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David M Willis! @damnyouwillis.bsky.social ⋅ 22d
Bayjmin Tuckles @bayjmin-tuckles.bsky.social ⋅ 17h
David M Willis! @damnyouwillis.bsky.social ⋅ 22d
Brian Tyler Cohen @briantylercohen.bsky.social ⋅ 21h
Mae Dean @maegodhavemercy.com ⋅ 2d
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ETHAN©®™ now available in kind-of-gay! (patent pending)
Order right now and you’ll get a random Transformer for free!
While supplies last.
Redeem our product code online to receive a free video of Amber licking Sky Lynx, free of charge!
*Wait, no, I’m sorry, seems that offer has SOLD OUT?!! Already? Damn, I know there’s plenty of people who like Amber, but ALREADY?!?! DAMN….alright, um, we’re experiencing…What?……..Alright, um, due to overwhelming demand, the Amber licking Sky Lynx deal is temporarily on hold as we work to gather the components needed. However word is we have another option in the works, apparently an actual Transformer is volunteering for the sequel performance…What-ball?….”
“Sorry, Squire, your server crashed”! Looks like t’ load on the NIC crashed it.
*Rebooting the kernel.* *Re-Spawning processes.*
“Dang, it crashed again. Try it without networking”?
Considering the fanbase, that would be a rather lucrative video…
Don’t tell Ethan that, or he’ll go in/come out every week until he gets the one he wants.
Ethan… ordering more Ethans…
I am okay with this. Not like he needs to be TOLD to go fuck himself.
[Larry the Cable Guy] I don’t care who you are that there’s funny[/Larry the Cable Guy]
Is the Transformer Sky Lynx? Cuz Ethan would want one.
Wait, is this chain of comments/webcomic turning into a game of “Guess what’s in the box?” by any chance? The Facebook Transformer fan group Daniel the Human’s part of is cracking down on those, far too many of them starting up lately for their liking…
I don’t care about which Transformer Amber is currently receiving from her online shopping, but I sure wouldn’t mind playing “Guess what’s in Amber’s box” either right now.
XD
*insert female personal hygiene item joke here*
BOGOF – Buy One Get One Free?
I’ll take 3!
I’ll take a dozen!
Yeah, Tesla.
oof. too soon
You should have got the copyrights Amber.
Amber should patent “My boyfriends are both interested in male parts and my life sucks” a novel by Amazigirl
Chapter 1: I have like the worst gaydar!
Chapter 2: Why I’m now a fujsohi
Chapter 3: On the bright side, I have a great relationship with the press!
Chapter 4: Nevermind, the press just hit on me.
Chapter 5: Thhe thrilling hunt for the Dong Bandit.
Chapter 6 : my dad splattered on the asphalt.
Chapter 7: Amazigirl vs. Toedad (The dad punchinging)
Chapter 8: Amazi-Girl vs Toedad 2 (The Re-punchening)
Whiteboard Ding-Dong Bandit
Chapter 3: Dinosaur otakus and the fundie lesbians who love them.
dang, i really wish this had made it into the original table of contents above
It got released in the British edition. Amazon.uk should have it.
That should go between “My dad splattered on the asphalt” and “Amazigirl vs ToeDad, The punchening”.
I think maybe she should write it before patenting it…?
((j/k I’m pretty sure you can’t patent novels since they’re already a thing))
Correct. You have to copywrite them.
At least the current one swings her way as well.
He’s out of the closet. Maybe he’ll go back maybe he won’t we’re playing it close to the chest.
Ethan is the campus Groundhog when it comes to sexuality it seems…
c’mon Ethan, you think Amber’s gonna turn a girl over to her abusive father?
No, but she might insist that Becky not stay on school grounds, etc, with that being illegal and all. Or try and take things into her own, violent hands in the case of Toe-Dad and potentially fucking things up even more.
Becky being upset that Amber folded her dad’s spine in half would be a delicious source of drama.
Blaine may be remorseless and brutal, but he doesn’t seem larger than an average adult male. Toe-Dad is fucking massive. Even with the element of surprise, I’d expect punching him would go over as well as punching Strong Mad.
Punches are only one form of violence. Amazi-girl can do other stuff.
A cinderblock dropped from a rooftop seems overly extreme, and a little underhanded for her, but there are options. Punch to the throat, push on his joints and knock him down, and then make him STAY down. No matter how big someone is, they still have joints and can feel pain, and someone with practice can exploit that.
Amazi girl in the end is an 18 year old girl with little to no training. Her biggest threats thus far have been graffiti artists, she has very little practice
No training? Have you forgotten about her crazy parkour stunts? I cant speak for her fight but her flight is well developed.
Yeah but she doesn’t always have the best fight-related strategic judgement. She was foolish in so many ways in her fight with Sal & The Gang, but probably the most was losing the element of surprise and letting them all come at her at once.
She was definitely not in a “strategic” mindspace in that fight, however. With another kid in a bad situation depending on her, I’d imagine (hope!) she’d be less reckless.
Can’t find it right now, but Amber has said that after Sal held up the shop she was in, her Dad sent her to Martial Arts classes instead of counseling, so she’s got a decent idea how to fight. That said, as Historyman pointed out, she could do with a few strategy pointers…
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-4/04-the-whiteboard-dong-bandit/tippingpoint/
It was Ethan, actually, who said it.
That’ll explain why I couldn’t find it, I was searching AMBER+Danny…
Further improving Amazi-Girl’s chances with Blaine, there’s every indication that Blaine himself has some knowledge and experience in punching, but there’s little reason to believe Toe-dad is similarly capable. You can be large and strong and still have no idea what to do when four-foot girl kneecaps you and then starts stomping on your face.
You’ve thought this out to a disturbing level. That is so hot!
I think he thinks she might turn Becky over to the RA or other campus authorities.
If she did that even knowing Becky’s sitch, that would count as Amber’s Kick The Dog moment.
I doubt Amber would turn Becky in. That’s what the horrible dad wants, and it would not be justice. She’d be a loose violent person though, plus Ethan hasn’t got permission to tell, so it’s still wiser to change the subject.
Seeing the word sitch made me think of Kim Possible, and now all I can think is that Danny would make a great Ron Stoppable.
Amber’s been in a weird place lately. Maybe she’d be cool. Maybe not. Hell of a thing to be gambling on.
Agree.
I kind of think she more chaotic good than any other choice.
Not sure which way she will jump.
Chaotic good would be a good thing, same as neutral, good because then she could choose to not follow the housing rules in honor of the greater good.
But if she is lawful then she won’t be able to help it because those rules are there for practical and logical reasons (which are not unfair in the great picture).
Most supers are neutral or chaotic good, with the notable exception of ’60s TV show Batman, who was deputized and registered (as Batman) as a LEO. He’s the one in the Lawful Good square of the 9 alignments poster.
Yeah, especially of late. Amber’s divergence of her DID personalities is getting way more intense:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/04-walking-with-dina/socialcircumstances/
And her Amazi-Girl persona is a stickler for the rules and Amber views that as critical to her mental well-being and psychological survival and so has a lot of barriers in place to try to keep that from breaking down:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/03-the-butterflies-fly-away/expulsion/
And unfortunately for Becky, one of the things that Amber thinks is critical is this idea that Amazi-Girl is consistent about rule-breaking whereas Amber may or may not be allowed some inconsistency:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-4/03-up-all-night-to-get-vengeance/consistent/
However, the bleedover effect as the personalities are still somewhat integrated seems to be mostly going in the Amazi-Girl to Amber direction and so Amber has shown herself to be inflexible about minor rule breaking before:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-5/03-the-butterflies-fly-away/disperse-2/
And that last one is important because that was the last time Ethan has seen her and so that growing inflexibility is probably very much on his mind.
Honestly, it’s a safe precaution to make and I could very much seeing Amber choosing to uphold the rules above all else with regards to Becky’s situation in order to protect how she thinks her mind works (and a little bit to fuck over Joyce for being a more recent queer-supporting ex who is getting to do all these little getting out of the closet actions with Ethan as pettiness and fear and other Amber emotions have been shown to affect Amazi-Girl in the past (see her confrontation with Sal).
Also, hoo boy Amber, divergence and forcing your personalities into rigid roles and tasks in the brain are not good directions for a DID person to go. Eventually she’s going to have to let her personalities converse with each other and really integrate into a whole again, because trying to separate them more and more and using your pre-existing props as a tool to do so is just a recipe for a lot of rough times and unnecessary suffering.
But then again, this isn’t Healthy Students Making Healthy Choices About Their Psychological Health of Age.
What I’m afraid of is that Amber will find out that Becky is breaking the rules, but not the reason why. Amber would hate Ross for multiple reasons, what with the controlling assholeness, and the trying to degay his daughter. I doubt she would turn Becky over to him. But if Amazi Girl doesn’t know about why Becky is doing what she’s doing, she could very well turn her in on principle.
As Amber, she’d be ok with helping Becky or keeping her secret but as Amazi-Girl? Who knows. She’s shown both a disregard for certain rules while placing high importance on others so it’s hard to know where she’d stand as AG.
A reminder, a Patent lasts longer than a Trademark, but nowhere near as long as a Copyright.
In a perfect world/Where everyone is equal/I’d still have the film rights and be working on the sequels!–Elvis Costello & The Attractions
Well, Amber *is* giving him a longing look everyday (everyday) everyday he writes the book!
A trademark lasts forever, as long as you are still using it.
Patent: government granted monopoly on a useful idea or invention; IIRC lasts 20 years in the US. Alleged justification: fostering science by rewarding inventors with temporary monopoly profits.
Copyright: government granted monopoly on a creative work; IIRC lasts life + 90 years. Originally lasted 14 years, with an option to renew for another 14 years. A lot saner then. Alleged justification: fostering art by rewarding artists and their estates with temporary monopoly profits.
Trademark: government granted monopoly on a brand or name. Lasts forever if you use and defend it right. Justification: it’s useful to be sure that the business you’re dealing with is the business you think you’re dealing with.
Currently the Trademark office only awards Trademark protections for 11 years, although a Trademark is renewable.
Example: Revell, a model kit company, took out Trademarks on the Robotech title back in 1983. Harmony Gold bought the Trademarks for said Robotech IP outright in the summer of 1987 and immediately renewed them with the Trademark office. They renewed them again in advance of the Exo-Squad re-releases of the old Matchbox toys by Playmates. And they’ve been renewed since.
Okay their banter is adorable.
err, okay this conversation as a whole is kind of a bummer, but that last bit really tells on how close they are
Well now I’m more curious than ever to see how Amber responds when she realizes what’s going on with Becky.
Though…she knows Becky and Dina are dating now, even though Becky was just supposed to be visiting, so she might put two and two together…
putting two and two together is dina’s job. the rest of them steer clear of that. apart from amazi-girl that one time.
And Dorothy that other time.
I may have missed it, but when did Ethan promise to look out for Tow Dad (assuming that is who he’s looking out for)?
I think that happened “off-screen”.
It happened off-screen but it gets brought up here:
http://www.dumbingofage.com/2015/comic/book-6/01-to-those-whod-ground-me/sposeta/
So glad Ethan changed the subject there. Who knows where this could’ve gone otherwise.
I like how alignments have leached into nerd culture as a whole. I’m still grumpy about 4e removing half of ’em.
I still prefer the 3.5 nine alignments system myself.
5e brought them back, and provided more encouragement for looser interpretations of them than 3.5 and 2e before it.
I miss 3.5’s bloated options for character builds, but 5e is much more elegant.
I didn’t even know there was a 5e.
It came out a couple years ago, if I’m remembering right.
There is, but they don’t call it Fifth Edition, because they are embarrassed to admit 4ed failed so hard.
And it came out last year.
They should be embarrassed in their fans poor taste, I agree.
4th was a disaster with heavily nerfed rules for the WoW crowd. The less spoken of it the better. And I’m still not happy with what 5th did to my favorite class, Warlock.
‘nerfed rules’? Are you for bloody real? If what you mean is ‘casters are no longer king’, then yes, but the rules themselves were mostly the same.
I mean, a more charitable reading is “They made DnD more of a tactical wargame”, I suppose, and here’s the thing: It didn’t. DnD has always been a tactical wargame. What it wasn’t, was honest about it. In 4th edition, at LAST, they were blessedly honest. They made a much better system as a result. If you were going to roleplay in DnD, it was just as hard as it was before, but now the system is less poisonous to itself, while being just as unhelpful to RP as it always has been.
Oh, and the equipment section doesn’t make me froth at the mouth over misnamed weapons and armor. Simmering resentment is much better than babbling rage.
They just should removed the whole thing. alignments re pretty dumb.
That’s just because you haven’t seen the Nine Alignments of Batman poster.
Or the Deep Space 9 version:
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/originals/9b/e1/67/9be1676b9ce52474650a4edbd5eca45c.jpg
I have always seen Odo as bouncing between CG and LG.
Well, he follows his own rules and pays lip service to Starfleet. It fits in either, but his unwillingness to compromise makes me lean towards Lawful.
Categorizing complex characters into the alignments doesn’t really work, but it’s fun anyway.
Yes, of course, a stupid meme will save a bad idea.
Yes, they’re dumb. They’re still useful for helping newbies learn to roleplay, and D&D’s fame makes it a gateway game for a lot of newbies.
Honestly? They’re not. They cause more harm than good – especially since they’re concrete concepts that exist in the world, yet are still inordinately nebulous.
Surprised Amber isn’t familiar with the concept, given he WoW obsession. Unless she was just “huh?”-ing Ethan’s connection of it to her. Or Willis was just giving the uninitiated in the audience a bit more explanation so they could get what the heck was going on.
I think she is IS familiar, just doesn’t know WHY it’s being used on her. Ethan points out after she asks why the broken rules for a good reason part, then changed subject before it got any deeper…
Seems like Ethan’s looking up in the sky for ToeDad.
It’s a bird! It’s a plane! No, it’s just ToeDad, ugh.
Looks like Ross is blasting off again!
well, that COULD be where to look for a shuttlecock
I don’t know why but my brain is now singing “ToeDad, ToeDad, does whatever a ToeDad can”.
Is the 60’s Spider-man theme you are hearing when you are singing that?
You know it. :3
You’ve made me think of the strangely-named musical from several years ago, “Oh Dad, Poor Dad, Mom’s Hung You in the Closet and I’m Feeling So Sad.”
Oh great, just what we need, Toedad swooping in from the sky. Swooping is bad.
In Panel 5, Ethan has just noticed Toedad flying in by jetpack.
How much would Mike charge for a sabotaged jetpack?
Your mom…..and a nickel.
It’d be free of charge. The realization of Toedad learning he got dicked over is all the payment Mike needs.
IT’S-
[cue giant Monty Python foot stepping on everybody]
I love the range of Amber’s facial expressions in this strip lol.
Alignment is the single worst concept ever introduced into RPGs.
But still, Amber alter ego is a vigilante. Which is kind of illegal. I think she should be down with breaking some rules for good.
(I wiigiied that into “hoof” on my first try, which set off all my brony alarms and made me want to give myself a beating.)
It could be improved/refined but for most part, I like the alignment spectrum.
It’s a tool, not a leash. Or it’s supposed to be.
A baseline to work from is really helpful for organically developing a character’s personality, and back when tabletop games were mostly wargames, every aid to RP would have been much more critical.
Not much of a reason to keep them now though. There are useful baselines, but you get far more mileage out of thinking things through on a more thorough level. L5R’s got a lot of problems, but the 20 questions at chargen are legit pretty helpful. Nobody should expect you to know everything before a character’s voice is found, but 9 arbitrary boxes are pointless. Though to be fair, the worst part of alignments is how, like many other DnD things, the fanbase insists it applies to literally everything.
So far as useful ethics in RPGs, I’ve found Legends of the Wulin’s virtues pretty good (Though it could stand to be less fixed at chargen, before you’ve found a character’s voice)
that is such a lawful neutral thing to say
It can work, as long as people don’t think that, for instance Chaotic Neutral means batshit insane, or that all Evil characters must constantly cause mass destruction, just for the lulz.
If you want a good example of a Lawful Evil Empire, try the Order of the Stick, starting when they get to the Empire of Blood in strip 717.
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0717.html
The problem isn’t with the alignments themselves, but with how people interpret them and choose thereby to play them. People have been playing them mainly at the extreme ends of each spectrum for longer than I’ve been alive and I got my start in the hobby in AD&D 1E. Most humans and demihumans should fall around the circle equidistant between true neutral and the other 8 extremes and heroic characters, like PCs, should fall closer to but not absolutely on the extremes which are pretty much the purview of the beings of the outer planes and other beings who are not native to the prime material plane and it’s environs.
“Kind of illegal”? How about “totally and unambiguously illegal”? On any given night when Amazi-Girl is out on patrol, she’s got even on on being the most illegal thing going on at the time.
My understanding was that the alignments were added to keep players from assuming good guys always follow the rules or that bad guys don’t respect them. I’ve even found them a useful way to explain that to people in real life.
But yeah, vigilantism is almost the definition of chaotic good, when it’s good at all. Lawful superheroes would be the ones who work with the cops like old school detectives.
I have to be honest, if Amber finds out about this and rats everyone out because it’s “against the rules” I will hate her forever.
Somehow I think Amber would be sympathetic to running from an abusive dad. She might break him in half though and Ethan hasn’t got permission to tell so it’s good he changed the subject.
Yeah, I guess that’s true. Ooh, I hope she breaks him in half.
I hope she only folds him in half, or possibly fifths; no need to make more work for the janitorial staff.
Comments like this are why this needs a +1 system.
Honestly, between her experience with a jerk dad and vicariously experiencing Ethan’s parents being awful about him being gay… I think Becky’s secret is pretty safe with Amber of all people. She should understand both major reasons Becky ran away from her dad in the first place and why she’s hiding out here.
I wish I could upvote your comment
It seems like Amber would be the perfect person to understand all of this, and, if need be, track down Toedad and kick his ass.
She won’t do that. She knows what it’s like to have a shitty dad.
Amazi-girl has rules about lawbreaking, though.
Maybe this could be the straw that breaks the camel’s back and forces her to merge her personas.
That… could have unforeseen effects. :[
Before getting to the merging part she’d probably have a mental breakdown though. : /
why am I now thinking of the Fusion Dance
Because you are a wonderful person.
I have habanero in my sinuses now from laughing at that mental image, though, so thanks for that.
Which Fusion Dance exactly? The dancing style with a partner or the Dragon Ball one?
Dragon ball
This. Amber’s personalities are diverging and that’s flaring up a lot more ever since her panic attack about being like her dad at Parent’s Weekend.
And so while Amber may have every reason to fully empathize with Becky’s situation and suffering, I can definitely see her Amazi-Girl persona getting all worked up about rule-breaking and more importantly, whether or not its a breaking of Amazi-Girl’s “code” to aid and abet said rule-breaking.
It’d probably fall the side of helping Becky in the end, but it’s a genuine risk that they haven’t reached the point of needing to take yet.
Though, given that Amazi-Girl has given Joyce her number in case of a crisis, I don’t see it being out of the norm for Joyce to reach out to her in a crisis point and take that risk.
Ya know, Amber being so gung-ho to micro-manage Ethan like this is kinda messed up if you think about it too long…
If you think about anything too long, it can be messed up.
For example, if you think about how someone calls himself a detective despite lacking the skills, credentials or authority of a detective, yet still does it to have the ability to have people arrested for things they probably didn’t do, it becomes pretty messed up.
And that’s why I choose not to think about things for too long.
are you talking about Nancy Drew, 80-year-old 18-year-old?
Amber can’t be Nancy Drew, she doesn’t have a pudgy friend Bess to get hot fudge sundaes with after every mystery!
no, but amazi-girl can be spooned by a bony bi-boy. personally, i prefer ice cream
The entire comments section had that idea before either of them.
There’s a difference between Lawful Good and “Lawful Awful” though, and I think there’s a way to be LG and still have no problem with Becky being a perma-guest.
The Lawful Good response might be to help Becky get access to a homeless shelter, food pantry, etc., where she can hide from her dad without breaking rules. But homeless shelters are not nice places, and Becky is much safer with her friends on campus, plus Amazi-Girl is a vigilante, not a caseworker.
The Lawsome response would be to kick someone in the head.
That is an option.
I was worried about this, though I think Amber would be one who could understand Becky’s problem the most sense she went through both the experiences of, “My best friend is gay I want to help them because they’re losing everything” and “My Father is a controlling asshole who’s hurting me more than helping me.”
Also reminds me of back when I said that Amber and Joyce are like 2 different sides of the same coin.
No, I think Ethan is right: Not every problem should get a punch in the nose, even when it deserves a punch in the nose.
This problem is best resolved with quiet voiced verbal confrontation. Amber MIGHT be able to pull that off but, the anonymous AG has been more of a swift deliverer of nosepunchery.
Toedad has to be maneuvered into ceasing a pursuit he believes is just and Beck has been shown to be too emotionally affected to pull that off alone. Whatever happens, the next confrontation will probably blow Beck’s safehaven, virtually immediately.
“If you liked it then you shoulda put a patent on it!”
After all Amber has bee through with Ethan I think she has earned the right to a sullen “told you so.”
I would enjoy a chaotic good Amber
Chaotic good is best good.
Does the strip have a chaotic good charcter? I really cant think of one.
I feel like Ruth could become chaotic good if her life gets better, and she’s now only chaotic neutral due to her nihilistic outlook on life.
Eh, I think Ruth leans a little too hard on her authority as an RA to be in the Chaotic column. She’s kind of a no-hold-barred lawful neutral at the moment, to my mind. If she continues down her current path and gets bounced from her job, that could change, though.
She may use the law, but she personally has no respect for it. She uses it to her own ends and ignores it whenever it is inconvenient. That’s a very chaotic mindset.
Marcie. Sal. Sarah.
“Whom” is a pointless word that should just die.
A good number of words we all use on a regular basis are of no merit and should be done away with. Grammar is an ugly, ugly business.
But before we start pruning out verb inflections and the like, the first thing that needs done (especially for all the non-native speakers who have to learn our tortured tongue) is spelling standardization. English is completely bonkers when it comes to what letters are in a word and how the word actually sounds.
Can’t it be both?
We will standardize English spelling as soon as Spanish speakers of the Spanish language and Mexican speakers of the Spanish language agree to standardize all the conjungations and not have regional differences. Oh, they won’t? And various Asian countries won’t agree to lop off all the regional differences in the language that have developed? Okay then, the English English and American English differences will stay then.
The spelling differences between American and English English are not the problem. The problem is when you have words like drought and thought, tough and through, etc, which are impossible to pronounce correctly if you’ve never heard them and impossible to spell if you’ve never read them.
So? It’s a bit trail and error, all languages have exceptions.
Sure, but what shoeboxjeddy said seemed kinda beside the point Thor was making.
Plus with English being the new French, it would be nice for us non-natives if it were easier, for a number of reasons ranging from being less difficult as a school subject to giving diplomats and such less opportunities to embarass themselves by making fairly obvious mistakes. XD
All natural spoken languages are probably about equal in complexity.
*Writing systems* can range from “perfectly phonetic” to “what the hell is that”. English is a lot closer to the latter. Spanish is much saner.
GHOTI = couGH + wOmen + posiTIon = FISH
“ti” is never pronounced as “sh” unless followed by a vowel.
Also, I, at least, pronounce the “o” of of women closer to the “oo” in foot than the “i” in fish
patio
Ghotio?
that is double plus ungood duckspeak
leaving aside the effects on bredth of thought expression and what it’ll do to our ability to have subtext, pruning a language is a fool’s errand. i say we all just learn esperanto. what could possibly go wrong?
Richard Stallman’s gay agenda.
Hi everybody,
I need help With a complex Coming out issue:
Any Pan /queer ? lesbians/ and especially Transmen would be helpful
This involving a new friend and gay and Trans dynamics .
The community here is pretty great, but there are dedicated forums for this sort of thing.
I’d like to help, but I’m a mostly cisgender heterosexual guy with extremely limited experience in such matters. Details would definitely help you get advice, though.
I am also cisgender male ( mostly attracted men, but some ladies, and maybe transmen . so pan? ) .
My new friend/acquaintance is a total young hottie twink. Im not trying to get anything from him, I just want to make him feel safe , to express his personal gender/ sexuality / expression of masculinity. Im am middle aged and do not expect him to be into me. And I dont want to make it weird or force him out of the closet. He might be straight / gyno-philic . I dont want to make things weird. I just want him to feel appreciated.
That being said he has pinged my gay-dar multiple times.
and He revealed enought personal data ( some on purpose, some accidental ) for me to know hes trans.
But he doesnt know that I know.
But I want to come out to him.
Its all kind of a weird massive coincidence. I was actually thinking that I wanted to meet some transmen just a few hours earlier ( before i found out I already had ) . So it feel like a gift to me.
I cant rely on my personal judgement and instincts because I have never knowingly met any other transmen. I dont want to accidentally say anything offensive be treating too much, like I would all other guys . Nobody like to reminded how they are different. But Im not even supposed to know so …its complicated. I want to arrange a coming out , without forcing things .
and also without seeming to be manipulative . or a creep.
Well, I’m no expert, but I’d find a way to casually imply or outright say it in conversation. If he’s dropped clues that you picked up on, you could do the same.
Others will come who can advise you far better than I. I’d refer you to /adv/ or /lgbt/, but even the relatively wholesome boards of 4chan can be somewhat caustic to newcomers.
He has dropped clues.
But Im older ,more experienced and smart. “Free gay pizza smart”
He gave a lot more clues, than he meant to.
He was probably testing the water and seeing how Id react.
I just dont know.
But now I know before hes consented to tell me.
It would easier if i didnt know.
And this is partly my fault. I already strongly suspected he was trans/queer due to said clues. I wanted make him feel trusted and valued. So I opened up about personal parts of my life. Guy stuff. He did the same. so far so good.
But he accidentally revealed he was trans. He probably thought he was just raising the possibility. My mind was automatically on just treating him as I would any other guy, and I didnt even realize it. Till After.
and Ive been kicking myself ever since!
This is why I am hyper-aware of not being manipulative. Because My brilliant plan to be open vulnerable and supportive worked. Too Well.
If he was trans i just wanted to sygnal to him that I saw him as a man,
and could share things with him as a man. So he could know he had that option , back.
But it worked too well. The information dy-symmetry creates a power imbalance, that I did not want or intend.
The conversation ended early and abruptly because he was tired.
Our work hours have been out of sync since.
and now I get to post neurotic Inquiries on queer friendly webcomics, until the situation comes so i can resolve this or not.
There is a lot of things i can share with him to let him Im queer friendly,
to try to lessen the information asymmetry. BUT because he outed himself by accident everything I could say feel manipulative.
I dont like him any less. If he was gay and closeted it wouldnt matter at all to me. But I think its more dangerous for a passing transperson to be out.
But I might be overthinking it.
I shouldnt Know, and because I do know , i feel like i should tell him.
And I should come out to.
Thats why I posed the question.
DO I just ripoff the bandaid, tell him I know, and I thinks hess awesome?
Do I let him tell me in his own time?
( AND feel like a liar. )
What if he outs himself to other people, by accident, and im a shitty friend, for not helping him prevent that?
Do I focus more on telling him more about me, even though that might easily get him to tell me , when i already know.
Humans are complicated!
There is basically no way to ask someone if they’re trans that doesn’t boil down to “so, tell me about your genitals”. If he wants to tell you, that’s his business. If you feel it’s important that he know you’re gay, that’s your business, but he will owe you nothing from that–and that includes telling you if he is, in fact, trans.
Frankly, his being trans shouldn’t matter to you in the first place. I know trans people, but their gender identity isn’t why I know them, nor is it the most important aspect of them to me. All it affects is what pronouns I use. If you want someone to talk trans issues with, you’re much better off going to a forum or a meatspace gathering of trans people and allies than starting a dialogue with someone who’s shown little or no desire to talk about it with you.
If you really feel a burning need to know, the best you can do is to find a place where you can meet with trans people and allies, and invite him to come along, but even then, you should be interested in more than satisfying your own curiosity. Go with the intention of being at least somewhat active or available to the community; the last thing transgender people need to be used as a way to out other transgender people.
You are confused. I already know he Trans.
He doesn’t know that I know.
You are projecting negative things here that dont exist. I’m not entitled.
“Frankly, his being trans shouldn’t matter to you in the first place.”
OK, thats your opinion but you should know this could be read as as either transphobic , queerphobic or positive.
Straight people just love to say this to enforce heteronormativity. It was progressive 2 decades ago, now its a step away from erasure. This is a justification for the closet. It doesn’t instill pride and sense of worth in queer people. The truth is inside queer culture sexuality and gender does matter and its appreciated.
It gets to matter to me, if i want to. Its my mind , its my pride , its my sexuality. After a lifetime of hearing poisonous messages on the media , I would rather have straight people say appreciative things of queer sexualities than say “It doesnt matter” OK?
I have shared some of most private thoughts. It doesnt have to matter to you. But you dont have a right to read those thoughts, and police my sexuality . Its Queerphobic.
“but their gender identity isn’t why I know them”
And imagine how youd feel if a stranger insinuated it was. Not nice.
Its not true for me ,either.
“nor is it the most important aspect of them to me.”
Then Im glad you arent a terrible human being. Congratulations if you need that validated.
Man you guys are friggin brutal.
Any more straight people want to tell me how awful i am for being BENT.
You have a lot to learn about being a queer ally. Not stigmatizing people for their sexuality is lesson 1.
“If you want someone to talk trans issues with, you’re much better off going to a forum or a meatspace gathering of trans people and allies than starting a dialogue with someone who’s shown little or no desire to talk about it with you.”
/FML /facepalm .
I didnt ask people who “who’s shown little or no desire to talk about it with you.” to respond. You chose to.
If talking down to me was the best you could do as an ally, then thanks for trying.
On the one hand ,I’m glad you are telling people not to be a tourist and use trans people.
One the other , you told me not to be a tourist and use people. Ouch.
Thanks for non-support.
“If you really feel a burning need to know”
I already KNOW.
This isnt the goddamned National Enquirer. Its about being a good friend.
Im sure If i was as abled-bodied as you, all that advice about being ‘active’ and going places would go down smoother. But Im not. You have an unhelpful amount of Ableism privilege. Your reading comprehension needs work too.
I dont have to travel to meet a transperson. I am am already friends with one.
“the last thing transgender people need to be used as a way to out other transgender people.”
sigh
Once again, i am glad you are explaining this to people who might this clueless or awful human beings.
But on the other, I have the natural feelings from having a straight person Straight-splain Queer sexuality, and the dangers of being noncloseted. You are talking down to me and past me.
Maybe i trusted the readership too much.
Start with “I find you attractive and sexy” and see how it works from there. That’s been my best option when dealing with trans people. Also remember they are people first and trans second, I have a hard time with that one.
Yeah I can coyly smile at him, arch an eyebrow , say: “I might be pansexual. “Then bite my lip, shrug my shoulders and say “But ive never dated a transperson so I dont know”
Alternately , i could just die forever!
Im not sure if you are kidding. I see him as a man first. and only’.
Its easy for me to forget.
First Thanks for everyones help!
I already know hes trans. But he doesnt know that I know.
Clarification: If I express a private attraction to someone who is absolutely drop dead gorgeous inside and out, those are my private feelings. That just means Im not dead. It doesnt mean I have a need to posses or use that person. Even if we had compatible sexual orientations I wouldn’t mean I expected, or intended anything. Its just a fact of life. I’m an adult and its no big deal . But I have no experience with interacting men who who were born female. What is easy is just treating him as a male friend. No problem there at all. What I care about is properly expressing positive regard in a socially appropriate way. Thats something thats always a delicate balance, that depends on circumstances social contexts , degree of intimacy, culture.
Those boundaries are things I wasnt taught well, and I learned over decades
I can usually just trust my intuition. but in this case i do not trust it because i have a lack of experience interacting with men who were born women. I would probably have different sets of behaviours and boundaries for a straight man versus a gay man. and a women versus a man. If hes recently transitioned hes probably looking to pick up some of these cultural cues from me and other men. I’m just self-aware enough to know that I should ask lesbians or transmen about this. I dont want to make things weird. I see him every day in a casual way. I hope that makes sense
youre acting manipulative but dont want to seem manipulative?
i dont know if i understood this correctly but you think your younger friend is hot and hopes he is trans or gay because that makes you horny or something? if you want to tell him youre gay, just do it. like if youre hanging out or whatever and yiu go quiet; you can just say it. but dont expect him to reveal anything back, dont ask him to
Ouch!
Because I know more than I am supposed to, I feel like everything I do or say will look and feel manipulative after the fact.
Normally I just let things happen naturally and come out to someone as I get to know them and its appropriate.
I feel this is a special case and I need extra guidance. Even just being cool, is now a strategy. Right? It cant be helped. I didnt intend to be manipulative. I just wanted to create a safe space. And in retrospect that seems manipulative.
Maybe Im overthinking it?
No, I dont think My young friend is hot. Hes objectively gorgeous , if there is such a thing. There is nothing wrong with that. Some people just are. Thats OK. There is nothing wrong being a beautiful person.
I know hes trans., He doesnt know that I know. My only desire is to express cial and situationally appropriate positivity, including toward his gender and sexuality , whatever those might be.
I hope that clarifies
How about casually mentioning something about an ex-boyfriend of yours if that’s possible?
Or casually mentioning something trans-supportive. ~Not~ about him, just something political you support and that you identify as an ally or something. Base it on something in the news. If he wants to for any reason, then he’ll know it’s safe to come out to you. Even if he doesn’t want to, or if he isn’t trans, hey, you’re spreading the good word.
Rereading your post, it sounds like you’re into him but he’s much younger. Your intentions do not sound altruistic or like you just want more trans pals. You’re hoping he says he’s trans so that you can hit on him. As a cis-woman, that sounds rather creepy to me! I would not like an older dude to try and make me feel safe to come out as bi so that he could then hit on me. Hit on him honestly or not at all.
If that’s not why you want him to come out, then why? What does it mean to appreciate him, and why does appreciating him depend on knowing his gender?
Thank-you Leolore!
. You see I actually am aware that is how it is for many women. That women live in vast ocean of unwanted sexually advanced. I know that and get that.
What you said about me is just awful, and wrong.
But I’m glad you said it
Thats part of my problem. I expect views like yours may color his experience since he was born a woman. I’m trying to factor that in and be sensitive to differences.
“Rereading your post, it sounds like you’re into him but he’s much younger”
Sure just like thousands of other people I see everyday. Its just a background part of life. Thats Ok. There is nothing wrong with having private feelings.
You have been given the liberty of knowing my private feelings. Treat them like they are private.
“Your intentions do not sound altruistic”
Nothing anyone does socially is purely altruistic. If you are implying my feelings are malevolent, or selfish, that is judgmental. My feelings arent hurt that you mistook this though , because I know there is a cultural divide between men and women and gay and straight.
Would you judge Ethan in this comic for having the same feelings? Its like that. OK? Men and gay men can have honest attractions to other people, and its not malevolent. I am aware that men can be creepy assholes. I just want you to be conscious that presuming that, is a homophobic meme too.
But I do honestly appreciate your response.
“I would not like an older dude to try and make me feel safe to come out as bi so that he could then hit on me.
Yikes. Do you have any idea how awful that sounds!! While I can understand you may have dealt with abusive manipulative males, that is NOt what is happening. OK .Just the opposite.
But I also know that toxic viewpoint is afloat in the culture.
The problem with it is it leaves zero room for me to come out to him, or to come out to me. And that toxicity is homophobic and transphobic.
Can you see that?
Would you go to the “Questioning Group” in the Dumbing of Age say say that to someone. Thats just stigmatizing people for being gay or queer. I am sure you didnt mean it that way. Im just trying to explain where i honestly am.
Part of my sexuality is a Positive Regard for his gender and sexuality. Thats my honest sexuality as i am in the process of learning it. Ok?
I’m sharing with you my super private thoughts about a new areas of my own sexaility. No one is a creeper just having private thoughts ,related to their sexuality. Everybody does. Even you. Its part of being human. Its how we act them that counts. Since this is partly new to me I want to act correctly .
I hope that clarifies that.
“”Hit on him honestly or not at all.”
After that lecture you are counseling me to give someone potentially unwanted sexual advances. Yikes. Ok I think this you be worse at this subject than I am.
Aside which I see him everyday. That would be the very epitome of making things weird forever. I cant believe you would want every male friend that found you pretty , to do make unwanted advances on you. ( Hmm. Maybe I should be giving you the advice? )
These questions are better:
“If that’s not why you want him to come out”
I already know hes trans. he doesnt know that I know. Ive stepped into a social minefield and I want to diffuse it.
” What does it mean to appreciate him”
Well That is partly a mystery right? I already thought he was awesome anyway. Hes a Bright shining star. A sexy guitar playing Goddie. I dont need to own that or use that. You probably have male friends that are hot. Plus sharing that with a straight guy when you are not, is also a socially delicate thing. It requires finesse. Because hes trans i dont where the borders of that finesse are. I cant rely on unconscious social cues that delineate gay males from straight.
This stuff didnt come naturally to me. As a teen i was like an anthropologist learning how to just be comfortably male with other guys. ( that might be why I respect the journey of transmen ) .
Maybe you always just knew, how to be a woman around other women.
I didnt soak that up naturally. I had to add that patch manually. So its natural for me to be concerned that I have a hole where transmen are concerned. Not because of transmen, but solely due to gaps in my own social interaction wisdom.
Being gay already means I see things in that that other people wouldnt.
Its not all malevolent. Its beauty and awesomeness. When you feel beauty its simply human to want to express that. But in social contexts this is tightly constrained by situations.
You cant just walk up to someone and gawk at them like they are your personal double rainbow. right? Even if they are. Just No.
“and why does appreciating him depend on knowing his gender?”
Well it doesnt, but it also does.
I already appreciated him. But that may be a new area of own sexuality.
I am curious. Think of me like Ethan at the questioning group.
You probably know exactly what your sexuality is. If you do, thats your privilege. Mines always been a little weird and tricky on me.
I have an intuition I may be more emotionally, romantically ( and even sexually ) compatible with Transmen than with women or gay men. I could be wrong.
Its very very hard for me to find people Im compatible with that reciprocate.
None of this means Im trying to turn a new friend into a trick. But It also means Its probably part of my sexuality. Which means I have a right to come out if I want to.
Its probably best to see this as an awesome coincidence, or a lucky break.
“like you just want more trans pals.”
Why not take my private feelings as honest. Look somewhere in the world there must be cis people that actually respect and appreciate the journey of transmen. Why cant that be me? This is not just something i imagined on a whim. Ive had these feelings for a long time. With all the unwanted hate that trans people get, I would hope simple positive regard was valued.
This is a complex social situation. I think you can see I have a right to the leave the closet if I want to, right?
See As a Gay/Bi/Pan male I present oddly as straight and masculine ( In comparison )
Im far far from the most masculine guy. But I pass. I get carded as straight at gay clubs. That makes coming out to someone a conscious choice.
But Its kind of like a string, is attached from my door , to his.
Maybe Im overthinking everything.
Thanks for your response. It was honest and I appreciate it. I wish we lived in a less sexist , homophobic, transphobic and less sex negative culture where this all wasnt so socially awkward. But it is and people of good will have to cut through it.
Actually that happened yesterday to me online.
I pointed out to one my supposed liberal , socialist and socially enlightened followers on G+ , that an article was secretly justifying vicious transphobia , and was filled with transphobic dogwhistles .
I merely questioned these , which brought a vicious hatefest on me.
I then researched that he ( the article writer ) was a notorious transphobic activist. Which instead of me being thanked , resulted in implied death threats against me .
Still totally worth it
.
I’m Not Mr Speech-Police. But I’d like social media a lot better , without death threats. Have your rants and tantrums, but stop there. We should make this a thing. I dont take this one seriously, but it says something about online culture when death threats are the new microaggression.
The whole experience made me more aware that I need to do more to publicly signal that I dont tolerate transphobia.
Its not enough to let people presume it.
thanks for listening
well That sounds like a good idea, but in practice might be manipulative.
I’m hyper aware that revealing intimate details of my biography creates some intimacy. or that would just be a mood kill.
( My exbf was a Transformers Obsessed Robotics researcher who went insane and killed himself ) I could start to cry. Accidentally blurt out I know hes trans and hes still my friend. We hug, scene ends.
Life isnt a movie. I better not do that.
Good for you Ethan. Nice snarky remark
Ethan, I love ya, and I’m cool with you being closeted to certain people for your own safety, but come on. “Kind of gay”? That closet have a revolving door? I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again: you can be out to your friends and closeted to your family, just don’t bring up your sexuality with your family. I just wish he’d be true to himself. Like, at least Amber knows and can be trusted not to out him to everyone, right?
I don’t know why I’m so invested in the sexuality of fictional characters, best not to get into it.
Also, Amazi-girl’s Chaotic Good at best.
I think by “kind of gay again” what Ethan meant was “I’m kind of out as gay again”, and the “kind of” refers to the part where he’s
loudly shoutedtold some people he’s gay and doesn’t know who else already knows etc.Ethan doesn’t really have the luxury to “not bring up” his sexuality to his family. They’ve already decided that he’s a failure as a son for voluntarily choosing to debase himself in the sinful act of being into dudes.
Ethan’s coming out was really dramatic and since then he’s felt his life has been defined by his sexuality. That he can now even say that’s he’s “kind of gay” is a step in the right direction.
Uh… is Ethan expecting Ross to drop out of the sky? Don’t get me wrong, that’d be unexpected and a little terrifying how hardcore Becky’s dad could be.
You never know with helicopter dads
Ethan’s got it all wrong. Toedad is definitely going to sneak into IU by drilling through the ground.
And with that last panel, I suddenly understand how these two can be friends with Mike. (For a Mike-value of “friend,” of course.)
Mike is less a friend and more a chaotic force that you direct towards your enemies.
For limited values of “direct”, naturally. Mike does what Mike wants to for Mike’s reasons, which do not include “being nice” –unless he’s drunk & except for SP Mike’s Extra-Ahole plot to get Amber to drop him … which totes crashed and burned. Mike does NOT do “nice” — except when he’s drunk: he’s got inhibitions about it? — except that THE exception to that Rule was a complete failure: the one time that Mike tried to be nice, despite himself, he totes screwed the pooch.
amber youve gotta expect this kind of thing by now
For the record, I would actually consider Amber Lawful Good but in that “that one player who rolls up a paladin and you try to be lenient but you still keep having to remind them their actions must be Lawful or they’re gonna lose their paladin status” way.
Wouldn’t the proper query be Lawful Good vs Lawful Neutral?
No, because the Lawful part is the problem.
Yeah, I mean, there’s nothing lawful about Amazi-Girl; she beats people up because she’s scared of taking out her aggression on the people she cares about, so instead she finds people she can morally justify hurting.
She’s Chaotic Good, but she’s convinced herself that her Amazi-Girl needs to be forced more into a Lawful Inflexible box in order to keep the whole edifice from crashing down into Chaotic Evil anarchy.
No good can come from that.
I don’t know if I can even describe Amazi-Girl as any kind of force for good. She’s certainly done good things in the mask, usually protecting people who are being mugged or beaten up, but those aren’t things she couldn’t do as Amber, right? She even describes herself in unilaterally terrible terms and sees her persona as Amazi-Girl almost as a way to make amends for failing her own moral standings.
The more I discuss Amber the more I realize Willis had us staring all her issues in the face for years without realizing it. We kind of just accepted the inherent silliness of a costumed hero at a college campus at face value.
Willis masks the depths with slapstick caricature.
Of all the people who’d be sympathetic to awfuldad problems…
Ethan, your effort is appreciated, but I’m pretty sure toedads can’t fly.
Poor Ethan. I think with him, it’s not even a matter of being okay with his sexuality, but that it’s not something he ever should have to actively try to accept in the first place. He should have just been able to continue on with his life, but he always feels trapped by that label.
Looking for the Bat Signal, perhaps?
Is this story-line going to end with Ethan being heroically beat up by an abusive father (like what happened in Shortpacked)?
166 comments, and not a single one calling Amber a hipster? (“I said you were gay before it was cool!”) I’m disappointed.
pointing out that someone’s being a hipster is so last decade
…Wouldn’t that be kind of a compliment to a hipster though
Wait does anyone own a patent on break-ups gay, bi, undisclosed, or straight? There’d be weird money in that. “Sweetie your cousin just broke up with her boyfriend. Do you know anyone?” “No my dear aunt but she DID give me five bucks because she ended that relationship. So please family. Who else broke up? I need to make rent.”
Ethan’s right not to disclose the situation. Amber would probably be sympathetic, considering her own dad situation, but one can never be 100% sure with her. Besides, this isn’t really Ethan’s secret to tell. I suspect that Becky wouldn’t hesitate to disclose, but it’s the principle of the thing.
While true, it goes beyond the issue of Becky’s privacy. Amber can probably be trusted. Amazi-Girl (with her fixation on upholding the law) is the one who probably can’t. Sometimes Amazi-Girl leaks out into Amber, and that is the problem. It’s why Ethan’s asking about Amber/Amazi-Girl being Lawful Good (“Enforce the law!”) or Neutral Good (“Do what is right, regardless of the law!”), and revealing the detail that rules are being broken for good reasons.
Isn’t the whole point of vigilantism putting justice above the law?
Amazi-Girl in particular puts quite a bit of stock into the letter of the law. When no law is being broken, Amazi-Girl doesn’t take action in the first place. Becky’s situation breaks the law. Therefore, there is a risk that Amazi-Girl would decide to uphold the law and turn Becky in. Might be better to keep the knowledge away from Amazi-Girl, then.
You ever notice that David Willis put a teenage girl version of Rorschach into his wacky college series?
“Legal system” vs “justice system” …
Thank you THANK YOU Ethan. When Amber turns into Amazi-Girl, there’s no telling WHAT she’d do to either or both Becky and Toe Dad.
Also Becky hasn’t approved of Ethan just telling people about her situation, so good on you Ethan. It’s her business.
Arrgh! The White Whale! Thar he blows!
Amber: “So Joyce is the reason you’re back out?”
Ethan: “Well, it helped when I went to that lgbtq meeting and met DaaaaAAAAAAAANNNNNnnnnnnnnnnnnnna. Dana. I mean Dina.”
Amber: “Oh yeah, she made out with Becky, didn’t she? Good for her, I hope they work out.”
Ethan: “Oh yeah, especially with that awful, homophobic daaaaaaAAAaaAAAAAAAAAAAAA…… nnnnny?”
Amber: “Wait, Danny is a homophobe!?!”
*suddenly, Danny*
Danny: “Hey, Ethan, I think I found the perfect boyfriend for you! His name is Jacob, and he’s got the most beautiful, smooth, athletic… oh hi Amber. You didn’t hear that.”
That made me laugh so hard I nearly choked on my sandwich. I needed that. Thank you.
You needed to choke on your sandwich? What kind of weird stuff are you into? 0_o
Should probs have phrased that differently, huh. XD
I’m pretty sure Amber is Lawful Hypocritical.
I like the detail with which Willis is drawing faces now. So much more info than was displayed in Shortpacked, and it is especially evident with these two.
i somehow feel that this comic is directed directly in my direction.
“i dont know if you’re lawful good or neutral good”
sounds a lot like what i say to myself every day.
but like, how much of a secret are we supposed to keep it?