I’m quite enjoying this thing where social media is starting to gatekeep their content to force subscribership. Have to sign up to view _twitter_? No, thanks for saving me the time of going down a content-hole.
I think it’s the result of the privacy cases against facebook where Zuckerberg said they didn’t keep track of profile visits from people who weren’t logged in.
I think I actually tried the Dr. Pepper barbecue sauce at one point. It might have been at some big barbecue gathering where multiple people brought sauce. Pretty sure I liked it, but it probably wouldn’t go with Kraft.
I forgot to mention, I only brought it up bc our friend would only eat stuff like Mac and cheese so this was one of the few acceptable condiments SOMEHOW
“The accumulated filth of all their comments and thread wars will foam up about their waists and all the karam-whores and posters will look up and shout “First post!” and Ana will whisper, ‘No‘.”
White pepper exists, just for that reason. It’s the same peppercorns, just picked at a different stage so they can be skinned before curing. (Tthe dried, pulverized skins make pepper dark.) It has a milder flavor too, so she might actually try it once.
I didn’t eat pepper until I was in my mid-20s. I could detect the slightest hint of an accidental grind and it would be like eating ash. I was nearly (not quite) Joyce-level food avoidant until I went vegetarian and had no choice but to try new things…. even now I have months where I can only eat X.
This week I have eaten nothing but bread and butter and dry noodles WITHOUT the seasoning. Partly because I can’t afford to go to the shops because anxiety and money, but partly because anything else that I do have in the fridge triggers rumination, including the thing I bulk bought because it was last week’s safe food.
Hi bogeywoman. If you haven’t already been evaluated for it, you may want to investigate and or seek testing for Mast Cell Activation Syndrome. Your circumstances are highly suggestive of it (and an exact description of what my partner was going through up until diagnosis), and it often goes undiagnosed for years as it is relatively unfamiliar to the majority of clinicians.
Here’s some information about Mast Cell Activation Syndrome (MCAS) symptoms, which may help you determine whether this warrants further inquiry.
(The “Characterizing Mast Cell Activation Syndrome” section is relevant)
If you decide to seek testing, you’d want an N-Methylhistamine and 11-beta prostaglandin F2 for confirmation; a tryptase test may be recommended to you, but be warned that it has high false negative rates.
Huh. The more you know. I thought it was just bc I’m autistic (and probably is), but I’ll get this checked out, because I experience several other symptoms spontaneously without clear cause. Thaanks for this!
I mean, it could very much be both. If you’re avoiding foods because they’re incredibly unpleasant to your senses, you might be describing sensory issues, which are a big part of autism; the brain doesn’t properly process things. Sucks. Also associated with ADHD sometimes, and there’s quite a bit of overlap between the two things.
If you’re avoiding foods because they make you physically unwell, you might have food allergies and/or Mast Cell Activation Syndrome. If it’s both, you might have both!
On the one hand, I relate to a lot of Joyce’s bland food quirks and am a person who genuinely finds basic pepper overly spicy.
On the other hand, given recent revelations that probably means I’m actually allergic to it.
What I’m saying is, if scratching an itch leaves bright red lines down your skin and certain foods largely considered ‘mild’ make your tongue burn, that might be an autoimmune issue and you might want to get that checked. Sometime when your local medical system isn’t collapsing, I mean.
Okay at this point I encourage you to look up trigger substances in the context of Mast Cell Activation Syndrome, because that’s all the mental labor I’m up to tonight. Alliums? Yes, turns out they’re a trigger. Mustard? Different family, spice I only ever had in the context of other things that are now known triggers, we haven’t tested that one yet because most of the things I’ve had it in are currently off the table.
It’s basically a constant state of low-grade anaphylaxis, if your immune system can freak out from its presence, there’s a chance it is currently making MY immune system freak out. It’s also a known post-COVID thing, and getting the plague definitely aggravated things. If you’re worried about it, see an allergist or something, I’m too busy figuring my own shit out.
Usually it’s fine – I brought it up for the same reason Ai’s linked outright, which is ‘sometimes something sounds familiar and was mostly mild ENOUGH it escaped notice and then you look it up and go “wait fuck”.’ But it’s also been on my mind a LOT because it’s such a recent thing I’m still figuring out what’s safe and what’s not (or ‘causes some reactions, but not bad enough to justify cutting this without something to replace it in my diet yet’,) which is about as stressful as it sounds even when the reactions aren’t life-threatening. And thus, out of spoons.
Hi The Wellerman. Here’s some information about Mast Cell Activation Syndrome (MCAS) symptoms, which may help you determine whether this warrants further inquiry.
(The “Characterizing Mast Cell Activation Syndrome” section is relevant)
MCAS often goes years undiagnosed and many clinicians may not have heard of it unless they are a specialist. If you seek testing you’d want an N-Methylhistamine and 11-beta prostaglandin F2 for confirmation; a tryptase test may be recommended to you, but be warned that it has high false negative rates.
Sorry about what you’re dealing with. A good friend of mine is allergic to pepper (and peppers, and at least one mystery ingredient), and while it’s a lot of careful label reading and still some reactions now, they say it’s a lot better than when they were growing up and had no idea what the trigger was.
I don’t really do much Mac n cheese but I really, really like how it tastes if you add a spoonful of dehydrated onions just after all is done, but 2 or 3 minutes before plating up.
dried shallots are too tough to use as a condiment, but the flavor is worth the PITA of grinding it up with a little salt. tarragon seems to me to go very well with dried shallots.
Cheese on macaroni is an abomination in the eyes of God and man. After all, macaroni is a form of pasta, and the only suitable topping for pasta is a richly seasoned, slow-simmered marinara sauce so deeply red that it could be mistaken for blood.
There are several places in the Bible, such as Luke 16:15 — “And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God,” and I’m sure I’ve also read it in a novel or something elsewhere. I may have taken some liberties, putting my own little touch as a writer on it in the name of poetic license.
Various combinations of meat and cheese naturally go with macaroni. After all, pasta is really just a kind of bread. So what you’re really making is a bowl of sandwich.
I like to add about a half pound of cubed ham. Simple, relatively cheap and it tastes good. And it reheats fairly well, so one batch is two or three meals. (I live alone, so anything I cook inevitably involves left-overs. So, “How will this taste a couple of days from now?” is one of my criteria for deciding what to cook.)
My favorite macs and cheeses are either tuna-broccoli with a little red pepper, multiple real cheeses with black pepper and a little garlic, or occasionally with thick tomato red pepper soup mixed in.
There is no one favourite way. There is only the inscrutable yearnings of the heart at any specific moment in the flow of time. Sometimes, one wants hearty baked macaroni and cheese with eggs in the batter and a bread crumb crust. Sometimes, one wants gooey oozy cheese like a soup. Sometimes one wants potato chips on top. Sometimes one wants fancy restaurant macaroni and cheese with truffle oil and mushrooms.
Sometimes, god help us, despite knowing it is wrong, one finds oneself desperately craving ketchup.
All are favourites in the moment. All are perfect at the time in which they are needed. I am a Canadian, and as such all macaroni and cheese is perfect and beloved in my sight.
A couple of years back I found some Hatch chiles in the store (not common this far into Gringoville) and discovered that dicing them into mac and cheese tastes AMAZING, and it goes well with tuna in there as well. I don’t know if the supermarket by me has a connection or what, but every year they get some Hatch in for about a week and very cheap (about half or more what it’d cost to get some shipped out direct from NM) and I load up and freeze them for this and stews and such.
I’m about to make something a little similar:
baked white lasagna casserole using heart-of-palm lasagna noodles, creamy aldredo sauce, and Mexican 3-cheese blend.
I cut up a few of the deer sticks my dad makes and throw them in. It adds a really nice level of spice to the mac & cheese. I discovered it in college and it still remains my favorite way to enjoy mac n cheese.
Mac and Cheese might be best expressed by the recipe on a box of Muellers macaroni elbows. In short, you first make a basic white sauce, then grate your cheese into it. Colman’s dried mustard and some white pepper are in the white sauce. A topping of toasted breadcrumbs stirred in melted butter is applied, before placing it in the oven.
I admit, I am also against adding hotdogs to macaroni because they are gross. However, no pepper and no salt? I would have to bring my own hot sauce just to fix it.
Mustard isn’t only acidic (vitamin c is an excellent flavor-enhancer, and it helps use less salt in a dish), but also astringent – As in, kinda raspy in your mouth, like, have you ever eaten what’s passes as wasabi in sushi? It’s tingly, and briefly drying, which in turn makes you salivate more.
It’s an excellent thing to put in a cheese sauce when you’re using a mild, fatty cheese (or an instant packet ;D)
I’m especially fond of Heinz and Gulden’s bold yellow for everything I use it on, especially combining one of those with Jack in the Box’s Honey mustard on IKEA’s hotdogs. Not too fond of French’s though.
Here in Chile, we call hot dogs “completos” (as in complete) and its inconceivable to have them without anything but sauces, like the most basic variety has tomatoes dices small and mayo. Most people also put ketchup and/or mustard in them, and the most popular ones are “Italianos”, which recibe their name because apart from the aforementioned toppings they have mashed avocado, resembling the Italian flag. If any of y’all feels adventurous, I can vouch for their deliciousness – Try them ;3
Don’t listen to Brazilians, tho. Their hot dogs are a mess.that requires using a plate and cutlery, because it gets buried under all the other stuff they throw on top.
I was an adult before I learned that some people ate mac and cheese without cut up hotdogs. Sure, it was left out of the name, but it was one of those things that went without saying.
I was hoping orange perfection was a dessert food, like involving oranges, but learning it was Kraft dinner after spending 8 hours throwing up after eating kraft dinner, makes this strip cursed.
Once dad was making Mac and cheese, and orange jello for dessert. We put together the ingredients out on the counter, set the noodles to boil, mixed up the orange powder packets for the jello… when the noodles were done, it was time for the cheese sauce…. but where was the packet with the orange powder?
Orange Perfection: the worst damn jello you’ve ever eaten in your life
Unfortunately too old to find on the Internet, so far back that I forget if I was in high school when it was on, PBS did a series on World History done as a parody of a news broadcast. They even had “in period” faux commercials. On one of these, a medieval minstrel was touting a new product from Turkey. Pepper Makes It Better!
PS: The TV series was called TIMELINE. It aired in 1989 and only ran for six episodes. This LINK goes to a YouTube that has an episode, but unfortunately not one that includes ‘Pepper’. :/
Culturally, “mac and cheese” hasn’t really been a thing where I live, but I sure have been eating pasta with cheese and ham sauce for most of my life… and that’s practically the same ingredients, aside from… y’know… the ham.
Can’t imagine ever making it without either white or black pepper. Salt and pepper are just the bare minimum for most dishes. (That said, now my brain is frantically trying to figure out exactly what determines if salt and pepper is appropriate for a dish or not. Savoriness? I don’t know.)
Mrs. Dash table blend replaced regular black pepper on my table. There’s black pepper in it, but it also has other stuff like onion powder, garlic, and cumin.
But…but…but… Joyce had to mix milk and butter and cheese and macaroni all together … AT THE SAME TIME!!! For someone who just last semester was picking pepperoni off of pizza and deconstructing tacos in the dining area, this is a HUGE step forward!
KD cheese sauce is a homogeneous, smooth substance, not something with things in. She likes homogeneous stuff, and is less grossed out by poop than food with things in.
I was nostalgic and bought some of the Boxed Mac And Cheese for dinner this week. The side of my box says 1. boil water 2. cook pasta, and 3. add cheese packet. Joyce is safe!
>
I mean… I like to add Lowry’s seasoning salt to cheap mac n cheese. Also, Joyce is literally the epitome of the Robin from Teen Titans GO saying boiled potatoes with salt is too spicy.
I usually add some extra cheese to thicken it up, but honestly, I don’t mess with Kraft much. Hotdogs or bacon, honestly, tend to overpower it a bit and make it very porky even outside of the bites with them in it, so I am not all that into that.
Never tried peppers, or any other veggies for that matter. I could prrrobably do something like broccoli or something else green?
I can’t eat Mac and cheese so I can’t really weigh in on this particular food item.
I will say I’m usually with Joyce though – I am not a person who typically adds things to other things. If I’m trying a new recipe, for myself or if I’m cooking for others, I am very strict about following it exactly the first time I make it. I want to see how it’s SUPPOSED to turn out before I start fiddling with it.
My mother’s still a little sore that I wouldn’t let her add garlic to a vegetable soup I made a while ago for my boyfriend’s birthday. TBF, it was very much the kind of thing that sounded like it should have garlic. The general consensus was it tasted good but my mom insists it would’ve been perfect with garlic. Ah well. Next time. XD
I’m An #Old, Latinx atheist and ADHD mess; yet there’s a lot of moments when I find Joyce highly, highly relatable. This one? Is not of them.
I’m a vegetarian pro cook (currently unemployed and missing the sadomasochistic environment of restaurants); and though sometimes I’ll happily sin with instant ramen, this strip made me shudder.
Yeah I totally get the recipe-fixation thing too. Lots of people like the stuff that’s real nostalgic and familiar, as do I, although for lots of things I don’t follow the box-directions.
For instance, when it comes to chicken recipes, I almost NEVER add the amount of salt listed. I mean, a little salt and spice is good, but not EVERYTHING needs to taste like concentrated KFC, you know?
Oh honey i was meaning the literal opposite of that. IDK about chicken recipes (haven’t eaten animals in 18 years) – I cannot with stuff straight from the box instructions. Swear to god I’m not disrespecting, if I’m offered some I’ll be happy to eat it! But yeah, I’m always modifying mine (and i adjust salt to taste because, professional cook and by now I do that from the soul); and one of my favorite pleasures is eating new stuff from around the world, and tasting new spices and seasonings.
My newest hack that doesn’t involve toppings is: add real milk, add real cheese(s), and a pinch of Masaman curry paste. Umami in your mouth all over, and a more “fresh” aftertaste :3
Wait, what did you mean again? Sorry, kinda suck at subtlety like this. Neurodivergence!
I do stuff from the box for nostalgic feelz, and sometimes I cook when I feel like I’m in the mood for something in particular, like for instance when Cowboy Bebop came on just the other day, I tried my hand at some bell peppers and beef.
Glad to meet yet another great chef around these parts, so awesome you like to try flavors from all over the world!
I never even thought to add curry paste to Mac and Cheese!!! Next to mustard in it, I’m bound to try that too, thanks!!!
It’s ok! As previously stated, ADHD mess here ;D it’s ok! I didn’t understand that well either, I thought you were saying you did stuff following the instructions because it was nostalgic, but didn’t get you were also saying you experimented from time to time ♥ ANIME FOOD THO. How do animators make it so pretty? It’s no wonder it inspired you, how excellent that you liked the bell peppers
And aldbfjs idk if “great” but I’ve been at it for a while and yeah, despite of the also aforementioned S&M treatment in pro kitchens, I still love it. Who else is a chef here? how cool that there’s more of us. Also, I’m really happy you liked the curry suggestion! Do tell me if you ever try it, I’d love to hear what you think ;www;
Well just to be modest, I used the sweeter kind of bell peppers since I didn’t have any of the kind Jet used. Anyways it wouldn’t have been exactly like his anyway because it actually had beef in it LOL
Yeah I might actually try making Agar pudding after watching a giant one made in Assassination Classroom, which is also like in my top 3 shows right now! 🤩
Oh, fam I haven’t watched that one but my little sister loves it. I’ll ask to join in when she re-watches (something she does from time to time) just to see the pudding X’DD Careful with agar agar tho! I’ve used it in vegan baking and while more expensive than clear gelatin, you use like a tenth of the powder you’d normally need. It’s potent! (Which is a pro, tbh)
And oi! Sweet bell peppers are tasty, I say there’s no loss in your replacing ;D As I said, once you have the base of cooking, “creativity” trumps “by the book” unless you’re trying something wildly out of your comfort zone.
Wouldn’t that package be full of salt already? I mostly do my cheese sauces and pasta from scratch so I wouldn’t know but doesn’t most food have already too much salt?
I just checked a box of macaroni and cheese (store brand because I’m a cheapskate), and there’s about 460mg of sodium in a 2.5oz (1/3 of the box) serving. That jumps to about 570 “as prepared” with butter and whole milk.
Personally, I think Kraft mac and cheese is perfectly fine out of the box, but given the option, I do like adding some mustard; it adds an acidity that compliments the savory of the mac and cheese nicely (he said as if he has any idea what he’s talking about.)
As someone who cannot stand mac and cheese in general, and Kraft mac and cheese even more so, I find it hard to read this strip.
As an English major, I was merely confused by the alt-text, trying to figure out what was orange about the ultimate abusive “but he’s so romantic!” bad boy. I tried to remember if there was some weird Irish ascendancy subtext in Wuthering Heights, but then I remembered the existence of comics. If I’d never discovered Comics Curmudgeon, though, I would probably still be utterly baffled.
See, breadcrumbs are nice on a homemade baked mac and cheese, but I can’t really see that working with Kraft. A friend of mine likes to top his with crumbled Nacho Cheese Doritos, though, and I think it just about works.
The most I’ll add to my mac and cheese is more cheese to make it gooey. Or bacon bits, if I’m feeling special. But hot dogs? Nasty Dorothy. Pepper is also terrible, but I just hate pepper in general, and accept some people like it. I refuse to accept hot dog, if you need meat, add REAL meat.
Depends on the sausage. If it’s a bratwurst, sauce feels like an insult and if I need more moisture I’ve failed to cook it properly. Kielbasa gets whatever I’ve got on-hand, typically curry sauce. Chorizo gets ground/chopped and I usually just use taco seasoning. “Breakfast sausage” is disgusting in most cases but sometimes it can go in a nice runny egg yolk, unless I’m feeling sensory. Italian sausage is great on a pizza with Alfredo sauce. Hot dogs get whatever’s closest at hand, typically a nice meaty chili or just some ketchup if I’m feeling particularly Caucasian that day. Good hot dogs get the shredded cheese and maybe some relish if they’ve behaved today. Once again, it all depends on the sausage, and if the combo is wrong it leads to the dread Shuma-Gorath gaining more power.
As a side note, it’s always a little odd/amusing to be referred to with just the adjective, without the subsequent noun.
If your kids don’t like hot dogs, send them to work in The Mines for a few weeks, teach the little blighters some respect and gratitude. No more than a month though, or they might lose their imprinting and forget your face.
Such a shame. The Mines build character and also whatever effects come from long-term exposure to sulfur. Although if you DID manage to send your child-self there, would you change in the present, and would it be enough to cancel out the need to send yourself? Alright yeah, I don’t think texture issues really warrant time travel.
‘Round these parts, we call that chili mac and toss in some protein, usually ground beef or hot dog slices if that’s all we got. Quick, cheap, filling, tasty.
If you’ve got the time, make patties with the beef, grill them, then grind them back up in a food processor. That shit’s good, better than just pan frying it.
This is different enough to merit being considered an entirely different dish, but if you ever try the baked kind of mac and cheese, I think it’s much better. It might have breadcrumbs on top, or crumbled Ritz crackers, and the cheeses can be actual, identifiable types beyond whatever the hell goes in the Kraft variety – it’s much heartier. Whereas I will more or less not eat the Kraft-type mac and cheese – I think I’ve intentionally gotten it once in my life?
That said, I’m with you on chili pepper going well with anything that’s inordinately cheesy.
I dunno, when she said that she can make great mac and cheese, I expected her to not use instant stuff. Like, with real ingredients. Cheese sauce is not that hard. Oh and the only cheese that’s allowed to be orange is cheddar. Which doesn’t melt that well, so you’d use gouda or Emmentaler as base. Both should have a light yellow. Cheese sauce shouldn’t be orange..
Well, on the bright side, I just learned I’m really great at making pizza. And Chinese noodles. And chocolate cake.
I’m really good at following instructions printed on the back of something
Hey, if it’s a tasty meal then it’s a good meal! I’m a pro cook but not a snob. My problem is specifically with the sadness of plain mac and cheese, ahaha
Usually annatto/achiote seeds. They’re small reddish orange seeds that give yellow coloring foods (sometimes as a cheap substitute for saffron). Used a lot in Latin cooking
Did she not specifically say Kraft Mac and Cheese? And even if not, what about Joyce’s relationship with food made you think that she’s cooking actual homemade meals? Homemade food is inconsistent; Kraft Mac and Cheese always tastes the same, as long as you follow the directions. The only real surprise here (which, let’s be honest, isn’t that much of a surprise) is the lack of add-ins.
While I have not done the experiment, I have enough faith in the Internet that I would put a small amount of money on the proposition that a Google search on “cheddar cheese carved dildo” would return something.
I’m definitely not going to link it here, but there’s a ubiquitous result titled “Masturbation with White Cheddar Cheese Carved Dildo”, which appears to be the same video spread across multiple sites. The thumbnail seems to be a delivery on said promise. Rule 34 and all that, I suppose.
Coincidentally, I made mac and cheese for dinner tonight. Joyce, and probably Willis, would have refused to eat it on pain of death.
Broccoli, halved cherry tomatoes, mushrooms, bell peppers, onion, garlic, salt, pepper, sage, paprika, chili, nutritional yeast, and a little cinnamon.
Your dish sounds good, but it is not Mac and Cheese. Pizza is not named for its ingredients. Like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, Mac and Cheese is. If your peanut butter and jelly sandwich contains avocado, it is not, in fact, a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. It is something else.
Right, I don’t put anything in macaroni cheese that isn’t a) macaroni or b) cheese. I don’t know why Joyce has a milk carton and a packet of butter on the table.
Paraphrased from a box of store brand I have handy:
– Cook macaroni, drain, do not rinse, return to pot
– Add 4 tablespoons unsalted butter or margarine, 1/4 cup milk, and cheese sauce packet
– Mix until well combined and creamy
The milk and butter reconstitute the cheese powder.
Yeah, I was kind of playing on the idea that if the term “macaroni cheese” is prescriptive, and prevents adding vegetables, then it logically prevents other things being added as well, even though they’re required. I’m not sure it was as funny as I thought at the time.
But it’s not a complete meal if it’s just macaroni and cheese sauce? I’d have to make vegetables or meat or whatever else and then add them to the side, which creates twice or more the dirty dishes. Throwing everything into the sauce is still mac ‘n cheese, just with stuff in it. I just disagree that a dish named for the primary ingredients has to be just that. Like if you put cheese and peppers on beans and rice, it’s still beans and rice?
I have made sauce with just nutritional yeast before, for vegan friends, but I actually hate it. I add it to regular cheese sauce because my partner likes the taste and it adds an important protein or amino acid or something.
Nutritional yeast has a bunch of vitamins, especially B12, which is why I put it in stuff (or on popcorn). I agree that it’s not good as a total replacement, but it’s not bad as an addition to things.
I’d just call it mac ‘n cheese with vegetables. (Unless the nutritional yeast was being used as a cheese replacement, in which case I would spell it as “cheez” or such to make the distinction.)
Spencer with the rest of the cast: *long-winded post on the character’s history and nature, compounded by their neuroses both ongoing and immediately relevant, speculating on what’s driving them in the now and has been for some time*
Spencer when Dorothy is on-panel: Hello Day-Ruiner, what fresh hell are you bringing with you today, is it the part where everything gets worse because of you, as if the day is being ruined
The problem with my constant bullying of Dorothy’s nerd face is that the lastmonth I’ve been stricken with a bad case of brain fog and losing hours due to dithering on where my time should go and to what, and my solution is to make a schedule.
Then the restaurants can make them cheaper. I’ve had some meaty-ass wings and I’ve had some disgusting bone piles, and the bone piles always seem more expensive for some reason. If I want something hard and dry to dip in something, I’ll get some chips. Adding a molecule-thin layer of meat to the inside of the deepest part of a pit of breading, that oughta be illegal.
That’s why they sell the breast, leg, and thigh cuts. (Or just get a whole rotisserie chicken from the grocery store. You’ll get a couple days worth of chicken from one of those!)
There’s nothing quite like properly grilled chicken tiddy. All you really need are charcoal and some apple wood chunks. Season with either Simon & Garfunkel blend (parsley, sage, rosemary, and thyme) or creole seasoning.
Not for everyone in the Midwest. My family obsesses over Thai dishes and we have decent exposure to the rest of SE Asia cuisine. And my wife makes a top flight pesto using basil from our herb garden. And my oldest son has a recipe for hoppin’ John that is awesome.
Yeah, it’s more of a traditional mid-West cooking thing. Lots of people, especially younger ones, embrace other cuisines.
Modern US white people cooking is pretty seriously diverse, as we appropriate tastes from other cultures and mix them in with our own. Even some traditional regional white US cuisines aren’t at all bland.
I suspect as well that a lot of it stems from Depression era (or just preceding working poverty) needs, followed by the introduction of mass marketing just as people started to be able to afford a little better.
Boomers and their parents had a tendency to boil the life out of everything… Broccoli is so much better when it’s not soggy and on the verge of falling apart!
AL DENTE BROCCOLI, SALT, LEMON, AND STRAIGHT INTO MY MOUTH. You gotta kill the cooking (because once you get it out of hot water its core is still hot and keeps cooking itself) via submerging and rinsing in cold cold water. Then you get something that barely needs additions to be a delight.
I love broccoli in dishes, and in special with asian sauces. Tempura broccoli is A++ too, and I’ve put it raw in a pizza before I take it to the oven. But that’s just great additions – The Platonic Ideal of Broccoli as a food is cooked until it’s bright green and not a second more, with a pinch of salt and lemon. Nothing else. I truly don’t know why people boil it until it’s yellow and falling apart :C AND WITH KETCHUP! It’s nastyyy
That’s blanching, and almost exactly what you’d do to prepare fresh vegetables for canning or the freezer.
Growing up, the broccoli I was always served by my mother and grandmother was almost all florets, boiled until they were wet sponges and a fork easily coasted through what little stem remained. To this day I don’t understand why. Maybe it was a Great Depression thing, or a French-Canadian thing that got passed down through the ages. I just know that when I cook broccoli for myself, it gets steamed. (Usually in an Instant Pot or a ready-for-the-microwave steam bag, because I’m lazy.)
Steamed vegetables are so much better than their boiled-to-mush counterparts! Peas, for example. Fresh or frozen steamed peas are amazing, canned peas are salty little balls of ennui.
Also, a combination of late 1800s/early 1900s food faddery (everything “exciting” was probably poison) and xenophobia (immigrants smell bad because they eat garlic, therefore they must learn to cook American – no pasta, no pickles, no saurkraut, no spices, no salt, and NO GARLIC).
Totally seriously, the Mormon ban on “hot drinks” (tea and coffee) can be directly traced to an 1800s food fad.
It’s like if a modern religious movement insisted on a paleo diet for followers, and then 200 years later after the food fad died people thought it was just a weird “Those Guys” thing.
I went to visit my then boyfriend in Georgia a few years ago and he brought me to a family birthday party where they embodied every white American stereotype. Couldn’t dance, reached volumes i legitimately didn’t think humans were capable of, losing their minds over rae dun pottery, probably would’ve said something racist to me if they got drunk (they were all trump supporters). And yeah, the food one too which was disappointing. His grandma warned me that the queso for the nachos they left out had jalapeno and was spicy, and I’m weak to pepper. But i didn’t even get a tingle when i tasted it. BBQ sauce is spicer. His grandpa was making shish kebabs and they smelled amazing but the meat was almost flavorless. It tasted grilled but idk if he even salted it.
The only other time i had to stay with white people for a while they were British and it was culinary hell. Had nothing but like, frosted wheat cereal for breakfast and they made me ham and cheese sandwiches for lunch that tasted like the color grey. Idk how they did it. But i tasted neither ham nor cheese in those sandwiches.
actually, you know what the most popular thing to add to the 4/1$ boxed mac and cheese amount my generation is/was?
Ketchup.. because you normally ate mac and cheese with hotdogs (in or separately) which involved ketchup and the two ended mixed together..normally anyways
However, since I only eat hotdogs with chili and cheese on them and the Velveeta shells and cheese I haven’t indulged in ages … Oddly tho for living in Indiana I’m surprised no one in the cast seems familiar with Hamburger/tuna helper
Well, Joyce can follow directions; turns out she’s just a little too beholden to them at this point in her life. Who knows what little amount of capsaicin she’s ever encountered so far?
For me, I didn’t know what dark chocolate was when I started my first semester of college (mumblemumble) years ago, but it was my first time on my own, and freshmen try new, weird things. Now I can find dark chocolate anywhere.
She rejected the authority of her church and her parents, and she’s gotten everything she needs from the optometrist, so the macaroni and cheese box is currently the highest authority she has to answer to!
Yup. I think this is what we’ve all been missing in discussing our own personal tastes (ha) in food, and macaroni and/or cheese in particular – Joyce is very much in favor and/or need of Following Directions, having structure, and obeying authority (so long as they don’t conflict with her own moral sense). Because that’s how she overcomes her own neuroses and/or is assured that she’s (Doing It) Right.
I have heard cold KD makes good pothole repair material. And yes, KD must be eaten immediately, once cooked, it must be consumed no longer than 20 minutes after preparation.
I love mac and cheese, but when I eat it I always have to cut up some hot dogs and put them in with it. Or just have some other kind of meat with it if there are no hot dogs.
Joyce has never been more right than she is in this strip. Then again I do love Joyce’s food issues because I have such similar ones (autism ftw, plus she and I both grew up within driving distance of each other)
Salt is a seasoning, so you can’t “spice things up” by adding salt. Additionally, I hadn’t realized until recently the only difference between herbs and spices is whether or not it originates as the leaf of a plant or not. Spices are literally just nonleaf (seeds, fruits, roots, etc) plant parts used to flavor foods.
when I was a kid, I used to cover my mac and cheese with pepper. I couldn’t get enough of it. Then I discovered that there are other spices. Today I wouldn’t dream of making mac and cheese without a bunch of black pepper, cayenne pepper, chipotle pepper, oregano, garlic.
I never add salt to anything, not even the water I boil pasta in.
This is the correct take on salt. Unless it’s Korean or Persian pickles and they are meant to be an incredibly salted, garlicky counterbalance to heaps of raw vegetables.
Tbh i like keeping my Kraft flavor simple. I hate grittiness in it so i can’t add any spices with big enough particles to detect. Plus if I’m making Kraft Mac n cheese then i just want that simple, delicious fake cheesey flavor so i can sit down with my pot and eat the whole thing in one sitting with a serving spoon
….
Shut up it’s just cuz I’m nostalgic for living on campus
Kraft Dinner is simple, it’s a blunt force of orange mush and you eat it to get punched in the face by that one taste.
Putting salt or ketchup or god forbid those disgusting hot dogs does not make Kraft Dinner “more rich and flavourful” or whatever, it just tastes less like Kraft Dinner.
If I’m eating sauteed salmon garnished with vegetables and buttered shrimp, that’s because I’m eating what is intended as a complex meal of individual pieces! I don’t just throw More Tastes in there when one of those tastes matters more!
So glad you think adding hot dogs is gross. What an unhealthy, awful contribution to an already fatty and heavily processed meal. It’s not even a good source of protein; you’re just adding more sodium and bad fats (as opposed to the good ones… Butter, in moderation, is good. Olive oil good. Most processed fats bad).
Not that we don’t still make boxed mac & cheese but I realized last year how incredibly easy it is to make homemade mac & cheese and basically insist on doing it most of the time these days. It’s just pasta, cheese, milk, flour, butter, salt & pepper (I normally wouldn’t mention salt & pepper but seeing so many people disgusted about black pepper – black pepper! – in mac & cheese makes me realize I should make an exception here).
Once you’ve got that going you can throw in any number of things: Chopped jalapenos, bacon, some veggies. (To try and trick the kid into eating vegetables sometimes we’ll chop up some spinach very finely and mix that into the sauce.) We don’t usually add stuff in since I’m usually making it as a side to something else but yeah, it’s a good base for adding lots of other stuff.
100 percent with Joyce on this one. Macaroni and cheese doesn’t need extra ingredients to make it edible. It’s a very distinct and consistent texture and flavor. Not a Kraft fan, personally, but the principle applies.
I mean, sure, but I’m a big fan of adding some real cheese to the mix. Grate some nice, flavorful, melty cheese and add it in when mixing everything together, real big flavor boost and a ton of extra cheesy stretch to it.
Agreed. Food at base should taste like itself. If you want yours with pepper, there’s the grinder to add to your own; but the baseline should be the food that is advertised done in a way that will be nice to most people who like that advertised food.
The idea of squishy, bland hotdogs in mac and cheese makes me want to puke. Personally I’d go with caramelized diced onions, peas, paprika, black pepper, extra garlic. Then I’d bake the mac and cheese so that it all comes together nicely. Maybe sprinkle powdered parmesan and some seasonings on top so that it has a slightly-crunchy cheese topping.
I’m curious if folks realize that adding hot dogs to Mac and Cheese is probably a notable nostalgic childhood thing for Dorothy. It’s not the most common addition, but it’s absolutely the sort of thing that would appeal of a little kid’s taste buds.
I honored this conversation this morning with veggie sausages & cheese with baked green onions, and coffee with cream and pepper. (Pepper makes everything better!)
Dude, this sounds like a delicious recipe. I’m going to try it! IDK about coffee with pepper, tho – I’m a black coffee fiend (even have my favorite place of origin, which is Guatemalan coffee). But I’ll try it because, novelty. How do you make it?
Just put some in my French Roast with coffee mate, and apparently the pepper tastes less pungent than the coffee itself. In fact I think I can taste the unique nuttiness of the pepper now. Not sure if that says something about me, or the coffee.
On a side note, I think I may have accidentally discovered a Silphium substitute
Ok so I’m going to try it now. Not today because if I have more coffee than I’ve already guzzled my heart is going to make a fit, but tomorrow :3 Guatemalan tastes like chocolate and it’s a medium roast so the pepper might be an actually great addition
(Do tell about the Silphium substitute. Is it this recipe itself? XDD)
I don’t use pronouns, and consider myself kind of omnigender, which I guess translates to genderfluid. Just kind of go back and forth, depending on context and how I feel.
But yeah, never had much use for pronouns, except for fun. “Sie/Sich/Sein”, “Yo”, “Shorty”, “Hon'”, lots of fun but not for definitions.
But year, Laura is an old name and does not reflect my current nongendered state.
As for how to make the recipe, I dunno…
Ground vanilla-ish coffee (Sumatra / Nicaragua / Colombia blend), prepped in a French Press, with 1/3 cup of whole milk and a dash of black pepper. Did it work out for you folks?
And then baked-apple veggie sausage baked in a toaster oven for 30 minutes, with green onions baked alongside them for ~20 minutes, with Mexican 3-cheese blend sprinkled on top. Yum! :-9
Not even the Garfield from the animated series? ;; I know the comic strips are meh and the character more a marketing thing than anything but the 90’s cartoon was super cute
Now the real thing to do is make ramen, not the cups the packages. Strain out the water then pour the noodles into a skillet where you mix in whipped eggs in order to coat the noodles in scrambled eggs.
Back when I actually ate that stuff, I would grind the provided pasta up for the bird feeder and then use real pasta and use the cheese mix at half strength.
later I found I could just buy the cheese mix powder from restaurant supply stores and save a lot of money all together. Now that I have learned that live culture yogurt makes me less lactose intolerant I have no desire to ever eat that crap again.
I’m not sure what “add everything” means. Black pepper, hot dogs, and hot sauce? Everything in the fridge and spice cabinet? I’d probably do red bell peppers, garlic, cayenne pepper, and nutmeg. Maybe tuna. I’m going to go ahead and count that as “add everything” for the survey. But I wouldn’t do hot dogs, they’re gross.
If it doesn’t have enough extra ingredients to stop looking and tasting like either macaroni or cheese to any perceptible degree, it’s illegal and you’re just being a food-hating snowflake. /sarcasm
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How about Dr. Pepper barbecue sauce
inb4 (prob the worst decision ever but we’ll see when the potential incubation period is up)
Welcome back Ana, been missing you.
I’ll just leave this here.
I’m quite enjoying this thing where social media is starting to gatekeep their content to force subscribership. Have to sign up to view _twitter_? No, thanks for saving me the time of going down a content-hole.
Works fine for me if I pop open incognito mode?
I think it’s the result of the privacy cases against facebook where Zuckerberg said they didn’t keep track of profile visits from people who weren’t logged in.
You can cancel the pop-up? I just click the X in the corner
Yeah, that’s the SAUCE
Yay, you’re back!
I think I actually tried the Dr. Pepper barbecue sauce at one point. It might have been at some big barbecue gathering where multiple people brought sauce. Pretty sure I liked it, but it probably wouldn’t go with Kraft.
I forgot to mention, I only brought it up bc our friend would only eat stuff like Mac and cheese so this was one of the few acceptable condiments SOMEHOW
Urgh, that reminded me of wanting spicy kiwi ketchup after watching Lower Decks.
Homemade Dr Pepper BBQ sauce is the best. Dad makes some every once in awhile. <3
that sounds awful
It doesn’t look bad.
Eew. Why ruin perfectly good barbecue sauce with Dr. Pepper?
Just use the hickory brown sugar stuff.
She’s (they’re?) alive! Welcome back good chrono-traveller!
As an European, Oh God. And, why is that a thing?
Am I blessed with the first comment? At 11:52?
Close, dang it.
None can defeat Ana.
In the beginning, Yahweh said “Let there be li-” and Ana flipped a switch.
Certainly seems that way sometimes…
Ok this got me
“The accumulated filth of all their comments and thread wars will foam up about their waists and all the karam-whores and posters will look up and shout “First post!” and Ana will whisper, ‘No‘.”
Karma. KARMA! Fat fucking thumbs!
It’s possible to post before Ana, but if you say that you’re first, you won’t be.
Okay wait, what problem does Joyce actually have with salt and pepper? This can’t be a textural or ‘no touching’ thing, it’s… salt and pepper.
Is she gonna be the kind that makes chicken breast with no seasonings?
Pepper adds visible black specks to the otherwise homogeneous appearance.
Salt is mostly invisible, so it is tolerated.
Ground pepper would be an absolute no-no. Pre-crushed into a powder so that it’s mostly invisible might be fine.
“crushed into a powder […] might be fine.”
I see what you did there.
White pepper exists, just for that reason. It’s the same peppercorns, just picked at a different stage so they can be skinned before curing. (Tthe dried, pulverized skins make pepper dark.) It has a milder flavor too, so she might actually try it once.
I have indulged in buying white peppercorns for certain dishes so the pepper doesn’t show up.
Yeah. I was taught to use white pepper in white sauces (Béchamel, Mornay etc.), Vichysoisse etc. for just that reason, and it is now a habit of mine.
I didn’t eat pepper until I was in my mid-20s. I could detect the slightest hint of an accidental grind and it would be like eating ash. I was nearly (not quite) Joyce-level food avoidant until I went vegetarian and had no choice but to try new things…. even now I have months where I can only eat X.
This week I have eaten nothing but bread and butter and dry noodles WITHOUT the seasoning. Partly because I can’t afford to go to the shops because anxiety and money, but partly because anything else that I do have in the fridge triggers rumination, including the thing I bulk bought because it was last week’s safe food.
Hi bogeywoman. If you haven’t already been evaluated for it, you may want to investigate and or seek testing for Mast Cell Activation Syndrome. Your circumstances are highly suggestive of it (and an exact description of what my partner was going through up until diagnosis), and it often goes undiagnosed for years as it is relatively unfamiliar to the majority of clinicians.
Here’s some information about Mast Cell Activation Syndrome (MCAS) symptoms, which may help you determine whether this warrants further inquiry.
https://www.mastocytosis.ca/en/diagnosis/signs-symptoms
https://www.brighamandwomens.org/medicine/gastroenterology-hepatology-and-endoscopy/advances-newsletters/reducing-gastrointestinal-symptoms-using-mast-cell-disorder-identification-and-treatment
(The “Characterizing Mast Cell Activation Syndrome” section is relevant)
If you decide to seek testing, you’d want an N-Methylhistamine and 11-beta prostaglandin F2 for confirmation; a tryptase test may be recommended to you, but be warned that it has high false negative rates.
Huh. The more you know. I thought it was just bc I’m autistic (and probably is), but I’ll get this checked out, because I experience several other symptoms spontaneously without clear cause. Thaanks for this!
I mean, it could very much be both. If you’re avoiding foods because they’re incredibly unpleasant to your senses, you might be describing sensory issues, which are a big part of autism; the brain doesn’t properly process things. Sucks. Also associated with ADHD sometimes, and there’s quite a bit of overlap between the two things.
If you’re avoiding foods because they make you physically unwell, you might have food allergies and/or Mast Cell Activation Syndrome. If it’s both, you might have both!
On the one hand, I relate to a lot of Joyce’s bland food quirks and am a person who genuinely finds basic pepper overly spicy.
On the other hand, given recent revelations that probably means I’m actually allergic to it.
What I’m saying is, if scratching an itch leaves bright red lines down your skin and certain foods largely considered ‘mild’ make your tongue burn, that might be an autoimmune issue and you might want to get that checked. Sometime when your local medical system isn’t collapsing, I mean.
Do you also get that reaction from glucosinolate spiciness?
We’re still working out what causes issues. Unfortunately, it’s largely a trial and error thing because MCAS is highly individualized.
So you’ve never gotten that kind of reaction from mustard or garlic?
Okay at this point I encourage you to look up trigger substances in the context of Mast Cell Activation Syndrome, because that’s all the mental labor I’m up to tonight. Alliums? Yes, turns out they’re a trigger. Mustard? Different family, spice I only ever had in the context of other things that are now known triggers, we haven’t tested that one yet because most of the things I’ve had it in are currently off the table.
It’s basically a constant state of low-grade anaphylaxis, if your immune system can freak out from its presence, there’s a chance it is currently making MY immune system freak out. It’s also a known post-COVID thing, and getting the plague definitely aggravated things. If you’re worried about it, see an allergist or something, I’m too busy figuring my own shit out.
Sorry if that sounds curt, just, yeah, I’m out of spoons and have been for most of the week.
That’s alright Regalli. Thank you for responding, and I’m SO sorry if I caused you any stress.
Sending caring support, Regalli. <3
Usually it’s fine – I brought it up for the same reason Ai’s linked outright, which is ‘sometimes something sounds familiar and was mostly mild ENOUGH it escaped notice and then you look it up and go “wait fuck”.’ But it’s also been on my mind a LOT because it’s such a recent thing I’m still figuring out what’s safe and what’s not (or ‘causes some reactions, but not bad enough to justify cutting this without something to replace it in my diet yet’,) which is about as stressful as it sounds even when the reactions aren’t life-threatening. And thus, out of spoons.
Ouch. You have all of my sympathy.
Hi The Wellerman. Here’s some information about Mast Cell Activation Syndrome (MCAS) symptoms, which may help you determine whether this warrants further inquiry.
https://www.mastocytosis.ca/en/diagnosis/signs-symptoms
https://www.brighamandwomens.org/medicine/gastroenterology-hepatology-and-endoscopy/advances-newsletters/reducing-gastrointestinal-symptoms-using-mast-cell-disorder-identification-and-treatment
(The “Characterizing Mast Cell Activation Syndrome” section is relevant)
MCAS often goes years undiagnosed and many clinicians may not have heard of it unless they are a specialist. If you seek testing you’d want an N-Methylhistamine and 11-beta prostaglandin F2 for confirmation; a tryptase test may be recommended to you, but be warned that it has high false negative rates.
Sorry about what you’re dealing with. A good friend of mine is allergic to pepper (and peppers, and at least one mystery ingredient), and while it’s a lot of careful label reading and still some reactions now, they say it’s a lot better than when they were growing up and had no idea what the trigger was.
Sometimes you just get used to things one way and changing that seems unthinkable.
In general? Nothing.
In this specific thing, they’re not part of her usual recipe.
Joyce almost always follows her usual recipes.
Eh, I don’t use salt or pepper with Mac & Cheese either
The alt text of this strip says Joyce has never used pepper: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2018/comic/book-8/04-of-mike-and-men/fidgety/
Mac n cheese casserole, that’s my jam. With a little crumbly crust on top. Ooohhh… Mac n Cheese TUNA casserole!
How about it, folks, a reprise of fave mac & cheese recipes?
Macaroni salad is interesting but kind of gross, IMHO.
Actually not that much of a fan of Mac ‘n Cheese, but I used to LOVE playing that one flash game with Kraft’s dinosaur!!!
What was it called again?
Macaroni salad is gross. Hawaiian macaroni salad is awesome!
I don’t really do much Mac n cheese but I really, really like how it tastes if you add a spoonful of dehydrated onions just after all is done, but 2 or 3 minutes before plating up.
y’know, Onion flakes
Ooh, yeah, dried onion flakes are my JAM!
dried shallots are too tough to use as a condiment, but the flavor is worth the PITA of grinding it up with a little salt. tarragon seems to me to go very well with dried shallots.
…. onion jam?
…. like, maybe if it was caramelized onion jam? That MIGHT be workable?
Onion jam is definitely a thing.
Cheese on macaroni is an abomination in the eyes of God and man. After all, macaroni is a form of pasta, and the only suitable topping for pasta is a richly seasoned, slow-simmered marinara sauce so deeply red that it could be mistaken for blood.
But then you just have to put cheese on/in the marinara.
My four-day ragù alla Bolognese begs to differ.
Where does that quote come from, “abomination in the eyes of God and man”?
There are several places in the Bible, such as Luke 16:15 — “And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God,” and I’m sure I’ve also read it in a novel or something elsewhere. I may have taken some liberties, putting my own little touch as a writer on it in the name of poetic license.
Oh, wow, cool! Thanks!
Didn’t it come from Castlevania?
nah
nah
i feel you
but nah
Various combinations of meat and cheese naturally go with macaroni. After all, pasta is really just a kind of bread. So what you’re really making is a bowl of sandwich.
I like to add about a half pound of cubed ham. Simple, relatively cheap and it tastes good. And it reheats fairly well, so one batch is two or three meals. (I live alone, so anything I cook inevitably involves left-overs. So, “How will this taste a couple of days from now?” is one of my criteria for deciding what to cook.)
“A bowl of sandwich” is a wonderful phrase I didn’t know I needed in my life
Same!
Nope, not so. Cheese is fine, and so is alfredo.
My favorite macs and cheeses are either tuna-broccoli with a little red pepper, multiple real cheeses with black pepper and a little garlic, or occasionally with thick tomato red pepper soup mixed in.
There is no one favourite way. There is only the inscrutable yearnings of the heart at any specific moment in the flow of time. Sometimes, one wants hearty baked macaroni and cheese with eggs in the batter and a bread crumb crust. Sometimes, one wants gooey oozy cheese like a soup. Sometimes one wants potato chips on top. Sometimes one wants fancy restaurant macaroni and cheese with truffle oil and mushrooms.
Sometimes, god help us, despite knowing it is wrong, one finds oneself desperately craving ketchup.
All are favourites in the moment. All are perfect at the time in which they are needed. I am a Canadian, and as such all macaroni and cheese is perfect and beloved in my sight.
A couple of years back I found some Hatch chiles in the store (not common this far into Gringoville) and discovered that dicing them into mac and cheese tastes AMAZING, and it goes well with tuna in there as well. I don’t know if the supermarket by me has a connection or what, but every year they get some Hatch in for about a week and very cheap (about half or more what it’d cost to get some shipped out direct from NM) and I load up and freeze them for this and stews and such.
Black pepper has its place, but that place is not on Mac and Cheese.
I suspect Willis of fomenting a religious was here for his own amusement.
Yum, yum, yum, yum, yum…
https://www.raos.com/recipes/macaroni-and-cheese/
I’m about to make something a little similar:
baked white lasagna casserole using heart-of-palm lasagna noodles, creamy aldredo sauce, and Mexican 3-cheese blend.
*alfredo
tunamac is awesome, though I prefer it with the premade bob evans type mac n cheese
My partner’s four cheese mac and cheese recipe with a topping of my chili recipe. Smooth, hot, goooood.
I cut up a few of the deer sticks my dad makes and throw them in. It adds a really nice level of spice to the mac & cheese. I discovered it in college and it still remains my favorite way to enjoy mac n cheese.
Mac and Cheese might be best expressed by the recipe on a box of Muellers macaroni elbows. In short, you first make a basic white sauce, then grate your cheese into it. Colman’s dried mustard and some white pepper are in the white sauce. A topping of toasted breadcrumbs stirred in melted butter is applied, before placing it in the oven.
This is correct.
I admit, I am also against adding hotdogs to macaroni because they are gross. However, no pepper and no salt? I would have to bring my own hot sauce just to fix it.
I tried adding some mustard to mine a little while ago, and apparently it DOES make it taste like sharp cheddar.
Now there’s some real spice.
(Max Tate, eat your heart out)
Mustard isn’t only acidic (vitamin c is an excellent flavor-enhancer, and it helps use less salt in a dish), but also astringent – As in, kinda raspy in your mouth, like, have you ever eaten what’s passes as wasabi in sushi? It’s tingly, and briefly drying, which in turn makes you salivate more.
It’s an excellent thing to put in a cheese sauce when you’re using a mild, fatty cheese (or an instant packet ;D)
Tell me about it slick! Real savory and tasty!
I’m especially fond of Heinz and Gulden’s bold yellow for everything I use it on, especially combining one of those with Jack in the Box’s Honey mustard on IKEA’s hotdogs. Not too fond of French’s though.
Like Beyonce, “I got hot sauce in my bag…”
You must not have ever had a decent hot dog. I recommend Zweigles, although they’re hard to come by outside of western NY.
Penny hot dogs, sliced up crosswise, fried in butter!
Here in Chile, we call hot dogs “completos” (as in complete) and its inconceivable to have them without anything but sauces, like the most basic variety has tomatoes dices small and mayo. Most people also put ketchup and/or mustard in them, and the most popular ones are “Italianos”, which recibe their name because apart from the aforementioned toppings they have mashed avocado, resembling the Italian flag. If any of y’all feels adventurous, I can vouch for their deliciousness – Try them ;3
Don’t listen to Brazilians, tho. Their hot dogs are a mess.that requires using a plate and cutlery, because it gets buried under all the other stuff they throw on top.
http://www.concepcionchile.cl/images_content/receta-completo-italiano.jpg
A picture of the thing /o/
I’m into it!
Excellent to know!
Do tell me if you ever have any, down here we’re proud of our sandwiches, ahah
(I’m vegetarian but ask me about pork tenderloin sandwiches. It’s one of the best things we offer.)
My mom would slice up spam and add frozen peas and carrots.
Mac and Cheese consists of Mac and Cheese.
Mac and Cheese and hotdogs etc. may be excellent, but it is no longer Mac and Cheese.
I was an adult before I learned that some people ate mac and cheese without cut up hotdogs. Sure, it was left out of the name, but it was one of those things that went without saying.
I was hoping orange perfection was a dessert food, like involving oranges, but learning it was Kraft dinner after spending 8 hours throwing up after eating kraft dinner, makes this strip cursed.
Here you go, Dorothy. Slip a box or two of this into the cupboard when Joyce isn’t looking ….
Oops… this was supposed to be standing on its own.
The fun shape macaroni always comes out too starchy, and if you cook it past al dente it just falls apart.
Rotini are the best “and cheese” macaroni, then it’s a tie between elbows and shells.
Once dad was making Mac and cheese, and orange jello for dessert. We put together the ingredients out on the counter, set the noodles to boil, mixed up the orange powder packets for the jello… when the noodles were done, it was time for the cheese sauce…. but where was the packet with the orange powder?
Orange Perfection: the worst damn jello you’ve ever eaten in your life
The word “abomination” has been used a lot last night, but this is the thing that 10000% fits its definition. Holy shit X’DDD
You can always add some pepper to your own bowl, Dotty.
Very much true!
Also I think you usually cook the hotdogs separately and THEN add them to the bowl when it’s done?
Yeah, so it’s still by the directions. You just combine things.
I think that’s what she’s suggesting here, that she will augment her own macaroni.
*peppers the mac with questions* Some white pepper oughta do it.
Panel 3&4: Ya cannot spell Joyce without coy.
I see what Dorothy means about the hot dogs but pepper? In Keaft Mac and Cheese? Gross
… wait, black pepper or bell peppers? Because bell peppers work pretty good.
Black pepper does too. That and curry powder works well in terms of spices.
Ooh, yeah, curry powder on EVERYTHING!
[reads alt text]
Why yes! Yes he is!
(Though Garfield was perfection once….)
I thought Dorothy meant actual peppers, and I was like “HELL YEAH!” Then I realized she meant regular condiment pepper. Disappointment.
I think she knows she needs to lower her bar in acknowledgement of Joyce’s culminary hangups.
Unfortunately too old to find on the Internet, so far back that I forget if I was in high school when it was on, PBS did a series on World History done as a parody of a news broadcast. They even had “in period” faux commercials. On one of these, a medieval minstrel was touting a new product from Turkey. Pepper Makes It Better!
PS: The TV series was called TIMELINE. It aired in 1989 and only ran for six episodes. This LINK goes to a YouTube that has an episode, but unfortunately not one that includes ‘Pepper’. :/
Welcome to RADICALLY DIFFERENT JOYCE.
We’re just lucky she hasn’t built an entire hardline worldview based on Kraft vs Velveeta.
Oh, this strip came on one of the Kickstarter Bookmarks, I just thought it had been a Patreon strip I missed!
I was wondering because I had seen it and was all “what the hell?” xD
You got this one? I’ve got like 5 of the Space Vampire ones, just figured they were the standard.
The one I got with Book 11 has the “get up Joyce, kill, eat” strip on one side and one with Amber and Ethan on the other.
Huh, mine has “get up Joyce, kill, eat” on one side and this one the other. I didn’t realize they were all different.
Dorothy, why do you want pepper in your mac & cheese? Why do you want pepper in anything?
I like it on scrambled eggs, but I don’t think I’d want it on my macaroni.
Because pepper is the best condiment.
My father declared black pepper to be his favourite food. Mostly to provoke a reaction, but….
No, that’s chilli and chilli sauce.
Pepper is good on a lot of stuff. Not Mac & Cheese, but on a lot of other things
I disagree. I think pepper goes wonderfully on Mac and cheese, just so long as you don’t overdo it.
Culturally, “mac and cheese” hasn’t really been a thing where I live, but I sure have been eating pasta with cheese and ham sauce for most of my life… and that’s practically the same ingredients, aside from… y’know… the ham.
Can’t imagine ever making it without either white or black pepper. Salt and pepper are just the bare minimum for most dishes. (That said, now my brain is frantically trying to figure out exactly what determines if salt and pepper is appropriate for a dish or not. Savoriness? I don’t know.)
Mrs. Dash table blend replaced regular black pepper on my table. There’s black pepper in it, but it also has other stuff like onion powder, garlic, and cumin.
…… Oh my god. I’ve just realized she puts pepper in it because of CACIO E PEPE
https://www.bonappetit.com/recipe/cacio-e-pepe
But…but…but… Joyce had to mix milk and butter and cheese and macaroni all together … AT THE SAME TIME!!! For someone who just last semester was picking pepperoni off of pizza and deconstructing tacos in the dining area, this is a HUGE step forward!
How?
KD cheese sauce is a homogeneous, smooth substance, not something with things in. She likes homogeneous stuff, and is less grossed out by poop than food with things in.
She has trouble eating non-homogenous foods, not necessarily cooking with them.
…. she knows it’s all basically cow-juice? (And she was happy to eat it when she visited home, before the deconstruction.)
I was nostalgic and bought some of the Boxed Mac And Cheese for dinner this week. The side of my box says 1. boil water 2. cook pasta, and 3. add cheese packet. Joyce is safe!
>
Those are all ingredients that combine into a homogenous, allegedly cheese-adjacent substance, so it’s fine.
Pepperoni have a separate appearance and texture and therefore must be removed and consumed separately.
I mean… I like to add Lowry’s seasoning salt to cheap mac n cheese. Also, Joyce is literally the epitome of the Robin from Teen Titans GO saying boiled potatoes with salt is too spicy.
I usually add some extra cheese to thicken it up, but honestly, I don’t mess with Kraft much. Hotdogs or bacon, honestly, tend to overpower it a bit and make it very porky even outside of the bites with them in it, so I am not all that into that.
Never tried peppers, or any other veggies for that matter. I could prrrobably do something like broccoli or something else green?
“Orange Perfection” in Naruto’s most notorious sex move.
SAUCE?!?!
I cannot stand KD done by the instructions.
Way too much milk. Sauce ends up thin and nearly flavourless.
Just a splash of milk, let the sauce get most of its moisture from the butter.
I can’t eat Mac and cheese so I can’t really weigh in on this particular food item.
I will say I’m usually with Joyce though – I am not a person who typically adds things to other things. If I’m trying a new recipe, for myself or if I’m cooking for others, I am very strict about following it exactly the first time I make it. I want to see how it’s SUPPOSED to turn out before I start fiddling with it.
My mother’s still a little sore that I wouldn’t let her add garlic to a vegetable soup I made a while ago for my boyfriend’s birthday. TBF, it was very much the kind of thing that sounded like it should have garlic. The general consensus was it tasted good but my mom insists it would’ve been perfect with garlic. Ah well. Next time. XD
I’m An #Old, Latinx atheist and ADHD mess; yet there’s a lot of moments when I find Joyce highly, highly relatable. This one? Is not of them.
I’m a vegetarian pro cook (currently unemployed and missing the sadomasochistic environment of restaurants); and though sometimes I’ll happily sin with instant ramen, this strip made me shudder.
Yeah I totally get the recipe-fixation thing too. Lots of people like the stuff that’s real nostalgic and familiar, as do I, although for lots of things I don’t follow the box-directions.
For instance, when it comes to chicken recipes, I almost NEVER add the amount of salt listed. I mean, a little salt and spice is good, but not EVERYTHING needs to taste like concentrated KFC, you know?
Oh honey
i was meaning the literal opposite of that. IDK about chicken recipes (haven’t eaten animals in 18 years) – I cannot with stuff straight from the box instructions. Swear to god I’m not disrespecting, if I’m offered some I’ll be happy to eat it! But yeah, I’m always modifying mine (and i adjust salt to taste because, professional cook and by now I do that from the soul); and one of my favorite pleasures is eating new stuff from around the world, and tasting new spices and seasonings.
My newest hack that doesn’t involve toppings is: add real milk, add real cheese(s), and a pinch of Masaman curry paste. Umami in your mouth all over, and a more “fresh” aftertaste :3
Wait, what did you mean again? Sorry, kinda suck at subtlety like this. Neurodivergence!
I do stuff from the box for nostalgic feelz, and sometimes I cook when I feel like I’m in the mood for something in particular, like for instance when Cowboy Bebop came on just the other day, I tried my hand at some bell peppers and beef.
Glad to meet yet another great chef around these parts, so awesome you like to try flavors from all over the world!
I never even thought to add curry paste to Mac and Cheese!!! Next to mustard in it, I’m bound to try that too, thanks!!!
It’s ok! As previously stated, ADHD mess here ;D it’s ok! I didn’t understand that well either, I thought you were saying you did stuff following the instructions because it was nostalgic, but didn’t get you were also saying you experimented from time to time ♥ ANIME FOOD THO. How do animators make it so pretty? It’s no wonder it inspired you, how excellent that you liked the bell peppers
And aldbfjs idk if “great” but I’ve been at it for a while and yeah, despite of the also aforementioned S&M treatment in pro kitchens, I still love it. Who else is a chef here?
how cool that there’s more of us. Also, I’m really happy you liked the curry suggestion! Do tell me if you ever try it, I’d love to hear what you think ;www;
Well just to be modest, I used the sweeter kind of bell peppers since I didn’t have any of the kind Jet used. Anyways it wouldn’t have been exactly like his anyway because it actually had beef in it LOL
Yeah I might actually try making Agar pudding after watching a giant one made in Assassination Classroom, which is also like in my top 3 shows right now! 🤩
Oh, fam I haven’t watched that one but my little sister loves it. I’ll ask to join in when she re-watches (something she does from time to time) just to see the pudding X’DD Careful with agar agar tho! I’ve used it in vegan baking and while more expensive than clear gelatin, you use like a tenth of the powder you’d normally need. It’s potent! (Which is a pro, tbh)
And oi! Sweet bell peppers are tasty, I say there’s no loss in your replacing ;D As I said, once you have the base of cooking, “creativity” trumps “by the book” unless you’re trying something wildly out of your comfort zone.
the best way to eat kraft dinner is to leave the noodles plain then sprinkle the powder cheese on top without mixing it in
It’s funny to me that Joyce’s expressions now resemble Roz’s a lot.
Here you go, Dorothy. Slide a box or two of this into the cupboard when Joyce isn’t looking.
Wouldn’t that package be full of salt already? I mostly do my cheese sauces and pasta from scratch so I wouldn’t know but doesn’t most food have already too much salt?
Yeah.
Even made from scratch mac & cheese is plenty salty, since most cheeses have a lot of salt. The packets are generally worse.
It’s like salting your instant Ramen.
I just checked a box of macaroni and cheese (store brand because I’m a cheapskate), and there’s about 460mg of sodium in a 2.5oz (1/3 of the box) serving. That jumps to about 570 “as prepared” with butter and whole milk.
Not great, but not terrible either…
For me, that’s a ton already, not something you’d add more to.
At the bare minimum, needs a little garlic. A couple of cloves, per person.
I shoulda known that Joyce’s mac n cheese would be vanilla.
…. wait, would vanilla work in mac n cheese? I WANT to say no, but….
The idea of macaroni and cheese with vanilla induced a full-body shudder.
No, no, I could see it. Like a vanilla frosted cake with a mild mac n cheese filling.
Like a cheesecake!
Vanilla Mac n Cheese, here’s the recipe:
http://www.recipekey.com/therecipes/Vanilla-Mac-and-Cheese
I love the expressions in the last panel
Joyce all smug, and Dorothy just, “…No”
Personally, I think Kraft mac and cheese is perfectly fine out of the box, but given the option, I do like adding some mustard; it adds an acidity that compliments the savory of the mac and cheese nicely (he said as if he has any idea what he’s talking about.)
Ketchup is better! Little acid, little sweet. If you get really fancy, little Frank’s Red Hot as well. Perfect KD.
The trouble with ketchup is that, like pickles, it just takes over the flavor of whatever it’s added to.
Mustard’s more than just acid, also nuttiness and savory and delicious spiciness!
But of course combined with ketchup it’s fantastic! Gotta try it in some Mac and Cheese next chance I get!
I am here for how this is going to blow up.
Does Dorothy know Becky’s going to show up?
I literally made KD for dinner a couple hours ago. KD works in mysterious ways…
(or its a coincidence)
Stand by, formulating lengthy diatribe on the moral bankruptcy of both characters in this moment, with particular emphasis on Dorothy.
As someone who cannot stand mac and cheese in general, and Kraft mac and cheese even more so, I find it hard to read this strip.
As an English major, I was merely confused by the alt-text, trying to figure out what was orange about the ultimate abusive “but he’s so romantic!” bad boy. I tried to remember if there was some weird Irish ascendancy subtext in Wuthering Heights, but then I remembered the existence of comics. If I’d never discovered Comics Curmudgeon, though, I would probably still be utterly baffled.
As am I.
For me, mac and cheese isn’t complete without pepper and green pepper Cholula sauce
Pepper is good Dorothy, but have you tried *paprika and breadcrumbs*?
See, breadcrumbs are nice on a homemade baked mac and cheese, but I can’t really see that working with Kraft. A friend of mine likes to top his with crumbled Nacho Cheese Doritos, though, and I think it just about works.
OK, now I’m just waiting for Kraft to partner up with Frito-Lay, ’cause that frickin NEEDS to happen bruh
The most I’ll add to my mac and cheese is more cheese to make it gooey. Or bacon bits, if I’m feeling special. But hot dogs? Nasty Dorothy. Pepper is also terrible, but I just hate pepper in general, and accept some people like it. I refuse to accept hot dog, if you need meat, add REAL meat.
Hot dogs are cheap and some kids are excessively fussy about their protein. Parents on a budget gotta make do.
Yeah, the meat’s the meat, but it’s all in the SAUCE, ya know?
Speaking of which Comrade Delicious, what’s your Primary Sausage Saucing Strategy?
Depends on the sausage. If it’s a bratwurst, sauce feels like an insult and if I need more moisture I’ve failed to cook it properly. Kielbasa gets whatever I’ve got on-hand, typically curry sauce. Chorizo gets ground/chopped and I usually just use taco seasoning. “Breakfast sausage” is disgusting in most cases but sometimes it can go in a nice runny egg yolk, unless I’m feeling sensory. Italian sausage is great on a pizza with Alfredo sauce. Hot dogs get whatever’s closest at hand, typically a nice meaty chili or just some ketchup if I’m feeling particularly Caucasian that day. Good hot dogs get the shredded cheese and maybe some relish if they’ve behaved today. Once again, it all depends on the sausage, and if the combo is wrong it leads to the dread Shuma-Gorath gaining more power.
As a side note, it’s always a little odd/amusing to be referred to with just the adjective, without the subsequent noun.
Yeah, just bored after staring at and debugging lines of Javascript all day, thanks for helping me mix and spice things up a bit
But if you’d rather I refer to you otherwise, I’ll totally respect that slick
Typically folks drop the adjective, since my name is Taffy. In a few months, we’re hoping that’s also legally the law.
Sweet! Stay Delicious, Taffy!
Not all kids like hot dogs. Sometimes you just don’t bother because you can’t win.
If your kids don’t like hot dogs, send them to work in The Mines for a few weeks, teach the little blighters some respect and gratitude. No more than a month though, or they might lose their imprinting and forget your face.
Yeah, I’m not sending my past self to the mines for hating the texture so much it made me sick.
Such a shame. The Mines build character and also whatever effects come from long-term exposure to sulfur. Although if you DID manage to send your child-self there, would you change in the present, and would it be enough to cancel out the need to send yourself? Alright yeah, I don’t think texture issues really warrant time travel.
Sliced hot dogs in mac and cheese is a classic! My grandpa used to call it pennies from heaven.
People’s change jars in Heaven must smell pretty weird, then.
In Heaven, it always comes out even at the register.
I had some leftover chili that I added to an otherwise “by the book” Mac & Cheese. You’re right though on the “no hot dogs”.
Something that goes well with Mac & Cheese is a can of chili.
‘Round these parts, we call that chili mac and toss in some protein, usually ground beef or hot dog slices if that’s all we got. Quick, cheap, filling, tasty.
If you’ve got the time, make patties with the beef, grill them, then grind them back up in a food processor. That shit’s good, better than just pan frying it.
As a non-American, I’ve always thought mac and cheese was gross. It’s just carbs and fat, no subtleness at all.
Then I tried some that had chilli (as in, the chilli pepper fruit) in it. That was pretty good.
So I’m with Dotty on this one, go find some spice!
This is different enough to merit being considered an entirely different dish, but if you ever try the baked kind of mac and cheese, I think it’s much better. It might have breadcrumbs on top, or crumbled Ritz crackers, and the cheeses can be actual, identifiable types beyond whatever the hell goes in the Kraft variety – it’s much heartier. Whereas I will more or less not eat the Kraft-type mac and cheese – I think I’ve intentionally gotten it once in my life?
That said, I’m with you on chili pepper going well with anything that’s inordinately cheesy.
Dorothy -has food preference-
Comments “ UGh DOrThy!!”
I dunno, when she said that she can make great mac and cheese, I expected her to not use instant stuff. Like, with real ingredients. Cheese sauce is not that hard. Oh and the only cheese that’s allowed to be orange is cheddar. Which doesn’t melt that well, so you’d use gouda or Emmentaler as base. Both should have a light yellow. Cheese sauce shouldn’t be orange..
She did show the packages at some point but though my brain knew better, my heart was still hopeful she did SOMETHING to them to justify that line :’)
Well, on the bright side, I just learned I’m really great at making pizza. And Chinese noodles. And chocolate cake.
I’m really good at following instructions printed on the back of something
Hey, if it’s a tasty meal then it’s a good meal! I’m a pro cook but not a snob. My problem is specifically with the sadness of plain mac and cheese, ahaha
Congratulations on being great ;3
Even Cheddar shouldn’t be orange. It’s just food coloring these days.
Cheddar is colored, yes, but AFAIK it’s the only cheese where colouring is traditional. There’s some plant stuff in it that makes it orange.
Usually annatto/achiote seeds. They’re small reddish orange seeds that give yellow coloring foods (sometimes as a cheap substitute for saffron). Used a lot in Latin cooking
Traditionally, it’s from something in the grass (or other vegetation?) the cows in Cheddar were grazing on, but now it’s just added.
Did she not specifically say Kraft Mac and Cheese? And even if not, what about Joyce’s relationship with food made you think that she’s cooking actual homemade meals? Homemade food is inconsistent; Kraft Mac and Cheese always tastes the same, as long as you follow the directions. The only real surprise here (which, let’s be honest, isn’t that much of a surprise) is the lack of add-ins.
Panel 3 Joyce will haunt my nightmares forever.
I only see two bowls and two forks. Hopefully if Becky shows up someone has extra so it’ll be a non-issue.
I’d imagine they’re either disposable or Joyce can summon them at will. They’re green, so there’s evidence of a Green Lantern ring.
Hopefully the dorm kitchen has a supply of disposable cutlery, or there are reusable ones and an off-panel dishwasher.
Or two of them get bowls, and the third eats right out of the pan, as is tradition.
Why get a third bowl dirty?
It occurs to me that this is, yet again, subtext of Joyce wanting to mac on Dorothy.
Cheese belongs nowhere near private parts, don’t put that evil in my head.
1) Mack can refer to just flirting. Or making out.
2) …. nope, not going to make a cheesy “head” pun.
I knew about the meaning of “mack” already. I was being deliberately obtuse and gross.
While I have not done the experiment, I have enough faith in the Internet that I would put a small amount of money on the proposition that a Google search on “cheddar cheese carved dildo” would return something.
I’m definitely not going to link it here, but there’s a ubiquitous result titled “Masturbation with White Cheddar Cheese Carved Dildo”, which appears to be the same video spread across multiple sites. The thumbnail seems to be a delivery on said promise. Rule 34 and all that, I suppose.
Lot’s of people say “I fucking love cheese”, so it follows someone would take it literally
Coincidentally, I made mac and cheese for dinner tonight. Joyce, and probably Willis, would have refused to eat it on pain of death.
Broccoli, halved cherry tomatoes, mushrooms, bell peppers, onion, garlic, salt, pepper, sage, paprika, chili, nutritional yeast, and a little cinnamon.
With all those added ingredients, doesn’t it eventually start to become a distinct food?
It does! It becomes mac ‘n cheese.
Kinda like pizza is still pizza with like sixteen kinds of meat and veg. (Unless you meant something else by “distinct food”?)
To be fair, I made it from scratch, so it wouldn’t really qualify as food for Joyce anyway.
Your dish sounds good, but it is not Mac and Cheese. Pizza is not named for its ingredients. Like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, Mac and Cheese is. If your peanut butter and jelly sandwich contains avocado, it is not, in fact, a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. It is something else.
Right, I don’t put anything in macaroni cheese that isn’t a) macaroni or b) cheese. I don’t know why Joyce has a milk carton and a packet of butter on the table.
Because the box of Kraft Dinner says to use them.
Paraphrased from a box of store brand I have handy:
– Cook macaroni, drain, do not rinse, return to pot
– Add 4 tablespoons unsalted butter or margarine, 1/4 cup milk, and cheese sauce packet
– Mix until well combined and creamy
The milk and butter reconstitute the cheese powder.
I had just assumed Daibhid C was kidding…
Must be my turn to be the overly literal joke ruiner. Sorry.
I’ve gotten more turns in that game than I can count
Yeah, I was kind of playing on the idea that if the term “macaroni cheese” is prescriptive, and prevents adding vegetables, then it logically prevents other things being added as well, even though they’re required. I’m not sure it was as funny as I thought at the time.
But it’s not a complete meal if it’s just macaroni and cheese sauce? I’d have to make vegetables or meat or whatever else and then add them to the side, which creates twice or more the dirty dishes. Throwing everything into the sauce is still mac ‘n cheese, just with stuff in it. I just disagree that a dish named for the primary ingredients has to be just that. Like if you put cheese and peppers on beans and rice, it’s still beans and rice?
I have made sauce with just nutritional yeast before, for vegan friends, but I actually hate it. I add it to regular cheese sauce because my partner likes the taste and it adds an important protein or amino acid or something.
Nutritional yeast has a bunch of vitamins, especially B12, which is why I put it in stuff (or on popcorn). I agree that it’s not good as a total replacement, but it’s not bad as an addition to things.
I’d just call it mac ‘n cheese with vegetables. (Unless the nutritional yeast was being used as a cheese replacement, in which case I would spell it as “cheez” or such to make the distinction.)
So, has Dorothy never actually seen Mac&Cheese actually prepared? (Since she asked “That’ it?”
Or has she only ever prepared it with hotdogs or other additions?
She’s probably none of those weirdos who add things that aren’t on the side of the box.
The latter, which she clarifies in response to Joyce’s follow-up question.
Spencer with the rest of the cast: *long-winded post on the character’s history and nature, compounded by their neuroses both ongoing and immediately relevant, speculating on what’s driving them in the now and has been for some time*
Spencer when Dorothy is on-panel: Hello Day-Ruiner, what fresh hell are you bringing with you today, is it the part where everything gets worse because of you, as if the day is being ruined
Fucking A lol
The problem with my constant bullying of Dorothy’s nerd face is that the lastmonth I’ve been stricken with a bad case of brain fog and losing hours due to dithering on where my time should go and to what, and my solution is to make a schedule.
It’s me. I was Dorothy all along.
sometimes i look at the comments and am forced to confront the reality that i have lived a VERY different life from some of the people in here
Orange? And that Orange is due to some weird cheese and not by pumpkin? I’ve lost my appetite….
So hey I’ve been wondering for a while… what’s up with that “White People Cooking” stereotype you have in US? Is it really so bad?
I think the epicenter is the midwest, where you’re more likely to find roadside diners selling breaded and deep fried butter pats.
Ah reminds me a visit to a KFC… there was more bread than chicken in those wings…
Wings are a vehicle for dipping sauce and toppings, they’re not supposed to have a lot of meat on them.
Then the restaurants can make them cheaper. I’ve had some meaty-ass wings and I’ve had some disgusting bone piles, and the bone piles always seem more expensive for some reason. If I want something hard and dry to dip in something, I’ll get some chips. Adding a molecule-thin layer of meat to the inside of the deepest part of a pit of breading, that oughta be illegal.
Full disclosure: that was meant to be facetious. “Wings” that are nothing but bones, breading, and sauce are a waste of perfectly good chicken.
Such Heresy! What am I supposed to do with meat I can’t bite into like Obelix bites into a boar?
That’s why they sell the breast, leg, and thigh cuts. (Or just get a whole rotisserie chicken from the grocery store. You’ll get a couple days worth of chicken from one of those!)
Yum!
There’s nothing quite like properly grilled chicken tiddy. All you really need are charcoal and some apple wood chunks. Season with either Simon & Garfunkel blend (parsley, sage, rosemary, and thyme) or creole seasoning.
Not for everyone in the Midwest. My family obsesses over Thai dishes and we have decent exposure to the rest of SE Asia cuisine. And my wife makes a top flight pesto using basil from our herb garden. And my oldest son has a recipe for hoppin’ John that is awesome.
Yeah, it’s more of a traditional mid-West cooking thing. Lots of people, especially younger ones, embrace other cuisines.
Modern US white people cooking is pretty seriously diverse, as we appropriate tastes from other cultures and mix them in with our own. Even some traditional regional white US cuisines aren’t at all bland.
I suspect as well that a lot of it stems from Depression era (or just preceding working poverty) needs, followed by the introduction of mass marketing just as people started to be able to afford a little better.
Boomers and their parents had a tendency to boil the life out of everything… Broccoli is so much better when it’s not soggy and on the verge of falling apart!
Crunchy.
Raw or soaking up Chinese sauces.
AL DENTE BROCCOLI, SALT, LEMON, AND STRAIGHT INTO MY MOUTH. You gotta kill the cooking (because once you get it out of hot water its core is still hot and keeps cooking itself) via submerging and rinsing in cold cold water. Then you get something that barely needs additions to be a delight.
I love broccoli in dishes, and in special with asian sauces. Tempura broccoli is A++ too, and I’ve put it raw in a pizza before I take it to the oven. But that’s just great additions – The Platonic Ideal of Broccoli as a food is cooked until it’s bright green and not a second more, with a pinch of salt and lemon. Nothing else. I truly don’t know why people boil it until it’s yellow and falling apart :C AND WITH KETCHUP! It’s nastyyy
That’s blanching, and almost exactly what you’d do to prepare fresh vegetables for canning or the freezer.
Growing up, the broccoli I was always served by my mother and grandmother was almost all florets, boiled until they were wet sponges and a fork easily coasted through what little stem remained. To this day I don’t understand why. Maybe it was a Great Depression thing, or a French-Canadian thing that got passed down through the ages. I just know that when I cook broccoli for myself, it gets steamed. (Usually in an Instant Pot or a ready-for-the-microwave steam bag, because I’m lazy.)
Steamed vegetables are so much better than their boiled-to-mush counterparts! Peas, for example. Fresh or frozen steamed peas are amazing, canned peas are salty little balls of ennui.
OOOH, delish!
Also, a combination of late 1800s/early 1900s food faddery (everything “exciting” was probably poison) and xenophobia (immigrants smell bad because they eat garlic, therefore they must learn to cook American – no pasta, no pickles, no saurkraut, no spices, no salt, and NO GARLIC).
Huh, that last one would explain why vampires were so prolific in US in Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter.
*snicker*
Totally seriously, the Mormon ban on “hot drinks” (tea and coffee) can be directly traced to an 1800s food fad.
It’s like if a modern religious movement insisted on a paleo diet for followers, and then 200 years later after the food fad died people thought it was just a weird “Those Guys” thing.
I found that out, btw, while trying to source the claim that hot bread out of the oven is bad for you. (It’s not. 1800s food faddery!)
Huh they actually told me that when I was a kid, something about hot bread making your intestines knot or blocking them up?
I went to visit my then boyfriend in Georgia a few years ago and he brought me to a family birthday party where they embodied every white American stereotype. Couldn’t dance, reached volumes i legitimately didn’t think humans were capable of, losing their minds over rae dun pottery, probably would’ve said something racist to me if they got drunk (they were all trump supporters). And yeah, the food one too which was disappointing. His grandma warned me that the queso for the nachos they left out had jalapeno and was spicy, and I’m weak to pepper. But i didn’t even get a tingle when i tasted it. BBQ sauce is spicer. His grandpa was making shish kebabs and they smelled amazing but the meat was almost flavorless. It tasted grilled but idk if he even salted it.
The only other time i had to stay with white people for a while they were British and it was culinary hell. Had nothing but like, frosted wheat cereal for breakfast and they made me ham and cheese sandwiches for lunch that tasted like the color grey. Idk how they did it. But i tasted neither ham nor cheese in those sandwiches.
Will say his grandma made a mean chocolate pie though. What that family lacked in salt they made up for with delicious sugar
“tasted like the colour grey”. I find that statement very funny, I might have to steal that if the appropriate situation arises.
It’s as accurate as any broad stereotype about a group of people which number in the 8-9 digits spanning over an entire continent of land.
You know.
Not at all.
Never tasted M&C, but it looks like is very tasteless and thin. Like instant Lamen.
>salt
The Absolute MadLass!
actually, you know what the most popular thing to add to the 4/1$ boxed mac and cheese amount my generation is/was?
Ketchup.. because you normally ate mac and cheese with hotdogs (in or separately) which involved ketchup and the two ended mixed together..normally anyways
However, since I only eat hotdogs with chili and cheese on them and the Velveeta shells and cheese I haven’t indulged in ages … Oddly tho for living in Indiana I’m surprised no one in the cast seems familiar with Hamburger/tuna helper
Holy crap that’d go PERFECT with the sharp cheddar mustard combo I’ve tried!
Dotty : “you have no idea what actual cooking is, Joyce”
Well, Joyce can follow directions; turns out she’s just a little too beholden to them at this point in her life. Who knows what little amount of capsaicin she’s ever encountered so far?
For me, I didn’t know what dark chocolate was when I started my first semester of college (mumblemumble) years ago, but it was my first time on my own, and freshmen try new, weird things. Now I can find dark chocolate anywhere.
She rejected the authority of her church and her parents, and she’s gotten everything she needs from the optometrist, so the macaroni and cheese box is currently the highest authority she has to answer to!
Yup. I think this is what we’ve all been missing in discussing our own personal tastes (ha) in food, and macaroni and/or cheese in particular – Joyce is very much in favor and/or need of Following Directions, having structure, and obeying authority (so long as they don’t conflict with her own moral sense). Because that’s how she overcomes her own neuroses and/or is assured that she’s (Doing It) Right.
Hot dogs, Dorothy? Really?
Fry up a pound of ground beef, drain it, and dump it in there. Or crack open a couple cans of tuna.
…vegetables
Oh, silly Joyce. It’s Kraft Mac & Cheese. It’s going to be gross no matter what anybody does to it.
And it must be eaten immediately, before it sets. And if you try to save any leftovers, forget it.
(There’s nothing more disappointing than gritty leftover macaroni and cheese from yesterday. Nothing you try will revive it to its original state.)
Ketchup. Ketchup restores leftover KD to a non-gritty state while still being delicious.
I have heard cold KD makes good pothole repair material. And yes, KD must be eaten immediately, once cooked, it must be consumed no longer than 20 minutes after preparation.
In addition to salt and pepper, like onions, broccoli, and a little hot sauce (Franks usu.)
I love mac and cheese, but when I eat it I always have to cut up some hot dogs and put them in with it. Or just have some other kind of meat with it if there are no hot dogs.
Joyce has never been more right than she is in this strip. Then again I do love Joyce’s food issues because I have such similar ones (autism ftw, plus she and I both grew up within driving distance of each other)
1 box mac and cheese to 1 can chilli to 1 can green chillis.
Once again I feel connected to Joyce. Are we sure she is not also on the autism spectrum?
Food sensitivities and anxiety/obsession/compulsion complexes like this are stripes that can occur with ALL kinds of neurodivergence.
Salt?
Dang, Joyce, contain that nihilism a bit!
Salt is a seasoning, so you can’t “spice things up” by adding salt. Additionally, I hadn’t realized until recently the only difference between herbs and spices is whether or not it originates as the leaf of a plant or not. Spices are literally just nonleaf (seeds, fruits, roots, etc) plant parts used to flavor foods.
when I was a kid, I used to cover my mac and cheese with pepper. I couldn’t get enough of it. Then I discovered that there are other spices. Today I wouldn’t dream of making mac and cheese without a bunch of black pepper, cayenne pepper, chipotle pepper, oregano, garlic.
I never add salt to anything, not even the water I boil pasta in.
The right amount of salt (or monosodium glutamate) will just enhance other flavors. If something tastes salty, it has too much salt in it.
This is the correct take on salt. Unless it’s Korean or Persian pickles and they are meant to be an incredibly salted, garlicky counterbalance to heaps of raw vegetables.
adding salt in water is overrated, anyway
When you’ve only recently been in charge of cooking for yourself and no one else.
Tbh i like keeping my Kraft flavor simple. I hate grittiness in it so i can’t add any spices with big enough particles to detect. Plus if I’m making Kraft Mac n cheese then i just want that simple, delicious fake cheesey flavor so i can sit down with my pot and eat the whole thing in one sitting with a serving spoon
….
Shut up it’s just cuz I’m nostalgic for living on campus
Look, it’s really easy to understand.
Kraft Dinner is simple, it’s a blunt force of orange mush and you eat it to get punched in the face by that one taste.
Putting salt or ketchup or god forbid those disgusting hot dogs does not make Kraft Dinner “more rich and flavourful” or whatever, it just tastes less like Kraft Dinner.
If I’m eating sauteed salmon garnished with vegetables and buttered shrimp, that’s because I’m eating what is intended as a complex meal of individual pieces! I don’t just throw More Tastes in there when one of those tastes matters more!
So glad you think adding hot dogs is gross. What an unhealthy, awful contribution to an already fatty and heavily processed meal. It’s not even a good source of protein; you’re just adding more sodium and bad fats (as opposed to the good ones… Butter, in moderation, is good. Olive oil good. Most processed fats bad).
See this guy gets it
Its weird that this is not universally accepted!
Ladies! Please!
Not that we don’t still make boxed mac & cheese but I realized last year how incredibly easy it is to make homemade mac & cheese and basically insist on doing it most of the time these days. It’s just pasta, cheese, milk, flour, butter, salt & pepper (I normally wouldn’t mention salt & pepper but seeing so many people disgusted about black pepper – black pepper! – in mac & cheese makes me realize I should make an exception here).
Once you’ve got that going you can throw in any number of things: Chopped jalapenos, bacon, some veggies. (To try and trick the kid into eating vegetables sometimes we’ll chop up some spinach very finely and mix that into the sauce.) We don’t usually add stuff in since I’m usually making it as a side to something else but yeah, it’s a good base for adding lots of other stuff.
100 percent with Joyce on this one. Macaroni and cheese doesn’t need extra ingredients to make it edible. It’s a very distinct and consistent texture and flavor. Not a Kraft fan, personally, but the principle applies.
It has a good flavor on it’s own but I might want some protein or veg if it’s the main meal.
yeh
Food should taste like itself.
I mean, sure, but I’m a big fan of adding some real cheese to the mix. Grate some nice, flavorful, melty cheese and add it in when mixing everything together, real big flavor boost and a ton of extra cheesy stretch to it.
Agreed. Food at base should taste like itself. If you want yours with pepper, there’s the grinder to add to your own; but the baseline should be the food that is advertised done in a way that will be nice to most people who like that advertised food.
OTOH, if you’re not cooking for public consumption and you know the tastes of those who are going to eat it …
The idea of squishy, bland hotdogs in mac and cheese makes me want to puke. Personally I’d go with caramelized diced onions, peas, paprika, black pepper, extra garlic. Then I’d bake the mac and cheese so that it all comes together nicely. Maybe sprinkle powdered parmesan and some seasonings on top so that it has a slightly-crunchy cheese topping.
Wow. This reminds me of Ned Flanders favorite snack: peanut butter on white bread with water for dipping.
Gotta say, I’m with Joyce on this one.
I’m curious if folks realize that adding hot dogs to Mac and Cheese is probably a notable nostalgic childhood thing for Dorothy. It’s not the most common addition, but it’s absolutely the sort of thing that would appeal of a little kid’s taste buds.
Not this former kid, at least. Hot dogs were meant for a hotdog bun only. They weren’t a sausage substitute either. They were hotdogs for hotdog buns.
Aged cheddar is good on Mac and Cheese though you’d have to either shred it into the pot while hot to melt or microwave after.
Why do I feel like dorothy has that orange scolapasta specifically designated for the kraft pasta?
Joyce****!!!
Joyce****!!!
I love it! 285 comments, all about mac n cheese!
I honored this conversation this morning with veggie sausages & cheese with baked green onions, and coffee with cream and pepper. (Pepper makes everything better!)
Dude, this sounds like a delicious recipe. I’m going to try it! IDK about coffee with pepper, tho – I’m a black coffee fiend (even have my favorite place of origin, which is Guatemalan coffee). But I’ll try it because, novelty. How do you make it?
Yeah! I myself am very curious of what it would do to Italian roast and vanilla cream
Just put some in my French Roast with coffee mate, and apparently the pepper tastes less pungent than the coffee itself. In fact I think I can taste the unique nuttiness of the pepper now. Not sure if that says something about me, or the coffee.
On a side note, I think I may have accidentally discovered a Silphium substitute
Ok so I’m going to try it now. Not today because if I have more coffee than I’ve already guzzled my heart is going to make a fit, but tomorrow :3 Guatemalan tastes like chocolate and it’s a medium roast so the pepper might be an actually great addition
(Do tell about the Silphium substitute. Is it this recipe itself? XDD)
Yes it is! Seriously fam (mind if I call ya?), coffee hasn’t sparked me up like that in a LONG time 🥴
Fam is great, thank you! ^^ And afdsk okay okay now THIS is some excellent endorsement for the potion 8) Curiouser and curiouser!
Waddya know, you also use “dude” as gender-neutral too!
sdflkjsd you too? It’s always sounded neutral to my Spanish-speaking ears but I’m trying to change it for “fam” (it’s not the same!)
Wait, what are your preferred pronouns?
ALL OF THEM, asfldsk. Mostly she/they tho. I’m genderfluid but haven’t eschewed the feminine, I’m just… more, y’know? :3 What about yours?
You’re Genderfluid too?!?! YAY!!!!
I go by they / bruh / dude / slick and sometimes she!
No seriously, it makes me SO happy to see genderfluid visibility around here!!!
Sweet! Sorry I missed this conversation!
I don’t use pronouns, and consider myself kind of omnigender, which I guess translates to genderfluid. Just kind of go back and forth, depending on context and how I feel.
But yeah, never had much use for pronouns, except for fun. “Sie/Sich/Sein”, “Yo”, “Shorty”, “Hon'”, lots of fun but not for definitions.
But year, Laura is an old name and does not reflect my current nongendered state.
As for how to make the recipe, I dunno…
Ground vanilla-ish coffee (Sumatra / Nicaragua / Colombia blend), prepped in a French Press, with 1/3 cup of whole milk and a dash of black pepper. Did it work out for you folks?
And then baked-apple veggie sausage baked in a toaster oven for 30 minutes, with green onions baked alongside them for ~20 minutes, with Mexican 3-cheese blend sprinkled on top. Yum! :-9
Oh, yeah, dude/bruh are great pronouns, but “Slick” is SLICK, yo!
Hot dogs in Mac and Cheese is ridiculous, dice up some ham and put it in there, that’s the good stuff
I’m honestly ready for the Heathcliff vs. Garfield war that probably will erupt based on that alt-text.
no one’s going to bat for garfield over heathcliff
What about Garfield versus itself?
Because I know Garfield Minus Garfield is the most popular candidate, but I’ve always been more partial to Realfield.
Not even the Garfield from the animated series? ;; I know the comic strips are meh and the character more a marketing thing than anything but the 90’s cartoon was super cute
Now the real thing to do is make ramen, not the cups the packages. Strain out the water then pour the noodles into a skillet where you mix in whipped eggs in order to coat the noodles in scrambled eggs.
Back when I actually ate that stuff, I would grind the provided pasta up for the bird feeder and then use real pasta and use the cheese mix at half strength.
later I found I could just buy the cheese mix powder from restaurant supply stores and save a lot of money all together. Now that I have learned that live culture yogurt makes me less lactose intolerant I have no desire to ever eat that crap again.
I’m not sure what “add everything” means. Black pepper, hot dogs, and hot sauce? Everything in the fridge and spice cabinet? I’d probably do red bell peppers, garlic, cayenne pepper, and nutmeg. Maybe tuna. I’m going to go ahead and count that as “add everything” for the survey. But I wouldn’t do hot dogs, they’re gross.
If it doesn’t have enough extra ingredients to stop looking and tasting like either macaroni or cheese to any perceptible degree, it’s illegal and you’re just being a food-hating snowflake. /sarcasm
Well, this comic got me to eat some macaroni and cheese tonight. Opted for a microwavable kind, though. Added a bit of garlic power.
Glucosinolate spiciness is tasty, isn’t it?
I like to put tuna, shredded cheese, and green beans in mine. And maybe add some pepper and paprika.