.
Seriously. You do the exact same thing you were going to do when you thought Amber was unscathed: Avoid breaking up with Walky.
Spoilers.
That’s not a spoiler.
There are two kinds of spoilers. One is “spoiling a twist no one saw coming,” the other is “spoiling something that technically has not been confirmed but absolutely zero people will be surprised once it has been confirmed.” You know, like in the 2018 She-Ra series.
Hey, spoilers!
That’s the point. She thinks she should be doing something to help Amber, but the only thing to do is let her rest.
“Acab”, In the first comment? I liked it.
Joyce, probably
this is 100% the right answer!
high five!
Ha!
hey-ooooo!
Beat me to it.
Came here to say this! ^_^
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Heck Yeah!
YOU GO BREAK UP WITH YOUR BOYFRIEND, DOROTHY.
And people are giving me guff for reading Dorothy as avoidant!
I can see how finding out a friend of hers she previously thought escaped a confrontation unharmed was injured to the point she needed medical attention might eclipse that in her mind for a bit.
Yeah, I would in fact be a lot more uncharitable to her if she immediately breezed past learning her friend was hurt by the cops bad enough to need medical attention so she could get back to her own problems.
This is something that should take the wind out of your sails a bit.
She’s just found out one of her best friends has been seriously wounded and that has become, understandably, a priority for her over relationship drama. Even if there’s little she can do in the moment she wants to help in any way she can, in keeping with everything we know about her personality.
So yeah, guff maintained, because this continues to be an uncharitable read.
She learned her friend was wounded and that’s understandably something to be concerned about but even after learning that everything’s been taken care of and she’ll be fine Dorothy is still trying to find something she can do to busy herself with the situation, because she is subconsciously trying to put off facing up to what she actually needs to be doing.
You can call it an uncharitable read if you want but it’s my view of her character and I like her better that way. I like when characters have really bad flaws!
To be fair, while she is also very likely trying to put it off, this reaction would also be completely in character if she didn’t have anything to put off.
Those people are wrong
Dorothy’s for sure avoidant, when it comes to things she knows will upset someone.
Dorothy could smell gas, see someone about to light a match, and then fret over interrupting the song that person is playing to tell them about the gas. She’d try to somehow organize the warning into a spreadsheet, and by the time she got around to actually saying something, the house would be a pile of ashes and she’d be attending their funeral from her hospital bed, via video call.
That was… oddly specific.
I like to be specific. It helps when I’m creating an image in your minds.
Taffy for the last time, you have to pay your share of the rent if you’re going to hang out putting images in my mind.
I’ll pay the rent when you fix this damn door.
NO!!!! YOU GO TALK YOUR BOYFRIEND INTO A POLYCULE!
“tHeN wHaT dO i dO?” IDK bro, make out with your girlfriend?
Decenter yourself, Dorothy dear.
1000000%
Yes, forget about your injured friend and go back to worrying about your other problems so that people can attack you for being callous to Amber instead!
Next we’ll attack her over her hairstyle! Girl, you look like you were halfway to a Beatles cosplay and got attacked by static electricity.
yaaay another Dina strip!
birthday weekend now instant satisfaction B)
Happy birthday weekend!
*August 30th*
Happy birthday month!
You act normal and go confess to Walky.
“Then what do I do?”
Breaking up with your boyfriend is still supposed to be on your to do list! Go talk to Walky!
Just make sure you tell him before you tell him about Amber so he doesn’t rush off to see her!
It’s at the bottom of that list, and IMO it will stay there as long as she can find almost anything else to do first.
I think you could make a case for waiting until Joyce actually breaks up with Joe. If she breaks up with Walky and Joyce is unable to bring herself to break up with Joe, then Dorothy could wind up with no-one and all her bridges burned. I mean, trust Joyce, but verify.
After what Joyce has been doing the last 24 hours, I think trust is the last thing she deserves from anyone.
Not from Joe, from Dorothy or even Sarah.
And especially not from Sirksome.
Well that’s just a given. I’d be more concerned if they did trust someone.
The bridge is already burned. Hanging onto a partner just in case things don’t work out with the person you’re cheating on them with is a colossal dick move.
Similarly, Joyce should wait to break up with Joe until Dorothy actually breaks up with Walky.
I think I see the flaw in this plan.
No-one is exactly who they both deserve 🩵
I agree with this. No one person is going to work for them, and that’s one of the reasons I am here to talk to you all today about polyamory.
In this essay I will…
Where the essay 🔫
It’s implied.
Dorothy clearly feels some guilt for not helping Amazi-Girl, but staying to help would only have made things worse. Amazi-Girl contacted Sal because she knew who would be able to help her the most.
I wonder if Dorothy also feels guilty because she thinks if she’d run sooner AG would be less injured. (I also wonder just how much her actions did put AG at more risk of injury.)
The answer is zero.
What AG did was very cool, fuck the police, but she decided to be there. She decided to fight cops. She decided to go back in and continue helping people get out long after she sent Dorothy on her merry way.
Of all the things that might arguably be Dorothy’s fault, AG’s actions are not. AG had agency, and she used it.
But did Amber?
Amber used her agency to call Sal.
“sal has hidden all of amber’s paraphernalia” and billifer is back on the amazi-girl trail? please please let this be going where i think it’s going
Yes, I think that’s 100% where this is going. Hopefully it’s *just* Jennifer who thinks it’s Sal, even after that. And if not, hopefully Dorothy can use her title as “amazigirl interviewer” to squash any theories that it’s Sal.
Hopefully without making everyone think it’s that Dorothy is the one behind the mask.
Well, Clark Kent did seem to get some really good interviews with Superman…
I know, right? Dude’s got some kind of superhuman luck of being in the right place and the right time to catch those interviews. I don’t know how he does it!
He took the same Super Hero Journalism Classes at college as Peter Parker
Ah, that explains it. So glad we didn’t feel the need to indulge in silly conspiracy theories.
Can’t remember when I last saw it, so I don’t know if it still happens, but Marvel used to have unnamed reporters who were obviously Clark and Lois show up occasionally. I think DC did the same with Peter, but I’m less sure of that.
Imagining them together in the same Super Hero Journalism school reminded me of that.
Yeah re: hoping it’s just Billie; it’s a little concerning to me because Sal has already been seen with Amazigirl, so even if someone didn’t think Sal is her, it could be used as evidence against her, and be used to leverage ‘she got in a fistfight with some rapist’ into ‘well clearly with this grappling hook she planned to (or already did) break into places’
This sounds like it could be extremely disturbing. Sal going down for Amazi-Girl’s actions would be very awful. I could see if that was about to happen. Amber might just come forward and confess to save Sal. Which would be very dramatic. I’m prepared to link back to this comment if this happens!
oh no.
That’s a terrifying thought. If Billie finds it connected with Sal and OUTS her publicly as the person who did violence to cops, the bi racial black girl who has a criminal history would be the target of the police, d-list masked characters and Carol.
I am emotionally not ready for how insufferable Jennifer would be when that happens.
Billie has displayed WAY more racial awareness than that would represent.
God I hope you’re right. But one memory that makes me a little nervous is that really naive phone call she had where she was asking someone “okay, you sent the homeless people away, but where to? Is it somewhere nice?”
I certainly can’t see Billie doing it intentionally, especially given how she let Lucy know about the “moving goal posts” aspect of Walky and Sal’s parents.
What story arc was that? I can’t remember that at all.
It was back when Becky had just arrived at IU after having run away from the fundie college and Toedad. I’m not sure how to search the archives for multiple tags… I just remember it was a scene that had Billie and Sal in the same strip. Billie was lying on the top bunk calling some associate or employee of her rich dad. Sal was standing on the floor, listening, growing more and more put off by what she heard of the phone conversation. I remember her really specific facial expression.
Here’s the specific strip: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/comic/book-6/04-it-all-returns/nina/
All you need to do to search multiple tags is to click on one tag (Let’s say Dina since she’s on this page), go to the URL, find that tag, put a + right after it, and add a second character’s name (I’ll go with Robin, on a whim). Once you’ve done that, it should look like this:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/tag/dina+robin/
And you can substitute any character you want, plus add a third or fourth or fifth the same way. I’ve never gone beyond 5, since bigger group shots aren’t super common, but you can.
Thanks for assist! Now I know for the future. 🙂
Oh, she’s absolutely still got CLASS blindness, but she’s always been really sharp on spotting racial biases of other people and cutting right to the point. With Walky and Sal at first and then again with Lucy.
She would know better than to out Sal as somebody who assaulted the police.
My thoughts is she wouldn’t necessarily know that Amazi-girl had an altercation with the police, or might only find out about that afterwards.
Racial awareness, yes, but not so aware of what is happening outside of her own immediate interest. If she were to out Sal (which she’s continually hoping to prove) I don’t think it would be knowing recent events and the stakes involved
Yeah I am in with the Sense of Dread here – you could be right. Also the only way out for Sal might be if Asher throws himself back to the Mob to pull some favours.
I was gonna be snarky, but I actually feel bad that Dorothys identity is so wrapped up in being the mom friend that when she’s not needed she feels she has no value
It’s really not that hard to actually understand the character. And yet so many miss it by so so muxh
But if they understood the character they wouldn’t be able to make baseless complaints about her.
Finally someone here gets me!
…oh you’re being sarcastic…
What if we do understand it and just find the self appointed mom of the group personality really annoying.
Learn how to deal with it, I guess?
“Umm, no” for $1000, Alex!
I said that’s not understanding the character, just taking a surface level read and assuming that’s everything there is to her.
Surface level read? That’s like the basis of all of her close interpersonal relationships with the cast. It’s literally in the alt text, however facetious it’s meant to be. You’re actually talking out of your butt for someone going around telling others they don’t understand a character.
Don’t know how’d you’d the Dorothy’s character any other way rn aside from her making this all about herself
Pretty easily actually. I just don’t think she is doing that.
I don’t see how anyone reading in good faith possibly could read it that way.
We’re not supposed to call her the mom friend. That infantilizes Joyce and something something Jocasta.
You are confusing calling her a mom friend and calling her Joyce’s mom and claiming there’s a power dynamic there.
People literally said that Dorothy didn’t have fellings for Joyce and just wnated to be her mom and that make her abusive because “power dynamic”. Nothing to do with calling her a mom friend.
People, or person?
I’m pretty sure it was a couple of ’em, maybe three. I will not provide receipts though, because it would eat into my Fortnite Battle Pass time, and I’m only 10 levels away from unlocking the White Power Ranger.
Plus, digging through a comments section to quote a troll verbatim is hardly what I’d call a worthwhile use of one’s time. So you know, a very wise decision on your part.
I like to exaggerate what they were saying sometimes and make jokes about Dorothy being Joyce’s literal biological mother who gave birth to her and raised her. Much nicer than trawling through an indeterminate amount of old strips to find individual comments that will perfectly satisfy even the pickiest evidence-needers.
And really in all likelihood they’d just double down than admit defeat, if they respond at all.
It’s good to see a person with priorities.
Jocasta?
The mythological queen of Thebes. I’m not sure what she has to do with this either. Probably another instance of auto-incorrect. Either that or an Oedipus reference is being made that I’m missing.
Some people (very few, who have taken it to this extent) have said that Dorothy is basically Joyce’s mom, therefore a romantic/sexual relationship between them would be/is incestuous. Thus, Jocasta.
Good lord… some anons seem to be going for gold in the Olympic long jumping-to-conclusions.
I was looking for a strip that demonstrated that, but ran across this one. https://www.dumbingofage.com/counselor/ Where she wonders if she confuses “busy” with “happy”. Which probably plays into feeling needed now that I think about it.
I read a fic some years back that really leaned into/deconstructed this aspect of the “Compulsive Hero” archetype, with a protagonist who, turns out, felt that they had no worth as a person except in what they could do for others. They drove themself to the brink of self-destruction and, when finally and literally forced to stop and rest, had no idea what to do with (or for) themself.
Oh, I got it!
Get under that weighted blanket Joyce got!
With or without ya new *partner*,
ya seem like ya could really use some full body pressure
bake muffins
This is rarely the wrong answer.
Honestly not a bad idea. Depending on how long Amber sleeps they might not be hot anymore but they should still be fresh enough for her to have something to eat when she wakes up that doesn’t require her to go to effort to make.
or cupcakes, that was the second thing she asked Danny for (after, iirc, a super fancy hard drive)
Oh no I’ve got it.
She’s Steven Universe Future.
This gonna end with Dorothy self loathing turning her into a kaiju? Because that would be awesome.
I thought that was about PTSD.
The self loathing was a byproduct of the ptsd.
This is the read.
So how many strips before she turns into a giant pink monster and goes on a rampage?
“I’m sorry, Steven. I think we’re gonna have to kill this guy.”
Damn.
I’ve always thought that Steven would get angry enough to beat up Hitler and then drag him to the Hague to face trial.
But I didn’t like that one!
Oh noooooooo
The threshold for this lot receiving therapy seems to be actual suicide attempts
We know that Dorothy is getting therapy. We also know that at the time it came up she was lying to her therapist so nothing that might interfere with her presidential ambitions would wind up on her medical record. We don’t know if she’s stopped lying to her therapist since. Therapy doesn’t do much good if you refuse to talk about what you actually need help with.
A good therapist will learn a lot from avoidance behavior. It remains to be seen if Dorothy has a good therapist. (The therapist strips in Questionable Content are gold.)
Yeah, honestly I miss Dr. Buenavida. She always cracked me up. Her quip about “things you’ll never hear a therapist tell you” lives rent free in my head.
Doing my “providing links” thing again:
https://breezewiki.com/questionablecontent/wiki/Doctor_Corrine_Buenvenida/Appearances
(using BreezeWiki because that Fandom wiki is a mess).
Incidentally, going through them I noticed an oddity that may have been coincidental… In that Dr. Buenvenida’s first appearance, Faye seemed to be consistently avoiding eye contact, but only intermittently later, which was presumably intentional (to show her varying levels of discomfort) and not the oddity. The oddity was that, in that first appearance, her eyes seem to be locked onto her therapist’s breasts.
Possibly lack of care over gaze depiction, possibly subtle foreshadowing that she’s not as heterosexual as she thought.
Hopefully that digression wasn’t offensive. As an aromantic asexual who, as a child, read zoology books for fun, I struggle to relate to the levels of meaning normal people attach to specific body parts.
Also, that’s generally the threshold for people who feel like they can’t afford therapy. And while I seem to recall that the school is covering their therapy that can be a hard habit to get out of. Just like how I currently have full medical coverage but generally won’t make an appointment beyond the ones the office scheduled for me unless I think I’m dying because my brain tells me I can’t afford to go see a doctor.
That’s definitely some of it in the US, but far from all of it. How much higher are therapy rates in countries with better health systems?
There’s a lot of internal prejudice against seeking therapy still. Some of it’s for thinking you’re admitting to being crazy. Some for admitting you can’t handle your own relatively minor problems that anyone should be able to handle.
There’s also that fun little detail that sometimes, the things a person might benefit from therapy for may also make them not want to go to therapy (or make it harder to benefit even if they do).
For example: Dorothy seems to have a tendency to feel she needs to be the one working on problems. Getting help from a therapist means letting another person work on her problems…
Yes, good therapists tend to help the client work on themselves (something that shouldn’t conflict with Dorothy’s issues) rather than doing all the work themselves, but it’s very possible that, with Dorothy’s reluctant interactions, this might’ve never been communicated.
Besides, there’s still that expectation many people have that therapy is just about telling the therapist some stuff and then getting proscribed pills (medication can certainly help (and sometimes may be critical due to neurochemical imbalances) but even then, usually in combination with other approaches). Dorothy may have an unexamined assumption that addressing mental health means having someone else do all the work, and that’s just not Dorothy’s style.
Triple that for the military, where any hint of mental issues can 86 your career instantly. (This might have changed for the better since I retired, but I doubt it. Only general officers are allowed to be obviously nuts. Oh, and CW4 helicopter pilots. And combat medics. And – you, know, the people who would have to be nuts to want the job.
“There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one’s own safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn’t, but if he was sane, he had to fly them. If he flew them, he was crazy and didn’t have to; but if he didn’t want to, he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle.”
dang, beated while typing :p
And if you’re sane enough to recognize a possible problem, you’re sane enough to fly missions.
I read a book about that once, many years ago. Wish I could remember the title…
😉
I mean, that’s not that far from reality ime
MenWomen would literally [example] before getting therapy?Great, Dorothy, you’re ruining the meme!
DO THE RIGHT THING DOROTHY
get breakfast
And then bring some to Joyce.
And maybe some to Dina. She doesn’t have cereal in today’s strip!
Lest we’ve all forgotten:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-4/01-the-only-dope-for-me-is-you/wonders/
Although, on less jokey reflection… maybe the reason we haven’t seen Dina eating cereal much lately is that, now she has Becky, she no longer needs the regular dopamine hit from her preferred food?
Not that she’s abandoned her cocoa puffs, however. Here’s an idiot risking his life:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-15/02-the-one-where-jocelyne-returns/absurddangerous/
It seems possible that there might be an investigation in which a few detectives will try to find out who Amazi-Girl “is”. And one of the things that they are likely to do is interview the student-journalist who wrote stories about her. But one of the things they are not likely to do is respect the confidentiality of a student-journalist’s notes and sources.
So what you do now, Dorothy, is erase incriminating notes and records, then engage a lawyer. The student newspaper ought to have someone on retainer.
Would the school even lend the use of that lawyer? Since said lawyer would be on their payroll, and they have a vested interest in continuing to send funds to the Bulmeria conflict… couldn’t they just say “lol, nope” and leave Dorothy to fend for herself regardless of her status as a student and a journalist?
And given how absurdly expensive lawyers are (dear lordy are they expensive), I doubt she could afford one on a college student’s budget.
lolwut
If Bezos owns it, maybe…
To be fair, Indiana University as a whole should have a lawyer on retainer, who could potentially offer some of their spare time to help if they’re not busy and IU is ok with it… neither of which is likely in the current situation. There’s just recently been a decidedly violent event on campus that’s almost certainly monopolising any legal attention, and as Tequila Mockingbird said, IU likely doesn’t want to do anything that might annoy their financial benefactors…
Come to think of it, they presumably wouldn’t want to take an official stance on this in either direction (due to their lesser sense of obligation to their students), and would welcome anything that takes attention away from their involvement in recent events.
That said… it’s not impossible that some faculty members are secretly in favour of Amazi-Girl’s actions to protect the students… Besides, even at the protest, nothing she did was likely to affect IU’s financial interests (the protest still broke up, after all). So… while I doubt any legal help will be forthcoming, some unofficial assistance is certainly possible.
Now there’s a thought. After all, we know Sarah is going into Law. Maybe one of her professors reaches out as a sympathetic party, off-the-record.
The primary or only focus of any attorney employed by the university is going to be Making Problems Go Away for their client. This often will not align with, or be directly opposed to, the best interest(s) of any students.
Back when I was an undergraduate (at UNSW) our Student’s Union had a bail fund for bailing out students arrested in protests, and a solicitor on retainer. And the Student’s Union, not the University, published the student newspaper (Tharunka).
I thought the US took these civics things more seriously than Australia.
Oh man, the cops are looking for Amazi-Girl?!
… y’know, I hear Billifer knows who she is-
I like the lighting work in this strip.
Also, Dina seems really glued to her phone. This seems like a conversation that warrants putting the screen down for a few seconds, so that it might continue uninterrupted and with a sense of greater severity.
I mean she autistic and hates eye contact (as do I) by default, this pretty expected hahaha
Can’t speak for others, but I have (after sustained effort) managed to convince people I live with that staring at my screen doesn’t mean I’m not paying attention to them, to the point that I can carry on an entire conversation without more than glancing in their direction and not cause offense.
An important part of that, of course, is actually paying sufficient attention to the other person… Something that some people struggle with, leading to the common assumption that looking at the screen means at least partially ignoring the not-looked-at person. However, many of us are perfectly capable of both listening to what we’re not looking at and keeping track of objects in our peripheral vision (at least enough that we can still notice if there is cause to actually look directly at them)… and, as explained by a great comment by S.R. yesterday — https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-16/01-not-so-smooth-criminals/goodgood/#comment-1918955 — some people may need the extra stimulation to actually be able to pay attention.
It might be Amber’s phone. She may be helping to maintain the “everything is OK” facade by keeping up Amber’s online presence…
Hey, I had not thought of that. It’s clever; I like it.
There are plenty of things Dorothy can do that don’t involve Amber. Breaking up with Walky for example, and maybe checking to see if Joyce has broken up with Joe yet.
But none of those help Amber which what any reasonable reading of the strip would understand she’s asking. Amber is injured and she wants to help her.
True, but by the looks of things Sal and Dina already did everything to help Amber so far. So since Dorothy can’t do anything to help Amber right now, she can go do the other things she was planning to do instead.
Ok, but going “Phew, guess I don’t have to worry about her at all then, ok bye” is also kinda the wrong reaction here.
There is no plausible reality, fictional or otherwise, where receiving all of this information is rationally met immediately with a response of “I’m going to continue about my day as if nothing is wrong.”
So instead the right thing for Dorothy to do is to make it all about her?
Rational not narcissistic people would say “I’m glad she’s taken care of. Give me a call if there’s any way I can help.”
She is not doing that for fuck sake. And can we stop with calling everything we don’t like about someone “narcissism” it’s so god damn played out.
She was told there was nothing she could do for Amber at the moment, and her response was “But what about me?” How is that not making it all about her?
How is it that?
Her response was not “What about me?” it was “What do I do?” because she just learned a friend was injured and wants to help her. Why are people inventing things that didn’t actually happen in the comic to get mad at Dorothy about?
people looking at a highly stigmatized personality disorder or mental illness
“okay, it didn’t work out so well the last six times, but maybe THIS one can be an intellectual way of saying ‘evil’?”
My kingdom for an upvote button. Thank you for saying this.
But if we keep trying it, we’re bound to get one that works eventually.
Maybe we could start by hypothesizing an Evil Syndrome and work our way backwards from there.
Calling it narcissistic is a bit much, it is a problem that she has so much of her self-worth tied up in being the friend who ‘fixes’ things, and I think the toll it is taking is primarily on herself. This is not so much ‘how do I make this about myself’ and more ‘if I can not do anything right now, am I failing as a friend? Am I failing the person I want to be?’.
Narcissism is “I’m the best ever in the history of everything, the closest thing to a god that has ever existed”, not “I need to feel like I’m doing something useful”.
It’s not really that either, it’s “I deserve to be treated like I’m the most important person in the room” — quite a few folks with NPD also struggle with self-loathing.
…it’s mostly*…
More to the point, these days it’s probably better to use “self-aggrandizing” or “self-centered” rather than “narcissist” now that the latter is becoming a better-understood diagnosis.
Since narcissistic has been co-opted as a medical term, we could take advantage of the richness and flexibility of the English language by pointing back to the foundational mythology with the term Narciss-like.
Maybe it’s just me, but when someone I care about is hurt or ill and there’s nothing I can do to help them at the moment, I try to do other stuff I need to get done and avoid spending all my time worrying about them. It’s not so much “continuing my day as if nothing is wrong”, more like not letting myself be consumed with worry when I can’t do anything anyway.
Sometimes people are young and have not learned all coping strategies yet.
Unforgivable. Be older NOW, damn it.
Give her maybe 30 seconds.
Yes, but Dorothy has a lot of her self-worth tied up in being the friend who cleans up the mess and ‘fixes’ things. Not being able to help feels like failing to her.
See, I think there’s a fairly major difference between “I’m going to continue about my day as if nothing is wrong.” and “I’m glad it’s been taken care of, that means that even though I’m worried I can do the other important things that I have to do.”
By the looks of things Sal has done all of that and Dina is sharing credit.
Mildly surprised that Amber wasn’t shot, it seemed implausible that she’d have escaped if she sustained those injuries in a brawl, but I guess it wouldn’t be the first time she’s done implausible things.
She barely escaped, considering that she was lying down grievously injured in the woods. But yeah, she does just also strain plausibulity sometimes.
Might have been less of an escape and more that the mystery assailant heard someone coming and booked it leaving time for AG to limp away and collapse before texting Sal.
I did not get the impression that Amber’s assailant was a mystery, considering that last we saw AG she was running off to fight a bunch of cops.
Do we know if Amber’s costume includes kevlar?
Because getting shot in kevlar can still mess you up bad.
I’m guessing you’re speculating on the possibility that she was shot and the bullet didn’t penetrate, leading to people mistakenly believing she wasn’t shot due to a lack of a bullet wound?
I’m not speaking from personal experience here, but… my understanding is that getting shot in kevlar doesn’t result in external bleeding (it stops the bullet but the force is transferred), unless the bullet actually passes through the kevlar.
For evidence of the blood, see https://www.dumbingofage.com/2025/comic/book-15/04-the-only-exception/enigmaticass/
Admittedly, it’s not impossible she was shot and her costume blocked it, but she was still hurt enough that a subsequent encounter with one of her earlier enemies ended in injury for her (and, to address to Thag’s objection, may have nonetheless won the fight after being injured), after which she staggered off and collapsed in the snow.
I went back and found https://www.dumbingofage.com/2024/comic/book-15/02-the-one-where-jocelyne-returns/sneakingback/ to check if there was any hint that Dorothy’s redesign of Amazi-Girl’s costume would give any hints as to whether it might contain Kevlar, but there doesn’t seem to me to be any indication either way.
Adrenaline is a hell of a drug.
More on that: I’ve read of people in duels continuing even after receiving fatal injuries. Struggling to find a good source right now, but https://thebooktrap.weebly.com/anthonys-blog/duelling-with-swords-the-reality includes the sentence “From the autopsies, it was clear that the first wound suffered by each man was the fatal injury. ” yet both had received at least four wounds in the course of the duel… and, apparently, one drove his sword into the other’s chest all the way to the hilt, yet it didn’t stop the latter stabbing the former in the heart through the shoulder.
Admittedly, that page lacks sources, but it fits with what I remember reading before… Looking further, I found https://defensescience.com/survival/what-really-happens-when-you-get-stabbed-or-cut/ — remember that the body has no need for a specific “off switch”, and as long as bodily processes can continue for the moment, death has not entirely occurred. In fact, considering known cases of animals fighting to the death to protect their young, there’s evolutionary benefit to being able to eke out a few more seconds even when mortally injured.
So… if someone can keep going a little longer when they should be dead, there should be nothing that strange about taking a gut injury, defeating or scaring off your opponent, and only then stopping to realise “oh dangit, I’m dying”.
That said, if this is what happened, whoever she ran into is quite possibly even worse off (maybe permanently so). If someone stabs you in the gut, you’re unlikely to get away unless you make very certain that your stabber won’t be doing any more stabbing.
There’s a reason “You should see the other guy” is a stock line.
Dear Dorothy, are you a reporter or not? Seeking to expose oppressive forms of government.
Remember kids, the highest award one can receive for journalism isn’t the Pulitzer, it’s getting murdered by the CIA. 😛
Most reporters in the US and other Western countries don’t do that these days. And the ones that do while working at major media companies tend to lose their jobs and sometimes their lives for doing so.
Oh damn, that would be a positive outlet for Dorothy. Doubt she’ll recognise it, but I’m gonna sit here and imagine a whole years worth of comics where that is what happens because that’s how I deal with not being able to help the characters
There’s not really a lot to expose here.
She could write up a piece about the protest, but it’s likely exposing any actual problems would get buried under the sensationalism of the campus superhero going rogue and attacking the police.
Quite. Start low key, like ask why the police would break up a peaceful protest.
NOT shot? Interesting. I wonder how she was wounded then? Enough to bleed anyway so a blade of some sort?
Very interesting indeed, because the police are not shooting people and shanking them now? Perhaps I’m crackpotting but we may soon learn that the police might now have been involved in her injury at all
one theory was that someone like the Incelerator or one of Ryan’s douche bros may have used the chaos of the protest to get some “payback” at Amazi-Girl in some fashion.
Until proven otherwise, I’m going to assume she was stabbed with a cell phone.
Blunt force can absolutely break skin.
experienced scooter accident about a month ago, can confirm T-T
Been in the SCA, fought heavy, it sure can.
Been fighting heavy for thirty years. There are places where blunt trauma doesn’t even bruise me anymore.
Just ask Sub-Zero.
Coulda been a shot from a rubber bullet. Those things pack a wallop and can do some serious damage without being considered the same as a gunshot.
Yeah, that sounds right. Hard to imagine her getting away if she took a grievous injury at baton range.
Dina seems like the exact wrong person to say “She was not shot,” though. Dina would probably correct people on the technicality of it being fired from a gun if it was a rubber bullet.
Or maybe they lied to Dina about it? Dunno, weird turn.
wouldn’t be surprised if a counter protester attacked her, plus plenty of injuries from batongs and shit (which will also break skin). or not shot but grazed by a bullet. Or having fallen (or been pushed) from a high surface.
In comes Mary, with a broken protest sign, and rage in her eyes!
Mary “Lumpjaw” Lastname
I believe you mean Mary “My Face Is A Butt” Bradford.
I was thinking more about Bongo, specifically. Something about Holly’s comment reminded me of it.
What do you do?
Have that uncomfortable conversation with Walky and let him know what’s going on with you and Joyce.
Forget that you ever heard about it, and maybe get her a nice meal delivered to her room to eat in privacy (and/or with Dina)
I know this isn’t the focus of today’s strip, but my eyes were drawn to the poll again today, and I want to point out how much the way things are framed changes dynamics.
The majority of us – at least those who responded to the poll fall in two main camps:
– 29% who aren’t too fussed about this plot line, attributing the errors in judgment to being young, which entails both horniness and inexperience/potentially poor judgment
– 24% who don’t like the cheating but aren’t condemning the characters forever
The second two largest groups, which are trailing by quite a lot, could roughly be associated with the two biggest groups:
– the 10% who say cheating is evil have something in common with the 24% in that both don’t like the cheating; one just finds it more permanently ethically damaging
– the 9% who say they don’t care because it’s a comic strip have a similar sort of chill vibe to the 29% who basically say, “hey they’re young let’s not get too worked up”
There’s a lot of interesting stuff about conflict dynamics and polarization observable in the comments the past few weeks – including how polls about complex topics can shift people toward a more polarized position. Sometimes people seem to take a more extreme/polarized stance out of humor, but then that gets lost over time, even to ourselves, and more easily to others who can’t tell it’s a “joke.”
172 people want “Jakey” to die. Like what the fuck is that about?
it’s really simple, I think Joe having his relationship ruined through no fault of his own is a really good and cool plot point actually.
Mind you, I really like Joe and i’m fully sympathetic to the fact that this is going to suck so so so much for him and I do absolutely think that Joyce is in the wrong to cheat on him and betray his trust but IMO I just never gelled with the idea that tying Joe’s ability to grow as a person with his ability to be a good boyfriend to Joyce was ever going to be the long term solution to the wider character arc he’s gone through, and now that he’s gotta directly confront those fears and hangups in such a direct and unpleasant way that is going to radically change him in a way that the current status quo wouldn’t have had.
I will fully cop that this is an unpopular opinion esp if you were more interested in seeing that journey for Joe be explored in a not-so nuclear way and maybe not even an accurate assessment for the other 2% who wanna kill jakey but that’s at least my reasoning for it.
This is a really good comment. I voted Jakey bc I have strong Paladin sympathies but at this point “I wish they’d done this the right way so I wouldn’t have to read about dudes every time this wlw relationship comes on screen” has superseded ”because I dislike cheating plotlines.” Also JoeJoyce veered into the actual territory that the original I hope jakey dies post was irritated with too much for my taste.
I actually like cheating plots so i think that’s probably were we differ lol, but thank you for the kind words!
I agree that seeing the same whataboutisms about Joe and Walky being said everytime Joyce and Dorothy are on screen together has been exhausting at best, but there’s only so much you can do when people are expressing their feelings and opinions on a story y’know?
This isn’t the first time the comments section has been in a tizzy over a major plotline and it probably won’t be the last, and i think taking steps to step away more often and be more thoughtful about sharing my opinions on this comic (even when it’s contradictory to majority consensus) has been helping to quell that peeved feeling lol.
I appreciate your recognition that people have a “right” to express themselves – I mean to the extent that 1) there is a comment section and 2) they aren’t violating the ToS here. It is on each of us to take responsibility for what we choose to read and engage with.
So to you, you’re not saying you want Joe to die, but for this aspect of his personality where he’s all about Joyce to die? Am I understanding correctly?
A bit, yeah! Very much how Dorothy choosing to go back into the protest signified the death of President Dorothy and Amazi-Girl signified the death of Amazi-Girl the Super Cop, Joe having to break up with Joyce (or at least having to heavily reevaluate his relationship with her) is the death of Joe as the proverbial “Jakey”, or at least that’s my take on it.
I am also fond of the “I hope Jakey dies” meme too lol
Are you telling me that Jakey wasn’t the name of the Joe/Walky ship?
*Amazi-Girl kneeing a cop in the face <– oop!
OK, I get it, although I initially was confused because I am not familiar with the meme and only have seen others’ explanations of it here (and don’t really want to look it up…I might like connecting with folks here but don’t want to go down a rabbit hole). The way others were explaining it, I thought it was more about a friend wanting their friend’s boyfriend to die because he’s annoying/getting in the way of their friendship.
It was the funniest poll option.
I don’t dislike Joe or Walky at all, but I am incredibly resistant to the idea that Joe “deserves” a relationship with Joyce as some sort of reward for cleaning up his act. I want to see where his character arc goes when he’s put in the work and DOESN’T get the girl. I want to see what he does when Joyce falls off the pedestal he’s put her on by doing something thoughtless and shitty, except this time it’s something she’s done to him and not to Jacob and it’s harder to write it off as “well she’s trying”.
I am equally lukewarm on the latest iteration of Dorothy/Walky, which lacks a lot of the spark that they had back before they broke up. I don’t get the idea that there’s a lot of passion between them any longer, but that they have fallen together into something that is comfortable. What I want most for Walky is to see him make a decision about the trajectory of his life, because he has thus far path-of-least-resistenced himself into three relationships that have not done numbers for his personal growth. I want to put the guy in a terrarium by himself and examine him for a while.
The third wolf in me has been shipping Joyce/Dorothy for like ten years. I have truncated this all down into “I hope Jakey dies”.
Real !!!
I don’t recall seeing anyone saying anything about Joe “deserving” a relationship with Joyce, but maybe that’s because I tend to interpret comments as though the commenter has good intentions, if such an interpretation is in any way plausible; that whole idea of someone (usually a girl, for some reason) having a romantic obligation to someone (usually a boy, for equally mysterious reasons) for something that all too often amounts to basic decency… well, I don’t find that tends to be compatible with charitable readings of a comment.
Anyway… I liked Joyce and Joe together because they were nice together and seemed good for each other. Joyce and Dorothy is more ambiguous right now… both of them have issues to work through, but then, maybe they’ll figure out how not to be terrible and end up also being good for each other.
The possibility of Joyce never managing to let go of either Joe or Dorothy and ending up in a poly disaster might ultimately be the best option for all of them (in character development terms) but would probably take a book’s worth of strips to sort out that mess.
For some of us, of course, that’s the primary appeal.
As to Dorothy+Walky… remember how, back when the cheating started and people were arguing over how it would affect Joyce+Joe and how much or how little Joyce and Dorothy should think about that between kisses or whatever? And Walky seemed like an afterthought? Yes, pretty sure you’re far from the only one who didn’t find their relationship particularly interesting, at least for its own sake. I know I personally liked their interactions, but — aside from their intimate activities sometimes being necessary context — they could’ve just as well have been simply friends.
As to your final paragraph: likewise. I might not be fond of how their relationship is currently going, and Dorothy’s recent mental state has soured it a bit too… but these don’t need to be permanent issues.
In fact, on further reflection: most of what I like about Joyce+Joe could also exist with someoneelse+Joe. Most of what I like about Dorothy+Walky could work just fine with them simply as friends. What I like about Joyce+Dorothy, though? Not sure we can find that with anyone else.
TBF I don’t think that anyone has been saying that Joe “deserves” Joyce as an award, but you hit the head on the whole “guy character’s emotional journey is complemented with a [wholesome] relationship with a girl” thing. It’s so common in the wider sphere of media that seeing it be subverted here is really refreshing.
Really like seeing your other thoughts as well, ultimately I think it’s a testament that all these characters and relationship dynamics are well written enough that there’s so much flexibility on how this can all turn out.
I appreciate your thoughts about charitable readings.
I don’t recall seeing anyone saying anything about Joe “deserving” a relationship with Joyce, but maybe that’s because I tend to interpret comments as though the commenter has good intentions, if such an interpretation is in any way plausible; that whole idea of someone (usually a girl, for some reason) having a romantic obligation to someone (usually a boy, for equally mysterious reasons) for something that all too often amounts to basic decency… well, I don’t find that tends to be compatible with charitable readings of a comment.
I don’t think anyone was saying it directly, and I certainly don’t think anyone was saying it on purpose. As you acknowledge, it’s such an odious thing to say! Very basic misogyny! When you put it in those terms, it’s so obviously bad, and most people don’t believe obviously bad things.
(Long pause while I stare into the middle distance and think about the current crop of conservative personalities, saying shit like “empathy is a sin” with their whole chests.)
…..anyway.
No one was saying that, but people were sometimes saying — variants. Versions that kind of circle around to being that basic sentiment once you follow them through to their logical conclusion.
There was a lot of “Joe’s worked so hard, he doesn’t deserve this” — and a distinct lack of the same sentiment for Walky, even though no one really “deserves” to be cheated on.
A lot of: “Joe’s come so far from the misogynist he used to be, he doesn’t deserve to have his first serious relationship end with him being cheated on.”
And I want to stress, I don’t think anyone saying this was consciously thinking, “What Joe deserves is the opposite, for Joyce to stay with him and be faithful.” I would bet that at least 99% of the people saying it, if they were asked, would argue that there’s a lot of gray area between those two opposites!
Even folks who would agree that Joe deserves a faithful girlfriend who loves him would argue that they’re not saying he should be awarded a woman as a prize, and they’re definitely not saying he should specifically have gotten to “keep” Joyce, just that he deserves nice things (generally), and that he didn’t deserve to be betrayed, and that Joyce should have broken up with him before she kissed Dorothy…
…and all of that is very reasonable, but I do think that there’s a part of all of us, programmed into us by society, that does kind of view “a faithful girlfriend who loves him” as a nice thing to which good heterosexual male characters are in fact kind of entitled.
And we react with confusion and sometimes anger when that narrative contract is broken.
Lindsay Ellis even mentions it, casually, in her video about Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2, when she notes that there’s “a reason” why Quinn didn’t “get the girl” in that movie. (The reason is that Quinn hasn’t yet completed work on himself and doesn’t yet deserve that particular reward.)
Again: not saying everyone who has complained about Joe not “deserving” this means that he should have been given the opposite by the narrative, and indeed I would venture to guess that that’s not a conscious part of anyone’s mental math.
But if you go back like two months, to before it became unarguable that Joyce returned Dorothy’s feelings, you’ll see a kind of interesting thread in conversations over how there was no way Willis would do that to Joe, because it would inevitably derail or ruin Joe’s character arc.
And I think that thread spoke to the underlying, unconscious assumption that Joe was going to “get the girl” because he deserved her more than Dorothy did. And I think there is a lingering thread now of betrayal from some of the readers that Willis subverted that particular expectation: manifesting occasionally in very specific complaints about how the writing is bad now, or Joyce’s characterization doesn’t make sense.
Pretty much all of this.
I am generally inclined to take charitable readings of comments, but I am also intensely sensitive to undercurrents of misogyny. I don’t believe that people intend to say to the letter “Joyce is a prize that Joe deserves”, but there has certainly been a noxious tone to some of the bemoaning of Joe’s plight and how this was going to rip all of his character development into shreds and how he deserved – maybe not saying Joyce outright, but deserved SOMETHING for all of his hard work.
And again, to be clear, I like Joe and I do feel for him. I don’t think he deserves to be cheated on, but I also don’t think he is entitled to anything for bettering himself. You should seek to better yourself for the sake of bettering yourself, and not because you will be cosmically rewarded for your efforts.
yes !!! big fucking cosign on my end as well
yep I defs concur to all dat
Joyce shouldn’t be seen as some object Joe is entitled to for his improvement — besides the latent and ironically misogynist undertones of that sentiment, it’s such a narrow way of looking at the meaning of his becoming a better person for his own sake
like he’s formed a great friendship with Dina, have we really forgotten that???
+200
I think this may be where “it’s fiction” applies. Narrative logic is a thing and doesn’t always (and doesn’t need to) follow what’s right in the real world.
That’s especially true in the Lindsay Ellis bit. That’s not a moral judgement about men needing to be rewarded with the prize of a woman, but a statement about narrative arcs. That’s just how romance plot arcs work – and they work the same way even in non hetero romances. You don’t go to “happily ever after” in the middle of the arc. (Caveats apply of course, there are countless variations, but the basic arc is there).
It’s not quite the same here, especially because this is serial literature, not a single story, so it’s normal to reach a temporary resolution of an arc and then disrupt it for another arc in a later story. My objection to this in terms of JoJo and why it feels off it me is not that Joe didn’t complete his arc and get his proper reward, but that their arc feels like it ran headlong into another one and for me at least, that’s where the sense the “narrative contract is broken” came from. JoJo didn’t need to be endgame and Joe didn’t need to get his “reward”, but I felt like JoJo needed to run its course.
And my feeling was strengthened by finding that Willis changed plans in the middle of this arc.
Now, none of this is quite what you’re talking about, but I think it’s easily mistaken for it at a glance
Okay. But I was just attempting to explain why no one needed to literally be saying “Joe deserved Joyce” for that to still be a vibe in the comment section.
Also, narratives that treat romantic love as a reward for character growth aren’t above criticism. It’s boring, for one thing, and contributes to female characters being more often object than subject in stories.
Wait, wait, is “Jakey” a shipping of two characters? Like how people might refer to “Ruthifer” or “Joycerothy” or something?
So… is it Joe and Walky? Or… Jacob and Walky?
Like literally, I’ve searched the comments section of several of these and didn’t find any clear answer.
TL;DR It’s an old Tumblr meme about hating on normie cishet boyfriends used colloquially to mock the lionizing of said normie cishet boyfriends
I’ve seen a few different interpretations now that I can’t even relate to each other, and I think some people chose it to be random without even understanding it. Something about everything being about a girl’s boyfriend? Her being too dependent on him or too cute with him? Him being too basic? Then there’s the other commenter here who seems to have a totally different take on it.
I chose body horror for the memes.
If I can’t call for a fictional character to have their mouth replaced with a need to scream, is it even a real poll?
Finally, somebody who gets it!!
Dress up as Amazi-Girl and be seen publically to confuse any attempts to identify AG’s secret identity.
No, but depending on where Sal hid Amber’s paraphernalia, and how eager Billie is to get the scoop on Amazi-Girl before Dorothy, we might be seeing a different kind of “reveal.”
Billie discovers Amazi-Girl’s outfit in Sal’s room. “Aha!”
Sal: “For the last time, Jennifer. Amazi-Girl is white. Ah am not white.”
Jennifer: “That’s just your secret identity. You become Amazi-Girl when you transform.”
Sal: “What kind of Sailor Moon bullshit… you do understand that ah don’t have super powers? That super powers aren’t real?”
Jennifer: “You’d LIKE me to believe that, wouldn’t you?! The truth comes out!”
Superpowers are absolutely real in the Dumbiverse. There’s Joyce’s teleport-to-Dorothy, Sal’s wall-crawling, Dina’s invisibility, behind-door-portaling, and teleport-to-incorrect-dinosaur-information, the Dina-Charlie gestalt ability to teleport anywhere, Billie’s Most Common Superpower, Carla’s ability to wear roller skates all the time without breaking her neck on the stairs…
They”re like Roger Rabbit’s, though… they only work when it’s funny.
I am very concerned about a storyline that involves the cops going after Sal.
Dorothy casually made a new Amazi-Girl costume in about five minutes.
By modifying the existing one in small ways. It’s not like she fabricated a new one out of thin air.
You mean she cheated? How dare she.
…did you see the two costumes?
You break up with your boyfriend.
“Calm the fuck down.” That’s what you do.
One DOA alt text lives rent-free in my brain: “Amber’s issues have issues.” I even found the link, haha: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-4/01-the-only-dope-for-me-is-you/coercing/
So, quoting that: Dorothy’s issues have issues.
*popcorn*
Dorothy’s issues have an entire section in a multi-floored Barnes and Noble
Lol. I kinda slept past when this comic updates. Don’t trust not being needed!
Don’t worry, Dorothy doesn’t.
(If people don’t need her, what is she even for? Why would they want her around?)
This whole plotline, the exchange from Bo Burnham’s “How the World Works” has been on loop in my head. “What can I do to help?” “I don’t know read a book or something!” […] “I’m just trying to become a better person.” “Why do you rich fucking white people always insist on seeing everything through the myopic lens of your own self-actualization? This isn’t about you! So either get with it, or get out of the way!”
That’s a good song.
Allow me to take a moment to respond to the reddit thread complaining about the main site comments complaining about reddit comments complaining about the comic.
Butts.
Thank you, that is all.
(please note, in case it is not obvious, that this is not in any way meant seriously)
“Allow me to take a moment to respond to the reddit thread”, now that’s a dangerous way to start a sentence. Whatever the dweebs are bawling about this time, they should go buy another Funko Pop about it. I’m sure there’s a new color of Batman coming out soon for them to preorder.
I really enjoyed reading today’s strip. I did not enjoy reading the comments. We KNOW Dorothy has flaws. Who doesn’t?
And why are people inventing new flaws she doesn’t have to complain about?
They know everyone’s tired of arguing with them about the existing flaws, and they need their fix?
If only Dorothy was considerate enough to keep developing new flaws, we wouldn’t have this problem.
You go to Walky and tell the truth.
“Walky, I’m sorry. I’ve been making out with Joyce behind your back.”
“You made me pause my cartoon for this?”
“Frankly that’s the least gay shit you two have done and the rest was in front of me”
“You told me you thought she was hot while we were fucking. I knew this before you did.”
Hm. It almost seems like Amazi-Girl needs someone who can deflect attention from her secret identity. Perhaps someone of similar proportions, who has experience with sewing an Amazi-Girl costume, and is filled with enough beans in the moment to set a plan in motion before Amber wakes up and can be seen in public.
If only Amazi-Girl had a blonde bisexual Alfred.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nFq4n_8RoM
Was Alan Napier bisexual? While I admittedly have not looked long, I could not find any evidence suggesting so.
Not as far as I know. I was specifically referring to Dorothy. Then again, with that era of Hollywood and television, would we even know? Napier reportedly said his autobiography wasn’t published because “I haven’t committed a major crime and I’m not known to have slept with any famous actresses.” He didn’t say anything about actors.
I was gonna joke that what Dorothy can do is find someone who needs help, but that’s how you end up becoming Amazigirl.
You go to therapy, dotty.
Does, omits, et cetera
Setting up a pillow fort here for other people who are also in the “Dorothy has plenty of flaws, but like the rest of the main characters, she means well and does in fact like and care about her friends” camp, I suspect that’s most of us — even most of us who dislike her!
Ooh, pillow fort.
There’s soda! And like, juice. I like Naked juice so lots of flavors of that in a cooler.
Also water! Of course. 🙂
Happy to join for this treats, I brought pringles and some cokes
For me Dorothy’s gone from good to great with this arc, I feel so much more invested in where she’s going
Nice!
I am seriously also welcoming folks in who don’t like her but don’t think she’s the strip’s villain.
I totally get finding her boring or bland or annoying! Much as I see her as a compelling sad wet cat of a woman, there are plenty of very reasonable negative takes and I think we can break bread together.
Or maybe in the spirit of pillow forts I should break out the childhood snacks. Gushers and Fruit by the Foot are lunch box desserts I remember fondly.
And we appreciate your welcome. There are DOZENS of us.
<3
Do you have the green Naked juice, so I can feel like I’m having something healthy and responsible even though it has enough sugar to kill a toddler?
Obviously. 🙂
I love this place, I’ve brought some strings of fairy lights for ambiance and Cheetos.
Heck yeah!!!
Oh snap, is there any room left in here? Stepping outside feels like hopping into the Warp without a Geller Field right now. (Warhammer 40k reference, for those who don’t get it.)
Plenty of room! 🙂 It’s a big pillow fort.
Sweet. Does anyone else drink Arizona Green Tea? I brought enough to feed an army.
I’m not much of a sweet tea person but Arizona Tea does it right.
I also have access to Jaffa Cakes in bulk. I guess I could be persuaded to share.
My position is that she’s a good person at heart and cares about her friends but is expressing that in an unhealthy way that dovetails into her avoidant tendencies.
Sounds reasonable to me!
That need to care more about others needs and on top of things and always be the best version of yourself 24/7 even when it’s obviously stretching yourself thin and ruining your life in disastrous ways that you know you should deal with but the impulse is to brute force yourself into overcoming it instead of actually stopping is too real for me to ever hate Dorothy. Anyways i brought cookies and nail polish for anyone who wants to do at-home manicures ✨💅
Here’s someone who gets it.
Nice nice 🙂
I need that thanks.
Heh, you’re welcome. It looks exhausting out there.
Dorothy is literally on Day 2 of her unplanned affair, having tried to confess her failing to Walky on Day 1. The hatefest and lack of grace extended to her feels more like trauma projection than anything else.
I do think there’s some of that. And I’m not making assumptions — some of the most vocally distressed folks in the comments have said they have trauma around cheating.
Me: oh, the comments will be full of people maybe realising that white girls with boyfriends kissing is a drop in the bucket compared to the actual greater stakes of the protest events yesterday
The comments: why is amber being gravely injured while ensuring the safety of protestors being used as a DISTRACTION from Dorothy’s moral duty to crush Wally so that she can live honestly???
Also the comments: once again, Dorothy makes everything about her. So self-centred, unlike me who can let go of my moral agenda for a moment to understand that the cheating plotline is peanuts compared to the wider ramifications of an anti-war protest in the midst of a police state.
Also me though: gee I really wish the protest hadn’t been inserted at all because it already takes forever for this messy webcomic to get through more mundane plots, much less a plot that has been going on in the real world for the last 60-70 years that makes me feel helpless and distraught at the impotency of individual actions.
Me: Hehe, Dina.
It’s really a question of audience and focus — the strip is ABOUT the college kids being dumb, not about the real-world political implications of the campus protest that’s fundamentally being used as a backdrop rather than a major thread here.
In other words, mostly, I agree with your last paragraph here as it functions as an adequate explanation of why most of us are happy to put the entire protest (and related comment blow-up) in the rear view mirror as fast as possible.
Wow, the Dorothy-hate is strong tonight. She might deserve it for cheating on Walky, and the fact that she still hasn’t told him yet. However I think there is clearly conflict going on within Dorothy because of this; not that she is trying to make it about herself, but she feels like she’s failed Amber/Amazi-Girl by not being there to help, or take care of her afterwards.
Is Dorothy more worried about how she could have helped Amber/Amazi-Girl rather than whether they are ok? A little bit, but more so she is feeling like she failed someone she cares about. I imagine this is more self-shame than anything else. Dorothy doesn’t like to fail; whether that be academically, professionally, socially, and personally. I have no doubt she cares about Amber/Amazi-Girl even if right now she’s hung up on her own self-worth at the moment.
So everyone take a deep breath, and learn to disagree without making it toxic.
I think it’s a mixture of both. Dorothy genuinely IS kind and thoughtful and looks out for other people. She’s sort of built up her self-identity as being the organizer and the carer of others, she who keeps people safe and functioning, so to speak. So she’s now confronted with a situation where normally SHE would be the one to have done all this, only to realize people went ahead and did it without her. So she’s having the usual “But then what am I even for??” moment of self-doubt, even though she is genuinely worried for AG/Amber.
I agree. I also think this comic doesn’t really have thought bubbles and she’s saying this almost to herself. I don’t think her intent is for Dina to hear it. It’s more like her internal knee-jerk reaction which I can have more grace for.
Equally, I think people being holier than thou about it either have already developed better coping strategies (like letting it be and not hovering) or are like me the mom friend who is actually relieved when stuff is sorted. Like I personally don’t want to have to do anything, I just feel compelled to step in a lot. But that doesn’t make me better than a Dorothy that probably just means I’m lazier or something. I’d probably be more inclined to hover in this moment because just buggering off would just feel wrong even if there’s nothing for me to do. I probably couldn’t just go on with my day if my friend was hurt.
I don’t hate Dorothy and the POINT is dumb decisions when young.
But I also would love to get on with it.
I don’t hate Dorothy but am annoyed that the train of thought that she exhibiting now is the same train of thought that lead her to stay in the protest for so long causing Amber to jump into a mob of cops just to save her in the first place.
To be fair, as people argued at length yesterday, while Dorothy did provide one more person to rescue (well 2, since Joyce came back in for her), Amazi-Girl also rescued others, starting with Asma if the bonus strip is to be believed and went back in after DoJo was out and safe. Dorothy is at least not the only reason AG got hurt there. Maybe, with a couple people less to worry about, she could have gotten everyone else out without injury, but that seems a stretch.
Wait, “disagree without making it toxic”? Is that allowed on the internet?
I asked the science department about it, and while they say it is unlikely, the numbers indicate it is possible… additional tests may be needed to verify.
In tomorrow’s strip, Dina reassures Dorothy that they will call her if they need her and that she is nice for checking in. Dorothy will promptly spiral in the shower within 5 minutes of that interaction.
…… yeah, this tracks.
She can self-medicate by tripling down on solving all of Joyce’s problems for her. There’s no way that can backfire!
First, she can break up with Joe for Joyce. That’ll help everyone.
Ugh now there is a horrific thought. Can’t imagine how you are supposed to process that when hearing it from the person who your partner cheated on you with. Even them being present for moral support would feel like a slap in the face.
I really do hope it’s Joe who ends up doing the dumping. My man really deserves to keep his dignity.
I feel for Dorothy here. It’s hard to be a mom friend hearing that one of your friends is in a bad spot but there’s no tasks left for you to do. It means you still have all the worry but nowhere to exercise it by helping so you just feel helpless.
Thankfully, just being there and going ‘let me know if you want/need anything’ and offering extra strength Tylenol can be lots in that situation.
The reasonable response from her would have been something like “how can I help”, not “you don’t need me to fix it for you? :(“
Good thing that wasn’t her response then.
Dorothy decides she has to track down the mob doctor like Batman!
Possibly passing Amber in the hall.
All to avoid talking with Walky.
As usual your hyperfocusing brain is a mess, Dorothy
I reiterate:
Not everything is about you, Dorothy.
Break up with your boyfriend, and have hot lesbian sex with Joyce, thats what you do
I think a lot of folks would be more charitable to Dorothy’s concern about Amber in last comic and this one if it wasn’t also increasingly seeming like her underlying motivation in all of this (conscious or not) is “put off talking to Walky, the one thing here that only she can do, as long as possible”.
she was very quick to just agree to Joyce’s idea to put it off until the morning, and there was no actual reason for her to pop in on Amber to see if she saw anything if she was just gonna go talk to Walky after her shower anyway. She’s being avoidant.
Its a really mild reading of the situation I don’t know why people are acting like you have to hate Dorothy to reach that conclusion.
My thought was *also* along the lines of ‘Dorothy I get it, but this ain’t about you, girl.’
Even with that the uncharitable readings are ridiculous.
She’s not the only one who can talk to Walky. I’m pretty sure Ruth’s offer to dump Dorothy’s boyfriend for her is still open.
You go tell Walky is what you do
Also, as a top-level aside, on “narcissism”.
I’m sympathetic to people using the term since the colloquial use of “narcissist” to describe “destructively self-centered/self-aggrandizing” has been around centuries longer than the formal diagnosis of NPD.
That said, now that it IS a diagnosis, I highly recommend being clear about whether you’re being colloquial or psychiatric, or better yet just using “abusively self-centered” etc. At least two folks in this comment section have a friend who’s struggling with the clinical diagnosis, and it (to be blunt) doesn’t always look like the colloquial abusive narcissist.
glad you said this
last time I mentioned the clinical diagnosis vs “abusive self centred” thing online (NOT HERE, to be clear) and said that maybe we shouldn’t be demonising mental illness people decided I was a “covert narcissist” and also a demon
kind of sucks!
Online narcissist discourse is an actual plague and evidence of much of the ills of modern society. It goes right in there with myers-briggs, PUA as a lifestyle, and religious fervor over one or another self-help guru.
There is an entire industry of unscrupulous or outright fake therapists/psychologists monetising your distaste over an ex or a difficult parent under the pretense of “narcissist awareness”.
Dorothy needs to learn two things here:
1. Sometimes, the most helpful and useful thing you can do is to stay out of the way of the people who are doing whatever needs to be done.
2. If something important needs to be done, it’s more important that it gets done (well) than it is that you are personally the one who does it.
It is her crippling flaw to the end that Dorothy does this. Frankly, as a workaholic, I do not like how much I relate.
read the room, dorothy, it’s quiet time
for real though I do know how a friend getting hurt and not being able to help eats at a person
even if your self-worth isn’t tied up in helping others (there are worse things to have one’s self-worth tied up in, it must be said) it sucks donkey dick like a vastly out of control vacuum in a stable
If “amazigirl” wasn’t shot what did I buy this cake that says “WE GOT HER” for?
I mean, do you need a reason to have some delicious cake? I say enjoy it, even if the event it was made for didn’t pan out… and pass me a slice where you’re at it.
I’m just eating it with a spoon straight from the tray, like I’m Tina Fey on SNL.
“What you will do is talk to your boyfriend before you continue with your girlfriend.”
“Does EVERYone know about that?!”
“Yes. And please keep your voice down. As I said, Amber is sleeping.”
If Dorothy goes to Walky and leads with Ambers injury, both Joe and Walky will be busy for a while. Joe would prioritize his new sister and Walky would remember who committed a felony for him.
Btw, amber is badly injured and no one talked to her new step brother, who they all know. Looks like a plot hole that Dorothy can fill.
Stop procrastinating and go talk to your boyfriend?
What Dorothy can do?
– Do a flip.
– Do a cheese cake.
– Go talk with Walky
– Do a barrel roll
I want her to talk with Walky, but I’d be fascinated to see her do a barrel roll. Tough choice.
Somewhere on campus, theres got to be a box of macaroni and cheese that needs makin’.
Have at it, Dorothy
Clearly this the time for an all-advised costumed misdirection attempt.
I dunno, the old old cheating memes were pretty up front on the whole ‘betrayal is bad’ part. I mean, Tristan was supposed to deliver Isolde to King Mark WITHOUT SAMPLING. Arthur needed to be able to trust Lance with everything, not just his wife. (Of course, both of those involved arranged marriages – does that make a difference?) Helen’s face launched a thousand ships. (Hopefully she had good dental.)
Those old tales were less about hurt feelings and more about lost honor, but the appeal was the same; people did what they weren’t supposed to, as people do, and everyone knows the feeling. It makes for good story telling.
Also, about Dorothy doing a barrel roll, please remember the wise seagull:
“Let’s start with level flight.”
“We don’t tackle flying through rock until a little later in the programme.”
arranged marriages make a difference, yeah
there’s a cultural context there that’s not particularly nice and while cheating is still, y’know, kinda shit it doesn’t typically have the same potentially quite dire consequences – an interpersonal matter rather than one of “the realm”
Dorothy this ain’t about you
Yeah, Dorothy, fuck you for giving a shit about your hurt friend! That just makes you an asshole!
Your reply brings to mind the meme about “I like pancakes” / “OH so you hate waffles???” / “No b*tch that’s a whole other sentence”
You know what?! Now Dorothy IS making it all about herself and that’s fucking awesome m she should do it more, nothing matter but her now.
I actually hate Dorothy and I cannot think one of character, real or fictional who is worse than her. I think if I had a gun with two bullets and it was between Dorothy and Voldemort I would shoot Dorothy both times.
I think Dorothy should allowed to murder anyone she wants at any time and been given an million dolars for each one
Go get some extra strength Tylenol at the drug store?
Interesting to me this morning:
Willis has called Dorothy and Amazi-Girl’s relationship a little bit Superman/Lois Lane, and I’ve been wondering for a while now whether there was any chance Amazi-Girl actually felt that way about Dorothy, or if it’s just a one-sided crush.
That she texted Sal when she needed help instead kind of seemed like a “no” to me, on top of her mildly baffled “surprisingly okay with the skirt” reaction to Dorothy’s “help” finishing her new costume…
…but. According to the tags, that wasn’t Amazi-Girl: that was all Amber, who’s a.) probably more aware of the tropey value of a superhero reaching out to their “nemesis” for help, and b.) maaaybe reluctant to talk to Dorothy right now anyway, given Booster’s analysis of her reasons for “helping” Dorothy take and send a lewd to Joyce…
So. Question still open, for the moment. 👀
It’s really incredible how much more enthusiastic I am about Dorothy/Amazi-Girl than I am Dorothy/Joyce like the way my eyes lit up
Dorothy is like Sauron after the destruction of the One Ring, a powerless spirit left to wander reality without the ability to affect anything or anyone.
Which is why she should go tell Walky.
By the way, did Sauron go back to Iluvatar after the destruction of the Ring?
No. Or at least not until the end when the world is unmade.
As Gandalf described what would happen at the Council of Elrond:
“If it is destroyed, then he will fall; and his fall will be so low that none can foresee his arising ever again. For he will lose the best part of the strength that was native to him in his beginning, and all that was made or begun with that power will crumble, and he will be maimed for ever, becoming a mere spirit of malice that gnaws itself in the shadows, but cannot again grow or take shape. And so a great evil of this world will be removed.”
After looking at this strip a half dozen times, it suddenly clicks what looks strange about Dina. She isn’t whiling away the time on a laptop while her friend rests up. She is using her iphone and doing her best not to look away for any length of time. Not Dina behavior, but from old experience it totally looks like a duty officer during a security alert.
Or maybe playing Angry Birds.
Yeah, it’s weird to see a teenager glued to her phone.
O wanted to make a boomer joke about phones and avocado yoast bit i couldn’t come up with anything funny.
LOL The funny part is our phones couldn’t leave the house and you never got a taste of avocado without being within 100 miles of the southern border. 🙂
Sorry. Grandparent genes kicking in.
Nothing. You can do nothing at all.
couldn’t even last
a year