My question is whether the “slipshine” will actually be on the Slipshine website or if it will end up on the Patreon instead. That is, the Willis drawing naked people patreon, not the regular one.
I’m thinking more Bloodhound Gang, given that last panel. that, and Joyce don’t strike me as a NIN fan but fuck do I know, the girl’s been full’a surprises
in the mid aughts winterpeg had a “christian” music station that played (not closer) NIN hourly, with frequent apocalyptica and marylin manson “they mention god in the lyrics therefor it counts as christian rock, right?” was the arguement they used, they died when the crtc said “no, it has to be classified as christian rock by the recording industry” FREQ107 was the best radio we had in winnipeg until then
Murphy dictates that there will be more build up, and then a distraction or other hijinks to derail things. Also, several scene cuts before the [SLIP SHINE EXCLUSIVE].
i hope that its so good for dorothy especially that she just post-orgasm glows through the whole “wait im in a polycule involving that guy i dislike” realization
Joe actively pushed Dorothy towards Joyce. I think he’s embracing the chaos and hoping he can still be happy in the end. I think he knows this might be messy, and I don’t think he’ll hold it against her.
Also, being super into each other is totally what leads to awful sex.
The looming (potential) issue now isn’t Joe being against Joyce-Dorothy. It’s that Joe seems to be aiming for Joyce simply dating both of them at the same time, while Dorothy thinks they agreed to be exclusive. And so far Joyce failed to commit to either course, despite telling Dorothy she would.
and Joe isnt wrong.
dorothy shouldnt be putting bars on Joyce,
when she knows joyce has major issues shes trying to resolve around her sexuality,
and now orientation too.
Im for a lot more fucking in all directions so they can at least get a sense of who they are,
Dorothy doesnt even know if shes into women,
Joyce doesnt even know if shes fully into men, or not
Or if shes sexually attracted to women. other being Homosocial.
( dorothy knows more than anyone how cloistered JOyce is on sex. Becky was atleast right in knowing Joyce needed to get on the bike and ride. )
Yeah. Given that Joe is informed and consenting, I’m not worried about Joe at this moment.
But Dorothy is *not* informed. Dorothy is engaging under false pretenses (believing that Joe is Joyce’s “ex-boyfriend,” and Joyce not taking any of the many opportunities to correct that misconception).
People seem so very sure that ”Joyce didn’t break up with Joe” is a massive sticking point for Joyce. Why would it be? Is she massively possessive and jealous?
Joe is being an adult about things, and in an odd way Joyce seems to be more adult here than Dorothy. I think of all people involved Dorothy is currently an absolute mess. I hope she finally has to reflect on her behaviour and attitude towards her lovers.
More of a sticky point for Dorothy I’d say. When she finally finds out about it.
And you don’t have to be massively possessive and jealous to not want to be blindsided by finding out you’re in a poly relationship you didn’t know about.
As much as I’m a hater, I’m not a hater because these two get to be happy, I’m a hater because WHAT drama? They’ve so far caused one miffed Sarah, two boys who are currently upset but coping in different unhealthy ways (yes, that’s a harsh opinion on Joe’s actual desire for poly), and a bunch of running around getting horny in the vicinity of other people’s problems.
As such I don’t care at all about their first time except the probably-vain hope that it cuts to Slipshine as soon as humanly possible so we can get on with some actual story and not just these two dweebs being all kissy AGAIN.
Danny and Sal just playin’ ukulele and riding motorcycles into the sunset (and most importantly not wearing out their welcome with excessive artificial sweetness).
SO unnatural! Someone will report them to Ruth, who will have to use the emergency masterkey! An entire concerned crowd will end up in the room with the hankypanky duo!
If that happens, I’mma need a montage of them continuously stumbling into this room and catching every single person in their friend group waiting in the dark, but simultaneously finding a way to break all their hearts before they’re revealed.
New Theory (your joke led to it so I’m putting it here):
– Joyce stays broken up with Joe BUT they try to stay friends despite still both having strong feelings about each other and only being broken up because Joyce is weirded out by polyamory.
– This leads to months of weirdly competitive sex where Joyce and Joe try to one-up each other with their new partners (Dorothy for Joyce and Rachel or Walky for Joe).
– They report back, snipe at each other, and get a combination of excited and infuriated with one another as they both commit to trying to be the sluttiest person on campus.
– After a particularly ‘heated’ exchange, they fuck. It’s Dorothy’s turn to say “thank fuck, finally!” and Joe has to go talk to Walky (or Rachel) about joining this new polycule.
“My enclosure needs enrichment” is a phrase I will be stealing because that’s the perfect way to describe the feeling of wanting drama in a story to shake things up for entertainment.
Not just after, but well after. Joyce isn’t going to tell her about it now. She’ll go back to talk to Joe about it tomorrow, wind up having sex with him and then Dorothy’ll find out.
im honestly just impressed theyre both gung ho about this with either of them not having box eating experience! though it would be within dottys character to have previously researched this topic lmfao
I was gonna make a remark about how she’d be finding dirt in her sheets for weeks afterwards if one of them took their shoes into the bed.
But with Joyce’s attitudes about hygiene, she’s probably gonna have to take these sheets to the laundry after having sex on them just because of assorted fluids and such.
It would actually maybe make things interesting again if she somehow managed to back out or de-escalate in the exact same way things did with Joe, although I’m not sure that’s possible given how I perceive the fundie upbringing’s classification of sex acts.
OTOH, that also means that it would be just as much of a twist to lean into Joyce being bi with SOMEONE realizing that Joyce NOT stopping means that some part of her is like “this isn’t REALLY sex”.
I’ll settle for anything that gets the stevia aftertaste out of my mouth with these two, granted.
(because I know this comment section, I will reiterate — my theorizing on the ways Joyce’s fundie brain rot might be similar to my childhood rural-Catholic-rightwing brain rot is not in any way an endorsement of said brain rot)
Yeah, I have the thing where stevia DOES taste sweet, for about five seconds, then it tastes like a toxic chemical factory was demolished on my tongue for the next hour.
This is what I have. Stevia has the most hellish after taste that takes seconds to hit and hours to leave. I have no idea what it tastes like to the people that created it, but I have to hope it’s a difference in tastebuds and not just lies.
I’m already aware I’ve got one of those genetic sets where certain things taste different to me (like, I love cilantro, cannot stand most bitter veg (kale/brussels sprouts) without extensive prep, and can taste coconut milk/sugar/oil in absurdly low concentrations in recipes) — and meanwhile, my kid can drink a bottle of stevia-sweetened lemonade and not notice it’s stevia-sweetened until I take a sip.
On the other hand, I ended up really liking bitter beer despite tasting it so flagrantly that I can routinely blind-identify even relatively uncommon hops varieties. So I do have that going for me.
I am SO reassured to hear that other people think stevia has a gnarly chemical aftertaste, I thought I was nuts. I have a very short Absolutely Fucking Not flavor list, but stevia is on it (along with…hmm, salmiak. Textures are a different matter).
Weirdly I kind of like the flavor of the actual leaves of stevia when you chew them, it’s just terrible as a sugar substitute.
For me, it’s an uncanny too-sweet plus wrong chemical sensation, followed by nasty aftertaste. At least it doesn’t turn my guts into a firehose like aspartame does, I guess? Think I’ll stick to avoiding the fake stuff.
Yeah, it’s a plausible theory that Joyce’s lizardbrain still balks at putting pickles on her snickerdoodle, but anything she considers “lesbian” sex is much less intimidating since it lacks the same gravitas.
Saw some of that mentality in college from partiers still glazed in brainrot. Drunk sapphic makeouts? Cool. Dating boys? Very serious business. One girl even seemed to be more lesbian than bi, but would only consider boys for relationship material. Weirdest queer erasure, when you’re both more relaxed about it, yet completely dismissive.
Being in a frat that was pretty open-minded (hell, our regional alumni president was a closet-door-exploding gay man in rural PA in the 1990s, who’d routinely crack jokes about mansex on our listserv and woe to the probationary member who got even slightly homophobic), I got to see a lot of the weird reverse of this, with guys who were hellbent on playing up the “I LOVE WIMMIN” and getting in a lot of smooching/dancing at parties but never taking anyone home, and who always seemed to be very reticent around certain dudes (especially the single-and-out gay ones).
Fortunately for all of them, of my own collegiate brothers I know of at least two gay marriages and one “actually, I’m your fraternity sister now”, so it did work out.
Aww, a happy end, love to see it! Most of the guys I knew were straight, or the closet door was so transparent it was pointless. One guy did do a lot of bragging about kissing gals from myspace (really dates this.) Turned out to be mostly true events, but the gals were strictly pals, or it involved a male mutual friend, instead.
I made an awesome analogy the other day and I think everyone missed it so imma drop this here.
I think this Arc is dumbing of ages Boat arc from berserk for everyone that doesnt just want to see these two fuck.
For those not in the know the “boat arc” is an unofficial arc in Berserk that spanned 20 chapters of the MCs just being on a boat. The reason its memed so much is because those 20 chapters took 9 years to come out. Dreadful to read live but in going back its actually not that bad at all.
This is that.
Anyways, back to them fucking each others brains out
That is a good analogy. Also, as somebody who is not into Berserk, I am curious as to how the authors got away with having their characters on a boat for nine real world years. Was other, presumably more exciting, material released during that time? Was it a particularly enthralling boat trip? Does Berserk just have that dedicated of a fan base that they would wait nine years for it to get exciting again?
No, nothing else Berserk related was being released at the time, fans just desperately waited with each chapter for Guts (MC) and the crew to GET OFF THE BOAT.
This was also very late into the series (over 200 chapters in) so most who made it that far were already invested. Thats not to say NOTHING happened on the boat but it is considered a low point of the series.
Kentaro Miura had a bad habit on going on months (and once or twice YEAR+) long hiatuses but the quality of the manga is just so god damn good that fans are willing to wait for it.
He sadly passed a way a few years ago and his best friend has taken up the mantle of finishing the story.
If you don’t mind dark fantasy (trigger warnings for SA, Gore, extreme violence the whole 9 yards) i HIGHLY recommend reading it as even incomplete I consider it the greatest story ever told personally.
I remember when Miura died, a fuckload of people in Final Fantasy 14 put on their best Dark Knight glams (it’s the big-ass sword class) and stood in one of the main cities with little campfires in front of them, as a tribute/vigil. Went on for a couple days, too. There were people handing out otherwise-expensive items for free so folks could get the vibes right.
I also remember when we repeated the trick for Kazuki Takahashi and Akira Toriyama. Seeing everyone dressed up as their characters and just hanging out to remember the stories and authors felt really nice.
I think it was a combo of creative block, needing mental health breaks from the story, or getting obsessed with games that led to the hiatuses, lol. It was widely memed at the time, but when you’ve been drawing the same series for decades, you’ve more than earned some time off. The manga industry is pretty brutal. Very unfortunate that Miura met with an unexpected emergency. Even if Berserk isn’t your cup of tea, it was hard not to appreciate the craftsmanship of his art.
A few years back at a friend’s going away party I got into a lengthy discussion about humans being animals. He just…completely believed that humans and animals were separate beings. When I explained I learned it from books and school he just chalked it up to being indoctrination of some kind.
He started going really out there saying stuff like “Well if humans are animals what’s stopping us from having sex with dogs”
and it’s like…Because we’re different animals dude!”
I wish I could say I kept my cool but I ended up yelling at him and throwing a balloon at him. Like he couldn’t understand the idea that being animals doesn’t mean “inhuman”. Ughhh I get pissed off just thinking of it.
“Pat Robertson once said it’s a long downward slide
That’ll lead to legalizing sex with ducks, if two men can stand side by side.
God I hope he’s right, because if gay marriage becomes lawful
I’ll find myself a duck, and legally do something awful….”
The irony that animals cannot consent or approve legally binding contracts, but at least a few of those weirdos wouldn’t understand that argument since they think child “marriage” should be legal.
As it has been pointed out, they’re obviously defining straight marriage in their own heads not as being a choice made by two consenting adults but a choice being made by an adult man so as to gain access to his desired sex object.
Which is the traditional definition of marriage in an awful lot of cultures, going back basically as far as we can trace it.
“choice made by two consenting adults” is a very recent development in western culture (and we’re ahead of some others). Or at least the concept of the two as equal partners. Both having the choice kind of goes back a bit further.
I don’t think this is something anyone in this thread didn’t already know, and it’s hardly a defense of the weirdo conservatives who are telling on themselves by basically admitting they view wives as sex dolls with no agency or interiority.
But also: linear progress fallacy. It is absolutely not true that marriage has always been “adult man chooses, helpless woman submits”. That’s both ahistorical and a belief that gives modern bigots the illusory authority of tradition. It’s like claiming child brides used to be normal when absolutely the fuck no they did not. It’s ignoring stuff like how Romeo & Juliet actually makes it textually clear that Juliet being married off to an older man is not just wrong, but uncommon: people love to whine about how she was 14, ignoring that Romeo is definitely also supposed to be a teenager, and that their relationship is contrasted against the inappropriate age gap she would have had with her betrothed.
Firefox on mobile blocks a lot of the worst things just because it has more robust privacy stuff. (I haven’t seen any ads on this site on mobile with it.)
There are ALSO mobile builds with add ons available, tho I’m not sure if they’re live yet.
I can assure you that, at least on my Pixel 8, the standard mobile Firefox install will let you install ublock origin as of whenever the hell I installed it last.
Soon the unholy union of Joyce and Dorothy will finally be consummated! “She never broke up with Joe!” A thousand dammed souls cry out in vain! “What of the consequences?!” Protest thy holiest of paladins. Nothing can stop these two from fucking and burning their friend group in the cleansing fires of drama!
Then a new friend group will be born, staring Asma, and Alice! Hell we’ll even throw in that Ken guy that was in like one strip and of course Jocelyne will be there too, completely replacing Joyce in what is the most obvious upgrade ever. And we’ll never see Dorothy or Joyce again as they are banished to the background cameo purgatory that their sins doomed them to.
honestly, I would be happy if we don’t ever see Dorothy and Joyce again, they have been so fucking annoying since the Tear Gas Wedding. I would accept it if they are just having sex in the background the entire rest of the strip, and we focus on the rest of the cast who still act like human beings
I’m amused by the idea that for the entire rest of the comic, whatever else is going in the foreground, Joyce and Dorothy are having sex somewhere in the background of every strip.
I really don’t get why there are so many people claiming that Joyce didn’t break up with Joe when we saw it happen on screen. Or on strip. Joe had a counter-proposal which Joyce rejected, but then promised to continue the conversation later. She made no promise of how she intended to continue the conversation. If she really intended to accept it at this point in time, she wouldn’t have been in so much of a hurry to break up Dorothy and Walky. There is no evidence she currently intends to every bring it up with Dorothy or to make any move to take Joe up on his offer.
You could make a better case that Dorothy hasn’t broken up with Walky yet. There was simply an announcement by Joyce and no collaboration. That has as much significance as if I announced that you and your significant other had broken up, which is to say none. If things immediately went south with Joyce, Dorothy could come back and say, “I hope you weren’t upset by Joyce acting stupid. You want to watch cartoons tonight and mess around?” Well, she could, other than being Dorothy. Though for maximum impact this wouldn’t happen until Walky committed to starting to date Amber.
What am I actually rooting for? As a committed Trash Goblin, I feel committed to hoping for Joyce and Dorothy independently cheating on each other with Joe and Walky respectively, winding up with mutually awkward discovery, leading in turn to mutual forgiveness and a messy chain polyamory.
Disclaimer: I haven’t actually been committed yet, but who knows what tomorrow will bring.
Oh, I’m of so many minds about this it’s a weird feeling! On the one hand, big picture, I’m not a huge fan of Joyce/Dorothy, so I really don’t care if they hanky panky within ~24 hours of becoming official. Not saying it’s a Morally Bad Thing if they do, I personally just don’t care, I’d rather read about Asma or Becky or Alice or literally anyone else. Joe, I’d read about Joe, whether he interrupts this scene or not.
On the other hand, on a general…human interest…level, I’m genuinely fascinated to see how this will go for them. As mentioned, they have been cruising in their happiness bubble so well, but this is actually new territory for both of them. Dorothy usually knows enough about sex to guide Joyce along, like the laundry scenario and prepping for her Sex Date with Joe, but Dorothy isn’t more experienced with this type of sex than Joyce is. Joyce has been bulldozing past her fundamental upbringing well, but it’d be interesting if some latent confusion hits once the hanky panky becomes real, kinda like with Joe. And Dorothy has been frantically avoiding the hanky panky horizon because of guilt and internalized sexuality crisis, so I’m interested to see if that will rear unpleasantly. Plus the Joe thing, but that’s the obvious external interference factor, I’m more interested to see if their own insecurities create new problems. But then, if it doesn’t, I also just like characters positively experiencing sex through communication and mutual respect in a way that’s not just “they just know how to have the best sex, sex is never awkward or requires a learning curve, it’s only earth shattering amazing ’cause hot”, so I also think it could be really sweet if Dorothy and Joyce just trust each other enough to figure it out together, in a way that’s not Instantly Face Meltingly Great Sex, but is a happy stepping stone in their intimacy.
But on to the Joe thing: I really would like to see that come up. Joyce knows she’s hiding it, she’s squirmed about it in a few previous strips, and I would like to see it broached one way or another. Consequences have been hitting like a meteor shower around here lately, but it still feels as if Dorothy and Joyce havent fully grappled with the repercussions of their breakups.
the one thing that would redeem the last couple of months is if these two were really bad at sex, like completely garbage at it and their night is totally ruined. THAT anticlimax would be funny. it might even make up for turning Jocelyne’s big coming out moment into nothing
That does not seem fair, I am not the biggest fan of Joyce right now, but she did not turn ‘Jocelyne’s big coming out moment’ into nothing, it was not a big coming out moment at all, Jocelyne did want to come out to her father. She only tried to because she thought she had to shield Joyce. What Joyce did was preserving Jocelyne’s chance to come out to Hank on her own terms.
Probably proportionally, as Derek was here: “They cheated on people who they were aslo friends with (ultimately, a mild-to-moderate bad thing involving sex/romance), so they deserve to have bad/unsatisfying sex (a mild-to-moderate bad thing involving sex/romance).” is hardly trying to over-punish anyone for anything.
Penetration?! All this Dorothy and Joyce stuff aside, that’s like the one thing teens making their sex debut can manage, even if it’s pretty artless. IMO, for first-timers it’s the oral and manual dexterity stuff that raises the bar 😂
I could see a reasonable case for Adam’s statement about penetration being harder (heh) if and only if “success” is defined as “everyone has an orgasm”, rather than “a dude completes a sex and his partner is also there”.
I doubt Joe is going to feel much about Joyce and Dorothy having sex, he’s already effectively given the okay to Joyce on it. I worry more how Dorothy will feel when she presumably eventually finds out that Joyce hadn’t broken up with Joe when she and Joyce first had sex (presuming they go through it now, or anytime before Joyce comes clean).
chorus:
“Do it now
You and me baby ain’t nothin′ but mammals
So let’s do it like they do on the Discovery Channel
(Do it again now)
You and me baby ain′t nothin’ but mammals
So let’s do it like they do on the Discovery Channel
Gettin′ horny now!!”
It’s so weird reading all the comments of people being upset at these two, or uninterested in what they’re up to. Inject 1000 more strips of these two dorks being into each other directly into my veins please and thank you.
Agree! Cute is cute, and worth seeing. Also, sex is (usually) good. Yes they’re being Dumb about some things, but not more so than typical for this strip IMO.
I wonder what the odds are that Sarah is either using the shared bathroom right now, or if not, will return to the dorm room before Joyce and Dorothy can do anything. And since it’s Sarah’s room too, I assume she has her key with her and can unlock the door if she’s not in the bathroom.
Autistic girls figuring out exactly what they want and how this involves domming the hell out of their partners is a beautiful phenomenon that should be studied in the full, ahem, spectrum of queerness.
I think the issue is that Dorothy still thinks Joyce broke up with Joe, and hanky-pankying while Joyce is still with Joe might be something Dorothy wouldn’t want to do if she knew.
So yes, Joyce is being Dumb, and creating an ethics issue in the bigger picture.
If it turns out Dorothy doesn’t like that, I kinda’ hope she’s just Dumb about it and not seriously hurt.
I also wonder whether Joyce is going to go full poly and tell Joe he can have other partners too, or whether she’ll do the easy selfish Dumb thing and demand fidelity from him.
Given this isn’t slipshine, it’s reasonable to not be here solely for the fuckin’, and as such it’s also reasonable to think about other characters who have story threads affected by the fuckin’.
It’s not “A man”. It’s two partners not being on the same page with each other. Having sex with someone while you’re hiding something where knowledge of that fact may make the person not want to have sex with you is…y’know. Frowned upon.
If I reversed the scenario and Joyce was having sex with someone who was under the impression he’d broken up with Joyce and he made no effort to make that clear I’d also call that scummy. And I wouldn’t say pointed things like “A man and a woman are trying to fuck and the first thing you think about is Another woman.”
It’s giving “Caring about men is bad”/Assuming people only care BECAUSE he’s a man which is pretty condescending.
This topic has become so polarizing. I want to formally request Willis for a poll to see how many of us actually believe Joyce and Joe are still together vs them having broken up. Cause that really adds context to this argument of whether Joe’s opinion matters here. I don’t think the narrative should be framed as “caring about men is bad” as much as “what business should your sex life be to your ex” but that entirely depends on the question of the moment. Are Joe and Joyce still together?
I personally don’t think Joyce would be comfortable letting things get this far with Dorothy if she thought she were still with Joe in a polycule because she cares about Dorothy too much to lie to her, but honestly I don’t know anymore. The arguments here have totally warped my perspective on this. I don’t know what to believe.
As is usual I don’t think the binary captures the majority of viewpoints, honestly.
Given I hover somewhere around “Joyce’s ‘we’ll talk about this, I promise’ is not unambiguous enough to guarantee that any given combination of Joe, Joyce, and Dorothy are on the same page or even in the same book.”
Ugh, additional thought “… especially given Joyce’s initial attempt at breakup ended up with the oral sex blanket incident, I’m not sure JOYCE is sure of where she stands on the issue — her flightiness in general has been a defining part of this arc as they flit from situation to situation.”
I absolutely think there’s like a critical mass of horniness plus the stress of being outed by the paper plus the stress of coming out to her dad, which has just completely obliterated all thought of Joe and the fact that she left him with a rain check on a longer conversation.
I doubt Joyce thinks she’s now in a polycule with Joe and Dorothy. I also don’t think she’s ruled it out and under these circumstances, that’s information I think she should share with Dorothy before moving on.
(Ideally before breaking her up with Walky, but hey)
Joe is irrelevant? Joe is the only character that matters. That’s why, whenever he’s not onscreen, everyone’s always asking “What about Joe?” You can’t expect some mere queer women to compare to the importance of Joe. /s
No you see. Joyce and Dorothy are the only characters that matter. At all. Any other character shown on screen in any capacity is incidental and completely unimportant until Joyce and Dorothy are on screen doing anything. Joyce isn’t the main character. She’s the only character and all other characters cease to exist when they stop sharing screen space with Joyce.
Joyce did break up with Joe. She told him that she went there to break up with him. She told him why. She does not need Joe’s agreement to have broken up with him. He does not have some kind of veto. She only needs her decision, which she made and told him about.
Joe then making a counter offer that Joyce has not agreed to does not change that! She hasn’t rejected this other offer, having got the “oh my god this photo is everywhere for real” realisation and then run away saying they’d talk later (WHICH IS IN NO WAY AN AGREEMENT TO HIS PROPOSITION), but she hasn’t accepted it either.
To me it’s felt very much like everyone on the UNETHICAL!!!1! side of this comments section has been assuming that he has a veto on this decision, that he hasn’t agreed they’ve broken up then they haven’t. NO. That is NOT HOW THIS WORKS.
Frankly, in this matter, what he thinks does not fucking matter, he does not get a veto on her leaving their relationship. She is not his to release.
It’s factually true that Joyce never outright agreed to stay dating Joe. If anything, I think there’s evidence to suggest she was against it in the moment, before she got distracted by the stupid photo and left the room. Being open to talking about it later doesn’t negate that her last explicit sentence to him in either direction was “I can’t date two people at the same time.”
I don’t personally give a shit if she does or doesn’t start fucking both of them, for the record.
its factually true, Joyce never told Dorothy she is broken up with joe, either.
and the last time she was supposed to she blew him instead.
Joyce actually might have a hard time with setting boundaries and barriers around love. Oddly for Conservative Christian, she seems to act out there are no rules and boundaries for Love. Not for the central character and her friends.
I am someone else who was raised conservative Christian, and the explicit instructions are to love without border (except all those borders they don’t spell out, that you’re just supposed to pick up from people’s general attitudes, and not from the scriptures). It doesn’t surprise me too much that Joyce struggles with that.
You’re wrong! Joyce and Dorothy have committed a cardinal sin! Being in love at the expense of others, especially a man and/or possessive lesbian friend! Their lust for each other, pride in the fact they’ll be fucking, and sloth in not properly breaking up with their former paramours by signing official, notarized breakup contracts, filing them in triplicate with the state breakup authority, and also offering a drop of blood for the witches circle as part of the reconciliation pact standard in every breakup ritual means these two harlots are guilty and must pay for their love with deeply unsatisfying sex! Those are the rules, Dara!
Joyce is still with Joe! #JUSTICE4JOE
Becky’s feelings have been hurt!
Joyce and Dorothy cannot enjoy themselves being together and if they do…….CONSEQUENCES. MUST. BE. PAID……Like Joyce admitting she’s in a polycule after the fact and that this relationship has started under false pretenses. That should be real fun!😁
Joe then making a counter offer that Joyce has not agreed to does not change that!
But she didn’t reject it either. She didn’t react at all, not even by staring silently or anything. She suddenly remembered something else and ran away.
The situation is unclear, and clearing it up is going to be a whole arc of extra drama. It’s not like drama is a limited commodity that the Damnable rations for us.
@Dara: That’s not what Chris Phoenix said was the issue. Joyce told Joe and said she was going to be kissing Dorothy more. She’s in the clear as far as Joe’s concerned. He’s got no veto or any right to complain (any more), just as you say.
The point is that he made the poly counter offer and Joyce is seriously considering that, it’s something Dorothy might want to know first. And there have been at least a few hints that Joyce is. That she doesn’t consider herself really broken up with Joe. That’s the remaining problem here.
If she just got distracted and hasn’t gotten back to him to reject the poly idea then it’s not a big deal, but if she wants to go for it, it’s something she needs to resolve with Dorothy.
That’s fine, but whatever Dara thinks about what Joyce thinks, it’s got nothing to do with the post she was responding to.
There’s been a lot of this on this topic today, but most of it was more general. This was a particularly good example, since it was a direct reply.
At the risk of reducing things to a binary again, I’m seeing a lot of:
“Joyce doesn’t seem sure she’s really broken up with Joe. Dorothy might have a problem with that, especially if Joyce does decide she wants to try poly.”
and:
“Joe doesn’t get a veto. They’re broken up. Joyce isn’t cheating on him.”
First, I’m not entirely convinced Joyce thinks they’re broken up.
Second, yeah, it’s relevant to both, but not to the point where the second version is a meaningful response to the first.
Of course it’s relevant. If you’re someone who thinks Joe was unambiguously broken up with, then of course you’re going to argue with other people claiming he wasn’t and that Joyce owes him another conversation.
It’s only an issue if Joyce chooses to actively continue things with Joe, without speaking to Dorothy about it beforehand. (Not that she was all that upset the last time, but she’d probably be annoyed if it happened again.)
Offhand; Blowjobs and Washing machines seems like the title to some smut romance book that you’ve never heard of but somehow is like a 5 time best seller.
I know. I just didn’t wanna go in the Permanent Discussion of “is this evil or not??” the comment’s section has every time they come into view, ye of little faith.
(… Which. Alright, yeah, I shall take umbrage against this slight against my person while still acknowledging that you’ve been given PLENTY OF REASON to no have said faith, holy shit it gets so tiring.)
The rules of Vaudeville say this much activity on stage is usually means somebody is about to get a cream pie in the face.
Actually, the rules of pron say the same thing.
I’m betting on pie.
I would put forward that, between shoes that have been made but not yet bought, people owning multiple shoes but typically only wearing, at most, one pair at a time, most people not wearing their shoes 24/7 (certainly not while bathing, usually not while sleeping, many not at all while at home), and shoes that have been thrown away sitting in landfills, it is just as likely if not moreso that most shoes at any given moment are unworn.
Story solution idea:
The do the deed. But both have no clue what they are doing, they get weirded out because it doesnt feel good …. and give up.
I´ve had a hookup plike that once – sparkles galore, super sympatico, been flirting for weeks – and when we finally got under the covers, there simply was no there there.
Probably gonna get me some flak from the shippers, and accusations of queer erasure.
But it would resolve the story in a surprising, believable and non-explosy way.
As someone who does enjoy the Joyce x Dorothy even at the expense of others characters being sad about it, I would find the potential for their first sexual experience together to be disappointing to be interesting, maybe even expected. And them working through that could be a compelling story. What spoils that for me is certain demands that they need to have bad sex as a sort of karmic punishment for the characters they’ve hurt by choosing to be a couple. It adds a spiteful tinge that sort of ruins that potential developer.
Not what I intended to say.
But then I really cant even fathom people viewing the world through a lens of karma or cosmic justice.
Thats sadly not how the world works, in my eyes.
Horrible folks often die old, rich and content in their belief that they have lived “right”.
While most folks I would consider “good” torture themselves with second-guessing, regret for mistakes and doubt until their dying breath.
Being self-aware and willing to course-correct has its drawbacks.
Don’t worry. You’ve articulated your thought well. It is a good idea. An interesting development at least. It’s just a sub section of comments that have been against Joyce and Dorothy as a couple because of the grief that it has caused find any reason they should be unhappy and bad sex is the most recent agenda.
It’s less karma and more that people just don’t want them together. I do like the idea in a bubble though. Joyce and Dorothy bad at sex is funny.
Most of all I thought it would be a way to “solve” the storyline that basically upends the weird tribalism that has gone on in the comments.
Also, yes, endless comedic and humanizing possibilities. This is at its heart a story about folks erring forward, after all.
But you are correct – those who want to tribalize will find a way to fit it into their respective triggerabilities.
Fortunately for all of us, that’s basically one guy (at least here).
(granted, I’ve suggested a couple of ways Joyce’s fundie programming could make this go really drama-heavy, but that’s not “karmic punishment” so much as it is “plausible follow-through on the setup”)
That would definitely make for some great drama. Sometimes, when you’ve built something up in your head too much, the reality is disappointing. With how much Joyce tends to double down, I can see a LOT of ways to find some comedy in the moment or aftermath. Or maybe it becomes the cold shower that wakes them up to the things everyone keeps harping on in the comments, and now they have to face those things with the sobering reality that the sex isn’t even that good XD
Has there ever been a sexual encounter in this strip that wasn’t unambiguously satisfying for all involved? Surely we are due for a disappointing time for *someone*.
With how smitten Willis obviously is with Dorothy and Joyce as a pairing, though, I find it unlikely that they’re gonna start here.
There’s been a few although seemingly only really framed as post sex regret. Joe didn’t seem in great spirits post Malaya and it’s hard to grade what Malaya got out of it either since it was all kind of a weird flex on owning the poors or unpopular or whatever the hookup was about. I also don’t think Sal and Jason really enjoyed their time with each other based on their post hookup animosity. Jason does apparently have a big dick though. Mike also didn’t seem fully pleased after banging Eric the finger guns guy, but Mike was always scowling so did he enjoy anything? All those seemed like sex was mostly for stress relief than any enjoyment in the act of it as far as I know. Without real slipshine insights it’s easy to see the emotional payoff over the sexual fulfillment. Maybe they’re also just young so energy and enthusiasm makes up for a lot.
Dorothy and Walky always seemed well-satisfied.
And while I dont remember BillieRuth talking much about their sex life – and I´m sure they dont either, given the amount of booze involved, they never complained.
Joe considered himself a pro doing good work, he had no complaints either (again, that I remember). At least not before his list wnt public.
Danny left neither Amazigirl nor more recently Sal lacking, or at least they didnt say.
Now – I´m not reading slipshine, nor did I manage to tackle shortpacked. But I struggle to imagine how you came to your conclusion.
Question, has Joyce actually expressed sexual attraction to cis-female anatomy? Like I know she’s romantically into Dorothy, and likes kissing but has she ever expressed viewing a fem-presenting person as hot? Because I remember her getting turned on by Joe but can’t remember if she ever got physically turned on by Dorothy or just romantically.
Joyce being bi-romantic but only sexually attracted to male presenting bodies could be a whole wrinkle for things to go through.
Most of the times she expressed sexual attraction to Joe, it was by denying it: “I don’t want to …”
She’s certainly been blushing up and lip biting thinking/talking about sex with Dorothy.
I did suspect the heterosexual/biromantic thing for awhile, but I’m pretty sure now that’s not where this is going.
Joyce’s first reactions to Billie and Sal both read gay as hell to me, even if Joyce lacked awareness at the time. She decides she has to befriend them on the spot, but it’s very puppy love, crush at first sight kind of behavior. We’ve just been seeing how Joyce acts for so long that we’re sorta desensitized to it.
The course of true love never did run smooth. . Especially here. Expect something /someone to get in the way. They are destined to be together but DYW is destined to make this take much longer. I wouldn’t be surprised if Sarah appears and asks about Joe. That would open a whole can of worms when Joyce stutters out the truth.
I continue to feel like this storyline is weird/rushed/taking over, but I’ve trusted Willis for decades now so I’m willing to stick around for the ride.
I also feel this one will read a lot better in collected format, rather than day to do. It will feel way more “consequences AND kissing” instead of the OR of today… probably.
Can I just say. I am SO sick of the trend of people referring to Joe as “A man”. As if that’s all he is. Just some guy. A dude. The physical representation of masculinity. And not like…a fully fleshed out person that we’ve seen grow and some of us have formed a connection to.
Like I get being way into sapphic romance and wanting to enjoy it and a grody “man” is getting in the way of the girl on girl but like…he’s a full character and person and like…I care about him? Not BECAUSE he’s a man, but because I simply like him.
So contextually just imagine the same scenario but it’s Becky cheating on Dina with Joyce if that helps the context feel less “OH WHAT ABOUT A MAAAN?” cuz I’d be equally critical of that.
I agree that there has been a lot of dehumanizing of Joe as a character, but I think that is in response to a lot of equal dehumanization of Joyce and Dorothy asa couple. Joe’s not even in this strip and hasn’t had an appearance for a little while now yet half the responses for days if not weeks of strips featuring Joyce and Dorothy being happy as a couple has been “What about Joe?” “Joyce never broke up with Joe.” That equally reduces them to not being seen as a couple but Joyce especially as only possessions of Joe and her happiness only mattering in how it effects him.
I think a lot of nuance in the discussion has been lost in favor of black and whiting the circumstance around both relationships (ironically Walky isn’t often considered a factor in any of this despite his breakup also being presented as debatably ambiguous) Either Joyce is still with Joe and thus cheating and lying and we should admonish her for it, or they are broken up and bringing up Joe all the time while two girls try to be in love is deeply insulting.
I think it’s probably not as big a deal as we’re all making it and we need to wait and see how things play out, but until then worrying about Joe or any character you like is totally fine. I think we all just need to chill sometimes and remember people are invested in characters and like them instead of reducing them to the worse generalizations to make an argument.
The reason people are talking about Joe so much is BECAUSE he hasn’t appeared in a long time. If we were getting regular updates on the dude maybe people wouldn’t be so concerned about him.
I’m less concerned about Walky cuz he got that heart to heart with Jennifer. As far as I know Joe’s standing in the same spot of his room frozen in time waiting for the love of his life to follow up with him. And that’s really frustrating cuz the story, the comic and the author have made it clear they don’t care about him.
Also, while Dorothy had trouble telling Walky and Joyce was petty and cruel about doing it for her, it’s pretty clearly resolved. There wasn’t an offer of poly on the table. Dorothy hasn’t shown the same kinds of hints she might not really be done with him that Joyce has shown for Joe.
“Joe’s not even in this strip and hasn’t had an appearance for a little while now yet half the responses for days if not weeks of strips featuring Joyce and Dorothy being happy as a couple has been “What about Joe?””
Yeah, you’d swear there was something unresolved between Joe and at least one of these horny idiots.
Clearly not, I don’t have any idea where people keep getting this idea from…
What are you talking about, Joyce definitely absolutely 100% unambiguously broke up with Joe and you’re a crazy person for suggesting that there’s anything unresolved or uncertain about their situation.
@Sirksome: I’m sure there are some talking about that, but the vast majority of comments about Joyce maybe not having broken it off with Joe are not about her cheating and lying because she’s still his possession.
She’s talked to him and made it clear she’s going forward with Dorothy. The only question is whether it’s going to be just her and Dorothy or whether there’s room for him in some kind of poly arrangement. Either way she’s not cheating on him. He’s aware and has essentially given his approval.
What most people are saying is that if she hasn’t ruled out the poly idea she should talk to Dorothy about it soon, preferably before the sex, because Dorothy might not be comfortable with Joyce still wanting to be with Joe.
I can’t believe this is a hot take, but if you remove the “prelude to an inevitable polycule” glasses, and the “Joyce is an evil demon who can do no right” glasses and actually listen to what she said in her last conversation with Joe, she broke up with him. She said that’s what she was doing, she made it absolutely clear that she chose Dorothy, and she as clearly as humanly possible said that she has no intention of dating two people at the same time. She’s neurotic enough to have guilt that she didn’t do so with the maximum possible degree of clarity, but it still happened.
Yes, Joe made a proposal to resume their relationship under different terms, and yes Joyce was interrupted before she could fully explain her “no”, but that doesn’t matter because she needed to explicitly say yes. If she has changed her mind and now intends to accept Joe’s proposal, she absolutely needed to discuss that with Dorothy. But if she still has no interest in dating two people at once, all she needs to do with finish her explanation with Joe as a courtesy to someone she presumably would like to remain friends with.
This is imo an inaccurate reading of that conversation. Joyce did not say she wasn’t interested in dating two people at once. She said she COULDN’T, with “I’m not a hussy” as an excuse. And like that’s a completely normal kneejerk reaction for a former evangelical who has never seriously considered the possibility that she may be polyamorous before.
Like idk the fact that the conversation didn’t actually reach a conclusion would indicate to me that it’s a thread that’s gonna get picked back up? If Willis had intended that to a be an actual breakup scene there are clearer ways to accomplish that.
What makes it ambiguous to me is the strip in the newspaper office. Dorothy declares EX boyfriend and Joyce makes a little face/sound instead of doing nothing or nodding.
@MadContra: But you’re basically right at the end there. I think she left it hanging more than you do and I definitely think she’s tempted by the prospect, but if she chooses not to then while she shouldn’t put it off for too long, she just needs to finish that conversation and be done with it. No need to wait on having sex with Dorothy.
If she does want to accept it or even is still struggling about it, then I think she should talk to Dorothy before going any further.
But you know, people make bad decisions all the time. That’s where the drama comes from.
A) Pretty sure Joyce is WAY more into this than Dorothy is. I think Dorothy really loves Joyce, but not sure she’s actually that…um…physically…into it.
B) How can we pay attention to the cute sapphic shenanigans when we still don’t know if Walky is alive or not? Jennifer could be busy hiding a body a little ways away!
This is true, but both Dorothy and Joe were much more open and enthusiastic about sex with previous partners than with Joyce. We know that Joe didn’t trust himself very much to go all-in on being sexually intimate with Joyce, but I think it is kind of interesting that Dorothy is showing a similar kind of trepidation with her when she never really did with Walky! I wonder what to attibute it to: nervousness about it being her first time with a girl? A larger anxiety about the relationship? Idk, it’s been an interesting dynamic that Dorothy has been a bit more cautious in general so far while Joyce has been eager to just plow ahead, and I hope it gets some focus. I think OP is definitely off-base about Dorothy being into Joyce, she obviously does wanna get in there.
I agree it’d be interesting to get some light on both their feelings about this (and we probably will). I wonder if Dorothy’s going through that common thing with baby gays where they don’t know how their attraction/position in the relationship is “supposed to” fit in because they’re still thinking in heteronormative structures. Or maybe she’s just nervous! Or maybe it’s guilt from the ‘cheating’. Be interesting to see how it goes, but I also agree that she’s DEFINITELY into it. Just trepidatious.
She went from fully realizing her attraction to her best friend to dating and fucking her in what, two, three days? That’s enough to throw anyone for a loop, and to a certain extent it might still feel not real to her. I think it’s probably a soup of that plus some of the other stuff you mentioned. Obviously I’m in the minority here but I’m wayyyy more interested in getting into the meat of all that than I am seeing these two still being cute with each other, haha.
I’m probably equally interested in both. I like the cute shit, but I’m very ready for a serious look at everything between them. The emotional depth is basically always what I’m craving, and I’m not picky which emotion it is.
Bonus: Dorothy is a perfectionist attempting something she’s never done before AND afraid of hurting Joyce. I feel like her anxieties about having sex with Joyce are probably not entirely dissimilar to Joe’s anxieties.
Meanwhile Joyce has clearly put all of this into terms of “this is the first person who ever helped me orgasm, I trust her so much, our love is pure and true, obviously this will be perfect”.
I really need Joyce’s attitude towards “true love” to be genuinely challenged and pushed back upon because it’s easily her least flattering trait, haha.
It’s as if people forget that, huh, one of them spent her entire life being told that she can’t do any of that until she marries some dude and wants to start having kids and hasn’t experienced any of this until like a week ago, and it’s brand spanking new.
Of COURSE Joyce is more into this than Dorothy is. At this very moment, Joyce is more of a sex enthusiast than a room full of Rozes, Joes, and Daisys. Daisies? Whichever.
Look, just because they’re queer doesn’t mean they can’t consent without an elaborate musical number. There’s such a a thing as subtle excitement, and women are capable of consent.
Wait we’re allowed to consent without elaborate musical numbers? Then wtf have I been learning all this choreography for? I was supposed to be off-book by the weekend!!
One possibility the other comments above me didn’t bring up is the potential of Dorothy being romantically attracted but not sexually attracted. I’ve personally known several bi/pan people for whom this is true for some genders.
Another potential is she’s in overthinking things mode and contemplating the potential of how adding a sexual or romantic dynamic may alter their friendship and/or how these events may affect/be affecting those around them (Becky for example).
The only way to salvage this inverse trainwreck is for one or both of these idiots to have a stark negative reaction to what having sex with another woman is going to entail and one or both of them realising they’re nowhere near as gay as they thought.
Because that’d be real fuckin’ funny, and it’d be very on brand for horny idiots figuring themselves out to have made complete asses of themselves and hurt other people on the process.
Speaking from experience, there’s a point where a person has just gone through so much of “Everything I ever knew is false”, that the constant hesitation gives way to assertive momentum. Truth becomes vital, trust in self grows, ability to drop the old and embrace the knew accelerates, and then, the ability to see cracks develops. You’ve broken through so much falsehood that you see the cracks. You see them everywhere. You know how much about you is fabricated at a glance. Lies cannot hold you. You become a truth-seer by your very nature.
Gay people. Apostates. Transgender people. Heretics. Philosophers that have been forced into paradigm shift after paradigm shift. Non-Euclidian Mathmaticians. Quantum physicists.
All have been forced, repeatedly, to abandon the known and learn to see the previously unknown.
“Those who claim for themselves to judge the truth are bound to possess a criterion of truth. This criterion, then, either is without a judge’s approval or has been approved. But if it is in no way approved, whence comes it that it is trustworthy? For no matter of dispute is to be trusted without judging. And, if it has been approved, that which approves it, in turn, either has been approved or has not been approved, and so on ad infinitum” Sextus Empiricus
Eternal existential relearning and unlearning is all there could be. Written on and wrestled with as true as early as 455BC this is not new just not currently in vogue to discuses how even the “rightest” amongst us are only echo’s of every untruth and some smattering of truth the perspective they hold reveals.
Can’t find it again, but thanks to the people who mentioned Karma. This adds another dimension to my puzzlement over views expressed that J&D need to be ‘punished’, which had seemed rather fundie to me. Now I can add that there are also people who ‘believe’? that life in general should ‘punish’ people for doing things that only some people have defined as ‘bad’.
I still cannot fathom why people would think that was, but at least it expands the reasons.
Anyone who does think that way care to politely engage with the why part?
I don’t think it’s so much that people think that life, generally, should punish bad behavior, but I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to feel as though it’s more narratively satisfying for bad behavior to be punished *narratively*. We like seeing people who have behaved cruelly, selfishly, or callously to get some comeuppance in stories. Of course, the extent to which Joyce and Dorothy have engaged in bad behavior is subjective, and when I refer to consequences I’m talking about Joe or Walky being upset and angry over being cheated on and tension being introduced into the friend group rather than anything particularly karmic, but I think when people talk about them suffering consequences or being punished, that’s most commonly the perspective people are coming from.
Well, that is an interesting extra take. Yes, I can see that people might want narrative karma, and that is different. So thanks for that. And I can see that Big Z agrees.
I’m less sure that “when people talk about … that’s most commonly the perspective people are coming from.” Notwithstanding Big Z agrees (and it could be the case) this isn’t how people have phrased it, for the most part. I’d be interested to know why you think this.
I’m with Dot here, in that the real world is (somewhat obviously) random, unjust, capricious, and cruel; thus, I understand the impulse for someone to enjoy a fantasy story wherein bad behavior ALWAYS ends up rebounding onto the malefactor in some karma-appropriate way.
This PARTICULAR situation is highly exacerbated by the high amount of variance in how people respond to cheating and cheating-adjacent scenarios (which IMHO is almost entirely determined by one’s reactions to personal experience) coupled with a high amount of variance for people’s experience of the problems of coming out, comphet, bi-erasure, (to name a few things people have mentioned in the threads) and all of the associated potential traumas of being LGBTQ+ in the modern era.
To rephrase, perhaps, the impulse to want stories that end with karmic justice is understandable, but hard to accurately calibrate where everyone’s perception of the amount of “justice” required is so highly dependent on one’s personal experiences and/or traumas that, in this particular case, “karmic justice” is on a range from “the ladies get to be gay with no worries forever because the gays deserve to be happy” to “cheating is ALWAYS heartbreaking and terrible, and anyone who perpetrates it is basically Satan”.
I think another thing about this arc is that i have never experienceexperienced this ‘New Relationship Energy’ to anywhere *near* the degree being portrayed. (And with the sheer number of people calling it relatable, i have to assume its not *that* exaggerated.)
Which is another think making the arc feel weird to me. Intellectually I understand People are different, but part of me still thinks they’re acting like aliens lmao
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holy shit they actually be doin this :0
*plays “Closer” by Nine Inch Nails on hacked muzak*
I suddenly want to hear a muzak version of Closer… no wait, I think that might be awful. ~<3
Plays “Let’s Marvin Gaye and Get It On”
Proposed Slipshine title: Joyce performs both a hanky, and a panky!
My question is whether the “slipshine” will actually be on the Slipshine website or if it will end up on the Patreon instead. That is, the Willis drawing naked people patreon, not the regular one.
Probably the Patreon. Willis said the slipperyshinies only get done when Slipshine commissions them.
Yeah, but those commissions have often linked up with story events, so it’s not so clear.
I might have to finally sign up for slipshine
how about an AI of Johnny Cash doing it ?
How about his actual corpse, it’d sound better
I’ve always thought Johnny Cash covering Hot Chocolate’s “You Sexy Thing” would have been great. But now it can never happen except as AI slop.
Can I interest you in a 50’s retro cover instead?
https://youtu.be/jemgIOAjGDw?si=agZsT86k2sI2gq0Z
RE Closer on Hacked Muzak: the nearest thing i could find to Muzak version is this glockenspiel sort of abomination
https://youtu.be/Mew84vXjYXw
I’m thinking more Bloodhound Gang, given that last panel. that, and Joyce don’t strike me as a NIN fan but fuck do I know, the girl’s been full’a surprises
Well, she was looking for more secular playlists…
in the mid aughts winterpeg had a “christian” music station that played (not closer) NIN hourly, with frequent apocalyptica and marylin manson “they mention god in the lyrics therefor it counts as christian rock, right?” was the arguement they used, they died when the crtc said “no, it has to be classified as christian rock by the recording industry” FREQ107 was the best radio we had in winnipeg until then
Love; the kind you clean up with a mop and bucket.
Is it, though? Something about this build-up makes me feel as if it might somehow get interrupted at the last second.
It does have that feel, but my intuitions about where things were going to go have been completely off this whole arc.
Murphy dictates that there will be more build up, and then a distraction or other hijinks to derail things. Also, several scene cuts before the [SLIP SHINE EXCLUSIVE].
For all the drama this has caused for everyone else
I hope their first time is awful
I mean I guess this is Joyce’s… fourth? Time having sex at all?
Handjob with Joe
Fingered by Joe
She put her mouth on his penis
So she has some experience, maybe it won’t be awful.
And she held dorothies hand on a washing machine
Joyce is totally a woman of the world now.
A woman of the Whirlpool, or maybe Maytag.
i believe you want sister of the Electrolux!
i hope they have such an amazing first time that they start fucking again instantly don’t leave this dorm room until the start of the next storyline
Hold on
Let them cook
until the start of the next book
I hope they remember to stay hydrated, at least.
i hope that its so good for dorothy especially that she just post-orgasm glows through the whole “wait im in a polycule involving that guy i dislike” realization
Joe actively pushed Dorothy towards Joyce. I think he’s embracing the chaos and hoping he can still be happy in the end. I think he knows this might be messy, and I don’t think he’ll hold it against her.
Also, being super into each other is totally what leads to awful sex.
The looming (potential) issue now isn’t Joe being against Joyce-Dorothy. It’s that Joe seems to be aiming for Joyce simply dating both of them at the same time, while Dorothy thinks they agreed to be exclusive. And so far Joyce failed to commit to either course, despite telling Dorothy she would.
and Joe isnt wrong.
dorothy shouldnt be putting bars on Joyce,
when she knows joyce has major issues shes trying to resolve around her sexuality,
and now orientation too.
Im for a lot more fucking in all directions so they can at least get a sense of who they are,
Dorothy doesnt even know if shes into women,
Joyce doesnt even know if shes fully into men, or not
Or if shes sexually attracted to women. other being Homosocial.
( dorothy knows more than anyone how cloistered JOyce is on sex. Becky was atleast right in knowing Joyce needed to get on the bike and ride. )
ClaudeLemieux I’m with you. I think Joe just wants Joyce in whatever way he can have her – as a lover, as a friend…he just really digs her.
I think the quality of the sex is far from the biggest peril they’re facing.
Dorothy still doesn’t know that Joyce didn’t break up with Joe.
Yeah. Given that Joe is informed and consenting, I’m not worried about Joe at this moment.
But Dorothy is *not* informed. Dorothy is engaging under false pretenses (believing that Joe is Joyce’s “ex-boyfriend,” and Joyce not taking any of the many opportunities to correct that misconception).
I’m worried about Dorothy.
People seem so very sure that ”Joyce didn’t break up with Joe” is a massive sticking point for Joyce. Why would it be? Is she massively possessive and jealous?
Joe is being an adult about things, and in an odd way Joyce seems to be more adult here than Dorothy. I think of all people involved Dorothy is currently an absolute mess. I hope she finally has to reflect on her behaviour and attitude towards her lovers.
More of a sticky point for Dorothy I’d say. When she finally finds out about it.
And you don’t have to be massively possessive and jealous to not want to be blindsided by finding out you’re in a poly relationship you didn’t know about.
Its perfectly natural, its understandable
to steal your gf from her lover,
by threatening to suicide by cop
its a “Trauma response”, who among us hasnt done it.
Its soo Romantic
if i cant have you to myself, may the cop on the roof sniper me through the head.
the Grotesque is my witness.
Amazigirl : this is all my fault. Shoot me first. Forgive me walky
ok
That is some grade A hater energy.
Joe is still left hanging, but other than that what drama? Any fallout that may have come from this just landed with a wet plop.
As much as I’m a hater, I’m not a hater because these two get to be happy, I’m a hater because WHAT drama? They’ve so far caused one miffed Sarah, two boys who are currently upset but coping in different unhealthy ways (yes, that’s a harsh opinion on Joe’s actual desire for poly), and a bunch of running around getting horny in the vicinity of other people’s problems.
As such I don’t care at all about their first time except the probably-vain hope that it cuts to Slipshine as soon as humanly possible so we can get on with some actual story and not just these two dweebs being all kissy AGAIN.
I MISS DANNY.
Danny and Sal just playin’ ukulele and riding motorcycles into the sunset (and most importantly not wearing out their welcome with excessive artificial sweetness).
I know right
This day has been devastating for everybody including them, but I guess it’s time to fuck themselves stupid haha such dorks
The girl is driven, excited to see how quickly this goes up in flames!
There is a gene-drive joke here somewhere…
joyce about to… drive those… jeans… uh…
She gonna lose those jeans.
(but first the shoes, though)
((they aren’t animals, you know))
Maybe tomorrow’s strip is Joyce eating tacos instead.
Only if they’re disassembled into their component pieces. Which uh. Wouldn’t be great for dotty probably
Don’t trust…..evolution….??? Don’t trust shoes. Yeah, let’s go with that one instead.
You can’t trust shoes. Some of them are real sneakers.
Wait? Locking the doors? In THIS comic?
Who are they and what have they done with Dorothy and Joyce?
SO unnatural! Someone will report them to Ruth, who will have to use the emergency masterkey! An entire concerned crowd will end up in the room with the hankypanky duo!
Still a chance that Joe is just sitting in the dark in there and they didn’t notice.
Things happened faster than he was expecting, and now it’s awkward.
Joe’s voyeurism fetish? Kind of an odd slipshine. Whatever they’re into I guess.
Isn’t slipshine totally voyeurism?
Technically correct, which is the best kind of correct.
If that happens, I’mma need a montage of them continuously stumbling into this room and catching every single person in their friend group waiting in the dark, but simultaneously finding a way to break all their hearts before they’re revealed.
“Should I just let myself out?”
Joyce: “Nope, you stay right there; you’re in charge of the camera.”
Dorothy: “Wut”
New Theory (your joke led to it so I’m putting it here):
– Joyce stays broken up with Joe BUT they try to stay friends despite still both having strong feelings about each other and only being broken up because Joyce is weirded out by polyamory.
– This leads to months of weirdly competitive sex where Joyce and Joe try to one-up each other with their new partners (Dorothy for Joyce and Rachel or Walky for Joe).
– They report back, snipe at each other, and get a combination of excited and infuriated with one another as they both commit to trying to be the sluttiest person on campus.
– After a particularly ‘heated’ exchange, they fuck. It’s Dorothy’s turn to say “thank fuck, finally!” and Joe has to go talk to Walky (or Rachel) about joining this new polycule.
I really hope Willis is taking notes and/or is willing to redraw a bunch of strips.
My headcanon accepts this.
Different room. Joe+Danny’s (where Joyce and Joe had the talk some strips back) has a Batman poster. Joyce+Sarah’s has a Monkey Master.
These girls will be getting a u-haul in no time.
Possibly a Subaru!
Oh. My. God. Do either of them like having pets?!
Sure. Joyce borrowed Fuckface the iguana for her Rapunzel costume. And the Browns had/have a dog named Snoopy, right?
Just “Snoop”, I think.
Poor Snoop.
Taking bets now whether Dorothy finally finds out/realizes that Joyce has not broken up with Joe before or after.
There would be a lot of drama if it happens after, so . . .
My non-existent money’s on “after”.
If it happens, I’m hoping ‘after.’ My enclosure needs enrichment.
someone throw me a watermelon to gnaw on with my powerful and carnivorous jaws
(the watermelon is Mess.)
insert marsupial-lion joke here
you and me are on the same page here. trash goblins shaking paws
“My enclosure needs enrichment” is a phrase I will be stealing because that’s the perfect way to describe the feeling of wanting drama in a story to shake things up for entertainment.
+1, and I’ll take a pumpkin filled with ground beef like the tigers get, please.
Not just after, but well after. Joyce isn’t going to tell her about it now. She’ll go back to talk to Joe about it tomorrow, wind up having sex with him and then Dorothy’ll find out.
As much as I joke about Joyce having lack of romantic object permanence…
For how long I waited for them getting together?…
im honestly just impressed theyre both gung ho about this with either of them not having box eating experience! though it would be within dottys character to have previously researched this topic lmfao
Only one way to get experience, after all.
We dont know if either of them have pica.
chuuuu?
Pica not Pika
Pica chew!
Excellent choice of gravatar. Well chosen!
I AM a PICA!
They might not have experience being the eater, but Dorothy might have experience being the eaten and can direct.
Tonight’s episode: The Eater and the Et
They’re going to call Leslie and have her walk them through it.
*Daisy kicks Leslie aside, taking over
Meh, people figure sex out on their own allatime. They’ll be fine.
They need to do it before they realize the consequences of their actions!
Also having sex with shoes on not my thing but don’t kink shame Joyce!
It’s not the sex – Joyce just doesn’t want shoes on her bed.
Yeah! They’re not animals!
(okay, yes, they are)
((i, too, believe evolution is correct))
I was gonna make a remark about how she’d be finding dirt in her sheets for weeks afterwards if one of them took their shoes into the bed.
But with Joyce’s attitudes about hygiene, she’s probably gonna have to take these sheets to the laundry after having sex on them just because of assorted fluids and such.
So maybe it doesn’t really matter all that much.
I’m all for the slipshine and all
but I am still worried about Dina T~T
Joe stood completely unmoved from the spot joyce left him in
There’s gonna be a disaster which blocks the slipshine I just know it
Will Joyce chicken out at the last moment? Place your bets!
If Joyce backs out at the last moment, that would be a rather awesome twist. I don’t think so, but it would be very interesting.
It would actually maybe make things interesting again if she somehow managed to back out or de-escalate in the exact same way things did with Joe, although I’m not sure that’s possible given how I perceive the fundie upbringing’s classification of sex acts.
OTOH, that also means that it would be just as much of a twist to lean into Joyce being bi with SOMEONE realizing that Joyce NOT stopping means that some part of her is like “this isn’t REALLY sex”.
I’ll settle for anything that gets the stevia aftertaste out of my mouth with these two, granted.
(because I know this comment section, I will reiterate — my theorizing on the ways Joyce’s fundie brain rot might be similar to my childhood rural-Catholic-rightwing brain rot is not in any way an endorsement of said brain rot)
im just happy im not the only one who cant taste stevia.
theres a lot of people whod put ratpoison in their coffee
You are definitely not the only one who doesn’t get any sweet taste from stevia.
Yeah, I have the thing where stevia DOES taste sweet, for about five seconds, then it tastes like a toxic chemical factory was demolished on my tongue for the next hour.
This is what I have. Stevia has the most hellish after taste that takes seconds to hit and hours to leave. I have no idea what it tastes like to the people that created it, but I have to hope it’s a difference in tastebuds and not just lies.
I’m already aware I’ve got one of those genetic sets where certain things taste different to me (like, I love cilantro, cannot stand most bitter veg (kale/brussels sprouts) without extensive prep, and can taste coconut milk/sugar/oil in absurdly low concentrations in recipes) — and meanwhile, my kid can drink a bottle of stevia-sweetened lemonade and not notice it’s stevia-sweetened until I take a sip.
I’ve got the same things!! Basically any time someone’s like “oh you can hardly taste the–” it tastes so strongly of it.
On the other hand, I ended up really liking bitter beer despite tasting it so flagrantly that I can routinely blind-identify even relatively uncommon hops varieties. So I do have that going for me.
I am SO reassured to hear that other people think stevia has a gnarly chemical aftertaste, I thought I was nuts. I have a very short Absolutely Fucking Not flavor list, but stevia is on it (along with…hmm, salmiak. Textures are a different matter).
Weirdly I kind of like the flavor of the actual leaves of stevia when you chew them, it’s just terrible as a sugar substitute.
For me, it’s an uncanny too-sweet plus wrong chemical sensation, followed by nasty aftertaste. At least it doesn’t turn my guts into a firehose like aspartame does, I guess? Think I’ll stick to avoiding the fake stuff.
Ugh, same.
I can tolerate aspartame, thankfully, and I don’t seem to have issues with reasonable amounts of sucralose/splenda.
Yeah, it’s a plausible theory that Joyce’s lizardbrain still balks at putting pickles on her snickerdoodle, but anything she considers “lesbian” sex is much less intimidating since it lacks the same gravitas.
Saw some of that mentality in college from partiers still glazed in brainrot. Drunk sapphic makeouts? Cool. Dating boys? Very serious business. One girl even seemed to be more lesbian than bi, but would only consider boys for relationship material. Weirdest queer erasure, when you’re both more relaxed about it, yet completely dismissive.
Being in a frat that was pretty open-minded (hell, our regional alumni president was a closet-door-exploding gay man in rural PA in the 1990s, who’d routinely crack jokes about mansex on our listserv and woe to the probationary member who got even slightly homophobic), I got to see a lot of the weird reverse of this, with guys who were hellbent on playing up the “I LOVE WIMMIN” and getting in a lot of smooching/dancing at parties but never taking anyone home, and who always seemed to be very reticent around certain dudes (especially the single-and-out gay ones).
Fortunately for all of them, of my own collegiate brothers I know of at least two gay marriages and one “actually, I’m your fraternity sister now”, so it did work out.
Aww, a happy end, love to see it! Most of the guys I knew were straight, or the closet door was so transparent it was pointless. One guy did do a lot of bragging about kissing gals from myspace (really dates this.) Turned out to be mostly true events, but the gals were strictly pals, or it involved a male mutual friend, instead.
I made an awesome analogy the other day and I think everyone missed it so imma drop this here.
I think this Arc is dumbing of ages Boat arc from berserk for everyone that doesnt just want to see these two fuck.
For those not in the know the “boat arc” is an unofficial arc in Berserk that spanned 20 chapters of the MCs just being on a boat. The reason its memed so much is because those 20 chapters took 9 years to come out. Dreadful to read live but in going back its actually not that bad at all.
This is that.
Anyways, back to them fucking each others brains out
That is a good analogy. Also, as somebody who is not into Berserk, I am curious as to how the authors got away with having their characters on a boat for nine real world years. Was other, presumably more exciting, material released during that time? Was it a particularly enthralling boat trip? Does Berserk just have that dedicated of a fan base that they would wait nine years for it to get exciting again?
No, nothing else Berserk related was being released at the time, fans just desperately waited with each chapter for Guts (MC) and the crew to GET OFF THE BOAT.
This was also very late into the series (over 200 chapters in) so most who made it that far were already invested. Thats not to say NOTHING happened on the boat but it is considered a low point of the series.
Kentaro Miura had a bad habit on going on months (and once or twice YEAR+) long hiatuses but the quality of the manga is just so god damn good that fans are willing to wait for it.
He sadly passed a way a few years ago and his best friend has taken up the mantle of finishing the story.
If you don’t mind dark fantasy (trigger warnings for SA, Gore, extreme violence the whole 9 yards) i HIGHLY recommend reading it as even incomplete I consider it the greatest story ever told personally.
In fact there’s charts out there that tracked all of of berserks hiatuses, the longest of which was 67 weeks between a chapter being released
I remember when Miura died, a fuckload of people in Final Fantasy 14 put on their best Dark Knight glams (it’s the big-ass sword class) and stood in one of the main cities with little campfires in front of them, as a tribute/vigil. Went on for a couple days, too. There were people handing out otherwise-expensive items for free so folks could get the vibes right.
I was a part of that!
I was among them!
I did it again on his anniversary as well
I also remember when we repeated the trick for Kazuki Takahashi and Akira Toriyama. Seeing everyone dressed up as their characters and just hanging out to remember the stories and authors felt really nice.
I was there too! (How many FFXIV players are there in this comment section?!)
At least four, it seems.
I think it was a combo of creative block, needing mental health breaks from the story, or getting obsessed with games that led to the hiatuses, lol. It was widely memed at the time, but when you’ve been drawing the same series for decades, you’ve more than earned some time off. The manga industry is pretty brutal. Very unfortunate that Miura met with an unexpected emergency. Even if Berserk isn’t your cup of tea, it was hard not to appreciate the craftsmanship of his art.
Thank you for the informative response and glowing recommendation. I will seriously consider checking it out.
A few years back at a friend’s going away party I got into a lengthy discussion about humans being animals. He just…completely believed that humans and animals were separate beings. When I explained I learned it from books and school he just chalked it up to being indoctrination of some kind.
He started going really out there saying stuff like “Well if humans are animals what’s stopping us from having sex with dogs”
and it’s like…Because we’re different animals dude!”
I wish I could say I kept my cool but I ended up yelling at him and throwing a balloon at him. Like he couldn’t understand the idea that being animals doesn’t mean “inhuman”. Ughhh I get pissed off just thinking of it.
Why dont dogs fuck pigs if all animals just have sex?
THAT’S WHAT I WAS SAYING. I truly can’t remember how he deflected from that. It’s why I hate getting mad. I definitely must’ve fumbled that argument.
I think that’s a terrible example, because a dog that lived in a shared enclosure might actually try…
I just wonder if he thought humans were vegetable or mineral.
“Well, if you want to have sex with dogs, I can’t stop you. You can get arrested, though.”
More importantly, they’ll put the dog down. No matter what your kink is, that’s just not worth it.
This is always how weirdo conservatives sound when they talked about how legalizing gay marriage would open the door for people marrying animals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXPcBI4CJc8
“Sex With Ducks” by Garfunkel and Oates
“Pat Robertson once said it’s a long downward slide
That’ll lead to legalizing sex with ducks, if two men can stand side by side.
God I hope he’s right, because if gay marriage becomes lawful
I’ll find myself a duck, and legally do something awful….”
The irony that animals cannot consent or approve legally binding contracts, but at least a few of those weirdos wouldn’t understand that argument since they think child “marriage” should be legal.
As it has been pointed out, they’re obviously defining straight marriage in their own heads not as being a choice made by two consenting adults but a choice being made by an adult man so as to gain access to his desired sex object.
I wish that was an angle I had clocked in the moment as a rebuttal but I was so frustrated by that point.
It’s a really frustrating argument! And I’m definitely quoting at least two different people I’ve heard make this point in the years since.
aka, don’t feel bad, being incisive in the *moment* is a wholly separate skillset from being witty or incisive in general.
Which is the traditional definition of marriage in an awful lot of cultures, going back basically as far as we can trace it.
“choice made by two consenting adults” is a very recent development in western culture (and we’re ahead of some others). Or at least the concept of the two as equal partners. Both having the choice kind of goes back a bit further.
I don’t think this is something anyone in this thread didn’t already know, and it’s hardly a defense of the weirdo conservatives who are telling on themselves by basically admitting they view wives as sex dolls with no agency or interiority.
But also: linear progress fallacy. It is absolutely not true that marriage has always been “adult man chooses, helpless woman submits”. That’s both ahistorical and a belief that gives modern bigots the illusory authority of tradition. It’s like claiming child brides used to be normal when absolutely the fuck no they did not. It’s ignoring stuff like how Romeo & Juliet actually makes it textually clear that Juliet being married off to an older man is not just wrong, but uncommon: people love to whine about how she was 14, ignoring that Romeo is definitely also supposed to be a teenager, and that their relationship is contrasted against the inappropriate age gap she would have had with her betrothed.
But Yoto, if we’re “just” human animals what’s stopping other animals from being human? Or worse, what makes us NOT special?? 😱
throwing a balloon?
well, can’t say I don’t get why you’d have that reaction, yeah that tracks XD (-_-)
I sympathise Yotomoe. I’m a biologist, but even if I weren’t I’d be 100% on your side in this.
Animal , Mineral , Vegetable Pick only 1. argument Over.
But …
or
Fungi, Protist, bacteria,
But
or
Gas Giant , star, black hole …
but
abstract representation of a natural law ,
BUT
or an AI pretendng to be a person
BUT
stupidity itself still talking.
BUT
Listen , Flowerdick only animals and Flowers have sex, which are you?
Penis or pansy whatyougot?
An ad for Claude AI just completely obscured the site for me
i recommend Ublock Origin, unless you’re on iphone, in which case i give you my condolences
Firefox on mobile blocks a lot of the worst things just because it has more robust privacy stuff. (I haven’t seen any ads on this site on mobile with it.)
There are ALSO mobile builds with add ons available, tho I’m not sure if they’re live yet.
I can assure you that, at least on my Pixel 8, the standard mobile Firefox install will let you install ublock origin as of whenever the hell I installed it last.
Nathon gets a better class of ad than I do.
Just like animals
Like animals
Like animals
Soon the unholy union of Joyce and Dorothy will finally be consummated! “She never broke up with Joe!” A thousand dammed souls cry out in vain! “What of the consequences?!” Protest thy holiest of paladins. Nothing can stop these two from fucking and burning their friend group in the cleansing fires of drama!
Then a new friend group will be born, staring Asma, and Alice! Hell we’ll even throw in that Ken guy that was in like one strip and of course Jocelyne will be there too, completely replacing Joyce in what is the most obvious upgrade ever. And we’ll never see Dorothy or Joyce again as they are banished to the background cameo purgatory that their sins doomed them to.
honestly, I would be happy if we don’t ever see Dorothy and Joyce again, they have been so fucking annoying since the Tear Gas Wedding. I would accept it if they are just having sex in the background the entire rest of the strip, and we focus on the rest of the cast who still act like human beings
Human beings act like Joyce and Dorothy!
“…'” says a smiling Joyce .
of course you were given a joyce icon.
Joyce is totally okay with this outcome.
I’m amused by the idea that for the entire rest of the comic, whatever else is going in the foreground, Joyce and Dorothy are having sex somewhere in the background of every strip.
Willis will put it it on the masthead,
for 5 years…
and they will never finish coitus w/out getting interrupted.
he did before.
I really don’t get why there are so many people claiming that Joyce didn’t break up with Joe when we saw it happen on screen. Or on strip. Joe had a counter-proposal which Joyce rejected, but then promised to continue the conversation later. She made no promise of how she intended to continue the conversation. If she really intended to accept it at this point in time, she wouldn’t have been in so much of a hurry to break up Dorothy and Walky. There is no evidence she currently intends to every bring it up with Dorothy or to make any move to take Joe up on his offer.
You could make a better case that Dorothy hasn’t broken up with Walky yet. There was simply an announcement by Joyce and no collaboration. That has as much significance as if I announced that you and your significant other had broken up, which is to say none. If things immediately went south with Joyce, Dorothy could come back and say, “I hope you weren’t upset by Joyce acting stupid. You want to watch cartoons tonight and mess around?” Well, she could, other than being Dorothy. Though for maximum impact this wouldn’t happen until Walky committed to starting to date Amber.
What am I actually rooting for? As a committed Trash Goblin, I feel committed to hoping for Joyce and Dorothy independently cheating on each other with Joe and Walky respectively, winding up with mutually awkward discovery, leading in turn to mutual forgiveness and a messy chain polyamory.
Disclaimer: I haven’t actually been committed yet, but who knows what tomorrow will bring.
Lookit that cute lil pout on Joyce’s face in that third to last strip…
Objectively adorable. Whether it’s immoral is a subject of same debate, but on an objective level this is sweet and bubbly.
Oh, I’m of so many minds about this it’s a weird feeling! On the one hand, big picture, I’m not a huge fan of Joyce/Dorothy, so I really don’t care if they hanky panky within ~24 hours of becoming official. Not saying it’s a Morally Bad Thing if they do, I personally just don’t care, I’d rather read about Asma or Becky or Alice or literally anyone else. Joe, I’d read about Joe, whether he interrupts this scene or not.
On the other hand, on a general…human interest…level, I’m genuinely fascinated to see how this will go for them. As mentioned, they have been cruising in their happiness bubble so well, but this is actually new territory for both of them. Dorothy usually knows enough about sex to guide Joyce along, like the laundry scenario and prepping for her Sex Date with Joe, but Dorothy isn’t more experienced with this type of sex than Joyce is. Joyce has been bulldozing past her fundamental upbringing well, but it’d be interesting if some latent confusion hits once the hanky panky becomes real, kinda like with Joe. And Dorothy has been frantically avoiding the hanky panky horizon because of guilt and internalized sexuality crisis, so I’m interested to see if that will rear unpleasantly. Plus the Joe thing, but that’s the obvious external interference factor, I’m more interested to see if their own insecurities create new problems. But then, if it doesn’t, I also just like characters positively experiencing sex through communication and mutual respect in a way that’s not just “they just know how to have the best sex, sex is never awkward or requires a learning curve, it’s only earth shattering amazing ’cause hot”, so I also think it could be really sweet if Dorothy and Joyce just trust each other enough to figure it out together, in a way that’s not Instantly Face Meltingly Great Sex, but is a happy stepping stone in their intimacy.
But on to the Joe thing: I really would like to see that come up. Joyce knows she’s hiding it, she’s squirmed about it in a few previous strips, and I would like to see it broached one way or another. Consequences have been hitting like a meteor shower around here lately, but it still feels as if Dorothy and Joyce havent fully grappled with the repercussions of their breakups.
the one thing that would redeem the last couple of months is if these two were really bad at sex, like completely garbage at it and their night is totally ruined. THAT anticlimax would be funny. it might even make up for turning Jocelyne’s big coming out moment into nothing
Ha! Anticlimax. That is fantastically clever word play.
That does not seem fair, I am not the biggest fan of Joyce right now, but she did not turn ‘Jocelyne’s big coming out moment’ into nothing, it was not a big coming out moment at all, Jocelyne did want to come out to her father. She only tried to because she thought she had to shield Joyce. What Joyce did was preserving Jocelyne’s chance to come out to Hank on her own terms.
Gosh, How do you react when people do actual bad things, like rape, murder, genocide, torture etc?
I mean, presumably by wishing worse things on them than a night of awkward/bad sex? Derek’s hope was hardly that severe, let’s be real here.
This definitely seems like a proportional response to this comment
Probably proportionally, as Derek was here: “They cheated on people who they were aslo friends with (ultimately, a mild-to-moderate bad thing involving sex/romance), so they deserve to have bad/unsatisfying sex (a mild-to-moderate bad thing involving sex/romance).” is hardly trying to over-punish anyone for anything.
isnt that …Likely ?
They are both first timers here
at least there is no penetration necessary. That raises skill level to sex well several orders of magnitude.
Joyce gets weirded out at the food touching each other, and obsess over trying to make stuff not touch.
then tries to get Dorothy to squish her but shes not heavy enough.
Penetration?! All this Dorothy and Joyce stuff aside, that’s like the one thing teens making their sex debut can manage, even if it’s pretty artless. IMO, for first-timers it’s the oral and manual dexterity stuff that raises the bar 😂
I could see a reasonable case for Adam’s statement about penetration being harder (heh) if and only if “success” is defined as “everyone has an orgasm”, rather than “a dude completes a sex and his partner is also there”.
“Hey guys, it’s Becky. I still have that spare room key Sarah gave me. I just wanted to say I’m sorry for how I acted before an- oh, come on!“
Thanks for the laugh!
I doubt Joe is going to feel much about Joyce and Dorothy having sex, he’s already effectively given the okay to Joyce on it. I worry more how Dorothy will feel when she presumably eventually finds out that Joyce hadn’t broken up with Joe when she and Joyce first had sex (presuming they go through it now, or anytime before Joyce comes clean).
she already failed to break up with him and gave him a blowjob
This time Dorothy is under the impression that they both broke up with their boyfriends though.
chorus:
“Do it now
You and me baby ain’t nothin′ but mammals
So let’s do it like they do on the Discovery Channel
(Do it again now)
You and me baby ain′t nothin’ but mammals
So let’s do it like they do on the Discovery Channel
Gettin′ horny now!!”
Joyce is the top, but there’s a chance that Dorothy is the only one who knows what to do here.
I have no doubt that she’s googled it at least once.
(For science!)
I think they’ve both got the same amount of experience with someone else who has the same equipment.
But like, first times don’t have to be physically amazing to be great.
My first thought would’ve been to ditch the shoes before climbing onto the loft bed.
Though I think I just was raised to not wear shoes indoors
Not very practical in a dorm.
Wait, prepare some chair for Joe
It’s so weird reading all the comments of people being upset at these two, or uninterested in what they’re up to. Inject 1000 more strips of these two dorks being into each other directly into my veins please and thank you.
Same. This is funny and heartwarming and sexy and terrible and I’m so here for it.
Same same same. Set up whatever kind of IV drop is best.
They’re gonna be so bad at this, it’s going to be hilarious. AND YES I AM SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE. 😀
Agree! Cute is cute, and worth seeing. Also, sex is (usually) good. Yes they’re being Dumb about some things, but not more so than typical for this strip IMO.
Yes, absolutely! Love these two.
I wonder what the odds are that Sarah is either using the shared bathroom right now, or if not, will return to the dorm room before Joyce and Dorothy can do anything. And since it’s Sarah’s room too, I assume she has her key with her and can unlock the door if she’s not in the bathroom.
At least Joe is free to be with Sarah
They had real chemistry in Roomies.
Joes tall and a fuck machine, both traits Sarah likes.
Sarah’s got a boyfriend.
Yeah, but nobody cares about Tony.
Presumably the Dean has some investment. It’s hard to speculate on Beef’s mental processes.
“Lock both doors”.
She really learned some good lessons from Becky, hasn’t she?
I shall not comment on the ethics of them doing this.
However, if there was any doubt about Joyce being a baby dom, well. Here we’re getting it hella dispelled them.
Nobody’s getting assaulted or coerced, the ethics are fine.
for reals holy shit
that said
i look forward to joyce and dina exchanging dom notes later, once all the awkwardness is over 😀
Autistic girls figuring out exactly what they want and how this involves domming the hell out of their partners is a beautiful phenomenon that should be studied in the full, ahem, spectrum of queerness.
I think the issue is that Dorothy still thinks Joyce broke up with Joe, and hanky-pankying while Joyce is still with Joe might be something Dorothy wouldn’t want to do if she knew.
So yes, Joyce is being Dumb, and creating an ethics issue in the bigger picture.
If it turns out Dorothy doesn’t like that, I kinda’ hope she’s just Dumb about it and not seriously hurt.
I also wonder whether Joyce is going to go full poly and tell Joe he can have other partners too, or whether she’ll do the easy selfish Dumb thing and demand fidelity from him.
oh shit didn’t even think of that.
Joe is irrelevant in this scenario. Two women are about to fuck, and somehow the first thing you think of is a man.
Given this isn’t slipshine, it’s reasonable to not be here solely for the fuckin’, and as such it’s also reasonable to think about other characters who have story threads affected by the fuckin’.
It’s not “A man”. It’s two partners not being on the same page with each other. Having sex with someone while you’re hiding something where knowledge of that fact may make the person not want to have sex with you is…y’know. Frowned upon.
If I reversed the scenario and Joyce was having sex with someone who was under the impression he’d broken up with Joyce and he made no effort to make that clear I’d also call that scummy. And I wouldn’t say pointed things like “A man and a woman are trying to fuck and the first thing you think about is Another woman.”
It’s giving “Caring about men is bad”/Assuming people only care BECAUSE he’s a man which is pretty condescending.
This topic has become so polarizing. I want to formally request Willis for a poll to see how many of us actually believe Joyce and Joe are still together vs them having broken up. Cause that really adds context to this argument of whether Joe’s opinion matters here. I don’t think the narrative should be framed as “caring about men is bad” as much as “what business should your sex life be to your ex” but that entirely depends on the question of the moment. Are Joe and Joyce still together?
I personally don’t think Joyce would be comfortable letting things get this far with Dorothy if she thought she were still with Joe in a polycule because she cares about Dorothy too much to lie to her, but honestly I don’t know anymore. The arguments here have totally warped my perspective on this. I don’t know what to believe.
As is usual I don’t think the binary captures the majority of viewpoints, honestly.
Given I hover somewhere around “Joyce’s ‘we’ll talk about this, I promise’ is not unambiguous enough to guarantee that any given combination of Joe, Joyce, and Dorothy are on the same page or even in the same book.”
Ugh, additional thought “… especially given Joyce’s initial attempt at breakup ended up with the oral sex blanket incident, I’m not sure JOYCE is sure of where she stands on the issue — her flightiness in general has been a defining part of this arc as they flit from situation to situation.”
Joyce just recently gave Joe a blowjob instead of breaking up with him. It’s actually VERY in character for her to put off upsetting information.
I absolutely think there’s like a critical mass of horniness plus the stress of being outed by the paper plus the stress of coming out to her dad, which has just completely obliterated all thought of Joe and the fact that she left him with a rain check on a longer conversation.
I doubt Joyce thinks she’s now in a polycule with Joe and Dorothy. I also don’t think she’s ruled it out and under these circumstances, that’s information I think she should share with Dorothy before moving on.
(Ideally before breaking her up with Walky, but hey)
Joe is irrelevant? Joe is the only character that matters. That’s why, whenever he’s not onscreen, everyone’s always asking “What about Joe?” You can’t expect some mere queer women to compare to the importance of Joe. /s
No you see. Joyce and Dorothy are the only characters that matter. At all. Any other character shown on screen in any capacity is incidental and completely unimportant until Joyce and Dorothy are on screen doing anything. Joyce isn’t the main character. She’s the only character and all other characters cease to exist when they stop sharing screen space with Joyce.
Joyce is Okay, I Guess™. She’s no Ruth.
I mean…yeah, do you remember what new relationship energy is like? it’s exactly like that thing you just said
Joyce did break up with Joe. She told him that she went there to break up with him. She told him why. She does not need Joe’s agreement to have broken up with him. He does not have some kind of veto. She only needs her decision, which she made and told him about.
Joe then making a counter offer that Joyce has not agreed to does not change that! She hasn’t rejected this other offer, having got the “oh my god this photo is everywhere for real” realisation and then run away saying they’d talk later (WHICH IS IN NO WAY AN AGREEMENT TO HIS PROPOSITION), but she hasn’t accepted it either.
To me it’s felt very much like everyone on the UNETHICAL!!!1! side of this comments section has been assuming that he has a veto on this decision, that he hasn’t agreed they’ve broken up then they haven’t. NO. That is NOT HOW THIS WORKS.
Frankly, in this matter, what he thinks does not fucking matter, he does not get a veto on her leaving their relationship. She is not his to release.
And it has been really fucking grating on me.
It’s factually true that Joyce never outright agreed to stay dating Joe. If anything, I think there’s evidence to suggest she was against it in the moment, before she got distracted by the stupid photo and left the room. Being open to talking about it later doesn’t negate that her last explicit sentence to him in either direction was “I can’t date two people at the same time.”
I don’t personally give a shit if she does or doesn’t start fucking both of them, for the record.
its factually true, Joyce never told Dorothy she is broken up with joe, either.
and the last time she was supposed to she blew him instead.
Joyce actually might have a hard time with setting boundaries and barriers around love. Oddly for Conservative Christian, she seems to act out there are no rules and boundaries for Love. Not for the central character and her friends.
I am someone else who was raised conservative Christian, and the explicit instructions are to love without border (except all those borders they don’t spell out, that you’re just supposed to pick up from people’s general attitudes, and not from the scriptures). It doesn’t surprise me too much that Joyce struggles with that.
Pointless whataboutism in the chat, as usual.
“I can’t date two people at the same time.”
Just one person, then another. seesaw like. MWF, TThS.
“I can’t date two people at the same time.” Not until i get a bigger bed
We could start a Rutech Go-fund-me campaign for Joyce’s bigger bed..
You’re wrong! Joyce and Dorothy have committed a cardinal sin! Being in love at the expense of others, especially a man and/or possessive lesbian friend! Their lust for each other, pride in the fact they’ll be fucking, and sloth in not properly breaking up with their former paramours by signing official, notarized breakup contracts, filing them in triplicate with the state breakup authority, and also offering a drop of blood for the witches circle as part of the reconciliation pact standard in every breakup ritual means these two harlots are guilty and must pay for their love with deeply unsatisfying sex! Those are the rules, Dara!
Joyce is still with Joe! #JUSTICE4JOE
Becky’s feelings have been hurt!
Joyce and Dorothy cannot enjoy themselves being together and if they do…….CONSEQUENCES. MUST. BE. PAID……Like Joyce admitting she’s in a polycule after the fact and that this relationship has started under false pretenses. That should be real fun!😁
sloth or Avarice ?
Hmm, but it’s October, what if we unburied our gays, as a treat?
(Don’t trust zombie Mike, though. He’d probably use it to be an even bigger troll.)
But she didn’t reject it either. She didn’t react at all, not even by staring silently or anything. She suddenly remembered something else and ran away.
The situation is unclear, and clearing it up is going to be a whole arc of extra drama. It’s not like drama is a limited commodity that the Damnable rations for us.
The Damnable is a great title.
@Dara: That’s not what Chris Phoenix said was the issue. Joyce told Joe and said she was going to be kissing Dorothy more. She’s in the clear as far as Joe’s concerned. He’s got no veto or any right to complain (any more), just as you say.
The point is that he made the poly counter offer and Joyce is seriously considering that, it’s something Dorothy might want to know first. And there have been at least a few hints that Joyce is. That she doesn’t consider herself really broken up with Joe. That’s the remaining problem here.
If she just got distracted and hasn’t gotten back to him to reject the poly idea then it’s not a big deal, but if she wants to go for it, it’s something she needs to resolve with Dorothy.
I think Dara thinks Joyce isn’t at all interested in poly and is reacting accordingly.
I also think Dara is wrong, but.
That’s fine, but whatever Dara thinks about what Joyce thinks, it’s got nothing to do with the post she was responding to.
There’s been a lot of this on this topic today, but most of it was more general. This was a particularly good example, since it was a direct reply.
At the risk of reducing things to a binary again, I’m seeing a lot of:
“Joyce doesn’t seem sure she’s really broken up with Joe. Dorothy might have a problem with that, especially if Joyce does decide she wants to try poly.”
and:
“Joe doesn’t get a veto. They’re broken up. Joyce isn’t cheating on him.”
They’re completely different conversations.
The fact that they are broken up and we saw that occur has relevance to both conversations.
First, I’m not entirely convinced Joyce thinks they’re broken up.
Second, yeah, it’s relevant to both, but not to the point where the second version is a meaningful response to the first.
Of course it’s relevant. If you’re someone who thinks Joe was unambiguously broken up with, then of course you’re going to argue with other people claiming he wasn’t and that Joyce owes him another conversation.
@Dara
So many truths there.
“hanky-pankying while Joyce is still with Joe might be something Dorothy wouldn’t want to do if she knew.”
it didnt bother her at all before.
I think Joyce slips up and bangs Joe again.
and ill laugh at the people who will cheer, currently hiding behind relationship paladin,
and vice versa.
all the shippers cosplaying Virtue Mother
As something of a paladin, I hope she does. Let’s get some actual cheating mess going here.
It’s only an issue if Joyce chooses to actively continue things with Joe, without speaking to Dorothy about it beforehand. (Not that she was all that upset the last time, but she’d probably be annoyed if it happened again.)
Blowjobs and washing machines dont count ?
…Unless a ‘world according to Garp’ scenario happens.
dont even know how that happens with a washing machine
Maybe if the washing machine was previously repaired by an illegal underground technician… Wait, no, that’d be a ‘Brazil’ scenario.
Offhand; Blowjobs and Washing machines seems like the title to some smut romance book that you’ve never heard of but somehow is like a 5 time best seller.
+++
I know. I just didn’t wanna go in the Permanent Discussion of “is this evil or not??” the comment’s section has every time they come into view, ye of little faith.
(… Which. Alright, yeah, I shall take umbrage against this slight against my person while still acknowledging that you’ve been given PLENTY OF REASON to no have said faith, holy shit it gets so tiring.)
That panky isn’t gonna hank itself!
At this point, I’ll believe Joyce is going to DO IT when I see her and Dorothy in a post-coital snuggle.
So what are the odds that a furious Dina is already in there with them.
Can she really be mad Joyce didnt steal her Girlfriend ?
or turned her Atheist.
This is it. The best comment. Thank you.
Yeah I’m firmly on Team What the Fuck Would Dina Have to be Pissed At Them For??
We’re taking suggestions for catchier names.
You get everything handed to You,
First you coopt gettting an autism diagnosis, Just by usual Bible thumping
Next You Bring my girlfriend to Atheism, after I did ALL the work!
( cuts open Pillow, dumps feathers on Joyce )
HeRE, Now you are the Dinosaur girl, Take it all …RAWR
HOMPK
Maybe she’s in the room because she wants some answers to her questions. Not because she’s pissed, but because she wants to confirm her hypotheses.
Low, but never zero.
I’m up for Riley eating cereal…
You and me baby ain’t nothin’ but mammals
So let’s do it like they do on the Discovery Channel
This resonates with me so much. “We’re actually doing this” is such a human thing to say about sex and it was basically my first time.
that is so not happening lol
Those sure are two people preparing to have sex, yup
Kind of hard to remove jeans in bed.
Even more off someone else
Even more off someone else in the top bunk
No prob. Unzip first; lift and shuck the hips second; raise feet and pull the legs last.
And removing from a partner is mostly the same except for you have an extra pair of hands. They do the worm while you pull their cocoon off.
I’m a normal person who just said a normal thing.
I wanna fuck you like an animal?
I wanna feel you,
from the the inside
of these covers, baby its cold outside
Excellent mashup. Five of five.
The rules of Vaudeville say this much activity on stage is usually means somebody is about to get a cream pie in the face.
Actually, the rules of pron say the same thing.
I’m betting on pie.
I hope they have a great time 🙂
Will this happen, or will Joyce choke like she did with Joe?
While choking does happen sometimes with fellatio, it’s far less common with cunnilingus.
Willis saw Ao3’s love of “enemies to lovers, slow burn, modern AU” and said, “hold my beer.” 15 years was one hell of a slow burn.
Remind me, when were Dorothy and Joyce enemies?
I mean, the Walkyverse. But that would make this more like 25 years of slow burn.
Most animals don’t wear shoes
But most shoes are worn by animals. Checkmate, atheist.
I would put forward that, between shoes that have been made but not yet bought, people owning multiple shoes but typically only wearing, at most, one pair at a time, most people not wearing their shoes 24/7 (certainly not while bathing, usually not while sleeping, many not at all while at home), and shoes that have been thrown away sitting in landfills, it is just as likely if not moreso that most shoes at any given moment are unworn.
Story solution idea:
The do the deed. But both have no clue what they are doing, they get weirded out because it doesnt feel good …. and give up.
I´ve had a hookup plike that once – sparkles galore, super sympatico, been flirting for weeks – and when we finally got under the covers, there simply was no there there.
Probably gonna get me some flak from the shippers, and accusations of queer erasure.
But it would resolve the story in a surprising, believable and non-explosy way.
As someone who does enjoy the Joyce x Dorothy even at the expense of others characters being sad about it, I would find the potential for their first sexual experience together to be disappointing to be interesting, maybe even expected. And them working through that could be a compelling story. What spoils that for me is certain demands that they need to have bad sex as a sort of karmic punishment for the characters they’ve hurt by choosing to be a couple. It adds a spiteful tinge that sort of ruins that potential developer.
Not what I intended to say.
But then I really cant even fathom people viewing the world through a lens of karma or cosmic justice.
Thats sadly not how the world works, in my eyes.
Horrible folks often die old, rich and content in their belief that they have lived “right”.
While most folks I would consider “good” torture themselves with second-guessing, regret for mistakes and doubt until their dying breath.
Being self-aware and willing to course-correct has its drawbacks.
Don’t worry. You’ve articulated your thought well. It is a good idea. An interesting development at least. It’s just a sub section of comments that have been against Joyce and Dorothy as a couple because of the grief that it has caused find any reason they should be unhappy and bad sex is the most recent agenda.
It’s less karma and more that people just don’t want them together. I do like the idea in a bubble though. Joyce and Dorothy bad at sex is funny.
Most of all I thought it would be a way to “solve” the storyline that basically upends the weird tribalism that has gone on in the comments.
Also, yes, endless comedic and humanizing possibilities. This is at its heart a story about folks erring forward, after all.
But you are correct – those who want to tribalize will find a way to fit it into their respective triggerabilities.
Fortunately for all of us, that’s basically one guy (at least here).
(granted, I’ve suggested a couple of ways Joyce’s fundie programming could make this go really drama-heavy, but that’s not “karmic punishment” so much as it is “plausible follow-through on the setup”)
Sorry, two guys. I forgot about the one because their hate was bland and unfilling.
Milquetoast hate
That would definitely make for some great drama. Sometimes, when you’ve built something up in your head too much, the reality is disappointing. With how much Joyce tends to double down, I can see a LOT of ways to find some comedy in the moment or aftermath. Or maybe it becomes the cold shower that wakes them up to the things everyone keeps harping on in the comments, and now they have to face those things with the sobering reality that the sex isn’t even that good XD
Thats what I thought.
Could deflate the whole trench warfare drama in one storytelling swoop.
Has there ever been a sexual encounter in this strip that wasn’t unambiguously satisfying for all involved? Surely we are due for a disappointing time for *someone*.
With how smitten Willis obviously is with Dorothy and Joyce as a pairing, though, I find it unlikely that they’re gonna start here.
There’s been a few although seemingly only really framed as post sex regret. Joe didn’t seem in great spirits post Malaya and it’s hard to grade what Malaya got out of it either since it was all kind of a weird flex on owning the poors or unpopular or whatever the hookup was about. I also don’t think Sal and Jason really enjoyed their time with each other based on their post hookup animosity. Jason does apparently have a big dick though. Mike also didn’t seem fully pleased after banging Eric the finger guns guy, but Mike was always scowling so did he enjoy anything? All those seemed like sex was mostly for stress relief than any enjoyment in the act of it as far as I know. Without real slipshine insights it’s easy to see the emotional payoff over the sexual fulfillment. Maybe they’re also just young so energy and enthusiasm makes up for a lot.
Dorothy and Walky always seemed well-satisfied.
And while I dont remember BillieRuth talking much about their sex life – and I´m sure they dont either, given the amount of booze involved, they never complained.
Joe considered himself a pro doing good work, he had no complaints either (again, that I remember). At least not before his list wnt public.
Danny left neither Amazigirl nor more recently Sal lacking, or at least they didnt say.
Now – I´m not reading slipshine, nor did I manage to tackle shortpacked. But I struggle to imagine how you came to your conclusion.
Aww, shite…. sorry.
You wrote “wasn´t unambiguouslysatisfying”, I misread. The opposite.
Ashes on my head
Dumbing of Age Book 16: Get On My Bed!
Dumbing of Age Book 16: Definitely On The Lift Hill To Hanky-Panky.
Question, has Joyce actually expressed sexual attraction to cis-female anatomy? Like I know she’s romantically into Dorothy, and likes kissing but has she ever expressed viewing a fem-presenting person as hot? Because I remember her getting turned on by Joe but can’t remember if she ever got physically turned on by Dorothy or just romantically.
Joyce being bi-romantic but only sexually attracted to male presenting bodies could be a whole wrinkle for things to go through.
She has expressed that boobs are in fact rad (not quite in those words) at the very least.
Most of the times she expressed sexual attraction to Joe, it was by denying it: “I don’t want to …”
She’s certainly been blushing up and lip biting thinking/talking about sex with Dorothy.
I did suspect the heterosexual/biromantic thing for awhile, but I’m pretty sure now that’s not where this is going.
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-3/03-answers-in-hennessy/curiosity/
Joyce’s first reactions to Billie and Sal both read gay as hell to me, even if Joyce lacked awareness at the time. She decides she has to befriend them on the spot, but it’s very puppy love, crush at first sight kind of behavior. We’ve just been seeing how Joyce acts for so long that we’re sorta desensitized to it.
The course of true love never did run smooth. . Especially here. Expect something /someone to get in the way. They are destined to be together but DYW is destined to make this take much longer. I wouldn’t be surprised if Sarah appears and asks about Joe. That would open a whole can of worms when Joyce stutters out the truth.
Still not telling Dorothy you’re still dating Joe, eh Joyce?
She’s not still dating Joe.
Does Joe know that? Does Joyce? Seems a little bit ambiguous to me.
I continue to feel like this storyline is weird/rushed/taking over, but I’ve trusted Willis for decades now so I’m willing to stick around for the ride.
I also feel this one will read a lot better in collected format, rather than day to do. It will feel way more “consequences AND kissing” instead of the OR of today… probably.
It’s about damned time…
I swear if somebody interrupts them, I’m gonna be almost as pissed as they will be.
I’m curious if Joyce will have the same doubts and second thoughts here as she did with Joe.
Can I just say. I am SO sick of the trend of people referring to Joe as “A man”. As if that’s all he is. Just some guy. A dude. The physical representation of masculinity. And not like…a fully fleshed out person that we’ve seen grow and some of us have formed a connection to.
Like I get being way into sapphic romance and wanting to enjoy it and a grody “man” is getting in the way of the girl on girl but like…he’s a full character and person and like…I care about him? Not BECAUSE he’s a man, but because I simply like him.
So contextually just imagine the same scenario but it’s Becky cheating on Dina with Joyce if that helps the context feel less “OH WHAT ABOUT A MAAAN?” cuz I’d be equally critical of that.
Fully signed on and endorsed.
I agree that there has been a lot of dehumanizing of Joe as a character, but I think that is in response to a lot of equal dehumanization of Joyce and Dorothy asa couple. Joe’s not even in this strip and hasn’t had an appearance for a little while now yet half the responses for days if not weeks of strips featuring Joyce and Dorothy being happy as a couple has been “What about Joe?” “Joyce never broke up with Joe.” That equally reduces them to not being seen as a couple but Joyce especially as only possessions of Joe and her happiness only mattering in how it effects him.
I think a lot of nuance in the discussion has been lost in favor of black and whiting the circumstance around both relationships (ironically Walky isn’t often considered a factor in any of this despite his breakup also being presented as debatably ambiguous) Either Joyce is still with Joe and thus cheating and lying and we should admonish her for it, or they are broken up and bringing up Joe all the time while two girls try to be in love is deeply insulting.
I think it’s probably not as big a deal as we’re all making it and we need to wait and see how things play out, but until then worrying about Joe or any character you like is totally fine. I think we all just need to chill sometimes and remember people are invested in characters and like them instead of reducing them to the worse generalizations to make an argument.
The reason people are talking about Joe so much is BECAUSE he hasn’t appeared in a long time. If we were getting regular updates on the dude maybe people wouldn’t be so concerned about him.
I’m less concerned about Walky cuz he got that heart to heart with Jennifer. As far as I know Joe’s standing in the same spot of his room frozen in time waiting for the love of his life to follow up with him. And that’s really frustrating cuz the story, the comic and the author have made it clear they don’t care about him.
And I KINDA CARE A LOT ABOUT HIM.
Also, while Dorothy had trouble telling Walky and Joyce was petty and cruel about doing it for her, it’s pretty clearly resolved. There wasn’t an offer of poly on the table. Dorothy hasn’t shown the same kinds of hints she might not really be done with him that Joyce has shown for Joe.
“Joe’s not even in this strip and hasn’t had an appearance for a little while now yet half the responses for days if not weeks of strips featuring Joyce and Dorothy being happy as a couple has been “What about Joe?””
Yeah, you’d swear there was something unresolved between Joe and at least one of these horny idiots.
Clearly not, I don’t have any idea where people keep getting this idea from…
What are you talking about, Joyce definitely absolutely 100% unambiguously broke up with Joe and you’re a crazy person for suggesting that there’s anything unresolved or uncertain about their situation.
Dot, it’s not nice to call people crazy.
It is, however, accurate.
Oh, please. Name five crazy people in this comments section, then.
Me, myself, yotomoe, I, and We (the Royal we)
I was gonna say, now that I’m here we’ve got almost five just in this thread.
We know who we are
Just call me, next time
All the interesting people are at least a little crazy.
@Sirksome: I’m sure there are some talking about that, but the vast majority of comments about Joyce maybe not having broken it off with Joe are not about her cheating and lying because she’s still his possession.
She’s talked to him and made it clear she’s going forward with Dorothy. The only question is whether it’s going to be just her and Dorothy or whether there’s room for him in some kind of poly arrangement. Either way she’s not cheating on him. He’s aware and has essentially given his approval.
What most people are saying is that if she hasn’t ruled out the poly idea she should talk to Dorothy about it soon, preferably before the sex, because Dorothy might not be comfortable with Joyce still wanting to be with Joe.
I can’t believe this is a hot take, but if you remove the “prelude to an inevitable polycule” glasses, and the “Joyce is an evil demon who can do no right” glasses and actually listen to what she said in her last conversation with Joe, she broke up with him. She said that’s what she was doing, she made it absolutely clear that she chose Dorothy, and she as clearly as humanly possible said that she has no intention of dating two people at the same time. She’s neurotic enough to have guilt that she didn’t do so with the maximum possible degree of clarity, but it still happened.
Yes, Joe made a proposal to resume their relationship under different terms, and yes Joyce was interrupted before she could fully explain her “no”, but that doesn’t matter because she needed to explicitly say yes. If she has changed her mind and now intends to accept Joe’s proposal, she absolutely needed to discuss that with Dorothy. But if she still has no interest in dating two people at once, all she needs to do with finish her explanation with Joe as a courtesy to someone she presumably would like to remain friends with.
This is imo an inaccurate reading of that conversation. Joyce did not say she wasn’t interested in dating two people at once. She said she COULDN’T, with “I’m not a hussy” as an excuse. And like that’s a completely normal kneejerk reaction for a former evangelical who has never seriously considered the possibility that she may be polyamorous before.
Like idk the fact that the conversation didn’t actually reach a conclusion would indicate to me that it’s a thread that’s gonna get picked back up? If Willis had intended that to a be an actual breakup scene there are clearer ways to accomplish that.
What makes it ambiguous to me is the strip in the newspaper office. Dorothy declares EX boyfriend and Joyce makes a little face/sound instead of doing nothing or nodding.
That definitely makes me think Joyce is at least tempted by the idea.
And just narratively speaking, I can’t see this as a plotline that’s been raised to just be shot down next time Joyce talks to Joe.
@MadContra: But you’re basically right at the end there. I think she left it hanging more than you do and I definitely think she’s tempted by the prospect, but if she chooses not to then while she shouldn’t put it off for too long, she just needs to finish that conversation and be done with it. No need to wait on having sex with Dorothy.
If she does want to accept it or even is still struggling about it, then I think she should talk to Dorothy before going any further.
But you know, people make bad decisions all the time. That’s where the drama comes from.
A) Pretty sure Joyce is WAY more into this than Dorothy is. I think Dorothy really loves Joyce, but not sure she’s actually that…um…physically…into it.
B) How can we pay attention to the cute sapphic shenanigans when we still don’t know if Walky is alive or not? Jennifer could be busy hiding a body a little ways away!
A) Literally every time Joyce shows sexual interest in someone this comment gets made. Maybe she’s just more extroverted about it than her partners.
B) There’s a Jennifer’s Body joke in there somewhere, I just know it.
This is true, but both Dorothy and Joe were much more open and enthusiastic about sex with previous partners than with Joyce. We know that Joe didn’t trust himself very much to go all-in on being sexually intimate with Joyce, but I think it is kind of interesting that Dorothy is showing a similar kind of trepidation with her when she never really did with Walky! I wonder what to attibute it to: nervousness about it being her first time with a girl? A larger anxiety about the relationship? Idk, it’s been an interesting dynamic that Dorothy has been a bit more cautious in general so far while Joyce has been eager to just plow ahead, and I hope it gets some focus. I think OP is definitely off-base about Dorothy being into Joyce, she obviously does wanna get in there.
I agree it’d be interesting to get some light on both their feelings about this (and we probably will). I wonder if Dorothy’s going through that common thing with baby gays where they don’t know how their attraction/position in the relationship is “supposed to” fit in because they’re still thinking in heteronormative structures. Or maybe she’s just nervous! Or maybe it’s guilt from the ‘cheating’. Be interesting to see how it goes, but I also agree that she’s DEFINITELY into it. Just trepidatious.
She went from fully realizing her attraction to her best friend to dating and fucking her in what, two, three days? That’s enough to throw anyone for a loop, and to a certain extent it might still feel not real to her. I think it’s probably a soup of that plus some of the other stuff you mentioned. Obviously I’m in the minority here but I’m wayyyy more interested in getting into the meat of all that than I am seeing these two still being cute with each other, haha.
I’m probably equally interested in both. I like the cute shit, but I’m very ready for a serious look at everything between them. The emotional depth is basically always what I’m craving, and I’m not picky which emotion it is.
Bonus: Dorothy is a perfectionist attempting something she’s never done before AND afraid of hurting Joyce. I feel like her anxieties about having sex with Joyce are probably not entirely dissimilar to Joe’s anxieties.
Meanwhile Joyce has clearly put all of this into terms of “this is the first person who ever helped me orgasm, I trust her so much, our love is pure and true, obviously this will be perfect”.
I really need Joyce’s attitude towards “true love” to be genuinely challenged and pushed back upon because it’s easily her least flattering trait, haha.
It’s as if people forget that, huh, one of them spent her entire life being told that she can’t do any of that until she marries some dude and wants to start having kids and hasn’t experienced any of this until like a week ago, and it’s brand spanking new.
Of COURSE Joyce is more into this than Dorothy is. At this very moment, Joyce is more of a sex enthusiast than a room full of Rozes, Joes, and Daisys. Daisies? Whichever.
Daisiae. Daisiarum, Daisiis, Daisias, Daisiis.
Thanks for the Latin flashback — 1st declension feminine plural
Look, just because they’re queer doesn’t mean they can’t consent without an elaborate musical number. There’s such a a thing as subtle excitement, and women are capable of consent.
Wait we’re allowed to consent without elaborate musical numbers? Then wtf have I been learning all this choreography for? I was supposed to be off-book by the weekend!!
I mean, the skills are still applicable, so you’re at least at a slight advantage now.
Fiiiine I’ll put it on my resume.
One possibility the other comments above me didn’t bring up is the potential of Dorothy being romantically attracted but not sexually attracted. I’ve personally known several bi/pan people for whom this is true for some genders.
Another potential is she’s in overthinking things mode and contemplating the potential of how adding a sexual or romantic dynamic may alter their friendship and/or how these events may affect/be affecting those around them (Becky for example).
People have brought that up as a possibility for both of them, repeatedly, for months.
The only way to salvage this inverse trainwreck is for one or both of these idiots to have a stark negative reaction to what having sex with another woman is going to entail and one or both of them realising they’re nowhere near as gay as they thought.
Because that’d be real fuckin’ funny, and it’d be very on brand for horny idiots figuring themselves out to have made complete asses of themselves and hurt other people on the process.
I can’t believe this is really happening! Love take-charge Joyce. She’s got no doubts or uncertainties about this, and it’s wonderful to see.
“no, that is my job”
she’s so serious <3
This is my favorite line in a while!
I still don’t believe this is going to happen – yet.
I give it at least another week of “oooh, they’re right about to do it~ here it comes~”
Joyce discovers, now that you know sex is really amazing and it means what you want it to mean, get ready for INDULGING!
Joyce rings a few bells at this moment.
Speaking from experience, there’s a point where a person has just gone through so much of “Everything I ever knew is false”, that the constant hesitation gives way to assertive momentum. Truth becomes vital, trust in self grows, ability to drop the old and embrace the knew accelerates, and then, the ability to see cracks develops. You’ve broken through so much falsehood that you see the cracks. You see them everywhere. You know how much about you is fabricated at a glance. Lies cannot hold you. You become a truth-seer by your very nature.
Gay people. Apostates. Transgender people. Heretics. Philosophers that have been forced into paradigm shift after paradigm shift. Non-Euclidian Mathmaticians. Quantum physicists.
All have been forced, repeatedly, to abandon the known and learn to see the previously unknown.
They become super heroes of truth.
And this is why liars fear them.
“Those who claim for themselves to judge the truth are bound to possess a criterion of truth. This criterion, then, either is without a judge’s approval or has been approved. But if it is in no way approved, whence comes it that it is trustworthy? For no matter of dispute is to be trusted without judging. And, if it has been approved, that which approves it, in turn, either has been approved or has not been approved, and so on ad infinitum” Sextus Empiricus
Eternal existential relearning and unlearning is all there could be. Written on and wrestled with as true as early as 455BC this is not new just not currently in vogue to discuses how even the “rightest” amongst us are only echo’s of every untruth and some smattering of truth the perspective they hold reveals.
Dorothy: “That was amazing!”
Joyce: “It sure was! BTW, I-did-not-fully-break-up-with-Joe-and-am-considering-dating-you-both-at-the-same-time-but-I-really-wanted-to-have-sex-before-telling-you.”
Dorothy: “. . . ”
Dorothy: “WHAT???!!!”
the way you’d undress her better be worth it, if not flawless
Still just animal
Always animal
Can’t find it again, but thanks to the people who mentioned Karma. This adds another dimension to my puzzlement over views expressed that J&D need to be ‘punished’, which had seemed rather fundie to me. Now I can add that there are also people who ‘believe’? that life in general should ‘punish’ people for doing things that only some people have defined as ‘bad’.
I still cannot fathom why people would think that was, but at least it expands the reasons.
Anyone who does think that way care to politely engage with the why part?
Oops “why people would think that”, no ‘was’
I don’t think it’s so much that people think that life, generally, should punish bad behavior, but I don’t think it’s unreasonable for people to feel as though it’s more narratively satisfying for bad behavior to be punished *narratively*. We like seeing people who have behaved cruelly, selfishly, or callously to get some comeuppance in stories. Of course, the extent to which Joyce and Dorothy have engaged in bad behavior is subjective, and when I refer to consequences I’m talking about Joe or Walky being upset and angry over being cheated on and tension being introduced into the friend group rather than anything particularly karmic, but I think when people talk about them suffering consequences or being punished, that’s most commonly the perspective people are coming from.
Well, that is an interesting extra take. Yes, I can see that people might want narrative karma, and that is different. So thanks for that. And I can see that Big Z agrees.
I’m less sure that “when people talk about … that’s most commonly the perspective people are coming from.” Notwithstanding Big Z agrees (and it could be the case) this isn’t how people have phrased it, for the most part. I’d be interested to know why you think this.
I’m with Dot here, in that the real world is (somewhat obviously) random, unjust, capricious, and cruel; thus, I understand the impulse for someone to enjoy a fantasy story wherein bad behavior ALWAYS ends up rebounding onto the malefactor in some karma-appropriate way.
This PARTICULAR situation is highly exacerbated by the high amount of variance in how people respond to cheating and cheating-adjacent scenarios (which IMHO is almost entirely determined by one’s reactions to personal experience) coupled with a high amount of variance for people’s experience of the problems of coming out, comphet, bi-erasure, (to name a few things people have mentioned in the threads) and all of the associated potential traumas of being LGBTQ+ in the modern era.
To rephrase, perhaps, the impulse to want stories that end with karmic justice is understandable, but hard to accurately calibrate where everyone’s perception of the amount of “justice” required is so highly dependent on one’s personal experiences and/or traumas that, in this particular case, “karmic justice” is on a range from “the ladies get to be gay with no worries forever because the gays deserve to be happy” to “cheating is ALWAYS heartbreaking and terrible, and anyone who perpetrates it is basically Satan”.
And to: what cheating…?
I think another thing about this arc is that i have never experienceexperienced this ‘New Relationship Energy’ to anywhere *near* the degree being portrayed. (And with the sheer number of people calling it relatable, i have to assume its not *that* exaggerated.)
Which is another think making the arc feel weird to me. Intellectually I understand People are different, but part of me still thinks they’re acting like aliens lmao
Fucking keyboard
I’ve said it before, but I HAVE experienced severe NRE, and I’ve never had it bad enough to make THIS level of oddball decisions.
where doing it man.
where MAKING THIS HAPEN
THIS IS GLORIOUS GLORIOUS I MEAN GLORIOUS OH MY GOOOOOOOOOOOOD JHXTYGFGGUGFJH