*immediately begins 24-hour radio silence while dropping this link to tomorrow’s strip early like a smoke bomb*
helmets are in the lockers
Discussion (739) ¬
[ Comments RSS ]
*immediately begins 24-hour radio silence while dropping this link to tomorrow’s strip early like a smoke bomb*
helmets are in the lockers
Loading ...
help I accidentally a Joe Blob
…
at least it wasn’t food touching other food?
But Joyce finds all of Joe’s body to be delicious!
To be fair, that is only one food
Joyce, you blew it.
Okay, shut the comments section down. Tonight’s have already been won.
Agreed, everyone wrap it up (like we hope Joe did) and go home.
Yeah, it’s all going down hill from here…
No. It was going down from between panels 4 & 5…
Sometimes this comment section really sucks, but for now we’re fine. Joyce took it upon herself.
I know, right?
Bravo. Perfect comment. 10/10, no notes.
. . .
. . .
Nope, too easy
on the contrary, Joe’s been putting in work for that
They don’t call it blow leisure.
Ok you win the thread.
I just want you know I was RACING to make this joke.
Perfect.
Thank you.
I was honestly ready for the drama, but this comic combined with this comment left me absolutely cackling. I needed that.
/thread
well done
HAHA 😀
IM DEAD LMAO XD
A+ comment
Turning my computer off and going to bed now. Nothing else I can see tonight will top that.
between this and Joe Blob I think I can safely not read anymore of the comments, this is peak. ~<3
Love your user name. Great nod to their biology professor.
Man, that “fella show” her such love!
Yeah, Joyce sucks.
Dorothy: “Joyce when I told you to get ahead of Joe, this is *not what I meant!*”
she had one job and she sucked at it.
JOYCE, you were a foodpicker!!
yeah like, that’s something
regardless of horny, did she enjoy the taste and/or texture? 🤔
She definitely looks like she enjoyed it
She does look a little flushed, yes.
That could just be because of the taboos still flying around in her head.
I think she’s biting her lip, too?
Now she’s a prick-fooder?
… prick-foody?
…
… dammit, how do I keep cocking up this pun?
Are you trying to say she’s a pricky eater?
I love that Joe brought up his father infidelity here. Just, you know, to remind the readers that that is a thing that is always in his mind.
When it is all out in the open, I don’t think Joyce will actually have a choice of not breaking up with Joe, as some are imagining.
Dumbing of Age book 15: Because Of The, You Know, Infidelity
We’ll find out!
This story either ends with everyone single or a polycule, calling it now
*gets out the red yard and thumbtacks for putting on the wall
Well hey, Walky’s dad would agree with you, given his “everyone get in a big f’*ck pile” comment from several years hence.
I’m just hoping Joyce tells him soon, so they can break up and he can hopefully find someone better for him. Someone who won’t cheat on him perhaps.
Yup, she needs to free them both from this situation she created. It’s just so ironic… cheating is like his Horndog Origin story. And Joe, Awesome Boyfriend, is ESPECIALLY going to be hurt.
It’s all in service of the character arc
Nah, this is good. This is starting to look like actual messy cheating. If you’re going to do a cheating arc, it’s better to commit to it.
Not have a choice because of who? The readers? Willis? Actual plot involving human interactions?
I mean, she’s on the road to hurt someone here, but I don’t think she’s a prisoner to guilt, love, or anything else.
This is a bit too late to reply but: because of Joe. I wasn’t talking about guilt, I was talking about Joe’s own cheating trauma which might lead him to reject Joyce outright once he learns.
Oh boy, here we go
Yeah see you tomorrow.
You ain’t just whistlin’ Dixie, pal! 😧😮
Will it break the comment record set by the kiss, do we think?
No chance, but I’d be willing to bet on it surpassing the Raidah hate sink hour.
I would be very surprised if this comic ever beat that record, that amount of activity requires a pretty seismic narrative beat
Mike coma dream reveal.
Nah. We’re only at under 400 by 8:00 EST.
Yesterday you said “I could set my clock to Joyce putting her foot in her mouth” but it wound up being a different body part.
She’s switching it up, that’s for sure!
And not one of her own!
I am just having Rachel Tice’s voice playing in my head.
“I gave every boy in school… a blow-jay.”
Love seeing a fellow MPGIS fan in the wild.
Hell yeah.
Makes me wonder if I need a weighted blanket…
If you like body pressure, you definitely should get one. If you have a joint issue (like EDS which is v commonly comorbid with ND people) get a lighter one than is suggested, but still get one.
I think it’s definitely body pressure, I usually sleep with a single comforter, then about three throw blankets on top of myself as well and I do have difficulty falling asleep sometimes. Thank you for the information!
They’re a godsend and I regret every day not taking mine with me when I moved states.
Yeah I was thinking that I’m not allowed to carry my own weighted blanket around (mine is 20 lbs and I’m limited to 5 lbs) so Joyce is just hoifting around a 20 lbs blanket? I have PoTS and hEDS so yeah. Blanket good. Squish good.
I have never been checked for hypermobility but I do have hyperextension in my arms and I can’t have a weighted blanket of any weight on top of my arms without joint pain and never connected that as a reason. Thank you for bringing it up.
Sounds like you have hypermobility. You may want to read up on that, as it can wind up being a big problem once you hit your 40s and your joints kinda realize that they’ve been overextended a bunch.
You might start out with one of the cheaper ones to see if it’s for you, and if not, you could probably pass it on pretty easily. (Or if you like it and can afford to get a nicer one… some of them are really good but also really expensive. I have a not-that-fancy one because it’s what I could swing.)
Thank you for the advice! I’ll try one of the cheaper ones and see how it goes.
They also make ones that are smaller, just for your lap (search “weighted lap pad” if interested) and I found it kind of amazing. I was subbing in a classroom for kids with high support needs and I was hanging out with a kid taking a break in the sensory room, and I put one on my lap since it was right there, and it was so good, like, instantly.
Keep in mind that some are made for warmth as well as weight, while others are designed for cooling, so check the material.
I had the same tendency to pile extra weight on, but that was too hot for summer. A cheap blanket filled with glass beads solved both problems. If I’d bought one of the warmer ones, though, I’d’ve probably been worse off than before… but they’d probably be wonderfully comfortable for cold weather.
Thank you, that’s good advice too. I live in a very hot location so I’d definitely need to account for the blanket having cooling material or fabric.
I really like mine! I realized I’d like them when I figured out that I found it super relaxing to get that vest draped on me for x-rays.
Last time I went to the dentist I totally asked for a 2nd x-ray vest, to wear em both. No shame, 0% caring it anyone thought it was unusual. It was so nice, highly recommend.
They’re amazing. Especially in summer, when lots of blankets gets to be a problem.
I saw someone had made a chain mail blanket and I thought about making/getting one. More because I have cats, and my back is currently bleeding from Ms Leah falling off this morning. But it should also be nice and cool.
Could that not potentially hurt claws?
I am the anti-Joyce in this regard. I have mild claustrophobia so I think I’d probably freak out under a weighted blanket.
An associate of mine has mild claustro, but says the smaller blankets are fine.
It has never been enough to trigger my claustrophia, but ymmv
I appreciate you and Steamweed weighing in on how these blankets may or may not work for someone with claustrophobia. I’ve always wondered about that for myself.
Any time! I hope you get a chance to test it out, because they can be really calming if they don’t spook you.
Glad to help out. I hope you get good results!
I don’t have claustrophobia, but I hate the feeling of being stuck/trapped, and I absolutely loathe weighted blankets. My partner adores them. (Fortunately we have a long-standing policy of separate blankets, because I am also an incurable blanket hog.)
I keep wondering if I should have one. Unfortunately, I cannot test it before I make a sale.
Maybe one of your friends has one you can test?
Maybe.
Do you figure she did it under the blanket?
It depends on the weight, but for mine, that would take way too much neck strength to be comfortable.
😳
…. I’ll be taking a break from the comments
by which I mean I’ll be “doing laundry”
WELP.
Do like a good weighted blanket.
did anyone even notice yet that the blanket is literally in lesbian flag colors???
XD <3
just like her vest!
Well I’m proud of her regardless.
She’s making progress on the mouth stuff, at least!
Fuck.
Just.
FUCK.
Dunno what else to say really.
XD @-@
Yes, she’s learning to do that.
Currently she’s still one letter off from that.
This comment is great.
And Dorothy is learning that too! Different letter, though
I don’t get the joke
Suck
perfect avatar for that comment, i am CACKLING XD
Cuck?
welp might as well play some appropriately inappropriate music
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
*plays “Closer” by Nine Inch Nails on hacked muzak*
Well, a couple of the lyrics are certainly very fitting. “You let me complicate you” and “You tear down my reason”, anyway.
Oh, just to add:
“Beautiful Disaster”by American Hi-Fi might be a good option, too… Consider the following lyrics:
I’m fuckin up again
(What you want anyway?)
We keep falling in love
What a beautiful disaster
What a beautiful disaster
Yeah, I’m not quite sure how I feel about Joyce’s escalation here.
eh, just be like the rest of us I guess,
grab a lawn chair, some popcorn, and enjoy the CHAOS XD
Joyce is getting a feel for Joe’s ejaculations here
This isn’t even the first
Oh boy I’m sure the comments are gonna have a normal one today
Willis said on other platforms that this would be a messy storyline, so I guess buckle up
I’m looking forward to checking back in a few hours and seeing a dumpster fire comparable to that of Reddit or Tumblr after announcing major policy changes
A sloppy one, even.
next Patreon 69 strip:
despite her picky eating, Joyce tries a sloppy Joe XD
people are trying to one-up the best one liner on the page and if this keeps going i’m gonna die lmao
My vote goes for I Know Why the Mowed Lawn Screams.
BAHAHAHAHA! Bravo.
chuckle up?!
Honestly I like this situation a lot more. It’s now clearer to me that, no, Joyce isn’t going to get out of this without heartbreak, and it’s actually starting to unpack the consequences. We get hints that, yes, Joe WILL be hurt by this. My reaction of “HEY D & J, what you’re doing kinda SUCKS,” now feels validated.
That or maybe my anger about the cheating has just burned itself out and I’m content to follow along for the ride
Well, that went worse than I could have expected… which I should have expected.
Hey, I’m waiting for the Joyce is cheating on Dorothy comments. Number so far – 0.
Alt text is hilarious.
Joyce had one job . . .
You mean Joe had one job.
Joe has had two jobs, ackchually
And it really blew.
I mean, she did just do a job. 😉
#include “alt_text.h”
I mean, she technically performed a “job”, of sorts…
Joyce did two jobs. She has demonstrated she is both handy and mouthy.
No Breakups, Only Blowjobs
The *no* in the last panel is perfectly placed.
Well that really blows. I mean that really sucks. I mean things are really coming to a head. I mean Fellatio. I mean-
FUCK. :p
No, not that.
If what Joyce and Dorothy did counts as fucking, what Joyce and Joe did *definitely* is.
There’s a difference between “sex” and “fucking”. (And, frankly, I don’t think that what Joyce and Dorothy did counts as either, unless they got up to some stuff we don’t know about off-panel. They’ve barely cleared the bar of “making out”.)
Well, there was also… um… “doing laundry”.
Yeah, I don’t think holding hands while sitting two dryers apart, mostly clothed, and then making your girlfriend leave the room while you finish yourself off counts as having sex with her, and it definitely isn’t fucking. Joyce’s definition is bad and results in ridiculous conclusions, like that Roz has never had sex, but Joyce may have been having sex with Joe when she watched their tape.
I mean by your definition sure, but we’ve already confirmed that this that is Joyce’s definition of sex. She’s already cheated. I wish people would stop being in denial about it.
Joyce’s definition is baddish, because it’s contrived for a couple of clear realization to be delivered in a humorous way. She did have a sexual encounter with Dorothy and with Joe, but that just doesn’t roll off the tongue (pun acknowledged). And also that she feels love for Dorothy in a way that includes physical intimacy after all. “sex” is her simplified way to say it. Like a midpoint of awkward wording between “physical intimacy” and “scissor pals”
No one was talking about cheating or not cheating until you felt the need to come virtue signal about it.
In any case, the laundry incident cannot possibly have been cheating, because neither Joyce nor Dorothy were dating anyone else at the time. Joe and Joyce didn’t get together until the next day — doing laundry was explicitly Dorothy’s attempt to forestall that happening — and Walky was still with Lucy.
We need to get Deep Throat’s opinion on this
SPIFFY SPACETRONAUTS!
I know it is hard to swallow but…
Reasonable response but also Joyce god dammit you were supposed to talk to him
I’m sure he appreciated it, though.
Also as a weighted blanket lover: they are the shit. Sucks that it’s too hot in summer to use mine though.
Don’t be mad at her, she was taught not to talk with her mouth full.
Pretty sure she was applying her oral capability.
Can’t wait to check back in like 20 hours and see people’s dissertations on why they’re for or against impromptu Joyce blowjob
Word of the day: Knullruffs
She does indeed have knullruffs, good work of the day!
Word* ffs phone
An excellent word.
Okay, on the one hand, Joyce has now effectively cheated on both of her partners. So, that’s…. fair?
Also……. Joyce has never done that act before… right? ……other patreon? 😀
In the same day, no less. Can’t say she isn’t efficient.
I don’t think Dorothy has any ground to be upset about being cheated on at this point in time
Hell, at this point, I’m hoping she walks in on a Walky and Amber. Not because I ship those two anymore (Amber crossed a line for me on Halloween, and hasn’t come back from it yet that I can see).
I’m just supporting any sequence of events that can add even more cars to this trainwreck.
Being lied to is never fun. Even if Joyce was transgressive to start this, she said she would break-up with Joe and instead had a form of sex with him. That’s her not doing what she said and therefore lying to Dorothy. Is it in character or something we should use to draw larger conclusions?
That’s what Dorothy’s thinking right now.
Joyce has to go back and forth with these sexual milestones for each. Blowjob for Joe, Oral for Dorothy, Handjob for Joe, Fingering for Dorothy. Balanced as all things should be.
“Joe, I can’t explain, but I need you to dry hump this washing machine”
Damnit, you almost made me laugh with this. Contained smile instead. (It would have been a weird moment for me to laugh.)
This is the only real way hinge poly will work for these three
Only possible way.
Oh no, if only there was somebody to meticulously maintain a spreadsheet related to all of their acts of coitus…
Agreed. This needs to get so messy that, at the end of it all, they can go, “Wait, who’s cheated on who with whom? Fuck it, let’s just fuckpile and get it over with.”
Definitely going for maximum “funny” (messy) disaster. Got it.
Is it cheating on your new girlfriend when you have sex with your unbroken up boyfriend that you were cheating on them with?
Honestly, I can’t even keep track anymore.
I’m not sure at this point, but I’m very disappointed in Joyce for still not telling Joe yet. It would’ve been awful for him after he got her that nice gift, but it’s probably gonna be awful for him regardless.
I think it goes beyond not telling Joe yet but no longer being certain about breaking up with him altogether.
Joyce is gonna have to break up with one of them, because I don’t think we’ve seen any indication that Joe would be ok with a poly relationship, and I doubt Dorothy would be ok with one with Joe, given their history.
Which is ironic because Dorothy is the one who absolutely has wronged him way more than he did her and that’s not downplaying Joe’s homophobic bullying.
I binged through a lot of the comic so I probably forgot. When did Joe do homophobic bullying?
Joe and Dorothy talked about how he used to joke about her being a lesbian.
I wouldn’t really want to be in a polycule with someone who had to cheat on me to get there, frankly. I’d actually think less of Joe if it went this route.
It’s mitigated if it becomes a full harem. Walky, Sarah, Rachel and Danny must also join as Joe’s wives.
It’s only fair, but Sal may have opinions.
If all you want is DRAMA though then a toxic polycule probably has the highest potential. No one is really happy, they just agree to it because they don’t want to lose a relationship. Everyone is hurt. Everyone is resentful. Communication is poor then the whole thing blows up. DRAMA is maximized.
If Joyce wants to stay with Joe, she needs to tell him. The longer she waits the worse it is. If she’s avoiding telling him because she is afraid he will break up with her, that is even more selfish.
I think this is more ‘waffling’ than ‘deliberate deceiving’–as in, part of her really, really doesn’t want to break up with Joe. If Dorothy weren’t in the picture, she’d probably be revising her wedding plans (remember, she already had them the first time they ‘dated’).
So she goes to break up with Joe, and runs headlong into him being awesome, and responds as if Dorothy were not a factor.
The thing is, and this has always been true about Joyce, she is just completely incapable of rational thought when she’s stressed. She reacts how her heart tells her to and, to quote a game I enjoyed:
“And your mind? Will you not heed its counsel as well?”
Was Nancy Hicks Gribble Cheating on John Redcorn by sleeping with Dale?
After a certain point, I think she was. 13 years of John Redcorn being Nancy’s primary guy, Dale being essentially a cover story, and literally raising Redcorns’s son while constantly lying to Dale every single day about it, I’d say any instance of Dalefucking counts as cheating on John. Even just breaking it down numerically, there’s a line indicating Nancy has been fucking John Redcorn at least twice a week the entire time Joseph has been alive, including some time beforehand (for obvious reasons), so taken literally that’s 2×52=104, 104×13=1352 Redcorn dickings, opposed to “Only on Dale’s birthday and Christmas”, leaving a pitiful 26 Gribblings by comparison. Personally, I figure whoever you’re fucking more often is your primary sexual partner, so any instance of Nancy fucking Dale would count as cheating on John Redcorn.
The real power move was Dale taking his son and molding him in his own image, to the point that genetics was the only characteristic John could claim. In the end that might have broken Redcorn even more than Nancy.
trying and failing to articulate my position here. i guess i would say a core component of cheating is deception? like, john isn’t gonna be shocked and alarmed that nancy is fucking her husband. like he doesn’t like it but he knows it’s happening and doesn’t seem pressed to stop it. similarly, joyce being intimate with joe isn’t outside the scope of dorothy’s perception. it’s a continuation of what was the status quo just a few hours ago. i dunno. i think if you’re The Other Person you don’t really get a moral high ground, unless they didn’t tell you going in that you’re The Other Person
but like. obviously it’s more complicated than that. if you know your partner is cheating on you, and they keep doing it…like that’s obviously still cheating even though the deception is no longer strictly relevant. maybe it works on a dibs system? i dunno
So I would say it’s more that it’s what is expected in a relationship. John Redcorn had no issues with Nancy sleeping with Dale, so it was technically infidelity, but not cheating. Dorothy was expecting Joyce to break up with Joe, so I would call it cheating. Even if Dorothy finds it understandable given the situation
I had earlier in the comments reached the conclusion that no-one was going to analyze if Joyce had now cheated on Dorothy, but I see now that there was no reason for concern. The indignation level doesn’t seem to be as high, though.
As a few other have jokingly commented on, does this now count as Joyce as having cheated on Dorothy? I feel like cheating requires more active planning, maybe the best descriptor would simply be a practice of unethical-non-monogamy?
But in all serious while Willis’ past patreon comments seem to possibly hint at Joyce/Dorothy being the “endgame” ship for the two, I do wonder if Joyce will actually attempt polyamory (if it its even possible with the semi-antagonistic relationship Dorothy still has with Joe)?
Whoops, accidentally double-posted my comment in a thread I didn’t meant to post it in.
Cheating doesn’t require planning otherwise all “I’ve got drunk and made up with my friend/coworker” wouldn’t count. My guess is if they were considering what they have a monogamus relationship. But what’s more important is how Dorothy feels about it, no matter technicalities.
(I just remembered that in Scott Pilgrim Scott says he cheated oj both girls she was meeting with so it kinda counts?)
I don’t think Joyce and Dorothy are technically girlfriends yet, but Dorothy should be upset
Dorothy should be upset
How upset she will be is highly dependent on what happened off-camera. If Joyce failed to break up with Joe, Dorothy will probably be annoyed and a bit hurt, but nothing’s broken. If Dorothy just spent the past hour breaking up with Walky she’s going to be livid. Dorothy blew up her relationship and threw a big stink-bomb into the social circle for Joyce, who chickened out and next-leveled with Joe thus hanging her out to dry. Meta: I defy Google to translate that sentence.
Dorothy ought to have some second thoughts here. Joyce is not ready for this level of drama. Sure, she can handle kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, the loss of her faith and community, and the realization that the very basis of her morality is a lie. However, teenage relationship drama? She is so not ready for that.
English -> Spanish -> French -> Lithuanian -> Latin -> Swahili -> Swedish -> English
Dorothy ruined their relationship and dropped a huge stink bomb on Joyce’s community, angering her and causing her to move on to the next level with Joe and thus leave him.
Yeah, doesn’t quite hit the same points, does it.
I’m told deepl.com is better, (though it doesn’t have Latin or Swahili), so…
English -> Spanish -> French -> Lithuanian -> Japanese -> Arabic -> Sweedish -> English
Dorothy ruined her relationship and caused a major scandal in Joyce’s community. Joyce, driven by fear, took the next step with Joe and left him and travelled away.
I’m not sure it quite understood the message.
This is WILD to me. Dorothy should be upset because after she cheated with Joyce, Joyce then cheated on her with the person she was actually in a relationship with.
There’s absolutely zero ground for Dorothy to stand on that doesn’t make her a massive hypocrite.
My gut says this isn’t cheating on Dorothy since they’re not, like, actually dating. They’ve just confessed their feelings to each other.
However, I *DO* think this is kind of like cheating on Joe. Yes I know, how can sex with Joe constitute cheating on him? But I think doing sexy stuff with a partner you intend to break up with is…iffy. Up until they did further intimate stuff, Joyce had an opportunity to make a “clean” break. But now she’s just gone back to Joe under “false” pretenses. Does that make sense?
You’re right, it’s only lying. She told Dorothy both “I love you” and at least heavily-implied that they were together and she was going to break things off with Joe. Then she did the opposite.
Relationships only come with contracts at the marriage level, judge that as you will.
Given that new girlfriend KNOWS that you’re not broken up with your old boyfriend yet, I’d say that’s kind of a stretch. But there might be grounds on the basis that you promised you were going to break up with him. Meaning, going over to his place right now to break up with him.
… look, I don’t write the rules, I just theorycraft them to see how they break.
Well, its good to know that Dorothy and Joyce are on the same page about what they wanted to do, thought we were going to have a bit where Joyce was going to suggest everyone dating everyone, and Dorothy on the break-up plan.
But yeah, this is looking to get UGLY.
I’m still hoping Joyce suggests that!
Joyce is going to try to backsies on the Yuri and break Dorothy’s heart but then hormones will take over and she’ll kiss/bang Dorothy again and be like “THIS TIME I’ll tell Joe” and then we just repeat until they get caught.
Oh boy this is gonna be an interesting next few days of reading
No, Joyce!
Dorothy surprisingly seems unbothered by this development though. Poly- open?
I don’t think we can know how bothered Dorothy is until we see the next panel. She hasn’t really had time to react yet.
What does Dorothy’s last sentence even mean? “The bit of loose skin on his elbow?” Huh?
The term “weenus” refers to that loose skin — source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wenis — but is also used as a kiddy name for a penis, and Dumbing of Age occasionally has fun with that ambiguity.
Mainly used in the context of “It’s the elbow skin! I know that word, that’s the elbow skin word!”, often by the nearest know-it-all.
Oh hey, Dorothy.
I’m pretty sure the “elbow skin” definition was made up for this joke played on kids during middle school lunch.
“Joyce, I will show you how to do this.”
*immediately beds Walky (again)
All right… which of you Paladins used the damn Monkey’s Paw???
I think you’re going to have to brush before Dorothy’ll let you kiss her again, Joyce.
I am just going to repeat my comment from last night
We need MORE AGATHA!!!
and cowbell.
Wait, is the plan to break up? Did we know that?
Yes, Joyce and Dorothy were just making a list of things to do before they become official and the first two were breaking up with their boyfriends.
Technically, the first two were “Tell Joe,” and “Tell Walky.”
“Tell Joe” isn’t the same thing as “Break up with Joe”. Dorothy appears to be assuming it is. Joyce… maybe not so much.
Joyce did. She just can’t do it because she just fell in love with him all over again.
I definitely think Joyce thought the plan was to break up with him — at least from her lack of surprise to Dorothy’s question. It’s possible tomorrow’s strip will open with her saying, “Wait, what? Who said I was breaking up with him?”, but…
Yeah, I think she’s aware that that was Dorothy’s expectation and was going along with her. But even in yesterday’s strip, when she got to thinking about actually doing it, it was definitely not making her happy, and I think she was already trying to come up with a way to thread the needle so she gets to have her beefcake and eat Dorothy too. And then Joe went and dropped a weighted blanket on her.
Heh. I think we agree, that we’re just having a specific-wording snafu.
I think Joyce was obviously happy and excited to Be With Dorothy, and that, as the reality of Breaking Up With Joe settles in, she’s just as obviously NOT happy with that part of the plan.
Bold of you to assume there’s a plan.
There’s a list, which is not the same thing as a plan.
No plan survives contact with the boyfriend.
Perfection.
everyone has a plan til they get [UNNECESSARY CENSORSHIP] in the face
-mike tyson
I do feel like in her excitement over what happened with Dorothy, she forgot she really does love Joe
What’s funny about this statement is that it works in reverse as well.
Yeah, other than some uncomfortable implications from Words of Willis, I agree.
Since the author is deliberately not here, lets talk frank: This wouldn’t’ be the first time he reacted to negative feedback with so much vitriol he changed his own story plans.
I’m curious, when did this occur? I’m also wondering how that worked out long term considering the climate here. >.>;
The only previous incident that springs to mind for me where Willis unambiguously said “I am changing this story because of all of you, deal with it.” was during Ultra Car(la)’s romance arc in Shortpacked when she went to visit her parents and Willis said that originally Joe (her father in that universe) was supposed to make an appearance but because he was sick of the comments making sex jokes about Joe, Joe had been removed from the storyline entirely.
Long term plans maybe, but I doubt he’s seriously rewritten as major a plot line as this – which he already has a year’s worth of in his buffer.
Oooh when did that happen?
But yeah, I don’t think I’ve ever seen this much discontent in the fanbase, and considering he apparently made this change on a… well, not a whim, but it wasn’t his original plan, I hope he’s doing OK. I mean, I also really dislike this whole thing, but I still enjoy DoA.
I’ve expressed quite a bit of discontent myself, but man I really do hope Willis is doing okay. I think chances are he is fine though. He is no stranger to this kind of reaction and has been doing webcomics longer than most people in the space. He knows how to navigate it by now. Probably called a Code Purple at his domicile and just has somebody giving him the foot notes to give him a degree of separation. Maybe. He is more experienced than any of us on this particular thing.
A blowjob is not necessarily an expression of love. In this case, I think it was:
– a delaying tactic, to give her time to think of a better plan for telling him the truth (and also putting off telling him the truth),
– paying Joe back for the sweet thing he did for her (so she doesn’t feel obligated to stay with him), and
– preemptively cushioning the blow of the breakup.
… heheh, cushioning the ‘blow’
I don’t think Joyce is that calculating about it. If she did that, it’s because in the moment she wanted to. I don’t know if that means “love”, but it’s not just to delay or payback.
I mean, these calculations were probably subconscious
Alright I’m fully on board with the idea that Joyce should express the desire to give polyamory a try. She clearly cares basically equally for Joe and Dorothy and she should vocalize those desires.
Of course, I’m still unconvinced either of the other parties would be open to it. Joe rather pointedly brought up how infidelity ended his parents’ relationship, and Dorothy is.. Dorothy.
Yep. It’s a case where poly might have been a good idea, but Joyce already ruined that possibility by cheating
Ya, pretty much this. She had a lot of chances during her date with Joe when she was actively thinking about Dorothy. But nope, she blew it.
Okay I feel insane here, I have to ask. Is the level of cheating that has occurred here actually that bad to normal people? I feel like I have seen a bunch of relationships bounce back just fine from someone jumping the gun a little bit on this kind of thing or doing bad partner behavior in other ways. It’s not that it’s not a breach of relationship contract, but that… Happens sometimes? And then you figure out where to go from there? What Joyce and Dorothy have done seems really low stakes as far as relationship violations go, especially given that their respective partners were already aware of their deep emotional relationship when they started dating. Sure it wasn’t romantic at the time, but again. I’m not claiming it’s not a contract violation just that it… Seems relatively small and extremely recoverable to me?
Like am I crazy in thinking there’s a very reasonable version of this conversation that goes “I have become romantically involved with someone without telling you ahead of time, it was unexpected and it happened today. I am interested in polyamory but what do you want to do about this” and the other person is like “this is a dealbreaker” or “here are the things I need from you going forward but let’s give it a go”? This seems. Really chill and fixable as relationship violations go.
Idk. Someone not poly tell me why people think this level of relationship violation ruins everything forever, I’m sure y’all are being real I just cannot model you in my head.
I am by no means an expert, or even very good at communicating considering how often my comments are misconstrued, but let me try pin pointing what bugged me personally about this even though it was like one kiss.
I actually started resenting this whole thing a LOT earlier than the protest visit. Everything leading up to it and skirting around the relationship felt like it was pre-meditated and actively pursued. Especially on Joyce’s end. They had the whole moment in bed where it got emotionally raw and intense, and that would have been the first moment where the conversation about poly could have happened. But it didn’t.
What’s worse, this happened right before a date with Joe that he was running errands for. She should have brought it up that night. But she didn’t. Instead it festered. The next morning, instead of hashing those feelings out, Joyce and Dorothy attempted to ‘do a load of laundry’ which we have all apparently have agreed is Sex to Joyce. And she initiated it.
Then we come to the protest, which you can argue the kiss was a moment of passion, but this has been building up since the night before. Everything that came after it would have had to have been pursued activity rather than just getting caught up in the moment. It’s repeat behavior. Yet the poly conversation hasn’t happened and instead they continue to sneak around. Even now, after a blow job.
When you frame it as having been less than 24 hours that all of this has occurred, it makes it seem less extreme. What sucks is for the readers it has been months of sneaking around.
I think Joyce being Joyce has made this inevitable, but yeah the comment section is unhinged over teenagers making some silly mistakes. Like Joe will be upset about this, but it’s not gonna like explode their friend group.
Yeah, before I ever fully realized I was poly, my boyfriend at one time confessed to me that he’d cheated two weeks prior by kissing someone at a party while he was drunk, and he clearly felt very bad about it but I also knew he was attracted to her, and my immediate reaction was pretty much just… “cool, thank you for letting me know, how was it though?” which I think probably threw him off a bit, haha.
I don’t know, I think some people consider even the slightest slip-up to be irredeemable and unrecoverable and worthy of derision and ridicule, but not all of us have the same amount of built-in jealousy where someone kissing someone else is immediately going to break our hearts forever. Even if I’m poly, that was a monogamous and closed relationship, and I was still pretty much just appreciative that he told me it happened and apologised, and considered that to be all the reason I needed to keep trusting him and staying with him as long as he remained interested in continuing our relationship.
I’m in a different closed mono relationship now, and I wouldn’t kiss anyone else but my current partner because we’ve established our own rules, but he does know I’m poly and that if it ever comes up, I would talk with him first. That’s equally fine to me, because we’ve talked about that and agreed to it.
People really do have very different standards for at what point someone is past forgiveness and what the appropriate response to any flavor of cheating is, and that’s fine, but it catches me off-guard sometimes how many people here will take their own personal strict rules and views on it and project it directly onto the entire cast. I definitely agree with you that this still seems entirely possible to discuss like mature adults, it’s just that Joyce is clearly having a hard time coming forward with it because she’s absolutely terrified. Which is understandable because she has good reason to think Joe will be heartbroken for multiple reasons! But we’ve also seen him do a lot of growth and talk with Dorothy about her attraction to Joyce, so I’m more willing than her to give him the benefit of the doubt here on him maybe seeing this coming, even if he’s still doing his best to be the boyfriend she deserves.
I’m poly-adjacent in that I’m happily monogamous but my best friend is in a steadily-expanding polycule, the core household of which (him and his two partners) has been stable for like 7 years now.
It’d absolutely be a problem if my girlfriend kissed her best friend. A big one, definitely a potential relationship ender. We haven’t talked about it, but I imagine she’d have the same problem if I kissed someone else.
Because kissing someone else is not something that we do, either of us. Before I started using dating apps and met my gf, it had been *years* since I so much as held a woman’s hand romantically.
In almost all cases, such as the one we’re seeing onscreen right now, it’s not just one kiss. It’s building up a wholeass relationship.
And in the rare cases where it’s just a hookup (usually drunken), well that’s *wildly* out of character for both of us. The woman I love is not someone who does that sort of thing, and if she changes to be the sort of person who does, I’m going to seriously question our compatibility.
In absence of verbal agreements, for most people the cultural norm takes precedence. And for many people that is sitcoms and dramas on television or in movies, since relationships and sex are taboo for normal conversation and not everyone has the kind of relationships that do have room for such conversations. What makes it worse is that those movies and television shows try to appeal to the largest possible number, which means they have to be more hung up on sexuality and love than average, so their viewers received distorted views about sexuality and love.
That’s basically my take on it. It’s cheating and it needs to be dealt with, but it’s on the lowest possible end of cheating. Most of the damage from cheating comes from the lying and the sneaking around (and obviously potential consequences like STDs and things).
A couple of kisses followed by a confession is something that many relationships could survive. Or survive as friendships, if the kisser does want to break up for the other person.
It’s not nothing, but it’s not like getting caught having sex with someone and find out it’s been going on for months. Or like having a second family next door as Blaine did.
The key though is clearing the air now and then sticking to whatever the new rules are. Which could be poly, could be a breakup, could be staying with Joe and not repeating anything with Dorothy.
OTOH, it wouldn’t be surprising if Joe was exceptionally sensitive to any kind of cheating, given his family history. This could be like twisting the knife in a still open wound.
I generally agree with this, to add a data point as a monogamous person who has gone through the process of considering whether monogamy is What I Really Want or not.
As a married person, my spouse impulsively kissing someone else would be a violation of trust and of the boundaries we have explicitly agreed to. But because we’ve had years to build up trust, because it’s the least bad kind of cheating, and if they confessed right away and agreed to some boundaries around their interactions with that person… I think my marriage would survive. I decided long ago that this sort of thing wasn’t necessarily an immediate deal breaker, because people make bad decisions sometimes.
But if I were Joe? Hell no. Joe and Joyce haven’t been dating long and haven’t had the time to build up that level of resilient trust. This would feel more like Joyce showing her true colors and less like a forgiveable indiscretion.
I agree Joe will probably break up with her, but I do think people are making this situation come off a lot more dire than it really is. People are messy, but I would expect everyone here to still be friends at the end
“This would feel more like Joyce showing her true colors”
Now that you mention it, I think this is more important than the actual betrayal. This is the second time Joyce has disregarded an existing relationship. First with Jacob, now with Joe.
One time could maybe be chalked up to a thoughtless mistake. Twice?
Some people are just incapable of cheating. It never occurs to them, or they’re too disgusted by the idea to entertain it.
Joyce has demonstrated that she can and will. Joe can never trust her again, and even if he thinks he can, they’re clearly incompatible given his history.
Dorothy should be wary, too. “If they cheat with you, they can cheat on you” is a known aphorism, and Joyce JUST demonstrated it.
Ya I have been thinking this line of thought a lot today based on some of takes in the comments. Initially I thought “Joyce cheating on Joe so suddenly is a regression of her character after her lesson with Jacob” but I may have been looking at that from the wrong lens. This could very easily just be who she is. The only question is who would stoke her passion enough for it to happen again?
The only question is who would stoke her passion enough for it to happen again?
Walky dressed as a mouse?
Well, that’s not how to do the quotes I’ve seen other people using. The italicized portion was hopefully obviously quoted form Josh.
FTR, people like me are using <blockquote cite=”name of person being quoted”></blockquote>.
(I used < up there in lieu of “real” anglebrackets so that it would show up as code.)
And so began Joyce’s Hymmel the Humming Hymnal Fursona arc, DoA’s second cataclysmic comment section event.
I am interested (down the line) in getting Jacob’s take on this whole situation.
OTOH, if it was just the kissing and she had managed to actually confess it – and then really seemed to be serious about not doing it again, even with the short relationship I think a lot of people would be okay with it. If uncomfortable and concerned for awhile.
OTGH, she didn’t actually confess it and it really doesn’t seem like she’s planning to even try to call things off with Dorothy, much less be able to hold herself to that, which makes everything much messier.
So, AK, a few things.
First, nobody in this plotline seems to want to be poly, at all. Joe doesn’t want it, Dorothy doesn’t want it, Joyce… maybe, but honestly I think she just has more conflicted feelings over which ONE person she wants to choose.
Second, as to the “level of cheating…” I think the fact that this is a comic strip, with small amounts of time taking place over a long while, is distorting things.
In real life, if a relationship was a week old (because, right? Isn’t that how long Joyce and Joe have been together?), and there was a small kiss in emotional circumstances… that is absolutely weatherable.
The issue is, the context is important. Dorothy and Joyce are both treating this… very seriously. Willis had all that “wedding” imagery during the riot, with pink tear gas, even.
Meanwhile, Joyce and Joe had a long, serious lead up to their relationship, and they were both treating is as a Big Deal already.
Point being, nobody in this entire storyline is treating anything casually or openly.
A simple kiss doesn’t have to be a big deal. A big kiss with declarations of love, wedding imagery, immediately planning breakups, etc makes it worse.
I think it would be more accurate to say “nobody involved has said anything to indicate that they want to be poly”, rather than that no one seems to want to be poly. As you acknowledge, Joyce maaaaybe might want that, actually.
So far, no one’s talked about it in those terms yet, so we don’t know if any of the characters would be interested in it yet. And hey, they MIGHT be about to have a conversation that would involve considering the idea and giving opinions on it, but of course Joe can’t weigh in yet (except inasmuch as his speech to Joyce about not being jealous after #dranks because he “doesn’t think he has a right to be jealous, not with his history” and then adding that he wants Joyce to have the things she wants, which Willis did include in their mega post of “Joyce/Dorothy-adjacent strips”.
(He didn’t say it while looking happy, and I don’t like how he downplayed his right to feel feelings, but it’s the closest any of these three have come to talking about the possibility of a Dorothy/Joyce/Joe poly situation.)
Of the people involved, Joyce does seem to be the most likely person to bring the idea of a poly relationship up. I can’t really find the strips, but there has been more than one comic where Joyce has interacted with her dorm’s resident polycule with actual curiosity and questions rather than being averse to it. It’s the strongest foundation by far for why you could expect Joyce to come up with it first.
Yep! Someone linked the first time she in-non-bonus-strip-comments realized Sierra and Grace were an item, and she reacts with dismay because she thinks she’s seeing Grace cheat on Mandy (in broad daylight! in the dorm hallway!), only for Grace to clarify that Mandy’s cool with it and Sierra to add that she sometimes also kisses Mandy.
Joyce has since then had a couple more conversations with one or more of them about the subject, MOSTLY in the aforementioned bonus strips (one of which also features Willis lampshading how usually dorm loft beds would be too small for three people to fit comfortably, but Joyce managed it with Dorothy and Walky that one time), but some of it on-panel.
None of which means that Joyce is going to think of it here, but this strip is the closest it’s come so far to visibly crossing her mind, and it’s one of the topics she and Dorothy could possibly get onto as a result. I at least expect Dorothy to ask Joyce if breaking up with Joe is really what she wants to do, even if what Dorothy means by the question is “are you sure you want to be with me” and not “are you sure you don’t want to be with us both”… so, another chance for the characters to potentially address the topic directly…!
Walky has actively brought the possibility up with partners (Lucy) in the past, but everyone seems focused on the potential Joyce/Dorothy/Joe thruple without accounting for the fourth person in this mess. Of course he’s probably not interested in dating Joyce himself (although maybe his constant bickering with Joyce should be looked at through a lens that recalls that his first instinctive reaction to developing feelings for Dorothy was to throw a toy at her head like a kindergartner) but it’s entirely possible his reaction to Dorothy confessing the kiss to him might be suggesting that Dorothy continue to date both of them while his relationship with Joyce remains platonic. This could lead to him trying to get Amber on board with joining the polycule or him exploring his nearly as obvious as Joyce’s bisexuality. On the other hand so could Dorothy breaking up with him.
The real question there is how interested is Dorothy in actually continuing her relationship with Walky?
Yeah, for sure Walky has said a couple of things that make him seem at least Academically Intrigued(tm) — we’ll see how far that goes, maybe, if Dorothy has the same trouble breaking up with him that Joyce just had breaking up with Joe.
Yeah, it’s easy to say “These are still short term relationships, they don’t really matter”, but that’s not how anyone of the characters are treating them (or the narrative itself with the wedding motifs).
I hate cheating with all my being…. but people in the comments have been really weird lately.
Personally, I wouldn’r even call the happenings as actual cheating.
I guess most people forget that these situationships aren’t really 10 years old. They are what, 3-4 days old.
Sheeesh.
Yayyy! Welcome to the fun side.
ONE OF US! ONE OF US!
Yeah, it’s gonna be a BUMPY RIDE but I am strapped in.
“Two for Tina” resolution, but not the “fit into a 22 minute show for broadcast TV featuring 13 year olds” version.
So almost none of the details are the same, except that only one person in the potential polycule is likely comfortable with polyamory. Which I imagine is pretty frustrating in real life.
Well then! That’ll make the future conversation way more awkward.
And interesting to learn about Joe’s mom! Did we know she was autistic?
It’s come up before, I believe! At least in the comments, so probably in the comic itself, although I don’t remember it perfectly.
yes
https://www.dumbingofage.com/hanging/
Ah, yep, it’s been a minute since I saw that strip. I’ll have to reread this comic at some point.
We did, yes! He’s mentioned it before.
I can absolutely agree with the weighted blanket + autism thing. I am under mine right now! It’s 20lbs and is the kind where it’s like, uhhhh, kinda quilted into squares to keep the weight distribution even. You might think that’s obvious, but the first one I owned had these heavy bags inside it that would flop around and just slide off of you into the sides of the blanket and essentially trap you in bed, which was very not fun. My current one is great, though, and I no longer suffer from repetitive myoclonic jerks that would prevent me from falling and staying asleep.
Weighted blankets (that don’t pin you to the bed) are very cool, is my point.
Joe really has become a good guy and a good boyfriend. It’s gonna be awful for him when Joyce actually tells him about her and Dorothy. She’s gonna have to do so eventually.
I bet that kiss ends up on the front page of the student paper
but who would have taken the photo?
Jennifer did. She submitted them for her Amazi-Girl assignment. She currently believes Joe is AG.
Daisy would CRY.
ooooh boy
I think the most difficult part of this for Joyce is going to be the fact that I think she truly, genuinely does love both of them. Perhaps in different ways, perhaps not… but this isn’t a choice between an obvious bad partner versus an obvious good partner. If it were, it would be a slam dunk.
I suspect no matter which choice she makes, Joyce is probably going to co e away feeling like she made the wrong one.
Honestly? Dorothy isn’t stable enough for a relationship born from cheating during a breakdown during police oppression during a protest while rebelling against her former core principle (trust in the government) right now.
Joyce should stay with Joe and push Dorothy to get talk therapy. Therapy is a good thing in general (you may have to shop around a bit for a psychologist or psychiatrist that is a good fit), but Dorothy has a lot to work through and it is becoming more and more obvious that she is unable of talking about most of her issues with her friends or lovers, so unless that changes she will just keep spiraling.
Dorothy has been going to therapy. She’s just been lying to her therapist.
I mean, almost everyone in this comic is still a college freshman, despite how much happened in the first semester.
Statistically, none of these relationships are surviving.
Yep 100% Searcher. The comment section keeps expecting teenagers to have perfect emotional intelligence, and it’s really silly
On the one hand, yay blowjobs. But on the other…Joyce has to tell him at some point.
Not if her mouth is full!
Applause!
I hope he calls him mom at some point. Not about the oral sex. Or even to talk in depth about the impending breakup. Just she seems nice enough.
Wait a minute. Joyce may have the hots for Dorothy now, but that doesn’t necessarily mean she wants to break up with Joe, does it? Like, I’m shocked that Dorothy assumed that was the plan. I have no idea what the plan should be beyond laying the cards on the table and talking it out.
Dorothy is very much under the impression that Joyce is going to be exclusively Hers now.
Dorothy’s conversation with Joe was based on the fact that she was in denial she was trying to steal Joyce.
Nope you’re right. Joyce loves both of them. She got caught up in her love for Dorothy but that doesn’t mean she suddenly doesn’t love Joe anymore and it seems she just realized that. And now she’s going to realize she has to make a difficult choice
Honestly I think that’s the most important thing for Joyce to realize before she talks to Joe. “Hey Joe, I realized I love Dotty, not you, laterz!” is going to hit him way different than “I realized I also have feelings for Dorothy and we kissed but I still love you and I don’t know what to do.”
They may break up regardless, but one of those is way more knife-twisting.
“I realized I also have feelings for Dorothy and we kissed but I still love you and I don’t know what to do.”
“… That’s what my dad said to my mom the first time he got caught cheating on her.”
God, that would be such a knife twist. I’m hoping for it now, shame on me…
While it’s certainly possible and it would be an awful parallel: Coming to tell him about it rather than getting caught makes a big difference. As does just kissing rather than actual sex, since I don’t believe it would have been just kissing with Richard.
What plan? This resulted from Dorothy crashing out at a protest, Joyce quoting Paramour lyrics through tear gas and then the two of them running away. This is just a mess.
I like the belief people have that this could be the start of a poly relationship(which is pretty much poly through coercion at this point) because that’s even more insane.
I thought she was quoting the book of Ruth
Honestly those might as well be the same thing for me since I don’t know either. I thought she was just repeating whatever song Dorothy gave her.
No, she was quoting Ruth–specifically, scripture about deep love between two women that is often read at lesbian weddings. Not exactly common knowledge, though.
Yeah, sounds like something the Borg would say: “Hello formerly exclusive boyfriends, you’re now part of a poly relationship without your foreknowledge, adapt or perish.”
Joyce doesn’t seem shocked that Dorothy thinks that was the plan.
Officially the plan was just “Tell Joe”, but it’s pretty clear the plan wasn’t “tell Joe that we kissed, but it’s okay because it’ll never happen again.”
It hasn’t been explicitly stated, but I don’t think the past several strips’ dialog holds together without them both planning to break up with their boyfriends, not merely tell them. Dorothy said telling them was a prerequisite to “before we can allow ourselves to… you know.” Joyce mentally drafted her talk as delivering “bad news”. Etc.
Most people would *assume* that when the girl they like swears that they are yours, and that they will always be yours, that that means exclusivity. Maybe they shouldn’t, but the fact of the matter is they *do*. Polyamory is the exception, not the rule, and it isn’t something many people are suited to.
I don’t personally think either Dotty *or* Joe are very interested in sharing Joyce with the other anyway.
I think I know what the alt text is referring to, but I cannot remember who made the comment that Joyce would break down and, uh, put her mouth on a billion weenuses to search for it and link it…
That’s tough. I feel like it could be Walky or Billie or Ruth.
Or Maybe Sarah to Jacob
Walky was the one making jokes about “weenuses”, but it was in a different context. Lying naked in Dorothy’s bed after they’d had sex pointing at things with his weenus, iirc.
It was after the whiteboard ding-dong bandit story, I believe.
It was Jacob! Jacob said this!
Aaand there it is: https://www.dumbingofage.com/2014/comic/book-4/02-i-was-a-teenage-churchmouse/therepressions/
Thanks for the hint!
Thank you; I never would have found that. Also Mr. Willis was sitting on that for eleven years?! I am impressed. I can hardly remember writing ideas I’ve had a week ago, much less over a decade.
Honestly I always remembered it as Joe. It just seemed a much more Joe thing to say.
“A human being should be able to enjoy butts without shame.” He’s a true philosopher, can’t wait to see more of him, someday.
I’m not sure if it’s the same thing but I think it was Ruth that predicted Joyce would go through some kind of ex-repression sexual bender.
Perhaps you’re referring to this?
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2018/comic/book-8/04-of-mike-and-men/need-2/
Definitely not the same comment, but the same general vibe (no pun intended).
Oh yeah, that’s a pretty similar sentiment just without an exact number.
“One day she’s gonna snap and suck like a billion dicks.“
She just needed that one nudge to get over the bump. First one down (SO down); 999,999,999 more to go!
I had wondered what Willis meant with that alt text. And now I know. 😀
“Joyce, you go back in there and break up with your boyfriend.”
“Right, right… so what do you think, just two or three more blowjobs to soften the blow?”
Dorothy too considered having sex with Walky one last time to soften the blow before breaking up with him, I think these disasters are just in sync in terms of being terrible at breaking up with people.
(By which I mean I bet Dorothy somewhat understands, but also at the time Dorothy didn’t want to break up with Walky, either, and was just doing it bc she thought it was the kinder option… so the situation has some similarities, heh.)
Technically after breaking up with him.
And after having sex with him during the “pause”.
Sure sure. I was sleepy. 🙂 I just mean she’s literally done either this or something similar, and also she tried to one-up it in terms of mixed messages. So she should be understanding.
Oof I hate this. Joe is so good to her. I wish they could talk it through.
This just made me sad ☹️
Me too. I can’t find any of this funny, and it’s written as jokes.
I mean, it’s a comic so… it’s likely to be written as jokes.
That was an amazing tactical trauma deployment and the man had no idea he did it.
Right? Absolutely and unknowingly devastating.
See! This is the best storyline ever! I can’t believe people want to step around all the potential for mess here. Like this is gold. Imagine if Amber goes and makes out with Walky before Dorothy gets to break things off because she probably knows about the kiss and wants Walky’s dick? Then who’s cheating? This is all going to be so bad!
I want to see AG in on the drama too. Has she noticed the attention from Dorothy, and the UST? Does Amber start hallucinating Mike again, on behalf of Joe? This Joyce is so much better than the “innocent misunderstanding sex” Joyce.
It’s so so good
Depending on how it plays out, it has the potential to hurt several people very badly.
Popcorn?
thank you…YES. i want messssssss.
So, possible twists here I had not considered:
1. Joyce never tells Joe but tells Dorothy she did and they *cheat* cheat
2. Joyce can’t bring herself to break up with Joe, decides to backsies on the yuri and breaks up with *Dorothy*, leading to Dorothy being resentful and kicking the can on everything going to shit until it inevitably leaks.
See, I could’ve sworn word of Willis is that they’re endgame otherwise I’d say #1 is the most likely outcome (and should end with Dorothy breaking up with Joyce in that instance.)
I swear, Willis saying (somewhere that nobody can point to) that they were endgame is probably the worst thing that could have happened to the comment section lol
I mean it still very much possible that Joyce breaks up with Dorothy and then they reunite much later. But that is probably just wishful thinking on my part
In preview panels from a year from now they’re still holding hands so don’t count on option 2.
Ah, but they could definitely be holding hands AGAIN after a breakup!
Well that would frankly be exhausting
Pff. Mostly joking!
I do think that still holding hands a year from now in real time doesn’t necessarily mean that much about their long-term sustainability, though.
An average (not mean!) chapter of DoA is 77.9 strips long, and MOST chapters cover 24 hours, though of course not all of them. These days, with one strip per day (remember when Willis used to skip weekends?!), that means that a chapter lasts a bit over two months. Which would mean a year of strips averages to about six days of in-universe time passing, although more recent storylines have mostly been longer, with the rare chapter still being about 50-60 strips, but most being closer to 90 strips, and therefore the amount of time passing per year dropping to more like four days.
So! Holding hands four days from now might not mean much, long-term.
(Also the next three storyline titles are all super ominous, heh.)
Are the names of the storylines out in the open or patreon only?
They’re in the open! Check the drop-down. We’re currently seeing the titles for the next four chapters.
“Not-So Smooth Criminals”
“I’m the Problem, It’s Me”
“Fools’ Spring”
“What a RARR! Mood I’m In”
(That last one makes me think of Dina, as well as Almost Like Being In Love (link is to the Nat King Cole cover, which is what’s on the Groundhog Day soundtrack and therefore the version I’m most familiar with, haha), where it’s a lyric. So, because of those two things, I think that chapter might be more positive again.
The three between us and it, not so much!
ruh roh raggy
Everybody mouth the weenus!
The weenus is a dance
Everybody is a genius
Who blew Joe in advance!
Dangit, now I’ll have to rewatch Deja Vu AGAIN.
which premium subscription do you need to get this version?! i need it for…research
Came into the comments JUST to ctrl+f “everybody” so thank you 😂
May i submit for the 2nd line “the weenus has a glans”
So, he gave her a blanket and she responded by blowing him? Was that gratitude, guilt, or an overblown (yeah, intentional) sense of reciprocity.
Yes.
Joyce is horny as fuck. She needs this polycule because neither of them are going to be able to keep up with her alone.
If nothing else, Dorothy doesn’t have a functional penis, so she can’t give Joyce that exact sensation.
If sex drives remain a multiversal constant, then Thumpasprung would indicate you’re extremely correct.
A weighted blanket. If it’s a good one those fuckers are expensive. It makes more sense to give head for that than Walky’s sugestion that he would blow a guy to get free pizza.
Well, they seem to have gone down in price since I last looked into getting one a few years ago. Still looks like they average more expensive than a pizza though.
Oh no, I just had a premonition. This story is going to end with a Joe flashback where Joe and Walky have been secretely practicing sex together all this time. It started with Walky asking Joe for advice with the ladies and developed from there into a full blown (intentional) masterclass. They’re highly ashamed of it, each for different reasons. This s one of the reasons why Joe is not moving past his issues with cheating, and one of the reasons why Walky spends so much time avoiding real conversations.
good news: Joe, you are NOT your father
bad news: Joe, you might be your mom
[Mike] So…gender-swapped Amber?
New prediction, not a bit. When Dorothy tells Becky, or Becky figures it out, Dorothy’s going to have something like an anxiety attack. Not because of Becky’s feelings about Joyce, that’s just the surface. Because she blames herself Ross being killed and has trauma dreams about it.
It still feels a little weird to me that Becky’s feelings are being prioritized as much as they are. She’s the least important factor here. Dorothy and Joyce have no obligation to tell her anything and frankly it’s not her business. I know they’re all friends and she had a crush but it feels like their relationship dynamic is a little unbalanced because of her possessiveness of Joyce.
When you tell people about your feelings, people will be considerate of them. Becky was much more open and honest about her feelings than anyone else involved here, so she gets the most consideration. This doesn’t seem weird to me, the rest of the cast is just self-sabotaging.
They’re worried about it because Becky is ALREADY jealous and possessive over Joyce and Dorothy’s friendship, and the fallout from this is likely to be bad. Neither of them wants to hurt Becky, and this is going to hurt a lot.
I’ve said it before so I’ll be brief this time. I really think Joyce, Dorothy, and even us readers are greatly underestimating Becky’s mental toughness.
I think it will be a blow, but I don’t think its going to devastate Becky or anything.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Becky’s either more confused about how much it doesn’t hurt her, or (paradoxically) hurt that it hurts at all, given how attached she is to Dina.
I’m predicting mostly messy, complicated feelings about it all. Also, some baggage about changing sexualities that she’s demonstrated previously.
I mostly want the “Dina knows she’s Becky’s second choice” gun to be fired after close to 10 years of it sitting on the shelf loaded.
This always feels like a wierd comparison to me for a couple reasons. Firstly, Becky never really talked to Dina before joyce rejected her, so it’s not like she was ignoring her until joyce rejected her.
The second is that Joyce… kinda was becky’s second choice? Becky had a girlfriend back at Anderson who dropped her after they were found out, and then fled to joyce when everything fell apart.
Firstly: I’m going pretty much entirely off of this comic:https://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/comic/book-6/02-that-perfect-girl/riddles/
Secondly: I *hate* it when this happens, but I *know* I read a strip where Becky talks about how she and Kaitlin “were worried that this was all there is so they just went for it”- they didn’t have a deep romantic connection.
Becky’s going to laugh about it. Joe is going to break.
I get that Becky is probably going to be more alright with it than they (and some of us) expect, but there’s this weird “You shouldn’t even consider the feelings of your best friend” vibe to this take.
It’s more like it’s hard to feel like Becky returns this kind of consideration when it comes to relationships with Joyce and Dorothy specifically. She gets jealous when they go out drinking. She literally pushed Dorothy away when she and Joyce get too close. I’m not talking about the polarizing “performative rivalry” thing. Becky just legit gets jealous despite being in a full, dedicated relationship with another top quality partner. It’s a cute character flaw but it does make we wonder why they show so much consideration for her in this circumstance when she’a always a speed bump to it. Maybe it’s a bit of a hot take on my part, perhaps I’m misunderstanding some of the subtleties of all their friendship dynamics. It just seems they’re doing a lot of worrying about her she never really showed them when they were only just friends.
I mean, if my best friend had been in love with me since we were kids, formed a semi-performative rivalry with my other best friend and acted jealous anytime me and my other best friend had some level of intimacy, I would be delicate about telling my best friend if me and my other best friend started hooking up.
I thiiiink that what keeps Sirksome from thinking the same, is they wouldn’t stay best friends with someone as mean as Becky has been to them.
So Dorothy and Joyce do think a like, thats exactly what Dorothy does when she believes she did something wrong to Walky, although Joyce didn’t go all the way with it like Dorothy was.
I know this is gonna be messy, as per the writer’s words, but I do hope that things will be okay in the end overall. I want Joyce to be happy, I want Dorothy to be happy. I also want Joe to be happy, but I highly doubt that by the end of this, he will get anything better then Bittersweet.
Dorothy and Joyce really are a amazing couple if they can actually get through this and Dorothy can get her shit together about her future plans. Joe is an amazing boyfriend, he truly does care for Joyce, loves her, but Joyce needs to follow her Heart, not her genitals, and her Heart has always belonged to Dorothy.
That all being said, Bad Joyce, you don’t go and get his hopes up like that when your planning to break up with him. Its one of the worst choices you could have made in this situation aside from the illegal choices.
if she breaks up with him now, she probably just literally ruined blowjobs for him, forever. he won’t be able to get it sloppy style ever again, without thinking of that time Joyce complete broke his heart, right after sucking out his soul.
Forever? That’s dramatic, I think he’ll be fine after he heals and gets blown a few times.
I think if anything has been demonstrated here it’s that her heart DOESNT belong to just Dorothy. She still adores Joe.
Nah, apparently she doesn’t care about him at all, she’s just horny for him.
At least that seems to be some people’s take.
I still feel like I was one of the main people wondering if Joyce just didn’t love him, and neither I nor any of the people agreeing with me actually suggested she didn’t care about him at all.
I have seen some “Joyce doesn’t care about Joyce at all,” but not combined with saying she was “just horny” — more combined with “if she cared about him at all, she wouldn’t be doing this to him”, or, most recently, “the fact that Joyce is talking about Becky right now proves that she doesn’t care about Joyce at all 😡”
lol. Sometimes typos are just funny. The second Joyce in both quotes was meant to be “Joe”.
Also, let me acknowledge that maybe you aren’t talking about me or the people who were agreeing with me? Maybe there was another conversation thread I missed. It’s a big, busy comment section.
Mostly I was sarcastically exaggerating. 🙂
I think that people are forgetting just how little time her and joe have actually been together. Like a couple weeks tops. Sure there is a part of her that loves joe, but you can Love a person without being IN LOVE with them. She is IN LOVE with Dorothy. Their connection trumps anything she had with Joe, and just about everybody knows it, including Joe and Walky.
Loving somebody and being In love with somebody are two different things. Part of her Loves Joe, but she is IN Love with Dorothy and has been for a while, just didn’t understand the feeling.
She has been with Joe for like a couple weeks, her love for him started very recently. She has loved Dorothy since about the start of this damn story, maybe not In Love since then, but she has held Dorothy close in her heart for a long ass time.
See, NOW I want them to kiss.
Given how Dotty feels about Joe, I suspect there is nothing she wants less in the entire universe.
Also, haven’t said it yet, but I appreciate the double-dipped Dune reference in your username.
I had a feeling the break-up would fail. Never would have guessed a sex act would be involved.
Man people are super rigid lately, like this story like has to end poly or with Joyce and Dorothy (and for that matter if they did, they would never break up after? Or for that matter, if they became poly then /that/ would never break up after).
Down to the very terminology, branding what seems to be two pretty bisexual women as lesbians or that their girlfriends when literally none of that has been said. How do we know that this isn’t the start of the Joyce is gonna become an absolute beast era (atleast for women, she does indeed seem pretty singularly focused on Joe when it comes to dudes at the moment but that’s my take on it).
These are college freshman, second semester seemingly just started and it’s taken forever just to get to here. I think anything being set in stone at this juncture is odd unless Willis decides we’re capping it before the summer.
Also, people keep saying they don’t want Joe to backslide like 1. That wouldn’t be perfectly understandable and 2. He can absolutely go back to being kind of a slut and it not being with the underlying stuff it was before. Not sure if he will, but as long as he has clear respect and consent for his hook ups and they do him, and they agree it’s not serious (or a rebound becomes serious) what’s the damage here?
Just feels kind of horseshoe theory a bit, like we can be fun flirty and queer but only if in the bounds of strict structure that Gay Jesus would approve of.
Let em live, and more importantly, let them be interesting since that’s why we read the comic.
Abso-smegging-lutely!
I wish people would wait until the story has played out rather than complaining about what they _think_ is going to happen.
I think people are (understandably) assuming that Dorothy and Joyce hooking up for the foreseeable future of the series is inevitable (be it in a poly relationship form or in a monogamous form) in part due to Willis’ comments from their Patreon and other social media platforms.
Yeah that sense of inevitability from Willia’ comments makes it weird. And like, contrary to what he’s said about rejecting fate.
Not just their comments, but the entire framing of the arc, especially the kiss scene.
This is being framed as Romantic, not as Joyce becoming “an absolute beast”.
I mean. I don’t think anything they’ve said has indicated it was going to be endgame, actually.
– They’ve said the “queerbaiting” strip with Daisy was meant to wink at the audience and reassure them that the tension WAS going to be resolved eventually.
– They’ve compared this to Leslie and Ann (Parks & Recreation) and JD and Turk (Scrubs) and talked about how they did get to thinking about how cool it would be if either of those shows had actually Gone There, and then realized hey, they’re the author of a similar situation, they had the power! They could go there!
– They’ve talked about having always envisioned Joyce going to Dorothy through some type of adversity and quoting the Book of Ruth at her again, this time romantically, and they’ve talked about realizing halfway through the protest story that it was happening, and hastening to add more wedding type imagery to the scene.
…but none of these things have to mean the ship is endgame, and even if it IS, endgame is a million years away — Dorothy and Joyce could break up tomorrow and then still wind up together in a far-future DoA epilogue.
Like, it wasn’t a literal marriage. And even if it had been, marriages end in divorce all the time.
I don’t think the worry about Joe is that he’ll be less moral. I think that it seems clear that he wants to be loved by someone, and he wants to be the type of person that someone would keep. It would be a shame if he saw any of this as being proof that he can’t have that.
Your worry isn’t that Joe will become less moral. Plenty of other Joe fans, too, have just said they’re worried he’ll he hurt, and some others have worried that he’ll dive back into being Shallow Mc Man-Slut, or some variant thereof.
But there have also been comments specifically forecasting that he was going to backslide all the way into misogyny, or that he and maybe also Walky are going to like, team up with The Incelerator, adopting that same really awful view of women.
I think Walky is in way greater risk of that than Joe. Incels are basically just radicalized dudes who have been rejected by society and can’t bring themselves to do introspection as to why, it’s basically a cult that feeds them an easy answer that they never have to question because as long as they keep spouting hateful bullshit, it will be a self-perpetuating loop of rejection.
Joe has friends, people he can rely on both men and women. Walky has jack shit, Walky doesn’t even have his parents. If anybody were going to be pulled to the way of the incel, it would be Walky. But I don’t think he’ll go that way. I think it’ll be an ongoing concern, but I still stand firm in my belief that Walky is going to end up kicking Incelerator’s teeth in before letting his rage simmer out. Idk how to solve his core problem of needing friends though. Maybe Danny and Joe take him in (despite Danny hating him, Danny can also be like “wow that’s really messed up”)
I don’t think so. Walky’s not only been more successful with women in terms of relationships than most incels, but actually likes them. No incel would ever have been friends with Lucy for months – without either trying a move or stewing in frustration over being friendzoned without actually getting up the nerve.
Old Joe was in many ways much closer to an incel. He certainly had the “women are objects to be used for sex” part down. He had enough “game” to be regularly successful though, so more PUA than incel. Not that there’s much difference there really.
You had one job, Joyce.
I did not know these blankets were a thing. I must have one!
And she gave it to Joe.
No Joyce, not that job!!! *sighs and gets the water spray bottle*
okay even as a certified sicko, this one has me oofing
I am sorry i gonna have to relinquish your Sicko certifications.
turn in your shirt and window
I recently had to break up with someone in very different circumstances (no cheating was involved), but we had also been friends for a while before starting to date and I knew they really liked me. The problem was that I realized things weren’t working out during exam week, and I felt like a massive jerk for breaking up at that point. Honestly, there really was no “right time” to break things off, and I knew the more I put it off, the harder it would get.
All this to say while Joyce has made some very questionable decisions, I can sympathize with her here. It’s gotta be even harder to break up with someone you actually still have feelings for.
Yeah, when you’ve decided to break up with someone, there usually isn’t a “right time” and it’s always going to suck. I had a friend who came to the realization that he wasn’t actually in love with his girlfriend, he just enjoyed the sex, and decided to break up next time they saw each other.
And then the next time they saw each other, she told him she was pregnant.
He still broke up with her, though he acknowledged that even though he was planning to do so before he knew, it was still SUPER shitty for her to go through a breakup and an abortion at the same time.
I think this is the first confirmation that Papa Joe is the one who left the marriage before being divorced by Joe Mom. Which is an interesting twist on the idea he was just a sleazeball cheating on her (he still is but didn’t try to keep it going indefinitely).
Joe could just be talking about after Richard got kicked out.
honestly, it’s hard for me to read it any other way.
I am reading it as confirming he wasn’t kicked out so that was surprising to me.
As a few other have jokingly commented on, does this now count as Joyce as having cheated on Dorothy? I feel like cheating requires more active planning, maybe the best descriptor would simply be a practice of unethical-non-monogamy?
But in all serious while Willis’ past patreon comments seem to possibly hint at Joyce/Dorothy being the “endgame” ship for the two, I do wonder if Joyce will actually attempt polyamory (if it its even possible with the semi-antagonistic relationship Dorothy still has with Joe)?
They haven’t really agreed that they’re in a relationship, so technically no. But Dorothy has every right to be upset, as the plan was to break up with their partners and be together.
I mean, what’s she supposed to do after that, not suck his cock?
I mean, she has standards.
And those standards include sucking off her cisgender boyfriend who’s so very kind to her. They’re good standards.
It’s just something friends do, according to Jennifer.
Jennifer “The Expert” Billingsworth, known for her reliable advice on relationships. If Joyce can’t trust Billie about these things, who can she trust?
I’m not joking, if it were me, I’d be up in there, too. Joe is so sweet.
It’s the pineapple.
I’m ace as hell but I think if I listed all the things I’d do for Joe it’d be auto flagged and I might get ip banned. I just. I really like this guy.
Now kiss!
Break up with him, Joyce.
Joe deserves way better.
This is actually a version of what I expected: Hijinks that delay or otherwise provoke resistance to having the break-up conversations, rinse, repeat. The longer it’s delayed, the worse the cheaters feel, the more the tension rises.
Good.
I was worried this wasn’t going to be messy enough.
I’m fine with this actually. Let the repercussions flow! Guilt! Angst! Dotty going to Costco to buy Joyce so much mouthwash but it never helps!
even better, walky gets told instantly. Joyce keeps delaying. walky goes to commiserate with joe and accidentally breaks the news
1) Marriage
2) Anal Sex
3) Vaginal Sex
4) Oral Sex
Those are the rankings for “That is the opposite of ‘breaking up.'”
Joe is so nice he’s somehow going to have the perfect gift every time Joyce tries to break up with him
Since Parks and Rec recently entered the discussion, here’s a scene that this reminds me of:
Ann: Oh, God. How did the breakup go?
Leslie: Well, I started crying because he gave me an eclair. And then we made out and spent the night together. But this morning in the cold light of day…
I cooked breakfast and we made out some more.
Ann: Wow, you opposite-of-broke-up with him.
Leslie: He gave me an eclair, Ann!
As the person responsible for that (and i feel no shame, Parks & Rec is golden), I very much laughed!
Also: Does this count as Joyce cheating on Dorothy?
Rule of cheating: the one you do the cheating with is your non-legit partner.
Having intimate interactions with your legit partner is not cheating, it’s just your regular intimacy.
You are still a cheater because you are with someone else behind the back of your legit partner, while your non-legit partner is actually aware that you already are in a relationship.
Cheating with your non-legit partner can only start after you have broken up with your legit-partner, as your non-legit partner has then become your legit partner (under the condition your former non-legit partner is also no longer in an other legit relationship of their own).
You can only cheat with your non-legit partner if your non-legit partner doesn’t actually know they are the non-legit partner. That’s double cheating, then.
The point is, if you are a non-legit partner and you learn that the person you are cheating with has just had an intimate interaction with their legit partner, the point is: don’t be an hypocrite.
I think if you’ve told your new partner you’re breaking up with your current partner to be with them, but you don’t actually do it and keep having sex with your original partner, then you are cheating on the new one too. Double cheating, as you say.
Classic example would be the dude pulling the “My wife doesn’t understand me, we’re practically separated” routine to seduce the new woman, while actually just continuing normally with his wife as well as the side piece.
They have just kissed for less than 20 minutes ago. Maybe 30, at most. A bit too early to make that comparison. Everythign is all new for them. And it’s not like Dorothy doesn’t know Joyce actually still has feeling for Joe. This isn’t a story where the cheating partner has fallen out of love with their legit one. And Dorothy is aware of that too.
Same apply with Dorothy and Walky via Joyce.
In this comic: Joyce is YTA, Joe is the STBX and Dorothy is the AP.
Joyce never told Dorothy they were exclusive, like she did for Joe.
Wait, she actually did? It’s not meant to be an exaggeration or what? That actually happened?
Seems like it.
It does seem she did, in fact, suck that dick
I would cackle like a loon if Willis actually did a BJ slipshine right after the lesbian protest wedding.
The level of chaos that would cause would be on the level that’d make the Red Wedding feel tame.
I hope Willis does exactly this.
Also Also: Do all the autistic women in this comic have a Sexy Times trigger?
i dont think you fully appreciate the allure of the big smoosh
Clearly, I don’t.
Euuuh okay this is my limit I think. My PTSD does not play well with this kind of consent obtained-by-deception on top of the regular-degular cheating (which was honestly already skating close to a sensitive area for me) so I will take an indefinite hiatus until my favorite comic character stops triggering me? Maybe longer?? Peace and love and all my sympathies to Joe for having to be the Me in this storyline… I can recommend a great therapist!
yeah, i have officially begun to Feel Bad about this :’/ rip
“consent obtained-by-deception”?
He doesn’t know she cheated on him, before he consented to the BJ.
I don’t think he’d have been down for the beege if he had known where her lips were less then a half hour ago.
I just wanna caution people against this sort of thing. I’ve seen people bend the boundaries of what “deception” is in order to level horrible accusations at each other. Deception isn’t a lie by omission (aka Joe didn’t ask Joyce if she cheated thus she didn’t tell him about the kiss). Deception is deliberate. Such as “oh don’t worry babe, I definitely have a condom on” or “I promise, I have no STDs” when such statements are lies on the part of the person talking.
Joe absolutely has the right to be upset when/if he finds out Joyce had been kissing on Dorothy earlier that day only to give him a BJ afterwards. I don’t think this would be consent obtained by deception.
As for Syd, only my best wishes for your mental well-being and peace of mind going forward.
Genuinely sorry both that that happened to you and that this is triggering. Definitely take care of yourself!! I hope you feel better soon.
Sorry to hear that bud, take all the time you need. Hope to see you back at some point in the future but fully get it if you don’t come back. Well wishes and all that
Oh God Joyce has no idea what she’s doing. I mean it was already obvious but now it’s so much worse
Yup. Actually makes me feel a little bit more sympathetic to her. She’s just overwhelmed and reacting. Basically no conscious thought driving any of this.
Oh my god I literally laughed out loud.
Joyce, it is NOT going to get any easier
From a drama standpoint, sure, this is some excellent drama and plot fodder, but honestly I kind of hate that all this happened 🙁 I feel like so many people are being hurt here and even if it works out my opinion of Joyce and Dorothy are lowered for doing something like this to folks they care about. I’m not even getting the “ooooooh juicyyyyy” drama enjoyement here i’m mostly just bummed out to see all this unfold ;-;
Feels bad, Captain.
It feels icky and not fun when you are empathetic for the characters. I wish I was as emotionally disconnected as the goblins who crave mess. What’s worse is this plot line is very likely going to run through most of 2026.
Kinda weird to assume people who like the mess aren’t emphatic to the characters or are emotionally disconnected. Those things don’t have any relation.
I swear there are a few of you who trawl these comments looking for things to nitpick so they can get their moral superiority points for the day. I meant emotionally disconnected from the fictional situation, not literally emotionally disconnected in a literal sense like a serial killer.
To participate in this comment section, you need a lawyer and a notary to check and edit your responses to be as specific as possible, or else you run the risk of drive-by commentary like this by your local internet wise guy. “Kinda weird” indeed.
Yeah i know what you mean that is what ehat i say was kinda eeird to assume. And weirder still to get si defensive about such a mild comment.
I technically agree with you- I’m happy for the mess because it’s just going to make the heartbreak worse when that bomb drops- but Josh is absolutely correct that any comment not 100% in agreement with the zeitgeist of the dedicated commentors here is frequently nitpicked all to hell and it can feel incredibly stifling to discussion.
People not agreeing with you is not “nitpicking”
We’ll have to agree to disagree on that point, but I do want to say I am sorry for snapping at you. Got some personal stuff going on that I won’t be dumping here but it was not cool of me to channel that aggression in the comments. My for realsies apologies
Okay thanjs for that i appreciate it, we better left it at that we disagree.
@Josh: I’m super sorry to hear that, I hope you come through that on the other side okay.
I think that if you make an assumption about someone or a group of people you can’t complain if those people feel spoken to and respond. It’s genuinely pretty easy to not make a broad generalization, because those are, usually, just wrong.
Anyways, as a goblin who craves mess & IS emotionally disconnected: yeah I’m probably having a better time than you. And I do know the feeling of getting so invested you stop having fun suuuuuper well (just not with DoA). Last year I just stopped enganging with a piece of serial media for a few weeks because I got genuinely frustrated, and when I picked it back up I still didn’t like it, but at least it was faster to get through. The bit about serial media and the pace it goes at is that it’s really exciting to turn things around in your head when you like what’s happening, and really frustrating when you don’t, because it can go into ruminating territory (at its worst).
Honestly, I’ve had to emotionally disconnect from the three of them for this storyline. Hopefully things will somehow work out to the point that it’s practical to care again… but, until then, the absurd mess can make this disconnection easier than if the characters were trying to deal with the bad situation in a sensible way.
Sometimes I crave mess specifically because of empathy and emotional connection to the media. I love dramatic shit happening that I’m emotionally invested in.
Here, I’m not that emotionally invested, but I haven’t been for a while. Couple of years at this point.
Yeah I’m waiting for the juicy stuff to his bc until then I gotta rely on shitty jokes to keep myself from feeling feelings about this. I am not funny, I’m gonna run out of shitty jokes very soon!
I mean, that’s next level thoughtfulness how do you break up with that?
i’d air mail dorothy to yale and just move on
The mail won’t take her, she weighs more than 70 pounds.
A trebuchet, however, has no such limitations.
They could raise funds to send to Bulmeria by holding a raffle to be the one who fires the Trebuchet!
Oh boy am i exited for today’s comments!
I hope Joyce used some mouthwash.
It’s WAY hotter if they make out and she didn’t.
She’s not going to break up with him, is she.
He’s going to find out about her thing with Dorothy from a third party, isn’t he.
Joe breaking up with Joyce would actually be so cathartic you have no idea.
God right? Let my man have his dignity.
I think she won’t break up with him but she may do a smarting of age and tell him the truth. He already clocked Dorothy had feelings, I think he’d he hurt but it’s not something they can’t work through.
Also, manifesting polyamory….
It’s basically just a matter of time, the Protest Kiss must be already all over the social media if not the news.
It’s possible it will be, but just two strips ago Dorothy was checking reports to find out if there was anything about AG and she didn’t mention anything about seeing their kiss anywhere. It’s not widespread yet, at the very least.
Two of my favorite Joyce ships are now butting head to head and there is no way out of this without misery. Willis is fucking evil.
Damn, that was fast. Surprised Dorothy didn’t hear Joe from the hallway.
Pretty sure Dorothy is in the women’s side of the dorm since Agatha was just behind her last strip.
Y’know what would be interesting, even if I do not think that it will happen? If, after the rush of hormones and tension wears off, Joyce has to take a step back from an intimate relationship with Dorothy AND Joe, for awhile. Not forever, not a vow of loneliness to the end of time. I’m not trying to dump cold water on Dorothy/Joyce forever after all the anticipation and waiting for it to actually happen.
But this is a pretty “bad” situation. Like, it just sucks [no pun intended]. I can’t tell if Joyce’s actions off screen and final face in this strip means she put her mouth on Joe’s weenus out of guilt, or gratitude for the gift, genuine reignited affection for him as a partner, or a combo, but this certainly isn’t a clean break for True Love. That turmoil sucks for Joyce [no pun intended]. Having her bounce back and forth between the two of them in the same day sucks for Dorothy and Joe [no pun intended]. I think both of them get to be peeved about that, even if Dorothy might understand it given her own turmoil. Stepping away from this into a new relationship with Dorothy, or back into her relationship with Joe (seems unlikely), or even a polycule, seems like…not the greatest start to any of those relationships? Maybe Joyce needs to take some time, even just a few days, to sit down, think about what happened, and not make a choice on the same day it all went down? Or, hard and unpleasant but interesting: sometimes the way things play out and indecision means that you don’t get EITHER of the things you want.
Like I said, I don’t really think that will happen. At least, not as clear cut as that. For one thing, Dorothy/Joyce has had a “wedding moment,” that changed the timeline of their relationship already, so I don’t see Willis backing off from that now that he already said it reached such a pivotal moment. Plus, the illusion of choice might be shattered as soon as Joe finds out. Especially given that now Joyce not only kissed Dorothy but approached Joe honestly, she hid it during another…uh…relationship act between them? If that gets out, some of the cast that would have been more understanding about Joyce choosing Dorothy might take a less forgiving view of Joyce’s actions toward Joe.
I dunno. I don’t love this situation, but in terms of Drama, I’d find it kinda grimly funny if this not only topedoed Joe/Joyce, but set Dorothy/Joyce back.
[Again, not against Dorothy/Joyce, not hoping for it’s downfall, not even particularly annoyed that Joe/Joyce might breakup, perfectly on board with Dorothy/Joyce being well set up and planned for keeps. Just pondering the potential pitfalls of this situation that might be interesting for the characters]
I think it’d actually make a lot of sense if this crashes so hard that Joyce and Dorothy end up taking some time apart to think! They’ve been glued to the hip the whole time, and they’re handling this with all the grace of a basketball launched into a ceramics workshop so far. It’s entirely plausible that this culminates in one of them deciding that they should take some time apart – both single for a while, most likely, and attempting to keep some distance – at least for long enough that when they get back together, it’s because the time is right and they’re both still sure that this is what they want and that they haven’t changed their minds in the meantime. I think it’d be interesting to see, and I think it’d make it more satisfying for everyone if they have their triumphant moment of getting together for real without also being in other relationships.
The wedding moment may have come unplanned and changed the trajectory of the comic a bit, and I totally get that, I know characters and stories sometimes take a turn that you just have to jump on – but I think it makes sense for this whole record-scratch “wait, hold on, we can’t be doing this” moment to lead to a solid setback for the ship too, even if only for a while.
I think what this entire sequence of strips has shown is that they’re not capable of stepping back and taking some time apart. They might decide that’s what’s best to do, but seconds after saying it, they’ll be making out again. Or as here, going in intended to break up and doing sex stuff instead.
Dorothy is not good at breaks, this is established.
She’s also not good at brakes, which I kind of relate to, honestly. For me, it’s either quit cold turkey, or the behavior creeps back up to a bad frequency, orz.
That’d probably be the healthiest/smartest decision, which means it’s for sure not happening. These two dummies are way too codependent for that shit
https://www.tumblr.com/meghanthedreamcrusher/790471683011231744/this-is-basically-what-goes-through-my-head?source=share
Hey what’s the worse that could happen
Seems like many commenters are eager to find out.
Danny writes the next Wonderwall-grade Ukulele hit single about being replaced in the Highschool Friend Second Semester Orgy for a slightly thicc’er girl copy of himself?
I said worse not best.
So… now Joyce cheated on Dotty with Joe XD
she’ll hit every sin in the bible by Summer at this rate
Gluttony might be challenging, she’ll need some big plates so the piles of food don’t touch each other.
A large enough vat of Kraft mac & cheese would sort that out.
Joyce and dotty hiding a body in the woods and swearing to take this secret to their grave, the weight of their crime heavy on their soul to the point of near madness when?
man, protesting really changes you, huh?
Claps gently. MESS MESS MESS MESS MESS MESS.
When he learns the timeline, Joe is going to construe this as a transaction. A transactional sex act from someone who is cheating on him is probably the absolute last thing current-Joe wants (old Joe specifically avoided situations in which either side could cheat and was probably fine with “soft” transactional sex). He’s probably going to think about things his dad did for his mom for cover or gifts that went to side-pieces.
I really hope we don’t get a Joe villain arc out of this. Backsliding and overshooting his old positions into a real nasty headspace seems very possible, especially given the combination of this and Dorothy’s denial.
It is very sad. I know this is meant to be funny, but the last frame was again just jarring.
Oh no It’s the same outfit. https://www.dumbingofage.com/2022/comic/book-13/01-bring-me-to-life-drawing/orders-2/
Bad Joyce no biscut
More seriously:
Honestly, after the way Joyce and Dorothy’s first kiss was framed, and especially after Willis going “sorry Joe” as they talked about launching their endgame ship here, I didn’t expect this. I didn’t think we’d get such a good reminder of how cool Joe has been to Joyce.
I’m not rooting for a polycule right now because I want Joyce to have to grapple with her choice. I want her to have to consciously decide if she’s going to break Joe’s heart or give up on Dorothy (for the time being).
Recognizing that a poly situation would undoubtedly be super-messy and dramatic, the reason it’s not what I’m aiming for is because it would mean Joyce avoids making that choice, and us as readers learning what her decision says about her character.
Your excellent analysis just inspired this unfortunately unlikely hypothesis… But I’ve never typed up a guess before, so here goes:
Maybe Joyce has enough time to cool down and decides to tell Dorothy it’s not right to start a relationship built on cheating, and she still lives Joe, so “breaks up” with her.
Then Joyce goes to Joe and honestly confesses to what happened with Dorothy. She tells Joe she still loves him, but understands that he might not be able to forgive her.
Then Joe gets some interesting options (and agency):
1) Break up with Joyce, encourage her to explore things with Dorothy;
2) Break up with Joyce, ask her to stay clear of Dorothy
3) Stay with Joyce, ask her to stay clear of Dorothy;
4) Stay with Joyce, encourage her to while things with Dorothy (possible poly)
The reasons I like this highly unlikely are
1) Joyce can be a good person who makes a mistake (she doesn’t have to be perfect or pure), but tries to make it right
2) Joe gets some agency, after an extended period here if Joyce and Dorothy driving the plot, and him large playing the supportive boyfriend (even to Dorothy!)
3) It feels like the most likely to be successful ethically pathway to poly (to my very non-poly understanding). Instead of cheating driving the poly, cheating drives the confession. In the context of honesty, openness, and love, the person wronged gets the opportunity to be the one to suggest it (or not) – not because “Joyce is now with Dorothy” (because I’m this scenario, Joyce has turned away from Dorothy to Joe), but only if Joe legitimately wants to offer that to Joe.
My understanding is probably riddled with holes and there’s probably less than 0.0021% chance of this happening… But it’s at least a possible path forward I haven’t seen discussed much (mostly seen “break up with Joe,” “Tell Joe ‘I love Dorothy now too’ and ask for /have offered poly – or have Joe break up with Joyce,” it “Try to hide it from Joe indefinitely” as options)
… My kingdom for an edit button….
Or the patience to wait until a non-phone device to type replies.
Choosing polyamory is still making a choice and it would still be something to grapple with. It would still tell us something new about Joyce. I understand you don’t want it to go that way, but I think framing it as a passive option that doesn’t actually come with struggle or decisions is short-sighted.
+1
Explicitly this is that polyamory would be Joyce attempting to have her cake and eat it, too. I explicitly want her to have to choose between Dorothy and Joe. I said I want Joyce to make “that” choice, not make “a” choice.
Like, meaning no offense, this is the equivalent of me going “Hmmm, I don’t think I want a burrito tonight, should I have sushi or fried chicken?” and you coming up to me out of the blue and saying “you should really consider having a burrito”.
“I understand you don’t want it to go that way, but I think framing it as a passive option that doesn’t actually come with struggle or decisions is short-sighted.”
But go off, lmao.
Like, meaning no offense, it was ACTUALLY like you came into a forum about fast food and said “Mexican food is boring, and I want people to talk about sushi or chicken” and I said “Hey I get that you don’t like Mexican food, but I think calling it boring is ignoring several things about Mexican food.”
Another +1.
Rogue 7, people gently disagreeing with you when you make sweeping value judgments is not the same thing as them denying you the right to your opinions.
Oh come on.
I didn’t make a “sweeping value judgement”. I said absolutely nothing about poly relationships in general. I was specifically talking about Joyce’s situation. I explained my own idea of where I want this story to go. Just the other day, weren’t you on me to not read people shipping things differently as personal attacks? All I said was “I want Joyce to have to choose between losing Dorothy and breaking Joe’s heart”. That’s not an attack on poly people.
Nymph- neighbor, you replied to me here. I didn’t come into a thread where people are speculating on what a Joyce/Dorothy/Walky/Joe polycule would look like and say “hey, but I think Joyce should have to pick between her two loves!”. That would indeed have been shitty of me. Again, you misread me saying “make that choice” as “make a choice”.
I understand why you’re sus of my comments after how weird I was on Monday. But I’m saying the same thing as dozens of other folks in these comments.
And I’ll again apologize for the tastless comment about infidelity I made earlier. It was a joke that I recognize was in poor taste.
No one said you were attacking anyone! And no, just replying to a thread where people are saying they hope this ends up poly by saying you hope Joyce has to choose between the two of them wouldn’t be shitty.
This is a comment section, it’s okay to enter into conversations with people you know disagree with you. It’s also understandable to want to avoid that, because not everyone enjoys the back-and-forth, but it’s definitely not automatically rude or awful to just say, “Actually I want the opposite of that! And here’s why: [explanation]”
That’s just… discussion.
I’m also gonna stop engaging with you for at least a while because regardless of my intentions, it’s clear that what I say is coming off real combative to you right now, and I don’t want that.
It’s not your fault Li you had been nothing but patient and trying to be as understating as possible.
Rogue, buddy, dude, no shit? I know that I replied to you. That’s how comment threads work. You said something, then I say something. Did you not know that’s how it works?
What in the gaslighting nonsense is this attempt to make me feel like I did something wrong by replying to you. Like I haven’t already explained and explicitly acknowledged that you didn’t want poly to happen right before I explicitly acknowledged that I felt differently. I didn’t misread/misunderstand/misrepresent you. I disagree with you, plenty of people do, you’re going to have to learn to live with that.
I didn’t even talk to you on Monday so I have genuinely no idea wtf you’re on about. You have some kind of persecution complex or you’re trolling, I have no idea which.
Fuck your thinly veiled homophobic opinions, your gaslighting, and your shitty “jokes” at the expense of real people.
Li, bless your patience. I’m absolutely done with this dork. Gaslighting is absolutely where I throw the whole man away.
Heh, thank you. (And Nadamás, thank you, too.)
Look, I’m sorry, but it genuinely feels like you folks are reading different comments than I’m posting.
Your initial disagreement with me was about framing a poly solution as a “passive option”, one where no choices get made when in reality being poly comes with its own set of complicated and difficult decisions to make. Please tell me if I’m mistaken here.
But I was, I feel, *very* clear with my language. That I specifically want Joyce to have to choose between Dorothy and Joe. And I can’t see how you’d disagree that not making *that specific choice* is the entire reason folks want a poly solution in the first place.
And from that, and from me giving the *mildest* pushback (seriously, I compared your comment to *suggesting I eat a burrito*), Li claimed I was making “sweeping moral judgements” and unable to handle folks disagreeing with me and you escalated to saying I wanted to stifle conversation in this whole comment section.
Those accusations are both so disconnected from what I wrote down that I can’t see how you got there. And because of that, you’re saying I’m *gaslighting* you?
I genuinely can’t think of any reason for this whole thing other than that you came to my comments looking to pick a fight, and when I didn’t immediately concede to your points, you both escalated until you got it.
Yeah, I’m going to be ignoring y’all just as much as y’all ignore me going forward
Have a nice day.
Your initial comment wasn’t that clear, and I understand how someone would take issue with how you positioned poly. “And I can’t see how you’d disagree that not making *that specific choice* is the entire reason folks want a poly solution in the first place.” is just nope for me. Nymph’s initial reply read as more mild than your next reply.
Between today and yesterday, I feel like your comments get more tangled up because you try so hard to position yourself as not being problematic that it loops back around. A comment of “would like to see Joyce choose between them” could have been made without bringing up poly.
Ty Yumi 💕
Yumi, I do hear what you’re saying. I think Li made much the same point, and I get it. I do get things twisted up a lot.
But, and I mean this without malice, I am *genuinely confused*, I don’t get your “nope” comment. The binary choice is “Dorothy or Joe?”. A poly situation means she chooses both of them….thereby avoiding the binary choice.
This, to be honest, is one of the reasons *why* I get so tangled up. Because it genuinely feels to me like my words get analyzed in a huge amount of detail. Because of that, I take my time crafting them, often erasing and rewriting what I want to say until I think I’m coming across as clearly as possible.
Obviously, it’s not working. On the one hand, I’ve been taught that if multiple people tell you you stink, you should take a shower, and I’m genuinely trying to be as self-reflective as I can here. On the other, this problem *only* happens in this comment section.
But is Joyce avoiding the choice “the entire reason folks want a poly solution in the first place”? People have different reasons for wanting a poly “solution.” Some want it to come after a difficult period that may have Joyce choosing something first before it changes. Some people want a poly solution because they want representation. I’d like poly to come up in a way that still complicates things and doesn’t end with a Dorothy x Joyce x Joe relationship.
Not having to have Joyce choose and be with both of them could be why some people want a poly relationship to form. It’s not the entire reason.
Because of how Joyce’s internal process has been out of focus, I WOULD like to see Joyce choose how her relationships preceed. To me the part I worry about not seeing Joyce choose something isn’t about relationship structure but that Joe might break up with her (possibly because he “wants to do what’s best for her”), and then she still didn’t make a choice. (Well, it’d still be a choice to continue a romantic relationship with Dorothy, but maybe a less compelling one.)
Thank you, genuinely.
That’s fair and I definitely see where I phrased that poorly.
Also, feeling misunderstood is incredibly frustrating, I hear that. I think that’s part of why other people here also try to put in a lot of effort when making their comments, including those in reply to you. When you make a comment full of details because you want to be clear on something, people who want to be clear in their reply may address those details.
You’re trying to explain yourself, they’re trying to explain themselves, and in the way MORE details come up and then things get more muddled. And sometimes those things then pull more focus.
Also, for what it’s worth, I don’t think you stink?
I think some of what you’ve said indicates you’ve got some things to unpack still, which is normal — we’re all works in progress! especially as allies — and honestly this goes back to the distinction I was trying to make the other day.
Sometimes, we all say stinky things. That does not mean we’re stinky people, especially not forever. It means sometimes people’re gonna let us know we said a stinky thing.
Oh and I was actually very deliberate in picking burritos as the food I didn’t want. Because I love burritos, and Mexican food in general. I wouldn’t call it boring. Just like me not wanting this situation to resolve into a polycule doesn’t have anything to do with my thoughts on poly relationships in general.
Hot take, Joe deserves better.
If it helps any, that’s actually been a relatively popular take! Not like in the majority, but you definitely aren’t alone in feeling that way, even just among folks motivated enough to add comments. 🙂
Well, yeah. The polycule is supposed to come after everyone does a bunch of emotional grappling and angsting.
Welp, maybe next time…
While i don’t think polyamory is the best solution for so-far-monogamous-people who are in love with two people, i really don’t like that “break up with one of the people you love simply because you love someone else too” has to be the solution in all media. In the end it’s always about “pick one” and that’s sad.
Polyamory has its own ways to be complex and people can get hurt just like they can in the “break up with one of them“ scenario, but…. it feels sad if people don’t get a chance to love whom they love, and having to deny loving the other one…
I feel for Joyce, so sad for Joey 🙁
*Joe
Okay, now this actually is cheating.
Like, if you’re breaking up with your partner for someone else, that sucks, but the question of whether kissing happens just beforehand isn’t particularly important, and such premature kissing is ‘cheating’ only in the most tenuous technical sense. Plus, kissing can be an understandable act of passion, and also part of the process of figuring out what your feelings are, especially in the case of newly discovered queerness.
But this? A blowjob is a whole goddamn process – you can’t write it off as an act of passion. She’s agreed to be in a relationship with Dorothy, that relationship has started, on the condition that they would break up with their partners before doing anything, and this is a genuine betrayal of their new relationship. (Also, by failing to break up with Joe, she retroactively transmutes her earlier Dorothy kissing into ‘mild cheating’, and also adds a layer of deception to the blowjob, and I would care about all of that if I cared about Joe at all.)
Joyce just seems genuinely selfish and incapable of respecting how her actions hurt her partners. That’s fine when it’s Joe, because I don’t care about him and am actively rooting for their relationship to end – I mean, good lord, it’s so boring, please for the love of God let it end – but it’s different when it affects Dorothy, a character I actually like and care about.
Pretty sure that makes you the fiest Relationship Blackguard Ive seen in these comments.
Mostly I find it deeply hilarious that you and I apparently have EXACTLY OPPOSITE opinions on which of these relationships has potential to be interesting and which is more boring than watching tectonic drift in real time.
Joe/Joyce is interesting to me insofar as it’s a part of Joe’s character development. I actually think in the abstract both relationships are boring for similar reasons. I think this strip in particular illustrates that Joe isn’t much different in his approach to caring for Joyce than Dorothy is – thoughtful, attentive, considerate, and with obvious devotion. Dorothy, unfortunately, is just not as interesting a character to me.
Joe’s development would be far better served by Joyce breaking up with him, though, giving him something to do other than be Generic Good Boyfriend. Whereas Dorothy has far more room to be compellingly insane about Joyce in a relationship.
I don’t disagree re Joyce and Joe breaking up (though I think it’s a bit soon after how much they were built up), although I have in all honesty seen quite enough of Dorothy being insane and possessive over Joyce for my own taste.
And honestly, today’s strip is emblematic to me about exactly WHY this is making everything more boring.
What we COULD have expected, based on previous strips, is a lot of ongoing work by Joyce and Joe about her religious programming, his fear of commitment, and all the other issues that surround gradually easing yourself into your sexual firsts (with a partner who you KNOW knows more than you do, and the attendant potential drama there).
What we got was “blowjob joke, back to the Disaster Sapphics being fuckups”.
This is everything I thought and hoped and wanted to happen and I guess it’s just not. Because we’re doing this instead.
Alright. Guess we’ll see how it goes.
Yes, i’d really like to see more of Joe/Joyce, i was still interested in how they both develop. i’m not particularly into the ship as a longterm thing, but they still have things to learn from each other and i want to see that…..
I suspect Dorothy doesn’t fully address her “Dorothy knows best” thing until she has zero enablers, and that’s going to take Joyce having enough of Dorothy being insane and possessive. and I’m afraid that’s going to be Lucy+Walky level of exhausting until that happens and she says something about it.
That’s kinda where I’m at, aside from the fact that I like both Joe and Joyce as characters and want them to be happy and frankly I could care less about Dorothy.
Joe and Joyce together means both of them get to grow in interesting ways as they have been the last few months of comic time.
Joyce and Dorothy together means the same old fucking up, but with sapphic kissing — if Dorothy were maybe showing any change/improvement it’d be one thing, but at the moment she seems to have hit rock bottom from the trauma and is bound and determined to stay there.
See, I really disagree with that last statement! I think we’ve had a lot of Dorothy bottoming out of late, for SURE, including cutting all her classes multiple times (which, I do wonder if that’ll come back to bite her academically), getting drunk with Ruth, getting pity from Ruth and Jennifer, singing Depressed Karaoke, and hooking up with an ex she specifically missed because she wanted to go back in time to the last moment she remembers being happy and feeling in control of her life…
…but that the protest was a turning point, and even though obviously sneaking around and cheating on their boyfriends sucks, we’re going to see change from Dorothy now.
Whether that comes in the form of breaking out of her doomer spiral and getting more politically active, or in the form of ultimately realizing that a bi awakening and political radicalization also aren’t going to fix her depression*, I can’t say. But I definitely see change coming.
* Just speaking for myself, I’ve always avoided clinical depression diagnoses because my bouts of depression have clear, specific causes, and the depression goes away when the cause is dealt with. I’m not saying love cures depression, so much as that SOMETIMES depression does have specific external causes, like the loss of a job, or months of pining sublimated into feelings of confusion, frustration, and self-loathing.
I think it’s too early to say whether Dorothy’s depression is short-term proximal-cause depression, or something chemical that will linger even if she works through her feelings of anxiety over losing her previous goal in life and the ugly mixed feelings she was having due to repressing her sexuality, etc etc.
Again, “love cures depression” is not a thing, but sometimes it can kinda LOOK like it worked, if your situational depression was for related enough reasons.
Mmm, I will believe that Dorothy’s trajectory has reversed when I see it. (frankly, as I said half-jokingly yesterday, “Dorothy takes Raidah too much to heart again, starts doing protesting to the further detriment of her academics/friendships/relationships” is also a plausible outcome here)
I’m admittedly being unfair to her, but she’s also in the process of sinking my ship.
* I needed therapy to fix MY depression, if I were going to diagnose Dorothy remotely I’d say she’s acting more like some buddies when their Bipolar was untreated.
Oh, not “reversed”, necessarily. Changed! Tilted somewhat upwards instead of continuing on the same sharp downwards slope line as before, rather than fully reversing. But we will definitely see.
* That, I don’t think I can speak to objectively. I have friends who are bipolar, among other things (different friends with other mood disorders), but the only person I know with what you might call untreated bipolar is my mom, and… yeah, that’s just too close to me, and too… painful.
(Just in case it needs to be said, no need to feel bad for mentioning it! For so many reasons, that would be unfair of me. Just, I know that’s not a topic I personally wanna get into, heh.)
Same lmfao. Dojo is too similar for me, I need stark contrast in my ships. They’re like butterscotch and caramel mixed together so far, sweet and still nice cuz, i mean they’re both great, but the flavors get lost in each other more than they blend together. And the cheating drama is the pinch of salt needed to keep it from being totally bland
“It’s different when it affects a character I actually like and care about”.
Please double-check your moral compass and make calibrations.
No this is actually a pretty reasonable position.
I never claimed to be reasonable. I just claim that right is right and wrong is wrong, no matter who it happens to. The same action is morally reprehensible or morally okay regardless of who performs it, to whom, or why.
Now if it’s a character I dislike? Schadenfreude. But that doesn’t make it morally okay. Character I like? Still not morally okay.
*taps moral compass, peers at it*
It’s pointing due “It’s Fictional”, I’m afraid.
No, fuck trying to make people be objective when it doesn’t actually matter. I’m more mad about Joe getting cheated on than raidah, oh no I’m such a hypocrite
I 100% understand “I think Character X is a less moral character than Character Y because of action Z” kind of “moral compass” feelings about a fictional world.
I 0% understand “I think your preferences about what kind of drama you like in a fictional world are a direct representation of your real-world moral compass.”
I wish more people acknowledged their opinions on the story were based off of which characters they liked instead of rationalizing like this.
You don’t consider a blow job to be an act of passion?
Also interesting how long it took one of these comments to pop up when the joyce/dotty kiss got such a large response. I really thought there would be more people complaining about Joyce “cheating” on Dorothy.
I think a blowjob has significantly more steps during which passion can be checked, compared to just kissing; it requires intent as well as passion, maintained over a significant length of time. It’s also just a much greater breach of fidelity than just kissing – ‘I kissed someone else’ is a much smaller concern in a relationship than ‘I blew someone else’ – and I’d expect someone’s conscience to give a much stronger kick about doing it.
I mean the issue really is that Joyce is, at this moment, in a relationship with both Dorothy and Joe.
It wasn’t just kissing though, was it? It was deciding laundry was sex, asking Dorothy to do laundry, holding hands for a long way, walking back through tear gas, kissing again and again and again, etc.
I don’t hold either version of this against Joyce, I just think they’re equivalent levels of “stupid act in the heat of the moment” rather than a blow job being “more steps” and therefore worse.
Also not totally sure Joyce and Dorothy have had a “we’re together now” talk, but as I said when it was Joyce and Dorothy: It’s not actually cheating (imo) unless there’s secrecy involved. The fessing up to Dorothy immediately reduces it from cheating to dumdum behavior for me personally.
That’s a really interesting place to put the line — I usually put it at “*prior* disclosure”, in that sense. “Walky, I am in love with Joyce and I’m going to make a move on her, if that crosses your lines then I understand and we’re over.” wouldn’t be cheating, but doing it the other way around kinda feels like a different kettle of fish.
That’s also a valid way to see it. I’m not a monogamous person, and anyway people’s lines and boundaries differ a lot individually, so I’m not totally surprised we’ve got different views there.
I’m not monogamous either, actually!
About half of my poly relationships have been on a “inform prior to adding sexual/romantic/play partner” basis, for whatever reason that was most common when I lived in smaller communities and with people who were being polyromantic-forward rather than polysexual-forward, if those terms make any sense at all.
Excuse me while I jump up and down!! Yay hi other poly person 💕
I think that version is probably more common than my personal view on it. My personal view tends to be that it’s not always necessarily possible to inform prior to a kiss in the heat of the moment or an excited day of flirtation and realization (as in the comic).
I mostly just care if my partners are honest and upfront or not. Like, smooch who you wanna smooch, but when it starts to get into sneaking around then I feel like it endangers me and my other partners health/happiness/etc.
And those terms make sense lmao. I’m not sure it’s the divide here, so much as I’m just a bit lax on where the cheating line is for me.
I’ve admittedly been on the receiving end of “hey, gonna kiss X now, will elaborate later” texts. 😀
—-
I also suspect there’s some “mono conditioning” and some “did you at any point have an experience where a partner WASN’T okay with something you thought was okay to do?” — I was the proximate cause of a poly marriage ending because apparently “having romantic feelings for a guy enough to have more involved dates than just sex times” was something my partner’s husband wasn’t actually as cool with as he thought he was gonna be, and her response was along the lines of “I’m not hurting Z just to let you move the goalposts”. Of course, her theory was something along the lines of “he was cool with poly when that meant threesomes with my best friend, but once it meant I go out on solo dates, and she moved two states to be with a new primary, he was pissy about it” which is where I learned that my partner’s relationships other are not and cannot be my concern except when some angry dude shows up on my doorstep to talk about “his wife cheating with me”.
Oooof yeah, I tend to stay away from being someone’s first poly relationship these days because too many of those little ~situations~ stressed me out lol. I agree that it’s not my (or your) job to make sure our partners are good with their other partners, but I like my drama to stay in comics as much as I can manage so I’d rather be sure it wasn’t going to snake into my life if they have issues.
May you keep dodging the angry dudes who thought they were chill with it when it was a porn category lmao.
Heh, I’d rather the angry dudes find me, I’m an ex-linebacker IRL so mostly I can talk some sense into them once they realize they don’t actually want to risk punching the 120 kg guy.
But yeah, all that to say I find even a little pre-warning is a relatively good cure for a LOT of poly drama, especially when heading into new or unfamiliar territory.
Oh, if they had done laundry together, that would absolutely be cheating (which I would of course fully support, because it’s morally good for characters I like to cheat on characters I don’t like). As for everything else…
I guess I think there’s different levels of cheating, and there’s also mitigating factors, like coming clean immediately. (I’m also willing to cut Dorothy and Joyce a lot of slack because they’re just figuring out their queerness and what their feelings for each other even are.) So, kissing someone else is cheating a little, but if you come clean immediately it mitigates it to the point that IMO it barely counts as cheating in the absence of larger patterns of behaviour. Having sex with someone else, including oral sex, is serious enough that I still consider it cheating even if you come clean immediately.
For me, nothing before this point has risen to a level where I’d consider it serious cheating, as long as they come clean immediately. This is the first thing that’s risen beyond that point, while also establishing that Joyce didn’t come clean, thus retroactively increasing the cheating level of all previous cheating-related activity.
Yeah, I think I definitely agree with this take on it then. Ty for more fully explaining/rephrasing so I understood where you were coming from!
If you think there’s time during a blowjob to check your passion I’m not sure if I should be feeling sorry for you or your partners.
”It’s different when it’s a character I actually care about”
Did any kind of thought happen after you hit send? This is the sort of internal dialogue that is extremely embarrassing to type up and share. Your spin and interpretation about what was agreed and started between Joyce and Dorothy extrapolates wildly from what we’ve seen in the comic as well.
I wish people would…
Is … this sarcastic? That ending truly sounds like either a paladin making a troll sicko post or a sicko making a troll paladin post, and I’m not sure this is for real?
It is kinda odd in the sense that it’s outright owning something that was getting thrown around as an accusation (“You don’t hold a position on the actions people are taking in this comic, only on whether those actions advance your preferred ship.”) at both sides.
FWIW, I do think that on the big ole D&D Alignment Chart, “true” sickos and “true” paladins are more rare than folks who are sickos for certain types of situations but not others, and paladins who are paladins for certain ships, rather than all ships.
That, I think, is just very normal.
“Just excusing this because it’s two girls” and “just mad about this because it’s two girls” are different statements, and ruder, imho, though obviously occasionally still true for an individual.
Personally, I’m of the belief too that the majority of people are actually closest to True Neutral – Pro My Ships, Anti Ships That Invalidate Mine. =P
Haha, absolutely.
Also, I’m not saying that fandom was a gentler kinder place when most shipping manifestos were stuff like “they stand next to each other in all the group shots” and “they both wear gloves” instead of stuff like “they have an age gap of less than 1 year and they’ve never had an argument”, because nah, there were always shippers who did stuff like abuse Fanfiction Dot Net’s rule against NC-17 content to get an author whose fics they didn’t like banned!
But I do miss the separation afforded by the Geocities Web Ring model of the Internet, back before everyone was sharing a “main fandom tag” and at the mercy of algorithms. It makes a lot more sense in the modern version of the internet to complain that people should keep xyz content out of the “main” tag for a ship or a fandom, and I think the fact that peer pressure is the only way anyone has of enforcing that “rule” has led directly to an increase, at least, in specious call-outs and targeted harassment.
Ironically, perhaps, these threads do remind me of that old Web Ring model — up to and including things getting occasionally arbitrarily volatile because everyone here is REALLY invested instead of being a casual fan.
To be clear, I am being sincere, and I think my analysis – that this is cheating in a way that previous actions weren’t – is correct, but I’m also acknowledging that my feelings about what’s happening are not based on an objective moral judgement of the characters, but rather how I personally feel about them and their relationships. I know that I’d probably feel differently if I cared about Joe at all or found his relationship with Joyce in any way enjoyable.
I don’t see what’s so weird about just wanting a ship. These are all fictional characters in a fictional situation. It says nothing about reality. I’m on the Sickos side, but I differ from the Trash Goblins because I just want my Joyrothy and I don’t care how I get it. In my ideal world, it would hurt the other characters as little as possible, but as long as Joyrothy happens, I’m happy.
Like I said, Relationship Blackguard.
Again, I agree with you (also, good luck with paladins here haha).
I don’t like him so much. Personal reasons. (Even knowing I hate it much more before). But he has a great potential, much more if he still be above all cheating situation with Joyce.
But one thing I’m very curious about Joe, and I believe that can add much points to him is if Willis show his relationship with his mother. He looks like he cares about her. All we have about Joe’s mom is on Patreon and some pics on Willis’s Tumblr.
While the last sentence is genuinely crazy, I do respect you for being open and honest about it. I feel like a lot of DoJo fans would be better served to be like you and own that they don’t care about what Joyce does as long as it only hurts Joe because of their bias.
The attempt to make it seem like they’re on a moral high ground makes it feel a little more insulting lo.
I am genuinely surprised at how little time we’ve spent on Joyce realizing she’s into a woman. I guess my prior problem of “joyce grappling with bisexuality being a repeat of Danny and Dorothy” has a pretty obvious solution — just don’t mention it since it’s more interesting to focus on their infidelity and the messy drama that resulted.
I mean she was fangirling over Sal since the second she saw her. The bisexual reveal is honestly less surprising than the one that she needed glasses.
It’s not the bisexual reveal – we knew that. It’s how she reacts to it that we’re not seeing.
She appears to have gone at some point from thinking of herself as completely straight to accepting that she was bisexual without any internal struggle at all.
Mind you, that’s “appears” – it might be that we just haven’t seen it because we haven’t got much of a look into her head in this arc. And it might even be that she really hasn’t slowed down enough to process it at all yet and we’ll get to see it later.
She Might be in a state of emotional high so it might take a bit for the whole thing to hit her properly.
A problem people have been pointing to is that we haven’t really gotten into Joyce’s head through this entire storyline. I was expecting there to be some kind of revelation of Joyce’s perspective that would make sense of it; but we kind of are getting her perspective now, and it feels like the comic is eliding a lot of the development I wanted to understand around her newfound queerness. I’m hoping the comic remedies that soon.
(I only wanted to italicise the word ‘are’ there; but I don’t see an edit function, so *shrug*)
It’s likely because as Willis said they didn’t expect to have to sell people on Joyce being queer they thought that would be completely unsurprising and Dorothy would be the harder one so tgey focused on her
Frankly, I think Willis underestimated how much people were going to take Joyce’s rejection of Becky as “I’m not into women, that’s my final answer” rather than the muddle of “don’t like YOU SPECIFICALLY like that” and “residual fundie programming” it likely actually was.
Frankly does seem like something that should have been anticipated. It’s a very major story beat, and it hinges on Joyce not being into a girl. Very easy to read into it that she’s straight irrespective of any of the other setup Willis was trying to fit in.
I don’t think it’s so much that people need to be sold on Joyce being bi or even having romantic feelings for Dorothy, but rather that people wanted more PoV from Joyce for this specific context, which is that Joyce’s burgeoning feelings for Dorothy become strong enough that she willingly cheats on her current romantic partner (who by all appearances she is very happy with), that’s specifically what some people feel they need to be sold on more/better.
Yes, it’s very easy for me to believe that Joyce is bi, but I would like to see more of how she realized it about herself and how she came to embrace it so easily. Given her usual response to change, I would have expected more freaking out from her.
This is a SUPER fair take, but also not the only one; there have been people just straight-up complaining that Joyce can’t possibly be bi, sometimes even in ways that make it clear that they think bisexuality is gross.
Oh no doubt, that’s unfortunately not surprising at all.
As is usual in discussing media, it can be hard to separate “I don’t like/understand this specific character doing this specific thing for story reasons” from “I don’t like anyone doing this thing because I’m a bigoted bigot who bigots angrily down the lane” when the latter is making an effort at being covert.
“Then he tickled my uvula.”
“The piece of skin hanging down the back of your throat?”
“Precisely “
Trying to give you a well-deserved internet for that, but I can’t seem to find the button.
Aww, that’s cool, and thanks. I’m adjusting to what I can only imagine is forthcoming emotional upheaval in the comic by letting my brain chemistry run free.
Honestly at this point, as much as I’m a Joe/Joyce stan, my new favorite ship that I wish would set sail is the magical unlikely pairing of “Joyce” and “stopping to think about what you’re doing for just five minutes, I’m begging you, and then making a goddamn decision”.
Yeah chief that ones about as likely as Joe/Walky
….if Willis would like to raise the odds of both I’d be ever grateful
Also, frankly, I think this kinda puts paid to the idea that Joe will be at all chill about infidelity when he does find out about it, which (IMHO) kinda makes the “polycule” ending that includes Joe less likely to actually pan out.
There’s still an outside chance that Joyce manages to explain/spin/apologize for this in a way that doesn’t make him feel like shit, but I’m increasingly leaning towards the “Joe lectures Joyce on moral hypocrisy and dumps her ass flat” ending I kinda jokingly hypothesized several strips back.
(I should be clear — this is the ending where Joe uses this as a springboard to reinforce his clear improvement, not the one where being betrayed causes him to backslide. He’s already tried backsliding, anyway, and it didn’t go anywhere.)
I like this result too. Whatever happens here, I feel like Joe rubberband-ing immediately to his old ways would be a total letdown. It would be a great moment to showcase how je truly has grown as a person, not just for Joyce, but for himself. I was/am a big Joe/Joyce stan, but if it’s gotta come to an end, I would like that end to be one in which both members of this (relatively short-lived) ship to come out of it having grown as people.
plot twist: Joe does try polyamory and decide he likes it, but it’s long after he and Joyce have broken up and it doesn’t involve her at all.
(How likely this is to happen is honestly I think partly down to whether or not Joe also has a bi awakening first, because I kind of think Willis might be reluctant to specifically retread any ground that might make Walkyverse readers think of how Willis’s first canonically bi characters were a group of women who all had regular orgies with Joe.
Like, I think they’d just want to avoid reminding anyone of that plot point, especially themselves, and it’s why Sierra/Grace/Mandy (part of the original orgie, along with Marcie) has so far been just the three of them and just women.
Not to say that it’s impossible to do something that would call back to “that time Joyce dumped Joe specifically for having a harem of hot bi women” in a more progressive way, just to say that I bet Willis still cringes too hard at the thought to be interested in a callback.)
I absolutely COULD see Joe as part of a poly relationship model, even or especially if Joyce’s antics here cause him to kinda backslide as far as “yeah, committed relationships are not for me, they just hurt when people cheat”… but he still has discovered the joy of caring about your partners past just sexytimes, so he ends up being everyone’s secondary partner (or the non-hierarchical-poly equivalent thereof) so he can feel insulated from any one person doing something to hurt him emotionally… but not Joyce’s, because that is gonna be an open wound for a bit.
“You better go home, son, and make up your mind…”
“Did you ever have to finally decide- to say yes to one, and let the other one slide…”
There’s so many changes and tears you must hide
Did you have have to finally decide?
*ever have to
damn it
JoJo fans when they see an unsucked weenus
(I’ve waited like 18 hours to post that joke here)
Joyce, how long before you realize you want both of them?
See _that_ would actually be interesting. The ”sorry Joe” from Willis sounded like he gets dumped without a backward glance, which would be lame IMO.
I used to like Dorothy a lot, but now she just feels like a neurotic, selfish hypocrite.
Dorothy has *always* been neurotic. “Selfish” is complicated. Her defining characteristic has been a pathological need to help others. But that came with an egotistical sense that she always knew what was best for them.
Not in the “there’s no such thing as altruism” way, but Dorothy’s “helping others” has always been selfish. She does selfish things, and rationalizes them as helping others.
I’m not arguing with you I think, just adding my spin.
And also, I like not extraordinary Dorothy a lot. The neurotic, selfish hypocrite. I thought she was boring when I read her as “more mature than most”, reading her as “I like to think I’m more mature than most” makes her resonate more. The Dorothy that doesn’t know she’s giving mediocre advice.
boring
First two panels: Aha!
Dotty is way more interesting as a neurotic selfish hypocrite (not that i really agree with that characterization).
She’s always been a little messy in romance; putting off dumping Danny, dropping the love word bomb on her casual fun relationship with Walky then yoyoing him, pushing him to Lucy as an attempt to solve her own issues. Leaning into that whole hog and breaking down her well put together, “I know best” self image is the best place to take her. And that includes a bit of mutual cheating with her best friend
I suspect that realization crashed into her True Romance Conquers All bubbles about “the beginning of this strip” ago at the very latest.
new item zero on the list: use mouthwash + brush teeth
You know, I wasn’t for the poly end cause that sounded like a cop out, but from a messy view that sounds like just what the doctor ordered
ONE OF US! ONE OF US!
ONE OF US! ONE OF US!
i can’t tell if this helps things out digs the hole deeper. Either way is fucking hilarious
And just like that, years of liking Joyce as a character has come to a full halt lol
My favorite character now is Sal
I gotta admit, I was flabbergasted that she was actually going to break up with Joe right on the spot. I thought she was going to sit down with Joe, confess what had happened, admit that she has developed a surprising attraction to Dorothy, and that she needs some time to figure out what happens going forward, because from everything that I’ve seen, her attraction to Joe IS genuine (given that the two of them were apparently being emotional support mates for each other for quite some time before they started dating). It wasn’t simply a “you’re hot, I’m into that” fling. I’m just having a hard time believing Joyce is the kind of person who would throw someone aside so quickly.
As we see, she isn’t.
She’s not. This strip is her failing to be that.
She’s not and Dorothy asks about breaking up, but it’s not quite clear what Joyce was trying to do when she went in there. Tell him certainly, but then what?
Yep. Honestly it’s kind of making me feel done with this comic but reading it has been one of my daily routines for like 10 years, and I do want to see the resolution.
Same for me, sadly. I’m not sure I want to see more now.
Same. Hard same. I literally have a reflex of checking the comic multiple times per day for no reason??? And I keep getting jumpscared by things that just upset me.
Joe/Joyce has been my ultimate ship for a very long time and I was anxious about it happening for exactly this reason. Because I knew that meant it was inevitably going to crash and burn as the cast dynamics shifted. But man. I knew it would happen eventually. But did it have to happen THIS HARD? And this SOON too? SIGH.
I feel so bad for Joe.
I wonder if Willis had read some spicy literature.
I’m reading this messing that DoA is turning and I’m thinking: “Sis, Willis is making Jorge Amado or Nelson Rodrigues very proud”
And she banged 4 people in the hallway on the way back to Dorothy
If there is ANYone who might understand what she’s going through right now it would be him…
god my heart hurts for him
Not even stopping in today except to say good luck to all of us who love the mess, may the odds be ever in our favour
Bless this mess, as they say
All things aside, given that we know Joyce is semi-autobiographical I’m really curious what Willis thinks of all of the reactions to this storyline and if they’re not the reactions they expected.
One expects that this portion of Joyce’s story is not autobiographical
I’d love for it to be and for this to be how their wife finds out.
They have said on Patreon that Maggie is basically their consultant on this arc (and the comic as a whole ig). She apparently hated this page at first but was converted into a sicko by gross purity flavor paladins lol
Wow. What a deeply vile thing to wish on a real life person. You would love for Willis to have cheated and for their wife to find out in a sketchy way?
That’s genuinely a cruel wish.
Yeah, that would indeed be a shitty thing to wish on someone IRL.
My intent was to make it a joke, that the ludicrousness of “someone finds out their partner cheated because they wrote about it in an autobiography” is funny.
Clearly it didn’t come across that way, my apologies.
Okay, well for future reference, joking about that kind of thing happening to real people is generally a shitty thing to do. Like, it wasn’t vague, it was aimed directly at a specific couple.
That’s just always going to come across mean rather than funny to me.
Well for what it is worth, I at least am one person who took it as the joke it was meant to be and didn’t immediately jump to the worst possible conclusion.
It’s not a conclusion I jumped to, it’s literally what he said.
“I’d love for it [Joyce cheating] to be [autobiographical to Willis] and for this to be how their [Willis’] wife finds out.”
I also took it as a joke.
This is a really fucked up and shitty thing to say.
Also this! I forgot I wasn’t somewhere I needed to couch my “wow fuck your opinion on this, what is wrong with you” in flowery language to avoid a censor lmao.
So like, I’ve been reading this comic for basically half my life at this point (started at 13ish, I’m 25 now) and checking for updates has been part of my morning routine for over a decade, to the point that I get a little depressed if I read the update at midnight like everyone else. So, nothing short of Willis sustaining a TBI and taking a sudden right wing shift like fucking sinfest would make me drop it. I’m here till either the comic dies or I do.
That being said, it’s gonna fucking suuuuuuck when i run out of emotional disconnection ammo and have to start feeling things about this storyline. Bc those feelings are going to be very bad, and I will hate this whole thing. Can we get like, a dina and Becky or Danny/sal side story? Just some good, healthy relationship content (that I just so happen to ship). I don’t even mean slipshines, just some wholesome slice of life shit
As a queer, I’m always down for queer relationships.
But man I feel so bad for Joe. He’s trying so hard to be a good person and a good boyfriend for Joyce. Like he wants to do better! He seems to be changing for the better too over time.
This just hurts. 🙁 I hope there’ll be a good outcome for all of them though.
Also another thing I just realized: weighted blankets are NOT CHEAP
It’s just such a thoughtful gift for Joyce from him.
Yeah. He’s a teenager!
You know there’s a space between polycule and monogamy too.
They could simply not be exclusively dating.
Ha, these bongoes don’t do half measures
If they are pursuing lasting romantic relationships with multiple people, that seems like polyamory to me.
A polycule doesn’t mean everyone is dating everyone in the network, it is just the network itself, which can include platonic relationships.
If they aim for non-exclusive dating, without it being polyamory, that seems like still a form of stepping back from the relationship.
Non-exclusive dating outside of polyamory is used when a person either isn’t looking for long term relationships, or is just casually dating until they find someone they want to be exclusive with. That isn’t what Joyce and Joe had established, and it doesn’t seem like what Joyce and Dorothy want with each other.
Polyamory won’t work between Joyce and Dorothy, specifically because Dorothy outright detests Joe. She thinks he’s a man-slut that will eventually move on to some other girl and break Joyce’s heart. Every time she sees them together she has trauma flashbacks of Blaine riding off with Joyce trapped in his van. There is just no way Dotty would be up for sharing Joyce with him.
Joyce, on her part, thinks Walky is a doofus. She seemed THRILLED with the thought that she was going to be the reason Dotty dumps him. I don’t think she outright despises him like Dotty does with Joe, but I totally see Joyce thinking that Walky isn’t worthy of polishing Dotty’s shoes, let alone being her boyfriend.
Basically both of them would be too jealous if they had to share to make any sort of polycule happen.
I think the difference is non-exclusive dating is seeing which ones work out in the long run versus lasting relationship in the present.
True! But I want polyamory rep, so I personally will be tooting that horn all the way to the end lol
Since this got underway I’ve just assumed she’d have intercourse with Joe before coming clean. So at least it’s not that! Today.
Crazy thing to say to Dorothy!
What would her reaction have been if Joyce had said yes?
C’mooooon SlipShine follow-up post. Come ooooooooon~~~!
Joyce! You were going to break up with him! This is the opposite of that!
Darn Joe being a really good boyfriend and making this difficult (clearly joking *shake fist at clouds tone*)
So, like, has Dorothy been standing in the hallway waiting, this whole time?
Joyce works fast for a first-timer.
Remember when I said Joyce’s heart was on fire for Dorothy? I think Joe just put that out by being a thoughtful boyfriend.
I think it’s probably just on fire for both of them, rather than either fire being extinguished.
Ah, the messiest starting place for discovering one is poly — where the fire is burning for all partners, but the mono-minded brain training makes one THINK they’re burning for one at a time (usually the last one to do this kind of gesture).
What no that’s unpossible don’t you know it is biological, physical, biblical *fact* that humans can only ever have feelings for one person ever
you said biological and I legitimately thought your argument was going to be “Don’t you know it’s biologically impossible for hearts to be on fire without killing you?”
Difficult to test.
Patients keep dying before I get the heart properly lit.
as far as I’m concerned Joe should share Joyce with Dorothy. do a throuple thing.
This seems less throuple territory more him accepting it because they are both women and it’s hot.
Thing is I’m not sure he’d go down this route and even if he does he’d still likely see anything before the agreement as cheating.
I see Joyce is rapidly approaching her anime harem era.
Hell, if that’s the route we’re going, I’m going to need WAY more popcorn.
the idea that they MUST break up is kind of wild
I’m sure the polycule isn’t exactly viable but for one it seems entertaining for two everyone involved is not actually super smart
But according to a large portion of the comments section Willis is only allowed to depict healthy relationships.
uh-oh
the irony is that Maggie literally brought it to his attention that never once have these young dumb college freshmen without doing it in an absolutely healthy way, that the comics’ very setting suggests that they should really be allowed to make mistakes this way
but yeah this is one of those tension points for which I’m not giving a side eye to Willis, I’m giving it to the audience
*ended a relationship without doing it in an absolutely healthy way
Billie and Ruth would disagree!
Speaking for myself, I’d certainly prefer it if Willis were only allowed to depict my specific ship in a healthy and long-term-successful way. It’d clearly make it a better overall comic strip.
See my OTP is Ruth/Billie so I don’t think I’m allowed to say things like this unfortunately
This feels true and fair. I support you.
Oh god I hate this. By which I mean, please hook me up to an IV and pump it directly into my veins. But also by which I mean, why are my veins burning, what the hell did you put in this IV, may I have some more please?
ha, I remember my first cup of “coffee” XD
Cheating aside, I can’t help but be impressed by all the stuff Joyce is doing in her one year of college🙂↕️ (it’s been like a year, right?🤔). Once an incredibly repressed Christian girl, and now look at her: Saying the F word, learning how to masturbate, sneaking in bars to drink alcohol, kissing and getting fingered by her(soon to be ex)boyfriend and NOT get married immediately like she intended to kissing a girl and now look at her, Gave her first HJ to giving her first BJ😉. Really makes you proud on how much she’s opened her mind🥹…. again, the cheating thing is wrong🙅🏾♀️ and I seriously hope that they confess before Joe or walky finds out someone else. But I just can’t help be impressed by Joyce here, she really learning to let loose for a person whose lived their entire life Inside of a cult and Finally realize that there’s more to life than keeping your nose in a book of rules that pretty much says that everything that you say/do is a sin and that they should ostracize or hurt others that don’t follow the same path as them. So good on Joyce for the Character Development🙆🏾♀️😊. But no to the cheating, that’s bad🙅🏾♀️😤
Only 5 months, actually. Two and half of which we skipped.
…the dingdong bandit strikes again.
Just have to say that that is a real quality Joyceface in panel 4.
I think at this point, I’ve accepted that unless the strip is explicitly trying to be serious, each character is like 20% Looney Tunes. I can’t judge these little beans like I would normal people. The universe bends them towards comedic timing, slapstick, snarky retorts, awkward phrases, and strange non-sequitrs that don’t make sense unless you hover a mouse over them.
This is the way.
This is the way.
This is the way.
I’m always of the opinion that the final strip in these comics is debatable canon. In the sense that sometimes they’re just there for a gag or joke and sometimes the next strip will expand on it in a way that makes it clear it was a joke/sarcasm/hyperbole. My main example is this one:
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2019/comic/book-10/01-birthday-pursuit/drop-2/
https://www.dumbingofage.com/2019/comic/book-10/01-birthday-pursuit/beeessin/
Strip one ends on a ‘Becky horny’ gag, the other strip moves along as if the Becky horny gag either didn’t happen or was just Becky making a silly face right before telling Joyce she was being a bummer.
#Final panel, not strip
Actually, it does work really well together. The first panel of the second strip is Becky correcting the statement made in the last panel of the first strip. It makes the most sense that way.
No, what I mean is that things in this universe will very often be exaggerated for comedic effect, or momentarily forgotten because it doesn’t match the story being told, or whatnot, or made more intense to hammer in the danger or excitement. You can’t look at it as closely as you would real life, because the rules of this universe is different.
I was criticizing Joyce’s feelings about Joe from a few gathered statements here and there which were probably gags or embellishments. And I’ve been ultra critical of Carla in the past, until I realized that I couldn’t take the expressed narcissism so literally. I was critical of Booster until I realized I couldn’t take their expressed callousness so harshly. And I was critical of Mike until I realized that I couldn’t take his antagonism so malevolently. All of that is, to one degree or another, over exaggerated.
Unless it isn’t, of course. Willis also lets us know when it’s serious. Here, Joyce just dazedly admitted that instead of breaking up with her boyfriend, she cheated on Dorothy far worse than she cheated on Joe- which almost certainly will not destroy their relationship, but instead be a “How do we fix this?” scenario, or “Do you really want this?” But at this moment I don’t even know for sure that Dorothy will even be angry, and so I’m not even going to assume that until I see her reaction.
Almost 666 comments and, until now, no one “damn you, Willis”?
666+ comments!!!! >:D
IT’S SHOWTIME!!!! ✌🏽😈
I’ve decided that what I want (that I do not think will happen, but) is this: they talk, and Joyce realizes she’s open to poly. Joe realizes he’s open to poly. Dorothy is not open to poly.
Why do I want this? idk. Move forward in a way that’s still full of yearning? I think dealing with an incompatibility between different desires for relationship structures would be interesting.
That would be really interesting actually
you know what else makes this new development kinda tedious and boring? knowing this is the author’s endgame. so now there’s no speculation on whether Joyce will pick Joe over Dorothy, because we KNOW Dorothy is the endgame. if I didn’t know this, right now I would be speculating whether Joyce could backslide into saying “that just spur of the moment/a mistake/an experiment”. But we know she won’t, so know it’s just a countdown on her breaking Joe’s heart.
I mean, knowing how a story is probably going to end has never really stopped me from reading it before….
Maybe this time, “Let’s be poly” will win out. My current tally amongst stories I’ve read with a love triangle is Poly: 0, Poly even suggested: 1.5, Monogamy: 1,009,231,235
In Faans!, Rik ends up with both Rumi and Allisin instead of choosing between them; that’s 1 for poly.
He said she ends up with Dorothy, he didn’t say *only* Dorothy.
BJs are to women what rose bouquets are to men
Why do I feel like Dorothy is gonna get jealous that Joyce gave Joe a BJ, and she’s gonna retaliate by giving Joyce one?
I feel like this might be an accidental name swap, but I like the version where it’s not.
See, I don’t think it was a mistake at all. Dorothy angrily asserting her dominance via going down on her pre-girlfriend.
“Still thinking about Joe?”
[Joyce’s brain be like “the number you have dialed cannot be reached…”]
I don’t know if Joyce has he appropriate set of equipment for that
Not with that attitude
I cosign this plotline
Normally things like that make a young man lower their emotional guard….dang it.
So her peer group’s weenus-sucking chart is basically now an ouroboros
Dodecahedron, platonically speaking.
For a certain subculture, it’s on the way to becoming a mesh network.
Well now I’m just disappointed.
This could be an issue with the limited panels but Joyce looks so upset before she does the deed I can’t read it as a “omg I love you so much” flip-flop but more of a “I feel really bad, here let me make it up to you even though you have no idea that’s what’s going on”.
I know some people think Joyce likes Dorothy and Joe equally but I have not been getting that vibe for ages. Its more like Joe is objectively a good boyfriend and Joyce likes that. Which just ugh in this scenario.
If I was Joe and found out my partner had sex with me because they felt bad I’d be grossed out. Delaying a break up due to complex circumstances, okay. But sex stuff? Nope not cool with that.
I’d have some sympathy with Joyce if the impression was she was overcome with lust or affection but that’s just not what I’m seeing.
I thought the same. The last panel she looks flushed and happy about the sex, but the sad-face panel then leading to a joyful sexual encounter doesn’t really make sense
So I’m legit confused. Is Joyce now blissfully confessing to cheating on Dorothy? Open relationships typically involve consent and honesty. Ya know, this is starting to feel a little shitty, even for young college students.
More like being honest about a thing she felt she had to do.
So to clarify…she had to give oral sex when she wanted to break up with him? I mean, that opens more doors than it closes, frankly.
We’re a little past that, I fear.
The thing that keeps throwing me for a loop is seeing people in the comments go “well they’re young! we’ve all been there” and like??? no? this is amount of selfish and cruel that most people don’t do just because they’re in college. The comment section is making me feel insane.
I think ‘blissfully’ is _incredibly_ disingenuous.
“eagerly”?
Yo, look at her face in the artwork and give me a better description of the flushed sex-face in last panel. Together, we can define this look.
Dave, I love you, and I do appreciate that Dorothy kinda lampshades it here, but I am BEGGING you to stop with “weenus”. I’m absolutely cringing.
Hang on. Dorothy has gone from tell to break up with. That was not discussed!
Can we take a moment to appreciate Willis’ self-control in not making the blanket pink?
I struggle to fall asleep regularly. My family also recommended (and gifted) me a weighted blanket. I think it may have helped initially, but I soon got used to it and whatever effect it had on me evaporated. Then all it was, was a frustratingly heavily thing to try and flip off yourself when you’ve been lying down for hours and have sleepy-time low blood pressure (and thus less strength). It lives folded up in the back of my closet now.
Best news is I didn’t keep using it until my cats could poke holes in it. Those things are filled with millions of tiny glass beads. The unholy mess if that ever ripped open… T_T
Step up, Dorothy, what will Joyce do when she’s not with you?
everybody do the Weenus—