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Guilded Age
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Nerf Now!!
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A cute webcomic about fanservice, video games, and... love. Mostly video games, though.
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The reason they shouldn’t hook up is because Joyce is gonna be the one having to deal with Sarah’s emotional aftermath of having lost her chance at Jacob. 0_0
But yeah other than that Jacob and Dorothy should totally hook up.
Yeah I think that would actually be potentially a very solid relationship. I mean I don’t feel like I know enough about Jacob’s off the clock interests, but given his family situation I feel like there’s a lot of potential for him to be a great avenue for Dorothy to learn about different ways that she could help people with a political science degree than going into politics. Which would probably help a lot.
i’m sure sarah would be fine with a more ‘serious’ relationship even if she doesn’t admit it
but wonder how it’d turn out if it did hookup and she was feeling unsatisfied like “yeah i’m over it now”
tho while joyce wouldn’t want sarah to be ‘heartbroken’ i’m sure she’d be overjoyed at the opportunity for ‘sister bonding’ (tho be nice if we had legit sister bondign with her and jocelyne too), and being able to support/comfort her
lol sarah isn’t exactly the type to join in on frat parties but outside of spiting raidah and jacob being ‘hot’ does sarah even like jacob as a person enough to have a ‘legit’ crush on him? b/c i doubt she’d be acting this thirsty if he was a ‘scrawny nerd’ lol (she did want someone she could ‘climb’ so maybe another occasional gym user lol)
The rack, as perceived by Victorians, was made up. The real rack was much worse. The iron maiden and the pear of anguish are also made up, although the iron maiden is, I believe, an imagined version of a real thing.
The real rack was three boards. Your breast went on one, your knees on one, and your heels under one. It worked by bending your knees the wrong way. Instantly. It crushed the kneecaps, snapped the hamstrings, and ripped the skin of the back in various places. I’ve read an account by a man who experienced it.
I only know that the iron maiden was made up, but I don’t know about the rack, that seems like it could have been made up, or it could have been real. I do know the Ohio Ren Fest has an attraction that’s this creepy tunnel with displays of various medieval torture devices with plaques explaining them, but I don’t recall a lot of the details because I kept expecting someone to jump out at me like a haunted house, they went to WAY too much effort to make it incredibly creepy and unsettling if the only goal was to be informative, didn’t retain ANY of the information, lol, it should either be significantly less creepy or they should add some jump scares, otherwise it’s just a waste of money IMO.
Honestly, I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that most of the “devices” were made up, because there were a LOT of really creative torture methods that didn’t require any special devices at all. Honestly, torture is shockingly easy and I don’t know why people overthink it so much, in the modern era all you really need is a PVC-pipe cutter, a blowtorch, and a knife, you might even be able to substitute the blowtorch for a lighter depending on how hard it is to get a knife hot enough to cauterize with a lighter. If you do it right you don’t even need to draw blood. (I should specify this is hypothetical, I have never tortured anybody, nor would I, but I play a lot of role playing games, both table top and live action, and I’ve played a lot of morally grey characters, some of which have had to employ torture, so I’ve put some thought into it)
All these car batteries and water boarding are way too risky, if the person dies before you get the intel you need then what’s even the point? Maximize pain, both physical and psychological, while minimizing risk of accidental death, promise to make it end once they give you what you need, after the intel has been confirmed, of course.
And I would agree if the stated goal was to be a nervewracking experience, but it was billed as an educational experience, so being thoroughly creepy and nervewracking undermined my ability to learn anything since the mood of the attraction made it almost impossible to be in a state of mind to retain any information. A jumpscare provides relief from that tension, once the tension is relieved you can start actually learning things. Or at least with a jumpscare I wouldn’t mind paying $20 or whatever it was and spending 15 minutes in a dark, creepy tunnel and not learning anything. But as an educational experience it kind of failed since it was too creepy to learn.
One advantage to the creepy complex devices is fear. One of the classic steps is showing the victim the instruments and explaining their use. Get them to break themselves with anticipation before you even really get started.
Also, with torture, you’re really aiming for confession, not real intel.Torture is notoriously bad at getting real actionable information, but notoriously good at getting people to say whatever you want to hear. There are almost always more effective ways of getting information out of people.
No, torture is bad for confessions specifically *because* people will say whatever they think you want to hear, which makes any confession given under duress unreliable.
What torture is good for is getting verifiable information, granted this isn’t really good under a time crunch, like trying to find a bomb before it goes off, since you need to have time to get them to talk, then you need to have time to verify they are telling the truth, and then if they aren’t you need time to punish the lies well enough to discourage further attempts at deception, and then you need to get them talking again, and so on. It takes a long time if they’re particularly resilient, but you *will* eventually break them and get what you need. The biggest drawback is you need to be sure the person you’re torturing actually *has* the information you’re looking for.
If someone is held prisoner, what more effective ways are there? Rewards? Doesn’t help with an extremist. Deception? Rather hard to trick someone to trust you when they’re your prisoner. Brainwashing? That’s just a different application of torture.
Torture is bad because it’s unethical, not because it’s ineffective. Also, because a lot of the situations, historically, where torture has been employed were situations where it *doesn’t* work, like with confessions. But if you have someone you are certain is the serial killer (for example), torturing them until they admit it means nothing, but torturing them until they tell you where the bodies are buried yields actionable intel that confirms they are the serial killer when you find the bodies where they tell you to look, the sticky part is figuring out where to draw the line and decide they aren’t telling you where the bodies are because they actually don’t know, how many wild goose chases does it take for you to conclude you have the wrong guy.
Regardless, still wrong, I am absolutely not advocating FOR torture, just saying the argument about it being ineffective or unreliable doesn’t hold up for gathering verifiable, actionable intel. If torture is ever considered an acceptable tool to resort to, it should be the last one, you should try other things first, but when all else fails, if you don’t have an ethical compunction not to employ torture, it’s a potentially effective fall back option.
On the fear and anticipation bit, that’s why I think the PVC-pipe cutter is a great option and why I said if you do it right you don’t even need to spill any blood, they start out significantly wider than a finger so you can pump it periodically to add to the psychological tension, and even when the blade touches skin it should take another pump or two before it even breaks skin and spills blood, most people would break long before the finger is actually severed.
I just don’t think you need a complicated device to have that effect, just explaining how you’re going to use this thin metal rod and a torch to torture them (not gonna go into detail for that one, but it’s a specific medieval torture/execution technique that is possibly the single most horrifying way to die), or how you’re going to use this spoon to torture them (more ways to do that than you’d think).
All I know is I see people hanging their torso off and doing some kind of upper body pull up only using their back muscles or abdominals or something. It’s one of those feats of athleticism that defy logic, like flag poling.
When it’s set up as depicted, it is mostly for making sit-ups harder. But some versions of the device are designed to allow the angle of the backrest, relative to the floor, to be adjusted down to almost-parallel. In this configuration it mostly works as Nono describes.
It’s a Roman Chair, a device for torturing your abs beyond their normal range of motion and really overtaxing them. But it still won’t give you a six-pack if your rectus abdominis doesn’t have the ligatures needed.
either way given what happened last time i def would’ve asked what it’s for and a tutorial/demonstration as opposed to attempting it even if it’s less likely to hurt me the way the toebreaker thing did
I’m both of them in this comic, one because I’m thinking what Joe is saying and two because I haven’t the faintest clue of how to use that thingy either and I’m pretty sure that’s how I would be tackling it too.
If I’m not mistaken, that’s a bench that should be at a less severe angle, you hook your calves between where Joyce’s hands are so that the front of the calves would be facing the black round padding, and you do sit-ups.
But that’s just a guess as I’ve never used that thing and did my sit-ups, in the bygone days in which I used to do sit-ups, on the floor the way God or lack of creativity intended.
That’s more or less right. Doing them at an incline can work different parts of your abdominals, or doing them at the incline makes it easier for people who have issues keeping their feet firm on the floor or have back issues.
i wonder if thats just his ‘joe-ness’ or he knows dorothy well enough as well to know that dorothy would consider a ‘hookup’ versus a longer relationship (tho i suppose ppl could’ve seen dorothy/walky as a fling even tho they were a bit more serious about each other )
If they do “hook up” it’ll be at least as serious as dorothy/walky was. Or fall apart even quicker, I suppose. Jacob is explicitly not interested in casual hook ups and Dorothy isn’t capable of them, even when she tries.
Dorothy and Jacob never hooked up because they’re so similar hooking up would essentially be masturbation. Also on a more serious note I can’t help but think Dorothy has a lot of superficially similar traits to Raidah and Jacob was already dating Raidah for most of the time they been acquainted.
I think it’s fitting. Raidah is kind of a foil and rival to her. Their similarities help highlight their differences and Raidah isn’t all bad. She is a studious, organized, and career oriented young woman and until very recently so was Dorothy. Jacob had a checklist at one point and I wouldn’t doubt Dorothy checked all the boxes, but the point of his little character arc with Joyce was that maybe chemistry didn’t mean looking for a girl off a checklist, or at least revising it.
One really noticeable difference is religion, which is part of why Jacob had clicked with Joyce so well. I have no idea how well he would go with a partner who is non.
I dunno, he said his interest was mostly academic, didn’t he? He liked talking about it with her, but he’d just need an atheist who wouldn’t be a jerk about him going to church, and honestly Dorothy might enjoy a purely academic conversation about religious teachings too.
Yeah, first Jacob was dating Raidah (and Dorothy was dating Walky when they first met) and then after that Jacob was probably staying distant from that whole social circle thanks to the Joyce thing.
…Joe really does have a point about how Dorothy is clearly a better match for Jacob than Sarah is.
Kinda feel like this is Willis speaking through Joe a bit, in a “huh, I never realized how much of a match they’d be because they were both in very different story arcs for so long” sense.
I believe “non-perverse” sexual lust consists of thirsting after one’s socially-sanctioned legal spouse, who is a member of the same generational cohort as oneself. Said lust must also exclusively feature fantasizing about intimate and/or sexual acts with one’s spouse that feature no accessories designed for other purposes, nor may they be obtainable from a merchant more specialized than a pharmacy or department store. Furthermore, the acts depicted in these fantasies must not entail physical configurations of the participants’ bodies that require any unusual degree of athleticism, flexibility, or creativity, and may not be performed anywhere save a private space the participants own, lease, or rent for their own private use, while in the presence of no third parties. Participants must both be fully consenting; conscious; of the same species; fully disrobed; adopting no fictional personas, relationships, or pseudonyms; and behaving towards each other only in a manner deemed respectful and equitable for the dominant culture of their time and place.
also, they must be intent on making bebbies and derive no pleasure whatsoever from the act, although i suppose that sometimes happens in spite of their best efforts.
Actually, those parts are optional! Mainstream American culture no longer aligns with puritanical Christian orthodoxy regarding sexual morality. Not only is it acceptable to have carnal relations without the intent of procreating, but it can even be enjoyed! Progress!
Exactly. Basic dildos and vibrators, condoms, lube, and contraceptives are all acceptable sexytime accessories according to mainstream Western culture these days. Using such things is not considered “kinky” (nor is wearing your garden-variety lingerie, for example), while things like restraints, butt plugs, pegging harnesses, etc. – none of which may be purchased in a brick-and-mortar store that isn’t dedicated to selling porn and/or fetish gear.
I may be a pedant, but it bugs me that the meaning of “perverse” has drifted to mean the same thing as “perverted.” They’re two different words and the distinction should be maintained.
i think he was roommates with someone but i doubt we’d get as much more screentime on him as carla’s been getting b/c he’s prolly on the same level of ‘side chara’ as agatha in, maybe even like a half step below lol
i mean, at a school i understand not providing them, but wonder if bigger gyms provide ‘rental’ shoes that are safe/ok to use on the equipment /at least a clean pair to swap out so no worries about tracking mud, idk if it made much of a diff bc i didn’t step onthe lanes but i did get some bowling shoes when i went to a place with a friend lol
I doubt it. Most stuff doesn’t require you to put your feet anywhere other than the floor, and for stuff that does (like treadmills), you would absolutely want to be wearing your own trainers and not a loaned pair.
(Dunno about the US, but they’ve also largely stopped doing bowling shoes over here in the UK)
Is it because Joyce doesn’t want to admit that she was attracted to someone who is very similar to Dorothy, or because she wants Sarah to be the one to hook up with Jacob?
The latter.
I don’t think Dorothy possessing traits that Jacob also possessed would be something she would be bothered by.
But Sarah has wanted Jacob since the moment she’d laid eyes on him (also, him and Joe are the only ones we’ve seen in the comic who meet size criteria to be an “obstacle course” for her).
Joyce knows this, worked hard to make that happen, ended up almost getting Jacob for herself, is now in a relationship of her own with Joe, and Joe and Jacob are friends which means she can also double date with Sarah if they get together.
She put way too much work into setting them up to suddenly switch to the Dorothy x Jacob ship.
I’m 50 50 on whether Joyce doesn’t want Dorothy to hookup with Jacob cuz she wants Dorothy for herself, or if it’s because she genuinely wants to give Sarah a win
joyce prolly assumes dorothy isn’t interested/currently looking for a relationship (tho idk if they were like “Sooo what about you?” after joyce was talking about her and joe when they spent time together
there is no way Willis is not well aware of the implications of Joyce looking jealous about Straight Jorothy *right after* having her get flustered from Dorothy touching her. Like people can propose entirely rational in-universe explanations all they want, but just as words mean things, I know shipbait when I see it.
The primary reason I’m against a Joyce-Dorothy ship is because it would SHATTER Becky mentally. She’s definitely still carrying a torch for Joyce (and probably will, for the rest of her life), and if Joyce and Dorothy do get together, Becky’s gonna have major “So you’d be gay for Dorothy but not for ME??? Your bestest friend since childhood?” trauma.
Maybe it’s how Willis felt when Becky first came out to Joyce — the alt text on those strips was full of apologies to her, including an “I’ll make Joyce gay if you’ll just stop crying” part — but I like to think they’d already come around a bit by the time Joyce tried to say she knew she wasn’t gay because if she “could have” been gay for anyone, it would’ve been…………. but then Sal shows up being super hot, and Mike accurately finishes the sentence “for her, right?”
Joyce loves Becky, but she’s always been like a sister to her, and that’s okay. We are not attracted to every single person of the genders we have the technical potential to be attracted to, and frankly more media should explore what happens when romantic interest is unreciprocated without making that either an obstacle for the protagonist to overcome. (Or vilifying the character who “won’t give [the protagonist] a chance”.)
Personally, I’d love to see Joyce come out as bi and Becky have to actually get 100% over her. I think it would be good for Dina, too, to finally have the specter of being Becky’s “second choice” banished.
Yeah, and like, I kind of *want* Becky to suffer? Like, that may sound mean, but this is a story. I want interesting things to happen. Dina in particular is long overdue something that meaningfully challenges or exposes flaws in her. Her insecurity about being Becky’s rebound was alluded to a while back. I’m excited to get the chance to explore that in more depth.
Becky/Dina are the most… stable relationship in the comic right now. I might say boring, even. Personally, I am *desperate* for some sapphic relationships that aren’t either blandly adorable or whatever the heck is going on with Ruth and Jennifer right now. I still ship Ruth and Jennifer a little, that’s how badly I want messy lesbian romance stories. Last year I was shipping Carla/Joyce.
I don’t even want the kind of horrible tragic calamities I think Willis prides themself on sometimes! I just want. Little a drama. I want a romance, not a couple.
a) We don’t see her face when she gets touched by Dorothy.
b) This is kind of a boring absolutist way to talk about someone who is probably at some point going to have to discover her bisexuality. Her reactions are going to vary a lot based on context and circumstance.
If Dorothy starts seeing Jacob, it probably won’t last long because Dorothy is carrying a torch for Joyce, and either she realizes it or Jacob realizes it.
Meanwhile, Sarah’s sitting the common area dejected and glowering at them walking by. She was too intimidated to open up with Jacob, especially since she was trying to avoid being snarky, and missed her chance. But nearby someone makes a wise-ass observation about what’s bothering her, and she bursts out laughing.
It’s you know who, and even though he’s not her usual type, they’re on the same wavelength, and she’s super comfortable with him, and I made a back up gravatar just in case I’ll have to switch to it.
kinda makes me wonder what her previous bfs are like, considering she had at least one that her sister ‘stole’ from her but at that age idk if they emotionally connected or if it’s like “you’re hot and i can tolerate you, so let’s make out” lol
Honestly the situation where Liz stole her “boyfriend” sounds more like the guy was interested in Sarah, but didn’t know how to approach her. So he came to Liz for advice, and they ended up dating instead.
1. no clunky potmanteaus ever. I will never do that tabloid bullshit.
2. walky’s a little shit with poorly calibrated humor he uses to avoid talking about things. In Shortpacked, Arnold’s snark is similar to Sarah’s snark in DoA, but measured so that he’s not pushing people away. He uses it effectively to talk about what he’s thinking.
Somehow this specific lamp shading makes me doubt it’ll work out? I don’t know why. But I like the potential drama in Joyce’s reaction to the idea here…
IF you DO harbor perverse sexual lust, in fact even if you harbour it, check out —
MAKE LOVE NOT WAR Part 6: once more with freckles~ (i keep forgetting to freckle my redhead) (whomst, it is true, is not a redhead at all, lol, for she is not Dorothy but DORIS why does everyone keep getting it wrong) (i’m giving her freckles anyway)
PART 1 for whosoever has not been paying attention~
and thusly, and please proceed with silliness for this one is especially ludicrous, PART 7
(to quote my own alt-text, like a dork, “NOTE: i am not a gravity doctor. Please do not take gravity-related advice from a pseudonymous goofy pornographic scifi fan comic on the internet”)
damn, of all the machines for Joyce to smear her dirty shoes on, she chooses the one people will put their head on. I suppose this is irony because she wrongfully took off her shoes last time to be polite? be polite now Joyce!!
Looks like Joe is having my same impression, this may be the beginning of Jacob and Dorothy’s beautiful, sweet, romantic relationship! And also the beginning of Sarah’s silent hate for Dorothy that may, or may not, end up in tragedy.
Doesn’t Joyce still think Dorothy is leaving for Yale in a matter of months? No reason to try and set up a relationship if she’s a short timer.
Sarah, the oldest of the main cast, has very undeveloped social skills. Dorothy can just be herself and chat unselfconsciously with a hunk and end up in a relationship. Sarah can even control her gaze or make her lips move.
I wonder if Joe and Joyce are using “hook up” as “casual bang” or as “start a relationship.” In my college days (the early oughts), “hook up” meant the former, but both usages are valid.
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side arc of Joyce “figuring out” all the exermacising equipment
Exermasochism equipment.
We need to vote that device in for a Patreon bonus strip just so we can see the arc continue.
if only to slow Willis down by making them draw a bunch of equipment and tricky poses.
he is too powerful.
So uh Joyce, this is how you go about getting hurt exercising. Just uh… FYI.
For the curious, it’s an Incline Situp Bench. Probably on its highest position.
The reason they shouldn’t hook up is because Joyce is gonna be the one having to deal with Sarah’s emotional aftermath of having lost her chance at Jacob. 0_0
But yeah other than that Jacob and Dorothy should totally hook up.
Yeah I think that would actually be potentially a very solid relationship. I mean I don’t feel like I know enough about Jacob’s off the clock interests, but given his family situation I feel like there’s a lot of potential for him to be a great avenue for Dorothy to learn about different ways that she could help people with a political science degree than going into politics. Which would probably help a lot.
YES she could really use that right about now
And yes, this can help Dorothy and see which political science is more extensive.
And find out who called the study of politics “science.”
Jacob will make an excellent first gentleman.
plus, Raidah would be SO MAD
oh hell yeah! >:D
We cannot deny that Joyce created a series in her head given that probability, but a friendship between Dorothy and Jacob is also acceptable.
i’m sure sarah would be fine with a more ‘serious’ relationship even if she doesn’t admit it
but wonder how it’d turn out if it did hookup and she was feeling unsatisfied like “yeah i’m over it now”
tho while joyce wouldn’t want sarah to be ‘heartbroken’ i’m sure she’d be overjoyed at the opportunity for ‘sister bonding’ (tho be nice if we had legit sister bondign with her and jocelyne too), and being able to support/comfort her
On that note, I wonder who Sarah’s rebound would be (if you would call them that).
lol sarah isn’t exactly the type to join in on frat parties but outside of spiting raidah and jacob being ‘hot’ does sarah even like jacob as a person enough to have a ‘legit’ crush on him? b/c i doubt she’d be acting this thirsty if he was a ‘scrawny nerd’ lol (she did want someone she could ‘climb’ so maybe another occasional gym user lol)
Is that the thing for the situps? I seen people use those and it looks like witchcraft. Defying physics is what people do on that thing I think.
I think so? I’ve never used it myself but I think I’ve seen people do that.
I’m pretty sure that’s a medieval torture device 0_0
Fun fact! The most famous medieval torture devices were made up by Victorians. Gotta make the past look awful otherwise progress might not be real
Is that so? I heard that chastity belts were based on a mythical device from this era, but most of them were myths really?
*plays “pa$$ the time” by Bronze on hacked muzak*
The rack, as perceived by Victorians, was made up. The real rack was much worse. The iron maiden and the pear of anguish are also made up, although the iron maiden is, I believe, an imagined version of a real thing.
The real rack was three boards. Your breast went on one, your knees on one, and your heels under one. It worked by bending your knees the wrong way. Instantly. It crushed the kneecaps, snapped the hamstrings, and ripped the skin of the back in various places. I’ve read an account by a man who experienced it.
I only know that the iron maiden was made up, but I don’t know about the rack, that seems like it could have been made up, or it could have been real. I do know the Ohio Ren Fest has an attraction that’s this creepy tunnel with displays of various medieval torture devices with plaques explaining them, but I don’t recall a lot of the details because I kept expecting someone to jump out at me like a haunted house, they went to WAY too much effort to make it incredibly creepy and unsettling if the only goal was to be informative, didn’t retain ANY of the information, lol, it should either be significantly less creepy or they should add some jump scares, otherwise it’s just a waste of money IMO.
Honestly, I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that most of the “devices” were made up, because there were a LOT of really creative torture methods that didn’t require any special devices at all. Honestly, torture is shockingly easy and I don’t know why people overthink it so much, in the modern era all you really need is a PVC-pipe cutter, a blowtorch, and a knife, you might even be able to substitute the blowtorch for a lighter depending on how hard it is to get a knife hot enough to cauterize with a lighter. If you do it right you don’t even need to draw blood. (I should specify this is hypothetical, I have never tortured anybody, nor would I, but I play a lot of role playing games, both table top and live action, and I’ve played a lot of morally grey characters, some of which have had to employ torture, so I’ve put some thought into it)
All these car batteries and water boarding are way too risky, if the person dies before you get the intel you need then what’s even the point? Maximize pain, both physical and psychological, while minimizing risk of accidental death, promise to make it end once they give you what you need, after the intel has been confirmed, of course.
1st paragraph: otoh whats more nervewracking than a jumpscare that never comes?
things getting rather morbid in here (comment section and brain)
And I would agree if the stated goal was to be a nervewracking experience, but it was billed as an educational experience, so being thoroughly creepy and nervewracking undermined my ability to learn anything since the mood of the attraction made it almost impossible to be in a state of mind to retain any information. A jumpscare provides relief from that tension, once the tension is relieved you can start actually learning things. Or at least with a jumpscare I wouldn’t mind paying $20 or whatever it was and spending 15 minutes in a dark, creepy tunnel and not learning anything. But as an educational experience it kind of failed since it was too creepy to learn.
One advantage to the creepy complex devices is fear. One of the classic steps is showing the victim the instruments and explaining their use. Get them to break themselves with anticipation before you even really get started.
Also, with torture, you’re really aiming for confession, not real intel.Torture is notoriously bad at getting real actionable information, but notoriously good at getting people to say whatever you want to hear. There are almost always more effective ways of getting information out of people.
No, torture is bad for confessions specifically *because* people will say whatever they think you want to hear, which makes any confession given under duress unreliable.
What torture is good for is getting verifiable information, granted this isn’t really good under a time crunch, like trying to find a bomb before it goes off, since you need to have time to get them to talk, then you need to have time to verify they are telling the truth, and then if they aren’t you need time to punish the lies well enough to discourage further attempts at deception, and then you need to get them talking again, and so on. It takes a long time if they’re particularly resilient, but you *will* eventually break them and get what you need. The biggest drawback is you need to be sure the person you’re torturing actually *has* the information you’re looking for.
If someone is held prisoner, what more effective ways are there? Rewards? Doesn’t help with an extremist. Deception? Rather hard to trick someone to trust you when they’re your prisoner. Brainwashing? That’s just a different application of torture.
Torture is bad because it’s unethical, not because it’s ineffective. Also, because a lot of the situations, historically, where torture has been employed were situations where it *doesn’t* work, like with confessions. But if you have someone you are certain is the serial killer (for example), torturing them until they admit it means nothing, but torturing them until they tell you where the bodies are buried yields actionable intel that confirms they are the serial killer when you find the bodies where they tell you to look, the sticky part is figuring out where to draw the line and decide they aren’t telling you where the bodies are because they actually don’t know, how many wild goose chases does it take for you to conclude you have the wrong guy.
Regardless, still wrong, I am absolutely not advocating FOR torture, just saying the argument about it being ineffective or unreliable doesn’t hold up for gathering verifiable, actionable intel. If torture is ever considered an acceptable tool to resort to, it should be the last one, you should try other things first, but when all else fails, if you don’t have an ethical compunction not to employ torture, it’s a potentially effective fall back option.
On the fear and anticipation bit, that’s why I think the PVC-pipe cutter is a great option and why I said if you do it right you don’t even need to spill any blood, they start out significantly wider than a finger so you can pump it periodically to add to the psychological tension, and even when the blade touches skin it should take another pump or two before it even breaks skin and spills blood, most people would break long before the finger is actually severed.
I just don’t think you need a complicated device to have that effect, just explaining how you’re going to use this thin metal rod and a torch to torture them (not gonna go into detail for that one, but it’s a specific medieval torture/execution technique that is possibly the single most horrifying way to die), or how you’re going to use this spoon to torture them (more ways to do that than you’d think).
The same Victorians who ate most of the mummies?
Yeah, incline situps.
All I know is I see people hanging their torso off and doing some kind of upper body pull up only using their back muscles or abdominals or something. It’s one of those feats of athleticism that defy logic, like flag poling.
You basically do a situp on a slope. Your feet hook under the parts at the top to act as a fulcrum.
It’s nice for people who can’t help lifting their legs or have back issues when doing regular sit-ups or crunches.
Oh, I thought it was for making sit-ups harder. Never realised that it could help if you have back issues. I might try it.
When it’s set up as depicted, it is mostly for making sit-ups harder. But some versions of the device are designed to allow the angle of the backrest, relative to the floor, to be adjusted down to almost-parallel. In this configuration it mostly works as Nono describes.
I might use it for crunches, but sit-ups that way would, it seems to me put powerful stress on the psoas muscles.
It appears to be adjustable and folded to an unreasonable position, maybe to make space? Or maybe sadism, masochism, or both.
Bingo. I don’t know if I’ve seen one of these at such a sharp angle. Usually it’s a fair amount more towards the horizontal.
Makes whatever Joyce is doing a lot funnier.
It’s a Roman Chair, a device for torturing your abs beyond their normal range of motion and really overtaxing them. But it still won’t give you a six-pack if your rectus abdominis doesn’t have the ligatures needed.
either way given what happened last time i def would’ve asked what it’s for and a tutorial/demonstration as opposed to attempting it even if it’s less likely to hurt me the way the toebreaker thing did
She is kinda short for this one. I can relate to that
Looks like the SS whatever-Dorothy-and-Jacob are is ready to leave harbour! Good luck to all the shippers, may all your favourite characters kiss ^^
I’m just glad Jacob has something to do again
That’s fair! I quite like Jacob and am enjoying seeing a bit more of him
Dorcub? Jacothy? White Chocolate? Air Force 1+1? Jake and the Thin Woman?
All Talk No Action
–Dave, Strange Bedfellows
“In fact, I’m glad.” [anxiety face]
Yeah. Keep telling yourself that, Joyce.
It’s an incredible relief, and she’s super not mad at all.
i read it as concern for dorothy, which is valid
I’m both of them in this comic, one because I’m thinking what Joe is saying and two because I haven’t the faintest clue of how to use that thingy either and I’m pretty sure that’s how I would be tackling it too.
If I’m not mistaken, that’s a bench that should be at a less severe angle, you hook your calves between where Joyce’s hands are so that the front of the calves would be facing the black round padding, and you do sit-ups.
But that’s just a guess as I’ve never used that thing and did my sit-ups, in the bygone days in which I used to do sit-ups, on the floor the way God or lack of creativity intended.
That’s more or less right. Doing them at an incline can work different parts of your abdominals, or doing them at the incline makes it easier for people who have issues keeping their feet firm on the floor or have back issues.
Joe just being able to see hook-up scenarios from a mile away is a talent I never knew I wanted until now.
i wonder if thats just his ‘joe-ness’ or he knows dorothy well enough as well to know that dorothy would consider a ‘hookup’ versus a longer relationship (tho i suppose ppl could’ve seen dorothy/walky as a fling even tho they were a bit more serious about each other )
If they do “hook up” it’ll be at least as serious as dorothy/walky was. Or fall apart even quicker, I suppose. Jacob is explicitly not interested in casual hook ups and Dorothy isn’t capable of them, even when she tries.
Joe’s instincts for this sort of thing have historically been unreliable. He’s a pretty bad wingman but he’s made some decent reads before
yeah i’m not sure that jacob is especially good at predicting hookups rather than just having “now kiss” on the tip of his tongue always
Dorothy and Jacob never hooked up because they’re so similar hooking up would essentially be masturbation. Also on a more serious note I can’t help but think Dorothy has a lot of superficially similar traits to Raidah and Jacob was already dating Raidah for most of the time they been acquainted.
Well, Dorothy has had her moments, but comparing her to Raidah
I think it’s fitting. Raidah is kind of a foil and rival to her. Their similarities help highlight their differences and Raidah isn’t all bad. She is a studious, organized, and career oriented young woman and until very recently so was Dorothy. Jacob had a checklist at one point and I wouldn’t doubt Dorothy checked all the boxes, but the point of his little character arc with Joyce was that maybe chemistry didn’t mean looking for a girl off a checklist, or at least revising it.
Both are applied, of course, but I feel that for the moment we have to wait and see if there are more details
Raidah has traits other than being a bongo, although it does tend to loom large
One really noticeable difference is religion, which is part of why Jacob had clicked with Joyce so well. I have no idea how well he would go with a partner who is non.
A friendship with both is welcomed without problems.
I dunno, he said his interest was mostly academic, didn’t he? He liked talking about it with her, but he’d just need an atheist who wouldn’t be a jerk about him going to church, and honestly Dorothy might enjoy a purely academic conversation about religious teachings too.
Backing this up, here’s a strip where Jacob is called “the biggest Dorothy”.
Yeah, first Jacob was dating Raidah (and Dorothy was dating Walky when they first met) and then after that Jacob was probably staying distant from that whole social circle thanks to the Joyce thing.
Third option: Dorothy and Sarah hook up.
Fourth option: gym room orgy
Remember to towel off once your done
Fifth option: Joe and Jacob hook up
not something Joyce has ever thought about a lot.
Nope.
Not even once.
Sarah and Dina. They like each other, and Dina needs to get rid of that red-haired weirdo she’s been seen with recently.
While I agree Becky is in a cult, I don’t think she’s that bad with Dina
She’s not bad with Dina. I just don’t like her.
…Joe really does have a point about how Dorothy is clearly a better match for Jacob than Sarah is.
Kinda feel like this is Willis speaking through Joe a bit, in a “huh, I never realized how much of a match they’d be because they were both in very different story arcs for so long” sense.
They seem very uninteresting story wise. No conflict. No drivers for character growth.
Lots of drivers for growth, just not (as you say) particularly interesting —and maybe a bit less boring now that Dorothy needs to heal some.
Ugh, I hate that Joe is growing on me–and in more of a way than a fungus
growing as more than a fungus, so as a… fungi? (badum ts.)
I walked into that
He’s getting better morels.
This looks like a good spot to find some ingredients.
“That’s never happening” says Joe about an unlikely romantic pairing to his girlfriend, Joyce.
I mean, he’s right, but still.
Welp, there goes Joe’s exercise time. He’s gonna need WEEKS to recover from a burn that severe!
oof
Well I’m convinced! She’s got this!
Your new poll is unclear. I harbor perverse sexual lust but not towards Jacob.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PerverseSexualLust it has its own tvtropes page, so it could just be in general XD
tho wonder what non-perverse sexual lust would be XD;
Willis have his own Tv Trope article, wow
I believe “non-perverse” sexual lust consists of thirsting after one’s socially-sanctioned legal spouse, who is a member of the same generational cohort as oneself. Said lust must also exclusively feature fantasizing about intimate and/or sexual acts with one’s spouse that feature no accessories designed for other purposes, nor may they be obtainable from a merchant more specialized than a pharmacy or department store. Furthermore, the acts depicted in these fantasies must not entail physical configurations of the participants’ bodies that require any unusual degree of athleticism, flexibility, or creativity, and may not be performed anywhere save a private space the participants own, lease, or rent for their own private use, while in the presence of no third parties. Participants must both be fully consenting; conscious; of the same species; fully disrobed; adopting no fictional personas, relationships, or pseudonyms; and behaving towards each other only in a manner deemed respectful and equitable for the dominant culture of their time and place.
So, completely boring.
unless it’s clown sex.
also, they must be intent on making bebbies and derive no pleasure whatsoever from the act, although i suppose that sometimes happens in spite of their best efforts.
Actually, those parts are optional! Mainstream American culture no longer aligns with puritanical Christian orthodoxy regarding sexual morality. Not only is it acceptable to have carnal relations without the intent of procreating, but it can even be enjoyed! Progress!
You can get vibrators at CVS nowadays.
Exactly. Basic dildos and vibrators, condoms, lube, and contraceptives are all acceptable sexytime accessories according to mainstream Western culture these days. Using such things is not considered “kinky” (nor is wearing your garden-variety lingerie, for example), while things like restraints, butt plugs, pegging harnesses, etc. – none of which may be purchased in a brick-and-mortar store that isn’t dedicated to selling porn and/or fetish gear.
so, nearly 9 Chickweed Lane then
–Dave, q.v. Willis’ extensive Twitter thread about
I may be a pedant, but it bugs me that the meaning of “perverse” has drifted to mean the same thing as “perverted.” They’re two different words and the distinction should be maintained.
I thought I cancelled this remark.
Well, Jacob DID say that he wanted a new girlfriend that was kind of like Joyce with some new things on the list…
poor lucy is not going to have many options left (as far as we know) when it doesn’t work out with walky if dorothy ends up with jacob
what’s ken up to these days?
i think he was roommates with someone but i doubt we’d get as much more screentime on him as carla’s been getting b/c he’s prolly on the same level of ‘side chara’ as agatha in, maybe even like a half step below lol
For someone who always towels down after use… he sure is OK with her messing up the felt with her.
Gotta love the “cavewoman using laser rifle as club” energy here.
i mean, at a school i understand not providing them, but wonder if bigger gyms provide ‘rental’ shoes that are safe/ok to use on the equipment /at least a clean pair to swap out so no worries about tracking mud, idk if it made much of a diff bc i didn’t step onthe lanes but i did get some bowling shoes when i went to a place with a friend lol
I doubt it. Most stuff doesn’t require you to put your feet anywhere other than the floor, and for stuff that does (like treadmills), you would absolutely want to be wearing your own trainers and not a loaned pair.
(Dunno about the US, but they’ve also largely stopped doing bowling shoes over here in the UK)
Is it because Joyce doesn’t want to admit that she was attracted to someone who is very similar to Dorothy, or because she wants Sarah to be the one to hook up with Jacob?
The latter.
I don’t think Dorothy possessing traits that Jacob also possessed would be something she would be bothered by.
But Sarah has wanted Jacob since the moment she’d laid eyes on him (also, him and Joe are the only ones we’ve seen in the comic who meet size criteria to be an “obstacle course” for her).
Joyce knows this, worked hard to make that happen, ended up almost getting Jacob for herself, is now in a relationship of her own with Joe, and Joe and Jacob are friends which means she can also double date with Sarah if they get together.
She put way too much work into setting them up to suddenly switch to the Dorothy x Jacob ship.
And she literally invited Sarah to work out so she could spend time with Jacob. And dragged her over to him to get them to interact.
Joyce wants to keep Dorothy for herself.
Amen
she might agree to both of them riding the same horse.
where did you come from where did you go? where did you come from?
–Dave, cotton-eyed Joe
To quote the poet Grant MacDonald:
My horse done got bit by a snake
And we got many a long mile to go
I’m 50 50 on whether Joyce doesn’t want Dorothy to hookup with Jacob cuz she wants Dorothy for herself, or if it’s because she genuinely wants to give Sarah a win
joyce prolly assumes dorothy isn’t interested/currently looking for a relationship (tho idk if they were like “Sooo what about you?” after joyce was talking about her and joe when they spent time together
Can be both.
there is no way Willis is not well aware of the implications of Joyce looking jealous about Straight Jorothy *right after* having her get flustered from Dorothy touching her. Like people can propose entirely rational in-universe explanations all they want, but just as words mean things, I know shipbait when I see it.
The primary reason I’m against a Joyce-Dorothy ship is because it would SHATTER Becky mentally. She’s definitely still carrying a torch for Joyce (and probably will, for the rest of her life), and if Joyce and Dorothy do get together, Becky’s gonna have major “So you’d be gay for Dorothy but not for ME??? Your bestest friend since childhood?” trauma.
That’s part of why I do want it, actually.
Maybe it’s how Willis felt when Becky first came out to Joyce — the alt text on those strips was full of apologies to her, including an “I’ll make Joyce gay if you’ll just stop crying” part — but I like to think they’d already come around a bit by the time Joyce tried to say she knew she wasn’t gay because if she “could have” been gay for anyone, it would’ve been…………. but then Sal shows up being super hot, and Mike accurately finishes the sentence “for her, right?”
Joyce loves Becky, but she’s always been like a sister to her, and that’s okay. We are not attracted to every single person of the genders we have the technical potential to be attracted to, and frankly more media should explore what happens when romantic interest is unreciprocated without making that either an obstacle for the protagonist to overcome. (Or vilifying the character who “won’t give [the protagonist] a chance”.)
Personally, I’d love to see Joyce come out as bi and Becky have to actually get 100% over her. I think it would be good for Dina, too, to finally have the specter of being Becky’s “second choice” banished.
Big wah-wah for the friendzone tho. It’s not Joyce’s fault Becky fuck-zoned her all those years.
Yeah, and like, I kind of *want* Becky to suffer? Like, that may sound mean, but this is a story. I want interesting things to happen. Dina in particular is long overdue something that meaningfully challenges or exposes flaws in her. Her insecurity about being Becky’s rebound was alluded to a while back. I’m excited to get the chance to explore that in more depth.
Becky/Dina are the most… stable relationship in the comic right now. I might say boring, even. Personally, I am *desperate* for some sapphic relationships that aren’t either blandly adorable or whatever the heck is going on with Ruth and Jennifer right now. I still ship Ruth and Jennifer a little, that’s how badly I want messy lesbian romance stories. Last year I was shipping Carla/Joyce.
I don’t even want the kind of horrible tragic calamities I think Willis prides themself on sometimes! I just want. Little a drama. I want a romance, not a couple.
does flustered look like this or this?
a) We don’t see her face when she gets touched by Dorothy.
b) This is kind of a boring absolutist way to talk about someone who is probably at some point going to have to discover her bisexuality. Her reactions are going to vary a lot based on context and circumstance.
If Dorothy starts seeing Jacob, it probably won’t last long because Dorothy is carrying a torch for Joyce, and either she realizes it or Jacob realizes it.
Meanwhile, Sarah’s sitting the common area dejected and glowering at them walking by. She was too intimidated to open up with Jacob, especially since she was trying to avoid being snarky, and missed her chance. But nearby someone makes a wise-ass observation about what’s bothering her, and she bursts out laughing.
It’s you know who, and even though he’s not her usual type, they’re on the same wavelength, and she’s super comfortable with him, and I made a back up gravatar just in case I’ll have to switch to it.
kinda makes me wonder what her previous bfs are like, considering she had at least one that her sister ‘stole’ from her but at that age idk if they emotionally connected or if it’s like “you’re hot and i can tolerate you, so let’s make out” lol
I think Lucy was kind of right (but she shouldn’t have said it).
Honestly the situation where Liz stole her “boyfriend” sounds more like the guy was interested in Sarah, but didn’t know how to approach her. So he came to Liz for advice, and they ended up dating instead.
IIRC that’s exactly how Liz described it.
Is it Walky? I don’t think they’d make it; “Sarah” and “Walky” combine into clunky portmanteaus.
I dunno, “walkah” kinda works
1. no clunky potmanteaus ever. I will never do that tabloid bullshit.
2. walky’s a little shit with poorly calibrated humor he uses to avoid talking about things. In Shortpacked, Arnold’s snark is similar to Sarah’s snark in DoA, but measured so that he’s not pushing people away. He uses it effectively to talk about what he’s thinking.
They certainly are standing next to each other.
LIKE ABSOLUTE SLUTS
Arms exposed for the whole world to see!!! Nasty!
Ooooy Joe what’s with that flag lol
What flag are you seeing?
the flag on top of the ship
–Dave, “hey!”
We have had one of those things in our home for years and I also never figured out how it is supposed to be used, lol. (My brother bought it)
It’s for crunches. You hook your knees over the top with your shin behind the bar in the back and hang upside down on the padded part.
Somehow this specific lamp shading makes me doubt it’ll work out? I don’t know why. But I like the potential drama in Joyce’s reaction to the idea here…
IF you DO harbor perverse sexual lust, in fact even if you harbour it, check out —
MAKE LOVE NOT WAR Part 6: once more with freckles~
(i keep forgetting to freckle my redhead) (whomst, it is true, is not a redhead at all, lol, for she is not Dorothy but DORIS why does everyone keep getting it wrong) (i’m giving her freckles anyway)
PART 1 for whosoever has not been paying attention~
and thusly, and please proceed with silliness for this one is especially ludicrous, PART 7
(to quote my own alt-text, like a dork, “NOTE: i am not a gravity doctor. Please do not take gravity-related advice from a pseudonymous goofy pornographic scifi fan comic on the internet”)
oooooo fanastic!
*plays “Defying Gravity” by Stephen Schwartz on hacked muzak*
I appreciate how you can make the genitals realistically funny-looking without making them look gross. It’s a good touch.
thx boo =)
yeah, genitals are so weird and cool. just cute and whacky and i love them
Everything is a bar-bell, if you’re strong enough…
I lift things up and put them down.
damn, of all the machines for Joyce to smear her dirty shoes on, she chooses the one people will put their head on. I suppose this is irony because she wrongfully took off her shoes last time to be polite? be polite now Joyce!!
Must admit, I’ve no idea what that thing actually does, and I use to clean a gym! Some kind of extreme sit-up device?
Yup! Or sometimes people take weights on there to do decline press, for those weird muscles.
It’s adjustable though. You’d normally see it at a much lower incline.
I think I’d rather get shoe dirt in my hair than foot sweat, actually. : )
damn, really? I think the bottom of a shoe is far nastier
Looks like Joe is having my same impression, this may be the beginning of Jacob and Dorothy’s beautiful, sweet, romantic relationship! And also the beginning of Sarah’s silent hate for Dorothy that may, or may not, end up in tragedy.
to be honest, I don’t know how to use one either
Me with about 90% of the doohickeys in the gym.
Doesn’t Joyce still think Dorothy is leaving for Yale in a matter of months? No reason to try and set up a relationship if she’s a short timer.
Sarah, the oldest of the main cast, has very undeveloped social skills. Dorothy can just be herself and chat unselfconsciously with a hunk and end up in a relationship. Sarah can even control her gaze or make her lips move.
Willis, I fucking love the chemistry you’ve established between Joyce and Joe. Every conversation between them is a ton of fun to read.
Seconded!
You already got the beefy boyfriend, Joyce, no need to act clueless in the gym to get him to talk to you anymore.
Joe’s eyebrows are providing a nice set of nuance here
–Dave, an overhead commentary as it were
I wonder if Joe and Joyce are using “hook up” as “casual bang” or as “start a relationship.” In my college days (the early oughts), “hook up” meant the former, but both usages are valid.
I would assume Joyce is using it in the latter sense, and Joe is using it in the former!
(and neither one of them is aware of the miscommunication, obvs.)
Actually, if Jacob and Joyce had a healthy and fond debate on Christian values, I wonder how that’d go with Dorothy.
All I can feel is pity for Sarah. Is there hope for her and people like her?