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No need to pass a law where a crime almost never happens. Statutes on crime are a great way to deduce what crimes happen where. The more complexly worded and loop-holey a statute, the more experience lawmakers have had with a crime.
…unless we’re in Lovecraft territory. People from the Miskatonic region have to put up with jokes about them sleeping with their huge, invisible, tentacled half-brothers.
Ah, F3: Frantic, Frustrated, and Female. The insistence of the subtitles that they were not sisters, and that their “landlord” was not their mother, despite them continually referring to each other as such, reached almost Pythonesque levels of absurdity… Especially since these insistent disclaiming subtitles did not appear until the second episode, thus the first episode played these familial relationships completely straight. (Or rather, completely lesbian!)
Just like how schools in hentai are always “colleges” in translation, despite having homerooms, a set start time for all students, students punsihed by having to stand outside, and students cramming for the entrance exam to get into college.
On the other hand, given that non-USA countries often call high school ‘college’ and college ‘university’, that could be playing weirdly into the translation, maybe the translators are having that consistency issue instead. (Plus how they take entrance exams for high school in Japan, too.)
Star Wars wouldn’t even qualify, really. Pseudo-Incest is basically about finding a technically okay reason why the people who are having sex can say “Daddy”, “Sis,” etc. The most common one is step-, in my experience.
Old songs are full of people calling their S.O. things like “Momma”, “Daddy” or “Baby” and this is considered normal and not hideously disturbing AT ALL.
There’s also the fact that the Japanese (as well as many hentai fans) seem to find the phrase ‘oni-chan’ cute and sexy, so many hentai producers have cute little girls saying it to people who demonstrably aren’t their big brothers, just to sell copy.
I think that Joyce has figured this out for herself. Their relationship made sense, in a weird self-deluded way, but it couldn’t outlast the delusions.
Of course there could be a practical reason for a gay student to say yes though.
Let’s say he was a dependent student whose parents made too much to get financial aid, getting married would put him in the independent category and allow him to qualify for Pell grants, which at close to six grand a year over a four year college education would add up to nearly twenty six thousand he wouldn’t have gotten otherwise, all for signing a marriage contract.
though it’s a thing for, say, Chinese gay/lesbian friends to agree to marry (but secretly keep their same-sex partners) just to get their parents to stop hassling them about marrying… though managing kids is a different matter
To think I thought all the kids getting married at the end of High School were nuts when in reality they may have been working the system to get money for college. Hindsight 20/20.
So to review: Walky and Dorry are fightin’, Bills an’ Ruth are in a Sexy Lesbian Suicicde Pact, Amber and DANNY are happy, secret datin’, Joyce is having a breakdown and Ethan is massively repressed.
And it’s still only Monday night.
This is gonna be a looong ass week, isn’t it?
prediction: Joyce finds out about Walky and Dorothy fighting, concludes that “See! Premarital sex DOES cause problems!”, and retreats back into her bubble of previously held beliefs for a while.
Also, don’t forget that Mary saw Billie furtively leave Ruth’s room
Mike: Hello, roomie! How was your day?
Walky: Well, Dorothy told me she loved me, and I told her I loved her, too. Now we’re both angry and miserable.
Mike: Good thing I started drinking early!
I miss Sarah! Also, I thought it was so sweet yesterday when Joyce predicted that Sarah and Jacob will end up together, despite Sarah’s inability to believe in her own loveableness. I hope so, and I hope Joyce knows she’s loveable, too.
It’s pretty extreme in its own way. A lot of their issues are things that are directed towards themselves, like Joyce’s issues with her own sexual desires and Ethan’s fear that he’ll never be “normal.” But until they resolve those things neither of them will be able to have healthy relationships. They’re never going to result in sexy suicide pacts, but they will result in a lot of sad feelings.
Well, I suppose dating Ethan is a way of having her oath of celibacy on record, so the bald look could work with that! (Now to time how long it takes someone to get the reference…)
Man, I hope she doesn’t do that. Willis would have to start putting in a lot of filler to dilute the plot to the point that it matched Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
(Which would probably have been a decent episode, but oh my stars, it made a terrible movie.)
Relationships are facing facts this arc. Dorothy and Walky have to decide whether it is just for fun. Joyce and Ethan will have to settle for best gay friend. Ruth and Billie need to remove suicidal from the relationship. Because none of these are ready to go the distance until they do.
Oh good, I was waiting for this relationship to hit the rocks. They may have had the right to choose to be with each other if they wanted, but that doesn’t change the fact that it was just a really bad idea right from the start.
Farewell, EthanxJoyce, you should never have been a thing in the first place. :l
Poor everyone. Hugs? I wonder who would be better for helping Joyce right now, if anyone. Maybe her sister could since she’s likely been through some similar thoughts.
Dailybrad, I don’t think Sarah is like that. She does not revel in turning the screw in people she cares for or ones she doesn’t actually.
Sarah is a realist. She tells it like she see’s it without sweetening it up.
More like:
“Joyce, you’re an idiot, you know this is wrong for you and I’m sorry you’re hurt but, damn girl, you gotta move on’
I was mostly teasing. Sarah does care about Joyce quite a bit, basically her little sister of sorts, but she still told her from day one this was a shitty idea for both parties. She has admitted she has some “I told you so” in her, but that the time she really wanted to do it, the gravity of the situation was far too grave for it, with the drugging incident.
Not yet, I think. This seems like a precursor to the actual decline of the relationship. Probably there’s going to be another steamy situation with Danny at some point in the future that’s going to cause 1) Danny to critically re-examine his sexuality, and 2) cause Ethan to finally admit to himself that it’s just not healthy for him to try to force himself into a heterosexual relationship.
Or alternately, it’ll cause Joyce (and Amber?) to talk him through the fact that its not fair to him or the women he’d be with to keep up the pretense
We’re definitely closer to the end than the beginning though
I dunno. I feel like the slingshot hasn’t pulled back far enough yet for the maximum amount of stinging pain.
Ethan really ought to talk to somebody about what he’s doing and feeling. And his only possible confidant is Danny. This is my horrible, monstrous hope.
And this is the part of the story where everything goes downhill and everyone screams “DAMN YOU WILLIS!!!!!” isn’t it? ‘Cause I’ll be legitimately surprised if it takes a turn for the better… Maybe Ruth and Billie get together and Marry only wants to throw them a big ‘ol Ice Cream party with a petting zoo and laser tag… Maybe Walky and Dorothy will realize the power of love through an 80’s power ballad… Maybe Joyce will find a nice boyfriend and not have her heart crushed… Maybe Ethan will find a nice boyfriend also… Maybe just this once… Just this once, everybody is happy… goddammit…
I want to be mad at Joyce for fueling the gay denial in Ethan and want to say she had it coming for trying to start a doomed relationship with someone who couldn’t be romantically attracted to her, but I can feel the hurt in loving someone who just isn’t into your gender.
to be fair tho ethan DID agree to the relationship knowing full well he is not and will not be attracted to her. And essentially is just stringing her along, for a beard, to keep his parents happy.
They are both being stupid but you cant help but feel sorry for both there situations.
I mean, at the end of the day, it’s not really a romance. They are basically in this relationship because they want some companionship but can’t handle a romantic relationship right now, for various reasons. One major reason Joyce is unhappy right now is because she is lonely. Ending this relationship wont make her any happier “in the end” until the other issues are sorted out.
That’s the problem with legitimately smart people. They start connecting logic dots as new information comes along. Its so very hard to keep them mindlessly leashed to dogmatic ideals once out of a hermetically sealed echo chamber.
What’s truely horrible is that they don’t get equipped with the tools to properly handle that input. The most important skill is learning how to learn. The methods and process of finding, evaluating, and integrating new information against what you already know. Without practice early you can end up in a cascade of questioning everything you’ve ever known because so much is in conflict with what you’re experiencing.
Good girl Joyce. Glad you’re actually thinking now. Alright, so what you gotta do now it break it off with Ethan and encourage him to be who he was meant to be.
I’ve had friends who have lived as sheltered a life as Joyce has been shown having, yet they are more understanding in the world. Way I see Joyce is like a brainwashed cult member rather then just a devoted Christian. To me she isn’t even trying to process a world outside the blind faith she has been raised in.
I don’t see she has to “break it off” with Ethan or whatever. I think she is doing pretty well, actually. She just has to figure out “its” place. It’s sort of disappointing that Ethan decides to run rather than help with that. But then it’s also sort of defining the limits of what she can expect of Ethan. I think he could do better than that in the “friend” department. Heck, even in the “big brother” department.
I thought he was running because he thinks Joyce guessed that he was attracted to her “brother”, and he’s worried he might accidentally spill Jocelyne’s secret to Joyce if he starts trying to explain why he’s not going to leave her for her “brother.”
I got really mad at Ethan in panel three for a moment. Promising Joyce the same “as Dorothy” sounded an awful lot like clinging to their stupid charade. Luckily, Joyce called him out for it immadiately.
Yeah, the part at the end was the Danning, where Ethan found the deepest closet he could and hid beneath some big ‘ol woolen coats, that would be what I was referring to.
This could have gone a lot worse. I was expecting her to say I love your first, romantically; ,and Joyce’s drama-hurricane factor to go way up, maybe up to 3, maybe all the way up to Billieforce.
This could have been a Damn-You-Willis moment of epic proportions.
The number of DYWes going around lately have made me remember something you might find interesting: Almost all fatal brain aneurysms occur in the part of the brain called the “Circle of Willis”
This has lead me to conclude that you are actually trying to murder us all by inducing such a level of DYW that fatal brain aneurysms occur.
Who else wants to see Joyce pester Billie for a while and try to get relationship advice from her asking all the time about her boyfriend?
I just need some laugh after seeing this page.
Kind of an unfair thing to say there Ethan. You both know that Joyce can’t have the same thing with you that Dorothy and Walky can have, and I’m glad Joyce brought him up on it. Hopefully this relationship can end soon!
Ethan’s character is interesting though, Joyce has always been a lot stronger than Ethan was. When Joyce entered this relationship, she did it because she thought she could help him and help herself with their own ‘bad urges’, whereas Ethan did it because woo free beard.
And now when Joyce starts to realise maybe this is never going to work and starts doubting herself, instead of really talking it out, Ethan runs away. I like Ethan, I think he’s a nice guy and he’s been supportive of Joyce when she needs him, but he doesn’t have that courage that Joyce has. Which is even something he brings up! I don’t know, it’s just interesting to see how different these two are.
I mean he’s taking an easy way out here by trying to make her feel better by saying he loves her too, but it’s still not addressing the problems Joyce has. but bla bla bla interesting characters are good /ramble
Agreed. Joyce is secretly very strong, especially emotionally, whereas Ethan is like Chik-Fil-A. Bawk, bawk, bawk.
I don’t think Ethan’s in it solely for the beard, though, I think he also likes being close to people and taking care of them, which he can’t do for Amber right now. And they’re both afraid of being alone.
This whole comic series is, basically, let’s set up a bunch of very distinct people and watch ’em bounce off of each other in interesting ways. It is my favourite.
Yeah, I think Ethan’s definitely getting the caring and looking out for someone bit out of this that he wants, he’s just not ready to admit yet that he wants a boyfriend, too.
Also, distinct lack of available males. There’s that too.
basically he really tries to care for people but has no damn clue how to take care of himself, and that makes him not know either how to take care of other people, or something
These people have known each other for a month. ONE MONTH. And yet they’re all talking about how they love each other. That’s crazy fast even for hormonal teenagers or at-college-to-get-an-MRS. These people should be applying the brakes big-time when someone they’ve known for a few weeks claims to love them. Because that’s a Crazy Person Indicator.
(If you want character development, go ahead and timejump forward. We don’t have to spend three months on every single day of their academic lives.)
Damn Joyce,
I know its in her nature, but damn, why do i have the feeling that this Joyce is going to end up being hurt worse in the long run than the alien-fighting rebel who came to her senses eventually?
Weaving the confusion in love… well this is interesting and typical! Typical because with men, we can predict such behavior My deepest regards with Joyce..I can see what will happen with her. BTW, Thanks for sharing this awesome webcomic!
For a second there I was confused as to what Dorothy was trying to say.
I got that she’s asking if he likes her as a wife or a friend or a sister, but I initially thought she was actually saying HE was “wife” or “sister” material because she thought he was girly or whatever. I was like DAMN, girl, that’s cold. @_@
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“Can’t decide? Why not both?”
wait no that would be weird
also DAMMIT WILLIS
Doesn’t that depend on which state you come from?
It works in the south. Boy Howdy.
Fun fact, you can look up incest laws by state. In general, the north is the most lenient about incest, the south is where it’s banned.
That’s gotta count as some kind of irony.
Nah. Being illegal makes things more fun!
How do they know they’re doing something right unless the gubmint doesn’t approve?
Well, you could look at it as the North knows better but in the South they had to actually punish it
It was happening enough for them to make laws against it.
Not exactly.
Cousin marriage is legal in most of Dixie, much of the east coast, and a few western states, New mexico and California.
I assume its illegal in MA because it was never a problem.
I think most people here just assume its illegal
No need to pass a law where a crime almost never happens. Statutes on crime are a great way to deduce what crimes happen where. The more complexly worded and loop-holey a statute, the more experience lawmakers have had with a crime.
We’re assuming that lawmakers actually have experience with the things they legislate now? o.O
Well, in American law court precedence basically IS law so….
Then again, I live on another continent, so what do I know
Honestly? Probably more than most of us.
so thats why whaling is illegal in Nebraska. got it.
I was about to say, why not all three? Wait no bad.
The quote that I don’t remember where it’s from is “both,” otherwise that’s what I would’ve said.
It’s from The Running Man.
And weird is wrong because…
hey I just said “weird”
which, uh, means…
uh
*side-eyes the door*
Beginning of the End of this relationship…
Well it was bound to happen sooner or later. I hope they stay in touch.
well joicy could have found the gender bender ray from the paralel dimension (or wath ever it was my memory is a wreck)
The end is nigh…
The beginning WAS the end.
the beginning is the end is the beginning
Thank god.
damn come on man just be both
You mean a husband and a big brother? KINKY!
This sounds like the plot to many hentai’s I’ve viewed.
“Onee-SAAAMA!”
Onee-CHANnnnnnnn….
You got mixed up onee-sama is big sister. You probably are thinking of “Oniiiii-chaaaan!”
DoH!
DoH? Dumbing of Hentai?
Huh, I guess I’m never reading hentai ever.
Just stick with reading the wholesome ones with the naughty tentacles.
Consentacles can be pretty adorably sweet.
Dear diary today I heard the term “Consentacles” and I am unsure what to make of it.
Consenual sex with a sapient tentacle monster. It makes so much more sense than dudes, really. Its often quite excellent.
Consentacles reminds me of Ghastly’s Ghastly Comic: Tentacle Monsters & The Women Who Love Them.
http://www.ghastlycomic.com/
Warning: NSFW
Where there’s tentacles, there’s very rarely any incest. So, yeah.
…unless we’re in Lovecraft territory. People from the Miskatonic region have to put up with jokes about them sleeping with their huge, invisible, tentacled half-brothers.
Like any medium ever, 90% of it is shit but there are some real gems if you can suck it up and root around in the muck for a few minutes.
I saw this awful one where they called each other “sister” and it was VIOLENTLY SUBTITLED to insist THEY WERE NOT ACTUALLY SISTERS
so I dunno
Ah, F3: Frantic, Frustrated, and Female. The insistence of the subtitles that they were not sisters, and that their “landlord” was not their mother, despite them continually referring to each other as such, reached almost Pythonesque levels of absurdity… Especially since these insistent disclaiming subtitles did not appear until the second episode, thus the first episode played these familial relationships completely straight. (Or rather, completely lesbian!)
Cough… Not that I have ever seen it, of course…
Just like how schools in hentai are always “colleges” in translation, despite having homerooms, a set start time for all students, students punsihed by having to stand outside, and students cramming for the entrance exam to get into college.
On the other hand, given that non-USA countries often call high school ‘college’ and college ‘university’, that could be playing weirdly into the translation, maybe the translators are having that consistency issue instead. (Plus how they take entrance exams for high school in Japan, too.)
Pseudo-Incest is crazy common. Note the lack of the “in hentai” qualifier.
Well obviously – you wouldn’t want to accidentally exclude Star Wars, would you?
Star Wars wouldn’t even qualify, really. Pseudo-Incest is basically about finding a technically okay reason why the people who are having sex can say “Daddy”, “Sis,” etc. The most common one is step-, in my experience.
Old songs are full of people calling their S.O. things like “Momma”, “Daddy” or “Baby” and this is considered normal and not hideously disturbing AT ALL.
A Lannister always pays his debts in bed
There’s also the fact that the Japanese (as well as many hentai fans) seem to find the phrase ‘oni-chan’ cute and sexy, so many hentai producers have cute little girls saying it to people who demonstrably aren’t their big brothers, just to sell copy.
*ahem* not that I watch that stuff… *blush*
These not-relationships happen in a fair amount of non-hentai anime too.
Not just hentai. It’s actually fairly common for young kids in Japan to refer to older kids they feel close to as “big brother” or “big sister”.
“A future wife?” Is Joyce turning into Tommy Wieseu?
“Oh hai Dorothy. haha”
“How is your premarital hanky-panky life?”
YOU ARE TEARING ME APART, ETHAN.
Leave your stupid comments in your pocket.
That avatar made that comment so much better
Bad. Wrong. Badong, even.
I deed not heet her. I DEED NOT!
Oh hi Danny.
Don’t touch me mother-f-er.
Everyone betray me, I don’t have a friend in the world….
“A future wife?” Is Joyce turning into Tommy Wieseu?
“Oh hai Dorothy. haha”
“YOU’RE TEARING ME APART, ETHAN!!!”
Wow, deja vu.
Can’t read your alt-text on my phone, but you may notice by the timestamps that Totz actually beat Yotomoe to the punch.
So Totz wins I guess?
Leave your stupid comments in your pocket.
That avatar made the comment so much better.
In other news, if Sara and mike had a jerk contest, I wonder who’d win.
Even if you had to edit out the interminable ‘love’ scenes, I would LOVE to see Joyce’s reaction to ‘The Room.’
Something tells me it won’t be wife.
I think that Joyce has figured this out for herself. Their relationship made sense, in a weird self-deluded way, but it couldn’t outlast the delusions.
Maybe he’s holding out for husband??
HEY JOYCE, WANNA JOIN YOUR SIBLING IN AN EXCITING ADVENTURE BUT THE REVERSE
HEY ADVENTURE, WANNA EXCITE YOUR SIBLING IN A JOINING JOYCE?
Joyce’s best hope is sister-in-law.
Joyce why.
She wants the PMHP and is starting to realise that Ethan won’t be providing her with it.
Well hey at least Joyce is being upfront about what she wants.
Joyce, you don’t just go around asking gay boys to marry you…
Well, you can, but it’s likely to turn out poorly as often as not.
Of course there could be a practical reason for a gay student to say yes though.
Let’s say he was a dependent student whose parents made too much to get financial aid, getting married would put him in the independent category and allow him to qualify for Pell grants, which at close to six grand a year over a four year college education would add up to nearly twenty six thousand he wouldn’t have gotten otherwise, all for signing a marriage contract.
YAY THAT SANCTITY OF MARRIAGE
though it’s a thing for, say, Chinese gay/lesbian friends to agree to marry (but secretly keep their same-sex partners) just to get their parents to stop hassling them about marrying… though managing kids is a different matter
Next time, on Sanctity of Marriage: Gays Who Marry Straight!
Next time, on Sanctity of Marriage: Straight, Married, and Childless!
Next time, on Sanctity of Marriage: “I Married My Cousin!”
To think I thought all the kids getting married at the end of High School were nuts when in reality they may have been working the system to get money for college. Hindsight 20/20.
That’s not why all of us did it, but it was certainly a perk to the timing.
So to review: Walky and Dorry are fightin’, Bills an’ Ruth are in a Sexy Lesbian Suicicde Pact, Amber and DANNY are happy, secret datin’, Joyce is having a breakdown and Ethan is massively repressed.
And it’s still only Monday night.
This is gonna be a looong ass week, isn’t it?
prediction: Joyce finds out about Walky and Dorothy fighting, concludes that “See! Premarital sex DOES cause problems!”, and retreats back into her bubble of previously held beliefs for a while.
Also, don’t forget that Mary saw Billie furtively leave Ruth’s room
I could see that.
longer if Blaine gets out if the Hospital
OH GOD
I FORGOT ABOUT THAT
Mike: Hello, roomie! How was your day?
Walky: Well, Dorothy told me she loved me, and I told her I loved her, too. Now we’re both angry and miserable.
Mike: Good thing I started drinking early!
It’s always a long-ass week.
Hey, DanBer isn’t completely sacred, either. Ethan and Danny have some sort of hots for each other.
Sarah’s warming up an I-Told-You-So, surely. Tossing it in a crockpot. Low and slow, that’s the best way to get that lip-smacking good flavor.
I miss Sarah! Also, I thought it was so sweet yesterday when Joyce predicted that Sarah and Jacob will end up together, despite Sarah’s inability to believe in her own loveableness. I hope so, and I hope Joyce knows she’s loveable, too.
Great for Sarah sure but whats in it for Jacob?
Not getting unalived by Sarah, or just maybe Joyce?
…
…
Oh, wait, I think I said that backwards.
Maybe I’ve just been spoiled by Billie/Ruth, Walky/Sal, Sarah/everyone, but these guys drama seems incredibly subdued.
Chill, chill, it’s like shakin’ a bottle a’ Coke. Just gotta wait for the pressure to build to max and burst the top.
A volcano seems subdued as well. Until it isn’t.
You misspelled “repressed.”
It’s pretty extreme in its own way. A lot of their issues are things that are directed towards themselves, like Joyce’s issues with her own sexual desires and Ethan’s fear that he’ll never be “normal.” But until they resolve those things neither of them will be able to have healthy relationships. They’re never going to result in sexy suicide pacts, but they will result in a lot of sad feelings.
I’m holding out on Sarah’s prediction back in page 16 of Book 3 Chapter 3.
“If anybody else finds out you’re doing this, they will not stand for it. You will lose them. You willespecially lose Dorothy.”
Sure, these two won’t rattle each other like other pairs, but the outside workd won’t take kindly to it.
oh riiiiight, I hadn’t thought about that
And there it is the truth surface’s and he backs down
“See? you can have what Dorothy has: a guy who throws around the word “love” because that’s what you do to level up the relationship.”
But damn if we aren’t charming.
I think you have something there.
Except Walky threw it out specifically to derail the leveling up that Dorothy had been trying to engage in.
I love you as a beard. You’re a really nice beard. Don’t have to shave you or nuthin’.
Now I’m picturing a bald Joyce. Thanks for making it weird.
Now I’m thinking of a bald Joyce as well but probably in a different light
Well, I suppose dating Ethan is a way of having her oath of celibacy on record, so the bald look could work with that! (Now to time how long it takes someone to get the reference…)
Man, I hope she doesn’t do that. Willis would have to start putting in a lot of filler to dilute the plot to the point that it matched Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
(Which would probably have been a decent episode, but oh my stars, it made a terrible movie.)
…Bald women can be super hot, guys. Guys, I serious. Guys?
Well, Sigourney Weaver has never been hotter than in Alien 3.
And I actually typed that entire sentence before realizing that it doubles as a horrifying pun. o_o
Sorry, lack of experience.
Well I think she’ll be fine now. And as for those choices if I were dating her. It’d be whichever she wants.
But she doesn’t want to want what she wants! Why do you have to go and corrupt her? What would Becky say?
Only you would say that.
And I don’t care what Becky says. Screw Becky
God I hope this is the beginning of the end for this relationship.
Me too.
Yeah! Let us sail the Ethan/Danny ship!
Aw HELL yeah. Pull the main-halyard and connect the blocks! It’s about to sail!
The Dethany?
That sounds like a rejected album title by Dethklok
I hope this is the beginning of the end of their *romantic* relationship.
They make such wonderful friends and they can compare notes on parental nastiness.
And prenatal nastiness, which is how I read that at first.
The beginning of the relationship was the beginning of the end for this relationship.
Perhaps the beginning is the end is the beginning for this relationship. Maybe that’s where Batman fits into all of this.
Relationships are facing facts this arc. Dorothy and Walky have to decide whether it is just for fun. Joyce and Ethan will have to settle for best gay friend. Ruth and Billie need to remove suicidal from the relationship. Because none of these are ready to go the distance until they do.
And Amber and Danny have to face facts about the whole Amazi-Girl thing, each in their own way.
Oh good, I was waiting for this relationship to hit the rocks. They may have had the right to choose to be with each other if they wanted, but that doesn’t change the fact that it was just a really bad idea right from the start.
Farewell, EthanxJoyce, you should never have been a thing in the first place. :l
I think its just started showing its potential;
I dont want it to end prematurely. I don’t want to drag it out for its own sake, only because it could be therapeutic for both charcters
Poor everyone. Hugs? I wonder who would be better for helping Joyce right now, if anyone. Maybe her sister could since she’s likely been through some similar thoughts.
Well done Joyce for asking the question you don’t want the answer to but asking it anyway
More like that question she’s neglected to ask for a while.
I don’t know I mean how long has she really known hes gay? Less then two weeks I’m guessing so shes doing well given her background I’m guessing…
It’s been about 8.5 days
Hasn’t she known he’s gay for the entire length of the (theoretically romantic) relationship?
That’s what I thought too.
Dailybrad, I don’t think Sarah is like that. She does not revel in turning the screw in people she cares for or ones she doesn’t actually.
Sarah is a realist. She tells it like she see’s it without sweetening it up.
More like:
“Joyce, you’re an idiot, you know this is wrong for you and I’m sorry you’re hurt but, damn girl, you gotta move on’
I was mostly teasing. Sarah does care about Joyce quite a bit, basically her little sister of sorts, but she still told her from day one this was a shitty idea for both parties. She has admitted she has some “I told you so” in her, but that the time she really wanted to do it, the gravity of the situation was far too grave for it, with the drugging incident.
Could it be? Is the break up finally here?
Keep you fingers and don’t stop believing, its almost over
Not yet, I think. This seems like a precursor to the actual decline of the relationship. Probably there’s going to be another steamy situation with Danny at some point in the future that’s going to cause 1) Danny to critically re-examine his sexuality, and 2) cause Ethan to finally admit to himself that it’s just not healthy for him to try to force himself into a heterosexual relationship.
Or alternately, it’ll cause Joyce (and Amber?) to talk him through the fact that its not fair to him or the women he’d be with to keep up the pretense
We’re definitely closer to the end than the beginning though
I dunno. I feel like the slingshot hasn’t pulled back far enough yet for the maximum amount of stinging pain.
Ethan really ought to talk to somebody about what he’s doing and feeling. And his only possible confidant is Danny. This is my horrible, monstrous hope.
The left side of your computer screen is filthy.
With that avatar and that smudge right in front of her face, that was perfect for me.
mine actually IS filthy.
I should probably clean it.
And this is the part of the story where everything goes downhill and everyone screams “DAMN YOU WILLIS!!!!!” isn’t it? ‘Cause I’ll be legitimately surprised if it takes a turn for the better… Maybe Ruth and Billie get together and Marry only wants to throw them a big ‘ol Ice Cream party with a petting zoo and laser tag… Maybe Walky and Dorothy will realize the power of love through an 80’s power ballad… Maybe Joyce will find a nice boyfriend and not have her heart crushed… Maybe Ethan will find a nice boyfriend also… Maybe just this once… Just this once, everybody is happy… goddammit…
Don’t you see Rose? Just this once, nobody had to die!
Yeah, and maybe Mike will stop being an asshole!
thats the easiest part to fix
Poor Mickey, not even his name’s right.
I want to be mad at Joyce for fueling the gay denial in Ethan and want to say she had it coming for trying to start a doomed relationship with someone who couldn’t be romantically attracted to her, but I can feel the hurt in loving someone who just isn’t into your gender.
They’re not bad people, just… deeply flawed. But they’re working on it, Joyce particularly.
Ethan owes it to himself to be trying a fuckload of a lot harder than he is, though.
to be fair tho ethan DID agree to the relationship knowing full well he is not and will not be attracted to her. And essentially is just stringing her along, for a beard, to keep his parents happy.
They are both being stupid but you cant help but feel sorry for both there situations.
Yeah, you’re right, Ethan is kinda at fault for this two. So they’re both just using each other and nobody is gonna be happy in the end =/
I mean, at the end of the day, it’s not really a romance. They are basically in this relationship because they want some companionship but can’t handle a romantic relationship right now, for various reasons. One major reason Joyce is unhappy right now is because she is lonely. Ending this relationship wont make her any happier “in the end” until the other issues are sorted out.
And suddenly Joyce is starting to realize the implications of dating a gay guy.
Lil’ Sister in Law if all goes well for Ethan. I’mjussaying.
The only sibling we’ve met is Jocelyne. I don’t think Ethan wants to date another girl, even a male-bodied one.
To be fair, we were never given room to see Ethan really process that revelation, like, “…yeah, but I’d still hit that.” (or not?)
Good job, Ethan. >_<
Man. Joyce was raised to only see within a particular worldview, but then she has these highly perceptive moments, and it’s tough. DYW.
That’s the problem with legitimately smart people. They start connecting logic dots as new information comes along. Its so very hard to keep them mindlessly leashed to dogmatic ideals once out of a hermetically sealed echo chamber.
What’s truely horrible is that they don’t get equipped with the tools to properly handle that input. The most important skill is learning how to learn. The methods and process of finding, evaluating, and integrating new information against what you already know. Without practice early you can end up in a cascade of questioning everything you’ve ever known because so much is in conflict with what you’re experiencing.
We know what that means. Don’t say “we can still be friends” either, because we know what that means too, Ethan.
Good girl Joyce. Glad you’re actually thinking now. Alright, so what you gotta do now it break it off with Ethan and encourage him to be who he was meant to be.
A nerdy Transformers fan-boy.
Yes
The feels. All of the feels!
Out of all the Dumbing characters, Joyce is the one I’m least fond of.
WHAT, HOW CAN YOU LIKE BLAINE MORE
OR FAZ OR MARY EVEN
I just feel really bad for her. I’ve seen people who grew up as sheltered as she is, and it’s really tough for them to process the world around them.
I’ve had friends who have lived as sheltered a life as Joyce has been shown having, yet they are more understanding in the world. Way I see Joyce is like a brainwashed cult member rather then just a devoted Christian. To me she isn’t even trying to process a world outside the blind faith she has been raised in.
I don’t see she has to “break it off” with Ethan or whatever. I think she is doing pretty well, actually. She just has to figure out “its” place. It’s sort of disappointing that Ethan decides to run rather than help with that. But then it’s also sort of defining the limits of what she can expect of Ethan. I think he could do better than that in the “friend” department. Heck, even in the “big brother” department.
I thought he was running because he thinks Joyce guessed that he was attracted to her “brother”, and he’s worried he might accidentally spill Jocelyne’s secret to Joyce if he starts trying to explain why he’s not going to leave her for her “brother.”
Neither of the above! You’re an adorable YouTube hamster, Joyce, and bibles are your tiny burritos.
Parry Gripp?
I got really mad at Ethan in panel three for a moment. Promising Joyce the same “as Dorothy” sounded an awful lot like clinging to their stupid charade. Luckily, Joyce called him out for it immadiately.
Whoa Ethan, are you a Pokemon? ‘Cause you just got BURNED!
(yes, I choose to quip insyead of focusing on drama or potential thereof)
PARALYZED with fear!
This relationship is POISONED. FROZEN in it’s tracks!
SLEEP!
JOYCE woke up!
JOYCE used DRAMA!
It’s super-effective!
Man, Ethan is just Danning it up all over the place. He’s starting to out-Dan Danny. Heck, he’s even Danning it up with Danny.
What happened between Ethan and Danny wasn’t Danning-ish at all. It was perfect.
Right up until the end when they both Danned things up a bunch. I like your name, by the way.
Yeah, the part at the end was the Danning, where Ethan found the deepest closet he could and hid beneath some big ‘ol woolen coats, that would be what I was referring to.
Oh, gods, I want to hug them both so bad right now.
oh, Ethan; so close!
This could have gone a lot worse. I was expecting her to say I love your first, romantically; ,and Joyce’s drama-hurricane factor to go way up, maybe up to 3, maybe all the way up to Billieforce.
This could have been a Damn-You-Willis moment of epic proportions.
that should say ‘i was expecting Joyce to say “i love you” romantically FIRST —thus putting Ethan in a bind, and setting us for courses under water
His save wasnt bad. But it wasnt great. It was an inoculation , not a cure
Gosh, I know so many couples who endured the heartbreak of entering into just such marriages. I feel for both the Joyces and the Ethans in the world.
Marriages where one loved the other as a friend or sibling, but not romantically. Damn, I didn’t consider that notion. It’s existentially shattering.
Damn you Wills! *shakes fist*
The number of DYWes going around lately have made me remember something you might find interesting: Almost all fatal brain aneurysms occur in the part of the brain called the “Circle of Willis”
This has lead me to conclude that you are actually trying to murder us all by inducing such a level of DYW that fatal brain aneurysms occur.
D=
*MIND BLOWN*
Dammit there goes another one.
Who else wants to see Joyce pester Billie for a while and try to get relationship advice from her asking all the time about her boyfriend?
I just need some laugh after seeing this page.
Get Dina in here, stat!
She’s probably already there.
Kind of an unfair thing to say there Ethan. You both know that Joyce can’t have the same thing with you that Dorothy and Walky can have, and I’m glad Joyce brought him up on it. Hopefully this relationship can end soon!
I love you like a man loves a children’s cartoon
I don’t think you know how much some men (and women) love children’s cartoons.
Ethan’s character is interesting though, Joyce has always been a lot stronger than Ethan was. When Joyce entered this relationship, she did it because she thought she could help him and help herself with their own ‘bad urges’, whereas Ethan did it because woo free beard.
And now when Joyce starts to realise maybe this is never going to work and starts doubting herself, instead of really talking it out, Ethan runs away. I like Ethan, I think he’s a nice guy and he’s been supportive of Joyce when she needs him, but he doesn’t have that courage that Joyce has. Which is even something he brings up! I don’t know, it’s just interesting to see how different these two are.
I mean he’s taking an easy way out here by trying to make her feel better by saying he loves her too, but it’s still not addressing the problems Joyce has. but bla bla bla interesting characters are good /ramble
Agreed. Joyce is secretly very strong, especially emotionally, whereas Ethan is like Chik-Fil-A. Bawk, bawk, bawk.
I don’t think Ethan’s in it solely for the beard, though, I think he also likes being close to people and taking care of them, which he can’t do for Amber right now. And they’re both afraid of being alone.
This whole comic series is, basically, let’s set up a bunch of very distinct people and watch ’em bounce off of each other in interesting ways. It is my favourite.
Yeah, I think Ethan’s definitely getting the caring and looking out for someone bit out of this that he wants, he’s just not ready to admit yet that he wants a boyfriend, too.
Also, distinct lack of available males. There’s that too.
basically he really tries to care for people but has no damn clue how to take care of himself, and that makes him not know either how to take care of other people, or something
best frustrated queer-platonic couple in comics
I told you. I TOLD you this relationship could only end in tears.
Every relationship ever ends in tears one way or another.
Unless you sorta just lose touch over time. Or if you die simultaneously. Happily ever after!
Yeap — there are no happy endings.
Oh shit.
She saw right through that gaze at Joshua, huh.
That is how I interpreted the last of Joyce’s options, although of course you mean Jocelyne, not Joshua.
Sis-zoned! Also, cis-zoned!
+1
Good on Joyce to pull the figurative trigger. The wait’s so excruciating.
Joyce and Ethan both have issues coming to terms with being friends of Dorothy?
THEY HAVE SO MUCH IN COMMON
Ah, Dorothy’s name. Truly the gift that keeps on giving.
I know that DYW plans things out a loooooooooong way in advance, but did he plan for all the Friends of Dorothy jokes?
Didn’t he start them?
These people have known each other for a month. ONE MONTH. And yet they’re all talking about how they love each other. That’s crazy fast even for hormonal teenagers or at-college-to-get-an-MRS. These people should be applying the brakes big-time when someone they’ve known for a few weeks claims to love them. Because that’s a Crazy Person Indicator.
(If you want character development, go ahead and timejump forward. We don’t have to spend three months on every single day of their academic lives.)
Technically true, but I think there has to be some allowance made for the time-stretched format of a comic.
I thought the point was that they’re all crazy…
Or at least being driven crazy by their unsorted baggage.
Aw man, too early to be feeling things.
To be fair, even if he was hetero, if you ask “future wife?” to a college freshman he might run off…
Hahahah…true.
Ethan, noooooooo. Stop saying what you think she wants to hear and say something that actually makes sensssssssse.
Ethan you dropped the ball big time in panel 3 unless you really don’t know what the hell Joyce actually wants
ya’kno what.
Joyce is pretty aware of how things are at least considering she felt the need to ask those 3 specific choices..
Do you think the last question was a reference to her brother or just as how Ethan sees her?
Y’ mean her Sister?
I took it as a reference to her relationship with Sarah.
Good thing he’s “good”.
Damn Joyce,
I know its in her nature, but damn, why do i have the feeling that this Joyce is going to end up being hurt worse in the long run than the alien-fighting rebel who came to her senses eventually?
Weaving the confusion in love… well this is interesting and typical! Typical because with men, we can predict such behavior
My deepest regards with Joyce..I can see what will happen with her. BTW, Thanks for sharing this awesome webcomic!
For a second there I was confused as to what Dorothy was trying to say.
I got that she’s asking if he likes her as a wife or a friend or a sister, but I initially thought she was actually saying HE was “wife” or “sister” material because she thought he was girly or whatever. I was like DAMN, girl, that’s cold. @_@