Joyce has been homeschooled her entire life until now, when she's suddenly a freshman in college! Things don't go well.
All Known Alternatives
Karolina 'Kajotko' Jankiewicz
Akane has only one way to get back home: collect the 42 keys to parallel worlds. Eri and Ben are just trying to get through the summer before university. When a magical key turns up in an old spare set, all three are forced to change their plans and fast.
Guilded Age
T Campbell, John Waltrip, Florence Machina
Welcome to the saga of the working-class adventurer! Enjoy the complete story with new annotations daily!
Hemlock
Josceline Fenton
A witch accidentally marries a monster, and now she and her familiar has to navigate life around her monstrous husband and her even more terrifying in-laws.
No End
Erli, Kromi
A queer romance about people attempting to build lives in a cold, post-apocalyptic world ravaged by hordes of undead.
Cyanide & Happiness
Explosm
Satire, dark humor and surreal humor.
Paint the Town Red
Windy, Winter Jay Kiakas
Winona runs a werewolf shelter with partner in crime, Odile in the Gothic city of Merlot. One day they take in an injured vampire, and soon unravels many of the dark secrets of Merlot.
BOOKMARK Click "Tag Page" to bookmark a page. When you return to the site, click "Goto Tag" to continue where you left off.
BUFFER WATCH
Comics are currently drawn and uploaded through:
Her eyes have become jellyfish and are naturally climbing towards the daylight so that they can drop upon unsuspecting fish. Actually not unlike her job as an overactive RA.
(Obama had one light-skinned parent and one dark-skinned parent. Calling him “black” is a symptom of our culture’s weird attitudes toward skin-tone-genetics. In a sane culture, there wouldn’t even be a word for Obama’s skin-tone-genetics except maybe “brown” or “tan.” In a differently insane culture, we’d still be calling him “mulatto” and we’d also be using words like “octaroon” as though they were meaningful.
Imagine, if you can, a culture so sane that we didn’t need words like “gay” and “bi” and “straight” but just said “Do you think s/he’d be into me?” It’s not like “bi” people are into every human being on the planet!)
Except you can’t disregard race as a social construct that is very real in reality. It has no scientific basis whatsoever, and is entirely socially constructed. That doesn’t make it any less real for Black people. Obama is Black. Unless you can actually pass for white, if your Black and White mixed race or whatever, your still Black. Also, Black people come in all shades no matter their heritage. My father and uncle are full brothers with no European in their genetics that they know of and my father is super dark, and my uncle is lighter skinned than I am – and my mother is German/Dutch.
Because race isn’t an actual scientific category, you can’t just say someone who has lived the experiences of a Black person not Black because they have a non-black parent.
yeah, sometimes labels are used for oppression and other bad stuff. but i am pretty grateful for labels that help me to explore who i am and express that in a way that other people can easily understand. just like i wouldn’t say “that small hairy thing in my house with a long tail and triangle ears that prefers to eat fish” instead of saying “my cat.” maybe there is some perfect world that doesn’t need labels like “genderfluid” or “cat” but i can only imagine a world in which choosing the label “genderfluid” and “pansexual” doesn’t lead to oppression rather than a world without labels.
The best explanation I’ve seen is one that is clear to anyone who has ever been around a cat: ‘There’s a big difference between putting yourself in a box and getting put in a box by someone else.’
Yeah, um, don’t do that. Sexuality and race are not analogous things and every time (inevitably) white queer people try to draw these parallels, we end up stepping in some bad shit. Both race and sexual orientation are constructs, sure, but that doesn’t mean that they don’t have real consequences and impacts. And they’re not the SAME consequences and they don’t function in the same way.
Sorry if I miscommunicated. I wasn’t saying that sexuality and race are analogous. It’s clear that they’re not – race is often visually apparent, and sexuality often isn’t; the patterns culture associated with each are very different; the patterns of oppression associated with each are also very different.
I was saying that calling Obama “black” highlights the construct nature of race-labels… and I was jumping from there to asserting that our sexuality-labels are also constructed, and that not having them might be a symptom of a society that’s saner about sexuality.
I’m actually white, straight, probably Aspie, and a member of two other stigmatized minorities that don’t show unless I talk about them.
Imagine how different society would be if sexuality were as un-charged as singing? Some people like to sing, some don’t, and unless you’re looking for people to sing with, it just isn’t very important.
Altalemur is glad that labels exist to help ver explore who ve is. Sure, in the current society, that’s incredibly useful; there aren’t enough examples of non-straight sexuality.
And maybe labels for sexuality would be useful in any society. But imagine if children had to decide, early in the process of exploring their creativity, whether they were or were not a “singer.” I’d think it would be better for children to grow up around singers, and decide for themselves how much, where, and how they wanted to sing.
So, I agree, race and sexuality are not analogous social constructs. But American society has a number of insanities about race, and also has a number of (different) insanities about sexuality. I think it’s useful to imagine a society that is sane about both – a society where the labels have so little charge, and so little utility, that “gay” is like “singer” and your skin tone is mainly of interest to your fashion consultant.
Is it too much to hope for that the Sexy Lesbian Suicide Pact(tm) someday develops into a healthy relationship that is neither dangerously codependent nor mutually self-destructive?
Please?
Someone give these kids the happy ending they need.
My suspicion is that Ruth has got some internalized biphobia in addition to her absolute lack of self-esteem and assumes Billie will leave her for a man eventually, so she may as well try and force the issue now and get it over with. But that’s not how being bi works, even if her depression gets jealous of the men Billie dated and has historically made a public show of being attracted to (after all Billie has often been dismissive of her romantic connections with women, which might be another element that was too frustrating to continue for Alice).
I think biphobia is pushing it too far. Ruth is worried that their relationships that will be too much for Billy and she’ll want a more “normal” relationship. And what better way to emphasize that than to point out she can have what some people would consider “normal:” a hot guy and a straight relationship.
Yeah, that’s part of the internalized biphobia, at least in my view. She doesn’t view her and her partners affections for women and each other as being as “normal” or as “desirable” than something easier. And she also feels it is inevitable that she will “switch” back at some point.
And a lot of that is really just her depression trying to sabotage her. I mean, what better way to get your host to doubt their happiness than by playing to social messages about how the world would view their type of affection and its potential future and playing to insecurities about how your partner doesn’t really love you but is just filling out time before they go off with someone “easier”.
Ruth does keep accusing Billie of wanting to be with men instead of with Ruth. but Billie is the first person who brought that up, back when talking about Joyce’s party. yeah, she did it in an off-handed way, but it put the idea in Ruth’s head that in reality, Billie still wants to go get jack-hammered by studly guys at college parties. so it’s probably part self-worth problems for Ruth, and part biphobia. (is Ruth bi? or just Billie?) i can say that as a queer person living in the Midwest who is interested in the ladies, 90% of the bi women my age are in long-term relationships with men and are looking for casual sex with women (and no, they are not looking to start poly-anything). having long term romance between two women is just “not something people do” in my area, unfortunately. so my entire community runs on a very biphobic standard of romance.
Ruth is bi – canon by word of god.
Willies revealed this in an It’s Walky strip (sexual orientations remain the same across ‘verses) and while the comic originally seemed to apply only to Billie, the reveal of Danny being bi in the Dumbiverse disclosed that all characters in that picture are bi.
More of a pet peeve than any real anger, but it’s annoying that so many people need “proof” that a character is bi; that unless a character has had the exact same amount of attraction or relationships with at least one character of the same and opposite sex, then they must not actually be bi.
We don’t ever need to see Ruth bang a dude before we can settle for certain that she’s actually bi.
There’s also the fact that Ruth was apparently unaware she could be attracted to women until Billie came along, so her discovery of that is tied into her, shall we say, complicated feelings about Billie (kissing the drunk driver and all that). I don’t know if that counts as internalized biphobia or not, but it’s probably going to have some sort of effect.
Billie seems to be bisexual, but also seems to be in denial about it. She may even be a lesbian in denial – she throws herself at guys when she’s frustrated or insecure, but both her serious relationships were with women. She vociferously denies being anything but straight around her friends, but her public drama hurricane with Alice may have broken that.
“She vociferously denies being anything but straight around her friends…”
…um… when? The only thing I can remember even close to that was minimizing her bisexuality to Joyce, but that was Joyce, and even then her answer implied she was bi, just using a lot of unnecessary words.
Well there was the time Billie talked about how she didn’t want to go to Joyce’s party, partially because there’d be no dudes to screw her. I bet that still bugs Ruth.
Actually I think this is positive it is a very powerful affirmation that she is not alone it is a step in thr right direction even if not yet truly there. Refusing to pull away and continuing to love and support someone is a huge huge way to help someone with depression or any mental illness really reaffirming that they are needed is helpfull and knowing they aren’t alone is good. This is a good thing Billie now professional help soon as you are sort of maybe heading the right way
Billie Panel 3 is Billie at her most perceptive and sharp. Ruth is trying to push her away. For a lot of reasons. Not feeling good enough. Not wanting to continue dragging Billie down into her abyss. Wanting an excuse to be able to end it all. Wanting an excuse to stop caring about another person and being hit with all the feelings that were making her fall into concerned faces the last few comics.
And Billie won’t let her push all the way away, which is good, though the codependence of the two is not (way too much pressure to put on a relationship).
And Ruth in Panel 1 is highlighting a potential speed bump. She’s counting the days until the NRE (new relationship energy) fades and she no longer feels new and shiny and full of powerful connection, because she believes Billie will run when things get hard(er than they are now). And I think Billie won’t take that. But I also don’t think she’s in a state to adequately have boundaries when she tries to strongarm her way into the hard work of building a good solid long-term couple.
Especially with Ruth always looking for an exit to bump Billie through so she can continue spiraling down to suicide in peace*.
*Which isn’t to say she’s more in love with her depression than Billie, rather that her depression will try and poison her relationship to resume its hold on her.
Yes this. It’s a very delicate thing they are showing positive momentum but the dangerous thing is the co-dependable it’s good to have support abd someone to share your pain but two uheLthy people can’t heal eachother and it won’t last long. I do think this I a sign that Billie is thr healthier of the two that’s she’s so perceptive and seems to be the one making the most progress quickly
Yeah, the codependence is scary, both because it puts a lot of strain on a relationship that is already facing a lot of hurdles (with regards to the alcoholism, depression, forced secrecy, awkwardness about admitting queer romantic affection, and so on) and because it makes their recovery semi-dependent on each other.
And that means that a breakup could fuck both up more than they were to start with in addition to also making both terrified of having a breakup if it’s needed because of how much they rely on the other for some sort of approximation of healthiness.
I think things were a lot darker between the two of them when they made their original suicide pact. Ruth hasn’t used physical force on Billie since her heavy handed way of letting Billie know she was interested.
Ruth also left the shirt on, the ponytail in, and is doing her job – more or less.
Ruth also, sort of, told Billie she is a good person: she is a master at left handed compliments. But, it was a compliment.
I think there is a chance for them, first time I’ve thought that since they started rooming together albeit in secret. I’d like to see them get a break.
“Left-handed compliments”…. That’s an interesting word choice, the expression must hark back to the whole “left-handed/different=bad” thing people used to actually believe.* I’m used to seeing it as “backhanded compliments”.
*my uncle is ambidextrous now because he was naturally left-handed as a child but his grandmother would tie his left arm behind his back to force him to use his right hand.
*Also agree on the other post* There’s a lot of good there buried under some really worrying behavior that could use some good advice or a good therapist or both.
Not to mention some anti-depressives to help them get over the rough spot and help them have the ability to put into practise whatever a therapist suggests.
No one ever seems to mention meds, but as someone who spent years struggling with depression and anxiety (and lost my last job because of it, yay fuck, not the first), meds can make SUCK a huge difference. Ideally one will have a good therapist as well; but given the option of only one I personally, based on my experience, would take the meds.
Having someone to talk to doesn’t help even when your therapist gives you her home number for emergencies, when you are suicidal and the gun is between you and the phone.
Oh fuck yes, 100% agree. Meds made it possible to even peek my head up out of the darkness and be able to breathe and get a handle on things and it’s definitely clear that both of them need medicating of the non- (self-) kind.
I am having the opposite experience. The suicide pact seemed the most real when it was first proposed – like, I was scared they were going to kill themselves that week. The longer the “pact” is just them dating, the more I think Ruth only holds on to that pretense because she is scared to actually BE in a relationship.
If she’s in a relationship, there’s both someone else besides her she needs to try living for and she also might have a future. Two things that seem both absolutely terrifying as well as ludicrously impossible to her.
She’s still in the head-space of waiting things out so she can carry out her suicide plans and is not sure how to handle this developing relationship she has found herself in.
Oh, I think both took it seriously in a lot of ways even if they are doing things to push themselves away from that edge (even if they don’t necessarily want to). Ruth does still want to kill herself and at least partially wants to be connection free so she can go through with it (she doesn’t want to drag Billie down, so the pact part still troubles her). And Billie? She still thinks she’s worthless and poison to everyone she touches and like she can’t help anyone. And part of her probably wants to die to escape the person she is, but she doesn’t want to do it alone and she doesn’t want to do it all at once, but is happy if the spiral of alcoholism and depression swallows them both (so more pact than suicidal, though with a fair amount of that as well, but not to the same degree or as deep in it as Ruth).
Watching them dance on that edge of the cliff-face is equal parts charming and terrifying.
I think the opposite. Billie really seems to be wanting this relationship to work. Otherwise she wouldn’t be trying to get Ruth to do her job or fixing her hair and dressing her. Nor would she even be having this conversation with Ruth.
I forget – WHY are they hiding their relationship again? Is it because Ruth is Billie’s RA? Why doesn’t Billie change dorms (which is possible mid semester, if a pain) and then just date her openly? Problem solved.
THAT problem, I mean. If that is the cause of that problem, which I’m not actually sure of.
One possible problem is that it would give away that Ruth is human, interfering with her reign of terror. Let freshmen get the idea that their femurs are safe and there is no telling what chaos might break out.
Next thing you know people are roller-skating in the halls or something.
Ruth is Billie’s RA and admitting the relationship would be a reveal of an abuse of authority that would get her fired and potentially further disciplined (possibly even suspended). And it sounds like Ruth needs that income as a means of establishing some small amount of autonomy from her abusive grandpa? (whoever that was on the phone with her that she was calling “sir”).
Still not sure of the extent to which Ruth could be in danger of losing her housing (she would at least lose having free housing which would be a hit). And the alcohol would also come with some heavy sanctions.
As for Billie moving her “official” residence to a different hall, it looks like that’s relatively easy, but she may have a difficult time in that she will need to provide a reason for her departure that must be approved first and this would also be a problem for Becky as at that point, Sal would officially be roommate-less and possibly more investigated by the people downstairs and this would definitely mean her suite would be considered “open” for someone else looking to change dorms.
But someone with more personal experience with the university would know for sure what the ramifications would be.
I thought part of it was also neither of the girls were really out. I mean, Billy emphasized she had a “boyfriend” rather than an anonymous girlfriend when other characters questioned it. It might be that she was just trying to keep anyone from connecting the dots, but I kinda felt that she also wasn’t entirely ok with admitting she liked girls. But then it’s been a long time since I read the early strips.
There might be a little of that, but the main reason is the one Cerberus pointed out, about Ruth being Billie’s RA so a relationship with her wouldn’t be kosher.
When I tried to date my RA, he had to sit me down and tell me that if we struck up a relationship he would get fired. Getting fired would mean he’d lose his free housing and meal plan. (that’s how they were paying the RAs) I knew an RA who got fired. She was literally homeless after that and had to couch surf until she managed to get a job and pay for an apartment.
Ruth is in a place where she doesn’t give a fuck about anything, but if her benefits are the same as they were at my school, she probably doesn’t want to lose out on them. I think if she DID get fired, she actually would go through with her plan. Whether or not she’d die from the attempt is another matter entirely.
These kinds of interactions between Ruth and Billie always make me hope for them as a couple. But before such a hope can be realized, I’d say they both need to see a psychiatrist for their depression. Start some therapy, maybe some medication if needed.
Purely IMO, Ruth needs it a lot more than Billie. Billie is half-way functional so long as she has people around her to encourage her. Ruth is actively self-destructive and isolates her to minimise the number of influences that might impede her self-destruction.
I can quite honestly see Ruth’s arc ending with her temporary institutionalisation and, for the rest of the strip, Billie occasionally vanishing on a Sunday to visit her at the clinic where she’s temporarily residing.
Billie’s main problem is alcoholism, as well as the coming-of-age realization that she’s not as hot-shit as she thought in high school. that can be fixed, if not cured, by alcoholism recovery program. let’s be honest, her body and brain are already addicted to alcohol.
Ruth, as we’ve seen from when she’s unable to focus in class and occasionally being really reclusive, has depression, and it’s chronic. she’s not “just sad” but has a real life-threatening chemical imbalance. i really do like sappy romances. but my idea of a sappy romantic ending would be Billie holding her hand during the process of getting professional medical/therapy help.
Billie is playing a high-stakes game here. She’s gambling that Ruth cares enough for her that she won’t self-destruct because she knows Billie will too. That’s working for now but it would only take a really bad day for Ruth to insist that they both ‘end it’ rather than suffer any further.
She’s saying that by staying, and by refusing to be hurtful, even when invited.
Ruth has been pretty clear that she’s not confident in her ability to discuss being happy and healthy yet, I can see why Billie’s not ready to chance that discussion again right now.
it’s so romantic how Billie promises to take Ruth down with her… no seriously, i am hoping with all my sappy romantic heart that they both find a happy ending together. i don’t care if it’s not realistic to have a codependent relationship like that. it’s still romantic!
I think altalemur meant that it wouldn’t be realistic if this toxic, codependent relationship managed a happy ending.
Which, maybe? The way they’re doing things isn’t healthy, but they’re still a stabilizing element to each other in some respects. It’s not impossible that the two of them could work things out.
Yeah, honestly as bad as this is, I wouldn’t be surprised if Ruth would by dead by now without Billie. It’s not healthy in the long run, but it might be buying them time so they have a long run.
Again where are the parents, teachers, older more mature students?
I know that remembering some parents actions they would rather hurt them more than help, but c’mon there must be some good understanding adults there who could help these two.
We haven’t seen much of Ruth or Billie’s teachers so we don’t know if any of them are as good and caring as Leslie. It does seem that both of them are more in large lecture style classes which tend to be less supportive overall.
And yeah, parents are definitely out of the picture. Ruth’s parents are dead and I suspect her grandpa is the “sir” that was on the phone way back in the closet strip and Billie’s parents have been noted several times to be completely disinterested in Billie’s life (after all, they even skipped out on Parent’s Weekend).
Also, they’d have to ask for help. Unless they ask, or have a breakdown of some type in public, no older, more mature person will realize anything’s wrong. And they’re both probably good at acting ok in front of authority figures.
Sometimes an RA might be closer to the situation and might be able to help, but that’s not going to work here!
I don’t think she wants to kill herself, it’s more that she and Ruth are convinced of it being an inevitability. If she’s choosing between dying and leaving Ruth, then they can both die, especially since Billie thinks she’s totally devoid of hope anyway.
Yeah, absolutely. Billie has problems, but she’s generally been in a cleaner state of mind than Ruth, and I think that’s most emphasized in these last few sequences; Billie treats this as a real relationship and resists the suicide pact, while Ruth is just kind of casually resigned to her death and is still trying to push Billie away so she doesn’t drag her down.
Loading ...
“WHY must I share EVERYTHING with you, CHEEZ, I bet you wanna share a coffin, too”
“it’s cool, we can be cremated”
also I bet Brick Mansome is just a pseudonym of Brick M. Stonewood
Blast Hardcheese, actually.
I think you’ll find it’s Roll Fizzlebeef.
No no, it’s Bulk Vanderhuge!
That’s Big McLargeHuge to you
That’s DOCTOR Big McLargeHuge to you.
Bob Johnson…wait
Slab Meathunk!
Slab Bulkhead.
Punch Rockgroin.
Bob Johnson.
That’s the name of a Chevy dealership near me. Swear to god.
Dealerships in our area sound like bottom-barrel porn stars: Dick Masheter, Tom Raper, Dick Ruhl, Sexton Dick.
Sebastian Lance.
And if you get that reference I’ll love you forever.
Walky crosses another name off the ‘change my name and move to the west coast’ list
J. Studley Hungwell, actually.
So which one is going to start collecting those superthick magazines full of funeral dresses, flower arrangements, etc?
[/stereotype]
Billie’s going to want a destination funeral.
what if they get married in funeral clothes and are eternal goth lesbians
a FINAL DESTINATION funeral
Being cremated is the opposite of being cool, though…
That depends on how much you’re going to spend in the funerals, these days. And there are a lot of interesting options for urns.
You… you missed the pun
In one urn, I assume
friends who stay together DIE TOGETHER
And then do it all over again.
This morbid codependency
Those last two panels are black comedy to a tee.
*plays Elton John’s “Funeral For A Friend/Love Lies Bleeding” on the hacked Muzak*
That’s some eyeroll, Ruth.
I think she nearly sprained an eyeball with that one.
Actually she is looking up at that cabinet where she keeps the remains of her last obsessive lover. And feeling guilty for infidelity.
“Oh gin bottle, I’m so sorry for cheating on you again.”
Gin? Nah, a bottle of Caribou Crossing Single Barrel.
Ow! I’ve never seen anyone roll their eyes that hard. That looks painful!
“EHHHHHHHHHHHH.”
I wish this had been the first comment, I literally busted out laughing.
Her eyes have become jellyfish and are naturally climbing towards the daylight so that they can drop upon unsuspecting fish. Actually not unlike her job as an overactive RA.
“i, for one, HONOR my sexy lesbian suicide pacts.”
It will eventually be revealed that Brick Mansome is Joe’s screen name on a popular dating site. Perhaps the one run by Orville Redenbacher.
Billie’s got her there.
What’s the marginally more realistic name of Brick Mansome’s DOA counterpart?
Rick Mansome, of course.
B. Rick Mansome. The B stands for Beverly.
Rick “The Brick” Sume
I am now picturing him as Ethan’s separated-at-birth identical twin.
If novellas have taught me anything, it’s that the identical twin separated at birth is evil and that he will go by the name, “Reynaldo” >.>
And has also a goatee.
Well, that goes without saying.
Even if it’s female?
Only interdimensional evil twins have to have goatees. But in that case, yes, all genders have them.
Meep.
Sweet, yet horrifying.
“Whatever. I’m going to bed.”
“OUR bed.”
“Dammit, if you’re going to be like this, you can just get out of my room!”
“OUR room.”
“Be that way. Do you want some more of OUR booze?”
“MY booze.”
*slow clap*
I’m pretty sure that Brick Mansome is gay.
Well so are they…
No no, they are bi/pan. There was a whole thing about it. :p
They are gay the way Obama is black.
(Obama had one light-skinned parent and one dark-skinned parent. Calling him “black” is a symptom of our culture’s weird attitudes toward skin-tone-genetics. In a sane culture, there wouldn’t even be a word for Obama’s skin-tone-genetics except maybe “brown” or “tan.” In a differently insane culture, we’d still be calling him “mulatto” and we’d also be using words like “octaroon” as though they were meaningful.
Imagine, if you can, a culture so sane that we didn’t need words like “gay” and “bi” and “straight” but just said “Do you think s/he’d be into me?” It’s not like “bi” people are into every human being on the planet!)
Except you can’t disregard race as a social construct that is very real in reality. It has no scientific basis whatsoever, and is entirely socially constructed. That doesn’t make it any less real for Black people. Obama is Black. Unless you can actually pass for white, if your Black and White mixed race or whatever, your still Black. Also, Black people come in all shades no matter their heritage. My father and uncle are full brothers with no European in their genetics that they know of and my father is super dark, and my uncle is lighter skinned than I am – and my mother is German/Dutch.
Because race isn’t an actual scientific category, you can’t just say someone who has lived the experiences of a Black person not Black because they have a non-black parent.
yeah, sometimes labels are used for oppression and other bad stuff. but i am pretty grateful for labels that help me to explore who i am and express that in a way that other people can easily understand. just like i wouldn’t say “that small hairy thing in my house with a long tail and triangle ears that prefers to eat fish” instead of saying “my cat.” maybe there is some perfect world that doesn’t need labels like “genderfluid” or “cat” but i can only imagine a world in which choosing the label “genderfluid” and “pansexual” doesn’t lead to oppression rather than a world without labels.
The best explanation I’ve seen is one that is clear to anyone who has ever been around a cat: ‘There’s a big difference between putting yourself in a box and getting put in a box by someone else.’
Yeah, um, don’t do that. Sexuality and race are not analogous things and every time (inevitably) white queer people try to draw these parallels, we end up stepping in some bad shit. Both race and sexual orientation are constructs, sure, but that doesn’t mean that they don’t have real consequences and impacts. And they’re not the SAME consequences and they don’t function in the same way.
Sorry if I miscommunicated. I wasn’t saying that sexuality and race are analogous. It’s clear that they’re not – race is often visually apparent, and sexuality often isn’t; the patterns culture associated with each are very different; the patterns of oppression associated with each are also very different.
I was saying that calling Obama “black” highlights the construct nature of race-labels… and I was jumping from there to asserting that our sexuality-labels are also constructed, and that not having them might be a symptom of a society that’s saner about sexuality.
I’m actually white, straight, probably Aspie, and a member of two other stigmatized minorities that don’t show unless I talk about them.
Imagine how different society would be if sexuality were as un-charged as singing? Some people like to sing, some don’t, and unless you’re looking for people to sing with, it just isn’t very important.
Altalemur is glad that labels exist to help ver explore who ve is. Sure, in the current society, that’s incredibly useful; there aren’t enough examples of non-straight sexuality.
And maybe labels for sexuality would be useful in any society. But imagine if children had to decide, early in the process of exploring their creativity, whether they were or were not a “singer.” I’d think it would be better for children to grow up around singers, and decide for themselves how much, where, and how they wanted to sing.
So, I agree, race and sexuality are not analogous social constructs. But American society has a number of insanities about race, and also has a number of (different) insanities about sexuality. I think it’s useful to imagine a society that is sane about both – a society where the labels have so little charge, and so little utility, that “gay” is like “singer” and your skin tone is mainly of interest to your fashion consultant.
And now I’m picturing a world where “bass” is a persecuted minority.
“What do you mean, I can’t sing in your choir?”
Brick Mansome sounds like it’d be the name of a Lego or Kre-o version of Brock Samson…
What the heck is Kre-o?
The Hasbro version of Legos basically.
Anyone remember Mega Blocks?….No?( Ok, I’ll show myself out)
Pepperidge Farm remembers
Pepperidge Farm dismembers
Still have lots, actually.
Butch Deadlift! Vaughn Hairychest!
Bob Johnson!
Seymour Butts!
I first heard that name at least 60 years ago. I wonder how far back it really goes.
It was the first thing said after the name Seymour was first thought up.
Little known fact: Jane Fonda’s full name is Jayne Seymour Fonda. Do with that what you will.
“The more ya see, the fonda you become”?
Don’t forget about Jacque Strappe.
surely, you mean baron jock stirrup
You should invent a guy named Brick Mansome and have him come in for an arc just because.
Brick Mansome is Joe’s superhero name after he develops a crush on Amazi-Girl
We’re just two lost souls swimming in a fishbowl of self-destructive nonsense.
Is it too much to hope for that the Sexy Lesbian Suicide Pact(tm) someday develops into a healthy relationship that is neither dangerously codependent nor mutually self-destructive?
Please?
Someone give these kids the happy ending they need.
Yes it would be.
Quick, remind him what comic he is reading. (or she, as the case may be )
Happy endings are messy… I’ll let myself out.
I’m pretty sure they already got a ‘happy ending’ in the slipshine exclusive.
It isnt’t. Just don’t count on it.
It’s not impossible, but it’d be extremely difficult and I really don’t think these two can make it work.
-whistles- the addams family!!
*snap snap*
Sweet!
“Our relationship is a failure!!”
“Considering that our relationship started as a suicide pact, I’d say that’s a good thing.”
“…Is it still Sexy?”
“…And Lesbian, yes.”
Billie and Ruth are bi.
I find it interesting that Ruth not only assumes that Billie will leave her for a man, but stresses that the way she does.
Dammit, these two should just reserve the double-wide coffin now, shouldn’t they?
Yeah, it really is interesting.
My suspicion is that Ruth has got some internalized biphobia in addition to her absolute lack of self-esteem and assumes Billie will leave her for a man eventually, so she may as well try and force the issue now and get it over with. But that’s not how being bi works, even if her depression gets jealous of the men Billie dated and has historically made a public show of being attracted to (after all Billie has often been dismissive of her romantic connections with women, which might be another element that was too frustrating to continue for Alice).
I think biphobia is pushing it too far. Ruth is worried that their relationships that will be too much for Billy and she’ll want a more “normal” relationship. And what better way to emphasize that than to point out she can have what some people would consider “normal:” a hot guy and a straight relationship.
Yeah, that’s part of the internalized biphobia, at least in my view. She doesn’t view her and her partners affections for women and each other as being as “normal” or as “desirable” than something easier. And she also feels it is inevitable that she will “switch” back at some point.
And a lot of that is really just her depression trying to sabotage her. I mean, what better way to get your host to doubt their happiness than by playing to social messages about how the world would view their type of affection and its potential future and playing to insecurities about how your partner doesn’t really love you but is just filling out time before they go off with someone “easier”.
Ruth does keep accusing Billie of wanting to be with men instead of with Ruth. but Billie is the first person who brought that up, back when talking about Joyce’s party. yeah, she did it in an off-handed way, but it put the idea in Ruth’s head that in reality, Billie still wants to go get jack-hammered by studly guys at college parties. so it’s probably part self-worth problems for Ruth, and part biphobia. (is Ruth bi? or just Billie?) i can say that as a queer person living in the Midwest who is interested in the ladies, 90% of the bi women my age are in long-term relationships with men and are looking for casual sex with women (and no, they are not looking to start poly-anything). having long term romance between two women is just “not something people do” in my area, unfortunately. so my entire community runs on a very biphobic standard of romance.
Ruth is bi – canon by word of god.
Willies revealed this in an It’s Walky strip (sexual orientations remain the same across ‘verses) and while the comic originally seemed to apply only to Billie, the reveal of Danny being bi in the Dumbiverse disclosed that all characters in that picture are bi.
More of a pet peeve than any real anger, but it’s annoying that so many people need “proof” that a character is bi; that unless a character has had the exact same amount of attraction or relationships with at least one character of the same and opposite sex, then they must not actually be bi.
We don’t ever need to see Ruth bang a dude before we can settle for certain that she’s actually bi.
There’s also the fact that Ruth was apparently unaware she could be attracted to women until Billie came along, so her discovery of that is tied into her, shall we say, complicated feelings about Billie (kissing the drunk driver and all that). I don’t know if that counts as internalized biphobia or not, but it’s probably going to have some sort of effect.
Billie seems to be bisexual, but also seems to be in denial about it. She may even be a lesbian in denial – she throws herself at guys when she’s frustrated or insecure, but both her serious relationships were with women. She vociferously denies being anything but straight around her friends, but her public drama hurricane with Alice may have broken that.
Billie in the other verse is married to a guy.
“She vociferously denies being anything but straight around her friends…”
…um… when? The only thing I can remember even close to that was minimizing her bisexuality to Joyce, but that was Joyce, and even then her answer implied she was bi, just using a lot of unnecessary words.
Well there was the time Billie talked about how she didn’t want to go to Joyce’s party, partially because there’d be no dudes to screw her. I bet that still bugs Ruth.
Ruth, your irises are not high enough.
Did her glasses grow boobs in the last panel?
Actually I think this is positive it is a very powerful affirmation that she is not alone it is a step in thr right direction even if not yet truly there. Refusing to pull away and continuing to love and support someone is a huge huge way to help someone with depression or any mental illness really reaffirming that they are needed is helpfull and knowing they aren’t alone is good. This is a good thing Billie now professional help soon as you are sort of maybe heading the right way
Billie Panel 3 is Billie at her most perceptive and sharp. Ruth is trying to push her away. For a lot of reasons. Not feeling good enough. Not wanting to continue dragging Billie down into her abyss. Wanting an excuse to be able to end it all. Wanting an excuse to stop caring about another person and being hit with all the feelings that were making her fall into concerned faces the last few comics.
And Billie won’t let her push all the way away, which is good, though the codependence of the two is not (way too much pressure to put on a relationship).
And Ruth in Panel 1 is highlighting a potential speed bump. She’s counting the days until the NRE (new relationship energy) fades and she no longer feels new and shiny and full of powerful connection, because she believes Billie will run when things get hard(er than they are now). And I think Billie won’t take that. But I also don’t think she’s in a state to adequately have boundaries when she tries to strongarm her way into the hard work of building a good solid long-term couple.
Especially with Ruth always looking for an exit to bump Billie through so she can continue spiraling down to suicide in peace*.
*Which isn’t to say she’s more in love with her depression than Billie, rather that her depression will try and poison her relationship to resume its hold on her.
Yes this. It’s a very delicate thing they are showing positive momentum but the dangerous thing is the co-dependable it’s good to have support abd someone to share your pain but two uheLthy people can’t heal eachother and it won’t last long. I do think this I a sign that Billie is thr healthier of the two that’s she’s so perceptive and seems to be the one making the most progress quickly
Yeah, the codependence is scary, both because it puts a lot of strain on a relationship that is already facing a lot of hurdles (with regards to the alcoholism, depression, forced secrecy, awkwardness about admitting queer romantic affection, and so on) and because it makes their recovery semi-dependent on each other.
And that means that a breakup could fuck both up more than they were to start with in addition to also making both terrified of having a breakup if it’s needed because of how much they rely on the other for some sort of approximation of healthiness.
Bickering like a married couple already.
I choose to believe that Ruth’s eyes are bulging out like a Loony Toons gag and they’re just pointed up at the ceiling.
Could you roll them any higher Ruth?
I think things were a lot darker between the two of them when they made their original suicide pact. Ruth hasn’t used physical force on Billie since her heavy handed way of letting Billie know she was interested.
Ruth also left the shirt on, the ponytail in, and is doing her job – more or less.
Ruth also, sort of, told Billie she is a good person: she is a master at left handed compliments. But, it was a compliment.
I think there is a chance for them, first time I’ve thought that since they started rooming together albeit in secret. I’d like to see them get a break.
“Left-handed compliments”…. That’s an interesting word choice, the expression must hark back to the whole “left-handed/different=bad” thing people used to actually believe.* I’m used to seeing it as “backhanded compliments”.
*my uncle is ambidextrous now because he was naturally left-handed as a child but his grandmother would tie his left arm behind his back to force him to use his right hand.
Happened to me as well (also via a grandmother), but it ended with me being completely right-handed in the end. Sadly.
Ended in the end… superb word choice there, me.
Oh noe I’m Joe
Aren’t we all a little Joe?
Okay, probably not.
We all have a little Joe inside of us.
Joe is still working on that part. (Except in regards to dudes, anyway. He hasn’t seemed all that receptive to Joe-on-dude action.)
It’ll happen eventually. He’ll think, “Why keep the Joe to just the ladies? The whole world deserves the Joe!”
And professional help.
So so much professional help.
*Also agree on the other post* There’s a lot of good there buried under some really worrying behavior that could use some good advice or a good therapist or both.
Not to mention some anti-depressives to help them get over the rough spot and help them have the ability to put into practise whatever a therapist suggests.
No one ever seems to mention meds, but as someone who spent years struggling with depression and anxiety (and lost my last job because of it, yay fuck, not the first), meds can make SUCK a huge difference. Ideally one will have a good therapist as well; but given the option of only one I personally, based on my experience, would take the meds.
Having someone to talk to doesn’t help even when your therapist gives you her home number for emergencies, when you are suicidal and the gun is between you and the phone.
*SUCH a huge difference. *facepalm* Also, proofread. Proofreading helps, kids.
Proofreading is another thing that is much much easier to do with supportive partner.
Oh fuck yes, 100% agree. Meds made it possible to even peek my head up out of the darkness and be able to breathe and get a handle on things and it’s definitely clear that both of them need medicating of the non- (self-) kind.
Is he related to Blast Hardcheese or Punch Rockgroin?
He’s definitely related to Thick Runfast. And Big McLargehuge.
Bob Johnson, not so much.
As long as he’s not related to Chedward Cullgray,
Anyone else thinking Billie/Ruth is actually scary. The longer it goes on the less the suicide pact seems like a joke.
I am having the opposite experience. The suicide pact seemed the most real when it was first proposed – like, I was scared they were going to kill themselves that week. The longer the “pact” is just them dating, the more I think Ruth only holds on to that pretense because she is scared to actually BE in a relationship.
If she’s in a relationship, there’s both someone else besides her she needs to try living for and she also might have a future. Two things that seem both absolutely terrifying as well as ludicrously impossible to her.
She’s still in the head-space of waiting things out so she can carry out her suicide plans and is not sure how to handle this developing relationship she has found herself in.
Oh, I think both took it seriously in a lot of ways even if they are doing things to push themselves away from that edge (even if they don’t necessarily want to). Ruth does still want to kill herself and at least partially wants to be connection free so she can go through with it (she doesn’t want to drag Billie down, so the pact part still troubles her). And Billie? She still thinks she’s worthless and poison to everyone she touches and like she can’t help anyone. And part of her probably wants to die to escape the person she is, but she doesn’t want to do it alone and she doesn’t want to do it all at once, but is happy if the spiral of alcoholism and depression swallows them both (so more pact than suicidal, though with a fair amount of that as well, but not to the same degree or as deep in it as Ruth).
Watching them dance on that edge of the cliff-face is equal parts charming and terrifying.
I think the opposite. Billie really seems to be wanting this relationship to work. Otherwise she wouldn’t be trying to get Ruth to do her job or fixing her hair and dressing her. Nor would she even be having this conversation with Ruth.
I forget – WHY are they hiding their relationship again? Is it because Ruth is Billie’s RA? Why doesn’t Billie change dorms (which is possible mid semester, if a pain) and then just date her openly? Problem solved.
THAT problem, I mean. If that is the cause of that problem, which I’m not actually sure of.
One possible problem is that it would give away that Ruth is human, interfering with her reign of terror. Let freshmen get the idea that their femurs are safe and there is no telling what chaos might break out.
Next thing you know people are roller-skating in the halls or something.
Ruth is Billie’s RA and admitting the relationship would be a reveal of an abuse of authority that would get her fired and potentially further disciplined (possibly even suspended). And it sounds like Ruth needs that income as a means of establishing some small amount of autonomy from her abusive grandpa? (whoever that was on the phone with her that she was calling “sir”).
I’m not terribly sure of Indiana University policy with regards to rooms, though I found this:
http://www.rps.indiana.edu/doc/AtoZguide.pdf
Still not sure of the extent to which Ruth could be in danger of losing her housing (she would at least lose having free housing which would be a hit). And the alcohol would also come with some heavy sanctions.
As for Billie moving her “official” residence to a different hall, it looks like that’s relatively easy, but she may have a difficult time in that she will need to provide a reason for her departure that must be approved first and this would also be a problem for Becky as at that point, Sal would officially be roommate-less and possibly more investigated by the people downstairs and this would definitely mean her suite would be considered “open” for someone else looking to change dorms.
But someone with more personal experience with the university would know for sure what the ramifications would be.
I thought part of it was also neither of the girls were really out. I mean, Billy emphasized she had a “boyfriend” rather than an anonymous girlfriend when other characters questioned it. It might be that she was just trying to keep anyone from connecting the dots, but I kinda felt that she also wasn’t entirely ok with admitting she liked girls. But then it’s been a long time since I read the early strips.
There might be a little of that, but the main reason is the one Cerberus pointed out, about Ruth being Billie’s RA so a relationship with her wouldn’t be kosher.
When I tried to date my RA, he had to sit me down and tell me that if we struck up a relationship he would get fired. Getting fired would mean he’d lose his free housing and meal plan. (that’s how they were paying the RAs) I knew an RA who got fired. She was literally homeless after that and had to couch surf until she managed to get a job and pay for an apartment.
Ruth is in a place where she doesn’t give a fuck about anything, but if her benefits are the same as they were at my school, she probably doesn’t want to lose out on them. I think if she DID get fired, she actually would go through with her plan. Whether or not she’d die from the attempt is another matter entirely.
Somewhere, Brick Mansome sheds a single, manly tear and doesn’t know why.
If Brick Mansome is in Walkyverse, he ought to be here too.
Calling it now: there will be a girl with the surname Mansome at some point in this comic
“For the last time, it’s pronounced mahn-so-may, not man-some! It does not sort of rhyme with handsome!”
billie’s morbid smug eyes KILL me
These kinds of interactions between Ruth and Billie always make me hope for them as a couple. But before such a hope can be realized, I’d say they both need to see a psychiatrist for their depression. Start some therapy, maybe some medication if needed.
Purely IMO, Ruth needs it a lot more than Billie. Billie is half-way functional so long as she has people around her to encourage her. Ruth is actively self-destructive and isolates her to minimise the number of influences that might impede her self-destruction.
I can quite honestly see Ruth’s arc ending with her temporary institutionalisation and, for the rest of the strip, Billie occasionally vanishing on a Sunday to visit her at the clinic where she’s temporarily residing.
Billie’s main problem is alcoholism, as well as the coming-of-age realization that she’s not as hot-shit as she thought in high school. that can be fixed, if not cured, by alcoholism recovery program. let’s be honest, her body and brain are already addicted to alcohol.
Ruth, as we’ve seen from when she’s unable to focus in class and occasionally being really reclusive, has depression, and it’s chronic. she’s not “just sad” but has a real life-threatening chemical imbalance. i really do like sappy romances. but my idea of a sappy romantic ending would be Billie holding her hand during the process of getting professional medical/therapy help.
Brick Mansome is in their scrapbook, too. He’s their Best Man because he’s the best man.
Brick McHansome, super cool, super spy, super awesome, because he is a solid guy. Now showing nowhere but only in your imaginations!
gg
Wanted your ol’ busybody back Ruth? Here she is!
I felt that eye roll hear in the 3 dimensional world.
Natural 20!
I mean I don’t doubt you would have made a character named Brick Mansome in the Walkyverse. You named a character Beef Walkerton after all.
Billie is playing a high-stakes game here. She’s gambling that Ruth cares enough for her that she won’t self-destruct because she knows Billie will too. That’s working for now but it would only take a really bad day for Ruth to insist that they both ‘end it’ rather than suffer any further.
You make a cute couple… of corpses!
So who will be the Corpse Bride?
Ruth’s eyeroll game is strong.
Agreed.
Best Comment.
With her back on the poster, she looks like she has a crown on panel 3.
I noticed that too. All hail Queen Billie!
Ruth and Joyce are in a competition for most epic eye-roll.
Just tell her you don’t want her to die, Billie, it really shouldn’t be that hard!
She’s saying that by staying, and by refusing to be hurtful, even when invited.
Ruth has been pretty clear that she’s not confident in her ability to discuss being happy and healthy yet, I can see why Billie’s not ready to chance that discussion again right now.
“Brick Mansome!” “Fist Rockbone!” “Smash Lampjaw!” “Crunch Buttsteak!”
Yeah, that wouldn’t sound out of place in the “Space Mutiny” episode of MST3K.
Heh. Crunch Buttsteak.
Rock Hudson.
YES, YES, YES. This is exactly what I was thinking. Reb Brown would totally play someone called Brick Mansome.
…I probably shouldn’t be able to see this much of myself in Billie, should I.
we can call Chick-Fil-A-Gay-Guy Brick Mansome
it’s so romantic how Billie promises to take Ruth down with her… no seriously, i am hoping with all my sappy romantic heart that they both find a happy ending together. i don’t care if it’s not realistic to have a codependent relationship like that. it’s still romantic!
How is it not realistic? Honestly wondering.
I think altalemur meant that it wouldn’t be realistic if this toxic, codependent relationship managed a happy ending.
Which, maybe? The way they’re doing things isn’t healthy, but they’re still a stabilizing element to each other in some respects. It’s not impossible that the two of them could work things out.
Yeah, honestly as bad as this is, I wouldn’t be surprised if Ruth would by dead by now without Billie. It’s not healthy in the long run, but it might be buying them time so they have a long run.
I’m sure love will find a way.
That’s a joke. These two need help. Immediately.
Again where are the parents, teachers, older more mature students?
I know that remembering some parents actions they would rather hurt them more than help, but c’mon there must be some good understanding adults there who could help these two.
Ruth’s parents are DEEEEAAAAADDD.
We haven’t seen much of Ruth or Billie’s teachers so we don’t know if any of them are as good and caring as Leslie. It does seem that both of them are more in large lecture style classes which tend to be less supportive overall.
And yeah, parents are definitely out of the picture. Ruth’s parents are dead and I suspect her grandpa is the “sir” that was on the phone way back in the closet strip and Billie’s parents have been noted several times to be completely disinterested in Billie’s life (after all, they even skipped out on Parent’s Weekend).
Also, they’d have to ask for help. Unless they ask, or have a breakdown of some type in public, no older, more mature person will realize anything’s wrong. And they’re both probably good at acting ok in front of authority figures.
Sometimes an RA might be closer to the situation and might be able to help, but that’s not going to work here!
No, his name is Brick Wagner.
That eye roll in the last panel looks like it hurts. Like Ruth should get a migrain from eye-sprain/strain
Dat last panel though…
Last panel is how I look when checking for ceiling Spider-Man.
This just makes me think of someone calling Grant Ward on Agents of SHIELD “Agent Brickface Manpain,” which makes me giggle eternally.
Billie? That “Till death do us part” thing isn’t supposed to be a goal you chase after.
I don’t think she wants to kill herself, it’s more that she and Ruth are convinced of it being an inevitability. If she’s choosing between dying and leaving Ruth, then they can both die, especially since Billie thinks she’s totally devoid of hope anyway.
Ruth is a lot more badly depressed than Billie, if you ask me.
Yeah, absolutely. Billie has problems, but she’s generally been in a cleaner state of mind than Ruth, and I think that’s most emphasized in these last few sequences; Billie treats this as a real relationship and resists the suicide pact, while Ruth is just kind of casually resigned to her death and is still trying to push Billie away so she doesn’t drag her down.
“Eyebrows, you’re in the way!”
and it’s strips like these that remind me that Billie is, in fact, eighteen, and a poor decision maker for an 18 year old at that
Looks like good decisions to me.
That is the weirdest/funniest eyeroll I have ever seen.
Does that mean that Dumbing of Age can’t have a Brick Mansome?
You watched The Holiday recently, too?