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better to come out eventually but at least it’s better to be ‘guided’/suggested rather than “actually i’m still into dorothy/someone else but she wasn’t available and you were”
–well okay, not quite as much as Danny, who doesn’t even want to have two crushes at the same time. But still! It would be OK to go chill a minute and catch up with himself.
I disagree. Lucy was primed to find the disastrous possibilities in interpreting anything he might say. He is, at last, talking seriously about something that is a wedge between them. There’s going to be some hard words said, and some hurt feelings. It’s unavoidable. They need to struggle to a common understanding.
This won’t resonate with some people here but I’m going to say it…this is not Walkys fault.
He came into this relationship looking to do this right and take his time, but it was starting to go south when Lucy sprung the premature “I love yous,” even walky knew this might be an issue. So what what did Walky do to avoid making a mistake and screwing up? He went to go get advice from the most mature and responsible person he knew, only for said person to decide make the worse possible advice imaginable which he still trusted.
Lol. I don’t think we need to turn this into some 4D chess move from Dotty. She gave bad advice that actually worked against her in the short term because she actually wanted to get back together with him. It wasn’t to plant seeds of discord, she can be just as dumb as anyone else sometimes.
Well, it’s Dumbing of Age and everyone does stupid things, to a greater or lesser extent depending on which character it is, but it’s already intriguing what Walky says tomorrow.
Ohhhh Žižek time! Paraphrased: Conspiracy theories are just what they (institutional powers) want you to believe, because it helps maintain their illusion of power and distracts from the real problems of structural inequality etc. that they contribute to maintaining.
To a point. But at some point the stupidity is negligent and/or wilful, and is turning a blind eye, operating on unexamined instincts, and opting not to learn better, any less evil than doing things in full intentional cognisance?
Sure, that’s just the sort of thing that’s uppermost in my mind when my whole world is unravelling and I’m sacrificing my own happiness for the good of someone I care about even though it’s twisting a knife in my gut to do so.
Yup. The big difference between “Good + Stupid” and “Evil + Stupid” is that G/S sometimes just does evil things by mistake, but at least tries to correct/counteract that evil once it happens. E/S, meanwhile, just does evil, the only difference being whether or not that evil actually advances their own goals. Raidah is a good example of the latter–a good bit of her own plotting is just getting in her own way, in terms of social climbing, but it’s still born from malevolent impulses.
It’s nobody’s fault, but Walky sure chose the worst possible time to bring Dorothy into this conversation… tho I’ll admit when i was his age i probably could’ve made a similar error
Is it really an error, though? He basically seems to be putting all the cards on the table right now. If Lucy subsequently decides to just flip the table entirely and walk away, well… better for both of them, in the long run.
yeah personally when these types of things start to spiral, i find it best to just do exactly what walky did and explain very honestly how it happened. if someone responds to that with more misinterpretation, that’s their bad
Ok, try to play the empathy game here. Imagine you’re dating someone you’re in love with and under the assumption they love you back. Through casual conversation you suddenly find out they don’t. In the first minutes of trying to even process this information, they defensively inform you that the reason you were dating to begin with is cause their ex told them to date you. Its a lot to take all at once, man! That’s humiliation on top of heartbreak! If Walky was more sensitive, he could have realized it was time to stop talking after panel 2.
Like i said, when i was 18-19, i probably wouldn’t have done much better and blurted it all out once
It may hurt but better to rip that bandaid off now than use kid gloves to further lead on Lucy. And someone being honest, even if it’s painful, doesn’t mean they lack empathy.
I get what you mean but “I don’t love you and i never did” means the bandaid is already off. Walky is a grown ass man, he chose to date lucy and he chose to kick the love can down the road. Working in Dorothy’s role is just rubbing in salt
But what he actually said was “I don’t love you and never did. It’s too early for that to be a possibility! But I have every reason to believe our relationship will grow until I do” with an implied “so I didn’t want to hurt your feelings by correcting your misunderstanding when we were literally on the same page but separated by a bit of time” looping back to a stated “and I had this plan of action stamped and approved by an official Smart Person who Understands Feels and Relationships” with an implied “so you can’t be mad at me here!! I do not understand why you being mad at me appears to be on the table!”
I agree. He’s been trying to do right by Lucy, he likes spending time with her enough that he does it a lot if not constantly. That he’s not in love after one week of being a couple is not a personal failing, nor is not being in love before they started dating, nor is the fact that someone he trusted gave him bad advice. Particularly when he was specifically asking for advice because he had no idea and would therefore be unable to identify bad asvuce.
This is a sad and inevitable fight, and I don’t really think either is being particularly shitty.
Nah Lucy is being shitty.
She creating a public fight on purpose, being a drama queen, when shes knows how much walky hates public conflict.
Shes pretending she didnt know Dorothy set them up so she can fight about it.
Shes Pretending shes didnt know in the first place walky didnt say “I love you” and she did it to exagerate in public.
shes using this moment to fight in public over walkys mother when she refused to do it in private. and walky had minimal sleep so he can go to church with her.
Walky already chose her mutiple times, but shes insecure and sabotaging their relationship.
and a bunch of people have stepped on her feelings this week ( Sal, Billy, sarah, Linda ) and got under her skin. Rather than talk about this with walky shes acted out, assuming or demanding public performance of affection.
don’t agree with every sentiment here but I 100% agree that Lucy willfully misinterpreted what Walky said. like ain’t no way she misheard him, she straight up made the conclusions she wanted to regardless what the words actually meant.
Why is there no way she misheard him? Even just the bias of wanting something really badly can lead to faulty perception, and people are already predisposed to perceiving what corresponds with their biases. I don’t see any reason to believe she doesn’t genuinely think he said he loves her. She’s obviously wrong, but what can be incredibly obvious to us is a lot less obvious to anyone in the strip.
I think this is incredibly uncharitable to Lucy. I see no reason to assume malice here. She’s been operating on a bad assumption and she’s built a whole house (of cards) on it and now the foundation is being ripped out. And I don’t think there’s any evidence that we’ve seen (and we’ve seen more than any individual character) that she knows the things she’d be required to know to be pretending what you say she’s pretending.
And keep in mind this is her first real relationship, so it probably feels like her entire world is ending. And on top of that she hasn’t had much opportunity to learn healthy ways of dealing with the many problems she’s gotten piled onto her.
I mean, not all bad things are someone’s fault! Sometimes neither side was communicating very well, even though they had the best intentions.
Sometimes a tree falls on someone and kills them. Sometimes a tree falls on a terrible, terrible person and doesn’t kill them.
I’m assuming either Texas or Florida, cuz i remember a tree falling on some d-bag high up GOP’s car in one of the states, i just forget which. but it was either Rafael’s car or Matt’s car
I remember saying something similar in the Halloween arc, that Amber and Walky’s fight wasn’t anyone’s fault, they just had incompatible coping mechanisms–Amber needed to think about Mike more and Walky needed to be distracted from the trauma. Lucy and Walky have looked like a doomed couple since their inception. They’re both trying their best but some things are too innate to be fixed
The state of palm and your town is named “Face”?
I feel like I should come up with a better pun but I got allergy shots today and benadryl is messing with me.
I think where he tripped up slightly was that he didn’t make sure Dorothy was in the right headspace to be giving advice to her ex about relationship issues; he just trusted that she was okay, because she’s Dorothy.
Though I think Walky could have gone to other people to also talk about this… most of his friend group aren’t great about relationship issues either. Maybe Sal?
Walky has Dotty as the main option and let’s be honest, I don’t think she would ever consider the others as options, with Sal I dare say that I never ask her for fear of saying something that will really upset her.
Very well worded. I’d go a step further in that I wouldn’t even necessarily say it was the worst advice possible for Dorothy to give. Not the best advice for any long-term relationship, sure, but they’re young kids in college, not adults settling down with their marriage partners. Suggesting he just let it go when there was a solid chance he’d feel it down the road as the relationship developed was fine enough advice for a college relationship…at least up until the point where taking things to the “next level” became a thing given that then it flirts with it being under false pretenses.
Oh Lucy! I agree that Walky has been honest and well-meaning. But clueless haha. Lucy is just not grounded enough to have a relationship with anyone. This relationship breaking up now is a blessing in disguise for them both, I hope Lucy won’t stuff it all back in and pretend everything is fine just to be a girl with a boyfriend.
Well no, Lucy needs to have relationship experiences like this to ground her, she is not gonna learn where her blind spots are without getting behind the wheel, so to speak. This is blowing up but it will be necessary for growth on both their parts.
All the love stuff aside it’s probably still a big gut punch revelation for Lucy. She’s had to deal with Walky’s mom tell her she’s not the “right(white)” type of girl for him and then she learns that the girl that his mom would like told him to go out with her and he’d eventually grow into the relationship.
From her position it would definitely reek of Walky is dating a black woman because he thinks he’s supposed to to counter his mom. Which is at least partially true since he’s still feeling guilty over how his mom treats Sal
This exactly. His issue was trying to go along with her view of things when he knew she didn’t have a realistic view on his feelings or investment. It was well intentioned and to minimise conflict and try to give the potential relationship a proper try, but it was still lying by omission at every occasion that he clocked a disparity in how she saw him vs how he saw her.
The next bit is as an aside, not directly related to your comment, just a tangent.
People say they’re teenagers, this isn’t marriage, but it remains often the case that people you date at university end up being people you marry or at least spend several years with beyond college. In many cultures and in earlier eras in places like the US and UK, women saw college as a means to meet men to marry. I’ve gone back to school recently and I still see that impression among much of the youth attending school with me, I think we infantilize young adults pretty significantly in the last 10 years especially. Considering many people have their first live in partner by the time they leave undergrad, between 22 and 25, why is it weird for two university students to approach dating with longer term prospects in mind? All of the parents in the comic so far have been evaluating romantic partners in terms of suitability as life partners.
I agree that it’s not weird to view college-age dating as having long-term prospects and going in with that in mind.
I think a week is maybe a touch premature to have expectations that a specific relationship is already on its way there. But also this is a very reasonable mistake to make in one’s first serious relationship.
Sure but I don’t think it’s unusual to assume you’ve reached “I love you” territory with someone you’ve had a crush on for four months, even if the actual dating time has been a week, and “I love you” isn’t marriage. She’s shown clear awareness of social norms for relationships, but her read with deference to those has always been misaligned to Walky’s. In fairness, I do also think Walky has been operating half in the notion that this could be his Big Relationship that lasts through uni, which is why he tried to sober her expectations of spending time with his parents, and why he is going through this effort with church and things. She is trying to move faster than his feelings are, but also she’s moving as fast as she perceives him moving – saying he “loves” her, introducing her to his parents, joining her for church, she’s reading all of this preferentially as signs of his long term interest in her. We’ve seen other characters fall into relationships with what would clearly be construed as some form of romantic love fuelling the dynamic, it’s just that it hasn’t been mutual here.
The time frame comes off as disingenuous because others have gotten more invested than Wally is in Lucy in shorter time, including Walky himself with Dorothy. Lucy isn’t a girl he met off of Tinder, he’s known her for months.
I’m not saying Lucy’s feelings are premature, her expectations are. I’m very much of the opinion that she heard what she wanted to hear in terms of the “I love you” that didn’t actually happen, and she wanted it that badly because she was already there and really wanted him to be too.
I think the timeframe disparity is important, because it really has that gap between the two of them. I don’t think Walky really considered dating Lucy until it was suggested to him, and he thought that she was pretty cool and that could work, with long-term potential. And I think he made a choice to try to work in that direction, which I think is very emotionally mature on the Walky Scale.
But Lucy never caught the possibility that the feelings development gap was there, not through fault of her own, but because she doesn’t have a lot of experience. I hope she’ll learn from this. More clear and explicit talk of where they are feelings-wise could have headed this off.
I support your take and mostly agree with you, but of the two parties one was aware of both their feelings and the other person’s and how they didn’t align, and that was Walky. He is not in the wrong for not returning her feelings, he’s probably not even in the wrong for trying to give her a chance, but everything he is revealing in this comic is because he was aware on some level that talking about these points with Lucy would upset her. This conversation is happening because Lucy’s finally starting to become aware that there’s an imbalance in feelings between them. Walky should have been honest, but also Lucy should have seen the many signs of reluctance in her previous efforts to assert her affections for him.
Gah, now I’m remembering the penultimate scene from The Graduate, with Ben swinging that 4′ metal cross from side to side like a sword to keep the crowd at a distance while backing out of the church.
I had the amazing fortune to perform it with the Philadelphia Orchestra, half a lifetime ago. An absolutely precious memory, to treasure always. Thank you for the gem of a reminiscence.
And just in case anyone is burning the midnight oil, as I am, or scrambling, as Walky is right now, here’s “Classical Music on a Deadline”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwY7w0k3j2Y
makes me wonder how his parents would react lol, even if they don’t like lucy as much as dorothy i’d think they’d react slightly diff to ‘she dumped me’ versus him ending the relatoinship
Not saying there’s a good way to handle this but “my ex told me to date you” is maybe the worst thing you could possibly say during this argument short of like confessing to murder
I feel like a lot of room for worse things that Walky could possibly say that have nothing to do with murder, except possible his upcoming murder by Lucy.
Whoa, manipulated into a relationship is a pretty tall order. She just was his friend and hoped he’d reciprocated feelings, it was third parties clocking her infatuation and recommending her as an option that led to him asking her out. She’s delusional about his feelings, but no moreso than the average teen getting into their first relationship with a crush they’ve had for months.
God I wanna read the comic you’ve been reading where Lucy is this genius, malicious, 4D playing villainess bc boy does it sound interesting, and completely different from this comic.
She crushed like a school girl for a few months while enjoying a friendship with him and then Dorothy told him to ask her out. If you can’t explain where this manipulation comes in, I’m gonna just chalk it up to (hopefully subconscious) misogynoir and move on
There’s no manipulation here, but you’re right that if she’d said something the relationship probably would have started much earlier and they’d have been closer to the same page. (Unless she said it too early, when he was still too messed up from the fallout from Amber and the kidnappings.)
It was the 70s and we were nerds. Every stat on the sheet, with the possible (possible) exception of Intelligence, was an attempt to model things we didn’t have.
There’s also persuasion and intimidation. Persuasion might actually fit better here. And charisma itself isn’t necessarily just for romancing it just represent how affable a person is in any given scenario. High charisma more accurately means you’re good at talking or have a positive reputation.
Those are still CHA-based in the editions I’ve played (4e had Diplomacy instead of Persuasion, but still CHA-based). I think there’s a good argument to be made for a WIS-based approach though, and I often take advantage of how 5e is structured in order to enable swapping attributes in skill checks.
I still don’t think we’ve figured out a perfect speech check system. Persuading someone is much harder to simulate in a game than hitting things with pointy sticks.
There are various social skills, mostly based on Charisma, but they get modifiers for the individual skills. It’s not all based on “rizz”, since that means something distinct, even if it does come from Charisma.
I’m not trying to actually analyze who is at fault here. I was trying to milk some humor out of Walky’s flub. I don’t blame Walky or Lucy for this falling out, but I will say you’re not giving Walky his credit in this. He also made choices that lead them both here.
Just to reiterate and expound on my reply to your comment above – Lucy isn’t manipulating because she doesn’t have the self awareness or social awareness to understand either her own headspace or Walky’s, or how they differ. She has been operating with the assumption that his innocuous exuberance and positivity are specifically love for her, this is extremely normal for teenagers with little or no romantic experience. She has excessive zeal and a very flat view of how things are meant to work, that will hopefully develop into something healthier after this confrontation.
Walky on the other hand, has complete awareness of both situations, but is trying to give Lucy what she wants, because he took Dorothy’s advice to heart. Walky is in the only position to properly manipulate here due to his objective understanding of where they both are emotionally, but he mainly has wanted to just be a good boyfriend to Lucy.
That’s a valid interpretation. My read was she genuinely misinterpreted him. Walky knew she misinterpreted him as he asked Dorothy for advice. Then he took her bad advice which caused it to blow up in his face.
I don’t think either as at fault really. Except naivety on both sides.
This is weird retconning absolutely did mishear him, we saw her reaction in the comic? We have seen subsequent similar instances where he says something innocuous and neutral and she takes it as a sign that he’s basically in it for life. That’s misinterpretation we literally see her internal monologue in these situations where she is like “omg he sees me as part of his family!!”
Maybe the disagreement here is over “hear”. If Lucy did not miss or garble any of the words Walky said (and I think that’s true), but extracted an understanding very different from the meaning that he was encoding in his words, is that mis-hearing or mis-perception? “Love” in contemporary English lies at the bottom of a deep well of multiple meanings and sloppy usage. That’s why I’ve become very careful of how I use that word, because it’s powerful.
Maybe, but Adam seems to be reading it as much more intentional thing – understanding what he meant, but using it to manipulate him, which I don’t see at all.
She did not mishear anything. Nothing in the comic illustrated that Lucy heard “I love you” when Walky said “I love that *about* you,”. I feel like if that had been the case, Willis would have shown that through the medium. Her reaction shows that she misinterpreted what he meant, and willfully. I’m not saying she did it with conscious malice, but she either does not understand that someone saying “love” in the vicinity of your name doesn’t mean they are IN LOVE with you, or she chose to interpret it how she wanted to.
That’s so weird to even suggest. You know what kind of social shit comes from saying “I love you too” if you knew the other person didn’t mean it that way? The secondhand cringe from that comic was legendary. She genuinely thought he meant that he loved her, that is in no way a manipulation. Yes, she wanted to hear “I love you” from that, but it was not some sort of “If I PRETEND he said he loved me that will make it true!” As evidenced by this whole in-comic exchange where she finally realised he wasn’t actually returning her affections. She even still thought he was then, until ostensibly the corrections in today’s strip, though time will tell on that front.
it’s prolly for the best they split up unless lucy goes unhinged and controlling like “I won’t *let* you break up with me” but i imagine walky would def run off at that point unless she goes full on stalker or so
Some hymns because they were about love and a lot of pop music from the 70s and the 90s. We had a lesbian couple on their 60s who played piano and guitar for us, too. The woman who played the guitar was trans, and she had transitioned during the 70s, so that was her favorite era of music
i mean, it’s not the ideal situation, but an ex being able to talk to you and suggest someone else is pretty mature otherwise (idk if Dorothy had any underlying motives but i don’t think it was anything malicious)
The issue starts when your relationship with your ex is better than with your S.O., and you drop that bomb in the middle of a spat
If he told her Before, clearing the air style, it would have strengthened their relationship. Lucy would know not to feel threatened by Dotty, and that she supports their relationship, as someone Walky trusts enough to give crucial life advice.
Doing it this way shows this was more about Walky and Dorothy(whatever label or lack thereof you want to put on the pair of ’em) than what’s good for Lucy.
This right here is exactly it. It hurts Lucy because he doesn’t talk to her about how he feels but he can talk to Dorothy, and she’s just learning now that actually no, he doesn’t love her, and he was conflicted because of that.
I mean I think what happened more recently, where she apologized for “pushing” him at Lucy and tried to get back together with him, was… LESS good, pff, and maybe Walky can make all of this much worse by bringing that up just as clumsily as he’s brought up the rest of this—
–but in the moment, yes. I think Dorothy tried to choose being a good friend to Walky over what she wanted herself. As terrible as most of the commentariat found the advice, I don’t think it came from a bad place, and I do think if Walky weren’t revealing all of this at once and making Lucy feel like he shares not only more with Dorothy in general but also this specific thing…
Like, think of it from Lucy’s perspective for a moment, as someone who barely knows Dorothy. Not only is this kind of her and Walky’s private personal business, it’s also probably pretty humiliating to imagine someone else in Walky’s social circle knowing he isn’t in love with her, while she continues on obliviously.
Especially for Lucy specifically, who has said things now and then that imply she doesn’t have a lot of friends in college and was bullied in high school. If you don’t know Dorothy, it’s pretty easy for this to mutate into a nightmare scenario in your head where people are laughing at you behind your back. People who used to date your boyfriend. :/
Dorothy did have underlying motives, iirc- avoiding the temptation of falling back in bed with Walky, and/or tying up loose ends were she to accept Yale.
She still has them on. Note her interpreting hanging out as retroactively dating. My money is on her accusing Dorothy of using walky to somehow Mean Girl her.
Well, IIRC, it seemed at the time that Dorothy had sought out Walky to suggest a booty call. Then she saw him and Lucy together, and, for whatever reason, decided not to go through with it and told Walky to ask Lucy out instead. I got the impression she was trying to be kind to them both.
I don’t think what she did then has any connection with her later attempt to get Walky to leave Lucy for her. One was considered and thoughtful, the other part of a severe downward spiral.
Nah, there were all sorts of hints that she was going to him to suggest getting back together, but then threw him at Lucy to keep herself from weakening.
Think we have had a misunderstanding because I am saying, I don’t think Dorothy gave Walky bad advice on purpose to sabotage his relationship with Lucy.
Okay, and ALSO I think she was also trying to do right by Walky, not JUST trying to stop herself from being tempted. I think Jennifer was not wholly wrong, but I think her interpretation was unkind.
My read is Lucy thinks that knowing someone for 4 months is long enough to fall in love even if youre not dating (which is true but obviously varies person to person). I think she’s just insulted Walky was in some way pushed to date her i.e. he wasn’t like “wow Lucy is awesome, I’m going to date her!” which yeah isn’t flattering from her perspective.
Yeah, I’m pretty sure she only brought up “it’s been four months” because Walky pretty directly said that she shouldn’t have said “I love you” to him because they’d only been dating a week, so she pushed back, to the tune of “yes but it’s not like I only met you a week ago”.
Less “how can you NOT be in love with me after four months”, more “c’mon, it’s not actually like I fell for you in a week”.
Frankly I really appreciated her response because the number of people pretending them, established friends, dating for a week is the same thing as two randos met up Offa tinder dating for a week feels like it’s intentionally crapping on Lucy for having a legitimate crush and sexual attraction to Wally when that sort of thing has been what has motivated most romantic interactions between cast members to date. She equates it with love, because she’s inexperienced, honestly some people never learn that isn’t love.
People’s dislike for Lucy is just making less and less sense to me the more reasons they give. With her being a recent addition, paired with a fairly loved character- I guess the fact that they had no chemistry just made people blame her for it? And her biggest flaw is her delusional nature, and being delusional isn’t a socially acceptable enough flaw? A lot of these characters have pretty egregious problems, but the response to Lucy has been really uncomfortable.
I’m also a friendless delusional girl though, so I guess I just relate to much. Related a lot to Joyce too despite never being a fundie haha.
I think if anything it’s a transferring of peoples annoyance at Lucy who’s actually a somewhat nice/pleasant if boring character who you wouldn’t really want to see something bad happen to be so bound and determined floor her car into the wall of this imploding relationship. At first it might not of been so bad because hey it’s going to happen I guess, but as it got stretched out and her hopes kept getting up it’s kind of like “just pull the rug out from under her already!”
I don’t think she was done any favors either by being essentially introduced as “Black Joyce” in and out of universe. I agree with your assessment as well!
Sal’s reaction will probably be a good chunk of exasperation but also sympathy for her brother, sympathy for Lucy if she hears any of the specifics, and then like……… also a little bit of “well it’s a good thing I decided Mom’s super conditional love wasn’t worth it, because otherwise I’d have egg on my face here after going to bat for you two”.
Maybe a SMIDGEON of “I told you so”, but also plenty of “I’m sorry I was right”, if Walky actually seems to be hurting.
yeah sal was just a lighthearted jab for the most part, idk what she thought of dorothy and walky as a couple and was ok with amber but i imagine if it were more serious she’d be like “you really dont’ wanna date my brother trust me”
Agreed. I’m hesitant to actually pronounce time of death, either. I don’t think this is GOOD, but I can see a wait out or two; it all depends on what Willis wants to do here.
I’m commander shepherd and this is my favourite comment on the citadel today.
Though I don’t think the prototypical orifice/body part that comes to mind in this question is at play here – honestly I’d say this would be that body part starting to leave that orifice for both parties over the course of this comic.
walkys parents prolly don’t rly care that much about the religious aspect, i think that part was more of a child actor thing versus spreading some kinda message since i’m sure it’d be easy to convince their own church to have their kid in a vid
Depending on Jennifer’s mood and/or willingness to help, that might actually give Lucy some straightforward information to chew on of the ‘not what she wants to hear but what she needs to hear’ variety.
i mean, it’s not like she wasn’t warned but i think it was general disdain or cynicism of walky’s ‘boyfriend material’-ness versus parental problems beforehand
There were other signs that walky wasn’t as “into” the relationship that Lucy was:
– their late night “date” following roller derby, where walky was more interested in the chocolate chip pancakes than the potential of a sexual encounter
It’s funny, because while it’s basically text that Walky isn’t into the relationship as Lucy, the way “he wasn’t up for sex” is so focused on is so incredibly gendered.
No one would be using that as a reason if we gender swapped the couple, but we assume that if a guy doesn’t jump at a chance for sex, he must just be completely uninterested.
Yes, though it’s also based on Walky in previous romantic interactions. He has been into make outs and had pretty intense physical attraction previously, especially to Dorothy. His lack of any indicated interest outside the shirt licking incident is just unusual for him given the romantic history we’ve seen.
I also think that particular moment being brought up repeatedly as proof that he WAS into her is a factor. That it happens to be a moment of probably-sexual attraction is almost coincidental tho, because what it was being used to argue was “Walky IS into her, though, it’s NOT one-sided, see? Remember how she licked his shirt in Taco Bell and he got flustered?”
If we had a moment where he got similarly flustered by say handholding, but only ONE moment, and otherwise the exact same relationship, I think folks would be similarly talking about how he only wanted to hold hands with her the one time… if that makes sense, lol.
I do agree that he hasn’t shown the same kinds of physical interest that he did in Dorothy and Amber. Altogether I think there are signs that there is an issue here.
I also suspect he’s been worried about this love thing and going too far under false pretenses. Or further confirming her existing false assumptions.
It’s just when it gets reduced to “Dude doesn’t jump at chance for sex. This relationship is dead.”
If you have a couple (who were supposedly dating) and the roles were reversed (i.e. on a day where sex was planned/expected) and the woman instead wanted to do something mundane, it would certainly be an indication that SOMETHING was wrong.
Ok, maybe a single incident isn’t hardcore proof, but if it is part of a regular pattern it would certainly be evidence of lack of sexual/romantic interest. (like the stereotypical “I have to wash my hair tonight”)
Yeah and if they hadn’t had sex yet and the guy had been trying to set an artificial timeline for how soon they should do it and the woman kept finding excuses to put it off, there would be something wrong, but most of us wouldn’t take it to be a problem with her.
More specifically, men are assumed to be ready for sex by default. Women are assumed to be the gatekeepers.
If a woman isn’t ready at an early stage in the relationship even though the man wants to, that’s not seen as a evidence she’s not into him, just that she’s not at that stage yet.
But the thing is, there doesn’t seem to be any “rational” reason for Walky to have wanted to wait.
He isn’t a religious person (so he doesn’t have any sort of christian morality to worry about). He had sex with Dorothy fairly early in their relationship (wasn’t it sort of on their first date?) And he never expressed any sort of reluctance before, when Lucy was talking about her “3rd date” rule.
Ultimately yeah, there’s nothing that says Walky HAS to be willing to have sex on demand, and who knows… maybe if this relationship actually lasts then his “pancakes over sex” preference might just have been a one-off thing.
Oh, they’re both being idiots. She was expecting WAY too much from the relationship, but Walky is doing an impressive job of making things worse every time he speaks right now.
By the moment that they first had a relationship, the equanimity-preserving moves had already been eliminated. They need to go through this, whether it splits them or brings them together.
Just in time for the weekend and a look in either on the Sarah and Jacob situation, or to see how our dear Carla is doing. As much as I’m hoping for more on the former, my favorite character was beginning to look a bit fragile on top of way vulnerable.
Does he even want to save it though?
he’s only in this because he followed dorothy’s advice.
What would he even be saving? he doesn’t love her, and she probably doesn’t have the patience to wait for him to force himself to do so.
Maybe! In panel 1 he does say he likes her very, very much, so it’s possible he’s not actually ready for this to end yet (barring things going super-south now).
Why do people expect him to be in love after only one week of dating? Is this how it really works? Like, are people really just not allowed to date without being In Love? I always thought dating was what you did to get to know someone in an intimate/couple rather than simply friendly context.
The dating you’re describing is what you do with someone you don’t already spend time with who doesn’t go in your social circles. The kind of dynamic and friendship Walky and Lucy have had has been the sort that, if there was attraction, would have developed for Wally by now already.
In abstract yes, it’s normal to date without feelings established. In this context having known of one another and hung out semi-regularly for a while before dating, yes it’s weird that he initiated this without feeling stronger first. Especially, getting into it knowing her attraction to him was obvious enough that at least one of his other friends that he knows of got the picture just from seeing them together.
That’s not true either. That implies people can’t just be oblivious and that feelings can’t change with time, especially when you start thinking about someone romantically.
I’ll grant you I’ve never been in the position of being oblivious to another person’s attractiveness nor their feelings for me. I will say I’ve had two pretty close friendships with two people who I’m pretty sure still to this day would jump up and say “yes!” To me asking them out, have confessed to me 20 years ago, have confessed again 10 years ago, have both confessed in the last two years, and yet we’ve never dated because I knew I just didn’t see them that way. Meanwhile I’ve never been physically attracted to someone first then become friends with them, I’ve always seen what that person is like as a person, had one-on-one interactions with them, and established a view of them. My husband famously worried that I’d eventually realise he wasn’t that great and dump him, and I still after 9 years think he’s basically the best person ever. But I also never had that infatuation I have had with a few people. Attraction, yes, admiration and respect definitely, lack of infatuation proved to be a good thing though as it meant we established our relationship based on what we appreciated about one another rather than letting effectively butterflies and new romance energy dictate whether we wanted to be together. There are a lot of different ways to feel about people, I will allow that people can be oblivious and start thinking about someone romantically and may even come to like or even prefer them.
I’m not sure I believe that can happen for Wally in this situation though. He likes her but it feels like he mainly wants to date her because he likes her and knows she’s infatuated with him.
way i see it, dating in something you do with a person you like to see if that “like” will blossom into love.
that’s why we have bf/gf before marriage.
dating is the trial period before signing up for a full account.
I’m gonna take the long odds and say they talk it out, everyone stronger, and last til the end of the semester. It’s so unlikely, but if it happens I’m gonna win so many Internet points for it.
I say she should’ve been clued in when he compared dating her to buying a value menu taco. It’s almost like dating a girl out of convenience was never gonna work.
Walky didn’t put it in the best way here but “I asked my friend for advice about a relationship where I didn’t know how I felt about it and she told me ‘yeah go for it'” is like. Totally normal, sorry. Lucy is only upset about what Walky is saying because it reveals a truth that both of them have been dancing around – that Lucy has been deeply in love for months, and Walky is still feeling out the first week of a new relationship, and so differing levels of investment in that relationship are normal and to be expected. If Lucy can’t handle that disparity being made clear then that’s on her, not on Walky. Just my two cents tho.
And it is quite uncomfortable that from here on, Lucy brings out all the helplessness that she has had to keep since Linday’s comment, Lucy does something unfair to Dorothy, yes, it was bad advice on her part, but she already has a damn torment on her.
Nah, you’re right. Walky going for advice from a friend isn’t even the issue here. He’s even said he’s trying to do right by her, which you can clearly tell by him trying to be careful with his parents, trying to defend her, going to church with her…
Her being crazy in-love makes it very one-sided, sadly. Hell, her saying “We’ve been hanging out for Four Months” feels… kinda wrong? There’s a BIG difference between “bein’ pals” & “being in a relationship” when it comes to being around others.
You hit it right on the head there: Lucy’s saying they’ve known each other for months because it retroactively legitimizes the time she spent pining over him as part of their relationship, when Walky’s only ever been aware of it for a little over two weeks.
Let’s not forget that when she met him he was actively dating someone else; hell, they met because Walky went to Jennifer for relationship advice.
So, Walky may be putting his foot in his mouth here, but there was no way this wasn’t going to end poorly.
I hadn’t gotten it initially reading the comic and comics referring to it, but yes. I don’t think Lucy is trying to forcefully retcon their hanging out as friends in a romantic light, she’s establishing what the barometer of mutual attraction would be, but walky was not attracted to her, and it’s been ambiguous for most of the time they’ve been dating whether he’s attracted to her now.
So again, in Lucy’s view, because she was pining for walky for four months then since he asked her out he must have also been into her when they were platonic, right? Right?? So these comics are a slew of extremely unpleasant glass shattering realisations for Lucy, I’m baffled by the people mutually holding in their minds that Lucy is both delusional but also somehow fully aware of the feelings imbalance and trying to manipulate walky. Obviously she had no idea, obviously her crime in this relationship is her headcanon being too fierce and big and consuming reality in deference to what feels good to her rather than any sense of emotional sobriety. She wants to hear “I love you”, she is insecure as she’s starting to realise something isn’t right here, she’s starting to wake up. But it hasn’t been some master scheme of hers, she just liked him a lot, and was hoping he liked her the same way.
I’m not sure how to say this, but thanks for not assuming the worst of Lucy? She’s got her problems but she isn’t some mastermind or doing any of this on purpose. To me she’s just insecure, and was under a false impression since the start of their relationship, in which she thought he must’ve been into her prior as well. But him asking her out involved no attraction to her until the day of when he… Noticed she was a girl.
On top of that, she’s being told that he only asked her out because of what his EX said, and has been taking advice about THEIR relationship from said ex. That’s gotta feel weird to hear? I’ve felt insecure and isolated in the way Lucy does, and while I never went the “After we go on three dates, we can have sex!” route, but I get where that weird checklist is coming from too.
Prior to college and during college, Lucy has consistently never fit in with anyone. I think she’s just trying to follow the rules she’s seen worked for other people… Possibly in fiction. She doesn’t have any friends of her own here, and the people who probably could be her friend are put off by her peppy nature that I wouldn’t be surprised if she’s forcing.
Dunno. I like Lucy. I don’t really think she’s boring, she’s just doing what she thinks she should be doing- and getting super carried away in what seems to be her first relationship. She’s infatuated. And she wants it to be love. Her weird sex rules are a lot of pressure though, and pretty creepy so hope she cuts that out like yesterday.
Hey exactly, it feels like Lucy is catching a lot of crap for something largely beyond her control that’s an honest mistake borne of her own loneliness and will to be liked and accepted. It is cringeworthy, but it should be pitiable not villainised. She’s been trying to do everything she thought was right too, she’s not very self aware and she has huge insecurities, but she still hasn’t done anything she realised would hurt Walky so far.
Yeah, they’ve both screwed up in ways that led to this and there’s a good chance they won’t be able to fix it, but neither of them were at mean or cruel or manipulative getting here. There were misunderstandings and mistakes, but the mistakes were all well-intentioned.
Well I really hope all that about her feeling out of place, isolated and about her not having friends isn’t all true because in combination with this that feels incredibly dangerous.
asking for advice is not bad, saying that you listened to the advice and did not make your own decision based on the advice means that you have no opinion about your own feelings and are just following orders. additional points because these are orders from the ex
Well, it’s at least saying he doesn’t have any strong feelings about being in a relationship with Lucy. Which is definitely something Lucy should have heard about sooner to shake her out of this idea they are super in love that she needs to believe to justify having sex.
Yup, they have asymmetrical relationship expectations. Lucy’s been hyping this up in her head for weeks, if not since Jennifer first made the suggestion.
So is Panel 3 Lucy saying that if you’ve been hanging out for four months, you should have fallen in love before you even start dating 3 months and 3 weeks in?
She’s saying “It’s not like we only met last week, yeah that’s how long we’ve officially been dating, but we’ve kinda been in a limbo zone for a while”.
…also, she’s a teenager, four months is like forever to them >_>.
Hell, Joyce and Joe actually went on a date a long time ago! One that involved a lot more punching than most dates do, granted, but still. By Lucy’s timeline they’re basically engaged already!
i think 4 months in is ok to say i love you to a platonic friend but if you’re the opposite gender (or two males in a heteronormative community), i guess it might come off as awkward if they don’t know that you openly say that to your other close friends as well
It’s supremely weird to see y’all putting arbitrary timelines to feelings. Walky met Dorothy and was immediately infatuated with her, he threw toys at her head to express his interest. Ruth and Billie were a damn mess but they were absolutely completely into one another by the time they started dating. Every relationship that we know of between main cast members has been built and, in many cases, broken in the four months Lucy is mentioning. The issue is the imbalance of affection, now how long is appropriate to say “I love you” to someone. I started dating my husband three months after we started talking and hanging out, there was a mutual attraction immediately but I never got that “into him” in the way Dorothy and walky were, and 9 years later my feelings have grown to have other valuable and positive elements but I’ve still never had that element informing out dynamic. The first impression you build of someone will inform how you feel about them without something unusual radically changing that perception.
Lucy is saying here that she has been attracted to him for four months and had assumed since he asked her out that he’d also been attracted to her. Walky did not feel that way, and her asking or stating that impression isn’t manipulative – it’s establishing the differences in their perspectives that he had only considered her as at all interesting in a relationship context for a couple weeks at the urging of friends, while she has been into him from day one.
It’s very disingenuous I suppose, from her perspective the whole relationship has been much longer and her attraction and feelings toward him have been building for more time. But on the other end she’s was more just in his sphere of awareness, he wasn’t focused on her really until close to when the actual relationship started. So once again they’re just not in sync.
at this point it wouldn’t even be salvaging, it would be giving in.
he’d just be continuing it to make her happy, which would probably make him unhappy/resentful because it would no longer be a relationship, it would be work without benefit.
it would be like his parents relationship, but without the racism.
True. If she actually liked Walky instead of her fantasy of Walky she would have figured out he’s honest to a fault and has no ability to social engineer or to be suave.
Replying here because sdklgjslk I didn’t meant it the way y’all think. It’s more like… If his goal here was to avoid hurting Lucy’s feelings, well. That’s off the table now.
I agree that she’s at the very least not ready for a relationship. She’s built Walky up in her head hardcore. Four months? That’s never necessarily mutual. Meanwhile, he’s tried to make this work in his own way. I like her because she reminds me of Early Joyce but I’ve been getting a feeling she’s not heading to a good place.
So what he did in this strip was, he fumbled the intro to a conversation they should’ve had but he had avoided. Now there’s no way Lucy’s going to listen.
does someone have the strip where they decide to go out together handy? has it been four months or one week?
I feel like they have been OFFICIALLY boyfriend and girlfriend (with sex on the table) for less than a week; before that they were hanging out as friends with Lucy not so secretly pining for more
They started dating about a week ago. They’ve hung out for about four months. Lucy had a crush on him for most of that time, which is why she brings it up as not being too fast for her, personally, to say I love you and also why she didn’t question it as odd when she thought Walky said he loved her.
I guess since she was under the assumption that he asked her out without any influence- she believes that he must’ve had a crush on her prior too. Jesus, this stuff from Walky would be so… Not great to hear if I were Lucy. It has to be said but it’s kind of brutal right now.
Dorothy was willing to go back to him, but for some reason, she thought that seeing that he and Lucy resemble each other, it was more convenient for him to be with her, but the fact that two people share tastes does not make them souls that should be romantically united.
Walky shouldn’t have said “Romantic” at first, the moment Lucy heard that, she already started creating her sitcom from start to finish, complete with offspring.
While that’s a way to describe it, it’s worth looking at the strips between, which focus on him being astounded that Lucy would be interested in him. I’d say him asking her out is more directly based on learning that she’s into him than on Dorothy telling him to.
I’m so used to Willis dragging us through certain plot lines at a snail’s place for extra tension, that having this confrontation finally happen and happen so QUICKLY in comparison. I just. It’s incredible. My heart rate is so high. I’m so giddy and lightheaded.
Honestly, I am glad that it is all out in the open, even through the process was so very uncomfortable. It either ends here (which I am fine with) or much less likely they somehow salvage and their relationship has become a bit more honest. To me, the best case outcome would be they decide to be friends, but that seems really unlikely.
She’s 18. Should she be dating a 35 year old?? Any boy at 18 has maturity to earn, and absolutely so does she. One week dating to “I love you.” Is not the mark of maturity
That’s literally not how that works.
Maybe Lucy should focus on herself and grow her own maturity. If we’re going by you’re logic, she’s 10 years old. She has no idea what a real, healthy relationship takes.
He’s acting like a normal 18 year old in their freshman year of college. She’s acting insane. If she dated a “mature” boy, he’d be wise to dump her in that first week after her behavior
How the hell is walky immature here? Lucy is the one rushing a WEEK LONG RELATIONSHIP and freaking out because he doesnt say he loves her A WEEK INTO THE RELATIONSHIP.
How dare Walky learn and grow from past relationships and try and take his time, how immature of him
Walky’s been nothing but mature about this entire relationship.
As much as I like Lucy, it’s clear she’s got some things to learn about how relationships work in the real world–starting with “when one of his friends says ‘you should ask her out’ it’s usually a GOOD thing”, and continuing directly to “the length of time you are acquainted doesn’t necessarily change any timelines once your relationship officially starts”, and definitely eventually covering “you don’t need to be in love to have sexy times, and that’s not even what your God says to begin with so please just do what you want to do”.
…Every time I write advice to Lucy, I’m really also writing it to myself in freshman year.
“We’d been hanging out together for four months.” Oh bud, that’s not remotely an argument for why someone should be in love with you after a week of dating.
Yeah as much as Walky is making this worse, this is on Lucy. She’s feeling hurt and betrayed because she is obsessed with the idea of storybook love and he’s the mature one trying to just treat it like dating.
Wild that Sal was 100% right about “I give it two weeks” but for the reverse reason.
Lucy’s fatal flaw is craving a cookie cutter version of happiness. Being tv version of popular, having a storybook love (like you said), to only have sex after “appropriate” amount of dates (and pushing for those dates bc horny) so as to be a still be a “good” christian. She’s fun, cute, dorky and kind! But she gets in her own way.
Getting angry at Walky for not being in love after a week may be bad for their relationship but maybe good for Lucy’s personal growth? I am curious to see how it goes!
I think her point is he “could” have fallen in love with her in that time not “should”. He’s a bit like “that’s ridiculous we only dated a week” and she’s saying it’s not like they didn’t know each other before.
So if her intention is to say “it’s not a ridiculous idea that we’d be in love” then I agree with her, it just didn’t happen for Walky.
I’m Demi and the point of asking out for me is when love happened. Otherwise we’d remain just friends. It’s not crazy but it is definitely a mismatch in their styles and a miscommunication in this specific case.
Oh, it’s understandable that Lucy is in love but unfair of her to expect Walky to feel the same way in the same amount of time. In plenty of relationships the people involved develop stronger feelings at different points of time.
Huh, didn’t expect to be correct about Walky bringing up he did not say he loved her. The fact he can’t remember that he said that he loved a certain thing about her, and not just some random object makes it more interesting. I think it was he loved that she understood he just wanted to make a meme joke and she continued the set up for him.
Well, I think it depends how you count it, since Dorothy dumped Danny right on their first day in the comic! Their relationship may have lasted longer than these two, but only off-screen.
Especially when one person has deeper feelings than the other. and they want to pretend otherwise to put up a false front, and manipulate the other person with.
Walky is right to explain the basics of the relationship is only a week. and he needs time to catch up, without excessive pressure to lie about it.
People are blaming walky, but this situation is entirely one of Lucys making.
She had a crush on him one week ago. Without a single real date.
Now after meetting his parents, her brother, Raidah, and going to her church, He must also be in love with her?
or he isnt worth dating?
Then she can stay single. and alone.
Walky has done his best in all of this, but the fact that he says it only lasted weeks makes me think that while Dorothy’s advice was not correct, I interpret the advice in a completely different way, it’s true, Lucy is not liked by many here, but honestly hating her is too absurd, that it has become uncomfortable… yes, but because of how she is reacting at the moment, it is too disturbing
I have no idea what you are trying to say. I dont mean to sound rude.
You have a bunnch of prefixes clauses that sound like they are supposed to be explained, or go somewhere, but lead nowhere like a dropped storlline.
“the fact that he says it only lasted weeks” its a true fact.
“I interpret the advice in a completely different way” OK and how?
You forgot to say how you intrepet the advice. Im shivering with anticipation, what about the symptoms?
(Are you High? its OK if you are high AF. I probably in ramble just like this in dangling clauses when im stoned. I hope you are having an awesome night.)
Heres to you Feeling Fine ( raises glass of ice tea )
I hope you are having a good time, and sorry that Lucy facing the truth makes you uncomfortable.
But She DID this. She’s DOING this. Shes making an uncomfortable confrontation happen. In a church.
She also started this , by pretending Walky told her he loved her and trying to gaslight and emotionally manipulate him with it.
Walkys been the dumb one, the naaive one, who buys her innocent act. ( shes not. Shes a social climber like Raidah . But too passive to admit whats shes doing ) .
Walky tortured himself because he doesnt want to hurt her feelings, and actually believes the lie she misheard him.
But in retrospect that makes zero sense. Walky was complimenting her how much he feels seen by her, that she gets him. Lucy was paying close attrention to him beforehand which is why she deserved the compliment. It doenst make logical sense she misheard him. She KNOWS what he said and tried to level it up. and she hasnt stopped to think about walkys feelings by pretending he said he loved her.
I dont fault her for saying it, but she turned it around into an obligation and expectation. ( the opposite of what Dorothy *did when she said she loved him ) .
But I also think Dorothy Knew what she told walky was bad advice.
. Or Dorothy is ok with lying to people about their feelings.
and it was probably selfserving because she was afraid She would
throw herself at walky ( which she did later ) .
Dorothy shouldve known this would hurt lucy by walky not being
more upfront with her . Just like Dorothy shouldve known her
actions with walky during their relationship would make him more
attached to her, than she was. She hasnt a learned a thing and
repeating the same mistakes with other peoples feelings, and mismatched relationships; as long it temporarily serves her interests.
Dorothy uses people, but she is a kind ,and authentic person. She doesnt
do the inauthentic social climbing of Raidah. Or Lucy. like youd expect of a
politician.
( Ive been shocked at Lucys nakd selfserving self deception and ambition ever since she went to Billys old wing to find levers to manipulate Billy with. its 180 degrees from the nice-girl act. Thats Machiavellian naked ambition. Then having gotten it she made sure Billy knew she was the master and wouldnt misuse it , thus ‘proving’ to herself she is “good”.
Dude you are making half this shit up in your head, like it’s not even funny this is psycho shit no one wants to read your villainess au fanfiction here, post it on ao3
Shes wildly manilulative. Just extremely passive.
and passive aggreessive.
She knows what walky really said and is letting him torture himself.
Nows shes galsighting him about it, letting him believe the lie she misheard.
She went to Bills old dorm specifically to find keys to manipulate Billy with. Then she interefered with her relationship. It was all about controlling Billy.
This is why shes distraight over walkys parents situation. There is NO WAY she can escape Billys control.
Shes upset at hearing Dorothy had a hand in putting their relationship togther because then she would owe Dorothy the way she tried to control Billy.
She wants to pretend that she passively manipulated Walky into asking her out and being in love. Now she learns NO. Walky did it when Dorothy told him too. this is about loss of control.
But she is manipulating walky because this isnt new information.
She was Literally prsent when Dorothy said this ( unless im misrembering)
.
Shes trying to guilt trip walky for saying the truth. When she had the same set of facts.
Ok, Dude. Again, I think people (including you) are giving Lucy way too much credit for planning/self-awareness here. I willing to buy passive-aggressive. That’s fair. As for manipulation, gaslighting, etc., those to me are intentional actions. You’re accusing Lucy of Raildah (sp?) like levels of villaintry (sp?) and Lucy’s just not in that league. (Not saying she wouldn’t like to be, but she’s not. Although Raildah might be willing to take her on as an apprentice if Lucy had any social connections.)
Lucy is closer to the villain in a psychological thriller who’s willing to use any means necessary to try to get reality to support her delusions, although even that’s probably too strong. She’s just another 18 year old girl who victimized herself by wearing rose colored glasses.
Are we seeing different comments? People saying walky is digging a hole are not saying walky is to blame for this relationship, they’re just saying in this one comic he’s saying the exact best response to upset her in every panel. As far as I’ve seen the trend has been “of digging a hole there walky” “it’s not Walky’s fault!” “Oh I know, I don’t mean the situation I mean his responses in the comic, this is definitely because of Lucy”
This is genuinely kind of cathartic for me, because I was Walky for a lotttt of my college relationships – but I never got forced to spell it out, and so I just shuffled along in a dismal dance with some poor girls who had become completely obsessed with me. I honestly wish things had blown up this bad instead. Can’t wait to see this to its conclusion!
Walky needs to be honest going forward about what he wants out of a relationship, which is something casual and fun. And its not something he can get from Lucy or Dorothy. Lucy was about ready to start planning their wedding. And Dorothy told him, “when I look back on the time I was the happiest it was when I was with you” Which is a lot of pressure on a college freshman.
Walky’s being open and honest. It’s probably painful, but it’s impressive. As for Lucy, someone with a high Emotional IQ needs to help her learn the difference between ‘friend’ relationships and ‘dating’ relationships. Sadly I don’t think that’s anyone in this comic.
Walky is doing the right thing. Lucy, one day you’ll appreciate this rare show of maturity from an adult teenager. It’s not something that *I* could have done at that age, that’s for sure.
Okay, I feel the need to again reiterate that I like Lucy and Walky, and I don’t actually think there are any villains here; I don’t think Lucy is manipulative or “crazy”, I don’t think Walky is a huge jerk, or whatever.
But this is an incredible train wreck of a conversation and I am cackling, which I assume was the intended emotional response for at least these parts.
Mm, SOME characters may have, but I doubt Becky; she seems to like Walky fine and doesn’t seem to have had any reservations about his relationship with Lucy, unless I’m failing to remember something. She also seems to like Lucy well enough, and in-universe where Lucy is a real person… yeah, I don’t see Becky laughing.
I have had many issues with Becky historically, but I agree. If she’s even still there instead of leaving or going a little ways away to give these two space, she does not think this is funny.
I don’t think they’re bad for each other, I just… don’t think they’re much of anything for each other. They were cutest when they hatched that hairbrained scheme together (fake-dating Amber to get his mom to like Lucy), but otherwise I don’t see any unique dynamics here.
I guess I gotta give her props for encouraging his web comic aspirations? that’s definitely a thing she did. He also got advice from Dorothy… I kinda want to compare what they said now, but I don’t remember which of them wanted him to go for a simpler concept to be funnier. Lucy, maybe? With Dorothy saying she thought the original idea had charm??
same; doesn’t seem to be a villain here. They just barely make sense as a relationship and their fundamentally different orientations to the world were bound to come to a head at some point
Oh. Wow. Okay, seeing how she’s reacting to things here makes it an incredible relief that she didn’t find out about Walky hanging around with Amber earlier. (Yet)
I do not think she would have handled that well at all.
Oh my god that’s absolutely where this is going isn’t it? He’s going to try and salvage this and talk her down and mention, “Gosh, why are you so upset? I hung out with Amber playing Mario Kart in my underwear, you think I’m aching to cheat on you or something?” and she’s going to go “you WHAT?!”
Oh god FINALLY. These two are *not* good for each other and regardless of which one of them is right or wrong (they’re both kinda wrong and both kinda right) I sincerely hope they break up…whatever the fuck this is and go find people who actually suit them.
Oh noooooo she’s counting the time they hung out as Friends as having been supposed to be him falling in love with her. She interpreted the first hot boy who hung out with her as inevitably romantic. Honey nooo.
I think he once said something “yeah well i guess girls and i are always going to be at an impasse” so Lucy would’ve eventually “have to” ask walky out/make the first move if dorothy hadn’t steered him towards it
but hopefully she finds a better boyfriend if she’s not immediately soured on relationships after this even without sarah and others rubbing it in (tho she’d def need a break and to focus on herself/personal life befor anything romatnic again)
If I having been hanging out with someone for months and then they ask me out, I would assume that they had been developing feelings for me during some of that time.
Right? Lucy isn’t wrong to assume that the person who asked her out had been attracted to her before dating. I’ve been in no less than ten relationships and discussion of when feelings started to develop for each person has been part of most of those.
+1
I’d think they’d asked me out because they liked me, right? That feels like a normal assumption to make. Brain wouldn’t jump straight to love though haha. But I’m not sure if she started saying “I love you!” before or after she thought he’d said it to her.
Yeah I feel like I distinctly remember it was after, which fits in with her character – she waited for months as his friend hoping he’d ask her out, she would wait for him to drop the first love bomb to start saying it.
While Walky is shoving his foot directly into his mouth here, I do think it’s important that Lucy hears this from him.
Still agree with Booster that Lucy can find someone way better for her. Walky isn’t a bad kid, and he’s been growing on me as a character, but he hasn’t done much more than recently clearing bare-minimum bars of being a decent person.
or she could make the first move herself, good to let ppl know right off the bat but i imagine ppl don’t just always make it public the instant they feel a crush for someone unless they’re confident/used to doing ‘first dates’ first versus just being friends XD
The fact that she was asked out with prompting isn’t on her at all – it’s entirely on Walky. She didn’t have a hand in that. Other than that, yes, she deserves someone who is actually interested in her.
Yeah, I don’t know that it speaks to walky’s character the way it sounds initially, “better for her” in this case could simply mean someone who was organically attracted to her at any point prior to asking her out.
Walky’s character has been established by like, the entire run of the comic up until now, not just this particular situation. I’m just saying that he hasn’t done anything particularly indicative of real strength or quality of character at this point.
But yes, finding someone actually attracted to her is something Lucy deserves.
I feel like I’m going crazy watching Walky be the mature one opposite from a woman who believes storybook romance is real. This guy has literally summoned people from the aether by saying “I can almost hear their voice” and turning around and *he’s* the one trying to approach this like a grown up.
i don’t think ppl cared enough for raidah to root against her versus cheering joyce on even tho making a move on someone while you know they’re dating someone else isn’t the best look
and jen/ruth are better off apart but ppl liked the toxic dynamic together lol
I also supported their weird little thing. And I was a Ruth/Billie shipper, they still clearly have immensely strong feelings for one another too, my poor dumpster kids.
Same. Also yes we were Ruth/Billie shippers, that’s not a reluctance to call her Jennifer, just historical accuracy.
I think I’d be more supportive of Jennifer’s current turn if I didn’t still feel like her turn were more about healthiness and character growth, and less about self-hatred (“I never liked Billie”) and Raidah’s machinations. Like, Asher at least DID genuinely like her (unsure of where he is atm), but Raidah and Carl are only pretending, and………..
Yeah. The one definite improvement she’s made is that she isn’t drinking anymore. So even from the perspective of wanting what’s good for Jennifer, it’s hard to ignore how much of her new life………… isn’t.
This exactly. I’m being historically accurate and trying to respect that Jennifer doesn’t want to associate with Billie-related things, *including* the relationship with Ruth. So I shipped Billie and Ruth, either Jennifer may become Billie again if she can ever reconcile with her past, or she’ll keep going as Jennifer, or she may periodically keep reinventing herself to keep hope that she can be better one day.
I genuinely don’t know what’s in store for Billie-slash-Jennifer, apart from “this can’t keep going indefinitely, something’s gonna give here and Jennifer is gonna get her heart broken when she realizes how a good chunk of her New Improved friend-group talks about her behind her back”. I don’t even know for sure what I think is gonna happen with her and Asher, except that this strip made me wince.
If you held my feet to the fire, I would guess that Jennifer is still ultimately self-destructive; that she was put off by (or perhaps scared of) Asher softening into a good boyfriend. I think it’s too simple (and falling into Tropes) to say that Jennifer wants, let alone needs, a “rocky” relationship like she had with Ruth; for me the biggest tragedy of their breakup is that it happened when they were happiest and healthiest, the same day that Billie told Ruth she wanted her to meet her parents.
Rather, I’d say Jennifer does not think she deserves happy or healthy, so Asher being too good-and-sensible-and-healthy got her hackles up, and she is genuinely more comfortable with this dysfunction.
I do think Jennifer is in that group both because she sees it as an expectation if she wants social acumen, and because as a former cheerleader she may feel more at home with fake smiles and barbed comments. Ruth not being able to accept that they could both be good for one another is devastating, and yes I think failed to give either her or Billie enough credit.
I’m genuinely sure that part of the Asher situation is due to Walky being such a big part of Jennifer’s formative experience as Billie, it’s her nightmare to be dating someone like him, and so she needed something about him to be harder, less goofy and sweet as Walky has typically been.
I actually commented on the very first strip of Billie sitting down with them that I wondered if she’d missed Char’s comment on her weight or if it reminded her of the cheerleaders she used to hang out with and was comfortably nostalgic
*ugh that sentence got rewritten a bunch. Would be more supportive of Billie’s turn as Jennifer IF I didn’t still feel like it’s less about being healthier and getting character development, and MORE about her self-hatred and Raidah’s machinations
1. A lot of people’s objections to Lucy and Walky has been “it’s boring and there’s no chemistry.” I don’t think you can really say that about any of the other three relationships. When it comes to fiction, “boring” is an actual problem; unhealthy or doomed but still entertaining is not, at least not for all readers.
2. Joyce/Ethan was obviously inevitably doomed even before it began; there was more ambiguity with Lucy and Walky, and technically there still is. I’m not completely ruling out the possibility that Willis might salvage this somehow. Folks not enjoying a relationship and not being confident it’s going to end soon = folks being more vocally relieved when it ends.
3. But also, are there more people celebrating this? Or is it just the case that most of the ‘ship’s defenders have stopped commenting, so the comment section seems more unanimous, which lends to the perception of more people cheering?
4. Didn’t personally want Billie and Ruth or Jacob and Raidah to break up, but that’s me, heh.
Ehhh. I think I reject that dichotomy. A lot of folks who most enjoy seeing pain and suffering in fiction would also describe themselves as Team Inside, because what they’re getting out of that is at least partly catharsis. Ask anyone who’s a big fan of “whump” in fiction, they will tell you the characters they love and relate to the most are the ones they put through the worst things.
I think you just want different things out of a story, and how much or how little you relate to the characters in that story as “real people” isn’t really relevant.
Personally, I am a sucker for a happy ending, but if the characters are gonna be in happy relationships the whole time, I want that to be more of a background detail woven in around a larger story mostly focused on action, or horror, or something like that. Relationship-focused slice of life stuff isn’t really my jam.
But also let me clarify: when I said “boring” in fiction was worse than unhealthy or doomed, I did specifically try to acknowledge that that isn’t true for all audiences. Most of what I was doing was speculating on why the Walky/Lucy breakup might get more people cheering than the other examples.
(But also none of us really relate to these characters as real people, because if we did we could just ask Walky and Lucy what they want, and they’d probably tell us they want us to go away and leave them alone to sort it out in private, and we’d all feel weird for being so invested in whether these people, who aren’t our friends and don’t know us, stay together or not. X3 )
Oh Lucy honey, you don’t really love him. This is NRE and I know it feels crazy good but that’s NOT love.
Love is an ACTION. Not a feeling. Because feelings can be manipulated by dumb little things, how much sleep you got, have you eaten lately, work stress-but no matter how you FEEL….you can always ACT lovingly.
And that’s what love really is. Not a feeling, but how you act towards people.
And you haven’t gotten to that point yet, not yet. Please give yourself time. ♥
Ehm, I have been so stressed and exhausted that all emotions and empathy shut down. Basically I was a broken robot who didn’t care anymore to pretend to be human. I watched a lost child wander around crying and not only didn’t feel a thing, I also didn’t care enough to solve it. That means the many ways I love people, kids, myself, society, responsibility, justice, and the well-being of others went away.
So while love might be an action, it most certainly can be affected by sleep and stress. You can break someone to the point that they’re no longer loving.
I’ll start by saying I agree with most of what you’ve said.
I’m of a different mind on two points though: the way you feel about someone can change over time, but how you’re attracted to them usually stays the same as long as they stay relatively the same. This is my experience at least. I love people, and yes it’s more of an action, and yes how I feel changes based on various factors, small and large. The way I see people though, generally stays consistent, and the issue here isn’t actually Lucy’s – it is normal to develop infatuations for a person on occasion, and to hope they reciprocate those feelings. She has let it get out of hand and leaned hard into the belief and hope that it’s mutual, but having no social awareness and being young are just normal. Yeah, young people often mistake NRE for love. But I said it up above and I’ll say it again – there isn’t chemistry here, these are really good friends with a one sided attraction that the other person has been made to recognise and is now trying to reciprocate artificially. I think Walky could grow to really like Lucy as a partner, but I don’t think he’d ever come to meet her feelings romantically. And that’s the core problem here, the imbalance, it is neither and both of them responsible, but Lucy’s only lesson to learn here is to not assume people feel the same way you do.
As a demisexual I get what it means. I’m not saying you greeted someone in class and that was it. I’m saying once you start hanging out with someone to the point where you don’t just consider them an acquaintance or a member of your general circle, that will click or it won’t. And it doesn’t look like it clicked for Walky. Certainly I’ve never seen it click for someone in a relationship without some radical change like “left for three months and came back much more confident” or “kept my life from falling apart when I lost my mother” happening. Yes, I’ve re-contextualised people, but it was before they became people I actually considered friends. We all know how well “just stay with them and you’ll learn to love them” has worked for arranged marriages, staying together for the kids, or closeted gay heterosexual relationships.
That doesn’t really make sense though– I spent months hanging out with my (now) husband and didn’t really think of him as a physical being until one day I did. There’s no specific timeframe where that happened. (And, in fact, him making a sign that he was interested in me is likely what started me thinking of him physically.) So not having physical attraction a week after finding out that someone is interested in you doesn’t seem like a long time to me even if you’ve been hanging out for a while.
Walky is obviously not demi-sexual, so the point doesn’t apply to him. But the statement that you can’t build up to attraction is wrong or that you can’t change your attraction level after things change or you find new information is wrong. I can’t speak for Walky, I can only speak for myself.
> the way you feel about someone can change over time, but how you’re attracted to them usually stays the same as long as they stay relatively the same.
Man, this is *so* wildly alien to my own lived experience it’s kinda crazy to be reminded that this is how many people work.
I think there’s some truth to what Lucy is saying. If you have been friends for a long time, romantic feelings can start to develop. By the time you are ready to risk friendship to try a romantic relationship, the feelings might even be quite strong. That’s why it’s such a blow to realize that Walky didn’t gradually develop feelings so strong that he had to ask her out, and was instead prompted by his ex.
Thanks for articulating this. I can see both their sides completely.
Also I’m a full grown adult and I tend to fall in love rather quickly. I’m mature enough to not expect other people to be the same but it’s not absurd that people like me and Lucy exist.
Imagine if she knew, too, that he had no hesitation at all about asking her out after he was prompted. It took some convincing from Dorothy for him to believe Lucy could possibly be interested in him, but unless I’m forgetting something he never expressed anything like “but I really value our friendship, I don’t want to mess that up”.
Like… is Lucy special to him, even just as a friend?
What does this even mean? If someone cares about you enough to do something they dislike (going to church) and enjoy spending time with you and are attracted to you, what’s the problem?
I guess culturally we expect all of this to come with “the flutters”, or basically that condition by which you can’t stop obsessing about the other. That which I’d call “infatuation” or “limerence”. The paradox is that the latter thing is shallow and doesn’t last long, and “true love” is what you should hope to get in the long run – what seemingly and potentially is already there in this case!
I mean, enjoying your company + caring about you + sexual attraction does not necessarily equal love. It especially does not necessarily equal the kind of deep romantic where you want to be in a serious, committed, monogamous relationship. But the only one who can tell us whether Walky is feeling love or not is Walky (or Willis, out of universe), and he’s currently unconvinced, despite having been in two romantic relationships before.
Anyway the current problem is that Lucy’s feelings for Walky are already intense and Walky’s feelings for her are (at least currently) not. The imbalance is making Lucy unhappy, now that she knows it’s there. Also Walky is explaining himself in just the worst possible way, which isn’t helping.
It doesn’t necessarily equal that deep romantic love, but neither does the infatuation uze describes.
The infatuation is easy to mistake for love, but it will fade and then you see what’s left.
@thejeff – well, part of my disagreement with uze’s assessment is that I don’t think a lot of folks in the comments are confusing infatuation for love? I mean, I won’t say it’s NEVER happened, and certainly the general trajectory of this thing has been compared to his initial intense crush on Dorothy, but that initial intense crush wasn’t his whole relationship with her, and I don’t think it’s what most people are talking about when they say he seemed more into that relationship.
For me, I was a LITTLE bit put off by how Walky specifically asked Lucy out; as someone who’s a big fan of “the pining is mutual, they’re just idiots”, something about his wording nevertheless twigged me as being “off”. It didn’t sound like he was realizing he liked her, so much as like he was realizing she was objectively A Catch.
And then we started to see an awkward mismatch on their enthusiasm for sleeping together*, but for a while I put that off as Walky having some “oh no, first time with a virgin, how do I navigate this” jitters.
Then he said “I love that about you” and Lucy misheard or misinterpreted it, and he freaked out — but resigned himself to not saying anything and soldiering on in the hopes that he would grow to love her in time.
Then his dad nudged him about dating who he really wanted to be with, whether his mom likes it or not, and the most he could muster in defense of his relationship was “I really like her.”
Now this.
I’m not saying friendships can never grow into romantic relationships. As someone who’s pretty dang demi, that would be very silly of me to say! And indeed I think there’s room in this comic for demisexual reads of Walky specifically.
But I dunno. I feel like the cards Willis has been laying down do not add up to Walky’s feelings for Lucy turning romantic. At least not fast enough for Lucy not to want to break up with him rather than hanging on in the hopes that he’ll feel what she feels if she waits a few more weeks or months or (however long it takes).
* There’s nothing wrong with men not wanting sex! but when two people have such different levels of interest in having sex together, it’s bound to cause issues — like the kind we saw Becky and Dina deal with — so at the very least Walky needed to communicate with Lucy instead of just letting her steer the ship.
I do think that demisexuality shouldn’t be used as “you develop feelings for your friends” as a blanket statement, which feels a lot like how it’s been used so far. I accept being oblivious, but Wally has organically formed feelings for two previous girls, showing he is capable of developing those feelings as well as noticing and reciprocating them, and much earlier into knowing them personally than the time he’s known and interacted with Lucy. Some people you just don’t get romantic feelings for. It’s true that being oblivious and told someone has a crush on you that you think is out of your league may make you reconsider, it’s just more likely given Walky’s history in the comic so far that he would have already been attracted to Lucy by now, without someone putting a lamp on her attraction to him.
I agree with all of your points, I just am demi and this keeps getting brought up and it feels like a misinterpretation of demisexuality. It’s not that if you like someone as a friend enough you’ll have a crush on them because they like you. Like, I knew a kid for two months I actually hated, then he tutored me in math for an hour and I got knocked over with a massive crush on him. Before that he was literally gross looking to me, after it he became the height of attractiveness and his smile lot up my life. We’d never spent one on one time before that. People I’ve developed crushes on far after having known them personally have been online and it’s because they changed both physically and personality wise into people I found more attractive. Physical is still an element, not really in the classical way – there are objectively beautiful people that I love to death as friends that I’m just not into romantically at all. That’s how Walky’s feelings have always read to me, it may not be the case for everybody but for me I think if you tend to get crushes on your friends, there’s no actual reason to expect that you just didn’t realise someone was attractive that you consider a friend.
It’s definitely not every single friend I’ve ever had. More of a “every best friend has gotten into a confusing zone that made me kinda miserable growing up”, in my case.
But I also don’t think I was saying the thing you are objecting to. I said that, as a demi person myself, it would be silly of me to say feelings can NEVER evolve from friendship to romance, and that even if you read Walky as also being demi (which I think is valid, at least for how my demisexuality has worked), it does not seem like Willis is setting him up to do that with Lucy.
(I would get more into what my personal experiences with deminess have been, and how yes I too have specifically developed crushes on people who were the Very Opposite of Attractive prior to that, but I don’t want my main point to get lost in a lot of paragraphs.)
My thought was more along the lines that neither of them are really in Love in that sense. Nor, most likely, were Dorothy and Walky. They’re all kids a few weeks into a relationship. They’re dealing with crushes and infatuation, mixed with a good dose of actual liking and maybe the seeds of something that could turn into Love in time.
The difference isn’t that Lucy’s in Love and Walky isn’t, but that Lucy’s infatuated and Walky isn’t. Seen that way, the difference isn’t necessarily fatal. The infatuation will fade. That’s when you see what you’ve really got. And Walky isn’t necessarily behind there.
I mean, sure, technically, but it’s going to be very hard to discuss this comic if we can’t even use “what the characters have said with seeming sincerity about their own emotional states” as a foundation, heh.
Anyway I would argue that Lucy still thinks she’s in love and she still thinks Walky is telling her that he doesn’t feel the same way, and while I’m not at all sure what tomorrow’s comic will bring, the Walky of the last couple comics does not strike me as being able to say “I’m just asking you to give me time, in the hopes that my current level of affection might rise to meet yours” in a way that doesn’t hurt her even more?
I dunno. I’ll just reiterate: I’m not saying it’s impossible for a relationship LIKE this one to work out. In some ways I’m living proof they can, lol. It’s just this specific set of circumstances, the way Walky wasn’t like this with Dorothy or Amber but IS like this with Lucy, Lucy’s inexperience and romanticism, their asymmetrical feelings (both romantic and sexual) — all of it adds up to make me think that, as a story, it isn’t going to work out in this case.
But the conversation ain’t over yet, so I guess we will see.
Walky hasn’t said anything that is false, so I feel like he’s copping a bit too much flak just for his poor decision making on what true things to say.
Oh no, nobody is giving him flak, “keep digging that hole” is empathy, not accusation. He is being honest and everyone knows he is, but -he- wants to de-escalate the situation, while in this situation being honest is adding gasoline to the fire because he’s been afraid of being honest about the situation and his feelings with Lucy for the last two weeks. So people are merely acknowledging that in this strip he is trying to avoid a fight, but everything he’s saying is building the intensity of the encounter. He’s still right and this still needed to come out for both their sakes.
It’s not false, but he’s phrasing it in a way that makes it sound worse.
Like if he’d said “Dorothy let me know you were interested in me because I was oblivious” rather than “She told me to ask you out”, that would come across completely differently, even though both are true.
I am exactly the kind of nerd who loves this kind of thing, so I looked, and yup, southern Indian ocean, almost exactly halfway on a line between Perth Australia and Kerguelen Island.
You Knew damn well what Walky really said. This isnt new information.
the guilt tripping here is out of control.
You Knew damn well, Dorothy got Walky to ask you out. It happenend in your own room.
Its disturbing how she wants to erase the minor edges off recent history to make herself feel better. its messed up she expects walky to lie to her about this.
She’s really Headed straight for Raidahs Crew. Or maybe a Crew of Raidahs castoffs. I get that she feels insecure about Linda.
But shes cares more about Linda not liking her than Walky ignoring his mother and choosing her anyways.
walky is right, she shouldnt take this out in Dorothy.
( OMG I cant wait for Walky to let slip that Dorothy wanted him back and he said no. Walky will think this proves his affection, but it will drive lucy crazy. )
“You Knew damn well what Walky really said.” I honestly think this is an honest confusion. Sometimes, people hear what they wish to hear instead of what is actually said. It happens.
Cannot imagine Lucy knowing Walky didn’t say he loved her and choosing to pretend otherwise. Especially because she did unselfconsciously it in front of other people.
Really, becuase she LITERALLY doing that right now. Twice.
Believe what you see and hear.
Shes doing it again about twings , the incident and Pretending in front of other people she didnt know Dorothy set them up.
Yes, She did it front of other people, exaggerating her relationship, in order to social climb and public acclaim. ( Just like she exagerated her relationship with Walky, to others all week including her Brother ) .
thats the point, >>no one else could imagine it either<< unless they knew better, or Walky publicly Humiliated her.
its a chess move and she knew what she was doing, both times.
Trying to level up.
She doesnt get credit for using an audience to manipulate walky. Thats how the trick is played.
and She gets negative points because she is doing it again, trying to manipulate him in the presence of an audience, and she, unlike Walky,
is totally willing to push the issue in public , and humiliate both herself and walky to get her way.
You are trying to hold onto the 'criterion of embarrassment' to claim it was unconconsious. But In this very scene she showing you the opposite, she doesnt feel this way. Shes perfectly willing to be humiliated or embarrass in public over this.
She created a very public fight over walky not saying 'i love you' in public. Then she cornered him and blew it up.
Thus evaporating any pretense that she didnt do the same thing in the first place.
Sanity check bro. No one else has been interpreting lucy’s actions with anywhere near your level of sinister vitriol. That could mean either you alone know the real dark truth, or she reminds you of a bad experience and you’re projecting to an alarming extent and making everyone uncomfortable. Also, fyi that manipulation angle sounds hella misogynistic, at least to me
I’m half way there. People can be unintentionally manipulative when upset and wanting to be right, but that doesn’t stop it from being true. She’s very manipulative of the social situations and where/how she tries to insert herself in. Particularly since she ignored so many other persons boundaries on the way. I wouldn’t be surprised if that is why she doesn’t have friends – she reads like “road to hell is paved with good intentions” with how hard she tries for what she thinks people should want vs listening to that. She is the worst social faux pas mix of Dorothy and Joyce, but with a more sunny and (overall but not for walky) easy going personality. However most of that last part seems to be due to repression and people pleasing which she’s always been frustrated aren’t working in her davor.
Opened my mouth (figuratively speaking) to argue but then I actually kinda agree with you. I still don’t think she’s very aware of what she’s doing, but she definitely *is* doing, she is making moves to achieve goals and paying little or no attention to the feelings of those around.
Plus he didn’t actually say I love hamburgers, he said ‘that’s what I love about you’ which clearly, to Lucy’s ears, meant like “that’s one of many things that I love about you, because I love you”.
The thing he ‘loved about HER , he had spelled out specifically.
and Lucy was paying very close attention to what he said and meant,
and that was WHY he was priasing her. Because she was. ( paying attention close attention and understanding him ) .
.
and the hamburgers came after.
My point here, is that Lucy is not intentionally lying. Lucy is young, naive, and ‘in love’. She was paying close attention because she loves him, and when she heard the slightest bit of reciprocated affection, she definitely made it mean more than it was intended but it isn’t lying.
That’s just… an emotional reaction. You’re sitting here acting like Lucy is scheming a way to fuck with Walky, when she’s just someone in her first relationship who has very unrealistic expectations because this is all new to her. People can do something wrong without it being a grand plan of manipulation.
“she definitely made it mean more than it was intended”
yes. because she was in front of audience! Just like shes doing now
If she really gets walky, she would know hes sensitive making fusses in public. and would prefer to go with the flow. Which i think she does know.
“but it isn’t lying.” except it is. When you know the truth and are exxgerating for public acclaim.
Is it Lying about Dorothy?
“You’re sitting here”
Yes i am on my Throne. Do Go on.
“acting like Lucy is scheming a way to fuck with Walky”
YES, exactly like that , but without the sarcasm.
That is literally the comic you are reading. Shes just not a very good schemer and a very passive one. Which is why it took intervention from Dorothy and Billy.
Please excuse my crime of passion I spent months and months building up to.
and Shes none to happy to have it pointed out that she wasnt able to do this all by herself.
… Lucy might not be trying to scheme everything, but she is definitely trying to manipulate the situation into fucking Walky, at least for her own mental gymnastics. She is making weird 3rd date rules and then deciding what does/doesn’t count as dates, while ignoring others boundaries during them such as Danny’s. She isn’t evil, but she does view this as finally getting what she wants vs understanding what her partner wants too. That isn’t excused by young love. It explains it, but doesn’t excuse it.
Fucking WITH Walky. I specifically said fucking WITH Walky, for lack of a better word, because Adam Black’s reasoning is that Lucy has been scheming and is gaslighting Walky because… I dunno, she’s evil and wants him to suffer I guess. Adam is writing some elaborate fanfiction here.
I’m not excusing her weird third date sex stuff as young love, I’m saying this misunderstanding is due to that. Frankly, I’m a little tired due to running in circles with this Adam guy and pretty close to deciding to just never engage in this comment section ever again. I’d go into more things about how Lucy’s weird sex shit is clearly due to being a Christian, how she’s trying to balance what her sexual wants with her religion, yada yada yada, but I’m tired.
Yeah, I dunno, I realize Adam here isn’t a new person in the comments, but these ice cold takes + that send off read as… well, as a garden variety troll who THINKS they’re Andy Kaufman.
Either way, probably best not to dignify their comments with an actual response. A+ on zee’s memeing elsewhere!
Pretty sure he’s the one who vented on a comic eons ago about a messy divorce and his ex-wife basically being the devil, so yeah. These Lucy vitriol takes are uncomfortable but not surprising.
I mean, if they’re trying to Andy Kaufman, that would also have been part of the troll.
But even if they’re sincere, I don’t think it does anyone much good to engage with actual points and effort. If they’re not a committed troll, they’re definitely deep in an alternate reality version of the comic, where they cannot be reached X3
“and Lucy was paying very close attention to what he said and meant,”
Seeing how she replied, she likely wasn’t. It’s an easy misunderstanding to make.
Somebody posted the strips where Dorothy convinces Walky to ask out Lucy. Lucy and Walky are in her room, then Dorothy asks to talk to Walky outside. Lucy does not hear any of the conversation. He comes back in and asks her to get romantic dinner. Possibly she could have put two and two together, but acting like she knows is unfair.
Ah, young romance. For everything that’s happened, this really shouldn’t be enough to detonate the relationship. These two are kind of good for each other, they’re just not fully in sync yet.
Not all romance has to be deep and meaningful. Not all romance has to be spontaneous and in the moment. If these two could find some middle ground it could still work out for them.
Yeah, I think so too. Though it might be that youth is against them here, it can be hard to navigate difficult issues in relationship disparity and communication even with experience.
They’re not married with kids. Sure they have some stuff in common but Lucy can probably find someone who shares her interests AND doesn’t mind going to church. Someone who likes her as much as she likes him— someone who loves her.
And Walky seems to have no trouble attracting smart women who share his interests.
Okay, but the fact they *need* to find middle ground to me shows they are not good for each other. In a single argument? Sure. In taste of friends, enthusiasm, beliefs, family navigation this early? No. That’s the sign you aren’t good for each other romantically, but we’re better off as friends because you don’t get to spend a week in a more immersive relationship and start a tally list of things that need to be compromised on. First you need to figure out if they are things anyone should compromise on.
I just don’t see it. Nothing against either character (I don’t get why there are so many comments saying one or the other of them is terribly fucking up), I just don’t think they’re particularly compatible
To be honest I am with walky on this one (and not just cause every time lucy shows up she somehow becomes a worse and worse character). If I am stepping into supposedly holy ground on a weekend for you? It means I am trying to be in a relationship for the long term.
I will be a little disappointed in Walky if he doesn’t notice and call out that they’re doing the thing where one person in a relationship hears a revelation and then keeps freaking out before they can hear the context. If she’s still mad after she hears all the context to each part of this, fine, she can be mad. But if she won’t let him get out the context, they both know their tropes well enough to know that kind of thing leads to unnecessary drama.
Because there is context for each of these things that Lucy is freaking out about which makes them pretty darn reasonable. I don’t know if she’s mature / secure enough to actually listen and understand those reasons, but honestly, as much as Walky can be a hot mess, all of these are reasonable.
He didn’t feel ready to say I love you yet, no matter how much he likes her or how long they’d been hanging out, because he only started to think about her romantically late in that period. Yes, he talked to Dorothy, because even though she’s his ex, she’s also one of his most mature friends in a lot of ways, and asking her advice on a matter like this doesn’t mean he still secretly has feelings for her. And yes, Dorothy told him to ask Lucy out, because he was being dense and didn’t realize there was even a possibility of romance with Lucy, nor that his own feelings were moving that way. He’s been uncomfortable because he *does* like her so much, but didn’t feel like he could tell her without hurting her feelings; but he also respects her enough to not just lean into the misunderstanding and say something that he doesn’t mean. In fact, him not being ready to say it yet doesn’t mean he won’t be willing to say it in the future – he’s been avoiding saying it in part because when he does say it, he wants to mean it, and for the words to have weight.
Oh, but did he ever say “I love you” to Dorothy? Irrelevant. That was a different relationship, one which ended and which he’s moved on from, and relationships are not interchangeable. Sure, he can tell her if she really wants to know, but that doesn’t mean she can then use that information to compare the relationships against each other. Sometimes, when you really really like someone, it matters extra much to you to be sure. (Or possibly that’s just me.)
If she’s willing to listen – and I don’t expect any force short of common media tropes to be strong enough to reach her now – Walky could finally get this off his chest, Lucy could start to get past her unrealistic expectations of relationships, and their relationship could actually grow stronger from this.
To be clear, from Lucy’s perspective right now, this is a hard and painful conversation. But feeling like you *have* to do something because it’s expected of you – like gift-giving or saying “I love you” – really can suck the joy out of it. Walky has been putting a serious effort in here, and as of this strip, I’m actually convinced that maybe the issue isn’t that Walky is trapped in a relationship he doesn’t want to be in and which isn’t good for him, it’s just that he’s been struggling against this misunderstanding and doesn’t want to either say those words (which he knows are so important to Lucy) without really meaning them OR hurt Lucy’s feelings.
And you know what? I believe Walky has actually had enough character growth to be able to actually navigate this moment. Whether he will or not remains to be seen, but I think he plausibly could, and their relationship could be stronger – placed on a firmer footing – because of it.
Like what you’re saying is reasonable and mostly accurate but I assure you that this argument is happening due to the imbalance of feelings it’s making clear to Lucy. Yes, this was gearing up to be a fight, because Wally has with all the best intentions in the world just been trying to give Lucy what she wants and Lucy has been starting to suspect that this isn’t the relationship she’s built up in her head. It has to escalate, because they’ve seen eye to eye on precisely nothing coming out right now. It’s partly an ever mounting escalation, but that escalation is for good reason – misaligned values, perspectives and goals finally coming to light.
Whats she’s actually made about is Linda microagressing her with the word “slumming” ?
She repressed it, then lied about it to walky ( her reason for ending last night early) .
Now shes Projecting Walkys failure to say ” i love you” back , publicly in front of an audience, AS its own microagression.
She picked a fight over it. ( One she actually started way back when she pretended he said it public ) , and she’s blaiming Linda microaggressing her for changing walkys feelings.
Shes mad about something real, but its something else.
The Rest are a series of shitty of powerplays she did for dominance that are going to blow up in her face.
This is all passive aggressive dominance behavior. Walky expressed he doesnt want to do this in public but shes willing to violate his boundaries.
Walky doenst need to explain any of it, she does. Shes the one acting out.
Walky isnt willing to humilate her in public over this, but she will do the same.
Walky isnt willing to manipulate her, lie or deceive her into accelerating their relationship, or get in her pants; but she is 100% willing to do the same.
Its NOT just a misunderstanding over words. She KNOWS these things. Shes KNOWS they were not really Bf/gf when she was pretending ti date him. She was called out on this by Sarah and admitted this!
But she wants to change history in pretend inorder to have a public fight in church. Thats NOT what walky wants out of this relationship.
SHe KNOWS about Dorothy! This isnt New news. Dorothy literally came to her Bedroom.
She just want to pretend Dorothy didnt just set then up a few weeks ago, an an EXCUSE for why she pretended Walky said I love you.
It doenst matter of if her expectaions are unreasonable, and she drops them.
Becuase Walkys are fairly reasonable and shes strayed far from them.
and NO she doesnt really love him,either.
( do people really believe this? Do they think Lucy LOVES walky? Cmon)
She has a superficial crush, but mostly just loves the idea of having a boyfriend.
Walky is a …status symbol, for a girl who feels she has zero status.
Walky is Lucys Trophy Wife, and he just ruined that by being NOT being a good trophy and saying I love you on public.
Walky isnt in love with her either, but he is decent enough not to lie to get in her pants or publicly humilate her on purpose. But he did want to give this relationship a chance to develop.
and Lucy Doesnt. She doesnt want this relationship to develop.
She expects it all, right now. Fully bloomed, becuase she feel shes entitlled to walkys love; because she payed for it in the friendzone.
This is obv Incel Logic. and you dont fix it this type of entitlement by dating it. You fix it by DUMPING it, and the person learns not to do it next time.
Walky dumped Dorothy for less entitlement. And Amber Dumped Walky when he was too insensitive after Mikes death.
having read the rest of this dude’s comments, that “kinda” has to do a lot of work.
I agree that Lucy is kind of a passive aggressive character, and has some entitled ideas about love and relationships (ones that are often baked into churches like that).
But is she being intentionally manipulative? Definitely not. She’s just optimistically read a lot into things that weren’t there and now has the rug pulled out from under her and is reacting to it with shock and emotion (which is totally reasonable)
Yeah no she’s just kinda dumb. She has bad ideas about sex and romance bc, I mean bad ideas of sex and romance are force fed to you from birth. And she hasnt had the experience to smack her in the face with learning yet.
Between the fictional 18 year old and the weirdo grown dudes frothing at the mouth about her in the comments, shes not the one who’s “””””””””schizo””””””””” here
Cringe ass usage of that word btw.
My wife is schizophrenic, and she’s stable. She’d never behave like Lucy, it’s really unkind of you to use that as an insult. You may as well drop the r-word
This and also bpd being used as a pejorative, liiiiike. No. Despite what Hollywood has taught you, the “scary” NDs like bpd and npd and bipolar disorder are all things real people, not movie monsters, have; there is no “being an asshole” disorder.
Haha, I have BPD! So many people think it’s so evil, but I really just cry a bunch and don’t trust others easily. It’s so silly how much people trust the stereotypes put out by the media
My mom’s got bipolar disorder, plenty of friends have bpd or npd. It’s just like… not magic?? It’s just a different way people’s brains can be set up.
As someone with high empathy (for the usual reason, TRAUMA), like. Feeling other people’s feelings with them does not guarantee kindness. It often makes it harder to be a good, compassionate friend, bc you can be overwhelmed when they’re upset and not as good at listening to them!
(Also, @ my fellow high-empathy peeps, empathy isn’t magic either. We’re not sci-fi characters and we can and do misread other people’s emotions, lol.)
I don’t know what Lucy was expecting. She burned his crops, poisoned his water supply, and delivered a plague unto his dorm room and she thinks that was going to make him fall in love with her?
I mean did she though? I love the turn on the popular meme but she’s just been trying to exist in a relationship she thought was mutually devoted and passionate. Walky didn’t wilfully deceive her, but he did pick up on the imbalance and tried to soldier on without acknowledging it.
Oh, my comment was 100% a dig at the people painting Lucy as some sort of manipulative mastermind when she is, ultimately, just not that emotionally mature
But for the sake of continuing the bit, Lucy is LITERALLY the head of the mob. She orchestrated everything from the kidnapping to Sal getting caught at the convenience store. She has been at the core of EVERYONE’S suffering and STILL expects walky to love her. It’s DELUSIONAL.
Ahh my apologies, I’d forgotten how to read satire by the time I got this far down the comments.
Honestly I love the violence, I thought it was a really bold move of Willis to have Lucy torch rival girls’ wings to ensure there would be no other woman that could take his affections, then the twist that he actually fell for ETHAN, man. Good stuff.
Y’know I love her but I guess I have to admit that literally gutting his childhood pet and writing a marriage contract in the blood while threatening to take Dorothy next if he doesn’t sign, was a step too far.
Everyone wants to repeat their late teens and early twens but they forget it was mostly shit like this. Even if you could take all your memories and experience with you, you‘d still be surrounded by people who haven’t. ^^
„Youth is wasted on the young“ as the saying goes.
Walky is a poor, young fool who is desperately out of his depth and unfortunately making a bad situation worse.
Lucy is utterly out of pocket and needs an adult in her life who can adequately correct her. Instead she’s going to go to Billie who’s going to reinforce the idea that Walky is being an asshole here (he is *not*) and Lucy will never confront the ridiculous pressure she put on a young relationship.
I have to wonder if Billie would say Walky is being an asshole… 1)she’s been recognizing he’s attractive lately. 2)even if she didn’t find that disturbing, he’s *her* asshole “brother”. He’s the first person she went to when broken. She’s tried to gently ease him into understanding Sals position. She’s combative, dismissive, but she does seem to care about him as a person.
Like I know this was primarily aimed at Adam Black but if I had a nickel for every time I thought I’d managed to be concise, hit “Comment”, and saw a terrifying number of paragraphs…. 🥲
It was, but I admit sometimes I have trouble reading through your replies! I try really hard, but dyslexia makes this forum difficult in a wall of text
no, he needs to keep talking; everything needs to be put out in the open.
no more misunderstandings, no more half understandings. these 2 need to completely understand the situation from start to finish, only then can they figure out what to do properly.
“we’d been hanging out together for four months”
I feel like if you’re trying to date a person by just hanging out with them even harder that’s a long fucking time to go without giving up
anyway yeah rip the elliot reid situation
wonder what becky’s gonna say
don’t get me wrong it’s pretty normal to have strong feelings if you’ve known a person a while before dating (I’m not arguing over how long is a while; they’re both inexperienced) but, like, come on man
I feel bad for lucy here, walky could’ve pulled down the veil a lot sooner
I think Lucy is counting the fact that she hasn’t had sex with Jennifer yet, unlike Walky and Dorothy (who had sex with each other, not Jennifer either)
I remember when Lucy was enamored of the way Walky showed consideration for others, and wanted to stay on good terms with Dorothy. Guess we’ll see how that held up over time.
See Lucy ? now aren’t you glad you guys didn’t have sex ? (i say this not as a “protect your virginity” type way but as a its waaaaaay easier to break up with someone when you haven’t had sex)
Oh. Oh dear – there’s no time left for things to get more precarious in this relationship via ill-advised sexytimes – it’s crashing down in flames right now, before our eyes.
Like lancing a boil, this is simultaneously painful and a relief to observe.
Where did Hollywood go so wrong? I thought movies were supposed to be an escape from reality, a chance to put your worries aside and not have to think about any underlying ideas or concepts. Well, not anymore.
theonion.com/you-can...
It's not a new argument, of course, but Chesterton dismissed it effectively in 1908.
"You will hear everlastingly... this argument that the rich man cannot be bribed. The fact is, of course, that the rich man is bribed; he has been bribed already. That is why he is a rich man."
Aaron Rupar@atrupar.com ⋅ 17h
Hawley dismisses Trump lining his pockets with his memecoin: "Listen, I think nobody believes that Donald Trump can be bought. I mean, what does Donald Trump need more money for?"
wilbur, savvy enough to know he's in a comic strip but still not a great actor, awkwardly lifts a muffin up into frame so that we, the audience, understand that he has a muffin right now, which is very important narratively, but he's not really selling it well as an organic, human action
confirming that the reason there's been no Galaxy Version female characters in Blokees until now is that they felt they needed to make Round Lady Thighs For Ladies
It's #webcomicday? We have a special day???
Well, my name is Pat McHoarney and I draw 69 Mouse-Ear Blvd, a multigenerational story about women who all have sexy legs and probably other features. There was a grandmother, but she wasn't hot and so she died off-panel.
Elizabeth Holmes is in prison for defrauding investors through her blood-testing company, Theranos. Her partner, Billy Evans, is now trying to raise money for a company that describes itself as “the future of diagnostics.” nyti.ms/3FbtZm9
www.ebay.com/itm/23609767...
selling my netflix war for cybertron megatron -- the walmart exclusive one that came with pinpointer and lionizer (but being sold here without pinpointer and lionizer)
Gran... IS ALIVE?
okay, juliette still has brown hair, so this is probably definitely a flashback
i'm just surprised that the comic has remembered her, at all
Aaron Rupar @atrupar.com ⋅ 17h
Pavel
@spavel.bsky.social ⋅ 10d
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well THIS sure went a place in a handbasket
And in a church. Though I suppose that’s more poignant than it implies.
better to come out eventually but at least it’s better to be ‘guided’/suggested rather than “actually i’m still into dorothy/someone else but she wasn’t available and you were”
Look at it this way. From here the conversation has nowhere to go but up.
If the breakup completes, do we suspect that Walky will gravitate towards Dorothy, Amber, or something completely different?
Nah, Walky will gravitate towards videogames methinks.
Amber and underwear it is.
But the more important question, nuggets or nachos?
Walky reminds me of Ron Stoppable. I could see him eating many nacos.
Could he not create a nacho-nugget abomination conglomeration? Just add nuggets to the nachos
nacho cheese over nuggets
nachuggets
First: That’s Nachitos to you!
Second: Por qué no los dos? Nuggs with nachitos.
specifically Booster’s video games.
Oh shit what if he and Charlie hit it off…
Oh shit the Carla drama that will unfold…
Headcanon now.
I hope Walky gravitates toward “getting his shit together,” rather than toward yet another relationship, old or new.
At this point, he’s as much a serial monogamist as Danny.
–well okay, not quite as much as Danny, who doesn’t even want to have two crushes at the same time. But still! It would be OK to go chill a minute and catch up with himself.
I know a certain Mobson who could get a Bj for a slice of gay pizza
He’ll gravitate to more nachitos
Church. It went to church in a handbasket.
Neatly done.
Walky has a serious case of foot-in-mouth disease
I disagree. Lucy was primed to find the disastrous possibilities in interpreting anything he might say. He is, at last, talking seriously about something that is a wedge between them. There’s going to be some hard words said, and some hurt feelings. It’s unavoidable. They need to struggle to a common understanding.
This won’t resonate with some people here but I’m going to say it…this is not Walkys fault.
He came into this relationship looking to do this right and take his time, but it was starting to go south when Lucy sprung the premature “I love yous,” even walky knew this might be an issue. So what what did Walky do to avoid making a mistake and screwing up? He went to go get advice from the most mature and responsible person he knew, only for said person to decide make the worse possible advice imaginable which he still trusted.
But could Dorothy have given that advice on purpose?
Lol. I don’t think we need to turn this into some 4D chess move from Dotty. She gave bad advice that actually worked against her in the short term because she actually wanted to get back together with him. It wasn’t to plant seeds of discord, she can be just as dumb as anyone else sometimes.
Well, it’s Dumbing of Age and everyone does stupid things, to a greater or lesser extent depending on which character it is, but it’s already intriguing what Walky says tomorrow.
Still, no need to attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
I love (hehe) this rule, it makes the world less evil
and more stupid.
The advantage to conspiracy theories is that it gives the illusion that there is actually someone in charge of the madhouse.
Never underestimate the power of stupid people.
I would call that a disadvantage actually, it keeps you passive.
Ohhhh Žižek time! Paraphrased: Conspiracy theories are just what they (institutional powers) want you to believe, because it helps maintain their illusion of power and distracts from the real problems of structural inequality etc. that they contribute to maintaining.
@Regret: It’s a problem with believing conspiracy theories, but it’s a good deal of the appeal to them.
@Aura: Or does Žižek just want us to believe that?
@the jeff: You might have a point, what if he’s in on it and it’s all just a big coverup???
To a point. But at some point the stupidity is negligent and/or wilful, and is turning a blind eye, operating on unexamined instincts, and opting not to learn better, any less evil than doing things in full intentional cognisance?
Sure, that’s just the sort of thing that’s uppermost in my mind when my whole world is unravelling and I’m sacrificing my own happiness for the good of someone I care about even though it’s twisting a knife in my gut to do so.
Off topic completely, but I love the ‘The Banner Saga’ Gravitar!
On topic… Yep, mistakes were made. Honest mistakes, mistakes caused by faulty logic… But mistakes none the less.
Generally speaking, malice and stupidity are not mutually exclusive. Quite the contrary, in fact.
(Just take a look at the past decade [at the very least] of American right-wing political discourse, if you need proof of that.)
Yup. The big difference between “Good + Stupid” and “Evil + Stupid” is that G/S sometimes just does evil things by mistake, but at least tries to correct/counteract that evil once it happens. E/S, meanwhile, just does evil, the only difference being whether or not that evil actually advances their own goals. Raidah is a good example of the latter–a good bit of her own plotting is just getting in her own way, in terms of social climbing, but it’s still born from malevolent impulses.
“Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity, but don’t rule out malice.”
That’s the “Heinlein’s Razor” version of Hanlon’s Razor.
Many do not realize that the key word is actually “adequately.”
But Dorothy is presidential-material smart. Let me rephrase that…
Dorothy is high intelligence, low wisdom
Dumber.
Dorothy has a giant blindspot here:
managing others feelings and expectations in a romantic.
She seems unable to learn from mistakes. Youd think shed learn after Danny and then Walky, not lead people on.
But she really Got walky to do it. Do a Dorothy.
She was still actively trying to deprive herself of Walky at the time, so I think she was sincere in that advice.
“Sincere” advice isn’t necessarily good advice, mind you.
It’s nobody’s fault, but Walky sure chose the worst possible time to bring Dorothy into this conversation… tho I’ll admit when i was his age i probably could’ve made a similar error
It’s true, the blonde already has too many problems for Lucy to want to retaliate now.
Is it really an error, though? He basically seems to be putting all the cards on the table right now. If Lucy subsequently decides to just flip the table entirely and walk away, well… better for both of them, in the long run.
yeah personally when these types of things start to spiral, i find it best to just do exactly what walky did and explain very honestly how it happened. if someone responds to that with more misinterpretation, that’s their bad
Ok, try to play the empathy game here. Imagine you’re dating someone you’re in love with and under the assumption they love you back. Through casual conversation you suddenly find out they don’t. In the first minutes of trying to even process this information, they defensively inform you that the reason you were dating to begin with is cause their ex told them to date you. Its a lot to take all at once, man! That’s humiliation on top of heartbreak! If Walky was more sensitive, he could have realized it was time to stop talking after panel 2.
Like i said, when i was 18-19, i probably wouldn’t have done much better and blurted it all out once
It may hurt but better to rip that bandaid off now than use kid gloves to further lead on Lucy. And someone being honest, even if it’s painful, doesn’t mean they lack empathy.
I get what you mean but “I don’t love you and i never did” means the bandaid is already off. Walky is a grown ass man, he chose to date lucy and he chose to kick the love can down the road. Working in Dorothy’s role is just rubbing in salt
But what he actually said was “I don’t love you and never did. It’s too early for that to be a possibility! But I have every reason to believe our relationship will grow until I do” with an implied “so I didn’t want to hurt your feelings by correcting your misunderstanding when we were literally on the same page but separated by a bit of time” looping back to a stated “and I had this plan of action stamped and approved by an official Smart Person who Understands Feels and Relationships” with an implied “so you can’t be mad at me here!! I do not understand why you being mad at me appears to be on the table!”
It might have been better to say, “I needed advice, and I didn’t think you’d want me going to your roommate.” Still, I can’t really fault Walky here.
I think mistakes have been made. and Dorothy made a bunch here. and so did lucy.
walkys sole one seems to be not telling his mother off last night.
Yeah, dude tried to do everything right and you know what? He succeeded.
Agreed.
I agree. He’s been trying to do right by Lucy, he likes spending time with her enough that he does it a lot if not constantly. That he’s not in love after one week of being a couple is not a personal failing, nor is not being in love before they started dating, nor is the fact that someone he trusted gave him bad advice. Particularly when he was specifically asking for advice because he had no idea and would therefore be unable to identify bad asvuce.
This is a sad and inevitable fight, and I don’t really think either is being particularly shitty.
agree mostlty
Nah Lucy is being shitty.
She creating a public fight on purpose, being a drama queen, when shes knows how much walky hates public conflict.
Shes pretending she didnt know Dorothy set them up so she can fight about it.
Shes Pretending shes didnt know in the first place walky didnt say “I love you” and she did it to exagerate in public.
shes using this moment to fight in public over walkys mother when she refused to do it in private. and walky had minimal sleep so he can go to church with her.
Walky already chose her mutiple times, but shes insecure and sabotaging their relationship.
and a bunch of people have stepped on her feelings this week ( Sal, Billy, sarah, Linda ) and got under her skin. Rather than talk about this with walky shes acted out, assuming or demanding public performance of affection.
Wait “pretending”?
Do we have some reason to think she knows about Dorothy setting them up? Or that she didn’t really misinterpret Walky’s statement about love?
Fuck you mean pretending???????
don’t agree with every sentiment here but I 100% agree that Lucy willfully misinterpreted what Walky said. like ain’t no way she misheard him, she straight up made the conclusions she wanted to regardless what the words actually meant.
Why is there no way she misheard him? Even just the bias of wanting something really badly can lead to faulty perception, and people are already predisposed to perceiving what corresponds with their biases. I don’t see any reason to believe she doesn’t genuinely think he said he loves her. She’s obviously wrong, but what can be incredibly obvious to us is a lot less obvious to anyone in the strip.
I think this is incredibly uncharitable to Lucy. I see no reason to assume malice here. She’s been operating on a bad assumption and she’s built a whole house (of cards) on it and now the foundation is being ripped out. And I don’t think there’s any evidence that we’ve seen (and we’ve seen more than any individual character) that she knows the things she’d be required to know to be pretending what you say she’s pretending.
And keep in mind this is her first real relationship, so it probably feels like her entire world is ending. And on top of that she hasn’t had much opportunity to learn healthy ways of dealing with the many problems she’s gotten piled onto her.
I mean, not all bad things are someone’s fault! Sometimes neither side was communicating very well, even though they had the best intentions.
Sometimes a tree falls on someone and kills them. Sometimes a tree falls on a terrible, terrible person and doesn’t kill them.
(take a wild guess what state i live in)
A state with a lot of trees?
I’m assuming either Texas or Florida, cuz i remember a tree falling on some d-bag high up GOP’s car in one of the states, i just forget which. but it was either Rafael’s car or Matt’s car
I remember saying something similar in the Halloween arc, that Amber and Walky’s fight wasn’t anyone’s fault, they just had incompatible coping mechanisms–Amber needed to think about Mike more and Walky needed to be distracted from the trauma. Lucy and Walky have looked like a doomed couple since their inception. They’re both trying their best but some things are too innate to be fixed
The state of palm and your town is named “Face”?
I feel like I should come up with a better pun but I got allergy shots today and benadryl is messing with me.
I don’t think he did wrong in a vacuum.
I think where he tripped up slightly was that he didn’t make sure Dorothy was in the right headspace to be giving advice to her ex about relationship issues; he just trusted that she was okay, because she’s Dorothy.
Though I think Walky could have gone to other people to also talk about this… most of his friend group aren’t great about relationship issues either. Maybe Sal?
Walky has Dotty as the main option and let’s be honest, I don’t think she would ever consider the others as options, with Sal I dare say that I never ask her for fear of saying something that will really upset her.
The best person to give advice is dead. Lucy throws up so many red flags here, Mikr’s advice would’ve been spot on, too.
How would fucking Lucy’s mom help anything?
Mike might have appreciated another nickel.
I mean, they probably wouldn’t be having this conversation right now if he had soooo….
sometimes bridges need to be burnt
Very well worded. I’d go a step further in that I wouldn’t even necessarily say it was the worst advice possible for Dorothy to give. Not the best advice for any long-term relationship, sure, but they’re young kids in college, not adults settling down with their marriage partners. Suggesting he just let it go when there was a solid chance he’d feel it down the road as the relationship developed was fine enough advice for a college relationship…at least up until the point where taking things to the “next level” became a thing given that then it flirts with it being under false pretenses.
Of Course Walkys done nothing wrong. ( almost nothing. He didnt defend his gf to his mother )
This self sabotage is all on Lucy, and I am here for it
Oh Lucy! I agree that Walky has been honest and well-meaning. But clueless haha. Lucy is just not grounded enough to have a relationship with anyone. This relationship breaking up now is a blessing in disguise for them both, I hope Lucy won’t stuff it all back in and pretend everything is fine just to be a girl with a boyfriend.
Well no, Lucy needs to have relationship experiences like this to ground her, she is not gonna learn where her blind spots are without getting behind the wheel, so to speak. This is blowing up but it will be necessary for growth on both their parts.
All the love stuff aside it’s probably still a big gut punch revelation for Lucy. She’s had to deal with Walky’s mom tell her she’s not the “right(white)” type of girl for him and then she learns that the girl that his mom would like told him to go out with her and he’d eventually grow into the relationship.
From her position it would definitely reek of Walky is dating a black woman because he thinks he’s supposed to to counter his mom. Which is at least partially true since he’s still feeling guilty over how his mom treats Sal
Hey now, Jennifer is like, passably white to them, I guess? Maybe she’ll do in a pinch.
Nah, she probably accepts that she’s asian because his mom definitely buys into the Model Minority thing
Jennifer did mention to Carla once that she was the Walkertons’ ‘white-passing daughter’.
So I think she’s at least clocked that much.
Interesting analysis, but I think it’s giving Lucy too much credit to say she’s already processing all of that. We’ll see.
Yeah, I really think that may come later but not necessarily the first place her mind is gonna go to here.
If he did everything right there wouldn’t be any revelations right now, because she’d already know.
This exactly. His issue was trying to go along with her view of things when he knew she didn’t have a realistic view on his feelings or investment. It was well intentioned and to minimise conflict and try to give the potential relationship a proper try, but it was still lying by omission at every occasion that he clocked a disparity in how she saw him vs how he saw her.
The next bit is as an aside, not directly related to your comment, just a tangent.
People say they’re teenagers, this isn’t marriage, but it remains often the case that people you date at university end up being people you marry or at least spend several years with beyond college. In many cultures and in earlier eras in places like the US and UK, women saw college as a means to meet men to marry. I’ve gone back to school recently and I still see that impression among much of the youth attending school with me, I think we infantilize young adults pretty significantly in the last 10 years especially. Considering many people have their first live in partner by the time they leave undergrad, between 22 and 25, why is it weird for two university students to approach dating with longer term prospects in mind? All of the parents in the comic so far have been evaluating romantic partners in terms of suitability as life partners.
I agree that it’s not weird to view college-age dating as having long-term prospects and going in with that in mind.
I think a week is maybe a touch premature to have expectations that a specific relationship is already on its way there. But also this is a very reasonable mistake to make in one’s first serious relationship.
Sure but I don’t think it’s unusual to assume you’ve reached “I love you” territory with someone you’ve had a crush on for four months, even if the actual dating time has been a week, and “I love you” isn’t marriage. She’s shown clear awareness of social norms for relationships, but her read with deference to those has always been misaligned to Walky’s. In fairness, I do also think Walky has been operating half in the notion that this could be his Big Relationship that lasts through uni, which is why he tried to sober her expectations of spending time with his parents, and why he is going through this effort with church and things. She is trying to move faster than his feelings are, but also she’s moving as fast as she perceives him moving – saying he “loves” her, introducing her to his parents, joining her for church, she’s reading all of this preferentially as signs of his long term interest in her. We’ve seen other characters fall into relationships with what would clearly be construed as some form of romantic love fuelling the dynamic, it’s just that it hasn’t been mutual here.
The time frame comes off as disingenuous because others have gotten more invested than Wally is in Lucy in shorter time, including Walky himself with Dorothy. Lucy isn’t a girl he met off of Tinder, he’s known her for months.
I’m not saying Lucy’s feelings are premature, her expectations are. I’m very much of the opinion that she heard what she wanted to hear in terms of the “I love you” that didn’t actually happen, and she wanted it that badly because she was already there and really wanted him to be too.
I think the timeframe disparity is important, because it really has that gap between the two of them. I don’t think Walky really considered dating Lucy until it was suggested to him, and he thought that she was pretty cool and that could work, with long-term potential. And I think he made a choice to try to work in that direction, which I think is very emotionally mature on the Walky Scale.
But Lucy never caught the possibility that the feelings development gap was there, not through fault of her own, but because she doesn’t have a lot of experience. I hope she’ll learn from this. More clear and explicit talk of where they are feelings-wise could have headed this off.
I support your take and mostly agree with you, but of the two parties one was aware of both their feelings and the other person’s and how they didn’t align, and that was Walky. He is not in the wrong for not returning her feelings, he’s probably not even in the wrong for trying to give her a chance, but everything he is revealing in this comic is because he was aware on some level that talking about these points with Lucy would upset her. This conversation is happening because Lucy’s finally starting to become aware that there’s an imbalance in feelings between them. Walky should have been honest, but also Lucy should have seen the many signs of reluctance in her previous efforts to assert her affections for him.
THROW THE PEW
Woo wrath, just ask for forgiveness after 8D;
Wreck the pub!
Altar-flippin’ time!
Just one after another
Pew pew pew
atta heng
you have vanquished me
–Dave, wrecked by oranges
We have a winner.
Do they make steel pews at all? Feels like we’re crying out for a “Bah God, it’s…” given the venue.
The DoA equivalent to this.
Gah, now I’m remembering the penultimate scene from The Graduate, with Ben swinging that 4′ metal cross from side to side like a sword to keep the crowd at a distance while backing out of the church.
Wow! I do not remember that part at all, but it sounds riveting!
*plays “O Fortuna” by Carl Orff on hacked muzak*
Perfect choice! Wow… I love that.
I had the amazing fortune to perform it with the Philadelphia Orchestra, half a lifetime ago. An absolutely precious memory, to treasure always. Thank you for the gem of a reminiscence.
(*Carmina Burana, I mean. Not just, “O Fortuna.”)
…Or, as the cat sighs: “Oh! For Tuna…” ;-9
I couldn’t find a recording of that performance — way too long ago! But this one is nice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOVP7qfWMA8
And just in case anyone is burning the midnight oil, as I am, or scrambling, as Walky is right now, here’s “Classical Music on a Deadline”:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwY7w0k3j2Y
Oooo nice choice!
When in the need for speed, I play Pizza Tower music, “Oregano Mirage” is perfect octane ^O^
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aV1pmoSfRQ
Yummers! 8-9
“Statuary on his knees… salsa cookies windmill cookies, they’ll give you gonorrhea”
This is the one I remember: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dbTAiEFmMjE&pp=ygUMT2ggZm91ciB0dW5h 11 years old
Also, no problem, glad what I posted lead to that trip down memory lane 🥲
I’m glad this is finally happening
Same!
makes me wonder how his parents would react lol, even if they don’t like lucy as much as dorothy i’d think they’d react slightly diff to ‘she dumped me’ versus him ending the relatoinship
Oh, well now this is on him. I thought he might save it for a sec there. Walky x Lucy stocks are in the mud.
I don’t think saving the relationship was in the cards, but saving his dignity might have been. That’s gone now.
Oh, I don’t think his dignity was in the cards, either.
This is not completely on him. She puts a lot of pressure on this relationship
Not saying there’s a good way to handle this but “my ex told me to date you” is maybe the worst thing you could possibly say during this argument short of like confessing to murder
I should have listened to my father and opted for Amber.
I realized that yesterday when we were playing vidiogame in her room in our underwear.
Of course it was because Dorothy told me to date you. I would do absolutely anything for Dorothy.
You’ll have to find some new people to hang out with. People were only tolerating you because of me.
I feel like a lot of room for worse things that Walky could possibly say that have nothing to do with murder, except possible his upcoming murder by Lucy.
This thread of alternatives are beautiful and I still hold out hope that a few of them come up in canon.
To give us a chance, I even turned Dorothy down when she was coming onto me.
And then Dorothy came into the room but I swear nothing happened! Amber was just letting me play with her Switch while we tag teamed my Nachitos!
Its not on him at all.
If Lucy had ever told walky about her feelings, he would have dated her months ago, and their feelimgs would be on the same page.
She manipulated walky into a relationship and is shocked its not Love at first sight.
Yup, she could have asked him out but instead she waited like a good little Christian or character from a Jane Austin novel.
Whoa, manipulated into a relationship is a pretty tall order. She just was his friend and hoped he’d reciprocated feelings, it was third parties clocking her infatuation and recommending her as an option that led to him asking her out. She’s delusional about his feelings, but no moreso than the average teen getting into their first relationship with a crush they’ve had for months.
Define manipulation and explain, with sources from the text, how it even remotely applies here
God I wanna read the comic you’ve been reading where Lucy is this genius, malicious, 4D playing villainess bc boy does it sound interesting, and completely different from this comic.
She crushed like a school girl for a few months while enjoying a friendship with him and then Dorothy told him to ask her out. If you can’t explain where this manipulation comes in, I’m gonna just chalk it up to (hopefully subconscious) misogynoir and move on
There’s no manipulation here, but you’re right that if she’d said something the relationship probably would have started much earlier and they’d have been closer to the same page. (Unless she said it too early, when he was still too messed up from the fallout from Amber and the kidnappings.)
To be clear I’m not talking about the relationship, just him majorly failing his saving roll on the charisma check. He had a chance and blew it.
I hate how D&D just lumps every social situation into a charisma check as if the only possible way to relate to other human beings is rizzing them.
It was the 70s and we were nerds. Every stat on the sheet, with the possible (possible) exception of Intelligence, was an attempt to model things we didn’t have.
Let’s have him roll for constitution
Chivalry and Sorcery at least split it into Appearance, Bardic Voice, and Charisma.
We did try that extra Comliness Stat for a hit minute
There’s also persuasion and intimidation. Persuasion might actually fit better here. And charisma itself isn’t necessarily just for romancing it just represent how affable a person is in any given scenario. High charisma more accurately means you’re good at talking or have a positive reputation.
Those are still CHA-based in the editions I’ve played (4e had Diplomacy instead of Persuasion, but still CHA-based). I think there’s a good argument to be made for a WIS-based approach though, and I often take advantage of how 5e is structured in order to enable swapping attributes in skill checks.
now now, some social situations CLEARLY require Wisdom checks
–Dave, or Constitution
I still don’t think we’ve figured out a perfect speech check system. Persuading someone is much harder to simulate in a game than hitting things with pointy sticks.
I mean charisma is just being likable. In DND it’s generally just knowing how people work. That is most social interactions as far as I can tell
There are various social skills, mostly based on Charisma, but they get modifiers for the individual skills. It’s not all based on “rizz”, since that means something distinct, even if it does come from Charisma.
There is “no saving throw” on charisma,
without lying and manipulating Lucy or letting her to that to him.
But Lucy backed him into a corner. He did the right thing. He should have done it sooner but took Dorothys very bad advice.
This is 100% on Lucy. She heard him correctly the first time, and has used it to try to manipulate walky and deceive herself ever since.
I’m not trying to actually analyze who is at fault here. I was trying to milk some humor out of Walky’s flub. I don’t blame Walky or Lucy for this falling out, but I will say you’re not giving Walky his credit in this. He also made choices that lead them both here.
Just to reiterate and expound on my reply to your comment above – Lucy isn’t manipulating because she doesn’t have the self awareness or social awareness to understand either her own headspace or Walky’s, or how they differ. She has been operating with the assumption that his innocuous exuberance and positivity are specifically love for her, this is extremely normal for teenagers with little or no romantic experience. She has excessive zeal and a very flat view of how things are meant to work, that will hopefully develop into something healthier after this confrontation.
Walky on the other hand, has complete awareness of both situations, but is trying to give Lucy what she wants, because he took Dorothy’s advice to heart. Walky is in the only position to properly manipulate here due to his objective understanding of where they both are emotionally, but he mainly has wanted to just be a good boyfriend to Lucy.
That’s a valid interpretation. My read was she genuinely misinterpreted him. Walky knew she misinterpreted him as he asked Dorothy for advice. Then he took her bad advice which caused it to blow up in his face.
I don’t think either as at fault really. Except naivety on both sides.
Not to mention a lot of emotional manipulation.
yup.
Lucy never misheard him.
She’s been working in extremely hard on building a fantasy world and now it’s crumbling in front of the alter.
This is weird retconning absolutely did mishear him, we saw her reaction in the comic? We have seen subsequent similar instances where he says something innocuous and neutral and she takes it as a sign that he’s basically in it for life. That’s misinterpretation we literally see her internal monologue in these situations where she is like “omg he sees me as part of his family!!”
Maybe the disagreement here is over “hear”. If Lucy did not miss or garble any of the words Walky said (and I think that’s true), but extracted an understanding very different from the meaning that he was encoding in his words, is that mis-hearing or mis-perception? “Love” in contemporary English lies at the bottom of a deep well of multiple meanings and sloppy usage. That’s why I’ve become very careful of how I use that word, because it’s powerful.
Or is it willful misperception? Human beings are known for hearing what they want to hear.
Maybe, but Adam seems to be reading it as much more intentional thing – understanding what he meant, but using it to manipulate him, which I don’t see at all.
She did not mishear anything. Nothing in the comic illustrated that Lucy heard “I love you” when Walky said “I love that *about* you,”. I feel like if that had been the case, Willis would have shown that through the medium. Her reaction shows that she misinterpreted what he meant, and willfully. I’m not saying she did it with conscious malice, but she either does not understand that someone saying “love” in the vicinity of your name doesn’t mean they are IN LOVE with you, or she chose to interpret it how she wanted to.
That’s so weird to even suggest. You know what kind of social shit comes from saying “I love you too” if you knew the other person didn’t mean it that way? The secondhand cringe from that comic was legendary. She genuinely thought he meant that he loved her, that is in no way a manipulation. Yes, she wanted to hear “I love you” from that, but it was not some sort of “If I PRETEND he said he loved me that will make it true!” As evidenced by this whole in-comic exchange where she finally realised he wasn’t actually returning her affections. She even still thought he was then, until ostensibly the corrections in today’s strip, though time will tell on that front.
A bold claim. Got anything to point to that backs it up?
it’s prolly for the best they split up unless lucy goes unhinged and controlling like “I won’t *let* you break up with me” but i imagine walky would def run off at that point unless she goes full on stalker or so
I think it’s been for the best that they break up for pretty much all of the relationship. This hasn’t been particularly good for either of them.
/popcorn eating intensifies
Church would be better with popcorn.
Or nachos! I’d sit through just about anything if I could do it while eating nachos. They’ve saved some lousy sporting events.
You’re looking for a United universalist church. I’m a queer atheist and I sang lead in the choir, so l to will say: THEY HAVE THE BEST SNACKS
Genuinely asking, what kind of songs were sung?
Some hymns because they were about love and a lot of pop music from the 70s and the 90s. We had a lesbian couple on their 60s who played piano and guitar for us, too. The woman who played the guitar was trans, and she had transitioned during the 70s, so that was her favorite era of music
Walky forgot the first rule of holes.
When you hit rock get a mining pick so you can dig deeper?
sometimes a hole needs to be dug.
“You can only dig your way out if you remember what stairs are like”?
Do not dig a hole while inside a hole?
Avoid yellow spotted lizards at all costs?
Is Becky still here or has she slipped out the back?
I hope she’s just off panel. I hope she has popcorn
she is now hiding behind one of the aforementioned doors
–Dave, with Dina, who came by to pick her up from church
100% still here, likely frozen in place because she has no idea what else to do.
at the very least, unless they were the last to leave , they’d def have other eyes on them/overhear by now
Every Syllable That Comes Out of Walky’s Mouth Makes It Worse: The Comic!
Everyone always wants to hear “I only asked you out because my ex told me to,” that’s like peak romance, everyone agrees
i mean, it’s not the ideal situation, but an ex being able to talk to you and suggest someone else is pretty mature otherwise (idk if Dorothy had any underlying motives but i don’t think it was anything malicious)
The issue starts when your relationship with your ex is better than with your S.O., and you drop that bomb in the middle of a spat
If he told her Before, clearing the air style, it would have strengthened their relationship. Lucy would know not to feel threatened by Dotty, and that she supports their relationship, as someone Walky trusts enough to give crucial life advice.
Doing it this way shows this was more about Walky and Dorothy(whatever label or lack thereof you want to put on the pair of ’em) than what’s good for Lucy.
This right here is exactly it. It hurts Lucy because he doesn’t talk to her about how he feels but he can talk to Dorothy, and she’s just learning now that actually no, he doesn’t love her, and he was conflicted because of that.
“””””supports”””””
+1
+1
I mean I think what happened more recently, where she apologized for “pushing” him at Lucy and tried to get back together with him, was… LESS good, pff, and maybe Walky can make all of this much worse by bringing that up just as clumsily as he’s brought up the rest of this—
–but in the moment, yes. I think Dorothy tried to choose being a good friend to Walky over what she wanted herself. As terrible as most of the commentariat found the advice, I don’t think it came from a bad place, and I do think if Walky weren’t revealing all of this at once and making Lucy feel like he shares not only more with Dorothy in general but also this specific thing…
Like, think of it from Lucy’s perspective for a moment, as someone who barely knows Dorothy. Not only is this kind of her and Walky’s private personal business, it’s also probably pretty humiliating to imagine someone else in Walky’s social circle knowing he isn’t in love with her, while she continues on obliviously.
Especially for Lucy specifically, who has said things now and then that imply she doesn’t have a lot of friends in college and was bullied in high school. If you don’t know Dorothy, it’s pretty easy for this to mutate into a nightmare scenario in your head where people are laughing at you behind your back. People who used to date your boyfriend. :/
Dorothy did have underlying motives, iirc- avoiding the temptation of falling back in bed with Walky, and/or tying up loose ends were she to accept Yale.
But yeah, no malice there
Garbage Scow. All hands on deck. Hard to Starboard!
Aye aye, Cap’n!
Does Garbage Scow have a Garbage Roof? Or would it be a Deck?
we come on the sloop Gar-B
–Dave, let me go home, I wanna go ho-o-ome
You dropped your rose tinted glasses
She still has them on. Note her interpreting hanging out as retroactively dating. My money is on her accusing Dorothy of using walky to somehow Mean Girl her.
With the way she’s been interpreting things, Lucy might do that stupid thing.
I think Lucy is clever enough to figure out that Dorothy threw Walky at her so she(Dorothy) wouldn’t be tempted back slide into Walky.
Honestly….I really doubt it
Me too.
Well, IIRC, it seemed at the time that Dorothy had sought out Walky to suggest a booty call. Then she saw him and Lucy together, and, for whatever reason, decided not to go through with it and told Walky to ask Lucy out instead. I got the impression she was trying to be kind to them both.
+1
I don’t think what she did then has any connection with her later attempt to get Walky to leave Lucy for her. One was considered and thoughtful, the other part of a severe downward spiral.
Nah, there were all sorts of hints that she was going to him to suggest getting back together, but then threw him at Lucy to keep herself from weakening.
As Jennifer pointed out right afterwards.
Think we have had a misunderstanding because I am saying, I don’t think Dorothy gave Walky bad advice on purpose to sabotage his relationship with Lucy.
Okay, and ALSO I think she was also trying to do right by Walky, not JUST trying to stop herself from being tempted. I think Jennifer was not wholly wrong, but I think her interpretation was unkind.
Fair, I read you as saying she wasn’t even considering getting back together with him when she wound up telling him to ask Lucy out.
I agree she wasn’t deliberately giving him bad advice.
My read is Lucy thinks that knowing someone for 4 months is long enough to fall in love even if youre not dating (which is true but obviously varies person to person). I think she’s just insulted Walky was in some way pushed to date her i.e. he wasn’t like “wow Lucy is awesome, I’m going to date her!” which yeah isn’t flattering from her perspective.
Yeah, I’m pretty sure she only brought up “it’s been four months” because Walky pretty directly said that she shouldn’t have said “I love you” to him because they’d only been dating a week, so she pushed back, to the tune of “yes but it’s not like I only met you a week ago”.
Less “how can you NOT be in love with me after four months”, more “c’mon, it’s not actually like I fell for you in a week”.
Frankly I really appreciated her response because the number of people pretending them, established friends, dating for a week is the same thing as two randos met up Offa tinder dating for a week feels like it’s intentionally crapping on Lucy for having a legitimate crush and sexual attraction to Wally when that sort of thing has been what has motivated most romantic interactions between cast members to date. She equates it with love, because she’s inexperienced, honestly some people never learn that isn’t love.
All of this!
People’s dislike for Lucy is just making less and less sense to me the more reasons they give. With her being a recent addition, paired with a fairly loved character- I guess the fact that they had no chemistry just made people blame her for it? And her biggest flaw is her delusional nature, and being delusional isn’t a socially acceptable enough flaw? A lot of these characters have pretty egregious problems, but the response to Lucy has been really uncomfortable.
I’m also a friendless delusional girl though, so I guess I just relate to much. Related a lot to Joyce too despite never being a fundie haha.
I think if anything it’s a transferring of peoples annoyance at Lucy who’s actually a somewhat nice/pleasant if boring character who you wouldn’t really want to see something bad happen to be so bound and determined floor her car into the wall of this imploding relationship. At first it might not of been so bad because hey it’s going to happen I guess, but as it got stretched out and her hopes kept getting up it’s kind of like “just pull the rug out from under her already!”
I don’t think she was done any favors either by being essentially introduced as “Black Joyce” in and out of universe. I agree with your assessment as well!
nonono
she was introduced as Straight Joyce
(that actually wasn’t my introduction to her, because I read Shortpacked, but DoA is intended to stand on its own)
Alright, I’m calling time. They’re finished in less than two weeks. Sal gets a cookie.
lol at least sal isn’t the gloating type (well maybe if it had been malaya/someone else she disliked)
Sal’s reaction will probably be a good chunk of exasperation but also sympathy for her brother, sympathy for Lucy if she hears any of the specifics, and then like……… also a little bit of “well it’s a good thing I decided Mom’s super conditional love wasn’t worth it, because otherwise I’d have egg on my face here after going to bat for you two”.
Maybe a SMIDGEON of “I told you so”, but also plenty of “I’m sorry I was right”, if Walky actually seems to be hurting.
The smugness of mom will be great and terrible.
yeah sal was just a lighthearted jab for the most part, idk what she thought of dorothy and walky as a couple and was ok with amber but i imagine if it were more serious she’d be like “you really dont’ wanna date my brother trust me”
I’m not sure we have Time of Death quite yet, but it sure is going down fast. I think you’re right about Sal calling it.
Agreed. I’m hesitant to actually pronounce time of death, either. I don’t think this is GOOD, but I can see a wait out or two; it all depends on what Willis wants to do here.
*way out or two
Keep trying Walky, I’m sure you can get your foot deeper into your mouth
I’m not sure that’s the body part/orifice combo that’s happening here.
I’m commander shepherd and this is my favourite comment on the citadel today.
Though I don’t think the prototypical orifice/body part that comes to mind in this question is at play here – honestly I’d say this would be that body part starting to leave that orifice for both parties over the course of this comic.
He’s like an oroborus caused by too much honesty waaaaay too late.
Ironic that he’s confessing the truth about his love in a church that, to my knowledge, doesn’t do confessions.
Oof, this isn’t just regular hole Walky is falling into, he’s stumbled headfirst into an antlion pit.
that’s already full to the brim with Christians
–Dave, and turn the metaphor dial up THREE! MORE! NOTCHES!
I always look for your comments, your signatures give me such a smile
-Mym, beaming from your humor
The people who dressed you up in a mouse costume for Jesus would really rather you be with an atheist Jew.
I think that was more mercenary trying to kickstart a child acting career than any sincere devotion.
squeak
walkys parents prolly don’t rly care that much about the religious aspect, i think that part was more of a child actor thing versus spreading some kinda message since i’m sure it’d be easy to convince their own church to have their kid in a vid
Does Amber count as Jewish because of her step-dad?
The atheist Jew (more or less) is Dorothy.
Well, look who shattered your illusions, Lucy.
About damn time.
In a minute, she’s gonna need a sentimental man or woman to pump her up after this heartbreak.
I’d have said Raidah, but they’re (still) in a church and Raidah goes to mosque.
Raidah wanted the Walkerton connection. I doubt she’ll have much use for single Lucy.
That means this comic is going to do the exact opposite and Lucy will go talk to Jennifer, right?
Depending on Jennifer’s mood and/or willingness to help, that might actually give Lucy some straightforward information to chew on of the ‘not what she wants to hear but what she needs to hear’ variety.
i mean, it’s not like she wasn’t warned but i think it was general disdain or cynicism of walky’s ‘boyfriend material’-ness versus parental problems beforehand
There were other signs that walky wasn’t as “into” the relationship that Lucy was:
– their late night “date” following roller derby, where walky was more interested in the chocolate chip pancakes than the potential of a sexual encounter
It’s funny, because while it’s basically text that Walky isn’t into the relationship as Lucy, the way “he wasn’t up for sex” is so focused on is so incredibly gendered.
No one would be using that as a reason if we gender swapped the couple, but we assume that if a guy doesn’t jump at a chance for sex, he must just be completely uninterested.
Yes, though it’s also based on Walky in previous romantic interactions. He has been into make outs and had pretty intense physical attraction previously, especially to Dorothy. His lack of any indicated interest outside the shirt licking incident is just unusual for him given the romantic history we’ve seen.
I also think that particular moment being brought up repeatedly as proof that he WAS into her is a factor. That it happens to be a moment of probably-sexual attraction is almost coincidental tho, because what it was being used to argue was “Walky IS into her, though, it’s NOT one-sided, see? Remember how she licked his shirt in Taco Bell and he got flustered?”
If we had a moment where he got similarly flustered by say handholding, but only ONE moment, and otherwise the exact same relationship, I think folks would be similarly talking about how he only wanted to hold hands with her the one time… if that makes sense, lol.
I do agree that he hasn’t shown the same kinds of physical interest that he did in Dorothy and Amber. Altogether I think there are signs that there is an issue here.
I also suspect he’s been worried about this love thing and going too far under false pretenses. Or further confirming her existing false assumptions.
It’s just when it gets reduced to “Dude doesn’t jump at chance for sex. This relationship is dead.”
Yeah, and again it’s only really a Relationship Issue because their levels of desire are SO different. At the very least they need to talk about it.
I don’t think it’s at all out of character considering his entire prior experience has followed a pattern:
1. Fun times
2. Sexy times
3. Fiery doom
I might be super-cautious too.
I have to disagree.
If you have a couple (who were supposedly dating) and the roles were reversed (i.e. on a day where sex was planned/expected) and the woman instead wanted to do something mundane, it would certainly be an indication that SOMETHING was wrong.
Ok, maybe a single incident isn’t hardcore proof, but if it is part of a regular pattern it would certainly be evidence of lack of sexual/romantic interest. (like the stereotypical “I have to wash my hair tonight”)
Yeah and if they hadn’t had sex yet and the guy had been trying to set an artificial timeline for how soon they should do it and the woman kept finding excuses to put it off, there would be something wrong, but most of us wouldn’t take it to be a problem with her.
More specifically, men are assumed to be ready for sex by default. Women are assumed to be the gatekeepers.
If a woman isn’t ready at an early stage in the relationship even though the man wants to, that’s not seen as a evidence she’s not into him, just that she’s not at that stage yet.
But the thing is, there doesn’t seem to be any “rational” reason for Walky to have wanted to wait.
He isn’t a religious person (so he doesn’t have any sort of christian morality to worry about). He had sex with Dorothy fairly early in their relationship (wasn’t it sort of on their first date?) And he never expressed any sort of reluctance before, when Lucy was talking about her “3rd date” rule.
Ultimately yeah, there’s nothing that says Walky HAS to be willing to have sex on demand, and who knows… maybe if this relationship actually lasts then his “pancakes over sex” preference might just have been a one-off thing.
ah yes, walky’s usual grace and deftness when handling an emotionally difficult situation. glad we can always rely on something in this life.
I’m in the minority, but Lucy is still being foolish.
Oh, they’re both being idiots. She was expecting WAY too much from the relationship, but Walky is doing an impressive job of making things worse every time he speaks right now.
Everyone in the comic is a different kind of idiot. Hence its namesake :p
By the moment that they first had a relationship, the equanimity-preserving moves had already been eliminated. They need to go through this, whether it splits them or brings them together.
Alright, over/under on how many strips before they break up?
2.
Just in time for the weekend and a look in either on the Sarah and Jacob situation, or to see how our dear Carla is doing. As much as I’m hoping for more on the former, my favorite character was beginning to look a bit fragile on top of way vulnerable.
Unless he pulls a fucking miraculous save it’ll be over by the end of the next one.
Does he even want to save it though?
he’s only in this because he followed dorothy’s advice.
What would he even be saving? he doesn’t love her, and she probably doesn’t have the patience to wait for him to force himself to do so.
Maybe! In panel 1 he does say he likes her very, very much, so it’s possible he’s not actually ready for this to end yet (barring things going super-south now).
Why do people expect him to be in love after only one week of dating? Is this how it really works? Like, are people really just not allowed to date without being In Love? I always thought dating was what you did to get to know someone in an intimate/couple rather than simply friendly context.
The dating you’re describing is what you do with someone you don’t already spend time with who doesn’t go in your social circles. The kind of dynamic and friendship Walky and Lucy have had has been the sort that, if there was attraction, would have developed for Wally by now already.
In abstract yes, it’s normal to date without feelings established. In this context having known of one another and hung out semi-regularly for a while before dating, yes it’s weird that he initiated this without feeling stronger first. Especially, getting into it knowing her attraction to him was obvious enough that at least one of his other friends that he knows of got the picture just from seeing them together.
That’s not true either. That implies people can’t just be oblivious and that feelings can’t change with time, especially when you start thinking about someone romantically.
Been there, done that.
I’ll grant you I’ve never been in the position of being oblivious to another person’s attractiveness nor their feelings for me. I will say I’ve had two pretty close friendships with two people who I’m pretty sure still to this day would jump up and say “yes!” To me asking them out, have confessed to me 20 years ago, have confessed again 10 years ago, have both confessed in the last two years, and yet we’ve never dated because I knew I just didn’t see them that way. Meanwhile I’ve never been physically attracted to someone first then become friends with them, I’ve always seen what that person is like as a person, had one-on-one interactions with them, and established a view of them. My husband famously worried that I’d eventually realise he wasn’t that great and dump him, and I still after 9 years think he’s basically the best person ever. But I also never had that infatuation I have had with a few people. Attraction, yes, admiration and respect definitely, lack of infatuation proved to be a good thing though as it meant we established our relationship based on what we appreciated about one another rather than letting effectively butterflies and new romance energy dictate whether we wanted to be together. There are a lot of different ways to feel about people, I will allow that people can be oblivious and start thinking about someone romantically and may even come to like or even prefer them.
I’m not sure I believe that can happen for Wally in this situation though. He likes her but it feels like he mainly wants to date her because he likes her and knows she’s infatuated with him.
way i see it, dating in something you do with a person you like to see if that “like” will blossom into love.
that’s why we have bf/gf before marriage.
dating is the trial period before signing up for a full account.
He entered this on advice. I think he’s found his own reasons to be in it.
And the advice was basically: “You idiot, can’t you see she’s into you?”
Lucy is: A) the one who really wants this and B) the one blowing it up.
Why and how could Walky “pull a save”?
There’s a reason ‘miraculous’ was in that sentence, and it wasn’t because I think Walky somehow unfucking this is likely.
I’m going to give a miraculous*~*nine*~* because we cut away to Faz for a mini adventure
Ten because we follow Faz’ adventure with Dina having a bowl of cereal.
Deal
The great Faz has prepared this chart outlining the itinerary of this adventure with special attention paid to quantifying how great he is.
That’s half the adventure, and I love every panel
The perfect time to find out what Danny and/or Sal are doing this fine Sunday morning.
in a surprise twist: not each other!
I’m gonna take the long odds and say they talk it out, everyone stronger, and last til the end of the semester. It’s so unlikely, but if it happens I’m gonna win so many Internet points for it.
I say she should’ve been clued in when he compared dating her to buying a value menu taco. It’s almost like dating a girl out of convenience was never gonna work.
Ehh, we’ve known Walky longer than she has and I *still* wouldn’t feel sure he wouldn’t use that in a wedding vow.
This conversation has definitely hit rock bottom and can’t possibly go any direction but up from here.
I am excited to watch Walky grab a shovel for this conversation tomorrow
They could also go on circles on this rock bottom. Hand in unlovable hand.
That depends on if one of them brought dynamite to get through the rock.
He’s still gotta dig through the 50 feet of crap to find Rachel.
*Arne Saknussem intensifies*
–Dave, I have learned over the past several real-life years that there’s always lower that can be gone
Walky: YOU UNDERESTIMATE MY POWER.
Walky didn’t put it in the best way here but “I asked my friend for advice about a relationship where I didn’t know how I felt about it and she told me ‘yeah go for it'” is like. Totally normal, sorry. Lucy is only upset about what Walky is saying because it reveals a truth that both of them have been dancing around – that Lucy has been deeply in love for months, and Walky is still feeling out the first week of a new relationship, and so differing levels of investment in that relationship are normal and to be expected. If Lucy can’t handle that disparity being made clear then that’s on her, not on Walky. Just my two cents tho.
its worse than she cant handle the entire basis of their relationship being new ( to walky)
She wants to cover it up, lie about it, and get walky to lie about his feelings to pretend it isnt true.
Dorothy gave him bad advice. Very bad advice.
And it is quite uncomfortable that from here on, Lucy brings out all the helplessness that she has had to keep since Linday’s comment, Lucy does something unfair to Dorothy, yes, it was bad advice on her part, but she already has a damn torment on her.
Nah, you’re right. Walky going for advice from a friend isn’t even the issue here. He’s even said he’s trying to do right by her, which you can clearly tell by him trying to be careful with his parents, trying to defend her, going to church with her…
Her being crazy in-love makes it very one-sided, sadly. Hell, her saying “We’ve been hanging out for Four Months” feels… kinda wrong? There’s a BIG difference between “bein’ pals” & “being in a relationship” when it comes to being around others.
Good wrong and manipulative.
You hit it right on the head there: Lucy’s saying they’ve known each other for months because it retroactively legitimizes the time she spent pining over him as part of their relationship, when Walky’s only ever been aware of it for a little over two weeks.
Let’s not forget that when she met him he was actively dating someone else; hell, they met because Walky went to Jennifer for relationship advice.
So, Walky may be putting his foot in his mouth here, but there was no way this wasn’t going to end poorly.
I hadn’t gotten it initially reading the comic and comics referring to it, but yes. I don’t think Lucy is trying to forcefully retcon their hanging out as friends in a romantic light, she’s establishing what the barometer of mutual attraction would be, but walky was not attracted to her, and it’s been ambiguous for most of the time they’ve been dating whether he’s attracted to her now.
So again, in Lucy’s view, because she was pining for walky for four months then since he asked her out he must have also been into her when they were platonic, right? Right?? So these comics are a slew of extremely unpleasant glass shattering realisations for Lucy, I’m baffled by the people mutually holding in their minds that Lucy is both delusional but also somehow fully aware of the feelings imbalance and trying to manipulate walky. Obviously she had no idea, obviously her crime in this relationship is her headcanon being too fierce and big and consuming reality in deference to what feels good to her rather than any sense of emotional sobriety. She wants to hear “I love you”, she is insecure as she’s starting to realise something isn’t right here, she’s starting to wake up. But it hasn’t been some master scheme of hers, she just liked him a lot, and was hoping he liked her the same way.
I’m not sure how to say this, but thanks for not assuming the worst of Lucy? She’s got her problems but she isn’t some mastermind or doing any of this on purpose. To me she’s just insecure, and was under a false impression since the start of their relationship, in which she thought he must’ve been into her prior as well. But him asking her out involved no attraction to her until the day of when he… Noticed she was a girl.
On top of that, she’s being told that he only asked her out because of what his EX said, and has been taking advice about THEIR relationship from said ex. That’s gotta feel weird to hear? I’ve felt insecure and isolated in the way Lucy does, and while I never went the “After we go on three dates, we can have sex!” route, but I get where that weird checklist is coming from too.
Prior to college and during college, Lucy has consistently never fit in with anyone. I think she’s just trying to follow the rules she’s seen worked for other people… Possibly in fiction. She doesn’t have any friends of her own here, and the people who probably could be her friend are put off by her peppy nature that I wouldn’t be surprised if she’s forcing.
Dunno. I like Lucy. I don’t really think she’s boring, she’s just doing what she thinks she should be doing- and getting super carried away in what seems to be her first relationship. She’s infatuated. And she wants it to be love. Her weird sex rules are a lot of pressure though, and pretty creepy so hope she cuts that out like yesterday.
Hey exactly, it feels like Lucy is catching a lot of crap for something largely beyond her control that’s an honest mistake borne of her own loneliness and will to be liked and accepted. It is cringeworthy, but it should be pitiable not villainised. She’s been trying to do everything she thought was right too, she’s not very self aware and she has huge insecurities, but she still hasn’t done anything she realised would hurt Walky so far.
Yeah, feel the same
hope she works out whatever’s going on with her. With or without Walky. I just want her to have friends haha.
Yeah, they’ve both screwed up in ways that led to this and there’s a good chance they won’t be able to fix it, but neither of them were at mean or cruel or manipulative getting here. There were misunderstandings and mistakes, but the mistakes were all well-intentioned.
Well I really hope all that about her feeling out of place, isolated and about her not having friends isn’t all true because in combination with this that feels incredibly dangerous.
asking for advice is not bad, saying that you listened to the advice and did not make your own decision based on the advice means that you have no opinion about your own feelings and are just following orders. additional points because these are orders from the ex
Well, it’s at least saying he doesn’t have any strong feelings about being in a relationship with Lucy. Which is definitely something Lucy should have heard about sooner to shake her out of this idea they are super in love that she needs to believe to justify having sex.
But, better late than never.
Yeah that would be really bad. Good thing Walky didn’t say that.
Yup, they have asymmetrical relationship expectations. Lucy’s been hyping this up in her head for weeks, if not since Jennifer first made the suggestion.
Dorothy being his ex might not be helping how Lucy feels about it too.
So is Panel 3 Lucy saying that if you’ve been hanging out for four months, you should have fallen in love before you even start dating 3 months and 3 weeks in?
She’s saying “It’s not like we only met last week, yeah that’s how long we’ve officially been dating, but we’ve kinda been in a limbo zone for a while”.
…also, she’s a teenager, four months is like forever to them >_>.
I mean the ‘dating zone’ is definitely different from the ‘friend zone’, even in how you look at the other person.
Joyce and Joe have known each other for over a semester, it’s not like they should have said I love you two days in.
Hell, Joyce and Joe actually went on a date a long time ago! One that involved a lot more punching than most dates do, granted, but still. By Lucy’s timeline they’re basically engaged already!
If she is, the aromantic in me is horrified lmao
Yes because she did.
Its pretend and gaslighting, and very childish.
It’s childish to be sure, but it’s nothing like what gaslighting is supposed to mean.
i think 4 months in is ok to say i love you to a platonic friend but if you’re the opposite gender (or two males in a heteronormative community), i guess it might come off as awkward if they don’t know that you openly say that to your other close friends as well
It’s supremely weird to see y’all putting arbitrary timelines to feelings. Walky met Dorothy and was immediately infatuated with her, he threw toys at her head to express his interest. Ruth and Billie were a damn mess but they were absolutely completely into one another by the time they started dating. Every relationship that we know of between main cast members has been built and, in many cases, broken in the four months Lucy is mentioning. The issue is the imbalance of affection, now how long is appropriate to say “I love you” to someone. I started dating my husband three months after we started talking and hanging out, there was a mutual attraction immediately but I never got that “into him” in the way Dorothy and walky were, and 9 years later my feelings have grown to have other valuable and positive elements but I’ve still never had that element informing out dynamic. The first impression you build of someone will inform how you feel about them without something unusual radically changing that perception.
Lucy is saying here that she has been attracted to him for four months and had assumed since he asked her out that he’d also been attracted to her. Walky did not feel that way, and her asking or stating that impression isn’t manipulative – it’s establishing the differences in their perspectives that he had only considered her as at all interesting in a relationship context for a couple weeks at the urging of friends, while she has been into him from day one.
It’s very disingenuous I suppose, from her perspective the whole relationship has been much longer and her attraction and feelings toward him have been building for more time. But on the other end she’s was more just in his sphere of awareness, he wasn’t focused on her really until close to when the actual relationship started. So once again they’re just not in sync.
Me when I was reading the strip: Oh, it’s over
Me when I read the last panel: Oh, HE is over
Walky tried his best. He could’ve MAYBE salvaged this, and then “Dorothy told me I’d grow to love you” nuked it from orbit.
its not his job to salavage it. Its Lucys. She needs to figure out what she really wants.
Eh, I think Walky needs to figure that out, too. He doesn’t know what he wants out of anything, let alone a relationship.
But I generally agree that Lucy is basically using Walky to punch herself in the face, and has been for this entire time.
at this point it wouldn’t even be salvaging, it would be giving in.
he’d just be continuing it to make her happy, which would probably make him unhappy/resentful because it would no longer be a relationship, it would be work without benefit.
it would be like his parents relationship, but without the racism.
True. If she actually liked Walky instead of her fantasy of Walky she would have figured out he’s honest to a fault and has no ability to social engineer or to be suave.
Replying here because sdklgjslk I didn’t meant it the way y’all think. It’s more like… If his goal here was to avoid hurting Lucy’s feelings, well. That’s off the table now.
I agree that she’s at the very least not ready for a relationship. She’s built Walky up in her head hardcore. Four months? That’s never necessarily mutual. Meanwhile, he’s tried to make this work in his own way. I like her because she reminds me of Early Joyce but I’ve been getting a feeling she’s not heading to a good place.
So what he did in this strip was, he fumbled the intro to a conversation they should’ve had but he had avoided. Now there’s no way Lucy’s going to listen.
does someone have the strip where they decide to go out together handy? has it been four months or one week?
I feel like they have been OFFICIALLY boyfriend and girlfriend (with sex on the table) for less than a week; before that they were hanging out as friends with Lucy not so secretly pining for more
They started dating about a week ago. They’ve hung out for about four months. Lucy had a crush on him for most of that time, which is why she brings it up as not being too fast for her, personally, to say I love you and also why she didn’t question it as odd when she thought Walky said he loved her.
I guess since she was under the assumption that he asked her out without any influence- she believes that he must’ve had a crush on her prior too. Jesus, this stuff from Walky would be so… Not great to hear if I were Lucy. It has to be said but it’s kind of brutal right now.
Huzzah, found the relevant strips:
Dorothy tells Walky to ask Lucy out
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-11/04-hompk/arguments/
Walky immediately does so
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-11/04-hompk/romantic-2/
they go on a taco bell date and Lucy immediately asks if he has felt romantically about her as she has for him, he skirts the issue
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2021/comic/book-11/04-hompk/attheborder/
Now that I read this again:
Dorothy was willing to go back to him, but for some reason, she thought that seeing that he and Lucy resemble each other, it was more convenient for him to be with her, but the fact that two people share tastes does not make them souls that should be romantically united.
Walky shouldn’t have said “Romantic” at first, the moment Lucy heard that, she already started creating her sitcom from start to finish, complete with offspring.
Two people basically picked her out of convenience. That kind of sucks now that I think of it
Amazingly romantic, a real declaration of impassioned love: Dang, you ARE a girl, why have I not noticed before!
Lucy’s read Harry Potter, right? I believe Ron literally says the words, “Hermione, you’re a girl” at one point.
While that’s a way to describe it, it’s worth looking at the strips between, which focus on him being astounded that Lucy would be interested in him. I’d say him asking her out is more directly based on learning that she’s into him than on Dorothy telling him to.
I’m so used to Willis dragging us through certain plot lines at a snail’s place for extra tension, that having this confrontation finally happen and happen so QUICKLY in comparison. I just. It’s incredible. My heart rate is so high. I’m so giddy and lightheaded.
oh did i miss a gravatar update? I don’t feel much like a charlie, what else we got.
dgfxngxgm imagining emo-than saying he’s so high and giddy with his straight face amuses me. He can stay for now.
Walky, dude, quit digging.
Honestly, I am glad that it is all out in the open, even through the process was so very uncomfortable. It either ends here (which I am fine with) or much less likely they somehow salvage and their relationship has become a bit more honest. To me, the best case outcome would be they decide to be friends, but that seems really unlikely.
Not sure Lucy even has any non-romantic interest in him…
I think it’s good to be out in the open, but it’s really funny he keeps making her reaction worse. XD
Well, he did want to “escape”…
No, no, rip the bandaid off. The pain will be over faster. No sense prolonging this train wreck.
immobilize Walky with duct tape, Lucy!
Lucy goes so wall-eyed from anger. She’s searching multiple corners for weapons
Here, Walky, have a shovel so you can keep digging yourself deeper
Well what do you expect when you date an immature boy?
Not this level of owing his feelings , and refusing to be manipulated into lying about them.
Right here!
She’s 18. Should she be dating a 35 year old?? Any boy at 18 has maturity to earn, and absolutely so does she. One week dating to “I love you.” Is not the mark of maturity
Shes 18 hes, at best, 14
That’s literally not how that works.
Maybe Lucy should focus on herself and grow her own maturity. If we’re going by you’re logic, she’s 10 years old. She has no idea what a real, healthy relationship takes.
*your. Stupid auto text
She absolutely should but it doesn’t make Walky any less of a the boy he still is
He’s acting like a normal 18 year old in their freshman year of college. She’s acting insane. If she dated a “mature” boy, he’d be wise to dump her in that first week after her behavior
Agreed but two things can be true at once
How the hell is walky immature here? Lucy is the one rushing a WEEK LONG RELATIONSHIP and freaking out because he doesnt say he loves her A WEEK INTO THE RELATIONSHIP.
How dare Walky learn and grow from past relationships and try and take his time, how immature of him
YordleJay has a point.
@shrub
Why don’t you point out where Walky is being “a 14 year old boy”
Shrub’s a walking dog whistle, I wouldn’t pay any attention to their commentary as far as it concerns Walky.
I’m aware, I’ve read their posts before. It’s no surprise we haven’t gotten any backup to their claims
You vastly overestimate the maturity of college guys. Walky is better than my very low expectations
Walky is way more mature than Lucy.
Walky’s been nothing but mature about this entire relationship.
As much as I like Lucy, it’s clear she’s got some things to learn about how relationships work in the real world–starting with “when one of his friends says ‘you should ask her out’ it’s usually a GOOD thing”, and continuing directly to “the length of time you are acquainted doesn’t necessarily change any timelines once your relationship officially starts”, and definitely eventually covering “you don’t need to be in love to have sexy times, and that’s not even what your God says to begin with so please just do what you want to do”.
…Every time I write advice to Lucy, I’m really also writing it to myself in freshman year.
“We’d been hanging out together for four months.” Oh bud, that’s not remotely an argument for why someone should be in love with you after a week of dating.
Yeah as much as Walky is making this worse, this is on Lucy. She’s feeling hurt and betrayed because she is obsessed with the idea of storybook love and he’s the mature one trying to just treat it like dating.
Wild that Sal was 100% right about “I give it two weeks” but for the reverse reason.
Lucy’s fatal flaw is craving a cookie cutter version of happiness. Being tv version of popular, having a storybook love (like you said), to only have sex after “appropriate” amount of dates (and pushing for those dates bc horny) so as to be a still be a “good” christian. She’s fun, cute, dorky and kind! But she gets in her own way.
Getting angry at Walky for not being in love after a week may be bad for their relationship but maybe good for Lucy’s personal growth? I am curious to see how it goes!
I’m SO curious if we’re going to watch them fall apart right now or if this is just the first big hint.
I think her point is he “could” have fallen in love with her in that time not “should”. He’s a bit like “that’s ridiculous we only dated a week” and she’s saying it’s not like they didn’t know each other before.
So if her intention is to say “it’s not a ridiculous idea that we’d be in love” then I agree with her, it just didn’t happen for Walky.
I’m Demi and the point of asking out for me is when love happened. Otherwise we’d remain just friends. It’s not crazy but it is definitely a mismatch in their styles and a miscommunication in this specific case.
Oh, it’s understandable that Lucy is in love but unfair of her to expect Walky to feel the same way in the same amount of time. In plenty of relationships the people involved develop stronger feelings at different points of time.
Huh, didn’t expect to be correct about Walky bringing up he did not say he loved her. The fact he can’t remember that he said that he loved a certain thing about her, and not just some random object makes it more interesting. I think it was he loved that she understood he just wanted to make a meme joke and she continued the set up for him.
Yeah, and it was only after she responded that he said “I LOVE HAMBURGERS”, but his memories must be muddled.
His mind shut down when she used that to say she loved him back. It’s not surprising he lost some of the details. He’s got the gist right.
Is this the fastest relationship speedrun in Dumbing of Age history? It’s been like two weeks max, Walky and Lucy might have the new record
Do we count Sal and Jason?
They were never even pretending to be dating, so I personally don’t.
Well, I think it depends how you count it, since Dorothy dumped Danny right on their first day in the comic! Their relationship may have lasted longer than these two, but only off-screen.
This is a very difficult conversation to have.
Especially when one person has deeper feelings than the other. and they want to pretend otherwise to put up a false front, and manipulate the other person with.
Walky is right to explain the basics of the relationship is only a week. and he needs time to catch up, without excessive pressure to lie about it.
People are blaming walky, but this situation is entirely one of Lucys making.
She had a crush on him one week ago. Without a single real date.
Now after meetting his parents, her brother, Raidah, and going to her church, He must also be in love with her?
or he isnt worth dating?
Then she can stay single. and alone.
Walky has done his best in all of this, but the fact that he says it only lasted weeks makes me think that while Dorothy’s advice was not correct, I interpret the advice in a completely different way, it’s true, Lucy is not liked by many here, but honestly hating her is too absurd, that it has become uncomfortable… yes, but because of how she is reacting at the moment, it is too disturbing
ok so first message imply everyone blame walky, then your message imply everyone hate Lucy, and uh, you both may want to lower those expectations ?
Things are going to get out of control, that’s all I can say
I have no idea what you are trying to say. I dont mean to sound rude.
You have a bunnch of prefixes clauses that sound like they are supposed to be explained, or go somewhere, but lead nowhere like a dropped storlline.
“the fact that he says it only lasted weeks” its a true fact.
“I interpret the advice in a completely different way” OK and how?
You forgot to say how you intrepet the advice. Im shivering with anticipation, what about the symptoms?
(Are you High? its OK if you are high AF. I probably in ramble just like this in dangling clauses when im stoned. I hope you are having an awesome night.)
Heres to you Feeling Fine ( raises glass of ice tea )
I hope you are having a good time, and sorry that Lucy facing the truth makes you uncomfortable.
But She DID this. She’s DOING this. Shes making an uncomfortable confrontation happen. In a church.
She also started this , by pretending Walky told her he loved her and trying to gaslight and emotionally manipulate him with it.
Walkys been the dumb one, the naaive one, who buys her innocent act. ( shes not. Shes a social climber like Raidah . But too passive to admit whats shes doing ) .
Walky tortured himself because he doesnt want to hurt her feelings, and actually believes the lie she misheard him.
But in retrospect that makes zero sense. Walky was complimenting her how much he feels seen by her, that she gets him. Lucy was paying close attrention to him beforehand which is why she deserved the compliment. It doenst make logical sense she misheard him. She KNOWS what he said and tried to level it up. and she hasnt stopped to think about walkys feelings by pretending he said he loved her.
I dont fault her for saying it, but she turned it around into an obligation and expectation. ( the opposite of what Dorothy *did when she said she loved him ) .
* Dorothy
But I also think Dorothy Knew what she told walky was bad advice.
. Or Dorothy is ok with lying to people about their feelings.
and it was probably selfserving because she was afraid She would
throw herself at walky ( which she did later ) .
Dorothy shouldve known this would hurt lucy by walky not being
more upfront with her . Just like Dorothy shouldve known her
actions with walky during their relationship would make him more
attached to her, than she was. She hasnt a learned a thing and
repeating the same mistakes with other peoples feelings, and mismatched relationships; as long it temporarily serves her interests.
Dorothy uses people, but she is a kind ,and authentic person. She doesnt
do the inauthentic social climbing of Raidah. Or Lucy. like youd expect of a
politician.
( Ive been shocked at Lucys nakd selfserving self deception and ambition ever since she went to Billys old wing to find levers to manipulate Billy with. its 180 degrees from the nice-girl act. Thats Machiavellian naked ambition. Then having gotten it she made sure Billy knew she was the master and wouldnt misuse it , thus ‘proving’ to herself she is “good”.
Good People, dont do those things.
Dude you are making half this shit up in your head, like it’s not even funny this is psycho shit
no one wants to read your villainess au fanfiction here, post it on ao3
No one is owed a relationship, even when they fill out a checklist
im adding your comment to the Univerasal Relationship checklist.
Your distinctiveness will be added to Our own.
Good stuff, keep em coming.
✓
Nobody in the comments are blaming Walky, lots of calling Lucy a manipulator though
I wouldn’t say she’s manipulative…but I think we’re seeing for the first time an unstable side due to the need for attention.
If you think Lucy is unstable, just wait until he dates Sydney.
First time seeing Lucy is unstable? It was quite obvious for a while.
Shes wildly manilulative. Just extremely passive.
and passive aggreessive.
She knows what walky really said and is letting him torture himself.
Nows shes galsighting him about it, letting him believe the lie she misheard.
She went to Bills old dorm specifically to find keys to manipulate Billy with. Then she interefered with her relationship. It was all about controlling Billy.
This is why shes distraight over walkys parents situation. There is NO WAY she can escape Billys control.
Shes upset at hearing Dorothy had a hand in putting their relationship togther because then she would owe Dorothy the way she tried to control Billy.
She wants to pretend that she passively manipulated Walky into asking her out and being in love. Now she learns NO. Walky did it when Dorothy told him too. this is about loss of control.
But she is manipulating walky because this isnt new information.
She was Literally prsent when Dorothy said this ( unless im misrembering)
.
Shes trying to guilt trip walky for saying the truth. When she had the same set of facts.
Congratulations on writing such elaborate gibberish.
Ok, Dude. Again, I think people (including you) are giving Lucy way too much credit for planning/self-awareness here. I willing to buy passive-aggressive. That’s fair. As for manipulation, gaslighting, etc., those to me are intentional actions. You’re accusing Lucy of Raildah (sp?) like levels of villaintry (sp?) and Lucy’s just not in that league. (Not saying she wouldn’t like to be, but she’s not. Although Raildah might be willing to take her on as an apprentice if Lucy had any social connections.)
Lucy is closer to the villain in a psychological thriller who’s willing to use any means necessary to try to get reality to support her delusions, although even that’s probably too strong. She’s just another 18 year old girl who victimized herself by wearing rose colored glasses.
what? passive aggressive and very bought into a religious model of dating? sure
being intentionally manipulative? That’s a ridiculous take
“Nobody” is being blindingly overkind to the other commenters, lol.
Are we seeing different comments? People saying walky is digging a hole are not saying walky is to blame for this relationship, they’re just saying in this one comic he’s saying the exact best response to upset her in every panel. As far as I’ve seen the trend has been “of digging a hole there walky” “it’s not Walky’s fault!” “Oh I know, I don’t mean the situation I mean his responses in the comic, this is definitely because of Lucy”
That is one thing she is not.
This is genuinely kind of cathartic for me, because I was Walky for a lotttt of my college relationships – but I never got forced to spell it out, and so I just shuffled along in a dismal dance with some poor girls who had become completely obsessed with me. I honestly wish things had blown up this bad instead. Can’t wait to see this to its conclusion!
I do admire Walky here, he’s sticking to his truth and not knuckling under.
100%. Hes become much more date-able.
Yep. Me too.
*Meant to be a reply to Scolopendra. I am NOT saying I am somehow more date-able*
Walky needs to be honest going forward about what he wants out of a relationship, which is something casual and fun. And its not something he can get from Lucy or Dorothy. Lucy was about ready to start planning their wedding. And Dorothy told him, “when I look back on the time I was the happiest it was when I was with you” Which is a lot of pressure on a college freshman.
Oh this is going swimmingly :3
Walky’s being open and honest. It’s probably painful, but it’s impressive. As for Lucy, someone with a high Emotional IQ needs to help her learn the difference between ‘friend’ relationships and ‘dating’ relationships. Sadly I don’t think that’s anyone in this comic.
Booster has a shot at knowing the difference. Weirdly, so might Malaya.
Booster already gave their 2-cents during their introduction and Lucy proceeded to ignore them to “help” Walky.
MAYBE Leslie, but that’s about it.
Walky is doing the right thing. Lucy, one day you’ll appreciate this rare show of maturity from an adult teenager. It’s not something that *I* could have done at that age, that’s for sure.
ffffffffff
Okay, I feel the need to again reiterate that I like Lucy and Walky, and I don’t actually think there are any villains here; I don’t think Lucy is manipulative or “crazy”, I don’t think Walky is a huge jerk, or whatever.
But this is an incredible train wreck of a conversation and I am cackling, which I assume was the intended emotional response for at least these parts.
I picture Becky just off-screen cackling too. She probably has made bets about this very thing.
Mm, SOME characters may have, but I doubt Becky; she seems to like Walky fine and doesn’t seem to have had any reservations about his relationship with Lucy, unless I’m failing to remember something. She also seems to like Lucy well enough, and in-universe where Lucy is a real person… yeah, I don’t see Becky laughing.
I have had many issues with Becky historically, but I agree. If she’s even still there instead of leaving or going a little ways away to give these two space, she does not think this is funny.
I don’t think they are good for each other, but I agree that there are no horrible puppy-kicking villains here.
i think of lucy as a puppy Kissing Villain.
That’s pretty dang cute, hah.
I don’t think they’re bad for each other, I just… don’t think they’re much of anything for each other. They were cutest when they hatched that hairbrained scheme together (fake-dating Amber to get his mom to like Lucy), but otherwise I don’t see any unique dynamics here.
I guess I gotta give her props for encouraging his web comic aspirations?
that’s definitely a thing she did. He also got advice from Dorothy… I kinda want to compare what they said now, but I don’t remember which of them wanted him to go for a simpler concept to be funnier. Lucy, maybe? With Dorothy saying she thought the original idea had charm??
Over the past few days I’ve noticed that you’re basically giving voice to my thoughts here, Li. Keep up the good work lol.
Haha, thanks.
Hard same, friend, hard same.
hi5
same; doesn’t seem to be a villain here. They just barely make sense as a relationship and their fundamentally different orientations to the world were bound to come to a head at some point
+1
I dunno what I did to Willis in a past life but I’m sorry man. Please stop this crazy train
:c Sincere apologies. Being ship-jossed by a creator is a very sucky feeling to have.
Oh. Wow. Okay, seeing how she’s reacting to things here makes it an incredible relief that she didn’t find out about Walky hanging around with Amber earlier. (Yet)
I do not think she would have handled that well at all.
Oh my god that’s absolutely where this is going isn’t it? He’s going to try and salvage this and talk her down and mention, “Gosh, why are you so upset? I hung out with Amber playing Mario Kart in my underwear, you think I’m aching to cheat on you or something?” and she’s going to go “you WHAT?!”
Welp, time to book for a string quartet o7
Four months tho, not bad… not good either.
and a children’s choir
–Dave, chanting ominously in either Latin or Queen
Oh god FINALLY. These two are *not* good for each other and regardless of which one of them is right or wrong (they’re both kinda wrong and both kinda right) I sincerely hope they break up…whatever the fuck this is and go find people who actually suit them.
Oh noooooo she’s counting the time they hung out as Friends as having been supposed to be him falling in love with her. She interpreted the first hot boy who hung out with her as inevitably romantic. Honey nooo.
I think he once said something “yeah well i guess girls and i are always going to be at an impasse” so Lucy would’ve eventually “have to” ask walky out/make the first move if dorothy hadn’t steered him towards it
but hopefully she finds a better boyfriend if she’s not immediately soured on relationships after this even without sarah and others rubbing it in (tho she’d def need a break and to focus on herself/personal life befor anything romatnic again)
If I having been hanging out with someone for months and then they ask me out, I would assume that they had been developing feelings for me during some of that time.
Yeah, I do find it weird to ask someone out in the first place on the basis of “oh huh, only just noticed you’re a girl”.
Right? Lucy isn’t wrong to assume that the person who asked her out had been attracted to her before dating. I’ve been in no less than ten relationships and discussion of when feelings started to develop for each person has been part of most of those.
That’s such a rational assumption to make and I don’t get why people are acting like it’s not
I can wholeheartedly +1 this. Lucy has misread potentially a LOT of things here, but none of them are hugely unreasonable misreadings.
+1
I’d think they’d asked me out because they liked me, right? That feels like a normal assumption to make. Brain wouldn’t jump straight to love though haha. But I’m not sure if she started saying “I love you!” before or after she thought he’d said it to her.
Yeah I feel like I distinctly remember it was after, which fits in with her character – she waited for months as his friend hoping he’d ask her out, she would wait for him to drop the first love bomb to start saying it.
While Walky is shoving his foot directly into his mouth here, I do think it’s important that Lucy hears this from him.
Still agree with Booster that Lucy can find someone way better for her. Walky isn’t a bad kid, and he’s been growing on me as a character, but he hasn’t done much more than recently clearing bare-minimum bars of being a decent person.
She could do better by finding someone who is interested enough to ask her out without prompting.
or she could make the first move herself, good to let ppl know right off the bat but i imagine ppl don’t just always make it public the instant they feel a crush for someone unless they’re confident/used to doing ‘first dates’ first versus just being friends XD
The fact that she was asked out with prompting isn’t on her at all – it’s entirely on Walky. She didn’t have a hand in that. Other than that, yes, she deserves someone who is actually interested in her.
Yeah, I don’t know that it speaks to walky’s character the way it sounds initially, “better for her” in this case could simply mean someone who was organically attracted to her at any point prior to asking her out.
Walky’s character has been established by like, the entire run of the comic up until now, not just this particular situation. I’m just saying that he hasn’t done anything particularly indicative of real strength or quality of character at this point.
But yes, finding someone actually attracted to her is something Lucy deserves.
This is painful, but I think they’ll both be better off in the long run.
I feel like I’m going crazy watching Walky be the mature one opposite from a woman who believes storybook romance is real. This guy has literally summoned people from the aether by saying “I can almost hear their voice” and turning around and *he’s* the one trying to approach this like a grown up.
I’m actually amused that more people are cheering on the breakup of Walky/Lucy than there were for Jennifer/Ruth or Jacob/Raidah or Joyce/Ethan.
i don’t think ppl cared enough for raidah to root against her versus cheering joyce on even tho making a move on someone while you know they’re dating someone else isn’t the best look
and jen/ruth are better off apart but ppl liked the toxic dynamic together lol
I didn’t hear a word about Mike/Ethan.
I supported their weird little thing
But you didn’t hear a lot of cheering about the way Mike ended it.
Well, except for Danny.
I also supported their weird little thing. And I was a Ruth/Billie shipper, they still clearly have immensely strong feelings for one another too, my poor dumpster kids.
And they still have a strong chemestry, something that Walky/Lucy never did.
100%
Same. Also yes we were Ruth/Billie shippers, that’s not a reluctance to call her Jennifer, just historical accuracy.
I think I’d be more supportive of Jennifer’s current turn if I didn’t still feel like her turn were more about healthiness and character growth, and less about self-hatred (“I never liked Billie”) and Raidah’s machinations. Like, Asher at least DID genuinely like her (unsure of where he is atm), but Raidah and Carl are only pretending, and………..
Yeah. The one definite improvement she’s made is that she isn’t drinking anymore. So even from the perspective of wanting what’s good for Jennifer, it’s hard to ignore how much of her new life………… isn’t.
This exactly. I’m being historically accurate and trying to respect that Jennifer doesn’t want to associate with Billie-related things, *including* the relationship with Ruth. So I shipped Billie and Ruth, either Jennifer may become Billie again if she can ever reconcile with her past, or she’ll keep going as Jennifer, or she may periodically keep reinventing herself to keep hope that she can be better one day.
@eskimolos – my thoughts, too.
I genuinely don’t know what’s in store for Billie-slash-Jennifer, apart from “this can’t keep going indefinitely, something’s gonna give here and Jennifer is gonna get her heart broken when she realizes how a good chunk of her New Improved friend-group talks about her behind her back”. I don’t even know for sure what I think is gonna happen with her and Asher, except that this strip made me wince.
If you held my feet to the fire, I would guess that Jennifer is still ultimately self-destructive; that she was put off by (or perhaps scared of) Asher softening into a good boyfriend. I think it’s too simple (and falling into Tropes) to say that Jennifer wants, let alone needs, a “rocky” relationship like she had with Ruth; for me the biggest tragedy of their breakup is that it happened when they were happiest and healthiest, the same day that Billie told Ruth she wanted her to meet her parents.
Rather, I’d say Jennifer does not think she deserves happy or healthy, so Asher being too good-and-sensible-and-healthy got her hackles up, and she is genuinely more comfortable with this dysfunction.
I do think Jennifer is in that group both because she sees it as an expectation if she wants social acumen, and because as a former cheerleader she may feel more at home with fake smiles and barbed comments. Ruth not being able to accept that they could both be good for one another is devastating, and yes I think failed to give either her or Billie enough credit.
I’m genuinely sure that part of the Asher situation is due to Walky being such a big part of Jennifer’s formative experience as Billie, it’s her nightmare to be dating someone like him, and so she needed something about him to be harder, less goofy and sweet as Walky has typically been.
Hah, that’s fair re: the Walky association.
I actually commented on the very first strip of Billie sitting down with them that I wondered if she’d missed Char’s comment on her weight or if it reminded her of the cheerleaders she used to hang out with and was comfortably nostalgic
*ugh that sentence got rewritten a bunch. Would be more supportive of Billie’s turn as Jennifer IF I didn’t still feel like it’s less about being healthier and getting character development, and MORE about her self-hatred and Raidah’s machinations
1. A lot of people’s objections to Lucy and Walky has been “it’s boring and there’s no chemistry.” I don’t think you can really say that about any of the other three relationships. When it comes to fiction, “boring” is an actual problem; unhealthy or doomed but still entertaining is not, at least not for all readers.
2. Joyce/Ethan was obviously inevitably doomed even before it began; there was more ambiguity with Lucy and Walky, and technically there still is. I’m not completely ruling out the possibility that Willis might salvage this somehow. Folks not enjoying a relationship and not being confident it’s going to end soon = folks being more vocally relieved when it ends.
3. But also, are there more people celebrating this? Or is it just the case that most of the ‘ship’s defenders have stopped commenting, so the comment section seems more unanimous, which lends to the perception of more people cheering?
4. Didn’t personally want Billie and Ruth or Jacob and Raidah to break up, but that’s me, heh.
sighs @ broken italics
I’ve come to think that part of the disagreement comes from whether you relate to the characters inside of the story or outside of it.
I’m on Team Inside. They feel like real people to me and I want to see them resolve this issue and be happy in each other’s company.
I understand that that would be less exciting, as a story, than a fiery breakup. Different people have different ways of enjoying good storytelling.
Ehhh. I think I reject that dichotomy. A lot of folks who most enjoy seeing pain and suffering in fiction would also describe themselves as Team Inside, because what they’re getting out of that is at least partly catharsis. Ask anyone who’s a big fan of “whump” in fiction, they will tell you the characters they love and relate to the most are the ones they put through the worst things.
I think you just want different things out of a story, and how much or how little you relate to the characters in that story as “real people” isn’t really relevant.
Personally, I am a sucker for a happy ending, but if the characters are gonna be in happy relationships the whole time, I want that to be more of a background detail woven in around a larger story mostly focused on action, or horror, or something like that. Relationship-focused slice of life stuff isn’t really my jam.
But also let me clarify: when I said “boring” in fiction was worse than unhealthy or doomed, I did specifically try to acknowledge that that isn’t true for all audiences. Most of what I was doing was speculating on why the Walky/Lucy breakup might get more people cheering than the other examples.
(But also none of us really relate to these characters as real people, because if we did we could just ask Walky and Lucy what they want, and they’d probably tell us they want us to go away and leave them alone to sort it out in private, and we’d all feel weird for being so invested in whether these people, who aren’t our friends and don’t know us, stay together or not. X3 )
lucy’s irises contracting into a singularity-like point
All the better to incinerate Walky with her laser-eyes.
Oh Lucy honey, you don’t really love him. This is NRE and I know it feels crazy good but that’s NOT love.
Love is an ACTION. Not a feeling. Because feelings can be manipulated by dumb little things, how much sleep you got, have you eaten lately, work stress-but no matter how you FEEL….you can always ACT lovingly.
And that’s what love really is. Not a feeling, but how you act towards people.
And you haven’t gotten to that point yet, not yet. Please give yourself time. ♥
Ehm, I have been so stressed and exhausted that all emotions and empathy shut down. Basically I was a broken robot who didn’t care anymore to pretend to be human. I watched a lost child wander around crying and not only didn’t feel a thing, I also didn’t care enough to solve it. That means the many ways I love people, kids, myself, society, responsibility, justice, and the well-being of others went away.
So while love might be an action, it most certainly can be affected by sleep and stress. You can break someone to the point that they’re no longer loving.
I’ll start by saying I agree with most of what you’ve said.
I’m of a different mind on two points though: the way you feel about someone can change over time, but how you’re attracted to them usually stays the same as long as they stay relatively the same. This is my experience at least. I love people, and yes it’s more of an action, and yes how I feel changes based on various factors, small and large. The way I see people though, generally stays consistent, and the issue here isn’t actually Lucy’s – it is normal to develop infatuations for a person on occasion, and to hope they reciprocate those feelings. She has let it get out of hand and leaned hard into the belief and hope that it’s mutual, but having no social awareness and being young are just normal. Yeah, young people often mistake NRE for love. But I said it up above and I’ll say it again – there isn’t chemistry here, these are really good friends with a one sided attraction that the other person has been made to recognise and is now trying to reciprocate artificially. I think Walky could grow to really like Lucy as a partner, but I don’t think he’d ever come to meet her feelings romantically. And that’s the core problem here, the imbalance, it is neither and both of them responsible, but Lucy’s only lesson to learn here is to not assume people feel the same way you do.
Interesting, because I find that first point completely untrue. A lot of my attraction to people is based on how I feel about them.
#Demi-sexual. (@eskimolos– look it up)
It is really interesting how so many people experience attraction differently!
As a demisexual I get what it means. I’m not saying you greeted someone in class and that was it. I’m saying once you start hanging out with someone to the point where you don’t just consider them an acquaintance or a member of your general circle, that will click or it won’t. And it doesn’t look like it clicked for Walky. Certainly I’ve never seen it click for someone in a relationship without some radical change like “left for three months and came back much more confident” or “kept my life from falling apart when I lost my mother” happening. Yes, I’ve re-contextualised people, but it was before they became people I actually considered friends. We all know how well “just stay with them and you’ll learn to love them” has worked for arranged marriages, staying together for the kids, or closeted gay heterosexual relationships.
That doesn’t really make sense though– I spent months hanging out with my (now) husband and didn’t really think of him as a physical being until one day I did. There’s no specific timeframe where that happened. (And, in fact, him making a sign that he was interested in me is likely what started me thinking of him physically.) So not having physical attraction a week after finding out that someone is interested in you doesn’t seem like a long time to me even if you’ve been hanging out for a while.
Walky is obviously not demi-sexual, so the point doesn’t apply to him. But the statement that you can’t build up to attraction is wrong or that you can’t change your attraction level after things change or you find new information is wrong. I can’t speak for Walky, I can only speak for myself.
TL;DR Everybody is different
I’m not!
> the way you feel about someone can change over time, but how you’re attracted to them usually stays the same as long as they stay relatively the same.
Man, this is *so* wildly alien to my own lived experience it’s kinda crazy to be reminded that this is how many people work.
I think there’s some truth to what Lucy is saying. If you have been friends for a long time, romantic feelings can start to develop. By the time you are ready to risk friendship to try a romantic relationship, the feelings might even be quite strong. That’s why it’s such a blow to realize that Walky didn’t gradually develop feelings so strong that he had to ask her out, and was instead prompted by his ex.
Walky probably wouldn’t have asked her out even with the feelings, he wasn’t emotionally mature and secure enough for that.
Nonsense, if he liked her he’d throw a toy at her head or something.
This exactly.
Thanks for articulating this. I can see both their sides completely.
Also I’m a full grown adult and I tend to fall in love rather quickly. I’m mature enough to not expect other people to be the same but it’s not absurd that people like me and Lucy exist.
Imagine if she knew, too, that he had no hesitation at all about asking her out after he was prompted. It took some convincing from Dorothy for him to believe Lucy could possibly be interested in him, but unless I’m forgetting something he never expressed anything like “but I really value our friendship, I don’t want to mess that up”.
Like… is Lucy special to him, even just as a friend?
Frick.
FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT 🤬
🩸
dammit i can’t make that theoretical DoA beat ’em up soon enough 0.0
Theory is for cowards and people with rent to pay.
I’d love to see that.
Damn bud, Y2K?? Jumpscare
I’m YIIKing out.
+ii
What does this even mean? If someone cares about you enough to do something they dislike (going to church) and enjoy spending time with you and are attracted to you, what’s the problem?
I guess culturally we expect all of this to come with “the flutters”, or basically that condition by which you can’t stop obsessing about the other. That which I’d call “infatuation” or “limerence”. The paradox is that the latter thing is shallow and doesn’t last long, and “true love” is what you should hope to get in the long run – what seemingly and potentially is already there in this case!
I mean, enjoying your company + caring about you + sexual attraction does not necessarily equal love. It especially does not necessarily equal the kind of deep romantic where you want to be in a serious, committed, monogamous relationship. But the only one who can tell us whether Walky is feeling love or not is Walky (or Willis, out of universe), and he’s currently unconvinced, despite having been in two romantic relationships before.
Anyway the current problem is that Lucy’s feelings for Walky are already intense and Walky’s feelings for her are (at least currently) not. The imbalance is making Lucy unhappy, now that she knows it’s there. Also Walky is explaining himself in just the worst possible way, which isn’t helping.
+1 exactly Li
It doesn’t necessarily equal that deep romantic love, but neither does the infatuation uze describes.
The infatuation is easy to mistake for love, but it will fade and then you see what’s left.
@thejeff – well, part of my disagreement with uze’s assessment is that I don’t think a lot of folks in the comments are confusing infatuation for love? I mean, I won’t say it’s NEVER happened, and certainly the general trajectory of this thing has been compared to his initial intense crush on Dorothy, but that initial intense crush wasn’t his whole relationship with her, and I don’t think it’s what most people are talking about when they say he seemed more into that relationship.
For me, I was a LITTLE bit put off by how Walky specifically asked Lucy out; as someone who’s a big fan of “the pining is mutual, they’re just idiots”, something about his wording nevertheless twigged me as being “off”. It didn’t sound like he was realizing he liked her, so much as like he was realizing she was objectively A Catch.
And then we started to see an awkward mismatch on their enthusiasm for sleeping together*, but for a while I put that off as Walky having some “oh no, first time with a virgin, how do I navigate this” jitters.
Then he said “I love that about you” and Lucy misheard or misinterpreted it, and he freaked out — but resigned himself to not saying anything and soldiering on in the hopes that he would grow to love her in time.
Then his dad nudged him about dating who he really wanted to be with, whether his mom likes it or not, and the most he could muster in defense of his relationship was “I really like her.”
Now this.
I’m not saying friendships can never grow into romantic relationships. As someone who’s pretty dang demi, that would be very silly of me to say! And indeed I think there’s room in this comic for demisexual reads of Walky specifically.
But I dunno. I feel like the cards Willis has been laying down do not add up to Walky’s feelings for Lucy turning romantic. At least not fast enough for Lucy not to want to break up with him rather than hanging on in the hopes that he’ll feel what she feels if she waits a few more weeks or months or (however long it takes).
* There’s nothing wrong with men not wanting sex! but when two people have such different levels of interest in having sex together, it’s bound to cause issues — like the kind we saw Becky and Dina deal with — so at the very least Walky needed to communicate with Lucy instead of just letting her steer the ship.
I do think that demisexuality shouldn’t be used as “you develop feelings for your friends” as a blanket statement, which feels a lot like how it’s been used so far. I accept being oblivious, but Wally has organically formed feelings for two previous girls, showing he is capable of developing those feelings as well as noticing and reciprocating them, and much earlier into knowing them personally than the time he’s known and interacted with Lucy. Some people you just don’t get romantic feelings for. It’s true that being oblivious and told someone has a crush on you that you think is out of your league may make you reconsider, it’s just more likely given Walky’s history in the comic so far that he would have already been attracted to Lucy by now, without someone putting a lamp on her attraction to him.
I agree with all of your points, I just am demi and this keeps getting brought up and it feels like a misinterpretation of demisexuality. It’s not that if you like someone as a friend enough you’ll have a crush on them because they like you. Like, I knew a kid for two months I actually hated, then he tutored me in math for an hour and I got knocked over with a massive crush on him. Before that he was literally gross looking to me, after it he became the height of attractiveness and his smile lot up my life. We’d never spent one on one time before that. People I’ve developed crushes on far after having known them personally have been online and it’s because they changed both physically and personality wise into people I found more attractive. Physical is still an element, not really in the classical way – there are objectively beautiful people that I love to death as friends that I’m just not into romantically at all. That’s how Walky’s feelings have always read to me, it may not be the case for everybody but for me I think if you tend to get crushes on your friends, there’s no actual reason to expect that you just didn’t realise someone was attractive that you consider a friend.
As I noted tho I’m also demi.
So. Yeah.
It’s definitely not every single friend I’ve ever had. More of a “every best friend has gotten into a confusing zone that made me kinda miserable growing up”, in my case.
But I also don’t think I was saying the thing you are objecting to. I said that, as a demi person myself, it would be silly of me to say feelings can NEVER evolve from friendship to romance, and that even if you read Walky as also being demi (which I think is valid, at least for how my demisexuality has worked), it does not seem like Willis is setting him up to do that with Lucy.
(I would get more into what my personal experiences with deminess have been, and how yes I too have specifically developed crushes on people who were the Very Opposite of Attractive prior to that, but I don’t want my main point to get lost in a lot of paragraphs.)
Side Burn: people getting lost ion lots of parsagraphs
–Dave, channelling Seth Meyers
whereas my fingers can get lost twice (or more) in a sentence
–Dave, and I’m STILL not used to having to proofread everything I type twice
My thought was more along the lines that neither of them are really in Love in that sense. Nor, most likely, were Dorothy and Walky. They’re all kids a few weeks into a relationship. They’re dealing with crushes and infatuation, mixed with a good dose of actual liking and maybe the seeds of something that could turn into Love in time.
The difference isn’t that Lucy’s in Love and Walky isn’t, but that Lucy’s infatuated and Walky isn’t. Seen that way, the difference isn’t necessarily fatal. The infatuation will fade. That’s when you see what you’ve really got. And Walky isn’t necessarily behind there.
I mean, sure, technically, but it’s going to be very hard to discuss this comic if we can’t even use “what the characters have said with seeming sincerity about their own emotional states” as a foundation, heh.
Anyway I would argue that Lucy still thinks she’s in love and she still thinks Walky is telling her that he doesn’t feel the same way, and while I’m not at all sure what tomorrow’s comic will bring, the Walky of the last couple comics does not strike me as being able to say “I’m just asking you to give me time, in the hopes that my current level of affection might rise to meet yours” in a way that doesn’t hurt her even more?
I dunno. I’ll just reiterate: I’m not saying it’s impossible for a relationship LIKE this one to work out. In some ways I’m living proof they can, lol. It’s just this specific set of circumstances, the way Walky wasn’t like this with Dorothy or Amber but IS like this with Lucy, Lucy’s inexperience and romanticism, their asymmetrical feelings (both romantic and sexual) — all of it adds up to make me think that, as a story, it isn’t going to work out in this case.
But the conversation ain’t over yet, so I guess we will see.
Lucy’s looking for The One, Walky’s enjoying the ride. She’s got more invested into the relationship than he does.
Need some help digging that grave, walk?
Nah, he’s good, I’m sure. He’s had lots of practice, after all!
Honey…
Keep it up Walky, you got this.
Walky hasn’t said anything that is false, so I feel like he’s copping a bit too much flak just for his poor decision making on what true things to say.
Oh no, nobody is giving him flak, “keep digging that hole” is empathy, not accusation. He is being honest and everyone knows he is, but -he- wants to de-escalate the situation, while in this situation being honest is adding gasoline to the fire because he’s been afraid of being honest about the situation and his feelings with Lucy for the last two weeks. So people are merely acknowledging that in this strip he is trying to avoid a fight, but everything he’s saying is building the intensity of the encounter. He’s still right and this still needed to come out for both their sakes.
It’s not false, but he’s phrasing it in a way that makes it sound worse.
Like if he’d said “Dorothy let me know you were interested in me because I was oblivious” rather than “She told me to ask you out”, that would come across completely differently, even though both are true.
Walky, bud, you’re not wrong about anything you’re saying here, but by god you picked a bad way to say it.
Well, he’s fumbling this a bit but he’s doing his darnest, and being uncharacteristically honest and direct so props to him, I guess.
Boy that was a rollercoaster.
If Walky keeps digging like this, he’s going to pop up in Shanghai. (Or maybe Albacoikey.)
Actually he’d wind up somewhere in the Indian Ocean, and best be lookin out for sharks.
To get to Shainghai, he’d have to dig from Entre Ríos Province, Argentina. :p
I am exactly the kind of nerd who loves this kind of thing, so I looked, and yup, southern Indian ocean, almost exactly halfway on a line between Perth Australia and Kerguelen Island.
cues up Ana Ng
Ooooh this implosion just went from painful to GLORIOUS.
Ugh Lucy, Just stop your lies.
You Knew damn well what Walky really said. This isnt new information.
the guilt tripping here is out of control.
You Knew damn well, Dorothy got Walky to ask you out. It happenend in your own room.
Its disturbing how she wants to erase the minor edges off recent history to make herself feel better. its messed up she expects walky to lie to her about this.
She’s really Headed straight for Raidahs Crew. Or maybe a Crew of Raidahs castoffs. I get that she feels insecure about Linda.
But shes cares more about Linda not liking her than Walky ignoring his mother and choosing her anyways.
walky is right, she shouldnt take this out in Dorothy.
( OMG I cant wait for Walky to let slip that Dorothy wanted him back and he said no. Walky will think this proves his affection, but it will drive lucy crazy. )
“You Knew damn well what Walky really said.” I honestly think this is an honest confusion. Sometimes, people hear what they wish to hear instead of what is actually said. It happens.
+1
Cannot imagine Lucy knowing Walky didn’t say he loved her and choosing to pretend otherwise. Especially because she did unselfconsciously it in front of other people.
Really, becuase she LITERALLY doing that right now. Twice.
Believe what you see and hear.
Shes doing it again about twings , the incident and Pretending in front of other people she didnt know Dorothy set them up.
Yes, She did it front of other people, exaggerating her relationship, in order to social climb and public acclaim. ( Just like she exagerated her relationship with Walky, to others all week including her Brother ) .
thats the point, >>no one else could imagine it either<< unless they knew better, or Walky publicly Humiliated her.
its a chess move and she knew what she was doing, both times.
Trying to level up.
She doesnt get credit for using an audience to manipulate walky. Thats how the trick is played.
and She gets negative points because she is doing it again, trying to manipulate him in the presence of an audience, and she, unlike Walky,
is totally willing to push the issue in public , and humiliate both herself and walky to get her way.
You are trying to hold onto the 'criterion of embarrassment' to claim it was unconconsious. But In this very scene she showing you the opposite, she doesnt feel this way. Shes perfectly willing to be humiliated or embarrass in public over this.
She created a very public fight over walky not saying 'i love you' in public. Then she cornered him and blew it up.
Thus evaporating any pretense that she didnt do the same thing in the first place.
Did lucy shoot your dog or something?
Sanity check bro. No one else has been interpreting lucy’s actions with anywhere near your level of sinister vitriol. That could mean either you alone know the real dark truth, or she reminds you of a bad experience and you’re projecting to an alarming extent and making everyone uncomfortable. Also, fyi that manipulation angle sounds hella misogynistic, at least to me
I’m half way there. People can be unintentionally manipulative when upset and wanting to be right, but that doesn’t stop it from being true. She’s very manipulative of the social situations and where/how she tries to insert herself in. Particularly since she ignored so many other persons boundaries on the way. I wouldn’t be surprised if that is why she doesn’t have friends – she reads like “road to hell is paved with good intentions” with how hard she tries for what she thinks people should want vs listening to that. She is the worst social faux pas mix of Dorothy and Joyce, but with a more sunny and (overall but not for walky) easy going personality. However most of that last part seems to be due to repression and people pleasing which she’s always been frustrated aren’t working in her davor.
Opened my mouth (figuratively speaking) to argue but then I actually kinda agree with you. I still don’t think she’s very aware of what she’s doing, but she definitely *is* doing, she is making moves to achieve goals and paying little or no attention to the feelings of those around.
*dark* truth alright. This reeks of misogynoir. Could be mistaken but I swear I remember this guy having garbage sal takes too
“Really, becuase she LITERALLY doing that right now. Twice.”
No?
She is only reacting to information that are new to her.
Yeah, where does this “She already knew Dorothy set them up” thing come from?
The deepest depths of the colon
Plus he didn’t actually say I love hamburgers, he said ‘that’s what I love about you’ which clearly, to Lucy’s ears, meant like “that’s one of many things that I love about you, because I love you”.
The thing he ‘loved about HER , he had spelled out specifically.
and Lucy was paying very close attention to what he said and meant,
and that was WHY he was priasing her. Because she was. ( paying attention close attention and understanding him ) .
.
and the hamburgers came after.
My point here, is that Lucy is not intentionally lying. Lucy is young, naive, and ‘in love’. She was paying close attention because she loves him, and when she heard the slightest bit of reciprocated affection, she definitely made it mean more than it was intended but it isn’t lying.
That’s just… an emotional reaction. You’re sitting here acting like Lucy is scheming a way to fuck with Walky, when she’s just someone in her first relationship who has very unrealistic expectations because this is all new to her. People can do something wrong without it being a grand plan of manipulation.
“she definitely made it mean more than it was intended”
yes. because she was in front of audience! Just like shes doing now
If she really gets walky, she would know hes sensitive making fusses in public. and would prefer to go with the flow. Which i think she does know.
“but it isn’t lying.” except it is. When you know the truth and are exxgerating for public acclaim.
Is it Lying about Dorothy?
“You’re sitting here”
Yes i am on my Throne. Do Go on.
“acting like Lucy is scheming a way to fuck with Walky”
YES, exactly like that , but without the sarcasm.
That is literally the comic you are reading. Shes just not a very good schemer and a very passive one. Which is why it took intervention from Dorothy and Billy.
Please excuse my crime of passion I spent months and months building up to.
and Shes none to happy to have it pointed out that she wasnt able to do this all by herself.
By the way, I’m the President of France.
Okay clearly Lucy reminds you of an ex who really fucked you up. My deepest sympathies.
Yes, I think so as well.
… Lucy might not be trying to scheme everything, but she is definitely trying to manipulate the situation into fucking Walky, at least for her own mental gymnastics. She is making weird 3rd date rules and then deciding what does/doesn’t count as dates, while ignoring others boundaries during them such as Danny’s. She isn’t evil, but she does view this as finally getting what she wants vs understanding what her partner wants too. That isn’t excused by young love. It explains it, but doesn’t excuse it.
Fucking WITH Walky. I specifically said fucking WITH Walky, for lack of a better word, because Adam Black’s reasoning is that Lucy has been scheming and is gaslighting Walky because… I dunno, she’s evil and wants him to suffer I guess. Adam is writing some elaborate fanfiction here.
I’m not excusing her weird third date sex stuff as young love, I’m saying this misunderstanding is due to that. Frankly, I’m a little tired due to running in circles with this Adam guy and pretty close to deciding to just never engage in this comment section ever again. I’d go into more things about how Lucy’s weird sex shit is clearly due to being a Christian, how she’s trying to balance what her sexual wants with her religion, yada yada yada, but I’m tired.
Doopyboop I hope you stick around cuz I’ve enjoyed your comments!
You’re silly.
Hey, Linda Walkerton, the Black woman isn’t the diabolical mastermind you’ve made her up in your mind to be
+1 to Lan everybody else go home this is the best response.
Seek mental help.
idk how seriously to take comments that end with “by the way I’m the president of France” tbh
Who else but the president of France would be on the DoA forum?
I, for one, am also the president of France. This is a farce
Snorfle
Yeah, I dunno, I realize Adam here isn’t a new person in the comments, but these ice cold takes + that send off read as… well, as a garden variety troll who THINKS they’re Andy Kaufman.
Either way, probably best not to dignify their comments with an actual response. A+ on zee’s memeing elsewhere!
Zee is a fucking delight +1
Pretty sure he’s the one who vented on a comic eons ago about a messy divorce and his ex-wife basically being the devil, so yeah. These Lucy vitriol takes are uncomfortable but not surprising.
I mean, if they’re trying to Andy Kaufman, that would also have been part of the troll.
But even if they’re sincere, I don’t think it does anyone much good to engage with actual points and effort. If they’re not a committed troll, they’re definitely deep in an alternate reality version of the comic, where they cannot be reached X3
@Mym aw, you’re making me blush
And Li. Glad my memeing efforts aren’t going to waste
huh. the undercomments are nested deep enpugh to be unrepliable
–Dave, france, we come from france
“and Lucy was paying very close attention to what he said and meant,”
Seeing how she replied, she likely wasn’t. It’s an easy misunderstanding to make.
You know who she reminds me of? Raidah.
yup.
“Oh my God, it’s Raidah but with a squeakier voice”
Somebody posted the strips where Dorothy convinces Walky to ask out Lucy. Lucy and Walky are in her room, then Dorothy asks to talk to Walky outside. Lucy does not hear any of the conversation. He comes back in and asks her to get romantic dinner. Possibly she could have put two and two together, but acting like she knows is unfair.
For God’s sake, Walky, throw away the shovel!
Ah, young romance. For everything that’s happened, this really shouldn’t be enough to detonate the relationship. These two are kind of good for each other, they’re just not fully in sync yet.
Not all romance has to be deep and meaningful. Not all romance has to be spontaneous and in the moment. If these two could find some middle ground it could still work out for them.
Yeah, I think so too. Though it might be that youth is against them here, it can be hard to navigate difficult issues in relationship disparity and communication even with experience.
They’re not married with kids. Sure they have some stuff in common but Lucy can probably find someone who shares her interests AND doesn’t mind going to church. Someone who likes her as much as she likes him— someone who loves her.
And Walky seems to have no trouble attracting smart women who share his interests.
Okay, but the fact they *need* to find middle ground to me shows they are not good for each other. In a single argument? Sure. In taste of friends, enthusiasm, beliefs, family navigation this early? No. That’s the sign you aren’t good for each other romantically, but we’re better off as friends because you don’t get to spend a week in a more immersive relationship and start a tally list of things that need to be compromised on. First you need to figure out if they are things anyone should compromise on.
I just don’t see it. Nothing against either character (I don’t get why there are so many comments saying one or the other of them is terribly fucking up), I just don’t think they’re particularly compatible
Randall Munroe summarized the problem quite well, I think: https://xkcd.com/807/
To be honest I am with walky on this one (and not just cause every time lucy shows up she somehow becomes a worse and worse character). If I am stepping into supposedly holy ground on a weekend for you? It means I am trying to be in a relationship for the long term.
Walky has by no means been acting perfectly in this relationship, but darn I still feel bad for him right now
I think I feel most terribly for the comments section
(incoherent screaming echoing in the distance)
You can’t be the president os United States, without making some enemies on your path.
It’s not three roentgen, Walky.
It’s 15,000.
You ve been (re?) watching the Chernobyl miniseries i think 🥰
I will be a little disappointed in Walky if he doesn’t notice and call out that they’re doing the thing where one person in a relationship hears a revelation and then keeps freaking out before they can hear the context. If she’s still mad after she hears all the context to each part of this, fine, she can be mad. But if she won’t let him get out the context, they both know their tropes well enough to know that kind of thing leads to unnecessary drama.
Because there is context for each of these things that Lucy is freaking out about which makes them pretty darn reasonable. I don’t know if she’s mature / secure enough to actually listen and understand those reasons, but honestly, as much as Walky can be a hot mess, all of these are reasonable.
He didn’t feel ready to say I love you yet, no matter how much he likes her or how long they’d been hanging out, because he only started to think about her romantically late in that period. Yes, he talked to Dorothy, because even though she’s his ex, she’s also one of his most mature friends in a lot of ways, and asking her advice on a matter like this doesn’t mean he still secretly has feelings for her. And yes, Dorothy told him to ask Lucy out, because he was being dense and didn’t realize there was even a possibility of romance with Lucy, nor that his own feelings were moving that way. He’s been uncomfortable because he *does* like her so much, but didn’t feel like he could tell her without hurting her feelings; but he also respects her enough to not just lean into the misunderstanding and say something that he doesn’t mean. In fact, him not being ready to say it yet doesn’t mean he won’t be willing to say it in the future – he’s been avoiding saying it in part because when he does say it, he wants to mean it, and for the words to have weight.
Oh, but did he ever say “I love you” to Dorothy? Irrelevant. That was a different relationship, one which ended and which he’s moved on from, and relationships are not interchangeable. Sure, he can tell her if she really wants to know, but that doesn’t mean she can then use that information to compare the relationships against each other. Sometimes, when you really really like someone, it matters extra much to you to be sure. (Or possibly that’s just me.)
If she’s willing to listen – and I don’t expect any force short of common media tropes to be strong enough to reach her now – Walky could finally get this off his chest, Lucy could start to get past her unrealistic expectations of relationships, and their relationship could actually grow stronger from this.
To be clear, from Lucy’s perspective right now, this is a hard and painful conversation. But feeling like you *have* to do something because it’s expected of you – like gift-giving or saying “I love you” – really can suck the joy out of it. Walky has been putting a serious effort in here, and as of this strip, I’m actually convinced that maybe the issue isn’t that Walky is trapped in a relationship he doesn’t want to be in and which isn’t good for him, it’s just that he’s been struggling against this misunderstanding and doesn’t want to either say those words (which he knows are so important to Lucy) without really meaning them OR hurt Lucy’s feelings.
And you know what? I believe Walky has actually had enough character growth to be able to actually navigate this moment. Whether he will or not remains to be seen, but I think he plausibly could, and their relationship could be stronger – placed on a firmer footing – because of it.
Like what you’re saying is reasonable and mostly accurate but I assure you that this argument is happening due to the imbalance of feelings it’s making clear to Lucy. Yes, this was gearing up to be a fight, because Wally has with all the best intentions in the world just been trying to give Lucy what she wants and Lucy has been starting to suspect that this isn’t the relationship she’s built up in her head. It has to escalate, because they’ve seen eye to eye on precisely nothing coming out right now. It’s partly an ever mounting escalation, but that escalation is for good reason – misaligned values, perspectives and goals finally coming to light.
See, i think Lucy already knows all these things.
Whats she’s actually made about is Linda microagressing her with the word “slumming” ?
She repressed it, then lied about it to walky ( her reason for ending last night early) .
Now shes Projecting Walkys failure to say ” i love you” back , publicly in front of an audience, AS its own microagression.
She picked a fight over it. ( One she actually started way back when she pretended he said it public ) , and she’s blaiming Linda microaggressing her for changing walkys feelings.
Shes mad about something real, but its something else.
The Rest are a series of shitty of powerplays she did for dominance that are going to blow up in her face.
This is all passive aggressive dominance behavior. Walky expressed he doesnt want to do this in public but shes willing to violate his boundaries.
Walky doenst need to explain any of it, she does. Shes the one acting out.
Walky isnt willing to humilate her in public over this, but she will do the same.
Walky isnt willing to manipulate her, lie or deceive her into accelerating their relationship, or get in her pants; but she is 100% willing to do the same.
Its NOT just a misunderstanding over words. She KNOWS these things. Shes KNOWS they were not really Bf/gf when she was pretending ti date him. She was called out on this by Sarah and admitted this!
But she wants to change history in pretend inorder to have a public fight in church. Thats NOT what walky wants out of this relationship.
SHe KNOWS about Dorothy! This isnt New news. Dorothy literally came to her Bedroom.
She just want to pretend Dorothy didnt just set then up a few weeks ago, an an EXCUSE for why she pretended Walky said I love you.
It doenst matter of if her expectaions are unreasonable, and she drops them.
Becuase Walkys are fairly reasonable and shes strayed far from them.
and NO she doesnt really love him,either.
( do people really believe this? Do they think Lucy LOVES walky? Cmon)
She has a superficial crush, but mostly just loves the idea of having a boyfriend.
Walky is a …status symbol, for a girl who feels she has zero status.
Walky is Lucys Trophy Wife, and he just ruined that by being NOT being a good trophy and saying I love you on public.
Walky isnt in love with her either, but he is decent enough not to lie to get in her pants or publicly humilate her on purpose. But he did want to give this relationship a chance to develop.
and Lucy Doesnt. She doesnt want this relationship to develop.
She expects it all, right now. Fully bloomed, becuase she feel shes entitlled to walkys love; because she payed for it in the friendzone.
This is obv Incel Logic. and you dont fix it this type of entitlement by dating it. You fix it by DUMPING it, and the person learns not to do it next time.
Walky dumped Dorothy for less entitlement. And Amber Dumped Walky when he was too insensitive after Mikes death.
I hate to break it to you dog but ain’t nobody reading all that. Happy for you though. Or sorry that happened.
AHH it’s my favourite meme of all time glorious
I read it all and I kinda agree
having read the rest of this dude’s comments, that “kinda” has to do a lot of work.
I agree that Lucy is kind of a passive aggressive character, and has some entitled ideas about love and relationships (ones that are often baked into churches like that).
But is she being intentionally manipulative? Definitely not. She’s just optimistically read a lot into things that weren’t there and now has the rug pulled out from under her and is reacting to it with shock and emotion (which is totally reasonable)
Yeah no she’s just kinda dumb. She has bad ideas about sex and romance bc, I mean bad ideas of sex and romance are force fed to you from birth. And she hasnt had the experience to smack her in the face with learning yet.
A stopped clock is still right twice a day, as the saying goes.
I also stand by liking the idea of Lucy as a puppy kissing villain, tho that might’ve been a typo on this guy’s part.
Thank you for elaborating what I’ve been trying to say.
Since it’s soooo far up there, I should state that this was addressed to bemisawa.
Hey, we all knew it was addressed to this Adam Black fellow.
I just wasn’t ready to do today’s class reading. Anyone have the sparks notes?
Yeah, here:
1) Just scroll past, it’s completely worthless gobbledygook.
I hope that’s the answer for the test!
Schizo mode activate
Bye bye Lucy, I’d say it was nice having your around. But it wasnt. I didn’t like ypu very much. Too positive and pushy
That’s not a great word to call someone. It’s offensive.
What, pushy?
The first word. The shortened form of schizophrenia, a mental disorder.
Between the fictional 18 year old and the weirdo grown dudes frothing at the mouth about her in the comments, shes not the one who’s “””””””””schizo””””””””” here
Cringe ass usage of that word btw.
My wife is schizophrenic, and she’s stable. She’d never behave like Lucy, it’s really unkind of you to use that as an insult. You may as well drop the r-word
This and also bpd being used as a pejorative, liiiiike. No. Despite what Hollywood has taught you, the “scary” NDs like bpd and npd and bipolar disorder are all things real people, not movie monsters, have; there is no “being an asshole” disorder.
Haha, I have BPD! So many people think it’s so evil, but I really just cry a bunch and don’t trust others easily. It’s so silly how much people trust the stereotypes put out by the media
Sympathy via light physical contact 🫂
My mom’s got bipolar disorder, plenty of friends have bpd or npd. It’s just like… not magic?? It’s just a different way people’s brains can be set up.
As someone with high empathy (for the usual reason, TRAUMA), like. Feeling other people’s feelings with them does not guarantee kindness. It often makes it harder to be a good, compassionate friend, bc you can be overwhelmed when they’re upset and not as good at listening to them!
(Also, @ my fellow high-empathy peeps, empathy isn’t magic either. We’re not sci-fi characters and we can and do misread other people’s emotions, lol.)
MOOD.
I don’t know what Lucy was expecting. She burned his crops, poisoned his water supply, and delivered a plague unto his dorm room and she thinks that was going to make him fall in love with her?
I mean did she though? I love the turn on the popular meme but she’s just been trying to exist in a relationship she thought was mutually devoted and passionate. Walky didn’t wilfully deceive her, but he did pick up on the imbalance and tried to soldier on without acknowledging it.
Oh, my comment was 100% a dig at the people painting Lucy as some sort of manipulative mastermind when she is, ultimately, just not that emotionally mature
But for the sake of continuing the bit, Lucy is LITERALLY the head of the mob. She orchestrated everything from the kidnapping to Sal getting caught at the convenience store. She has been at the core of EVERYONE’S suffering and STILL expects walky to love her. It’s DELUSIONAL.
Ahh my apologies, I’d forgotten how to read satire by the time I got this far down the comments.
Honestly I love the violence, I thought it was a really bold move of Willis to have Lucy torch rival girls’ wings to ensure there would be no other woman that could take his affections, then the twist that he actually fell for ETHAN, man. Good stuff.
Oh, I didn’t realize Lucy was Asher’s grandpa. Lookin’ good, Gramps!
Y’know I love her but I guess I have to admit that literally gutting his childhood pet and writing a marriage contract in the blood while threatening to take Dorothy next if he doesn’t sign, was a step too far.
Propaganda. If we can’t allow college freshmen to strangle their dormmates with their own intestines, what is this country coming to?
The woke legions don’t want you to commit excessively gory violence in the safety of your own campus.
No, that was gophers
Messy as hell, but if that’s what it takes to get these two broken up I’m all for it
Ah, to be young and stupid again.
Everyone wants to repeat their late teens and early twens but they forget it was mostly shit like this. Even if you could take all your memories and experience with you, you‘d still be surrounded by people who haven’t. ^^
„Youth is wasted on the young“ as the saying goes.
This arc stirs up a lot of memories, tbh.
Well, if you gotta trainwreck, better to do it early.
This is going well! (for certain “trainwreck” values of “well”)
It terms of drama and intrigue this is really top notch, going excellently
This reminds me of an arc in Leftover Soup, from the friend’s POV.
Oh for God’s sake don’t do what I say. What’s the matter with you?”
https://www.leftoversoup.com/archive.php?num=593-etc
Willis, I don’t usually go in for couples fighting, but goddamn you’ve got me eatin’ popcorn for this one.
Wow he’s so bad at this. No wonder he fumbled Dorothy
Lucy can be a tad much, but she deserves better than this.
Walky can be a tad much, but he *also* deserves better than this.
Lucy, Walky didn’t even know you were into him for those 4 months.
Glad there’s finally an explosion of drama though. Wish it could’ve happened on Linda.
Lucy, Walky didn’t even know you were into him for those 4 months.
Glad there’s finally an explosion of drama though. Wish it could’ve happened on Linda.
The php is being weird and saying I already made this post, so here’s some extra characters. Behave, php.
Okay, joke’s on me.
Hahaha
It works with your name
Walky is a poor, young fool who is desperately out of his depth and unfortunately making a bad situation worse.
Lucy is utterly out of pocket and needs an adult in her life who can adequately correct her. Instead she’s going to go to Billie who’s going to reinforce the idea that Walky is being an asshole here (he is *not*) and Lucy will never confront the ridiculous pressure she put on a young relationship.
I have to wonder if Billie would say Walky is being an asshole… 1)she’s been recognizing he’s attractive lately. 2)even if she didn’t find that disturbing, he’s *her* asshole “brother”. He’s the first person she went to when broken. She’s tried to gently ease him into understanding Sals position. She’s combative, dismissive, but she does seem to care about him as a person.
I wish these comment sections had a character limit so people would make their point in fewer than 10 paragraphs
Never (I’m definitely one of the offenders oops)
Ahahahaha
Like I know this was primarily aimed at Adam Black but if I had a nickel for every time I thought I’d managed to be concise, hit “Comment”, and saw a terrifying number of paragraphs…. 🥲
It was, but I admit sometimes I have trouble reading through your replies! I try really hard, but dyslexia makes this forum difficult in a wall of text
The fun thing about adhd is I have trouble not rambling but I also have trouble reading things the length of my own rambles sometimes so like,,,,,
if it helps any I do sometimes also hurt myself in my confusion, like a pokemon
Nah, it’d just result in people making like ten posts in a row instead.
They’d just make their point in 10 posts.
I’m gonna say the 10 paragraphs didn’t make their point today, either, maybe breaking it up would help them realize there wasn’t much to say
“Well, well, well, if it isn’t the consequences of my own actions”
Please let this be the end.
Walky, I think we are officially in the part of the conversation where you stop talking before the foot gets stuck
no, he needs to keep talking; everything needs to be put out in the open.
no more misunderstandings, no more half understandings. these 2 need to completely understand the situation from start to finish, only then can they figure out what to do properly.
You know what? Fair enough
Maybe say she “encouraged” you, Walky.
ahh… finally
Put the shovel down Walky, thats deep enough!
This is going about as well as it can for Walky, tbh.
honestly, this is being handled about as well (ethically) as it could/should be, even if parts of it aren’t being landed gracefully.
He’s certainly attempting.
This is going to end worst then his breakup with Amber.
“we’d been hanging out together for four months”
I feel like if you’re trying to date a person by just hanging out with them even harder that’s a long fucking time to go without giving up
anyway yeah rip the elliot reid situation
wonder what becky’s gonna say
don’t get me wrong it’s pretty normal to have strong feelings if you’ve known a person a while before dating (I’m not arguing over how long is a while; they’re both inexperienced) but, like, come on man
I feel bad for lucy here, walky could’ve pulled down the veil a lot sooner
ive seen this exact conversation 20 times on my campus this semester alone
Is Lucy forgetting that she got told to ask Walky out by Jennifer?
I think Lucy is counting the fact that she hasn’t had sex with Jennifer yet, unlike Walky and Dorothy (who had sex with each other, not Jennifer either)
(yet)
Me: number of comments hasn’t gone up much since I last looked.
Me again, squinting: oh that’s a SIX
This is one of the most commented on pages I’ve seen!!
some kinda irony bc I kept saying I wasn’t seeing a lot of Walky/Lucy defenders and assumed they’d taken a break bc these weren’t fun strips to read
but uh,,,,
You inspired me. I couldn’t stand by and watch this slander! Team Lucy!
Haha
So this is off topic, but does anyone have a link to Yotomoe’s sexy DOA art collection? I was talking to someone about it but I can’t find it anymore.
https://imgchest.com/p/ne7bw5ovn75
Pika pi! ^^
I remember when Lucy was enamored of the way Walky showed consideration for others, and wanted to stay on good terms with Dorothy. Guess we’ll see how that held up over time.
This is going very very well! <.<
See Lucy ? now aren’t you glad you guys didn’t have sex ? (i say this not as a “protect your virginity” type way but as a its waaaaaay easier to break up with someone when you haven’t had sex)
Oh. Oh dear – there’s no time left for things to get more precarious in this relationship via ill-advised sexytimes – it’s crashing down in flames right now, before our eyes.
Like lancing a boil, this is simultaneously painful and a relief to observe.